Lifetab spells

[Shinko]

LifeTap spell line


as we all know they don't land and they were nerf with that hoop. Any word if we could get this reverted or anything?


http://eq.magelo.com/spell/341
Resist: Magic -200
Resist Adjust: -200
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=341

[Brut]

/agree

Thought the resist mod was changed due to hoop abuse, but that isn't much of a factor anymore? Gib SK/Nec some lovin pls.

[Xadion]

tap you dumb ogers and trolls! Tap, lifeTAP

lol

anywho...

yes, please review the hoop nerf and get lifetaps back to the way they where on classic...nearly irresistible...

[Nirgon]

The fix for this (just little old me here again):

Make another spell called Spirit Tap

Give it a different spell ID, jack its resist however like taps are done now.

Stick it on the hoop.

Revert resist changes to all the other taps except this newly created one.

[Xanthias]

The fix for this (just little old me here again):

Make another spell called Spirit Tap

Give it a different spell ID, jack its resist however like taps are done now.

Stick it on the hoop.

Revert resist changes to all the other taps except this newly created one.

Get no arguement out of me on this.
Necro's aren't supposed to be useless until Velious :)

[Haul]

shinko how did you manage to get above lvl 30, lifetab? *facepalm

[bizzum]

I think the resists could just be reverted at this point. With the award rate for hoops being set down so low and the recharge being set to such a high value, there really is no need to worry that hoops are going to be put into use again. I also doubt that there is a secret stash of 500 hoops for use when needed by anybody!

[cyryllis]

I never understood this change either. I played a necro on live and remember lifetaps almost never resisting. Arent they supposed to have -200 MR checks?

Makes absolutely no sense to nerf multiple classes core spells that are meant to increase their survival rate, simply because people were abusing a classic item.

/agree with making a different spell for the hoop.

[Shinko]

I never understood this change either. I played a necro on live and remember lifetaps almost never resisting. Arent they supposed to have -200 MR checks?

Makes absolutely no sense to nerf multiple classes core spells that are meant to increase their survival rate, simply because people were abusing a classic item.

/agree with making a different spell for the hoop.


/agree!

[Jjlent]

bump

[JayDee]

The fix for this (just little old me here again):

Make another spell called Spirit Tap

Give it a different spell ID, jack its resist however like taps are done now.

Stick it on the hoop.

Revert resist changes to all the other taps except this newly created one.

obv

[Nirgon]

Maybe after Rogean gets done fixing up the new staff / petition tools brudda. Think you'll just hafta endure till then. A dev 1 liner response would be nice tho.

[maximum]

I highly suggest you read this post (and all replies): http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19. Read every word.

Then, edit your original post. Developers will probably be more receptive to it then.

[Shinko]

don't know what else to say

/bump

[Shinko]

Bumpz

[Shinko]

^

[uygi]

necros havent lifetapped raid mobs in over a year.


i assume thats what youre complaining about because i never have had a regular mob resist a lifetap.

Spite golems, black reavers, emperor chottal don't count as regular mobs? There are others but that's off the top of my head.

[Brut]

Spite golems, black reavers, emperor chottal don't count as regular mobs? There are others but that's off the top of my head.

Tolapumj resisting Life Leech made me prty sadfaced for one. And prty much all the dark elves in Kithicor.

[Shinko]

love for SK and necros

[kanras]

/agree

Thought the resist mod was changed due to hoop abuse, but that isn't much of a factor anymore? Gib SK/Nec some lovin pls.

No. The resist mod was changed (from unresistable to -200) because there was research that showed it was getting resisted by the majority of raid mobs where we are in the timeline.

[Nirgon]

I'll get you the raw this week

[Xadion]

While anyone is rummaging around patch notes, look up the patch note that changes how SK Disc unholy aura works- in that it referances lifetap spells... nm I'll go find it... ahh there it is

DECEMBER 19, 2000

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today's patch primarily consists of tuning of Velious zones as well as content and other additions. In addition, the following changes have been implemented on the Live servers:
...
...

The Shadow Knight's "Unholy Aura" discipline has received an enhancement. When in use, harmtouch resistances will be checked versus disease instead of magic. In addition, harmtouch will resist in the same fashion as lifetap spells, meaning that unless the creature is immune to disease, you should get full damage most of the time.

...
...
...


case and point is... lifetaps have always and should always be nigh unresistable and 99% of the time full dmg, I remeber that SKs where usualy "free" albeit crappy DPS as they could usualy sustain themselves with lifetaps throughout most AoEs on bosses.

edit again: also this patch note indicates and confirms that lifetaps are not normal spells in the way they work- in the "resist is desease" paired with "...unless the creature is immune to disease" and "should get full damage most of the time" meaning that it confirms many of the things posted here- A) lifetaps are disease B) unresistable sans 100% disease mob - aka 100% or 98% mr "epic" mobs should be able to be tapped as should "bosses" etc etc- for full dmg, and that lifetap dmg when not "full" and that is is VERY rare not to be full- it still is REALLY close to full like 90-100% dmg

[Nlaar]

While anyone is rummaging around patch notes, look up the patch note that changes how SK Disc unholy aura works- in that it referances lifetap spells... nm I'll go find it... ahh there it is



case and point is... lifetaps have always and should always be nigh unresistable and 99% of the time full dmg, I remeber that SKs where usualy "free" albeit crappy DPS as they could usualy sustain themselves with lifetaps throughout most AoEs on bosses.

I think that about sums up everything right there, thanks X!

