T-staff proc in PvP

[Dullah]

I think most rational players can agree at this point that t-staff proc could use a fast forward on the nerf. Both live servers and just about every other emu tmk have nerfed the proc in some way, and I think for the benefit of pvp the same should be done here.

Now I generally support all things classic but some exceptions have to be made (item recharging etc).

This is actually being suggested more as a courtesy for our competition than for any personal benefit as Nihilum presently has 3 new monks chomping at the bit for a t-staff and I hate to think of the negative impact of having 6 t-staff monks in one guild against our adversaries.

For the sake of pvp, I suggest reducing the proc duration in similar fashion to all other movement impairing effects in pvp. Perhaps a set 6 seconds versus the present 12. Maybe a random duration of 2-6.

PS. if nizzar guildkicks me and heartbrands my gear as a result of this thread, its been nice knowing all of you.

[Smedy]

T-staff was never touched or nerfed during the classic era of everquest, perhaps later in luclin and beyond but that does not apply to red99 <b>CLASSIC</b> dog

Seeing a wizard complaining is always a good sign of balance taking place though, wizards are op as fuk since day 1 and still op as fuk in kunark, will continue to be a decent class all through out velious but meeles will by far be better in the end

Wait for a ranger to get windstriker then holla back

[Jenni D]

3 new monks? jesus.

do any new players take the challenge on this server anymore & not join nihi??

[Smedy]

more tstaffs then monks brogirl, but shit's classic, don't add yellow text, don't remove tstaff proc, simple as that, shits classic also rogues backstabbing for 1.3k is classic

so many things are classic, so classic i couldn't stand it

[SamwiseRed]

so many things are classic, so classic i couldn't stand it

LOL

[heartbrand]

If you're going to remove item recharging, have a custom resist system, water doesn't cancel spells, lev basically destroys melees ability to hit PC's (hit box much smaller here than on live), etc. etc. I think the least you can do is re-evaluate t-staff.

[Nirgon]

I think you should re-evaluate double wurmslayers being in as non-classic and get to melting faces when people start talking about changing classic features.

Another project is on the way, time to raise the masts and batton down the hatches. CLASSIC TIME PALS.

[heartbrand]

Retarded argument. Classic doesn't mean the game must play identically as it did back then according to each patch note. Should all exploits that were in classic remain here? After all, it's classic. You were able to transfer no drop gear in classic using exploits, shouldn't that be in, it's classic?

[Nirgon]

You're talking about nerfing the tstaff because you're not a monk.

The cat is out of the bag and has strewn the contents of his little box all across the floor.

Enjoy those double wurmies while they last! Kanras/Nilbog aren't too far off from one more chest bump with the classic gods on this one.

[SamwiseRed]

seen alot of nilly monks lately. at least they are helping me get better at juking.

[Nirgon]

You know who sold the Russians the atomic bomb secret?

I have the patch notes (http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/rosenb/ROS_TJRO.HTM) on that one, Heartbrand.

Thou shalt not defile classic EverQuest.

[heartbrand]

You're talking about nerfing the tstaff because you're not a monk.

The cat is out of the bag and has strewn the contents of his little box all across the floor.

Enjoy those double wurmies while they last! Kanras/Nilbog aren't too far off from one more chest bump with the classic gods on this one.

T-Staff's greatly favor my guild, as we have almost all of them and far more monks. This actually hurts my guild.

[SamwiseRed]

This should not be nerfed. Alot of up and coming monks should get to chance to own face in pvp. This is like the mage swords and other things nerfed after one group of players abused the shit out of them. Someone doesnt want anyone else having a strategic advantage. Do not nerf.

[Dullah]

T-Staff's greatly favor my guild, as we have almost all of them and far more monks. This actually hurts my guild.

You can't make any sense to folks on these forums. Hopefully nilbog notices this thread and has more sense than they do.

Once we are rolling around with 6 t-staff monks in pvp, you know this thread will get bumped on a daily basis with the outrage. I just hope it doesn't hurt the server and cause the mass rage quitting that losing to Nihilum has caused in the past.

[SamwiseRed]

something tells me there are other reasons for this thread. why would you handicap yourself if this gives you the advantage? do not nerf, not classic. 4 of us leveling monks atm and are waiting for more t staffs to flow down.

[Dullah]

Smedy also trolling r99 forums because he has nothing invested here, doesn't even play, and couldn't care less about the negative impact bugs and imbalances.

Heres a quote from him from another EQ PvP emu where he had the exact opposite opinion.

Much respect coming out as a monk with t-staff mentioning that it's very overpowered. I couldn't agree more and i did notice the effect (spin) lasted longer then it did on live.

If you think this damage is good just wait till a monk picks up the "ton po" staff with 44/40 damage/dly with the same proc as t-staff, it will not be a fun sight.

I wouldn't wanna nerf the monks best friend but seriously reconsider the "spin" effect to last for the whole duration, like buh said, make it root people like on live, but the spin effect only lasted about 2-3 seconds.



Also, the proc is supposed to be a random duration in pvp, not a set 12 seconds every time.

Perhaps this will help
Quote
Reply
#Nov 29 2002 at 12:04 AMRating: Default
Shakuden

54 posts
First off, as long as the skelly warlord pops at second bridge you don't have to kill his other PH's, so long as no one is killing his other PH's, so he'll spawn only at the second bridge IF he does spawn. Second, the staff doesn't show in his hand, nor does he "crush" you with it either. And as for the effect, it's 120 damage out-right, 1-12 second stun, and the stun will last either 1 tick(6 seconds) or 2 ticks(12 seconds), or just insta stun the mob. Also, it is unresistable, period, I've had this thing before and it's never been resisted ever, I used it on Naggy and it never resisted on him. I just looted one today (Turkey Day) and I should know. This has been the happiest Turkey Day ever for me (=

found here http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=572

Also see Searyx comments

People are confusing what the T-Staff proc was on live.

It was 2-10 seconds random duration unresistable stun with a 120 DD. It did work in PvP, although it does seem to last longer more frequently on the emu. It was always really fucking good - it's endgame for Monk. The problem right now is there are too many of them floating around, while other classes are still using shitty weapons/spells.

I'm not saying it isn't OP, but I would considering waiting to see how other classes stack up once they have their killer items/spells. There are lots of Monks with tstaff running around now, but very few sks or warrs with Herbalist Spade / Oggok Cleaver / etc., Shamans with Bane/Malo/Pox, or Wizards with Sunstrike.

Weapons also seem to proc slightly more in general on the emu, which can be drastic when there are weapons like the Flint Dagger for rangers and T-Staff for monks. The Adamantite Club / Baton combo is arguably even more brutal.

This is what I would change:

-Prevent exploiting on warlord spawn, and make it slightly rarer (it was around 2.5% drop rate on live).

-Reduce weapon proc rates slightly for all weapons.

-Look at the One Hundred Blows effect and make sure it's not lasting max duration every time. It's supposed to be random either 2-10 seconds or 2-12 seconds.


found here http://emu.pwned.com/showthread.php?3735-T-staff

[Dullah]

something tells me there are other reasons for this thread. why would you handicap yourself if this gives you the advantage? do not nerf, not classic. 4 of us leveling monks atm and are waiting for more t staffs to flow down.

Because I actually like when people are playing on the server. We've been crushing the competition for a year now, and don't need to give them a reason to quit. 6 t-staff monks in one guild will be the excuse they need to quit playing, whether they know it now or not.

[SamwiseRed]

so tell them not to use t staff. sheez do you guys have any sense of self control? anyhow the nerf is not classic and I would like to experience being a walking stun machine.

