PVP Charm/Fear

[Kruel]

Fear isnt working as intended. I know allot of people are saying it was never in classic and some (like myself) remember being dominated by this spell.

Here is your proof.

http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/19990607.html

Later on down the road they made AE fear spells not work in pvp. But as it shows there.. single target fear is classic in pvp .

[Nirgon]

I'll just chase you around on this one, the pvp damage cap wasn't changed until later in the game and not classic. Bugs and glaring problems shouldn't exist period regardless of time line in my opinion. Because, you're asking them to recreate problematic elements that will cause people to go nuts about them and have known major associated bugs only to remove them shortly thereafter. I disagree with doing so, but in the spirit of recreating a "completely accurate classic timeline" yeah this and other things should have existed at launch that were gamebreaking :P. This would mean going back and spending time on breaking other things. Catch my drift here bro.

[Kruel]

to fix fear doesnt mean you will ruin other gme mechanics. This is like an enchanter not being able to mez people. Currently as it stands this server is a emulated experience of classic p99 pre kunark. I submitted a error with proof like required. I hope that the GMs will take this into concideration on the pvp server, since that is the reason we are here on red... is to pvp.

Also on a side not EVERY fear related post i saw didnt actually provide proof, but rather just a "i remember people getting feared".. Along with other people stating "No way not classic, fear wasnt used in pvp". This thread can put those threads to rest. People were feared in pvp on live. ESPECIALLY at the time period this server is currently emulating. Allow me to QQ more bro

[Albane]

Everyone knows and will not deny that fear was on classic. So was training mobs. This is why fear was removed. Fear does help big time for PvP, especially as one of the classes with it, but it is also a huge cause of grief in dungeons.

Fear will not be put back in, as far as I have heard.

[ChubbyBubbles]

Awesome bug report Kruel....however since fear was not put in the server because of the problems it causes, it isn't actually a bug. Your post here is more of a suggestion of how you would like the game to be. Perhaps making a poll so that you can see just how many people are for or against something like this would of been more along the lines of what you were aiming for?

http://gracesgraphics.com/1/days/friday/glitter/021.gif

[Kruel]

ah i didnt see any GMs comment on knowing fear in pvp was classic, yet ommiting it on purpose for the sake of fighting into mobs and training. Maybe i missed the post if someone is able to link it. Fearing in pvp is classic, i was under the impression that the staff was striving to have a "as close to possible" experience of classic eq. Short of the variance this is all i have seen to be true. So one spell from a class that makes them a powerhouse in pvp was nerfed because of trains,.... really doesnt make sence- and yet wizards are running around with ice comet? .

Also as another side note this isnt how i want the game to be played.. but rather how the game was intended and was to be played back in 99-00'. Fear in pvp WAS / IS CLASSIC.

[Kruel]

Everyone knows and will not deny that fear was on classic. So was training mobs. This is why fear was removed. Fear does help big time for PvP, especially as one of the classes with it, but it is also a huge cause of grief in dungeons.

Fear will not be put back in, as far as I have heard.

I mean if the training part is the problem i can understand them adding a no cast in a dungeon similiar to sow. Although this again isnt classic.

[Nirgon]

The grounds for removal are that is screwed the game up royally. Not that it was a quest that was added as a certain part of an expansion. It was a very broken mechanic that needed to be removed, same with charm on players. Fear and charm still work on other player's pets, which imo is fine.

[Kruel]

The grounds for removal are that is screwed the game up royally. Not that it was a quest that was added as a certain part of an expansion. It was a very broken mechanic that needed to be removed, same with charm on players. Fear and charm still work on other player's pets, which imo is fine.

see now if charm was classic (this is another discussion all together), post proof and this should be added. This is a classic emu!!

Edit: i see the page of update notes from my original post says that players could be charmed. IMO both of these are classic and should be added. Restrict them if you must but keep it classic!

[Verdu]

see now if charm was classic (this is another discussion all together), post proof and this should be added. This is a classic emu!!

