Items with worn effects (i.e. Regeneration/Flowing Thought)

[nilbog]

I need to compile a list of classic items which should have worn effects instead of the generic Regeneration +, Mana Regeneration +, Attack +. These are non-classic and I am doing away with them.

For example:

-Fungus Covered Scale tunic should read Effect: Fungal Regrowth instead of Regeneration +15.
-Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate should read Effect: Regeneration instead of Regeneration +5.
-Rubicite Breastplate should read Effect: Rubicite Aura instead of Regeneration +3.
-Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl should read Effect: Flowing Thought I instead of Effect: Mana Regeneration +1

These are fixed for the next patch.

HP Regen:
Rubicite Breastplate (Rubicite Aura)
Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate (Regeneration)
Zlandicar's Heart (Regeneration)

Mana Regen:
Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl (Flowing Thought I)

Regen/Attack:
Belt of Dwarfslaying (Aura of Battle)

Attack:
Can't recall names off the top of my head, but I believe they were labeled Vengeance.


List some more if you know them please.

On a similar topic, we are looking into removing (Worn) and (Must Equip) on items.

[Eccezan]

might as well remove casting time as well if possible! (as shown below)

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/a/8/a8ad914e9c895447eef66885a2ec8943.png

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/c/4/c4d8ae15240cfe91ad8d05b4767a218c.png

[Brut]

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro got +10 attack, not sure what it oughta be as an effect.
Spirit Wracked Cord also had Aura of Battle methinks?

[Raz]

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro had Firefist

Any item with +10atk/2hp regen is Aura of Battle: (Dorfslaying belt, Silver Mask of the Slayer, Boots of Deep Thought, Boots of Silent Striding, Pauldrons of Ferocity, etc)

Vengeance items were introduced in Luclin

[Ele]

Don't know if these GM events have been done (or will be).

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6456
Al'Kabor's Expansive Mind = mana regeneration +10

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/5/e/5e305651ecef3215e892121d1408a1b4.png

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6854
Prime Healer's Blessing = regeneration +15

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/4/a/4a20a6791a648787d8a23c8ab4f5049d.png

[Droxx]

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro had Firefist

Any item with +10atk/2hp regen is Aura of Battle: (Dorfslaying belt, Silver Mask of the Slayer, Boots of Deep Thought, Boots of Silent Striding, Pauldrons of Ferocity, etc)

Vengeance items were introduced in Luclin

Chestplate of Vindication too.

[Happyfeet]

Ton of East TOV quest stuff...

Buckler of Insight (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6508)

Silver Mask of the Slayer (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6418)

Mask of the Silver Eyes (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6187)

White Dragon Statue (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6131)

White Dragon Idol (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=14610)

Boots of Deep Thought (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6097)

Boots of Silent Striding (ETOV) (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6510)

[Ele]

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/d/7/d7d3d61e2c21075422c4029da3ea7530.png

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6765

[Brinkman]

Complete ( mostly ! ) list ( please note these are only WORN items, no triggered items with the same effects are listed )


WORN Aura of battle Items up to Luclin ( but not including )

Belt of Dwarf Slaying

Belt of the Great Turtle

Boots of Deep Thought

Boots of Silent Striding

Chestplate of Vindication

Plated Boots of Ill Fates ( PoM revamp? )

Silver Mask of the Slayer

Spirit Wracked Cord (Arms)


Flowing Thought Items up to Luclin ( but not including )

FT 1

Brain of Cazic Thule
Buckler of Insight
Choker of the Wretched
Eye of Cazic Thule
Mask of the Silver Eyes
Robe of Inspiration
Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl
White Dragon Statue

FT 2

Crown of Narandi
White Dragonscale Boots

FT 3

Golden leaf earring
Sal'Varae's Robe of Darkness


FT 4

NONE

FT 5

Essence of nature

No FT items higher ( please note that the CT revamp came out 3 months after luclin release and there are a few FT items that drop there, these items will never be on P99 I. E. Viscid Slime Gloves FT4 )

Sceptre of Al'Kabor ( Gm event item, First ever worn mana regen item given on a live server )
Al'Kabor's Expansive Mind on this item is Mana regen 10


Regen Items

Regen 15

Fungus Covered Scale Tunic
Shroud of Longevity
The Prime Healers Bulwark ( GM Item, Artifact Velious era )

Regen 10

None

Regen 5

Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate
Zlandicar's Heart
Shield of Hatred ( GM event item, artifact Kunark era )

Regen 3

Rubicite Breastplate


Attack only ( firefist etc)

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro ( firefist )

Holgresh Spirit Beads ( Grim aura )


Ragebringer should only show the effect of " Seething fury " The attack and haste should be hidden if its not.




That should be everything, I may have missed a GM item, possible an attack only item.


Please deposit a few of these on my Monk Usagii on blue for my troubles! ( yes its classic !! )

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=911

[Atmas]

Well if we are doing stuff not out yet:
Robe of Inspiration
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=5374

[Ele]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=4808

Fungal Regrowth

[Brinkman]

Plane of Fear 2.0

Brain of Cazic Thule : Flowing Thought I

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=5513

Eye of Cazic Thule : Flowing Thought I

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=5558

[Kender]

Velious items:

10th Ring war ( yes these will be in velious, I was there on Povar when Bentos Got his a few Months before Luclin )



This is a clicky effect not a worn effect. instant cast 10 regen 10 DS 10 Atk

[Brinkman]

Velious

Plane of Growth

Golden Leaf earring : Flowing Thought III

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7026



Essence of Nature : Flowing Thought V ( yes FT5, pre luclin )

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7043

[Brinkman]

This is a clicky effect not a worn effect. instant cast 10 regen 10 DS 10 Atk

I did not say the 10th ring, I was simply saying the items I listed are obtained during the 10th ring war.

[Kender]

I did not say the 10th ring, I was simply saying the items I listed are obtained during the 10th ring war.

opps sorry so you did. carry on 8)

[Brinkman]

Velious

Sleeper's Tomb 1.0


Shroud of Longevity Fungal Regrowth ( hp regen 15 )

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=4808

[Maze513]

when was Earring of Solstice?

[Miller]

when was Earring of Solstice?

Luclin

[Brinkman]

Velious

Temple of Veeshan


Sal'Varae's Robe of Darkness Flowing Thought III

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6402

[Brinkman]

Attack:
Can't recall names off the top of my head, but I believe they were labeled Vengeance.

As already stated vengeance was not added until luclin.

All items with aura of battle ( 10 attack + 2 hp regen ) should read " Aura of Battle " in classic:

Belt of the Great Turtle

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3981

[Brinkman]

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro had Firefist

Any item with +10atk/2hp regen is Aura of Battle: (Dorfslaying belt, Silver Mask of the Slayer, Boots of Deep Thought, Boots of Silent Striding, Pauldrons of Ferocity, etc)

Vengeance items were introduced in Luclin

ALSO!

Please do not confuse WORN Aura of Battle with TRIGGERED Aura of Battle

Pauldrons of Ferocity is right click insta cast

Boots of Deep Thought is worn.

Some items still have right click Aura of battle to this day on live so please be careful that you dont change these items to worn:

Pauldrons of Ferocity

Fearsome Shield

The same goes for firefist:

Berserker's Ring

All Monk Velious boots

[Brinkman]

Ok I'm sobering up =) Dunno how I even got here!!!

[Lagaidh]

This thread gives me a thrill =)

[kungfugeek]

What about the FT3 boots from the CT remake?

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/f/f/ff6db9b15bc78013a3b1e62090b88072.png

[Ele]

What about the FT3 boots from the CT remake?

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/f/f/ff6db9b15bc78013a3b1e62090b88072.png

Luclin update, not classic.

[kungfugeek]

Ahh thought the CT remake came out before Luclin, my bad.

[nilbog]

Thanks for the replies. Looks good and helps me out a lot.

If any more are discovered, bump this thread!

[Snackies]

I recall on live my Enchanter had the Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawl (quested via one of those tradeskill check questlines) which had Flowing Thought 3 on it.

The shawl just before that had FT1 (can't remember the name of it for the life of me **edit** just realized Nilbog noted the name "Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl" on the original post).

Unless that was added after Velious?

[falkun]

The 8th shawl was added post-luclin, and will not be on this server. The 7th shawl (FT1) is the best you will see here.

[Brinkman]

Ahh thought the CT remake came out before Luclin, my bad.

Although you have already been corrected, it really peeves me off when people don't read and just post stuff.

If you dont feel like doing the research and want to just "remember " stuff. Keep it to yourself.

On the first page, I clearly stated

" No FT items higher ( please note that the CT revamp came out 3 months after luclin release and there are a few FT items that drop there, these items will never be on P99 I. E. Viscid Slime Gloves FT4 )"

I stated this because I KNEW someone would post those items and not do research.