[Dullah]

You have no clue what the classic mechanics were, you didn't even play on a pvp server. They were stated above, and found on Zam.

You have nothing useful to add to this thread, just excuse yourself.

[SamwiseRed]

one zam post from 2002.

if that is sufficient evidence around here then i got alot of things i want to see changed :)

[SamwiseRed]

http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8834&highlight=tranquil+staff

2001 post about t staff proc always lasting longer than 4-5 seconds to cast some spell

"the tranquil staff always stuns long enough to get a cast from the bio orb (4-5 seconds or so). As soon as the Tstaff procs, right-click bio orb and bang, unless he's got good resists, your opponent is blinded and helpless. "

i cant find anything that says 10 seconds every time but i cant recall it lasting 1-3 seconds ever.

[Treats]

Also, the proc is supposed to be a random duration in pvp, not a set 12 seconds every time.

found here http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=572


Effects on players versus NPCs are NOT the same.

T Staff stun in PVP was full duration but you could stop the spinning.

[Dullah]

Many collaborative sources say even in PvP, it wasn't 12 seconds every time.

Regardless, it needs to be adjusted like I said it would need to be 3 months ago. Because of our knowledge of the game 13 years later, t-staff has become far more prominent early than it was on live. Thus, so should the nerf. PvP never came down to t-staffs in classic pvp, but here it does. Its only going to get worse. This is all I'm going to say about it. Devs can make up their own minds, but its going to be a shame when people start leaving the server because 1 item makes PvP completely 1 sided. I just don't want to see it come to that because I really enjoy this server.

[SamwiseRed]

are you kidding? any pvp thread about monks relies on t staff to win any fight. without monks are pretty fucked. if nihilum wants to recruit 20 monks with t staff then so be it.

[Treats]

Many collaborative sources say even in PvP, it wasn't 12 seconds every time.


----

1) Buy Tranquil staff

Use: If you are fighting a rogue, druid, sham, pure caster, you can probably kill them during the time they are stunned with innerflame (always works for me)

http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8828

And here:

Monk
Like WAR, watch for the riposte or high damage discipline. In the case of the riposte discipline either get behind them or more preferable avoid them for the duration altogether (11 seconds?). Remember that monks get mend but it has a decent refresh time. If they are dual wielding you should have an easier time jousting them to death. Monk weapons hit very, very hard. Avoid getting stunned by a Tranquil Staff, and Nimble if you do so they don't kill you with a discipline. They also have a better Safe Fall than you. Switch to AC gear.

http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?t=185

Monks can get good at higher lvl when they get certain weopons. I.E. tranquil staff, after it procs disc on them and its over

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=17671

[Vayder]

Item re-charging is classic but was deemed detrimental to the health of the server.

All Destin is trying to say is perhaps the devs should consider whether t-staff should fit in the same category.

People are upset that root still lands ~6% of the time. Root can be dispelled and the rooted player can still cast and attack. The player casting root is giving up dps in order to cast root a non-damaging or low damaging spell.

Tranquil Staff lands 100% of the time. Cannot be dispelled and the rooted player cannot cast or attack. The monk is giving up 0 dps in order to do so.

Stop for a moment and consider the math:

At max dex you get 2 procs per minute.
Currently proc is an unresistable 12 second stun.

That means each monk is "super rooting" someone every 30 seconds without using mana while putting out the most damage they are capable of.

[SamwiseRed]

im more worried about vp geared zerg that keeps recruiting than a classic item doing classic things. T-staff maybe the deciding factor in 1v1 but eq pvp has never been balanced. people need to learn to avoid melee hits. ive been t staffed once and thats because i didnt think it would proc so early. now i avoid melee range of monks at all costs.

the counter to t staff is to not get hit. learn to not just stand there and spam 1 button.

edit: also i have yet to hear of anyone getting griefed off the server by t -staff. the only reason ive heard from anyone is losing too much xp to pvp or some other complaint about xp. this kinda reminds me when the nilly opposition was complaining about wands.

[Dullah]

What you think is irrelevant. You are no one, a nobody who doesn't even play here on the regular, have no classic pvp experience, and no present experience from which to even speak. In pvp on a daily basis just since kunark, I have seen you once. You're completely out of touch of what is happening on r99 and spend 99% of your time in game and on the forums trolling. Just take a big step back... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OVnTQYliR0)

Myself and Nihilum stand to gain nothing from what I'm proposing except to help balance the pvp scene, especially bearing in mind that we already have 3 t-staff monks and will soon have several more. I actually want to help. Those who don't and only hang about to senselessly oppose those who do have no place in the bug forum.

[Jenni D]

why do nilly need any more monks? or even more members, jesus!!

[Vayder]

why do nilly need any more monks? or even more members, jesus!!

This just in: T-staff overpowered, server flooded with monks.

[SamwiseRed]

if you dont like classic things there is always live. btw the only time ive seen you in game is during raids so ofc you dont see me.

[Vayder]

if you dont like classic things there is always live.

Oh really?

Resists - Must stay true to providing a balanced resist system over a classic one. Classic resists were built around the game being new and a lot of things were unknown/undiscovered. It was also built around a bigger population size and the availability of resist gear. No way in hell did they expect more than half the population to be decked out in blue diamond gear by Kunark. I am not saying the current system doesn't need a little tweak here and there but not at the expense of every melee being John Rambo with a few pieces of MR gear.

[SamwiseRed]

i aint mad so apparently i like it. i just find it funny that zerg keeps zergin but worried about pvp balance.

if this is about t staff proc being too long, cool its long but classic and doesnt really bother me.

if this is about balance, I can think of 100 other things that take priority over t staff.

edit: what does my comment have to do with an unresistable proc?

[Nizzarr]

Let's fix wizard/druid nukes so I can partial 50% of the damage with 75 fr like live

[Rettii]

Destin, crying for nerfs to favor whatever class he is currently playing

the saga continues

[heartbrand]

Let's fix wizard/druid nukes so I can partial 50% of the damage with 75 fr like live

I don't think one change is exclusive of the other, and this should be the case!

[Dullah]

If every 60 monk on RZ VZ and TZ had a t-staff like they do here, the nerf they dropped would have come during kunark. Thankfully, not everyone knew the power of the t-staff, or how to effectively farm it.

This is not the case here.

Also, +1 for classic resists. (oh shit the guy with the wizard wants to nerf wizards? all your theories were just foiled.)

[Nirgon]

Let's fix wizard/druid nukes so I can partial 50% of the damage with 75 fr like live

I'd correct you but you know better. It wouldn't be 50% of everything... but it also wouldn't be getting hit for full with 230 fire (through a wall by a bolt)

[SamwiseRed]

im for seb and other keys being body bound. i was confused when i died on my bard and spawned with a seb key. not classic, please remove.

[Nirgon]

Item re-charging is classic

So help me god.

Learn the difference between something intentionally added, and a bug.

T-staff? Not added by accident.

Item recharge? Yeah ok, maybe we get it now.


You think monks are the end all/be all? Make one.

Classes have more use than just PvP in this game, and the PvP/PvE content is not exclusive. There's no PvE gear and PvP gear. There's just the damn gear.

This is a balance debate and not a bug. The game isn't balanced, some chars are situationally stronger which is what balance really is to me in EQ.

Do melees complain that they aren't as strong when naked as casters? Maybe you guys will now that I've mentioned it.

[heartbrand]

So help me god.

Learn the difference between something intentionally added, and a bug.

T-staff? Not added by accident.

Item recharge? Yeah ok, maybe we get it now.


You think monks are the end all/be all? Make one.