Edit: i see the page of update notes from my original post says that players could be charmed. IMO both of these are classic and should be added. Restrict them if you must but keep it classic!

The problem with the whole 'classic' tag is that classic is a time-frame, and not a specific moment in time.

Fear and Charm worked on Players for part of classic eq, but were also removed pre-kunark. So fear and charm working on players and not working on players fall under the Classic description.

[ChubbyBubbles]

see now if charm was classic (this is another discussion all together), post proof and this should be added. This is a classic emu!!

Edit: i see the page of update notes from my original post says that players could be charmed. IMO both of these are classic and should be added. Restrict them if you must but keep it classic!

Okay so it was classic. But I'm pretty sure everyone , including you can remember that they were taken out. So why in the world would the devs go about putting something in the game that was flawed from the beginning? So they can eventually spend time taking it back out? I'm not seeing the logic here, only the fact that you want to be able to fear people in pvp because it was 1: op and 2 : classic.

No.

[Kruel]

there are tons of things that are in game that will be taken out.. manastone / guise / quests like thex etc. Allot of these were taken out for some reason or another. But its to relive the classic experience.

[ChubbyBubbles]

Those things are legacy items, and quests that once done the items stayed with those people. Sometimes live these things were referred to as "pre-nerf item so-and-so". However the Game mechanic Fear is not an item that is in limited quantity.

Can you please give some other reasons that this mechanic of fearing players should be put in the game other than to cause grief or sate some weird obsession you seem to have with being able to fear players, as it must of been done to you in the past?

[Kruel]

to be honest, i was a warrior for 6 years on blue and i remember being feared allot. And not that it is a big deal, at the end of the day it is classic. I simply say that if something was in the game at classic, that is what the server should be trying to impliment. I kinda feel its like taking away sow for a druid/shaman because they can run faster than the mob... this is true but this was classic and it was one of the things that made them strong. In the same thought charm / fear is what made necros and chanters strong. They could even make the chances that it sticks nill to none. Make it very highly resisted, but keep it classic.

[Slave]

If it was highly resisted more than other spells, it would not be Classic. Your comparison of Fear to SoW was particularly apt in my opinion, and in that vein neither seems overly powerful compared to the other.

If PvP experience death penalty matched mob experience death penalty, and if training and other play nice policy rules were removed, we would see that the immensely larger range of player options and real consequences could easily lead to an instant revitalization of this server.

[Kruel]

If it was highly resisted more than other spells, it would not be Classic. Your comparison of Fear to SoW was particularly apt in my opinion, and in that vein neither seems overly powerful compared to the other.

If PvP experience death penalty matched mob experience death penalty, and if training and other play nice policy rules were removed, we would see that the immensely larger range of player options and real consequences could easily lead to an instant revitalization of this server.

one thing at a time, first thing is the purposefully nerfed spells for no reason other than.. it kinda sucks if someone casts this on you around mobs.

Game mechanics like training, griefing, cursing, play nice policy are the policy of the staff and people who run this server. Other than that all spells and abilities should remain as they were in classic.

[Lazortag]

I am a huge classic purist and I almost never say that something classic should be excluded from the game, but there are good arguments for not including fear in pvp, especially on an emu. Firstly, it is very easy to make someone take an exp death with this spell. Granted there are spells in game that can make players take exp deaths (crowd control spells, song of highsun, crission's pixie strike (push someone off a cliff/into water), etc.), but they're either very high level spells or there are only very few situations in which they induce exp deaths. With fear, pretty much any situation where someone is engaged with a mob or has mobs nearby leads to an exp death. Secondly, fear is very exploitable (moreso on an emu). You can fear people behind zonelines and sometimes inside of walls/under the world, which requires GM intervention and generally isn't fair. It was a mistake to allow fear on live pvp servers and I see no reason why they should repeat that mistake on red99.

[Kruel]

im just lost in this whole discussion. This isnt making the game how u want it to be. the game already came out 10 years ago and this was HOW IT WAS THEN. Not picking and choosing what we want from EQ.