/rant off.

[Happyfeet]

Although I completely agree, I'd rather be giving the developers too much information than not enough. Let me direct you to Ftree's post which blew my mind with accuracy (from the bugs forums on WoN)... I just think it's one of the best posts in a while regarding digging up past information.


Baub I actually agree completely. Problem is, we're talking about a 6-week window on live in 2000-2001 when this was *POSSIBLY* an issue. EQ was moving very fast at the time and there is an absence of information about the mechanics of WoN due to this very short time frame. After scouring the internet, you'll find there's little concrete evidence for anyone's opinion on the matter here, including Kanras's. Therefore, I believe some weight should be given to those who actually obtained and used their leafblower prior to the 1/9/2001 patch and remember how it worked. That is all!

[Messianic]

What about the FT3 boots from the CT remake?

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/f/f/ff6db9b15bc78013a3b1e62090b88072.png

clearly a ranger item

[kungfugeek]

Although you have already been corrected, it really peeves me off when people don't read and just post stuff.

If you dont feel like doing the research and want to just "remember " stuff. Keep it to yourself.

On the first page, I clearly stated

" No FT items higher ( please note that the CT revamp came out 3 months after luclin release and there are a few FT items that drop there, these items will never be on P99 I. E. Viscid Slime Gloves FT4 )"

I stated this because I KNEW someone would post those items and not do research.

/rant off.

Sup, tool?

[azeth]

Sup, tool?

I think you're misunderstanding his point. You shouldn't provide info to Nilbog unless you have concrete evidence. He's not going to do anything based on people's memories.

Was kind of a tool response tho haha :p

[nilbog]

Complete ( mostly ! ) list ( please note these are only WORN items, no triggered items with the same effects are listed )

WORN Aura of battle Items up to Luclin ( but not including )
Belt of Dwarf Slaying
Belt of the Great Turtle
Boots of Deep Thought
Boots of Silent Striding
Chestplate of Vindication
Plated Boots of Ill Fates ( PoM revamp? )
Silver Mask of the Slayer
Spirit Wracked Cord (Arms)

Flowing Thought Items up to Luclin ( but not including )

FT 1
Brain of Cazic Thule
Buckler of Insight
Choker of the Wretched
Eye of Cazic Thule
Mask of the Silver Eyes
Robe of Inspiration
Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl
White Dragon Statue

FT 2
Crown of Narandi
White Dragonscale Boots

FT 3
Golden leaf earring
Sal'Varae's Robe of Darkness


FT 4
NONE

FT 5
Essence of nature

Sceptre of Al'Kabor ( Gm event item, First ever worn mana regen item given on a live server )
Al'Kabor's Expansive Mind on this item is Mana regen 10


Regen Items

Regen 15
Fungus Covered Scale Tunic
Shroud of Longevity
The Prime Healers Bulwark ( GM Item, Artifact Velious era )

Regen 10
None

Regen 5
Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate
Zlandicar's Heart
Shield of Hatred ( GM event item, artifact Kunark era )

Regen 3
Rubicite Breastplate

Attack only ( firefist etc)

Blazing Gauntlets of Fennin Ro ( firefist )
Holgresh Spirit Beads ( Grim aura )

Ragebringer should only show the effect of " Seething fury " The attack and haste should be hidden if its not.


All of this is fixed for next patch.

Thanks to everyone who helped compile this information.

[Treats]

http://poopspant.com/vp/eq000432.jpg

Difficult to find any info on the other things with Flowing Though I+.

Tunare wasn't itemized until late 2001 just before Luclin so those drops didnt exist with Flowing Thought III and V.

First entry I could find on the Crown of Narandi was added on November 9, 2001. (This item was also Pal/SK only).

Perhaps the Ring War wasn't itemized until then? I cannot remember.

Couldn't find anything on the White Dragonscale Boots but I think that part of the quest may have been added later also.

Turning in the Head of Tormax to Yelinak resulted in the Clawed Griffon Sword at first for sure, possibly noone thought to turn it in again to get the Boots reward? Dunno.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

I need to compile a list of classic items which should have worn effects instead of the generic Regeneration +, Mana Regeneration +, Attack +. These are non-classic and I am doing away with them.

For example:

-Fungus Covered Scale tunic should read Effect: Fungal Regrowth instead of Regeneration +15.
-Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate should read Effect: Regeneration instead of Regeneration +5.
-Rubicite Breastplate should read Effect: Rubicite Aura instead of Regeneration +3.
-Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl should read Effect: Flowing Thought I instead of Effect: Mana Regeneration +1

These are fixed for the next patch.

HP Regen:
Rubicite Breastplate (Rubicite Aura)
Ceremonial Iksar Chestplate (Regeneration)
Zlandicar's Heart (Regeneration)

Mana Regen:
Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl (Flowing Thought I)

Regen/Attack:
Belt of Dwarfslaying (Aura of Battle)

Attack:
Can't recall names off the top of my head, but I believe they were labeled Vengeance.


List some more if you know them please.

On a similar topic, we are looking into removing (Worn) and (Must Equip) on items.

Small aside, but are we getting the classic 1 ft 1, 1 ft 2, 1 ft 3 (ft's of the same type not stacking) or the more luclinish ft just adding regen? Seemed like it was bug before but not sure.

[Arteker]

All of this is fixed for next patch.

Thanks to everyone who helped compile this information.

i think u forgot berserkers ring cliky firefist.

[Arteker]

Small aside, but are we getting the classic 1 ft 1, 1 ft 2, 1 ft 3 (ft's of the same type not stacking) or the more luclinish ft just adding regen? Seemed like it was bug before but not sure.

FT doesnt stack prior to luclin , its on patch files . if u get lucky to get tunare item that ft would override ur ft 1 item from ct.

[nilbog]

Small aside, but are we getting the classic 1 ft 1, 1 ft 2, 1 ft 3 (ft's of the same type not stacking) or the more luclinish ft just adding regen? Seemed like it was bug before but not sure.

Needs to be researched to get a conclusive opinion. I have heard that the original developer statements were wrong, and that FT did stack. I have also heard that flowing thought shouldn't stack with flowing thought of the same level.

For example, should a Flowing Thought I item stack with another Flowing Thought I item?

With a cap of Flowing Thought 15 being in place, was that an arbitrary number or was it based on: FT1+FT2+FT3+FT4+FT5 = FT15 ?

[Arteker]

From the EQ Developer's Corner:
posted 01-08-2002 11:13 AM user search report post
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bigmeeno wrote:
From todays patch message...


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Flowing Thought effects will now stack
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

with...
a) Clarity
b) PotG
c) other FT items
d) the all new uber.. err.. useless shaman mana potions
d) a and b
e) a, b and d
f) a, b, c and d
g) none of the above
h) other

Couldnt they have been just a little more specific?

Sorry, I guess that was a little less than descriptive.

How about this:

- Flowing Thought effects will now stack with other Flowing Thought effects.

Alan

[Arteker]

in velious FT items didint stack . higheer FT item would be the one working.

howver u could stack up to 5 aura of battles worn items.

if u look carefully at aas per expansion u will see how they allowed u to break the caps.

later to avoid confusion they switched worn efects for FT atk hp rege to be displayed as numbers so u could calculate the max u have and wich aas u needed to raise the cap.

Main reason u have now fungy tunic now with regeneration xxx rubi with rege xxx and iskar bp with xxx.

[Arteker]

more links .
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=8982
nother FT slot
Quote
Reply
#May 23 2002 at 12:22 PMRating: Good
Kataliya
Scholar

70 posts
I believe this information is inaccurate. Corrction below:

ALL Flowinng Thought effects will stack with one another, poeriod. There APPEARS to be a maximum of FT15, as shown by multiple logs posted to various public forums. There are additional effects (such as "Zephyr of Brell" and "Lunar Whispers") that add additional levels of mana regenration, and as of this writing, none of these effects have been proven to NOT stack.