Classes have more use than just PvP in this game, and the PvP/PvE content is not exclusive. There's no PvE gear and PvP gear. There's just the damn gear.

This is a balance debate and not a bug. The game isn't balanced, some chars are situationally stronger which is what balance really is to me in EQ.

Do melees complain that they aren't as strong when naked as casters? Maybe you guys will now that I've mentioned it.

The difference here is you have an item that essentially negates skill and creates a fundamentally uneven playing field. This is an argument of philosophies, I don't think one is "better" than the other, I just happen to think mine (classic with tweaks) gives for a more enjoyable playing experience, /shrug.

[SamwiseRed]

a hell of a lot easier to root someone than proc a t staff. dont fight monks in a 2x2 box.

[SamwiseRed]

also monks suck without t staff, straight up. why take away the only item that makes these guys worth playing in pve unless you consider the ability to train a perk then there is still that reason.

ready any pvp guide for monks around the classic area. 90% of it relies on the t staff.

[Nirgon]

Yeah I bet you on live if we had years and years of Kunark, we woulda all leveled up monks.

Wait till you guys get some Bo Staffs from VP / primal veliums and the monks wise up to proc staff -> swap wep -> pop inner flame.

http://static4.fjcdn.com/comments/When+I+stop+breathing+then+you+have+my+permission+ to+_ed53befb3892b1f8d68a2caabea87627.jpg

Then... then you have my permission to cry about monks.

Wonder how long till they figure out muscle lock + malo/mala.

Stop trying to balance the game. Just make a classic server.

Oh yeah and the difference here is? You're not a monk.

[BigSlip]

a hell of a lot easier to root someone than proc a t staff. dont fight monks in a 2x2 box.

what

[SamwiseRed]

dont know what i was saying anymore. i guess quit trying to nerf the only thing that makes monks viable in pvp. keep t staff classic.

edit: i dont even have a monk and have been owned by a t staff.

[Smedy]

isn't dullah a wizard, always something amusing when wizards complain considering they have been riding the wave of ez mode since launch and finally when shit starts hitting the fan they start dropping knowledge @the boards

anyway, personally i think all effects such as tstaff, root, snare landing is retarded, it makes pvp boring, but considering melees are FUCKED and root/snare is far from classic landing at 120+ mr all the time nerfing tstaff isn't an option.

So dullah, being mad about dying to a proc isn't gonna help, you'll just going to have to:

http://i.imgur.com/qgDo0.gif

[Smedy]

Item re-charging is classic but was deemed detrimental to the health of the server.

All Destin is trying to say is perhaps the devs should consider whether t-staff should fit in the same category.

People are upset that root still lands ~6% of the time. Root can be dispelled and the rooted player can still cast and attack. The player casting root is giving up dps in order to cast root a non-damaging or low damaging spell.

Tranquil Staff lands 100% of the time. Cannot be dispelled and the rooted player cannot cast or attack. The monk is giving up 0 dps in order to do so.

Stop for a moment and consider the math:

At max dex you get 2 procs per minute.
Currently proc is an unresistable 12 second stun.

That means each monk is "super rooting" someone every 30 seconds without using mana while putting out the most damage they are capable of.

meanwhile, root is a level 1 spell everyone has

tstaff is one of most rare items in the game (supposedly) and you cannot control the proc (blame neckbeards in nihlium for overflow of tstaffs)

also saying root can be dispelled is ignorant, if you play a pure melee you can't dispell shit considering you have 0 channeling skill. 1 green mob on ya and you cannot ever dispell yourself, or a smart caster who knows how to play the game.

monk is a pure melee and needs melee range to hit you. If you as a caster get hit by a monk, you have litteraly failed at everquest and deserve to die from 1 proc.

[Vayder]

also saying root can be dispelled is ignorant, if you play a pure melee you can't dispell shit considering you have 0 channeling skill. 1 green mob on ya and you cannot ever dispell yourself, or a smart caster who knows how to play the game.

monk is a pure melee and needs melee range to hit you. If you as a caster get hit by a monk, you have litteraly failed at everquest and deserve to die from 1 proc.

Just so I understand what you're saying your position is: in everquest pvp a caster should always beat melee and should never even take a single point of damage?

Additionally cancel magic and pumice are things "every level 1 has" and can cast when a guildmate is rooted. There is no assistance for t-staff stun.

[Nirgon]

Don't think this is getting changed, its classic and a very rare drop compared to getting something like an fbss.

[SamwiseRed]

Just so I understand what you're saying your position is: in everquest pvp a caster should always beat melee and should never even take a single point of damage?

Additionally cancel magic and pumice are things "every level 1 has" and can cast when a guildmate is rooted. There is no assistance for t-staff stun.

try using pumice with a green con wisp attacking you. the point is with zero channeling its almost impossible to channel a single charge of nullify magic. hence if i see a melee pumicing i attack them on my druid, I have interrupted the cast before with my kithicor mace. as far as a guildmate casting it for you, well balance shouldnt be built around a supposed guildmate who is following around pure melees ready to dispel anything that comes there way. casters usually targetting first in mass pvp and are usually busy trying to survive themselves.

pet root is out of control on this server, needs to be looked at waaaaaaaaaaay before t staff. yesterday i was chain rooted my an earth pet at 90mr. i dont mind it landing sometimes but literally the second it wore off or dispelled I was re rooted. basically it locked me down long enough for the melees to zone in and beat me down. that pet must have been casting root every 5 seconds, i kid not.

[Andis]

fix staff for the love of god

fix pet root

[Nirgon]

Pet yes, staff no

[SamwiseRed]

Pet yes, staff no

[Andis]

if one gets tstaffed, its 99% chance of death.

needs fix.

[Nirgon]

All this wanting for faster xp and people pl'd up monks hhhmm

[SamwiseRed]

more worried about dual wielding wurmys than t staff.

[Andis]

that makes no sense sam

when tstaff procs literally every encounter

[Nirgon]

I understand its a pretty overpowering game mechanic, but a guild needs more to win than just monks.

If you want to make a guild entirely of power levelled up monks, go ahead.

For instance, when resists went up very high in Velious, all the enchanters didn't reroll. Part of the game is PvE progression, part is PvP. Without being able to do both you will fail.

That said, definitely get the monks in your guild tstaffs :P.

[SamwiseRed]

focus the monks then. i just cant see the t staff getting nerfed without gimping the entire monk class. also lets fight t staff with t staff.

[Knuckle]

T Staff 8 second unresistable stun confirmed classic, suck a dick and enjoy it.

[Dullah]

Actually lasts longer than 8 seconds, but whose counting (closer to 12)...

This thread just got all kinds of stupid but ironically a monk with t-staff (Vayder) can come here talking sense along with Andis (mind blown).

Item recharging is actually the perfect parallel. Both t-staff and item recharging were extremely imbalanced and things which would have both been nerfed much earlier had they been as widely used/easily obtained as they are now.

[SamwiseRed]

i didnt think wands in classic were balanced considering one guild farmed them uncontested for 7 months but tbh who gives a fuck lol

if you are looking for balance then im sorry. eq classic is not for you

[TempleOfLife]

yall way too immersed man

[SamwiseRed]

Actually lasts longer than 8 seconds, but whose counting (closer to 12)...

This thread just got all kinds of stupid but ironically a monk with t-staff (Vayder) can come here talking sense along with Andis (mind blown).

Item recharging is actually the perfect parallel. Both t-staff and item recharging were extremely imbalanced and things which would have both been nerfed much earlier had they been as widely used/easily obtained as they are now.

cries about balance, joins 145 man guild on a 100 person server. ho ho ho

[heartbrand]

SamwiseRed
This message is hidden because SamwiseRed is on your ignore list.

p.s. let's fix t-staff pals for health of the server

[Tippett]

Yeah t staff is what's affecting health of server, think there is bigger fish to fry honestly.

