Motherboard Advice

[vinx]

So.. in the past (00-05) ive always been able to build a better PC or at least cheaper build then what was being sold at bestbuy or wherever..
I was in walmart the other day and checkin out the desktops. one for $600 the other about $900 and they looked pretty good to me lol

Question is, well couple questions really.
1) I was looking for a minimum of 2.0Ghz or better
but the MBs i see on newegg are dual core and around 1.6-1.8 (price range: 100-200)
Is that the speed of each CPU? or total? or do i need to price higher?

2) Any recommendations for a good MB manufacturer? I dont recognize most these names
(i been out of the build loop for years / keep patching up old PCs)

Or should i just save up and buy a premade? they seem like they are getting better...

edit: fyi lookin for the MB/CPU combo not just a MB

[guineapig]

1.) What operating system do you plan on running? 2.0 Ghz is kind of slow for anything beyond Windows XP

2.) What socket type is the motherboard?

3.) Not sure about your question regarding the "speed of each CPU", you are (most likely) only going to have 1 CPU in your computer, the number of cores the CPU has is another story.

4.) Do you have the other parts already? If you are building from scratch the price is going to jump around wildly depending on how much you invest in your graphics card (very important for gaming) and your power supply (not expensive per-say but highly important) and cooling.

5.) Which leads to my last question: What do you plan on running on this rig?

[vinx]

1) i have xp atm, but with a new build im prolly going win7
2) idk, havent really looked into that yet lol
3) yea i meant cores, but it does stand to reason they are seperate and going to be faster then 2.0 (id just rather look stupid an ask first before buying lol)
4) no other parts.. i expect the total price to vary depending on parts. but i like to start with the MB first and build around that.
5) Gaming, plus id like to run Adobe CS5 creative suite on it

I think the CS5 has recommended processors iirc but the real question is just..
what are some decent manufacturers? or maybe better yet..
what manufacturers should i avoid?

I usually dont buy high end and dont mind takin chances on soso mid range hardware
I just want to avoid the brand names with horrible track records..
know any? hehe

[falkun]

You can still make a much better rig yourself than you can buy in the store. For some starter advice on getting back in to building, check out some of the "monthly build" sites:

Tom's Hardware's 9/11 System Builder Marathon (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-a-pc-value-overclock,3033.html)
BitTech's 9/11 PC Hardware Buyer's Guide (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/buyers-guide/2011/09/01/pc-hardware-buyer-s-guide-september-2011/1)

Those are both great (almost) monthly issues to check out, hitting different price points with solid hardware.

[Gwence]

it'll always be cheaper to build your own, for some reason retail stores drive the price up for things like memory which I don't understand because they are always shitty modules but cost per component one of the highest in the whole tower. You're also getting a shitty power supply with a pre-made machine and most likely a micro atx shitty piece of shit mobo.

Question is, well couple questions really.
1) I was looking for a minimum of 2.0Ghz or better
but the MBs i see on newegg are dual core and around 1.6-1.8 (price range: 100-200)
Is that the speed of each CPU? or total? or do i need to price higher?

2) Any recommendations for a good MB manufacturer? I dont recognize most these names
(i been out of the build loop for years / keep patching up old PCs)

Or should i just save up and buy a premade? they seem like they are getting better...

edit: fyi lookin for the MB/CPU combo not just a MB

question 1 makes no sense, you're confusing motherboards with computer processors I think, not sure how though? =p

There is much better than dual core out right now, they have up to 6 cores that are affordable, last time I looked the phenom II x6 was $180 or something. It depends on your budget of course but generally AMD chips are going to be quite a bit cheaper than intel right now, the performance isn't a huge difference, intel is better but not by a whole lot until you start getting into the core i5's i7's and beyond.

As far as motherboards intel chipsets vs amd chipsets there isn't a big difference in price, again it's what your plans and budget are. If you're going with AMD I'd reccomend any board with the 990FX north bridge, if intel I'd say you'd probably want any LGA 1155 socket and work off the P67 or Z68 chipsets. Those are all the practical boards for someone that wants the ability to have a top end gaming machine without going to broke.

Question 2 about the manufacturers, there really isn't too many out there, for regular sized ATX boards I'd steer clear of Biostar, aside from that most of the board manufacturers do a pretty good job, when you find a model you are interested in do some research and try to find some tech reviews on it that will help with your decision. Bottom line in terms of personals preferance, ASRock is at the top of my charts right now for motherboard manufacturing, they make great boards with all the features and are usually $30-50 cheaper than companies like ASUS with boards in the same level bracket. Gigabyte is also a good manufacturer but the gaps that company has between its mid tier to high end boards is a bit big for my taste in terms of price anyway. MSI is the other big name and they're pretty good too. Intel sells their own boards as well but they are overpriced to high heaven because of the name, but the quality is probably way high because of it as well, dont know for sure I've never had an intel board.

The combo packages aren't saving you that much money either maybe 20-30 bucks when its all said and done and you're limited on the choices as you can probably see.

I always suggest building your own computer to people, it's a ton of fun and you know exactly what you're getting and what the quality is.

[Gwence]

1) i have xp atm, but with a new build im prolly going win7
2) idk, havent really looked into that yet lol
3) yea i meant cores, but it does stand to reason they are seperate and going to be faster then 2.0 (id just rather look stupid an ask first before buying lol)
4) no other parts.. i expect the total price to vary depending on parts. but i like to start with the MB first and build around that.
5) Gaming, plus id like to run Adobe CS5 creative suite on it

I think the CS5 has recommended processors iirc but the real question is just..
what are some decent manufacturers? or maybe better yet..
what manufacturers should i avoid?

