Corpse dragging by faction - Velious Discussion

[nilbog]

From the Velious supplement:

Corpse Dragging in Velious
Due to the importance of faction within Velious, we wanted to avoid a situation where a group could die in an area, and then easily bring in someone with good faction to drag all of the corpses out without consequence or risk. As such, there are some zones in Velious where dragging a corpse is considered “assisting the enemy” by the inhabitants of the area. They will react accordingly. Did the corpse-drag aggro happen only if the dead person was KoS, or did it always happen?

What zones did this happen in? All of Velious, only Kael, or Kael and Skyshrine?

Any input, memories, or research that you may have, discuss here.

[eadric]

It certainly applied to ToV and Kael. Not sure about Skyshrine, as I never fought much there. My recollection is that it caused agro for anyone dragging a corpse within agro range of a mob, regardless of faction. I don't think there was any kind of faction check to see if the corpse in question was KOS or not.

[azeth]

1. This occurred when the decedent was KoS IN ADDITION to lowering DUBIOUS con to THREATENING, thereby making the dragger "KoS"

2. Kael, Skyshrine, Thurgadin, ToV

[Zapatos]

for kael:
"I learned the hard way that the giants there aggro on you for dragging corpses through the city...whether you're visible or not." http://www.guforums.com/archive/index.php/t-6694.html (4th post down)

for tov:
"Dragging corpses here will cause agro even if you are max ally to CoV." http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.shtml?zone=116 (way far down)

and from my own experience, at least in tov, it seemed even if both the corpse and player are non-kos, just the act of the drag is regarded as a hostile action. Not sure about in SS, thurgadin, or velk's though.

on another note, hurray for a velius discussion with the devs!

[Ele]

Probably best explanation:

The warring races issue has brought up one modification to how people play the game that some aren't too happy about. Normally when you die, you can have a friend go to your corpse and drag it out of danger. That won't work so well in Velious. If you die in an area where you are viewed as an enemy, and have a friend who is liked by that race try to drag your corpse out, they will be viewed as assisting the enemy and therefore attacked. This is only a minor setback that can you can get around using invisibility, unless the mob can see through that at which point you will be seeing "LOADING ¿ PLEASE WAIT" once again...
http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=35536
http://au.pc.ign.com/articles/165/165361p1.html (December 8, 2000)


The NPC AI has also been adjusted in Velious. In the past, if you had trouble retrieving a corpse, you could have a comrade drag your corpse out of danger to another area of the zone. In Velious, however, a new angle comes into play. If you have bad faction with a new mob (let’s say Ice Dragons) and you are killed with your corpse surrounded by Ice Dragons you’ll face a new obstacle. If you call on a friend who has good faction with Ice Dragons and they try to drag your corpse away, that friend will find that the Dragons (who normally tolerate their presence) will attack as soon as he tries to drag the corpse. Nasty.

http://www.gamesfirst.com/reviews/ben/Velious/scars.htm

Death has never been easy to deal with in Norrath, as having to retrieve the possessions from your own corpse, let alone having to spend hours regaining the experience you've lost, can be extremely frustrating, but Velious adds a further possible complication. It's no longer safe for a player with good faction standing to drag another player's corpse to a convenient location for the revived player, as the creatures of Velious won't let someone assist their enemies. This makes death an even greater risk in Velious, so again, unless you're traveling in a large group or with high-level clerics ready to resurrect their fallen comrades, then you'd best be extremely careful.
http://reviews.cnet.com/pc-games/everquest-the-scars-of/4505-9696_7-30976185.html?tag=previous%3bpage1
http://www.gamespot.com/everquest-the-scars-of-velious/reviews/everquest-the-scars-of-velious-review-2663885/

[baub]

growth as well

[Ele]

I can't imagine any corpse dragging would cause instant KOS status, but that instead the dragger takes on the faction status of the dragee.

I'm not sure what kind of cross-check would be involved or if a corpse can retain a faction status.

[happyhappy]

Thurg a&b, ToV, Skyshrine, WW (dragons not random drakes and wurms), DN (rat faction), CS (only otters), Kael, Growth are the ones as far as I can remember.