[heartbrand]

I think we're looking long term here pal, there's plenty of issues I agree, but this is a pretty simple fix that if not looked at will make this server pretty... RETARDED (heh heh heh) for the opposition

[Tippett]

Considering it's being farmed 24/7 it's obviously going to me used en masse against the already smaller and weaker guild on the server and you guys obviously don't want the destruction to be too insane but alas that's what should/going to happen.

I don't think there has been any other item on the server that has suffered a nerf like the one proposed in this thread.

[Tycko]

It's not going to get nerfed, I don't understand why this keeps getting brought up. The horse is dead pals, seriously.

[SamwiseRed]

Destin just mad as usual. nothing to see her. he calls for nerfs on all classes that arent wiz or rogue.

[Dullah]

Except that major issue I've been championing since the dawn of the server.. what was it again? Oh ya, fixing resists making them in line with classic which would make casters about half as powerful.

Useless troll is useless.

[Dullah]

It's not going to get nerfed, I don't understand why this keeps getting brought up. The horse is dead pals, seriously.

This could be said about literally every single problem on red, yet somehow, 1 or 2 things do make it to the patch notes every 6 months.

Seeing as how we haven't had a patch since Kunark, this could be one of those things! :)

[Nirgon]

You got the patch for the hole etc don't forget.

There's non-classic issues that need a fix. But don't you worry Destin, I got this end covered.

[SamwiseRed]

http://i.imgur.com/0MDiy.jpg

classic things are not bugs. please delete this thread.

[Smedy]

http://i.imgur.com/0MDiy.jpg

classic things are not bugs. please delete this thread.

/thread

pras brad

[Nirgon]

Move this to resolved, thx

[Sickpuppy]

bump tstaff is classic ... deal with it . itsthe only item that makes mnks any good in pvp alot of haters in this thread

[Nirgon]

Unless you're Gongshow, resolved

[Dullah]

Of the dozens if not hundreds of monks during this period on live, I saw maybe a couple 50+ that had a tstaff.

Here we have about 8 or 9 on a server with a population of 100.

Last 2 major fights, people cried hard about Nihilum's tstaffs, including certain members of the opposing guild which sent me tells telling me how right I am in this thread.

/shrug 6 tstaffs (and rising) vs 2

ya'll gonna get griefed.

[Smedy]

Shit's classic dog, we ain't even mad

[Cwall 52.0]

smedy when i saw that you were the latest reply to this thread, i envisioned your post to say this exactly:

Shit's classic dog

[Dullah]

Shit's classic dog, we ain't even mad

Funny, you didn't used to think this way on 2 other EQ emu boards I found you posting on in the last few years.


Much respect coming out as a monk with t-staff mentioning that it's very overpowered. I couldn't agree more and i did notice the effect (spin) lasted longer then it did on live.

If you think this damage is good just wait till a monk picks up the "ton po" staff with 44/40 damage/dly with the same proc as t-staff, it will not be a fun sight.

I wouldn't wanna nerf the monks best friend but seriously reconsider the "spin" effect to last for the whole duration, like buh said, make it root people like on live, but the spin effect only lasted about 2-3 seconds.

Guess the shoes on the other foot now that you don't play and live only on the forums.

[Nirgon]

Smedy down, yet here I and classic EQ stand. Let's nerf duelist next because it can one shot casters on demand. Inc defense from you. WoW has lots of balance discussion, this is a classic EQ project.

[Smedy]

Funny, you didn't used to think this way on 2 other EQ emu boards I found you posting on in the last few years.



Guess the shoes on the other foot now that you don't play and live only on the forums.

Well, there's a ton of shit being overpowered, nerfing tstaff won't solve anything, it will just make monks useless.

Rogues backstabbing for 2k duelist in kunark? Lul... i never saw a rogue backstab with duellist for over 500 in kunark on live. Shit's classic dog i ain't crying just saying

There's one big issue, and it's resist. Fix resist, then consider doing other changes

[Nirgon]

I saw what you posted first Smedy, you back sliding swede traitor not giving Xantille the staff he rightfully deserves

[Dullah]

Well, there's a ton of shit being overpowered, nerfing tstaff won't solve anything, it will just make monks useless.

Fix resists first, then consider doing the other changes.

Shameless backpedaling.

Smedy down, yet here I and classic EQ stand. Let's nerf duelist next because it can one shot casters on demand. Inc defense from you. WoW has lots of balance discussion, this is a classic EQ project.
Like I said, the present scene with t-staff monks becoming the predominant majority instead of the extreme minority is not classic. Just like every player recharging and utilizing wands and egg shaped pumice wasn't the majority during classic era, but here everyone would do it. Hence it was changed for the good of the server, and rightly so.

Go ahead and keep saying the same things though, simply for the sake of argument.

[Smedy]

needs to be as rare as air bow, problem solved

solution

wipe server

fix resists while you're at it

[Nirgon]

T-Staff isn't a bug. Item recharge is.

[compulsion]

9 pages of flames and opinions on how the game should be, with like 3 people actually citing evidence from live. This seems like one of those items that blue players love because it makes the game so easy, just like the old sword of runes. Proc rate was 10x or higher than it was on live and everyone just abused it to get their loots faster.

So anyhow... if a t-staff monk is basically the most fearsome class on this server, you would imagine monks would really dominate PvP on live, where they would be immune to roots and easily partial the rest with just resist buffs and a few plat diamond rings(avg price 4000 in 2001).

http://web.archive.org/web/20011205095922/http://everquest.station.sony.com/stats/sz_summary.jsp

Wait, what? So 4 months into the server, after evil team got to xp and farm uninterrupted in KC for the first 2 months, only 1 single monk appears in the points leaders(#56 of 60). As a matter of fact, monks are below warriors and rogues in class representation on the SZ leaderboards and are tied with paladins who did not have one single offensive option in the classic resist system.

If live was like this server, evil monks would have been steamrolling everyone with high unresistable damage and a t-staff that procs so often it is basically a stunlock. Since the exact opposite is true and monks appear to have been shit on live PvP, it appears that the t-staff code on this server is completely wrong.

"The DD part of the Proc always happens, the Stun though still not stun Unstunnable Mobs. The Consensus on Monkly Business seems to be that the Stun Lasts for 3 6 or 12 seconds, depending on the mob's level. If you Duel with it it tends to stun other toons for 12."

"Yeah, I must admit I like the 120 DD part never being resisted. As far as I am concerned the Stun part is pretty much a joke anyway, 80% percent of the time it wears off instantly, there was even a time right after a patch you would get the 'wears off' message before the proc message. I have heard that max duration on the stun is supposed to be 12 seconds, but in the year I have had mine I have see that all of about once, usually more in the few seconds time frame if it happens at all"

"The proc rate is very high unresistable , 120dd + 1 - 6 secs stun , but similar like common root series spells , you will recieve a spell fade message from mobs. But , why mobs always start to move or attack before the spell fade message appear?"

I am guessing that someone read that the proc is unresistable, which originally was only the damage, and made the stun as unresistable as well. From castersrealm, jan of 2001(6 mos after kunark release)

http://web.archive.org/web/20020522122154/http://eq.castersrealm.com/data/item.asp?Id=1255

"Effect Details: This effect causes the target to be stunned while it is rained down with blows delivering 120 hitpoints in damage. It is unresistable. The stun is a variable duration from 1-10 seconds. On high level mobs (54+) it is usually just an instant stun and they wont stay stunned, but will still be interrupted if casting. "

So, according to a credible (castersrealm and allakhazam being *the* EQ resources at the time) period specific source, the duration of the stun should only be 1-10 seconds. Player comments from the era suggest the same thing. On this server the stun is always max duration and according to multiple sources, is also max duration on mobs that it should only act as an interrupt on.