HOWEVER, the issue is complicated by some logs floating around out there that seem indicate there is no FT cap, but this is hotly disputed. The cap *appears* to be FT15, but unfortunately untill VI gives us a difinitive statement regarding the issue, nothing is certain. /sigh


***EDIT***: Sadly, mana regeneration via worn items has been HARD CAPPED at 15 as of the patch most recent to this writing. A discussion and logs proving this can be found here: http://www.********.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1543

This, IMHO, sucks. =(

Edited, Tue Jun 11 20:30:04 2002
____________________________

[Arteker]

final link to patch : http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2002-1.html


** Spells **

- Necromancer Group spells should now be working, they were only
affecting the caster. This includes spells such as: Degeneration,
Succession of Shadows, Crippling Claudication, and Zavfeer's Theft of
Vitae. These spells have also had their duration increased. Mind Wrack
will be fixed soon.
- Shadowknight "Torrent" spells have also been fixed and have had their
duration increased as well
- Flowing Thought effects will now stack
- Meditating on a horse occurs only while not in combat
- Mark of Retribution should work as intended
- The Decession spell now requires you to be in the same group
- Levitation can no longer be used in The Deep
- Fixed a problem that was still allowing people to Cast Eye of Zomm in
Ssra Temple
- Fixed a problem that was still allowing people to cast Call of the
Hero in Ssra Temple
- NPCs that cannot be stunned will once again take damage from damaging
stun spells (this was actually patched earlier along with an emergency
patch)
- Critical heals and nukes now display damage numbers (this was
actually patched earlier along with an emergency patch)

[Arteker]

Hope that helps nilbog .

:)

[Brinkman]

http://poopspant.com/vp/eq000432.jpg

Difficult to find any info on the other things with Flowing Though I+.

Tunare wasn't itemized until late 2001 just before Luclin so those drops didnt exist with Flowing Thought III and V.

First entry I could find on the Crown of Narandi was added on November 9, 2001. (This item was also Pal/SK only).

Perhaps the Ring War wasn't itemized until then? I cannot remember.

Couldn't find anything on the White Dragonscale Boots but I think that part of the quest may have been added later also.

Turning in the Head of Tormax to Yelinak resulted in the Clawed Griffon Sword at first for sure, possibly noone thought to turn it in again to get the Boots reward? Dunno.

All very good points. With the list mostly complete, I guess the only thing to do now is it make sure they should all be in velious, like you are saying.

It will be very difficult to find proof for the FT items. Many of them were added in patches 30-90 days before luclin. The ring war was itemized sometime in october, but again need the proof.

What complicates things further is during this timeframe a lot of guilds stop posting kill and drop information for some reason.

Im pretty sure Triton was on a DKP system back then, if we can find a raid rewards listing from september to december 2001 there should be most of the info we need. Unfortunatly their site was not kept up like FoH.

Next; question: If an item wasnt put in ( or a mob not itemized ) in until 1 month before luclin, does it get added right away for p99. If a quest wasnt completed until 1 month before luclin, does it go in right away, with all rewards ( ring war, first completed on Povar in Sep of 2001 )

If a mob wasnt killed ( therfore we do not know if it was itemized at realease or not ) until 1 month before luclin should that mob drop the items ? I dont beleive AoW was killed until late october or early november right?

[Arteker]

aow was itemized but original Boc didint have EB proc .

[Alarti0001]

Was a decision reached in regards to FT stacking? FT1+FT2? etc?

[ArumTP]

Don't know if these GM events have been done (or will be).

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6456
Al'Kabor's Expansive Mind = mana regeneration +10

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/5/e/5e305651ecef3215e892121d1408a1b4.png

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6854
Prime Healer's Blessing = regeneration +15

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/4/a/4a20a6791a648787d8a23c8ab4f5049d.png



That breastplate is Luclin era. It came into play when there was the GM event that turned all the karanas green because of the plagues that bertoxx sent. This event occurred luclin era. Conceivably its stats aren't much different that what will be dropping in velious, and probably wouldn't effect anything if such GM event were to happen here.

[Ele]

That breastplate is Luclin era. It came into play when there was the GM event that turned all the karanas green because of the plagues that bertoxx sent. This event occurred luclin era. Conceivably its stats aren't much different that what will be dropping in velious, and probably wouldn't effect anything if such GM event were to happen here.

The earliest comment on the Zam page is October 15, 2001, pre-Luclin.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6854

Thanks for the congrats guys. I love my new BP.

Just wanted to correct TheGrandGuru on his obvious reading of the spdat.eff file and thinking he knows what this spell does.

This spell IS self only because its NOT a spell. It is an effect just like the Fungus Covered Scale Tunic.
Your comparing of the file data of the cast spell to this effect is like comparing the spell cast by the Fungus Covered Great Staff to the effect of the Fungus Tunic. The spell and the effect have the same name, yet they do two entirely different things.
The effect on this Breast Plate is a permanent effect that effects the person wearing it as long as they have it equipped. It is not a spell you have to click on to make the item proc its effect on you. Therefore the duration and ticks you are pulling from the spdat.eff file do not apply.

[ArumTP]

mybad

[Erati]

Ft1 only stacks with Ft 2 which will give u 3 which will stack with FT3 which will give u 6 etc.

You could NEVER stack 5 FT1 items and get 5 mana regen before Luclin. I believe sometime way later they just made it hardcap at 15 and the items just say mana regen. though the 15 ft cap might have always been in but just pretty impossible to obtain w just velious)

If the higher FT simply overwrites the lower one meh not that big of deal as mostly people will only have FT1 neway with a few will have both FT1 and 2 so ur not losing much. FT mechanic never ever ever let u stack multiple versions of FT1 to get anything more than just 1 tho.

[Aeolwind]

final link to patch : http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2002-1.html


** Spells **

- Necromancer Group spells should now be working, they were only
affecting the caster. This includes spells such as: Degeneration,
Succession of Shadows, Crippling Claudication, and Zavfeer's Theft of
Vitae. These spells have also had their duration increased. Mind Wrack
will be fixed soon.
- Shadowknight "Torrent" spells have also been fixed and have had their
duration increased as well
- Flowing Thought effects will now stack
- Meditating on a horse occurs only while not in combat
- Mark of Retribution should work as intended
- The Decession spell now requires you to be in the same group
- Levitation can no longer be used in The Deep
- Fixed a problem that was still allowing people to Cast Eye of Zomm in
Ssra Temple
- Fixed a problem that was still allowing people to cast Call of the
Hero in Ssra Temple
- NPCs that cannot be stunned will once again take damage from damaging
stun spells (this was actually patched earlier along with an emergency
patch)
- Critical heals and nukes now display damage numbers (this was
actually patched earlier along with an emergency patch)

Pretty decisive proof that it didn't stack till Luclin. Highest value is all that had effect till then.

[Alarti0001]

Ft1 only stacks with Ft 2 which will give u 3 which will stack with FT3 which will give u 6 etc.

You could NEVER stack 5 FT1 items and get 5 mana regen before Luclin. I believe sometime way later they just made it hardcap at 15 and the items just say mana regen. though the 15 ft cap might have always been in but just pretty impossible to obtain w just velious)

If the higher FT simply overwrites the lower one meh not that big of deal as mostly people will only have FT1 neway with a few will have both FT1 and 2 so ur not losing much. FT mechanic never ever ever let u stack multiple versions of FT1 to get anything more than just 1 tho.

Does anyone have real evidence of this? Would be great to know. We are getting alot of first hand accounts/memories but little evidence. I am guessing this will likely be unanswearable with a high degree of certainty.

Pretty decisive proof that it didn't stack till Luclin. Highest value is all that had effect till then.

Actually is in absolutely no way decisive proof.

[Erati]

Heres my question tho, that just says "Flowing thought items stack" but doesnt say anything about the unique stacking method most players remember ( Ft 1+ Ft2 etc ).


Was there ever a time in Luclin u could stack multiple versions of Ft 1 and they stacked ( after these patch notes) Also when did they change to just + mana regen bc then Ft1s would b stacking which also coulda been from this patch.

Basically im wondering if the different levels of Ft were each considered their own thing and thus u couldnt stack multiple FT1 or FT2 before these notes but since they might have been their own effects u could gain benefit from each effect individually since if they were a buff would have different names.

More research needs to b done and unfort im at work but that one sentence shouldnt b the death nail in different versions of FT goin at the same time.

[Alarti0001]

Heres my question tho, that just says "Flowing thought items stack" but doesnt say anything about the unique stacking method most players remember ( Ft 1+ Ft2 etc ).



More research needs to b done and unfort im at work but that one sentence shouldnt b the death nail in different versions of FT goin at the same time.

Exactly. Needs more research or maybe a Nilbog response. I've done ALOT of research on this and cant find anything definitive :(((((

[feanan]

If you look at the allakhazam page for FT1
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=1298
you will see that someone with a green name and a lot of posts posted in 2003:

"Nope, Flowing Thought does not stack, it takes the highest one available and ignores the rest. So if you have a Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawl (FT3), and an Earring of the Solstice (FT1), then the earring isn't doing you and good in the mana regen department.
Edit: Oh, and no, if you have TWO FT1 items, you won't get 2 mana per tick, just once. "

and again in april 2003

"I did some research, as of the January 8th patch, ALL flowing thought items stack with each other, even two of the same level. So 2 FT1 witem will give you 2 mana per tick. You don't even have to pick one of each level."