[Lazortag]

im just lost in this whole discussion. This isnt making the game how u want it to be. the game already came out 10 years ago and this was HOW IT WAS THEN. Not picking and choosing what we want from EQ.

The devs don't always reproduce exploits, and I explained how it could be exploitative, so you're just ignoring all the arguments you can't respond to.

[Kruel]

The devs don't always reproduce exploits, and I explained how it could be exploitative, so you're just ignoring all the arguments you can't respond to.

there are allot of spells that are unfortunate for pvp.. like how a enchanter can see you running invis through a zone you are KOS in, and just straight mez / root / keep you perma stund while trying to bank. (this actually happened to me).


You are not reproducing an exploit when the game we are trying to emulate allowed it. Allot of spells can be exploitative.. but if they were classic then you have to allow it. I really feel when you pick and choose what to allow and what not to allow its BS. This is the first thing i have seen on p99 that isnt original and was intentionally left out because someone just didnt want it to work like classic.

[Knuckle]

endless instant gate pots and hoop faggotry? not classic to be exploitable and well known. fear working in pvp quite classic via proof, make instant gates lore or make fear work in pvp if not.

[Lazortag]

there are allot of spells that are unfortunate for pvp.. like how a enchanter can see you running invis through a zone you are KOS in, and just straight mez / root / keep you perma stund while trying to bank. (this actually happened to me).


You are not reproducing an exploit when the game we are trying to emulate allowed it. Allot of spells can be exploitative.. but if they were classic then you have to allow it. I really feel when you pick and choose what to allow and what not to allow its BS. This is the first thing i have seen on p99 that isnt original and was intentionally left out because someone just didnt want it to work like classic.

I was referring to being able to fear people behind walls and zonelines..

[Slave]

one thing at a time, first thing is the purposefully nerfed spells for no reason other than.. it kinda sucks if someone casts this on you around mobs.

Game mechanics like training, griefing, cursing, play nice policy are the policy of the staff and people who run this server. Other than that all spells and abilities should remain as they were in classic.

You're right, I did get carried away. I do agree with the OP. Many of the abilities and mechanics that made EverQuest immersive, fresh, and original were later deemed to be bugs and removed. That is why we are on P99 and not P2010.

Obviously game breaking overpowered things, such as hoops (in PvP), should be at least slightly nerfed in some way (in PvP).

Really the only way to relive the original experience, which the grand majority of us are here for, is to accurately emulate the original experience. We seem to be drifting rather far from this ideal lately, but it is harder to own on a PvP server, because it has to be a mixture of the two best PvP server rulesets. IE: item loot from Rallos Zek and everything else from Sullon Zek. Oops, there I go again.

[Clutchy]

Evidence that Fear was in and should be in. Come on, if we're going to have things like hoops and gate pots then least we can have is Fear in PVP. It's not much worse than people snaring players already engaged in mobs.

[Lazortag]

Evidence that Fear was in and should be in. Come on, if we're going to have things like hoops and gate pots then least we can have is Fear in PVP. It's not much worse than people snaring players already engaged in mobs.

So you're not going to address what I already mentioned twice about fear being exploitable? On other pvp servers where fear was enabled (like King and Bandits) people were often feared behind zonelines or inside of walls, and while I know p99 is coded much better, I'm sure there's still a chance of this being possible here as well.

[Slave]

So you're not going to address what I already mentioned twice about fear being exploitable?

Exploitable how?

On other pvp servers where fear was enabled (like King and Bandits) people were often feared behind zonelines or inside of walls, and while I know p99 is coded much better, I'm sure there's still a chance of this being possible here as well.

Oh I see, on another server with totally different code it sometimes didn't work properly. Good one. This nearly attains the usual standard of your reasoning.

[Lazortag]

Exploitable how?



Oh I see, on another server with totally different code it sometimes didn't work properly. Good one. This nearly attains the usual standard of your reasoning.

