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Old 07-29-2022, 08:44 PM
Reiwa Reiwa is offline
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Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Effectively all high-speeed rail service is heavily subsidized so that argument's moot.

When you're talking wheeled ground transport, you get speed or you get cost effectiveness, you don't get both. Putting those wheels on steel rails helps some, but doesn't eliminate the basic problem. Rail is absurdly good at hauling heavy loads at modest speeds. If you want to ship ten thousand tons of coal overland at thirty miles an hour, rail's unbeatable.

Train resistance, usually expressed here in the states in pounds per ton, increases with speed. Modern railroad locomotives use electric motors and have a tractive effort curve that is effectively a straight line--you go faster, you have less pull. If you want to haul a heavy passenger train at high rates of speed, you have no choice but to grossly overpower your train*. That costs money. It costs more money because safety regulations mean the equipment tends to be very heavy. Deadweight per passenger on the Northeast Corridor's "Acela" are on the order of two tons per, or roughly rivaling that of single-occupancy automobiles. If you want to run passenger trains with some semblance of efficiency, you need to run slower. To repeat: You get speed or you get cheap, you don't get both.

The same problems of course apply, to an even greater extent, to highway transport. It's why the government tried to reduce speed limits during the 70's, and part of why speeds have never reached particularly high levels. The cost is too high, both in dollars and in pollution due to increased fuel consumption.

Passenger rail has its uses, even being rather cost-inefficient. It's great for helping out with congestion in built-up cities when the air corridors are too crowded and there's little physical space for ground corridors. This seldom applies in North America due to lesser population density here than in some other regions, but that will likely change with time and continued population growth. Some air routes are already heavily congested.

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*This is why most high-speed rail uses electric locomotives rather than diesel-electrics, including all of the highest-speed lines. Either of them use electric motors, but the diesel is limited by carrying its own onboard power plant. An electric using outside transmission can be over-powered at the cost of requiring expensive infrastructure and higher route maintenance.

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Short version: High speed rail has its place, but is rarely ideal in present-day North American conditions. It's frequently sold, wrongly, as a cheaper option when it seldom is, giving fuel to its detractors.

Danth
Why passenger trains heavy? Seems like nonsense.
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