[Alarti0001]

If you look at the allakhazam page for FT1
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=1298
you will see that someone with a green name and a lot of posts posted in 2003:

"Nope, Flowing Thought does not stack, it takes the highest one available and ignores the rest. So if you have a Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawl (FT3), and an Earring of the Solstice (FT1), then the earring isn't doing you and good in the mana regen department.
Edit: Oh, and no, if you have TWO FT1 items, you won't get 2 mana per tick, just once. "

and again in april 2003

"I did some research, as of the January 8th patch, ALL flowing thought items stack with each other, even two of the same level. So 2 FT1 witem will give you 2 mana per tick. You don't even have to pick one of each level."


On that same exact thread you also see this post

ALSO I find it VERY curious that you posted those 2 posts and not the one exactly in the middle of them...your second post is actually a response to the one i just linked.

WTF man?


RE: Not stackable
QuoteReply# Apr 12 2003 at 10:26 AM Rating: Default Mkorak
11 posts
Sorry man, but you are wrong. FT items stack as long as they are differant types, up to FT15.

FT1+FT2+FT3+FT4+FT5=FT15

So if you have a FT3 and a FT1 then you have FT4.

[Erati]

Alarti is the wizards best hope with his quest for some semblance of mana regen.

Stick to your guns and make people prove it didnt stack in the unique method that many remember. I think the biggest problem is the era in which we are trying to pinpoint there was not alot of items in the game to test this. It was always well known multiple FT1 s did not stack. But there was like 2-3 other items that even had a higher ft TO STACK WITH. So if basically no one had two of these items to test before Luclin its veru hard to say if they stacked or overwrote. Those patch noted could simply refer to the era when it didnt matter if it was multiple instances of the same FT stacking ( which is mentioned in that alla post having many of same type to stack up).

Think ab the nature of the effect, why have thrm conviently add up to the hardcap if they didnt stack one on top of another so u had to seek out one of each FT type to b capped.

Velious only mostly offers FT1 so this may b moot but it is basically the holy grail of effects for casters in our classic trilogy would b nice if it worked properly.

[feanan]

because the post in the middle was posted by some scrub with 11 posts.

i give the other posted benefit of the doubt cause he's green :)

[Alarti0001]

Alarti is the wizards best hope with his quest for some semblance of mana regen.

Stick to your guns and make people prove it didnt stack in the unique method that many remember. I think the biggest problem is the era in which we are trying to pinpoint there was not alot of items in the game to test this. It was always well known multiple FT1 s did not stack. But there was like 2-3 other items that even had a higher ft TO STACK WITH. So if basically no one had two of these items to test before Luclin its veru hard to say if they stacked or overwrote. Those patch noted could simply refer to the era when it didnt matter if it was multiple instances of the same FT stacking ( which is mentioned in that alla post having many of same type to stack up).

Think ab the nature of the effect, why have thrm conviently add up to the hardcap if they didnt stack one on top of another so u had to seek out one of each FT type to b capped.

Velious only mostly offers FT1 so this may b moot but it is basically the holy grail of effects for casters in our classic trilogy would b nice if it worked properly.

I actually remember it just being top FT being it.. SO Ft1+Ft2+Ft3=Ft3

But my memory is subject to time, persuasion, and second-hand information.

[Alarti0001]

because the post in the middle was posted by some scrub with 11 posts.

i give the other posted benefit of the doubt cause he's green :)

Post count doesn't determine accuracy. Don't leave out information... the point of research is to gather ALL relevant information and compare for the most accurate.

[TWDL_Prexus]

I actually remember it just being top FT being it.. SO Ft1+Ft2+Ft3=Ft3

But my memory is subject to time, persuasion, and second-hand information.

That is how I remember it also. You could have every single FT item possible, but whichever FT was the highest, was what you got.

[webrunner5]

Although you have already been corrected, it really peeves me off when people don't read and just post stuff.

If you dont feel like doing the research and want to just "remember " stuff. Keep it to yourself.

On the first page, I clearly stated

" No FT items higher ( please note that the CT revamp came out 3 months after luclin release and there are a few FT items that drop there, these items will never be on P99 I. E. Viscid Slime Gloves FT4 )"

I stated this because I KNEW someone would post those items and not do research.


/rant off.

Jesus dude chill out. It's just a freeking game.

[Samoht]

let's flame 9 month old posts!

[Daviss34]

Well i remember specifically having to stack FT1 + FT2 + FT3 to get to FT6. I also remember that FT1+FT1 did not = FT2. As to at what point in time I remember this, I couldn't give you a definitive date :(.

[Ele]

Couldn't find anything on the White Dragonscale Boots but I think that part of the quest may have been added later also.

Turning in the Head of Tormax to Yelinak resulted in the Clawed Griffon Sword at first for sure, possibly noone thought to turn it in again to get the Boots reward? Dunno.

White Dragonscale Boots posted on Graffe's on August 16, 2001, along with quest

http://web.archive.org/web/20010924052840/http://graffe.com/

[Ele]

First entry I could find on the Crown of Narandi was added on November 9, 2001. (This item was also Pal/SK only).

Perhaps the Ring War wasn't itemized until then? I cannot remember.


First Completion of 10th Ring War May 14, 2001
http://web.archive.org/web/20010516001024/http://www.tritonguild.com/
http://web.archive.org/web/20010614025750/http://www.mobhunter.com/SiteChannelServlet.html?page=article&id=-1968328161
http://web.archive.org/web/20010515212352/http://eq.castersrealm.com/
http://web.archive.org/web/20010521203919/http://eq.castersrealm.com/data/item.asp?Id=4395

June 2001 entries on EQweapon database for 10th ring items

http://web.archive.org/web/20010619183335/http://www.planeteverquest.com/eqwadb/detail.asp?ID=3911

Narandi's Faceguard
MAGIC ITEM LORE ITEM
Slot: Face
AC: 10
STR: +10 STA: +10 HP: +10 SV DISEASE: +10 SV POISON: +10
Effect: See Invisible
WT: 1
Class: WAR PAL RNG SHD MNK BRD ROG
Race: ALL

http://web.archive.org/web/20010619175607/http://www.planeteverquest.com/eqwadb/detail.asp?ID=3906

Crown of Narandi
MAGIC ITEM LORE ITEM
Slot: Head
AC: 25
STR: +8 DEX: +8 STA: +8 CHA: +8 WIS: +8 INT: +8 AGI: +8 HP: +50 MANA: +50 SV FIRE: +4 SV DISEASE: +4 SV COLD: +4 SV MAGIC: +4 SV POISON: +4
Effect: Flowing Thought II
WT: 3
Class: PAL SHD
Race: ALL

June 9, 2001 Archive pull, update dated May 28, 2001:
http://web.archive.org/web/20010609122010/http://www.planeteverquest.com/eqwadb/

News from 5/28/2001:

I am back! - 5/28/2001 11:10:00 AM (Quatto)
Well, I'm back from my much needed vacation and to get things started, how about a nice little update.

����Primal Velium Battle Axe -2H Slash (Sleeper's Tomb)
����Emerald Bastardsword of Purity -1H Slash (Temple of Veeshan)
����Narandi's Lance -2H Piercing (Western Wastes)
����Steelsilk Pauldron -Shoulders (Tailor Skill)
����Visage of Life -Face (Plane of Growth)
����Shield of Midnight -Shield (Temple of Veeshan)
����Ring of Dain Frostreaver IV -Fingers (Eastern Wastes Quest)
����Bloody Griffon-Hide Wrist Guard -Wrist (Plane of Air)
����Narandi's Faceguard -Face (Eastern Wastes)
����Silver Wristguards -Wrist (Plane of Mischief Quest)
����Clockwork Watchman Helm -Head (Tinker Skill)
����Clockwork Watchman Greaves -Legs (Tinker Skill)
����Clockwork Watchman Vambraces -Arms (Tinker Skill)
����Truesight Helmet -Head (Temple of Veeshan)
����Crown of Narandi -Head (Eastern Wastes)
����Sentient Greaves -Legs (Wakening Land)
����Breastplate of Superiority -Chest (Temple of Veeshan)

http://web.archive.org/web/20010603075829/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/chokerofthewretched.jpg
http://web.archive.org/web/20010603075829/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/chokerofthewretched.jpg

http://web.archive.org/web/20010603084009/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/narandislance.jpg
http://web.archive.org/web/20010603084009/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/narandislance.jpg

http://web.archive.org/web/20010603082956/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/narandisfaceguard.jpg
http://web.archive.org/web/20010603082956/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/narandisfaceguard.jpg

http://web.archive.org/web/20010603081458/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/crownofnarandi.jpg
http://web.archive.org/web/20010603081458/http://www.knightsofthecreed.com/pom/crownofnarandi.jpg

[nilbog]

Saw that Narandi loot and it reminded me..