I'm pretty sure I'm responding to a troll but I figured I'd inform you that zone geometry is pretty much the same across servers. Also they haven't coded fear for pvp here so it would probably work the same as on servers that just use the default PEQ code. To make it non-exploitable they'd have to waste precious dev time on something they're very quickly going to take out anyway, and that's assuming it's even possible for them to code fear so that it can't be exploited. This is just my guess for why it's not being included based on my admittedly limited knowledge of the subject.

I'd also like to add that fear has a much higher probability of making people aggro mobs and take exp deaths than other similar spells, since (a) the player doesn't have to be aggroed onto the NPC before fear is cast (you can fear someone into nearby NPC's for example), and (b) fear doesn't wear off once the player is hit (like with mez). Crission's pixie strike is still okay because if you push someone into mobs, the mobs will break the mez and the player can still escape, so it's not as likely to induce an exp death. Also, if you fear someone in a situation where there are nearby KOS NPC's, there's a high chance you'll cause a train and kill OOR players as well.

Arguing with you guys is pointless though since you'll probably just ignore the bulk of what I'm saying or misinterpret it somehow.

[Slave]

zone geometry is pretty much the same across servers. Also they haven't coded fear for pvp here so it would probably work the same as on servers that just use the default PEQ code. To make it non-exploitable they'd have to waste precious dev time on something they're very quickly going to take out anyway, and that's assuming it's even possible for them to code fear so that it can't be exploited. This is just my guess for why it's not being included based on my admittedly limited knowledge of the subject.

This is a good enough reply regarding the arguments against due to code/devtime, though I suspect that you, like me, have very little idea what it would entail. We are probably way off.

I'd also like to add that fear has a much higher probability of making people aggro mobs and take exp deaths than other similar spells, since (a) the player doesn't have to be aggroed onto the NPC before fear is cast (you can fear someone into nearby NPC's for example), and (b) fear doesn't wear off once the player is hit (like with mez). Crission's pixie strike is still okay because if you push someone into mobs, the mobs will break the mez and the player can still escape, so it's not as likely to induce an exp death. Also, if you fear someone in a situation where there are nearby KOS NPC's, there's a high chance you'll cause a train and kill OOR players as well.

With the high amount of exp death that is caused on this server and goes unpunished, it seems like it never will. To say it is overpowered is disingenuous... SoW is overpowered. Root is overpowered. This is not a good enough reason to not include a classic spell, and it is the bulk of most arguments against it.

Let there be Classic, and the spells shall fall how they may.

[Critical]

Patches from July 2002 - December 2002

Stand Out Occurrences:
- New interface goes live (July 24)
- The Bazaar is introduced (July 24)
- Lifetappers no longer say "Ahhh... I feel much better now!" with every spell (July 24)
- Players are no longer susceptible to other players' fears and charms (July 24)
- /makeleader command introduced & LD group member no longer bugs the group (July 24)
- You can now view and/or delete your own petitions (Sept. 4)
- Hell levels are eliminated (Sept. 4)
- DoT spells cast by different players on an NPC now stack (Sept. 4)
- Clerics gain the Bash ability (Sept. 4)
- Merchant inventories grow to 80 (Sept. 4)
- Items are now linked in the "... has looted an X" messages (Sept. 26)
- Recast times are added to Rods of Mystical Transvergence (Sept. 26)
- Rods of Mystical Transvergence no longer kill you if your max-hitpoints are lower than the conversion (Oct. 17)
- /shield is introduced (Oct. 17)
- Planes of Power goes live (Oct. 21)

Reference: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2002-2.html


** PvP **

- Fixed a bug on Tallon and Vallon Zek that made player characters in
non-human illusions immune to ranged attacks.
- It is no longer possible for PC's to fear other PC's at all on any
server. The same was also done for charm.
- Pets can no longer be affected by charm spells. This should fix the
issue that caused charm spells to make pets disappear.
- NPCs who are pets of players and call for help from other NPCs will
have their cries fall on deaf ears


The reason I am posting this is because I am an actual veteran from Rallos Zek I started during Release and quit during Planes of Power. I was pvp'ing with someone who claimed to be a VZ veteran and he claimed that fear and charm was nerfed in PVP during classic. I knew for 100% sure it was Luclin era, and told him so... I am now posting this along with many other bug fixes to make this server as close to classic as possible. It seems we have a large number of people claiming to know how EQ was during classic. The link referenced has all patch notes from release to Velious and on... Therefore we should be following that time line, and we are not doing so in any way currently.