Also, the dragged had to be KoS by faction, not agro. Like if you are ally to thurg, nuke a guard and die, you could get dragged with no issue.

[Spitty]

I'm trying to find definitive proof, but you can add some (or maybe all?) of the CoV faction named in WW to that list. Corpse-dragging across the zone with a KoS body could cause some pretty hilarious trains to show up at ToV. You'd also have to get someone to train a raid encounter mob around to pull bodies if you wiped and it decided to corpse camp instead of path.

Kael, Thurgadin, Skyshrine and Plane of Growth were all definitely zone-wide areas for corpse aggro.

[Splorf22]

on another note, hurray for a velius discussion with the devs!

[Xadion]

It was pretty much all of velious- but as stated, skyshrine, PoG, Kael, ToV, Thurg AB etc

Also do note, as stated in a feq quotes- it did not trigger you instantly to KoS- as you could invs drag just as you could all the time- it did not magically make the mobs see past your invs- also it had some sort of timer, as if you- lets say are non kos to giants, and drag a kos-corpse invs to zone, un-invs then wonder over to the other side of the zone- the giants wont kill you- I took that as "they didnt see you dragging the corpse" but I as a SK with a prenerf CoS was always invs- this may not be the case and others may be able to comment more on the long lasting effects of dragging a kos corpse.

and yes, yay velious

also i dont think the corpse thing was "classic velious" but put in a little later

[Artah]

I can't imagine any corpse dragging would cause instant KOS status, but that instead the dragger takes on the faction status of the dragee.

I'm not sure what kind of cross-check would be involved or if a corpse can retain a faction status.

I remember that the KOS status was temporary and only lasted until the player zones out then they are back to their original faction when they zoned back in. They become kos again if they start dragging again (had too much fun with this). I am not sure if it's an entire zone temporary faction change or just the aggroed NPC and anything that was aggroed by association.

[Arteker]

was one of the main reasons robes for necros have summon corpse in it as cliky .

Rogues find hard to drag corpses in such zones for that reason (most times was monk work). it changed when they added the AA for hide

[Ele]

Anyone have input for how the faction sharing worked while FD on a monk/sk/nec?

[happyhappy]

Flip flop was essentially like invis, no agro trigger if you /corpsed while fd.

[Spitty]

Corpse aggro was definitely classic - right from the get-go. It may not have been been around in early stages of testing, but it quickly became obvious how easily exploitable the raid zones in Velious were.

All you needed was a single epic cleric in your guild on +CoV and you could bring a whole raid right into Yelinak's lair, for example.

[maximum]

I can never remember a problem with corpse dragging using Rogue Hide+Sneak, in Kael or Skyshrine. I can't speak for any other classes, or Invisibility spell.

[Grozmok]

Straight from William Fisher, Velious game designer:

So, basically the person dragging the corpse would pick-up aggro if the corpse was KoS to the NPC in aggro range.

This would remain until the player zoned.

[Lazortag]

If you drag a KOS player's corpse past an NPC and the NPC aggroes you, then someone kills the NPC, do you lose faction?

[Fazlazen]

If you drag a KOS player's corpse past an NPC and the NPC aggroes you, then someone kills the NPC, do you lose faction?

if a npc aggros you and someone kills it without you doing anything, you take a faction hit, standard mechanic here, nothing different about corpse dragging.

As to the question about FD corpse dragging, it was widely used, monks became big draggers in velious + because of their ability to fd, drag corpses, move a bit, drag etc.

[Metallikus]

It is important to note that the corpse dragger becomes "scowling" rather than "threateningly" because one is instant agro and the other requires a 2nd server tick in agro range to be attacked.

[Dumesh Uhl'Belk]

Basically, while dragging you have the faction of the corpse you are dragging instead of your own (if it is worse). The part I don't remember was how long it lasted (duration, or until you zone). It definitely did not persist through zoning. As has been said before... you're just temporarily counted as having that faction... nothing about see invis, invis, is modified. I'm almost positive Feign death would clear the faction change until you dragged again. EQMac would be a great place to run a few tests if some TR people want to chime in.

