remove staff from player interactions?

[Darwoth]

ninjalooting, trade ganking, scamming, training, xp lossing, stranding warriors in hate and so on should. imo be approached with a hands off tough shit mindset as they were on sullon (and for all but training, on rz as well)

tired of seeing/hearing about the latest ruling on what is or is not allowed and the various shades of gray cast as a result, the only truly fair ruleset is no ruleset.

[Harrison]

Holocaust caught exploiting. Darwoth is in Holocaust.

Darwoth of course doesn't want punishments for cheating.

[Darwoth]

Holocaust caught exploiting. Darwoth is in Holocaust.

Darwoth of course doesn't want punishments for cheating.


there is so much stupid condensed in such a small sampling of your drivel i have no response but the following.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyMXYE_50Ts

[hagard]

This message is hidden because Harrison is on your ignore list.

But if you take it out of staffs hands it falls on the guilds to settle it. How it was on live, the gm intervention has never worked well

[Harrison]

Guilds don't police themselves because all it is now is two guilds exploiting back and forth incessantly.

On live exploiters and cheaters were ostracized and weren't allowed in your guild. Here? They're celebrated and welcomed in, gladly.

Permanent bans are the only solution.

[Kringe]

Do you ever stfu.... Nonstop blabble in every forum on every topic... Blue or Red.... Mad Postal Worker is Mad..

[Hovis]

Do you ever stfu.... Nonstop blabble in every forum on every topic... Blue or Red.... Mad Postal Worker is Mad..

he wants them post counts bro to feel special hahah

[aerokella]

Darwoth confirmed mad.

[Harrison]

Reset my post count to 0, where my care level for it is.

I'm just promoting legitimacy on both servers.

[Darwoth]

Darwoth confirmed mad.

bout what?

[Harrison]

That you can't exploit CT script anymore.

Now you have to pvp.

[Gongshow]

Darwoth's posts are always spot on.

R99 needs to become the wild west before the staff runs what little player base off that we have left. Eventually people come to agreements, know who they will be courteous to, know who they will grief, etc. It all works out in the end, and for the best, with minimal headaches.

GM's should only be enforcing hacking, exploiting, etc. Player interactions should be just that. PLAYER interactions.

[Darwoth]

That you can't exploit CT script anymore.

Now you have to pvp.

well since i am not in holocaust, haven't triggered the script once, and said nothing supporting "exploiting and cheating" here or elsewhere i guess you truly are batting a thousand in the league of stupidity.

[Srs Not Ames]

Tired of the rules lawyering and Petitionquest the red server has turned into. Remove the unnecessary rules and GM intervention and avoid all this dumb blue bullshit.

[Srs Not Ames]

GM's should only be enforcing hacking, exploiting, etc. Player interactions should be just that. PLAYER interactions.

[fiegi]

GM's should be catching mq2 users and helping players when their corpses are stuck under the world. that's_it

[Harrison]

Fiegi's guild caught exploiting Nagafen (on his command, read my sig)

Of course he doesn't want GMs policing exploits...

Thread invalidated like his entire guild, and Nihilum.

[fiegi]

This message is hidden because Harrison is on your ignore list.

[bamzal]

only blues need rules

[SamwiseRed]

GMs have no place on red especially with what we have on r99.

[Lulz Sect]

Perhaps a /ready command that both raid forces need to type before engaging in Fear PvP?

[SamwiseRed]

when raid elitist gm over a red server. shits bound to be fucked. put someone who has pvped outside the arena in charge of this server or FFA this bitch.

[stormlord]

I voted no because there're a lot of cases where nobody can right a wrong. There're exploits and mechanics that just do not have an opposite. It's not as straight forward and malleable as reality is. In reality there's a equal and opposite reaction for everything. But in games it's hit and miss and filled with holes.

Also keep in mind that whatever problems classic had we inherit.

However, I would prefer to only have rules for the most extreme cases. This is pvp. You can over-rule a server. Makes your job harder and makes hte atmosphere feel suffocating for players.

How does Eve-Online handle griefing?

[hagard]

At least she's not locking chars during pvp lol

[Harrison]

Eve supports and condones griefing, and exploiting.

Not possible to compare Eve to EQ. Eve was designed for pure pvp. EQ added it after, with no regard to its implementation.

[Palemoon]

ninjalooting, trade ganking, scamming, training, xp lossing, stranding warriors in hate and so on should. imo be approached with a hands off tough shit mindset as they were on sullon (and for all but training, on rz as well)

tired of seeing/hearing about the latest ruling on what is or is not allowed and the various shades of gray cast as a result, the only truly fair ruleset is no ruleset.