As an aside,

At max dex you get 2 procs per minute.
Currently proc is an unresistable 12 second stun.

While this should be true, procs here seem to frontload. The old sword of runes would fire off multiple procs before the first melee swing even landed. The t-staff and the ranger conflag dagger both proc multiple times at the onset of melee. The t-staff not only almost always procs in the initial swings, but it reliably procs again before the first stun has worn.

[compulsion]

Anyone remember shit like this from live? How unstoppable would Nizzar be if he was completely immune to CC and any damage spell that wasn't lure based. The only way that a monk goes from being the worst PvP class in the game on live, to the best PvP class in the game on this emu, is because the t-staff is incorrectly coded.

And now, what EQ PvP was always meant to be...

[Smedy]

wait until theres a ranger with windstriker and get back to me, you can atleast avoid being hit from a tstaff :)

shit's classic dog, and yes tstaff was unresistable 12 second (i think maybe even 18 seconds on live) you might not have gotten to play vs a monk with tstaff on live, cause shit was rare as fuck.

[Bamzal Sherbet]

i recently discovered quotes of players discussing the stun in detail. it would stun for the first two seconds. at the same time it acts as a root-spin for (1 to 2) procs (6-12 seconds). during the root-spin you can melee, cast, etc

[Nirgon]

Okay, so what does it do on EQMac?

I had access to Ketov the iksar monk on live who had one. I can't remember either way on it despite having proc'd it. I sorta remember yondering after being stunned... Jinxat proc'd it on me fighting me in Lavastorm... test on EQ Mac! I feel like it wasn't as gamebreaking as it is here but still very strong. Maybe 2-3 second stun, root+spin for rest of duration..

[compulsion]

wait until theres a ranger with windstriker and get back to me, you can atleast avoid being hit from a tstaff :)

shit's classic dog, and yes tstaff was unresistable 12 second (i think maybe even 18 seconds on live) you might not have gotten to play vs a monk with tstaff on live, cause shit was rare as fuck.

You should let the good people over at castersrealm who detailed the item in 2001 know that they are wrong. "shit's classic dog" should be all they need to issue a formal apology to you and everyone else for having the item info completely wrong for the last 12 years.

Which scenario is more likely:

A: T-staff was such a well kept secret on live that monks on Sullon Zek didn't use them, and that is why they were tied(with paladins) for least representation of any class on the PvP leaderboards.

B: T-staff here is incorrectly coded and so overpowered that players have gotten used to it being a crutch and just organize their entire PvP groups around t-staff equipped monks.

PS: In the spirit of evidence supported, rational discussion, could we get some evidence for "(i think maybe even 18 seconds on live)"? We all just want to get this thing right after all.

[heartbrand]

lol smedy quote kinda funny I had him ignored tbh

[Tippett]

shits classic stop crying about it and go farm one and roll a monk if you think its so great

also why the fuck is this thread in bug discussion?

classic mechanics are not bugs

[Rettii]

9 pages of flames and opinions on how the game should be, with like 3 people actually citing evidence from live. This seems like one of those items that blue players love because it makes the game so easy, just like the old sword of runes. Proc rate was 10x or higher than it was on live and everyone just abused it to get their loots faster.

So anyhow... if a t-staff monk is basically the most fearsome class on this server, you would imagine monks would really dominate PvP on live, where they would be immune to roots and easily partial the rest with just resist buffs and a few plat diamond rings(avg price 4000 in 2001).

http://web.archive.org/web/20011205095922/http://everquest.station.sony.com/stats/sz_summary.jsp

Wait, what? So 4 months into the server, after evil team got to xp and farm uninterrupted in KC for the first 2 months, only 1 single monk appears in the points leaders(#56 of 60). As a matter of fact, monks are below warriors and rogues in class representation on the SZ leaderboards and are tied with paladins who did not have one single offensive option in the classic resist system.

If live was like this server, evil monks would have been steamrolling everyone with high unresistable damage and a t-staff that procs so often it is basically a stunlock. Since the exact opposite is true and monks appear to have been shit on live PvP, it appears that the t-staff code on this server is completely wrong.

"The DD part of the Proc always happens, the Stun though still not stun Unstunnable Mobs. The Consensus on Monkly Business seems to be that the Stun Lasts for 3 6 or 12 seconds, depending on the mob's level. If you Duel with it it tends to stun other toons for 12."

"Yeah, I must admit I like the 120 DD part never being resisted. As far as I am concerned the Stun part is pretty much a joke anyway, 80% percent of the time it wears off instantly, there was even a time right after a patch you would get the 'wears off' message before the proc message. I have heard that max duration on the stun is supposed to be 12 seconds, but in the year I have had mine I have see that all of about once, usually more in the few seconds time frame if it happens at all"

"The proc rate is very high unresistable , 120dd + 1 - 6 secs stun , but similar like common root series spells , you will recieve a spell fade message from mobs. But , why mobs always start to move or attack before the spell fade message appear?"

I am guessing that someone read that the proc is unresistable, which originally was only the damage, and made the stun as unresistable as well. From castersrealm, jan of 2001(6 mos after kunark release)

http://web.archive.org/web/20020522122154/http://eq.castersrealm.com/data/item.asp?Id=1255

"Effect Details: This effect causes the target to be stunned while it is rained down with blows delivering 120 hitpoints in damage. It is unresistable. The stun is a variable duration from 1-10 seconds. On high level mobs (54+) it is usually just an instant stun and they wont stay stunned, but will still be interrupted if casting. "

So, according to a credible (castersrealm and allakhazam being *the* EQ resources at the time) period specific source, the duration of the stun should only be 1-10 seconds. Player comments from the era suggest the same thing. On this server the stun is always max duration and according to multiple sources, is also max duration on mobs that it should only act as an interrupt on.

As an aside,



While this should be true, procs here seem to frontload. The old sword of runes would fire off multiple procs before the first melee swing even landed. The t-staff and the ranger conflag dagger both proc multiple times at the onset of melee. The t-staff not only almost always procs in the initial swings, but it reliably procs again before the first stun has worn.

Winner winner chicken dinner. Give this guy a promotion.

Anyone remember shit like this from live? How unstoppable would Nizzar be if he was completely immune to CC and any damage spell that wasn't lure based. The only way that a monk goes from being the worst PvP class in the game on live, to the best PvP class in the game on this emu, is because the t-staff is incorrectly coded.

And now, what EQ PvP was always meant to be...

[Tavrin]

shits classic stop crying about it and go farm one and roll a monk if you think its so great

also why the fuck is this thread in bug discussion?

classic mechanics are not bugs

Because people do not believe that the current T Staff is classic. All evidence from the kunark/velious era shows the proc being an interrupt on 54+ mobs, and a variable 1-12 second stun on everything else.

Here is a link to allakhazam in December of 2001, the comments date back to May 2001.

http://web.archive.org/web/20011224192518/http://eqdb.allakhazam.com/item.html?item=572

Specific comment from May 2001:

"And lets not forget to mention that the proc is UNRESISTABLE , Nothing can resist it, on the mobs like 54+ it doesnt stune them but it will interupt there casting. Its a 120DD and a 1 to 12 second stun. Im 47 and got lucky and won a roll on it the other day in karnors (yahhhooo) I about had a heart attack, glad I got my IFS the week b4 and started pracing 2hb was at 50, now im at 212, cant wait to proc time :O) "

And another:

"k, we all know the issues that monks have with weight. Frankly, I like the fact that I can hit for 115 (at level 43) with just under 200 skill in 2hb better then I would like those few extra ac points. The proc is a 120 point unresistable dd from what I understand, as well as a up to 12 second stun. At this point I don't give a rats ass that I'm at 18 weight. With this thing I beat stuff up, end of story."