[fischsemmel]

Amg velious discussions!!!

[Asher]

Corpse aggro was definitely classic - right from the get-go. It may not have been been around in early stages of testing, but it quickly became obvious how easily exploitable the raid zones in Velious were.

All you needed was a single epic cleric in your guild on +CoV and you could bring a whole raid right into Yelinak's lair, for example.

As opposed to the more difficult method of a lvl 55 mage with CotH parked there.

Asher

[Nedala]

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/10029987.jpg

[Xadion]

Draggin up to lord Yilly is a bad example....

All it takes is 1 non kos Mage to just CoTH everyone up there... a rouge would take forever. (edit: i see this was already pointed out lol)

And...not much sees invs in Skyshrine anywho- just gatta know how to get through the maze.

Was this from velious release patch note? /shurg

It really only bones the unlucky adventurer out wondering and gets killed in a bad spot- now you have to find a necro rather than "HEY random guy can u help me" any raid-like stuff that this was meant to slow down etc is nulled 90% of the time by haveing rouges,monks,necros,mages etc at hand.

[sabinrf24]

Pseudo-Velious note - Chardok post-revamp had the corpse drag faction mechanic in place, as well. I'll see if I can't dig up some references to exact implementation dates.

[Daldaen]

I'm curious about what is deemed "While dragging".


Cause.. afaik /corpsedrag function isn't active until PoP or later. You have to spam a /corpse hotkey. Meaning each instant you hit it you are 'dragging' the corpse but you aren't continually doing it, its like taunting. You hit taunt for a single instant every x seconds if you are trying to get aggro....


So how long after I've hit /corpse do I have to wait until my con reverts to normal on the mobs in the zone I guess...? Because if its something where I will drag a corpse then 10minutes later get popped by a mob that I'm really Ally with, that'd be uber lame.

[Pscottdai]

The way it was set up, once you hit the /corpse key you became KOS and stayed that way until you zonned or lost agro due to FD.

[Grozmok]

The way it was set up, once you hit the /corpse key you became KOS and stayed that way until you zonned or lost agro due to FD.

This.

[Gwence]

Basically, while dragging you have the faction of the corpse you are dragging instead of your own (if it is worse). The part I don't remember was how long it lasted (duration, or until you zone). It definitely did not persist through zoning. As has been said before... you're just temporarily counted as having that faction... nothing about see invis, invis, is modified. I'm almost positive Feign death would clear the faction change until you dragged again. EQMac would be a great place to run a few tests if some TR people want to chime in.

we're all kos in kael so can't really test dragging in there, I can tell you I can drag in kael perfectly fine with invis on without getting any agro.

tov is instant agro if u drag within range of a mob

pogrowth is same as tov

haven't tried dragging in skyshrine or thurg, they all love us too much to kill us, I'll test it out later today.

[bulbousaur]

Didn't they eventually remove this?

[Lazortag]

Didn't they eventually remove this?

If it's still on eqmac (see the above post) then it probably wasn't removed in classic.

[DoucLangur]

Invis dragging might be okay - as one of the above posters mentioned, dragging gave you instant aggro in PoG and ToV - both zones IIRC have almost or exclusively see invis mobs.

I disagree with the statement that you got a temporary faction hit for dragging. Dragging would get you aggro like taunting/attacking the mob. And you would still be at your default faction to other mobs if you then decided to stop dragging and run off - as long as other mobs didn't assist on the one that already aggroed you.

You could *definitely* drag corpses without FD in areas were no giant was in range to aggro in Kael (steep corridor leading up to Arena area only had roamers in one part). If you then got into range of other mobs, you would not be aggroed - unless you dragged the corpse in their vicinity again.

Dragging while FD was perfectly fine. FDing off aggro from a drag was also fine - you could get back up and - if aggro successfully cleared - you'd be free to walk around again. No sources other than my memory - sorry.

[fadetree]

I don't recall persistent drag aggro status either. If you got 'seen' doing it, then that mob would be after you, but you wouldn't be marked for zonewide aggro apart from normal aggro mechanics.

