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View Full Version : Game Mechanics: 50 melee vs 50 caster = epic fail.


Mleh
05-24-2010, 12:13 AM
I played PVP for years, and I used to slay many a caster. I'm a lvl50 sk with maxed skills and fighting a robe caster is a complete joke.

I missed a necro sitting down 3 times in a row, not to mention missing him consistantly every other hit if i could even hit him for 1/2 my normal dmg.

He was able to defeat me without a pet and standing still like I was a joke. I am in 1/2 planar gear with a planar weapon.

This is not correct.

Below is a post of me just hitting him standing still casting a few spells.
http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/65/necvssk.jpg[/URL]

-- I believe the pvp of this EQ was adjusted for future weapon damage - in classic EQ only spell dmg was reduced to balance.

President
05-24-2010, 01:33 AM
now thats pretty fucked

Gorroth
05-24-2010, 05:48 AM
Been this way for a while. =/

JayFiveAlive
05-24-2010, 10:32 AM
I really hope this gets looked at... that is just so wrong. It definitely should not be like that, never was in classic!

Gorroth
05-24-2010, 12:04 PM
Then again, it's PvP so I suppose it should take a backseat to other issues.

Omnimorph
05-24-2010, 01:14 PM
I would have been too embarrassed to post this. Good for you Mleh! ;)

Mleh
05-26-2010, 04:00 AM
Bump, but seriously GMs want to do PvP events like the Zek CTF and its completely embarrassing to even join up, I am totally against any form of PvP as long as this is left as is.

Solution is too simple just to lift melee dmg pvp restraints for atk rate/dmg% - it was always based off opponents AC just like PvE, spell damage was always 2/3 due to the obvious reason that NPCs have 2-3x the hp players do and spells were made to kill them.

From what I've observed it seems that the pvp formulas nerfed melees due to much higher damage weapons and higher stats that would balance it in newer eq, but its quite obvious classic was never that extreme in stats to where melees would need a pvp nerf.

I understand there are priorities in debugging, but I'm not asking for a rallos zek weekly on the spot correction to PvP balance, just a simple fix to give melees their fighting chance back. (its bad enough in classic as is with nobody having MR or higher damage weapons)

Jify
05-26-2010, 08:10 AM
(its bad enough in classic as is with nobody having MR or higher damage weapons)

This is basically all I read.

But.. WHAT?!

When I was playing CTF, I could leisurely melee any caster class down using only my fists. Even the Necros had a hard time landing anything on me. Just need to focus on resists. ;)

Kainzo
05-26-2010, 09:30 AM
This is basically all I read.

But.. WHAT?!

When I was playing CTF, I could leisurely melee any caster class down using only my fists. Even the Necros had a hard time landing anything on me. Just need to focus on resists. ;)

Maybe it's just hybrids - I played back in Classic (Paladin) and I never remember the miss rate being so high or taking such large hits.

Thankfully this is something can be resolved and adjusted.

Mleh
05-26-2010, 12:38 PM
This is basically all I read.

But.. WHAT?!

When I was playing CTF, I could leisurely melee any caster class down using only my fists. Even the Necros had a hard time landing anything on me. Just need to focus on resists. ;)

Believe monk, war, rog have higher skill caps and much faster hits is the reason you dont notice it as much as I do with a 2hander, again in classic on my monk i recall hitting players full dmg with fists and 2h, are your punchs being reduced?

And yes I know its on me to increase my own MR, but in general people don't make MR jewelry like pvp aserver does.

When I played CTF, a mage laughed hysterically at me while his pet killed me.

Kainzo
05-26-2010, 02:52 PM
I found this in the old patch notes.

PVP Changes:

In order to make PVP combat between spellcasters and melee types more viable some changes to PVP spell effects have been made. All damage spells cast in PVP combat will do less damage to the PC than the same spell would do to an NPC. When a PC is under the effect of a root-type spell there is a 20% chance that they will break free when a direct damage spell is cast upon them.

guineapig
05-26-2010, 03:53 PM
This is basically all I read.

But.. WHAT?!

When I was playing CTF, I could leisurely melee any caster class down using only my fists. Even the Necros had a hard time landing anything on me. Just need to focus on resists. ;)

Well, yes but a bard with good drums can increase his own MR by what like 150 with the right twist? ;)

And I'm guessing you have a full set of diamond/BD and planar gear so you're probably hovering around max cap on your resists when you want to be. :D

Aeolwind
05-26-2010, 05:04 PM
No offense intended to the OP, truly. But in general, casters > Melee. Only defense, like folks have said, is resists. I doubt we'll get deeeeep into PVP mitigation and avoidance as it stands. Too much other pertinent crap needs fixed. Unless Haynar stumbles upon it.

Mleh
05-26-2010, 06:19 PM
No offense intended to the OP, truly. But in general, casters > Melee. Only defense, like folks have said, is resists. I doubt we'll get deeeeep into PVP mitigation and avoidance as it stands. Too much other pertinent crap needs fixed. Unless Haynar stumbles upon it.

I wont get into an argument about PvP here cause itll go on forever, but the fact that casters mitigate damage as well as a planar geared tank is not correct - It just seems like a simple fix. In any case thanks for reviewing the post.

Aeolwind
05-26-2010, 06:33 PM
Sadly, it's not. If i'm not mistaken, player to player interactions (Aside from healing) are handled by a separate set of code. I think it's a flat damage reduction (Among other things) to the interaction on any detrimental effect from a player that targets another player.

It took us literally months to figure out how to get the Manastone around this road block.

(Again, I'm not a source guy, I have to work off of hearsay and speculation in some cases. I am certain regarding the flat damage reduction....that pissed me off.)

Case and point: We've been live 8 months and just now able to tweak NPC/PC Combat interactions.