Please provide evidence that the stun was always 12 seconds if you wish to support your claim that the current tstaff is 'classic' and not a bug.

[SamwiseRed]

You should let the good people over at castersrealm who detailed the item in 2001 know that they are wrong. "shit's classic dog" should be all they need to issue a formal apology to you and everyone else for having the item info completely wrong for the last 12 years.

Which scenario is more likely:

A: T-staff was such a well kept secret on live that monks on Sullon Zek didn't use them, and that is why they were tied(with paladins) for least representation of any class on the PvP leaderboards.

B: T-staff here is incorrectly coded and so overpowered that players have gotten used to it being a crutch and just organize their entire PvP groups around t-staff equipped monks.

PS: In the spirit of evidence supported, rational discussion, could we get some evidence for "(i think maybe even 18 seconds on live)"? We all just want to get this thing right after all.

SZ came out after kunark (in velious) so the t staff we had on there was already nerfed ( I THINK NOT 100%) also it was rare as fuck and not many monks. this class relies on a proc to kill most people 1v1 so it wasnt too appealing on SZ when you had manaburning wizards all over the fuckin place. fuck the police.

[Vayder]

SZ came out after kunark (in velious) so the t staff we had on there was already nerfed ( I THINK NOT 100%) also it was rare as fuck and not many monks. this class relies on a proc to kill most people 1v1 so it wasnt too appealing on SZ when you had manaburning wizards all over the fuckin place. fuck the police.

That would be great except:

1) When was t-staff ever nerfed? I'd like to see the patch notes on that one.
2) There were no manaburning wizards when the chart linked was posted


The SZ leaderboards are a pretty strong statement I think. They show pretty much what we see here currently (druids and wizards are good) with the strong exception that monks are nowhere near elite status on the SZ boards and are pretty sick here.

[SamwiseRed]

i must be overlooking link to sz leader boards. link again?

SZ came out middle or late 2001. luclin is right around the corner so how is there not mana burning wizards unless its a real early board.

[SamwiseRed]

btw training was legal on sz, you think monks were trying to pvp toe to toe on there? lulz monks were too busy causing a train fest to sit there and wait for a t-staff proc which i am sure wasnt even close to as farmed as it is here because luclin came out pretty early.

basically what im saying is w/e leaderboard thing you are talking about doesnt take into consideration that alot kills were due to trains.

about the nerf, i assumed the drop rate was nerfed because that shit was rare as fuck on live. there are already a dozen floating around on here so i thought the drop rate was different than live. guess not?

[Vayder]

i must be overlooking link to sz leader boards. link again?

SZ came out middle or late 2001. luclin is right around the corner so how is there not mana burning wizards unless its a real early board.

SZ had been out for more than 6 months -- date of leader board is Dec. 5th, 2001. Luclin has been out 2 days.

[SamwiseRed]

I think using that leaderboard as any kind of proof is a little silly. I mean if there was a red99 Leaderboard, I doubt even Nizzarr would be top 50 in kills since Kunark. Wizards/Druids would still be on top. Let's face it there just wasnt alot of monks running around SZ. the ones that were there were training the shit out of people so ofc they arent on leaderboard.

if training were legal here, i can imagine there would be at least 1-2 less t staffs do to KC being a fucking nightmare to farm anything. people would be training there all the time, day and night.

[Tavrin]

I think using that leaderboard as any kind of proof is a little silly.

I think the Leaderboard was just an example. The other links provided show that the tstaff was a random variable duration stun, rather than the fixed duration stun that exists on r99.

That is the 'bug'.

[SamwiseRed]

ya im actually happy that someone linked that. had forgotten about it. i cracked a smile when i saw a few of the people on that list. hehe

[SamwiseRed]

anyone talk to seary about it? main'd a monk with a t-staff. he should know whats up.

[Avon Barksdale]

Item loot sounds pretty cool.

8-9 of these things is a lot when that's like 8-9% of the server population using it at any given time. It's still a pretty rare item overall.

If you've got a problem with people running around with their dicks hanging out of their zippers 24/7 ready to tickle your throat, use the threat of cutting off those dicks to force them back into their pants some of the time.

Dicks are OP, but they're also rare, and precious. People are going to be far less likely to charge at you and your group dick-first if the prospect of getting zerged and summarily neutered is real. Dicks are far less OP when you don't have one anymore.

[Nirgon]

Phonin this one up to the booth.

Big Avon get this proc effect tested on EQ Mac, dawg.

[Smedy]

Item loot on a server where resist is completely bugged and unclassic, on a class where you have zero escapability and channelling skill, ***** please.

I'd be fine with item loot if 80+ mr made me immune to all magic effects, like it was on live, not the case on red99.

[compulsion]

shits classic stop crying about it and go farm one and roll a monk if you think its so great

also why the fuck is this thread in bug discussion?

classic mechanics are not bugs

Are you too stupid to even read a half page of information? It isn't a classic mechanic when several people have provided multiple concrete links that the stun is a random duration and not fixed at 12 seconds. Castersrealm links from 2000 exactly describe the effect as a 1-10 second stun. That is classic, not this emu version.

http://web.archive.org/web/20020522122154/http://eq.castersrealm.com/data/item.asp?Id=1255

This emu version only exists, just like sword of runes proccing 20x as often as normal, because blue players feel better about themselves plowing through content the easy way.

Go back to leveling your next 52.

I think using that leaderboard as any kind of proof is a little silly. I mean if there was a red99 Leaderboard, I doubt even Nizzarr would be top 50 in kills since Kunark. Wizards/Druids would still be on top. Let's face it there just wasnt alot of monks running around SZ. the ones that were there were training the shit out of people so ofc they arent on leaderboard.

if training were legal here, i can imagine there would be at least 1-2 less t staffs do to KC being a fucking nightmare to farm anything. people would be training there all the time, day and night.

You obviously never played SZ or probably any red server. Monks were all over the place because they were such amazing pullers in Velious. Evil team had 2 months and 1300+ people to actively farm KC uninterrupted while neutrals and goods(maybe 600+ players between both factions) tried to level, and yet their monks couldn't get kills in PvP. They got fewer kills than warriors and rogues.

Real training has nothing to do with class. It never fails to run anyone you want into the middle of a raid and have them accept a rez as the mobs come pouring in behind them. FD can be countered.

If you ever actually PvP'd with the 57+ groups, you would know that Nizzar is actually a major factor in the engagements. People ask in TS all the time about which new Nihilum monks have the t-staff. Hell, look at Smedy's sig. Undergeared 53 monk kills best equipped 60s on server with t-staff proc. And that is exactly my point. SZ boards show, with a 3000+ person sample size, that on live, geared monks were ineffective killers. On this emu, fresh 50s in wu's pants wreck shop. Why? Because t-staff here stuns more often and for longer periods, as has been demonstrated with multiple sources cited, than it did in classic.

Item loot on a server where resist is completely bugged and unclassic, on a class where you have zero escapability and channelling skill, ***** please.

I'd be fine with item loot if 80+ mr made me immune to all magic effects, like it was on live, not the case on red99.

Lets keep this to you trying to convince us that t-staff stun should be 18 seconds.