Should it be Faceguard of Bentos the Hero? Or Faceguard of ____ the Hero, the first player to complete the ring war on p99?

Should Vulak loot be named as per soe dev/gm or should it be named from the dev/gm staff of p99?

These are the only instances that I can recall having character-specific naming schema.

Nilbog's Axe of Slaughter eh. Just saying! :P

[Frieza_Prexus]

Should it be Faceguard of Bentos the Hero? Or Faceguard of ____ the Hero, the first player to complete the ring war on p99?

Should Vulak loot be named as per original or should it be named from the dev/gm staff of p99?

These are the only instances that I can recall having character-specific naming schema.

Nilbog's Axe of Slaughter eh. Just saying! :P

The goal is a complete "relaunch" of classic so name the face guard after the first person who gets it.

[maximum]

Should it be Faceguard of Bentos the Hero? Or Faceguard of ____ the Hero, the first player to complete the ring war on p99?

Should Vulak loot be named as per soe dev/gm or should it be named from the dev/gm staff of p99?

Do whatever is best for rapid development, please.

[nilbog]

Do whatever is best for rapid development, please.

The difference between 1 second, and 10 seconds. Not relevant to this question I guess.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Name the Vulak items after the Gm staff and the top beta/bug report contributors.

"Elethia's Rod of Disempowerment"

[Ele]

Name the Vulak items after the Gm staff and the top beta/bug report contributors.

"Elethia's Rod of Disempowerment"

Approved.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Approved.

We could make a thing out of it.

Akkrus' Mask of Warfare could become some RnFer's mask of Salty Tears.

[Alovia]

IIRC Alarti has it right. FT would not stay with another one of its type.

FT was orginally coded to be a different effect all together.

FT1 had its own spell code, and FT2 had a completly different one.

There for no 2 alike would stack. However a FT1 WOULD stack with a FT2... I think in Luclin they made it all stack no matter how many of each you had and caped it at 15. before that 6 mana regen was all you could cap, with FT1+Ft2+FT3

[kenzar]

Saw that Narandi loot and it reminded me..

Should it be Faceguard of Bentos the Hero? Or Faceguard of ____ the Hero, the first player to complete the ring war on p99?

Should Vulak loot be named as per soe dev/gm or should it be named from the dev/gm staff of p99?

These are the only instances that I can recall having character-specific naming schema.

Nilbog's Axe of Slaughter eh. Just saying! :P

If the goal is recreate classic EQ as it was, and not as it would be today, then keeping the item names established the first time through I feel would be important. Everything on p99 should reflect what everquest was when it was new, this includes item names.

[Itap]

For the naming of items, I agree with everyone above me. Nilbog's axe of slaughter sounds ridiculous

[nilbog]

If the goal is recreate classic EQ as it was, and not as it would be today, then keeping the item names established the first time through I feel would be important. Everything on p99 should reflect what everquest was when it was new, this includes item names.

Right, and I agree with you. When it was new, the names were dynamically changed to an extent. Like Faceguard of Bentos the Hero. Bentos was a bard (player) in Triton from Povar.

So.. when it was new, the name was dynamic. Just getting some opinions here.

[nilbog]

For the naming of items, I agree with everyone above me. Nilbog's axe of slaughter sounds ridiculous

Hopefully Palladius felt the same. :P I don't really care, as stated above I'm getting opinions.

People do know that those particular items are named from the devs and gms though?

[Alarti0001]

Hopefully Palladius felt the same. :P I don't really care, as stated above I'm getting opinions.

People do know that those particular items are named from the devs and gms though?

I actually did not... haha.


But.... how is FT going to work!!!!!!!!?????

[Alarti0001]

IIRC Alarti has it right. FT would not stay with another one of its type.

FT was orginally coded to be a different effect all together.

FT1 had its own spell code, and FT2 had a completly different one.

There for no 2 alike would stack. However a FT1 WOULD stack with a FT2... I think in Luclin they made it all stack no matter how many of each you had and caped it at 15. before that 6 mana regen was all you could cap, with FT1+Ft2+FT3

Well FT5 on tunare right before luclin i think.. so you could have FT11.
If that FT1 stack with FT2 etc is accurate.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Hopefully Palladius felt the same. :P I don't really care, as stated above I'm getting opinions.

People do know that those particular items are named from the devs and gms though?

I think the face guard should absolutely be dynamic. It's a one time occurrence whose outcome is determined by the players. It is much like waking the sleeper, just with less drastic results.

[Alarti0001]

I think the face guard should absolutely be dynamic. It's a one time occurrence whose outcome is determined by the players. It is much like waking the sleeper, just with less drastic results.

I like the idea of the Faceguard being the first player.... The Vulak weapons.... nooo thanks!. Alovia's Robe of Darkness... ewwww

[kenzar]

Right, and I agree with you. When it was new, the names were dynamically changed to an extent. Like Faceguard of Bentos the Hero. Bentos was a bard (player) in Triton from Povar.

So.. when it was new, the name was dynamic. Just getting some opinions here.

word.

[kenzar]

It's a one time occurrence whose outcome is determined by the players.

It was a one time occurrence whose outcome has been determined by the players. It's not as if each individual server had their own unique mask name, if they had I'd totally agree with you, but it's been established already.

[Frieza_Prexus]

It was a one time occurrence whose outcome has been determined by the players. It's not as if each individual server had their own unique mask name, if they had I'd totally agree with you, but it's been established already.

I see your point, and I don't entirely disagree with it. However, I see two counterpoints. First, this server is a complete reset as if classic were launching again. The mask was not named on the day Velious launched, and it should not be named the day this launches. That would keep it within the time line, and one day we'll hit a point where it needs to be named. The BoTB was a one time event on live, yet we still handed out new titles despite many of the original winners playing the same class on P99.

Secondly, happening on only one server does not change much. It simply means it was a race to do it first. Much like Furor was the only one to be the "first level 50" across all servers with Kalaran, and much like any mob kill only one person got to be "first." It just so happens that Bentos had an additional reward beyond bragging rights attached to his unique achievement.

Besides, if Velious launches the same day on Red, it'll be a race between the two servers just as it was on live, and that's even more classic.

[nilbog]

http://zam.zamimg.com/images/9/b/9b7206f97c580a1b79bf484e7f6d025e.png

Valtron was the "Erollisi Marr dev" and is responsible for the Necklace of Wonder and Valtron's Finest Brew. He later made Dawnshroud Peaks (I forgive you Valtron!). Spoke with him a few times and he was a nice guy.

[kenzar]

I see your point, and I don't entirely disagree with it. However, I see two counterpoints. First, this server is a complete reset as if classic were launching again. The mask was not named on the day Velious launched, and it should not be named the day this launches. That would keep it within the time line, and one day we'll hit a point where it needs to be named. The BoTB was a one time event on live, yet we still handed out new titles despite many of the original winners playing the same class on P99.

Secondly, happening on only one server does not change much. It simply means it was a race to do it first. Much like Furor was the only one to be the "first level 50" across all servers with Kalaran, and much like any mob kill only one person got to be "first." It just so happens that Bentos had an additional reward beyond bragging rights attached to his unique achievement.

Besides, if Velious launches the same day on Red, it'll be a race between the two servers just as it was on live, and that's even more classic.

Exactly, it was a race to do it first, and its been done.





Relive the classic Everquest MMORPG Gaming Experience as it was in 1999 and onward.

'was' being past tense.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Exactly, it was a race to do it first, and its been done.

'was' being past tense.

Yet, I think the BoTB situation is completely analogous. At the very least, it's a strong precedent for dynamic naming on P99. If nothing else, it indicates that here there is a preference to reset the awarded names that were "won" by player achievement.

[kenzar]

Player's name != item name...not even close, I don't know how you see that equivalency. An item name's scope stretches across all servers, while a players name is distinct to it's server.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Higher tier BotB titles were unique across all servers, yet they've been reproduced here.

Player naming and item naming are analogous in this situation. Both are unique awards granted in response to player achievements and both existed uniquely across all the servers. The BotB titles already exist on P99, and they have been given to individuals who did not win them back on live EQ. Thus, it is just as acceptable that the mask of Bentos be renamed.

[kenzar]

If the goal is recreate classic EQ as it was, and not as it would be today, then keeping the item names established the first time through I feel would be important. Everything on p99 should reflect what everquest was when it was new, this includes item names.

Right, and I agree with you. When it was new, the names were dynamically changed to an extent. Like Faceguard of Bentos the Hero. Bentos was a bard (player) in Triton from Povar.