[Shinko]

thanks for the info guys :)

[Treats]

edit again: also this patch note indicates and confirms that lifetaps are not normal spells in the way they work- in the "resist is desease" paired with "...unless the creature is immune to disease" and "should get full damage most of the time" meaning that it confirms many of the things posted here- A) lifetaps are disease B) unresistable sans 100% disease mob - aka 100% or 98% mr "epic" mobs should be able to be tapped as should "bosses" etc etc- for full dmg, and that lifetap dmg when not "full" and that is is VERY rare not to be full- it still is REALLY close to full like 90-100% dmg

Lifetaps will check Disease ONLY when Unholy Aura is active.

Every other Lifetap and Harmtouch is still Magic.

Harmtouch and all Lifetap Spells are listed as Magic in the spdat.eff that I have from 3 months after this patch.

It's kind of difficult to find info on this but it looks like there should only be a small chance for something to resist a Lifetap but it really should depend on your level vs. the mob's level.

If the Mob you are casting on is 6+ levels above you though it should be a full resist every time.

[Xadion]

Lifetaps will check Disease ONLY when Unholy Aura is active.

Every other Lifetap and Harmtouch is still Magic.

Harmtouch and all Lifetap Spells are listed as Magic in the spdat.eff that I have from 3 months after this patch.

It's kind of difficult to find info on this but it looks like there should only be a small chance for something to resist a Lifetap but it really should depend on your level vs. the mob's level.

If the Mob you are casting on is 6+ levels above you though it should be a full resist every time.

Petition me for "flaming outside RNF" again if you will...

but...

WTF?

"When in use, harmtouch resistances will be checked versus disease instead of magic. In addition, harmtouch will resist in the same fashion as lifetap spells"

What we are talking about is how lifetaps are resisted if they even are... this patch note explains it... I remeber alot of talk back in the day about exactly how lifetaps are factored- as it is not a straight XXXX# magic or disease-- from what I recall of the discussions lifetaps where some odd form of 2 checks with the pass given the go- meaning it would somehow roll vs magic and diseas and whatever one passed it would use it...however that is just my recollection and not anything to be used here.

But what we have here is...a full general explanation to how lifetaps work => "harmtouch will resist in the same fashion as lifetap spells, meaning that unless the creature is immune to disease, you should get full damage most of the time."

it is saying "Like lifetaps do" not "When this is active the disc will also make lifetaps act like this" seriously dude?

[kanras]

Necros aren't custom 'nerfed'. This is era specific to what they should be. The people arguing that are misinformed of the situation. Lifetaps went from completely unresistable to a resist mod, which is correct.

Here's some reading.
http://web.archive.org/web/200101231906/http://forums.castersrealm.com/eq/Forum8/HTML/000930.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200101271415/http://forums.castersrealm.com/eq/Forum8/HTML/001495.html

Sep 2000 - Dec 2000

-our life taps are all compl. resisted at the ubermobs,

BUT in raids*and the high end game isnt about soloing,its about raids*we cant land the taps at the ubermobs.the result is,that we cant use lich,we cant use pact,because we cant replace the lost hp.thats why our class is broken at the high levels.

Epic monsters and bosses with lvl 55+ IMMUNE to ALL necro dots - we cannt land em even after shamans malo mob (if they can land it)
Those mosters also immune to ALL our DD as well including life drain.

Taps are quite resistable by the dragons and what not along with maestro.

Lifetap doesn't work on most uber most so it's not unresistable. Maestro, Naggy, Vox, trakanon, are all completly immune to the spell.

We went through all of this a year ago.

[Treats]

Lifetaps will check Disease ONLY when Unholy Aura is active.

My fault, I was thinking of Leechcurse (this is a Lifetap thread, lol).

The Unholy Aura discipline was changed from MR to DR because it was getting resisted and resulted in a blown disc for 72 minutes.

Most mobs (typically high end bosses/etc) had higher Magic Resistance than Disease Resistance, a lot were Magic Immune.

Patch note from January 9, 2001:

http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20010109.html

The 'Unholy Aura' Discipline now gives a 50% bonus to Harmtouch (compared with the previous 25%) and causes it to save versus disease, which should result in even fewer resists in most high-level encounters.

Any mob here on P99 that is Unslowable you should not be able to Lifetap. The reason being is because back then before they could specifically tag a mob as Unslowable it just had Magic Resistance that was too high to ever overcome.

You can find a lot of information here on why lifetaps were initially changed from unresistable to resistable:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.games.everquest/search?group=alt.games.everquest&q=lifetap+resists&qt_g=Search+this+group

Petition me for "flaming outside RNF" again if you will...

Have no idea where this came from, I have never petitioned you for flaming in the bug forum....

[Nirgon]

Any mob here on P99 that is Unslowable you should not be able to Lifetap. The reason being is because back then before they could specifically tag a mob as Unslowable it just had Magic Resistance that was too high to ever overcome.

Wow. Posts like this get me going in the AM.

[Shinko]

lure of life all im saying

[Razdeline]

Moving this here:

Quote:
DMF works in kedge, but isn't castable in there.
Not sure if that's how it works here?

Found another:

Quote:
Lifetaps worked on cazic thule last time I tried....also bond worked fine
I havent tried dots do to the bug mentioned above so I cant comment on those.

I assume cazic is a uber mob?

hehe
Quote:
Thats wrong all my lifetaps hit that treant in pog he still got me with his 700 hits though.
Looks like Necro taps landed on some mobs, but not all. At least these posts are specific on what mobs they DO land on, though.

[Razdeline]

I'd encourage everyone to start reading:

All Caster's Realm Necro Forums C. Aug/2001

http://web.archive.org/web/20010806063111/http://forums.castersrealm.com/cgi-bin/eq/ultimatebb.cgi?category=11