[Szeth]

Dragging while FD, at least as I understand it, is enough to dispel the notion of a temporary faction change (unless it's .1 second). As just the other day I dragged in HoT, and immediately stood back up without aggro. If it changed your faction level temporarily I would have gotten aggro upon standing from the dead persons bad faction.

[Szeth]

Pseudo-Velious note - Chardok post-revamp had the corpse drag faction mechanic in place, as well. I'll see if I can't dig up some references to exact implementation dates.

This is also 100% untrue. I am ally in chardok and dragged multiple corpses from betrayer camp up to zone in without aggro.(on eqmac)

[sabinrf24]

This is also 100% untrue. I am ally in chardok and dragged multiple corpses from betrayer camp up to zone in without aggro.(on eqmac)

I was fairly convinced that I remembered it correctly, but everything I have found has proved me wrong. Apparently Chardok wasn't affected by this.

Assuming the mechanic wasn't reverted prior to this posting in 2003, this would prove that post-nerf Chardok did not utilize this mechanic.

http://www.erollisimarr.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-12755.html

[Metallikus]

Originally Posted by Pscottdai
The way it was set up, once you hit the /corpse key you became KOS and stayed that way until you zonned or lost agro due to FD.

This.

Actually NOT THIS at all. The act of dragging a corpse in agro range of a mob that was KOS to the corpse was the only act of gaining agro. You could drag a corpse around all day, and when a mob is pathing toward you, you just wait till its gone and continue dragging the corpse along. All the while never getting agro unless a mob saw you do it.

[Grozmok]

Originally Posted by Pscottdai
The way it was set up, once you hit the /corpse key you became KOS and stayed that way until you zonned or lost agro due to FD.



Actually NOT THIS at all. The act of dragging a corpse in agro range of a mob that was KOS to the corpse was the only act of gaining agro. You could drag a corpse around all day, and when a mob is pathing toward you, you just wait till its gone and continue dragging the corpse along. All the while never getting agro unless a mob saw you do it.

Going off of what I was told by a former EQ developer. I'll ask around a bit more and get back to you.

[happyhappy]

The term KoS is being tossed around without the afterthought of what it actually means.

Being KoS: Monsters will attack you when in their range without any need for hostile action
Getting agro: Monsters attacking you as a result of an hostile action.

Corpse dragging a player with KoS status was considered as a hostile action, therefore you would gain agro, not become KoS.

[Spitty]

I don't know where you people got rogue dragging from in my post.

I used Yelinak as an example because that was one raid mob that stood out as being easily exploited. You could get your entire raid force inside his room without even fighting the door guards and either click-rez everyone in or, as it was apparently necessary to point out twice, use the obvious CoH mage.

[Happyfeet]

I don't know where you people got rogue dragging from in my post.

I used Yelinak as an example because that was one raid mob that stood out as being easily exploited. You could get your entire raid force inside his room without even fighting the door guards and either click-rez everyone in or, as it was apparently necessary to point out twice, use the obvious CoH mage.

How do you get the corpses inside the room to rez them in? I think this is the rogue dragging you were curious about. Although other classes can drag through SS as well.

[Spitty]

The point I was trying to make was that it became painfully obvious early on that raid zones could be exploited by corpse dragging and corpse aggro was built into the expansion upon release. Someone suggested that the aggro was added later, and that simply isn't true.

I forgot entirely that this board's makeup is largely people who need to correct everyone else in order to feel good about themselves, or I would have just made that point and not included a goddamn example to back it up.

[nilbog]

Okay here are the confirmed rules so far:

Testing environment
zone: kael
pc: rallos zek ogre (dubious con)

Dragging my own corpse = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc = aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc while invised = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who isn't kos (another dubious ogre) in range of npc = aggro

Initiating a corpse drag out of range of npc, leaving the corpse, then approaching the npcs = no aggro


Tested in great divide = no aggro
Tested in thurgadin = no aggro
Tested in icewell keep = aggro

So,

-Faction of corpse's player is irrelevant. Dragging corpses in zones where this rule exists equals aggro.
-Dragging your own corpse is safe.
-Dragging someone else's corpse out of range of npcs does not equal zone aggro. They must see you perform the action in aggro radius.
-Dragging someone else's corpse within range while invisible doesn't aggro. The npc must see through invis to aggro.