So.. when it was new, the name was dynamic. Just getting some opinions here.

[Alovia]

Saw that Narandi loot and it reminded me..

Should it be Faceguard of Bentos the Hero? Or Faceguard of ____ the Hero, the first player to complete the ring war on p99?

Should Vulak loot be named as per soe dev/gm or should it be named from the dev/gm staff of p99?

These are the only instances that I can recall having character-specific naming schema.

Nilbog's Axe of Slaughter eh. Just saying! :P

IM kinda partial to the player name and the GM/staff name.

I actually remember when this happend. Was kind of a big deal.

[Alovia]

I like the idea of the Faceguard being the first player.... The Vulak weapons.... nooo thanks!. Alovia's Robe of Darkness... ewwww

lol

But I agree with the others. The fact that the items are dynamic and player controlled gives it a bit of pride.

As for the GM/dev items.... we gotta have our fun to =P

[Alovia]

Exactly, it was a race to do it first, and its been done.







'was' being past tense.

I agree/disagree with you Kenzar. I get your point. But since P99 is a completly different WORLD should be reason enough to do this here. Just like if Velious was launching on live for the first time, it would not have a name. So launching here for the first time it should not either..... gives more of a "classic feel" than doing something that was done 12 years ago.

[Ele]

Leaning in favor of providing a unique P99 naming system, at least for the faceguard, is the fact that the first faceguards were named "Narandi's Faceguard" and later changed to "Faceguard of Bentos the Hero" to recognize the first person to achieve the 10th ring. Following the same series of events, the first one dropped on P99 or Red should be Narandi's Faceguard and then changed to reflect the first person to achieve the 10th Ring.

http://web.archive.org/web/20010619183335/http://www.planeteverquest.com/eqwadb/detail.asp?ID=3911
http://web.archive.org/web/20010708071914/http://www.planeteverquest.com/eqwadb/detail.asp?ID=4042

[Handull]

in b4 someone wins the race to complete the 10th ring with a troll named toon.

[SirAlvarex]

in b4 someone wins the race to complete the 10th ring with a troll named toon.

That was my one worry reading these posts lol.

"Turdburglers Faceguard" just doesn't have a nice ring to it.

[Versus]

I like the renaming of the Faceguard, etc. But not Vulak items. I love the server GM's and stuff but the names are so classicly cool, it would feel corny renaming them to Sirken's Axe of Slaughter and Alovia's Necklace of Wonder.

[Frieza_Prexus]

"Turdburglers Faceguard"

Why does this sound like a real thing?

[Alarti0001]

That was my one worry reading these posts lol.

"Turdburglers Faceguard" just doesn't have a nice ring to it.

ah...hahaha awesome... and terrible

[Ele]

Needs to be researched to get a conclusive opinion. I have heard that the original developer statements were wrong, and that FT did stack. I have also heard that flowing thought shouldn't stack with flowing thought of the same level.

For example, should a Flowing Thought I item stack with another Flowing Thought I item?

With a cap of Flowing Thought 15 being in place, was that an arbitrary number or was it based on: FT1+FT2+FT3+FT4+FT5 = FT15 ?

Long time coming, but finally got some stuff on this. Surprisingly, CastersRealm and Graffe didn't really have anything contemporaneous with Velious, only post-stacking patch Luclin information.


End Result: Flowing Thought does not stack in any respect, highest Flowing Thought wins.

The January 8, 2002 (Luclin Era) patch (http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20020108.html) changed that so all kinds of FT stacked with each other up to a maximum of FT15.

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=39453&postcount=7
Also, for the record, if you have 2 items with the Flowing Thought effect, only the one with the highest value will affect you(similar to the way haste items work). IE they don't stack with each other.

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=88152&postcount=2
2. Flowing Thought effect (often referred to as FT) stacks with all known forms of mana regeneration spells, but it will not stack with itself. i.e., if you had an item with FT 2, and had clarity, it will stack and give two more mana per tick than clarity alone.

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=47290&postcount=12
Flowing Thought items are like haste items, you can equip as many as you like but the one with the highest value overwrites the effect of the others.


This thread on EQ Clerics (http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?p=49205) contains some good discussion. It is the same day as the stacking patch January 8, 2002, but includes a break down of the previous FT system and the rumor mill of how it might work once the servers came back up.

The original post in the thread echos Nilbog's words above.
The word from the developers (Lawrence Poe to be exact) is that FT is supposed to stack, and that it not stacking (like it doesn't now) is a bug and on the list of things to fix. Now if that isn't huge for casters I don't know what is. Hell I'm bit afraid it'll trivialize some stuff since against weaker mobs I'm not losing any mana as it is (all NToV dragons except Vyemm for example).


There is this lone post by the EQ Clerics Admin, but it is immediately disputed by the next several posts.
The way FT has worked until now is that FTs would stack ONLY if they weren't the same. For instance, FT1 and FT2 would stack but 2 FT 1 items would not work. So if they fixed the stacking issue, then 2 FT1 items should now stack. Bit funny they say that it's broken now when it's been this way since the release of Velious AND "working as intended(tm)".

However, the above post is immediately disputed by the next several posters:

Boanerges I have to disagree. ... Looking at every test done sofar with FT items *noone* have stacked. Not same FT values and not different FT values. What will be the case after this patch remains to be seen. I hope they all with stack.

FT never stacked in any form. It always took your highest version, and that was the extra mana you got. With this patch, if it works as intended, ALL FT items will stack. So if you have 3 FT1 items, 2 FT2 items, and 1 FT3 item, you will have mana regen of 10 from your FT items.

[Ele]

Velious

Temple of Veeshan


Sal'Varae's Robe of Darkness Flowing Thought III

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6402

Flowing Thought III was not added to Sal`Varae's Robe of Darkness until March 20, 2002. Forever FT1.

http://web.archive.org/web/20020803133028/http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6402

Posted @ Wed, Mar 20th 1:03 AM 2002
Robe was upgraded with today's patch. It now has Effect: Flowing Though III(Worn).

Three separate sources state FT1, as of February 2002. http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=4960

[Aerar]

This got me thinking. Is Rubicite obtainable on this server? I remember it was done away with in a fairly early expansion

[Ele]

This got me thinking. Is Rubicite obtainable on this server? I remember it was done away with in a fairly early expansion

You can purchase/trade other players for it, there are some sets still floating around. It has not dropped since March 2010.

[Aerar]

im assuming people cant dye armor here so to me thats one of best looking armor sets in game

[Ele]

im assuming people cant dye armor here so to me thats one of best looking armor sets in game

Can't dye in the Luclin sense of applying dye to any armor. However, crafters can make fine plate in various colors.

[Alarti0001]

Long time coming, but finally got some stuff on this. Surprisingly, CastersRealm and Graffe didn't really have anything contemporaneous with Velious, only post-stacking patch Luclin information.


End Result: Flowing Thought does not stack in any respect, highest Flowing Thought wins.

The January 8, 2002 (Luclin Era) patch (http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20020108.html) changed that so all kinds of FT stacked with each other up to a maximum of FT15.

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=39453&postcount=7


http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=88152&postcount=2


http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=47290&postcount=12



This thread on EQ Clerics (http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?p=49205) contains some good discussion. It is the same day as the stacking patch January 8, 2002, but includes a break down of the previous FT system and the rumor mill of how it might work once the servers came back up.

The original post in the thread echos Nilbog's words above.



There is this lone post by the EQ Clerics Admin, but it is immediately disputed by the next several posts.


However, the above post is immediately disputed by the next several posters:


Hmmm,

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showpost.php?p=88152&postcount=2

This link you left out some stuff

1. Those items are rare. They either drop off high end mobs or can only be gotten through extremely difficult quests. (read: King Tormax's head, 7th Coldain Prayer Shawl, Robe off Cazic Thule, etc.)

2. Flowing Thought effect (often referred to as FT) stacks with all known forms of mana regeneration spells, but it will not stack with itself. i.e., if you had an item with FT 2, and had clarity, it will stack and give two more mana per tick than clarity alone.

3. Two mana per tick sounds like a lot - and it is at lower levels - but if you consider the total mana pool and mana regeneration rate level 55+ character would have, it really doesn't make or break a character.

Edit: No, I don't have an item with FT, though I could conceivably get one. But the time and effort would be better spent if I were to upgrade my HP/mana than 1 more mana per tick.

Not sure if we should trust an unqualified response.



Also, the other ones offer opinions, not sure if we should go with a gran assumption. Need real data. Alot of people back in the day like to offer up their opinions as fact.

[Alarti0001]

This issue is likely going to come down to best guess, or Nilbog's discretion.