[Critical]

Also to add, the only thing that was nerfed Fear wise in PVP was AoE fear's in classic, they no longer affected PC's.

------------------------------
March 29, 2000
------------------------------

This morning's update consisted primarily of server-side changes to
improve performance of the game engine in general. No items, spawns,
spells (with the exceptions below), etc., were changed as a result of
this patch.

Area Effect "Fear" spells will no longer work in PvP. This affects a
bard song, as well as the Cleric "Wave of Fear" spell.

Corrected a bug with some of the Resurrection spells that caused them
to return too little experience.

We plan on publishing data and item changes next week if all goes well
on the Test server. We apologize to those who are inconvenienced by
having to wait for the expected changes.

- The EverQuest Team

Reference: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-1.html

[Combobreaker]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

LETS KEEP IT CLASSIC

[Critical]

This also means that AoE fears should not be working on pets, as they are now..

[Scratch&Sniff]

played rallos zek kunark -> luclin, remember getting charmed, remember getting feared, remembered it was awsome

[Dullah]

Would be great to have something like this, permitted resistance to magic even vaguely resembled the system in place during classic. IE. 70mr would make you virtually immune to fears and other cc (excluding things with negative resist checks like enchanter mez).

[Critical]

Destin, will you please provide proof of any of these resist checks you speak of. It seems a lot of you claim to know how things were when in fact you only have your memory to base this off of.

In reality Fear/Charm/CC was resistible but "Virtually Immune" sounds like you're terrified of being dominated in PVP by these changes.

This is how classic was and I am 110% sure that Fears/Charms/CC's landed just as often as other spells like Root. The only difference is was that Root had an extra 20% chance of breaking when the target was hit by a Direct Damage line spell.

This was remedied during classic prior to Kunark Release.

PVP Changes:
- In order to make PVP combat between spellcasters and melee types more
viable some changes to PVP spell effects have been made. All damage
spells cast in PVP combat will do less damage to the PC than the same
spell would do to an NPC. When a PC is under the effect of a root-type
spell there is a 20% chance that they will break free when a direct
damage spell is cast upon them.

[Critical]

Reference: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-1999.html

[Nizzarr]

on sullon zek, you could only charm linkdead players.

Fear worked for a little while then got removed.

[Dullah]

This is how classic was and I am 110% sure that Fears/Charms/CC's landed just as often as other spells like Root.

Exactly, never.

Oh wait, you were bad and didn't know to stack 70mr.

[Critical]

on sullon zek, you could only charm linkdead players.

Fear worked for a little while then got removed.

This is very inaccurate information Nizzar, according to the Patch Updates that EverQuest has posted, they made changes to all 3 servers during Luclin, the only individual changes that were made were to Vallon Zek when it was changed from Coin+1 item to Coin ONLY. Then they implemented a 1 time transfer since the rules on the server were changed post production.

You are both straying away from the subject to obviously have this thread full of random arguments...

Destin, you are incorrect and I did stack MR, and simply put, the resist system has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that Charm/Fear worked in PVP up until the end of Luclin before the release of Planes of Power.

Fight the change all you want but this is classic. I will do everything in my power to have this implemented onto our server to keep it as close to classic time line as possible..

[Dullah]

No one is straying, wtb u reading comprehension.

Fear was not a factor because the way resists worked on live pvp servers was much different. I'm not against any classic mechanic, but adding something as powerful as those spells before fixing the other problems is just going to make matters worse.

[Dullah]

Also, charm and fear was removed from pvp on Rallos a couple months after launch. I don't know how they tried to rework it in on other newer pvp servers, but it was taken out from rallos for obvious reasons.

I haven't found any references dating back to that era, as it happened prior to any EQ websites, but just a quick google search found numerous references to the early removal of fear/charm by players posting throughout the last decade.