Remaining questions:
What all zones should this happen in?

Kael - yes
Thurgadinb - yes

I assume skyshrine, temple of veeshan, and plane of growth. How about plane of mischief?

[Rogean]

That confirms my suspicion of how SoE coded it, thanks. This should be fairly easy to accomplish.

My question to content designers is how do you want this to work.. would you rather flag an entire zone via the zone table for corpse dragging aggro, or would you prefer to flag it per NPC.

[nilbog]

Well, the whole zone would be quicker (?), but it might be dirty. Invisible men used as emotes and triggers would be killing folks.

I guess by npc_type, or by spawn2.id would be safer.

[Rogean]

Invisible men used as emotes and triggers would be killing folks.

Not if those NPC's are properly flagged as un-aggroable, they will fail the CanAggro/CanAttack checks.

[Nuggie]

-

[Treats]

I'm certain it would happen in Temple of Veeshan. Factions a bit different though depending on where you go.

Inside the door to the Halls of Testing - All aggro, if you opened the door the drakes outside would assist also.

West ToV (Gozz/Len/Telk) - All on CoV faction.

Past the door to North I cannot remember what faction the Wyverns/Eashen of the Sky/Ikitiar the Venom were on. I think CoV but not totally positive. The smallish mini drakes above Eashen were all on CoV as you needed a Mage to CoH there to insert in. The two large drakes in front of the drop off to Aaryonar and beyond should all be fully KoS no matter your faction and give negative hits to CoV.

Plane of Mischeif I dont think there is anything there that gives any type of faction hits except for a few named mobs. However they could all be on Denziens of Mischief, I cannot remember ;/ The pansies in the forest however are KoS to all.

Lithiniath has his own faction. -Lithiniath, +Gelistial??

Stomples on Denziens of Mischief. (Give Debbis his foot to repair faction)

Debbis the Fish on Denziens of Mischief.

Cannot recall about Plane of Growth or Skyshrine (almost positive Skyshrine used this for sure though).

[DoucLangur]

Okay here are the confirmed rules so far:

[..]
-Faction of corpse's player is irrelevant. Dragging corpses in zones where this rule exists equals aggro.
-Dragging your own corpse is safe.
-Dragging someone else's corpse out of range of npcs does not equal zone aggro. They must see you perform the action in aggro radius.
-Dragging someone else's corpse within range while invisible doesn't aggro. The npc must see through invis to aggro.

I am positively surprised that this coincides 100% with my memory of how things were - I did not dare speak up against the irrelevance of faction of the corpse "owner" - since I wasn't too sure, just gut feeling :)

Did you confirm this on EQMac?

[Daliant17447]

Not sure if this is still an active topic but I came across this recently:

http://web.archive.org/web/20000511105010/http://www.everlore.com/MBoards.asp?show=3

You have to be kidding me. Corpse dragging is instant argo in some SoV zones?

How about a weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee bit more info. Will Rogues hide / sneak be broken while pulling bodies? Will regular invis disappear? Are you prepared to tell a player that looses everything that he spent months if not years getting that "Sorry, there is nothing I can do" if he cant get a Corpse summoned or pulled out? Just what are the limits?

Ok, here's a bit more information.

The idea is that there are some places where, with a good faction, characters can travel unharmed. Some of those places are very, very dangerous to those that are not aligned with the folks that live there. These will be major adventuring/hunting zones for those that don’t mind not being able to wander around free there and talk to the locals.

We really like it that way, but setting things up like that leads to a simple problem. Folks that are hated by the natives can make assaults on them and have their 'friends' who are well liked by the locals simply drag their corpses to safety, right in front of the people they were trying to kill. There are other potential abuses of this situation that I won't describe…

So, to maintain the risk of fighting in these difficult places, we had to have these mobs get upset when you drag their kills off. And, yes, rogues and invisible types will have to be a lot more careful doing their recoveries once they actually lift that corpse up on their shoulders and start to scamper away.