[Ele]

Also, the other ones offer opinions, not sure if we should go with a gran assumption. Need real data. Alot of people back in the day like to offer up their opinions as fact.

I actually remember it just being top FT being it.. SO Ft1+Ft2+Ft3=Ft3

But my memory is subject to time, persuasion, and second-hand information.

:confused:

[Alarti0001]

:confused:

How is that confusing I very clearly stated an opinion not as fact and said it wasn't a source to trust since there wasn't facts.
Just because I remember something, someway doesn't mean I am correct. Which is why my previous post says this will likely be up to best guess or Nilbog discretion.

I don't make claims based off opinions.

[Ele]

How is that confusing I very clearly stated an opinion not as fact and said it wasn't a source to trust since there wasn't facts.
Just because I remember something, someway doesn't mean I am correct. Which is why my previous post says this will likely be up to best guess or Nilbog discretion.

I don't make claims based off opinions.

Do you dispute the way FT worked as stated in my post or just the authority with which I stated it?

There has been zero contradictory evidence posted, whether it be "facts" or contemporaneous opinions, representing anything other than the conclusion in my post and numerous others in this thread. The two contradictory posts were modern recollections without support. It is completely reasonable to reach the conclusion in my post in these circumstances.

IIRC Alarti has it right. FT would not stay with another one of its type.

FT was orginally coded to be a different effect all together.

FT1 had its own spell code, and FT2 had a completly different one.

There for no 2 alike would stack. However a FT1 WOULD stack with a FT2... I think in Luclin they made it all stack no matter how many of each you had and caped it at 15. before that 6 mana regen was all you could cap, with FT1+Ft2+FT3

and

Ft1 only stacks with Ft 2 which will give u 3 which will stack with FT3 which will give u 6 etc.

You could NEVER stack 5 FT1 items and get 5 mana regen before Luclin. I believe sometime way later they just made it hardcap at 15 and the items just say mana regen. though the 15 ft cap might have always been in but just pretty impossible to obtain w just velious)

If the higher FT simply overwrites the lower one meh not that big of deal as mostly people will only have FT1 neway with a few will have both FT1 and 2 so ur not losing much. FT mechanic never ever ever let u stack multiple versions of FT1 to get anything more than just 1 tho.




Hmmm,
Edit: No, I don't have an item with FT, though I could conceivably get one. But the time and effort would be better spent if I were to upgrade my HP/mana than 1 more mana per tick.

Not sure if we should trust an unqualified response.

If there was no other corroborating support (fact or opinion), then that post would be more suspect. However, that particular poster's comment corroborates all but one of the other posts listed and also matches the recollections of a majority of the other posters in this thread. Also how does that person not having a particular item disqualify him from being able to issue a statement regarding the workings of the game?


Also, the other ones offer opinions, not sure if we should go with a gran assumption. Need real data. Alot of people back in the day like to offer up their opinions as fact.

Opinion testimony is perfectly fine to support a conclusion. Please read up on Federal Rule of Evidence 701. If you can find for us an empirical double-blinded study of Flowing Thought that satisfies your criteria for a proper scientific study, then please share. Until then, we have to rely on contemporaneous posts which include opinions!

[Alarti0001]

Opinion testimony is perfectly fine to support a conclusion. Please read up on Federal Rule of Evidence 701. If you can find for us an empirical double-blinded study of Flowing Thought that satisfies your criteria for a proper scientific study, then please share. Until then, we have to rely on contemporaneous posts which include opinions!

We actually don't have to rely on them.

Don't claim something as solved unless it is.
It might support a conclusion but it doesn't make a conclusion.

It would be reasonable to make a best guess not to conclude.


Luckily this isn't federal court and we don't need to rely on witness testimony. I'm sure you can probably think of a few cases were witness testified something that didn't stick.

[Ele]

We actually don't have to rely on them.

Don't claim something as solved unless it is.
It might support a conclusion but it doesn't make a conclusion.

It would be reasonable to make a best guess not to conclude.

Would you ignore all those posts and rather have the devs flip a coin? Because as it stands now the statements and posts in this thread are our best evidence and heavily support no-stacking of any kind.

When will this be solved in your mind? Do we need original server code? Statements from original devs? A P99 dev here making a statement of how it will work?

Do you draw a distinction between "best guess" and "conclusion"? Is not a "best guess" a "conclusion"?

If you are of the opinion that my "conclusion" is the end all be all and not subject to revision, then you are mistaken. If anyone posts any evidence to the contrary, I would certainly be open to examining it and revising my "conclusion" based on the outcome of an examination and a totality of the evidence.

[Alarti0001]

Would you ignore all those posts and rather have the devs flip a coin? Because as it stands now the statements and posts in this thread are our best evidence and heavily support no-stacking of any kind.

When will this be solved in your mind? Do we need original server code? Statements from original devs? A P99 dev here making a statement of how it will work?

Do you draw a distinction between "best guess" and "conclusion"? Is not a "best guess" a "conclusion"?

If you are of the opinion that my "conclusion" is the end all be all and not subject to revision, then you are mistaken. If anyone posts any evidence to the contrary, I would certainly be open to examining it and revising my "conclusion" based on the outcome of an examination and a totality of the evidence.

The point is we likely won't find good evidence to decide which is was with any certainty

[Treats]

The point is we likely won't find good evidence to decide which is was with any certainty

Highest Flowing Thought is the only one that is active.

Flowing Thought II + Flowing Thought I = Flowing Thought II

It is hardcoded into the Trilogy Client.

[Alarti0001]

Highest Flowing Thought is the only one that is active.

Flowing Thought II + Flowing Thought I = Flowing Thought II

It is hardcoded into the Trilogy Client.

That would be my opinion too, but words are wind.

[Treats]

That would be my opinion too, but words are wind.

It is not an opinion, it is a fact.

This is coded into the Trilogy Client, there is no disputing it.

[Alarti0001]

It is not an opinion, it is a fact.

This is coded into the Trilogy Client, there is no disputing it.

/facepalm

You are offering words... I could say its coded in the Trilogy Client to stack.... see the dilemma here?

[Treats]

/facepalm

You are offering words... I could say its coded in the Trilogy Client to stack.... see the dilemma here?

This is a stupid argument.

Have you worked at all with the Trilogy Client?

Also, Flowing Thought III and Flowing Thought IV gave no Mana Regen as of 8/22/01.

There must not have been any items with FTIII or FTIV at that time.

Flowing Thought I
Increase Mana by 1 (L1)

Flowing Thought II
Increase Mana by 2 (L1)

Flowing Thought III
Increase Mana by 0 (L1)

Flowing Thought IV
Increase Mana by 0 (L1)

Flowing Thought V
Increase Mana by 5 (L1)

[Alarti0001]

This is a stupid argument.

Have you worked at all with the Trilogy Client?

Also, Flowing Thought III and Flowing Thought IV gave no Mana Regen as of 8/22/01.

There must not have been any items with FTIII or FTIV at that time.

Flowing Thought I
Increase Mana by 1 (L1)

Flowing Thought II
Increase Mana by 2 (L1)

Flowing Thought III
Increase Mana by 0 (L1)

Flowing Thought IV
Increase Mana by 0 (L1)

Flowing Thought V
Increase Mana by 5 (L1)

/facepalm

You are offering words... I could say its coded in the Trilogy Client to stack.... see the dilemma here?

[Splorf22]

Clearly all of Elethia's posts from 2001 are the result of corrupted packets. Treats is obviously making random statements about the Titanium clientbecause of a vendetta he's held against Flowing Thought since it urinated on his car one night while drunk back in college. I can just see you now . . .

Alarti: Officer, I did no go through that red light
Sworen: I have a picture!
Alarti: Planted by the Russians.
Sworen: Are you serious?
Alarti: Prove me wrong bitch! PROVE ME WRONG!
Sworen **taser**

P.S. What about that green scale you owe FE?

[Alarti0001]

I am a giant moron
Stay out of discussions that are over your head. No where did I state treats has malicious intentions. However, unlike some of you, I am not going to accept something as fact just because someone said it was so. Show me the "hard code" there are enough people here with CS/MIS degrees to read it.

To go with your little cop story... basically, I am asking Treats(the cop) for the picture. Not saying the picture was a plant.
Ill explain more basics if you need them later cupcake.

Also, Mavtank and some enchanter are more than able to pay me the 100k a piece they owe me :)

[Splorf22]

Alarti, if you are going to go so far as to send me insulting PMs, I expect you to at least come up with some new material. I can read the thread for myself. Hint: I am not debating with you, I am mocking you because your positions are so silly that they are not worthy of logical conversation. Your request that Treats spend god-knows-how-many-hours disassembling the Titanium client is just as ludicrous as your continued assertions that you did not lose your bet, unsupported by any of the evidence that you love to demand from others.