No, this is classic everquest not your personal torture chamber.

Keep it Classic

[Lazortag]

ninjalooting, trade ganking, scamming, training, xp lossing, stranding warriors in hate and so on should. imo be approached with a hands off tough shit mindset as they were on sullon (and for all but training, on rz as well)

tired of seeing/hearing about the latest ruling on what is or is not allowed and the various shades of gray cast as a result, the only truly fair ruleset is no ruleset.

TD;DR (too dumb; didn't read)

[Darwoth]

No, this is classic everquest not your personal torture chamber.

Keep it Classic

everything i mentioned IS classic to have GMs not interfere.

[Palemoon]

everything i mentioned IS classic to have GMs not interfere.

Wrong and Nellodee/softcore PK already pointed all this out to you months ago.

You see what you want to see from behind your hannibal lecter mask.

[Darwoth]

Wrong and Nellodee/softcore PK already pointed all this out to you months ago.

You see what you want to see from behind your hannibal lecter mask.

sorry, but i dont need morons from some carebear server to "correct" me

the only thing that was against the rules out of what i mentioned was training, and that was on RZ and everyone did it anyway.

[Flunklesnarkin]

ninjalooting, trade ganking, scamming, training, xp lossing, stranding warriors in hate and so on should. imo be approached with a hands off tough shit mindset as they were on sullon (and for all but training, on rz as well)

tired of seeing/hearing about the latest ruling on what is or is not allowed and the various shades of gray cast as a result, the only truly fair ruleset is no ruleset.



http://i44.tinypic.com/p0fow.jpg

[Null]

everything i mentioned IS classic to have GMs not interfere.

I have personally been banned or had guildies banned for everything on your list outside of stranding people in Hate. It didn't happen often, mostly because banning people meant losing revenue but it did happen.

[Darwoth]

as an aside one could note that those for getting staff out of the affairs of the server are well known folks in game or on the boards, and those against are retards from the blue server, 20 post alt accounts and nihilum members.

predictable to say the least.

[Darwoth]

I have personally been banned or had guildies banned for everything on your list outside of stranding people in Hate. It didn't happen often, mostly because banning people meant losing revenue but it did happen.

you also personally had red full resists on single effect nukes that never happened throughout the entire duration of launch through velious.

i have screenshots of ozuri (lead gm of RZ) squirreled away somewhere telling me tradeganking was legal after i shitcanned someone during a gbs "trade" in neriak for thousands of plat.

ninjalooting was a regular occurance on RZ among all of the raid sects and nobody ever got banned for it.

instead people were banned for things like "zoneline camping"

[Harrison]

Well known cheaters...yeah. Seriously, every single one.

[Darwoth]

in fact the policies on such were clear.....

"scamming", if you willingly gave another player an item or your login you were shit out of luck

ninjalooting, was considered part of raid security to prevent it

tradeganking, you were expected to be careful and take precautions against it (gems for example)

training was the only thing i mentioned that got people a gm response, and even that did not apply on sullon.


your either full of shit, played long after sony took over the game or had GMs operating on a whole different set of rules on the (team?) server you played on.

[Envious]

Being right all the time gets so boring...

[Nirgon]

Worst thing that can happen to a game is a staff failing to enforce rules equally.

This server is in the toilet.

[Lazortag]

Worst thing that can happen to a game is a staff failing to enforce rules equally.

This server is in the toilet.

Boo hoo. God forbid you try to be reasonable with a GM instead of going full retard on the forums the second things don't go your way. It was the exact same way after you were disbanded for exploiting Naggy, you guys tried to play the victim when you were in the wrong in the first place. When you do something wrong and you're caught red handed, the correct response is contrition. Your response however was to bitch as much as possible about unequal treatment. And that is why no one will ever take you seriously - you could have probably solved all of your woes by politely speaking with a GM but instead you chose to do what Holo does best: whining publicly.

[SamwiseRed]

nah I had doubts about this server when holo was banned for using known nihilum strats. was totally confused and thought there was something else behind it. nope just full retard decisions being made by people without a clue.

[oldfish]

I played Rallos for 2 years (01-02), and ive never heard of anyone banned for the stuff Darwoth is talking about.

Hell i never even thought training was illegal back then because i had never heard of someone getting banned for it and to be in Oasis meant to be watching your back for spectres or sand giant trains, always.