You will not have a problem dragging your own corpse (at least not any more of a problem than you would normally have). So if you accidentally fall to your death and you are friendly with the natives, you will be able to drag your own corpse all over the zone with no additional problems. But then, you won't need a safe spot either…

This will make corpse recovery a little bit more difficult in the few places where this rule is used. But we see this as a necessary and useful inclusion. We wanted to tell you about it before hand to help reduce the number of people surprised by this addition.

Alan

Yikes!

Correction on my last post.

Dragging a corpse will not make you more visible. So if the creature sees through invis, it will still see you dragging a corpse. If it does not, dragging a corpse will not increase your visibility to that creature.

Sorry for the goof on that. Hopefully I caught it fast enough.

Alan

Axterix wrote: "Absor: Let's say that Joe and myself, who are both friendly with the things in the dungeon, are going about our business. Joe takes a nice 10k plunge off a cliff. I go air elemental and float down to his body.

Joe isn't KoS. I'm not KoS. Can I drag his body safely?

Basically, you've stated that you can drag your own body around with no additional risk... what I want to know is does it merely look at if the body is yours or not or at the factions of the owner of the body?"

Normally we don't like to go into too much detail about stuff like this. But this works differently than people are used to, and we don’t want there to be too much confusion over this. You're right in your assumption. Dragging any corpse but your own will cause a reaction in those around you. Corpses don't have faction… So your friend will have to walk back and get his own corpse.

Feydakin said: "I think this is the heart of the debate: Is dragging a hated corpse a "faction hit" or does it just put you on a mob's hate list and cause it to attack. It is understood that if you are attacked and defeat the mob, you would take a faction hit. But the question that I'm seeing asked and not answered is whether you take and actual FACTION HIT by merely dragging a corpse.

Can I, for instance, have good faction, but hightail it to the zone, dragging my buddy's corpse, and assuming I zone safely... have I lost faction with the pursuing mobs, or does zoning clean the hate list and I'm back to being best pals with them when I zone back over?"

There is no faction hit for dragging a corpse. You can do exactly as you suggest in your last paragraph with no loss of faction. And I'd consider you a brave and foolish friend for doing so.

Alan


The way I understand it is: Dragging ANY corpse regardless of what the corpse owner's faction is, will flag the dragger KOS to any mobs in the area that can see the dragger. If the dragger is invis and the mob does NOT see invis, you can drag a corpse past it safely.

[Daliant17447]

Okay here are the confirmed rules so far:

Testing environment
zone: kael
pc: rallos zek ogre (dubious con)

Dragging my own corpse = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc = aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc while invised = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who isn't kos (another dubious ogre) in range of npc = aggro

Initiating a corpse drag out of range of npc, leaving the corpse, then approaching the npcs = no aggro


Tested in great divide = no aggro
Tested in thurgadin = no aggro
Tested in icewell keep = aggro

So,

-Faction of corpse's player is irrelevant. Dragging corpses in zones where this rule exists equals aggro.
-Dragging your own corpse is safe.
-Dragging someone else's corpse out of range of npcs does not equal zone aggro. They must see you perform the action in aggro radius.
-Dragging someone else's corpse within range while invisible doesn't aggro. The npc must see through invis to aggro.

Remaining questions:
What all zones should this happen in?

Kael - yes
Thurgadinb - yes

I assume skyshrine, temple of veeshan, and plane of growth. How about plane of mischief?

Disregard my last post, I see you guys got it covered already

[nilbog]

Okay here are the confirmed rules so far:

Testing environment
zone: kael
pc: rallos zek ogre (dubious con)

Dragging my own corpse = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc = aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who is kos in range of npc while invised = no aggro

Dragging a corpse of someone who isn't kos (another dubious ogre) in range of npc = aggro

Initiating a corpse drag out of range of npc, leaving the corpse, then approaching the npcs = no aggro


Tested in great divide = no aggro
Tested in thurgadin = no aggro
Tested in icewell keep = aggro

So,

-Faction of corpse's player is irrelevant. Dragging corpses in zones where this rule exists equals aggro.
-Dragging your own corpse is safe.
-Dragging someone else's corpse out of range of npcs does not equal zone aggro. They must see you perform the action in aggro radius.
-Dragging someone else's corpse within range while invisible doesn't aggro. The npc must see through invis to aggro.