[Smedy]

Hell, look at Smedy's sig. Undergeared 53 monk kills best equipped 60s on server with t-staff proc.

Hate to say it, most of my lvl 52 nizzarr kills where with a Master Wu Trance Stick , and then just a fist, lol. The reason nizzarr dies isn't that i have a tstaff, it's that he has zero ability to get away when he gets rooted, resists are fucked, you cannot pumice yourself without channeling skill, no matter how good gear you have as a pure melee you'll get fucked once you get snared/rooted.

Yeah, tstaff is OP, no doubt, but raging like a mongoloid to fix something you can with ease avoid being hit buy while resists are fucked and affects everyone in a bad way is retarded

Fix resists first, then fix tstaff. I was tstaffed on live and can confirm i couldn't get away, however i do believe that the stun effect only lasted a few seconds, while i kept spinning. (this was however in luclin so not sure how legit it would be here).

Who gives a shit, resist is really no#1. Tstaff isn't even close.

Wait until you meet a rogue who has figured out how to use posions on this server, and then get back to me

[compulsion]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=572

First couple quotes from 2001:





http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showpost.php?p=18515&postcount=51

2002:



Note that the tstaff stun effect *is* the same spell effect used in whirl.

and...

The spell effect was not nerfed to 1 second. The 2006 post from live has nothing to do with the proc here.

It will randomly break depending on various factors. It's working as intended.

from...

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=31193

All you people claiming the full 12 seconds is classic please let kanras and uthgaard know that they are wrong.

[compulsion]

Hate to say it, most of my lvl 52 nizzarr kills where with a Master Wu Trance Stick , and then just a fist, lol. The reason nizzarr dies isn't that i have a tstaff, it's that he has zero ability to get away when he gets rooted, resists are fucked, you cannot pumice yourself without channeling skill, no matter how good gear you have as a pure melee you'll get fucked once you get snared/rooted.

Yeah, tstaff is OP, no doubt, but raging like a mongoloid to fix something you can with ease avoid being hit buy while resists are fucked and affects everyone in a bad way is retarded

Fix resists first, then fix tstaff. I was tstaffed on live and can confirm i couldn't get away, however i do believe that the stun effect only lasted a few seconds, while i kept spinning. (this was however in luclin so not sure how legit it would be here).

Who gives a shit, resist is really no#1. Tstaff isn't even close.

Wait until you meet a rogue who has figured out how to use posions on this server, and then get back to me

The topic of this thread is "t-staff proc in pvp" where you show that said proc should be 18 seconds. It is not "share your thoughts on the resist code".

[Tippett]

T staff classic dudes mad as fuk

Not a bug, keep trying to nerf monks though.

[SamwiseRed]

shits classic, move to resolved plz

[Tavrin]

shits classic, move to resolved plz

Please provide proof that the current version is classic.

A number of people, myself included, have provided links showing that the current form is not correct. The stun duration should be variable and not fixed.

This is a bug forum, not troll land. Provide evidence to support your assertions.

[Smedy]

who is this comp guy, he seems awfully mad about a weapon he can easily avoid, must be a clicker

[Tippett]

An old ass comment from some bad player 10 years ago isn't proof.

Melees don't need any non classic nerfs now move along.

[Nirgon]

Smedy makes some very good comments here but let's just put this bad boy on hold until tested on EQ Mac.

[Vayder]

who is this comp guy, he seems awfully mad about a weapon he can easily avoid, must be a clicker

Can we stop using this terrible argument? I mean seriously you don't even believe this. What you are saying is,

"A melee should never be able to deal any damage to another player in pvp."

That's just dumb. So please stop.

[Nirgon]

EQMac is the way to go here given window and lack of changes to the spell, hoping I can have Avon get us some infos.

[SamwiseRed]

EQMac sounds good, I'd also like to see Searyx comment since he was a monk with a t-staff in classic.

[Tippett]

Pretty offensive that casters are in here bitching about t staff, I mean the fucked resists make all casters here beyond overpowered. Yet they bitch to get one of the few things that give melee a chance a nerf.

2/6 ROOTS AT 204 MR NEVER FORGET #bitchmadedruids

[Samrothstein]

Of course some people will bitch about both.

T-staff might need investigation.
Spell resists are completely jacked right now.

If you rely on root, you are a failure at PvP.

Nothing new here, stop arguing in bugs.

[Tippett]

Everyone relies on root to great success unfortunately

[Rettii]

Sadly I went full mana to oom casting root on Hughman at ~150 mr not sure if saying 2/6 at 200+ is srs, might be too much of a random numbers game. Not rly sure of root argument still viable.

[Nirgon]

Rooted 2/5 with 151mr against Larsen, who did con red... so there's that.

Despite claims of "no one tries to root any more" , it is frequently cast on me in fights.

I feel very bad for people who don't have jac rings, tcrown, gbs etc.

[Vayder]

Rooted 2/5 with 151mr against Larsen, who did con red... so there's that.


In other news I flipped a coin 5 times and it came up heads 4 times, coin must be rigged!

[Rettii]

That's what I'm saying, I think it's the RNG part of roots that need looking at (if this is te case) but I just was adding to the argument tangent about melee getting rooted. This is tstaff thread carry on.

[heartbrand]

You shouldn't have to stack MR to 200 sacrificing all other resists to just be able to reach the 95% root cap

[Nirgon]

You shouldn't have to stack MR to 200 sacrificing all other resists to just be able to reach the 95% root cap

No surprise that an ex-holo is one of the few among you that gets the point.

[Vayder]

No surprise that an ex-holo is one of the few among you that gets the point.

Except I've already shown that you don't have to be at 200mr and that 120mr gets you there perhaps even less.

Everyone gripes about root but you resist it 95% of the time at 120mr. See what kind of resists you get on cold, fire, poison, and disease at 120... That's the real problem at the moment.

[Nirgon]

I agree with the elemental part big time. Further, rains were VERY easily resisted in classic. Here? They absolutely rape the shit outta people :P (I know you can move out, I'm not entering a debate on something that obvious).

[Rettii]

Tstaff thread folks

[CitizenOfGrobb]

Except I've already shown that you don't have to be at 200mr and that 120mr gets you there perhaps even less.

Everyone gripes about root but you resist it 95% of the time at 120mr. See what kind of resists you get on cold, fire, poison, and disease at 120... That's the real problem at the moment.


ur not 95% resistant until 180mr. Get your facts straight.

[Bamzal Sherbet]

175 mr 2nd ensnare lands :(

[SamwiseRed]

damn 1/10 snares land at 90 mr. how u getting snared at 175

[Nirgon]

I got ensnared on the 2nd cast at 161mr by a blue con druid. Drop the facade bro.

Post dat EQ Mac tstaff bomb.

[SamwiseRed]

nah tbh i dont believe you guys. no evidence posted. not taking anyones word over my own tests. snare barely landed at 72 mr let alone 90. not buying it without ss.

and working on t staff stuff. ive found monks with it but none of them want to duel me lol.

[PvpChampIronLion]

gonna agree with samwise.

snare , clinging darkness, blind, rarely land with 100 over.

its possible it landed on second cast.

id still say odds are about 2/10 snares land over 100 mr

[Tippett]

idk about snare but i got rooted 2/6 at 200 mr by andis

[SamwiseRed]

gonna need a good 150k on eqmac at this rate to get my own t staff, these bluebie wont duel me lol

[Nirgon]

Tell them you will bend over and take it for science

[SamwiseRed]

i do have a a testimony but its not concrete. ill post. this guy had a monk in classic and said he never lost a duel with his t staff. said it was ALWAYS an 8 sec stun. said it stunned and they were not able to cast.