[Critical]

Fear was not a factor

You sir did not play any pvp servers, this is something I cannot prove, except by your lack of knowledge.

Also, I played Rallos Zek and there was no such nerf, find something reliable, a source that shows this information...

Allakhazam has every patch and patch note since the games release in 1999. I am also 100% sure there was eq.castersrealm.com prior to EverQuest's release... The information provided on that website was submitted from Alpha and Beta versions of the game that were being tested by the developer and online community.

You are full of false. I have always seen your posts and they are always full of shit, please do not post on this thread unless you are providing evidence or proof of your claims..

Claiming things with no evidence ... Sounds like Destin

[Nizzarr]

How is this innacurate? I won the botb enchanter on sullon zek.

you could only charm linkdead players, single target fear never worked. Only Cleric/bard aoe fear worked.

[Critical]

How would you explain this patch then?

Please stop lying for personal gain.

Patches from July 2002 - December 2002

Stand Out Occurrences:
- New interface goes live (July 24)
- The Bazaar is introduced (July 24)
- Lifetappers no longer say "Ahhh... I feel much better now!" with every spell (July 24)
- Players are no longer susceptible to other players' fears and charms (July 24)

The patch was implemented after Luclin's release.

[Critical]

Also to add, the only thing that was nerfed Fear wise in PVP was AoE fear's in classic, they no longer affected PC's.

------------------------------
March 29, 2000
------------------------------

This morning's update consisted primarily of server-side changes to
improve performance of the game engine in general. No items, spawns,
spells (with the exceptions below), etc., were changed as a result of
this patch.

Area Effect "Fear" spells will no longer work in PvP. This affects a
bard song, as well as the Cleric "Wave of Fear" spell.

Corrected a bug with some of the Resurrection spells that caused them
to return too little experience.

We plan on publishing data and item changes next week if all goes well
on the Test server. We apologize to those who are inconvenienced by
having to wait for the expected changes.

- The EverQuest Team

Reference: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-1.html

AoE fears were fixed before Kunark release as stated in my previous post.

Stop the bullshit Nizzar.

[Critical]

Also for you lying bullshitters...

First patch post from Allakhazam...

April 6, 1999 News Bit from John Smedley
------------------------------

Music works on all sound cards. If you still aren't getting music,
double check to make sure that music is turned on in-game. In addition,
you may not have correct drivers, and/or you may not have it set
properly. In any case, either call our tech support or go to the tech
support area in chat. Please be advised that music DOES have a
performance impact on the game, although it is a small one.

Frame Rate Speedup - Our resident graphics genius sped up the game a
fair amount. Those of you in areas like Greater Faydark should see some
real improvements.

Corpse Bug - We've been tracking a nasty little bug that would make
corpses disappear. I'm sure many of you know firsthand about this one.
We finally nailed it and it should be safe to die again ;)

There's a whole bunch of other stuff that has been fixed as well and is
listed in the patch message.

Just as an FYI we did find a server-side bug that's been fixed and we
will probably have to down the servers one at a time to update since
this bug is one that really needs to be fixed.

One final Item: Yes, glide on banshee's is coming back. It should be in
later this week.

- John Smedley, President and CEO: Verant Interactive, Inc.


EVERQUEST RELEASE DATE : March 16 1999

So you're telling me in the 20 some odd days that it took to post the first patch and fix ALL AUDIO FILES FOR ALL AUDIO CARDS ACROSS THE BOARD that they had time to nerf fear/charm for Rallos Zek and somehow there is ZERO record of it...?

Please get the FUCK out of my thread with your bullshit and lies, Nihilum is terrified of playing on a classic server, they all share account information which if this was classic was agaisnt EULA rules. You guys exploit any chance you get, many of which are famous for exploiting on Blue99 and were banned for it.

[Critical]

Stop being afraid Nihilum, the change is coming, and your death is near.