[Alarti0001]

Alarti, if you are going to go so far as to send me insulting PMs, I expect you to at least come up with some new material. I can read the thread for myself. Hint: I am not debating with you, I am mocking you because your positions are so silly that they are not worthy of logical conversation. Your request that Treats spend god-knows-how-many-hours disassembling the Titanium client is just as ludicrous as your continued assertions that you did not lose your bet, unsupported by any of the evidence that you love to demand from others.


Just cause you dont know how many hours doesnt mean only god would know.
Taking something as fact just because they say so.. is idiotic as best. So lecture me about logical conversation when you pass the first test.

So equally supported by evidence then?

Otherwise take your trash back to the RnF cave where you belong... or you know those strings of RnF bait threads you posted for awhile.

[Splorf22]

As I keep telling you, I am not lecturing/debating/arguing with you. I am mocking you. Your position of total disbelief towards anything stated by anyone, no doubt a grotesque exaggeration of some off-the-cuff comment by a professor in logic 101, is just that silly. When you demand that the waiter prove the specials of the day - and surely you wouldn't believe some random piece of paper! - you are unlikely to get any soup.

It's also worth noting that I haven't insulted you even once, only your ludicrous positions. I don't have to resort to ad hominems because your quotes like "Just cause you dont know how many hours doesnt mean only god would know." are so ripe for parody.

[Alarti0001]

As I keep telling you, I am not lecturing/debating/arguing with you. I am mocking you. Your position of total disbelief towards anything stated by anyone, no doubt a grotesque exaggeration of some off-the-cuff comment by a professor in logic 101, is just that silly. When you demand that the waiter prove the specials of the day - and surely you wouldn't believe some random piece of paper! - you are unlikely to get any soup.

It's also worth noting that I haven't insulted you even once, only your ludicrous positions. I don't have to resort to ad hominems because your quotes like "Just cause you dont know how many hours doesnt mean only god would know." are so ripe for parody.

Your analogies are nonsensical and have no relevance to the point you are making... surely you can see that? Every analogy you seem to make just reflects on your inability to understand the situation and further illustrates the deficiencies of your thinking.

[Autotune]

Take your lover's spat to private messages, no one wants to watch your gay marriage fall apart in text form.

[Llodd]

Oh I don't know, watching Alarti digging himself into oblivion throughout this thread is mildly amusing.

[Vynn]

Right, and I agree with you. When it was new, the names were dynamically changed to an extent. Like Faceguard of Bentos the Hero. Bentos was a bard (player) in Triton from Povar.

So.. when it was new, the name was dynamic. Just getting some opinions here.

This is a very petty correction, and it doesn't matter immensely, but Bentos was actually a Half-Elf Rogue.

I feel this must be corrected as I was a member of Triton present for the event...as well as a fellow rogue :cool:

That said, with the current raid situation as it is, it doesn't seem like many/any deserve to have items named after them. The wonderlust of the event is gone and everyone knows what to expect: Keep it classic.

[Byrjun]

So, can anyone help with a recap on FT gear in Velious? Here's where we seem to be at right now:

FT doesn't stack with itself in any way. Only the highest FT functions.

At least as of March 2001, FT3+ didn't even function and we can assume they weren't in the game.

Was the earring from Tunare ever FT3 before Luclin? I tried checking the LoS archive, but it seems like every time they attempted Tunare it was broken in some fashion:

http://legacyofsteel.net/home/archives/2001-11-14%5Cpog_tunare_bugged.jpg http://legacyofsteel.net/home/archives/2001-11-03%5Ctunare.jpg

Second question: Are there any items besides Narandi's Helm and White Dragonscale Boots that were FT2? It seems like the strategy going into Velious will be: Do whatever you can to get White Dragonscale Boots, and if you're a priest grab the Golden Leaf Earring from Tunare (it's a BIS anyways). IF the earring ever becomes FT3 at the ass-end of Velious, you can trade your White Dragonscale Boots in to your guild if you're lucky enough to win Sirran's Boots of Lunacy.

I assume if the Golden Leaf Earring is upgraded to FT3 prior to Luclin (somewhere between March 2001 and December 7th 2001), then that is also when Essence of Nature is upgraded. This would put priests at a possible FT3 and intelligence casters at a possible FT5 and making Tunare as sought after as Vulak throughout Velious.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

Don't forget sar'velah's robe of darkness off vulak. ft3, but i have no idea when it was made ft3. Priests is kinda touchy, but it did have cleric on it, but only for the robe clerics :P

[Byrjun]

Don't forget sar'velah's robe of darkness off vulak. ft3, but i have no idea when it was made ft3. Priests is kinda touchy, but it did have cleric on it, but only for the robe clerics :P

Someone posted in this thread with evidence that the robe wasn't FT3 until some time in 2002, post-Velious. FT1 forever on this server.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

Someone posted in this thread with evidence that the robe wasn't FT3 until some time in 2002, post-Velious. FT1 forever on this server.

Balls :( But good, ain't gotta feel down and out for being a shorty. Any word on what version of tunare / tunare loot is happening? She's one complicated bitch :p

[Byrjun]

Balls :( But good, ain't gotta feel down and out for being a shorty. Any word on what version of tunare / tunare loot is happening? She's one complicated bitch :p

I would be interested on the research on Tunare as well. She was changed / broken just about monthly throughout Velious.

[Daldaen]

From my recollection, FT didn't function as "highest operates".

It functioned as "one of each operates".

So if you have 2 FT1 items, 1 FT2 item, and 1 FT3 item, you would have 6 FT total. Since only one of the FT1 items would take effect.

Same deal with regen I believe.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

From my recollection, FT didn't function as "highest operates".

It functioned as "one of each operates".

So if you have 2 FT1 items, 1 FT2 item, and 1 FT3 item, you would have 6 FT total. Since only one of the FT1 items would take effect.

Same deal with regen I believe.

Was patched from highest, then to each, then stacking to 15. Dates have been posted in thread.

[Daldaen]

Ah check, haven't read through entire thread yet. That makes sense though.

[Vandy]

Was the earring from Tunare ever FT3 before Luclin? I tried checking the LoS archive, but it seems like every time they attempted Tunare it was broken in some fashion:

I assume if the Golden Leaf Earring is upgraded to FT3 prior to Luclin (somewhere between March 2001 and December 7th 2001), then that is also when Essence of Nature is upgraded. This would put priests at a possible FT3 and intelligence casters at a possible FT5 and making Tunare as sought after as Vulak throughout Velious.


The first mentions of the item are in November 2001
this ring Reply... By: morbidplague,
19 posts
Posted @ Mon, Nov 26th 8:08 PM 2001 Score: Decent[3.00]
id kill my god...a guildy....stranger..whatever this is the best caster ring ive ever seen..FT3 wow and great stats.... and look what slot it goes into....woots

[Top]

Also Afterlife was the 2nd guild to down Tunare and they did it Oct 13, 2001. I am not sure who the first guild to kill her was but it will be hard to find any information on the item previous to that. So if it didnt have FT3 at Velious launch we may never know.
Saturday October 13, 2001

Posted by Arele
Afterlife Slays Tunare!
Afterlife trampled the Plane of Growth tonight in preparation for the killing of a god. After only 6 hours of steadily slaughtering trees, bears, thiflings, horses, and everything else that moved, we made our first ever attempt on Tunare. Defeating Tunare is another first for Afterlife on Mithaniel Marr, and we are one of only two servers to have ever killed the god.
Go Afterlife!

[Ele]

I would be interested on the research on Tunare as well. She was changed / broken just about monthly throughout Velious.

Whole dedicated thread to her:

http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125800

[falkun]

Question, will flowing thought work for bards on this server? According to Thott, FT does not work for bards into 2002 (post-Luclin):
https://web.archive.org/web/20020806131541/http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/retune.php
Flowing Thought
Since Luclin shipped, FT has increased from 1, possibly 2, to 15. FT 0->15 is an enormous leap in power for casters and hybrids...yet FT doesn't work on bards. FT is a straight up, across the board, large jump in power for all casting classes...except bards.

Has mob power increased along with FT? Nope. Many times bards/enc have joined groups, adding mana needed for the group to kill without downtime. Now that mana is available to all. Bard/enc mana is no longer necessary to avoid downtime.

Bards lost relative power due to FT itself, and lost power due to secondary effects from FT. What changed with bards? Nothing, bards were forgotten.

[Daldaen]

Pre-Fade.. Bards don't have much of a use for mana anyways... But it sounds like it doesn't work for em.

[baalzy]

Bards should just consider themselves lucky that they weren't repeatedly raped with the nerf-stick the way necros & druids were during that whole era.