Wether it is classic or not, i think it makes the game more interesting.

What would eve online be without all the scamming, etc...? Alot more boring.

On rallos i once got bind camped for 20mins outside unrest and the guy tells me "Ill stop but you have to port me to EC" i said sure! And ported him at 2am
in dreadlands with nobody around.

This is the kind of stuff that should be allowed here. Dont wanna get ported in the middle of nowhere? Make sure the guy you are getting a port from is trustable.

[SearyxTZ]

I'm too tired to go into fine detail on this. I would say no, though.

This is coming from someone who tried both approaches on VZTZ. I believe I was the only staff member there who actually tried hands-off with PvP rules (for a brief time).


The upside was that I didn't drive myself crazy trying to police every fucking stupid pvp encounter between the assholes in the two top guilds.

Because there were no rules, and it was up to the players to figure all that out and govern eachother.


The downside: as you would expect, griefing skyrocketed. Training replaced PvP. Entire guilds quit the server. Server population dropped.

I really don't think we want this here.

GM intervention may not always be perfect or objective, but I promise those of you who want nothing at all that you'll be begging for GMs to come babysit everyone again after you get trained into the ground anytime you try to go do anything.

[Supreme]

nb4rnf

[Harrison]

Boo hoo. God forbid you try to be reasonable with a GM instead of going full retard on the forums the second things don't go your way. It was the exact same way after you were disbanded for exploiting Naggy, you guys tried to play the victim when you were in the wrong in the first place. When you do something wrong and you're caught red handed, the correct response is contrition. Your response however was to bitch as much as possible about unequal treatment. And that is why no one will ever take you seriously - you could have probably solved all of your woes by politely speaking with a GM but instead you chose to do what Holo does best: whining publicly.

Starting to think he is the only player with an IQ over 50 on red. Holocaust literally has downs. Exploit, caught, cry, forum spam tears, and blame the world. Never once man up for yourselves.

[oldfish]

GM intervention may not always be perfect or objective, but I promise those of you who want nothing at all that you'll be begging for GMs to come babysit everyone again after you get trained into the ground anytime you try to go do anything.

But he said everything but train

[Autotune]

Should go for both servers.

Let players govern what they can: Training, Scamming, Griefing, Douchebagging, KSing, Ninjalooting, ect.

Let GMs take care of what players can't: Hacking, Exploiting, RMTing, Stuck corpses, bugs, ect.

Would solve most headaches and free up server staff from disputes between players/guilds

[Salty]

This message is hidden because Harrison is on your ignore list.

[Dullah]

I voted no because there're a lot of cases where nobody can right a wrong. There're exploits and mechanics that just do not have an opposite. It's not as straight forward and malleable as reality is. In reality there's a equal and opposite reaction for everything. But in games it's hit and miss and filled with holes.

Also keep in mind that whatever problems classic had we inherit.

However, I would prefer to only have rules for the most extreme cases. This is pvp. You can over-rule a server. Makes your job harder and makes hte atmosphere feel suffocating for players.

How does Eve-Online handle griefing?
I have to side here.

I want it like RZ, with very little interaction. I have to say though, there was a much higher quality of people, and more character accountability than there ever will be here.

Back in those days, if you were random pk, it was a permanent choice. That character would never see planar loot, you wouldn't be participating in "progression", but just ganking around dungeons hoping to snag some loot off players in bigger guilds. Simply put, you lived the life of an outcast, in fear of the bigger groups, always watching your back. You didn't even tell people about your pk alt on your char in a white knight guild lest it come back and taint your good rep. You couldn't even think of ninja looting shit, you might as well just delete that character.

Heres its completely opposite. You can spam ooc with nothing but bullshit, taunt, insult and grief in any and every form possible, present yourself as the most deranged degenerate pos of all time, and be considered a generally stand-up guy by half the population of the server.

So... if people are going to conduct themselves in such a way and spend 10 hours of their life in 2 days triggering a script to deathtouch a 15-30 man raid without any repercussions, obviously GM intervention is required at such times. Though, if you fit the description in the previous paragraph, this won't make any sense to you.

[Gongshow]

So... if people are going to conduct themselves in such a way and spend 10 hours of their life in 2 days triggering a script to deathtouch a 15-30 man raid without any repercussions, obviously GM intervention is required at such times. Though, if you fit the description in the previous paragraph, this won't make any sense to you.