[Woodcon Valor]

How is this innacurate? I won the botb enchanter on sullon zek.

you could only charm linkdead players, single target fear never worked. Only Cleric/bard aoe fear worked.

stop listening to the trolls THIS quote is the right one, time to implement

[Dullah]

Tomb confirmed completely ignorant of classic eq pvp.

[Critical]

You guys are fighting raw factual evidence from the most famous EQ viable source with...

"I remember all the EQ changes because I played Classic EQ PvP and I won everything in EQ and I also coded the game so the resists system should be coded like my way, you hard working Developers of the free game I enjoy yet exploit, cheat, hack, make illegal currency from know nothing about classic EQ because it's not the way I remember experiencing it."

You fat nerds make me sick, reminds me of this fatass down there.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jpNcAQKQO8

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m32fcliH8N1r98eg0.gif

[Critical]

stop listening to the trolls THIS quote is the right one, time to implement

Time to implement???

You're a moron defending something you don't even understand. Take Destin's dick out of your mouth for a moment and read please.

You would not be saying "time to implement" if you could read a fucking word in English.

[Nirgon]

Charm and fear are not working here and it should stay that way.

It worked for a little while in classic (read: prekunark) with aoe fear being its own seperate little retarded entity.

Then it was looked into because someone within range could fear someone and then ANY PLAYER could attack the feared person (hi2u conflagging a lvl 30 some for an SMR).

I'll tell you another fun story of things that shouldn't work that did for a while on live.

I was linkdead and had disintigrate up for some reason (Velious era). An enchanter friend hit me with his shissar stick, resisted a casted disintigrate then promptly raptured me and ran.

Charm/fear working as intended here.

One change that needs to exist, though, is that charming a mage pet (maybe necro pet too, I just remember seeing it happen to mages) while under control by its owner would make the pet suicide. Not sure what happens here but things like bard song, puppet strings etc should gib summoned (at least mage) pets.

[Dullah]

http://i.imgur.com/Kk6vs.jpg

[Critical]

Destin trolling Destin?

I'm confused now, please leave the bug forum Destin.

[Critical]

Bump

[Heavydrop]

Also, charm and fear was removed from pvp on Rallos a couple months after launch

This is what I remember.
When I first started on RZ (roughly May '99) it was still possible to charm and fear other players. It was also possible to loot their weapon/shield/ranged slots (I lost my uber Dwarven Axe outside of Crushbone)
It was a real menace to players to be charmed and then made to attack the guards or to be taken deep into the castle in Crushbone throne room and to have the charmer break charm, etc.

The last time I remember someone being able to charm other players was when
my druid was old enough to self gate (there fore somewhere around 19-24) and that would have been around November '99

I remember this because a bard friend of mine was being charmed by the guildleader of Darkenbane (aka Dorkenbane) Kerrygetz in North Karana.
I didn't know she was being charmed but when I came upon her she was fighting a griffawn/griffenne and was dying.
Jumping to her aide I began to heal her. I noticed a DE hanging out watching her, so I thought he was in a group. When I started healing her he took off and ran to East Karana. I thought that odd. When she had killed the bird (or during the process of it) she told me that he had charmed her and was using her to kill the bird, most likely with the intention of letting it beat her down then mezzing it, breaking charm, killing her, then killing the bird and that my healing had interferred with this process.
I hunted him to no avail so I probably didn't have track by then and was only level 19

[Critical]

That would be 6 months then, thank you for the mental evidence.

Fear/Charm was not removed until Luclin.

Bump!

[Nirgon]

Fear and charm was gone before Kunark.

AoE fear was removed a little later because dumbs on Verant team forgot to remove.

You cut it out now, K.

[Critical]

Nirgon you've got 0 evidence of your claims, I have linked proof to my sources of when they nerfed Fear/Charm for Player Versus Player... It was clearly nerfed in Luclin..


Keep trying though... You don't even play here, you must be Supreme's troll account.

[Nirgon]

The evidence is in my sig.


Player Datasheet and History for Nirgon
First Seen in Norrath 2000-03-12 13:28:05, Last Seen in Norrath 2002-01-17 19:49:58


Wish it showed /played during the classic era as well as # of pvp kills. I'll admit grey areas or where I need to reinforce my memory. This is not such an area sir.