Remaining questions:
What all zones should this happen in?

Kael - yes
Thurgadinb - yes

I assume skyshrine, temple of veeshan, and plane of growth. How about plane of mischief?

Bump.

I need to know what Velious zones should follow these rules. Below, I listed all the Velious zones for completeness, but zones where everyone is kos should not matter.


greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = ?
crystal = ?
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = ?
iceclad = ?
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = ?
sirens = ?
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = ?
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = ?
westwastes = ?

[maximum]

Bump.

I need to know what Velious zones should follow these rules. Below, I listed all the Velious zones for completeness, but zones where everyone is kos should not matter.


greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = ?
crystal = ?
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = ?
iceclad = ?
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = ?
sirens = ?
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = ?
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = ?
westwastes = ?



I'm pretty sure I remember westwastes being Aggro (red), but I forget of the Dragons during Velious era could see through Rogue Hide.

[Galanteer]

greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = ?
crystal = ?
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = ?
iceclad = ?
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = ?
sirens = ?
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = ?
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = ?
westwastes = ?



I am pretty sure Velketor is no agro, during early Velious my entire roll in a raid was to drag corpses to the clerics while we sent multiple waves to take him down.

Enchanters could be non kos in Velks and I would often drag corpses all over. (Illusion werewolf and faction spell) Also only Velketor gave a negative faction hit (the tashing enchater would suicide or camp to avoid the hit).

[Kika Maslyaka]

Nilbog from my "perfect" memory:

-When velious was JUST released - I don't remember what drag rules were there if any at all

BUT shortly after the following was implemented:

In city-like zones like Kael, Skyshrine (Thurg? not sure):
-any player who is dragging someone else corpse - gets agroed on
-if you are invis/hidden/sneaking - your invis state works as normal - if mob can't see you it can't agro

I specifically remember players asking devs questions about "what if the owner of the corpse wasn't KOS?" And the devs specifically answered that: "A corpse doesn't have a faction. So any dragging will result in agro. You can still drag your own corpse as normal"

ToV may have been added to this list later, but I can't be sure.

I am also not sure that PoM and PoG were affected by this rule since there weren't part of Velious 3-way faction wars.

[nilbog]

Bump.

I need to know what Velious zones should follow these rules. Below, I listed all the Velious zones for completeness, but zones where everyone is kos should not matter.


greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = ?
crystal = ?
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = ?
iceclad = ?
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = aggro
sirens = ?
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = ?
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = ?
westwastes = ?



Bump. Anyone can test this by 2 boxing on live/eqmac afaik. Corpse drag aggro still works on eqmac; not sure about eqlive. Some zones will be more difficult than others, but there are several near cities. Skyshrine is still needed, wakening lands, iceclad, cobalt scar, etc.

[Clark]

Glad I have a 60 Necro alt to corpse summon.

[nilbog]

Bump.

I need to know what Velious zones should follow these rules. Below, I listed all the Velious zones for completeness, but zones where everyone is kos should not matter.


greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = no aggro
crystal = ?
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = no aggro
iceclad = ?
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = aggro
sirens = no aggro
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = no aggro
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = no aggro
westwastes = ?



Updated from Uthgaard tests.

[cyryllis]

crystal caverns and iceclad ocean no corpse drag aggro

[nilbog]

Is it definitive that corpse drag aggro still exists on eqlive? The testing is great, but the mechanic is gone, then they will all be no aggro :(

updated list as per cyryllis.

greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = no aggro
crystal = no aggro
necropolis = ?
eastwastes = no aggro
iceclad = no aggro
sleeper = ?
growthplane = ?
mischiefplane = aggro
sirens = no aggro
skyshrine = ?
templeveeshan = ?
wakening = no aggro
frozenshadow = ?
velketor = no aggro
westwastes = ?

