Originally Posted by Nefarum (Post 1247682)

In all the arguing and proposals put forth, people are forgetting the facts of the matter.

1. The devs have stated that they will not change how the server is functioning. This means no things like repops or reduction of variance will be implemented.

2. Players want to have some competition on the server, it's part of what makes EQ what it is.

3. Everyone is sick of the current monopoly and the majority of players being blocked from experiencing end game content.

4. The system should treat all guilds equally. No one on the server is more entitled than anyone else. TMO/FE players have put in more effort playing the game, but that doesn't give them more of a right to game content than a more casual player. The fact that the more hardcore guilds are "ahead" and that there will still be an element of competition means that you guys will still "do better" anyways. The new implemented system doesn't need to add to this advantage by treating certain guilds in a special way.

5. The GMs have stated that they will not enforce a rotation, meaning it is up to the player base to handle whatever agreement we come up with. This means that only a simple, easily-understood and easily-implemented system will work long-term. Dividing the guilds into tiers, with councils, arbitrary rules of where you can have characters or not, and all the other nonsense proposed by FE/TMO will not be understood by players and will be fraught with endless arguing and confusion. Deciding which guilds are which tier etc etc will only add to the fighting.

So to repeat, no changes to server code, must be simple and easily implemented, must still encourage competition, and has to eliminate monopoly and blocking the majority of the server from content, must treat all players/guilds in the exact same way.

I think everyone should agree/remember these premises when tackling this issue.

So what do I propose? Well I don't have a perfect solution designed, but i can offer a starting point. Your input is encouraged. I say the agreement should be something close to the following:

1. If a guild kills a raid target, they are not allowed to kill it again the next 2 times it pops.
2. If a target is up for 12 hours, it's open for anyone to take, even if a guild normally couldn't take it because of rule 1.
3. Any training/interference tactics should be heavily punished.

- Simple.
- Easy to remember/understand.
- Doesn't require code changes.
- All players/guilds are treated equally.
- There will still be competition for mobs, it's just that the competition each time will only involve the guilds that are able to kill the mob that spawn cycle.
- Eliminates monopoly as more guilds get a chance at mobs
- The table of what mobs popped when and who killed them could be easily tracked on a simple webpage

This isn't the lesser guilds asking for handouts, as the top guilds will most likely get the kills on cycles where they are allowed to, but it will get rid of the current monopoly/bottleneck. Sure, this will "cost" the top guilds some loot, but the currently monopoly is the reason we are in this mess. No viable agreement won't end up costing the top guilds something.

I think this is a more reasonable starting point than anything else I have seen.

Originally Posted by Cyrano (Post 1247809)

Why is it not viable?

Originally Posted by Nefarum (Post 1247897)

It's not necessarily a 3-guild rotation. It still encourages competition, but makes the competition more viable for lesser-than-TMO guilds. A guild like BDA/Divinity/etc. will have more of a chance getting a mob if 2/3 of the top guilds have to sit out that pop. Lesser guilds will only have 1 of the top 3 to contend with (along with the other lesser guilds).

I honestly think just a small change like this, plus the addition of Velious content is all we really need. Keep in mind I'm not even a member of a top 5 guild and I'm saying this.

This just prevents such a ridiculous bottleneck on key items, like Trak teeth.

---> One more thought:

I honestly don't believe there will ever be a proposal that will have unanimous agreement. The GMs' mandate for us to reach a consensus is pretty much impossible. We could have a near-perfect plan, and there will still be people who don't like it. No matter what, the top guilds have to give up power, and/or the lower guilds will still feel oppressed. I think no matter what happens, the GMs might have to just choose a proposal that isn't universally reviled and just declare it the new law. That's the only way I see anything actually moving forward.