[SamwiseRed]

http://i.imgur.com/EtrtDo0.jpg

ya its not proof but at least this guy is claiming to have mained a monk back then.

[SamwiseRed]

bump

[Smedy]

Cwall confirmed survived tstaff proc, assist train and poison blind simultaneously, you sure could use a protip or two on how to get better at everquest and stop dying to this silly item

[SamwiseRed]

big searyx is back and says t staff wasnt always full duration. he played a monk in classic with t staff. his word is as good as gold on this subject.

[Dullah]

Ya, doesn't matter that I said this months ago.

No reason for 12 second stuns to have full duration when every other affect is shortened in pvp.

[Cwall 52.0]

shit's lasting longer than that

fresh from today's pvp:
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] You are stunned!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] You begin to spin from one hundred blows.. You have taken 80 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but YOU block!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Kebartik convulses.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Venomous notes seep through your body..
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Gream convulses.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:33 2013] Node convulses.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] Elderan tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] Ender pierces YOU for 64 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] Ender slashes YOU for 42 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:34 2013] You have been disarmed!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Elderan pierces YOU for 39 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Elderan tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Elderan tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Nizzar crushes YOU for 120 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Nizzar crushes YOU for 95 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:35 2013] Ender slashes YOU for 24 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Kebartik says 'Sorry, Master..calming down.'
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Elderan begins to spin from one hundred blows.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Wanyo tries to crush Elderan, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Wanyo crushes Elderan for 68 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Wanyo was burned.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Gream slashes YOU for 32 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Gream slashes YOU for 17 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:36 2013] Nizzar kicks YOU for 58 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Ender slashes YOU for 12 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Kebartik slashes YOU for 26 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:37 2013] Kebartik tries to bash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Gream pierces YOU for 45 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Gream tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but YOU block!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Ender pierces YOU for 73 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:38 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] You resist the EarthElementalStrike spell!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] Wanyo tries to kick Elderan, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] Ender pierces YOU for 51 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but YOU block!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:39 2013] You feel protected.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Firebowlt begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Solsek begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:40 2013] Kebartik tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:41 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:41 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:41 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:41 2013] You slow down.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:41 2013] Wanyo's spell fizzles!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Firebowlt regains concentration and continues casting.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Gream tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Nizzar tries to crush YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:42 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Node begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Nizzar tries to crush Wanyo, but Wanyo is INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Nizzar tries to crush Wanyo, but Wanyo is INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:43 2013] Gream tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:45 2013] Nizzar tries to crush Wanyo, but Wanyo is INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:45 2013] Nizzar tries to crush Wanyo, but Wanyo is INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:45 2013] Solsek begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Nizzar crushes Lite for 29 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Nizzar was burned.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] You feel dazed.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Nizzar kicks Lite for 53 points of damage.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Nizzar was burned.
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Kebartik tries to slash Lite, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:47 2013] Kebartik tries to kick Lite, but misses!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:48 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:48 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:48 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:48 2013] Solsek's casting is interrupted!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:49 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Gream tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Gream tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Ender tries to pierce YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] Ender tries to slash YOU, but are INVULNERABLE!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:50 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:51 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:51 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:51 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:51 2013] You can't cast spells while invulnerable!
[Sun Mar 03 11:49:51 2013] You are unstunned.

looks like 18 seconds to me

[Sear]

Samwise nerd alerted me to this thread, so here I am to make my one forum post.




Tranquil Staff never had a set duration at any point on live. It had a random duration of 1 to 12 seconds. It was still the best pvp weapon in the game even during Velious.

Smedys concern about resists also seems valid.

I HOPE THIS HELPS

[Clark]

You shouldn't have to stack MR to 200 sacrificing all other resists to just be able to reach the 95% root cap

good point

[Nirgon]

I gotta say that Jinxat did proc this on me in Lavastorm, I was able to yonder while still spinning but unable to move.

I keep saying I think the full 18s stun is classic BUT that single memory firmly sticks out otherwise.

I've lurked the EQ mac boards and found out they cost 150k there because it is so rare and no one really camps it.

Iirc the Kunark "uber rare drops" were much rarer than they are here.

Random 1-12 stun, but full spin/root sticks out for me I think. 18s.... eh don't think so.

[Dullah]

Now we have the good ole Skean in play for almost all melee. Its easily obtainable and basically does the same thing as t-staff, but is resistable. Both proc spin stun for set duration effectively trivializing tactics or skill involved in the pee vee pee.

Sad times for pvp.

[Nirgon]

Someone needs to obtain and proc a tstaff on a player on eqmac a few times.

As far as resists, get in line!

[Sear]

I gotta say that Jinxat did proc this on me in Lavastorm, I was able to yonder while still spinning but unable to move.

I keep saying I think the full 18s stun is classic BUT that single memory firmly sticks out otherwise.

I've lurked the EQ mac boards and found out they cost 150k there because it is so rare and no one really camps it.

Iirc the Kunark "uber rare drops" were much rarer than they are here.

Random 1-12 stun, but full spin/root sticks out for me I think. 18s.... eh don't think so.

Yeah I am positive on that 1-12.

18 seconds would allow you to full-to-zero almost any class on one proc.


from http://web.archive.org/web/200112241....html?item=572

Ahout Proc By: Anonymous
Posted @ Sun, May 20th 11:07 AM 2001 Score: Good[4.00]
And lets not forget to mention that the proc is UNRESISTABLE , Nothing can resist it, on the mobs like 54+ it doesnt stune them but it will interupt there casting. Its a 120DD and a 1 to 12 second stun. Im 47 and got lucky and won a roll on it the other day in karnors (yahhhooo) I about had a heart attack, glad I got my IFS the week b4 and started pracing 2hb was at 50, now im at 212, cant wait to proc time :O)



I have this staff By: Anonymous
Posted @ Fri, May 25th 10:40 PM 2001 Score: Decent[2.50]
Ok, we all know the issues that monks have with weight. Frankly, I like the fact that I can hit for 115 (at level 43) with just under 200 skill in 2hb better then I would like those few extra ac points. The proc is a 120 point unresistable dd from what I understand, as well as a up to 12 second stun. At this point I don't give a rats ass that I'm at 18 weight. With this thing I beat stuff up, end of story.


I would peg the drop rate at 2% (arguably closer to 1%). You'd get the named npc (skeletal warlord) maybe once an hour if you camped the jail area.

[Sear]

also Skean was shit on live. Proc didn't land any more than SBD proc did.

[SamwiseRed]

searyx has spoken, can we get a fixed pending update?

[Smedy]

Please investigate... I've never had someone run off early from a tstaff proc, not even nizzar tbh, so if he is ackin he surely just installed them.

My feelings are there might have been a silent nerf to tstaff during the latest "reboot" which also patched in some bankers being kos to AoN (dont think they were prior to reboot).

[Smedy]

Skean gets nerfed with velious though, so it's not a huge issue, just a periodical pain in the ass.

[heartbrand]

tstaff proc'd on nizzar today and he ran off 1-2 seconds later, either random or he's ackin

going to say random because nizzar would be better than he is if using hacks

This is random and happens with mez and root as well. I think it's tied to the unseen hand bug. If the other player doesn't see you in zone you can damage them and it shows your spells landing but movement impair spells / disables will not affect the player.

[Nirgon]

^ you know I thought this bug was a lie but..

I tested it by gating into WC and Wendolyn could see me in zone but I couldn't see him.

You can get the person from 100-1% and they won't even notice their hp move... but when you kill them the death certainly takes effect!