[47shadesofgay]

Can't confirm it still works on live, can confirm it still works on EQMac.

ToV confirmed agro from dragging.

[doraf]

greatdivide = no aggro
kael = aggro
thurgadina = no aggro
thurgadinb = aggro
cobaltscar = no aggro
crystal = no aggro
necropolis = aggro
eastwastes = no aggro
iceclad = no aggro
sleeper = no aggro
growthplane = aggro
mischiefplane = no aggro
sirens = no aggro
skyshrine = aggro
templeveeshan = aggro (every mob in zone agro'd corpse draggers)
wakening = no aggro (Except the two velious dragons)
frozenshadow = no aggro
velketor = no aggro
westwastes = aggro

[Kieu]

Kael/Thurg were definite aggro when dragging. I honestly didn't really notice it besides those zones, but that doesn't make it sound at all.

[doraf]

Did you just guess on all of those? Because west wastes and wakening land dragons definitely did not aggro during my tests.

Unfortunately, The list is only my best recollection. I spent a lot of time in PoM (long enough to get my crazy cleric bp and my flowers) and I do not remember agro pulling any corpses in PoM.

I'm pretty sure I remember running around Rolandal in WL whenever I pulled KoS corpses to Skyshrine.

[Sundawg]

Unfortunately, The list is only my best recollection. I spent a lot of time in PoM (long enough to get my crazy cleric bp and my flowers) and I do not remember agro pulling any corpses in PoM.



100 percent certain you get agro for pulling corpses in classic PoM, I tested it myself recently on EQmac.

[radditsu]

growth and necropolis did not aggro. Growth just had the protectors( when working) being jerks and attacking people with bad faction no matter what.

[doraf]

There is a post in feb 2002 and another 2004 stating that you will agro mobs in PoG if you drag corpses w/o invis.
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/zones.html?zstrat=103

As for the CoV faction dragons (Whoushi and Rolandal) in WL. I can't find anything, but I would assume (I'm pretty sure it was like this back in the day) they would agro if you attempted to pull a KoS corpse past them w/o invis.

[nilbog]

Could be the functionality was removed from eqlive :T But, it still works on eqmac. Anyone willing to test it could use 2 dubious rallos zek ogres in Kael.

[Droog007]

Seeing as it's been proven that mobs/zones flagged for this behavior do not care about the faction the corpse had when it was still alive, I would speculate that this did not happen in zones where there are significant populations of warring factions.

e.g. It would be dumb if a dwarf near Thurgadin attacked you for dragging the corpse of someone slain by a giant... or if Wuoshi turned on you for the same reason.

Rather, since it seems to have been dumbed down to the point that "if you died in here, you're either KOS, intend to be KOS, or just dumb - so anyone dragging you is guilty by association", then it was more likely limited to the strongholds of the 3 factions.

Personally - I only remember it happening in Kael and ToV, but I didn't do much raiding in Thurgadin or SS.

[maximum]

Bump.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

I can't imagine any corpse dragging would cause instant KOS status, but that instead the dragger takes on the faction status of the dragee.

I'm not sure what kind of cross-check would be involved or if a corpse can retain a faction status.

What about it being a flag on the "item" that it was killed by a zone npc?

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

growth and necropolis did not aggro. Growth just had the protectors( when working) being jerks and attacking people with bad faction no matter what.

I always found the PoG's endearing. If I were an npc, I'd want to be a PoG. Sure, kill me, i'll just respawn and come at ya 20 minutes all over again, an irritating little fucker.

[webrunner5]

This is not Rocket Science. There is pretty much Dragon and Giant faction. And throw in Clerics of Tunare faction and that is about it. Once you start the ball rolling the whole damn zone is out to kill your ass. Even if you are a nice little Druid or Ranger, kill Tunare and your goose is cooked.

[heazels]

Corpse Dragging agroed in Skyshrine, Thurgadin, Kael, Temple of Veeshan, Plane of Growth. I'm 100% certain. Faction did not matter, giants would agro corpse draggers if you were even KoS. The faction does not change, but mobs will attack you and will assist each other in attacking you even the mob conned green.