...or you lift your skirt up and send a few people to stop it. If that had happened to Holocaust we would have someone sitting directly on their bind spot chain rooting and killing until plug.

The other day when Beowulf did it to us with Eye of Zomm we snuffed him out 2-3x. Sure he triggered on us a few times too, but we prevented it just as well and he ended up losing his corpse in Fear for at least a few hours or more until the zerg showed up.

First night of Fear PVP, after we booted Nihilum, Troriste triggered CT and various other lackeys tried to train. We set up defense and stopped every subsequent attempt while clearing at the same time.

PVP is about manning up and doing what it takes to win, that does not mean screaming to GM's because you have no sack. Defending against trains and griefing is part of a raid, not up to GM's to enforce.

[Supreme]

...or you lift your skirt up and send a few people to stop it. If that had happened to Holocaust we would have someone sitting directly on their bind spot chain rooting and killing until plug.

The other day when Beowulf did it to us with Eye of Zomm we snuffed him out 2-3x. Sure he triggered on us a few times too, but we prevented it just as well and he ended up losing his corpse in Fear for at least a few hours or more until the zerg showed up.

First night of Fear PVP, after we booted Nihilum, Troriste triggered CT and various other lackeys tried to train. We set up defense and stopped every subsequent attempt while clearing at the same time.

PVP is about manning up and doing what it takes to win, that does not mean screaming to GM's because you have no sack. Defending against trains and griefing is part of a raid, not up to GM's to enforce.


Whoa there...

25-30 people constitutes a zerg? Or is that just the number you state because you only have 13-15 to counter?

Booted Nihilum from fear:rolleyes:?

As i remember Fear was already cleared and done with for the day. In fact on that first day people where in there for almost 10 hours straight farming. Got to take a break sometime.

Your last comment is laughable at best. How many threads started by Nihilum about your "PVP tactics" are on the forums...how many are Holocaust threads?

Defedning against trains and griefing is not part of the raid. That is what YOU think should be part of the raid...but GMs and Server staff disagree and you cannot stand it.

[FoxxHound]

fat people

[Darwoth]

Whoa there...

25-30 people constitutes a zerg? Or is that just the number you state because you only have 13-15 to counter?

Booted Nihilum from fear:rolleyes:?

As i remember Fear was already cleared and done with for the day. In fact on that first day people where in there for almost 10 hours straight farming. Got to take a break sometime.

Your last comment is laughable at best. How many threads started by Nihilum about your "PVP tactics" are on the forums...how many are Holocaust threads?

Defedning against trains and griefing is not part of the raid. That is what YOU think should be part of the raid...but GMs and Server staff disagree and you cannot stand it.

yes, 30 people on a server of 100 is a zerg

when those are 30 people out of the 60 that are above 42 is it more of a zerg

if you are playing on a server of thousands and your roster is 70 people or more you are indeed a zerg, so when the servers max population is generally around 130, well..... yeah.

[oldfish]

Heres its completely opposite. You can spam ooc with nothing but bullshit, taunt, insult and grief in any and every form possible, present yourself as the most deranged degenerate pos of all time, and be considered a generally stand-up guy by half the population of the server.


I may not agree with everything Dullah said, but damm he nails it here, hard.

[oldfish]

lets keep trains out of this, for once i agree with Darwoth, everything he listed but trains should be allowed.

My opinion on trains notwithstanding.

Edit: Oh wait he did include trains....

I think trains should be allowed but only because of xp loss. Nobody in his right mind is going to try to 10vs25 a raiding guild because the only thing in store for the 10 side is xp loss.

So unless you want the biggest zerg to win, always, trains should be allowed.

Better yet, remove XP loss so the less populous side can at least have a fun attempt at trying to piss on the zergy guild's raid.

But there has to be a way to contest camps or else this server is gonna continue to die a slow death.

If we wanted to own camps without contest we would be playing on blue

[Truth]

haha darwoth i voted for option B just to troll. .. CASH4CLUNKERS

[Jabber]

but GMs and Server staff disagree and you cannot stand it.

Gms are blue
You and your faggot guild are blue
I mean fuck holocaust but dam yor blue
Enjoy uncontested loot and no high end pvp CAUSE YOUR BLUE
P99red the new less populated P99blue



So in summary continue to be blubie faggots
There is no point leveling to 50 if your blubie guild
Is the only high end option

[hagard]

I'm pretty confident to say if your guild makes up for 35% of the server that constitutes a Zerg he he

[Amelinda]

Learn to post in the correct forums.