It doesn't show my time in Darkenbane oddly enough, hum!

Unfortunately people choose to believe this doesn't exist, oh well. I also brought up changes in the necro heal thread and had Zyrino who won the best of the best on RZ as well as almost winning the whole thing come post backing me up. /shrug

It's as classic as you guys want it to be I guess.

[kaos057]

Why can't you fear players? You could in classic. If a shaman can blind then fear should work too. Even if fearing a player makes them just stand there.

[heartbrand]

At this point in timeline it was removed regardless, but yes it should've been in on release but devs made decision that it was imbalanced and not to include it much like charm. Now why non classic decisions like that were made but tstaff eighteen second stun and bard song lulz are in I don't know.

[kaos057]

The ability to fear players was removed on July 24, 2002 which is after luclin was released.

[Zalaerian]

The ability to fear players was removed on July 24, 2002 which is after luclin was released.

No, very wrong. Was removed pre kunark

[Nirgon]

Yeap. No fear or charm here bud.

[kaos057]

from: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches.html

Patches from July 2002 - December 2002

Stand Out Occurrences:
- New interface goes live (July 24)
- The Bazaar is introduced (July 24)
- Lifetappers no longer say "Ahhh... I feel much better now!" with every spell (July 24)
- Players are no longer susceptible to other players' fears and charms (July 24)
- /makeleader command introduced & LD group member no longer bugs the group (July 24)
- You can now view and/or delete your own petitions (Sept. 4)
- Hell levels are eliminated (Sept. 4)
- DoT spells cast by different players on an NPC now stack (Sept. 4)
- Clerics gain the Bash ability (Sept. 4)
- Merchant inventories grow to 80 (Sept. 4)
- Items are now linked in the "... has looted an X" messages (Sept. 26)
- Recast times are added to Rods of Mystical Transvergence (Sept. 26)
- Rods of Mystical Transvergence no longer kill you if your max-hitpoints are lower than the conversion (Oct. 17)
- /shield is introduced (Oct. 17)
- Planes of Power goes live (Oct. 21)
- Planes of Power flags can be done out of order (Dec. 19)

[Nirgon]

Dude PoP and Luclin spell changes broke shit that they fixed. LIKE THE NECRO HEAL. Cough!!!

[kaos057]

and http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20020724.html

[kaos057]

well i started playing live when velios came out and i most definitely remember being feared before. most of the time you would just stand there but it definitely worked.

[Num1RecommendedByDentists]

lol

[Nizzarr]

single target fear didnt work on sullon zek, just the PBAOE cleric one. You couldnt charm players directly but.. you could charm enchanter mobs and they could charm people for you.

You could charm linkdead players as well.

[kaos057]

So much for a classic server

[kaos057]

ps this server is nothing like SZ. You should know that.

[kaos057]

by the way I was charmed by a bard not even a week ago. so why is it that charm sometimes works but fear is hardcoded to never work.

[Faerie]

by the way I was charmed by a bard not even a week ago. so why is it that charm sometimes works but fear is hardcoded to never work.

Are you sure you weren't mezzed?

[kaos057]

I was in OT at the spell merchants when I got the message you are no longer in control or something like that. I then swung on a merchant one time. Luckily the merchant just ignored it.

[Lazortag]

from: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches.html

Patches from July 2002 - December 2002
..

- Players are no longer susceptible to other players' fears and charms (July 24)

I believe this is referring to duels on PvE servers, but I could be wrong. I know that fear was taken out of duels on PvE servers later than its removal from pvp servers.

[Awwalike]

I was in OT at the spell merchants when I got the message you are no longer in control or something like that. I then swung on a merchant one time. Luckily the merchant just ignored it.

wut

[Reddi who?]

charming players to attack merchants is kunark era

need to devote all human resources to this development effort

Lazortag could be right about it lasting longer on PvE servers, that's where I did it.

[Stasis]

Can someone tell me how to play a rogue?