I usually dont buy high end and dont mind takin chances on soso mid range hardware
I just want to avoid the brand names with horrible track records..
know any? hehe

What's your budget, I'm a work and bored, I will be happy to have something to pass the time and can find components that would work for you for the things you listed you wanted to do. (Gaming, Adobe etc)

[vinx]

All good advice and links, yea its been awhile so when i started to actually browse mobos today i was like..hmm wth
(i used to use Abit and Intel) but Intel does look expensive
figured id ask the gamers first for preferred mobos or ones i should steer clear of. then do the research on ones in the middle i think look decent.
I think i will take your advice and consider seperate mobo and processor now ;)
What's your budget, I'm a work and bored, I will be happy to have something to pass the time and can find components that would work for you for the things you listed you wanted to do. (Gaming, Adobe etc)
not much of a budget or plan lol
im just using extra cash i might have on the side like 100-200 a month maybe
And no timeline for a finished machine either, tho i would prefer something like feb/march

[vinx]

I usually start with the mobo/case, and those sit for about a month
then as things start to fall into place like the PSU and RAM
i get more excited and start pickin up the buying pace to hurry up and get things running :)

[Honest]

Most everything is going to bud off of what processor you get. I would recommend getting a CPU that uses DDR3 as it is less expensive than DDR2, not to mention faster. Do you want to run dual video cards? Basically what do you want to do with this rig? I'm a newegg fanboy for sure so I would recommend looking on their website. They also offer interest free financing for 6 months for orders $250-499 and a year interest free on $500 and up. Also I dont know how much your tweak your machine but if your planning on Overclocking anything (ie ram, CPU) you will need at list a mid level Motherboard. I am an AMD fan myself and there are many reasonably priced CPU's out there that you can push up and beyond their stock speeds. Infinite possibilities out there.

[vinx]

Ahh no, i never got the overclock thing down =/
but yea im itchin to start on a build before to long, so was on newegg today thinking about getting a mobo, and was sorta lost on where to start..mobo's and processer wise. (like i said its been since 05 so like 6 years)
nah, i dont think i need to run dual cards with the CS5 im not creating movies or flash that requires that much graphic usage and i would think most games can run on 1 card
I thought DDR3 was more expensive and better then DDR2 (or used to be?)
thx for the heads up about it being cheaper.. dont think about what PSU/RAM and other things until later and i get the mobo/CPU
like you said, everything buds afterwards

[Honest]

There is a certain alloy they use in manufacturing DDR2 that makes it more expensive than DDR3. DDR3 is the better ram, also happens to be the cheaper. As far as overclocking, it's not too difficult once you understand the concept. Do keep in mind that the larger the MB and the more powerful the processor your gonna need a larger PSU. You can probably build a decent machine for 600 bucks.

[Gwence]

Overclocking is all one touch nowadays with UEFI or the manufacture suites that come with pretty much every newer motherboard, a retarded monkey could do it with no trouble, it's very easy and companies like Intel and AMD are starting to underclock their processors just so people feel all warm and fuzzy when they one touch their speed up past 4 GHz

I wouldn't bother OC'ing your memory, it doesn't do much for you just check the specs on the modules and the latency times and make sure you're getting those times when they get installed it might need some tweaking to get the specs that the modules are rated for but that also isn't very difficult with how easy the UEFI's are right now. Example of this is when a person buys a dual channel kit with the modules rated for 1600Mhz alot of the time the motherboard will default the modules to 1333Mhz so you just have to change that in the bios. The motherboards also tell you what speeds they support without overclocking.

I would however OC your video card whichever you choose to buy and in most cases you can save money on video cards by buying a Non-OC'd card and then doing it yourself with windows software (MSI afterburner is free software and will OC Nvidia GPU's as well as AMD GPU's) ASUS also has one they just came out with too, can't remember the name. This is very easy as well as you're pretty much just moving a slider bar in the program and then restarting. You may have to tweak voltage depending on how high of an OC you want but they're minor tweaks. I'm making it sound easy but it really is just dont go overboard and 99.9% of the time you'll be just fine.

I will say your buying method is a bit risky imo, motherboards are something I usually buy last in my builds because of the DOA risk I want to be able to RMA or return if needed. It's not something that happens often but better safe than sorry. What I normally do is decide on the board and then buy everything else other than solid state drive before the MB. Buying a processor first is fine those things are solid as steel.

I would suggest deciding on your CPU before anything else, once that is done, decide on a video card and get the dimensions of it, after that pick out a case making sure it will be big enough to house your video card and any aftermarket cooling solutions if you plan on doing that. Then pick out your power supply and make sure it can handle whatever video card you picked. Now pick out your motherboard because at this point you know which socket you need, you know how big it can be, and you know which expansion slot(s) you will need for your video card, and you also know which power supply connectors you have and double check to make sure the board calls for them and the video card connectors as well (from the psu). It sounds like a lot of information but it's not too bad. After that figure what you want for your storage and boot or if it's going to be the same drive (wouldn't reccommend that) and pick out some memory and an optical drive and that's about it.

Give me a few min I'll link to some good processors in your price range.

[bonehand]

I owned a PC and Server shop till 2002 when the whole 9/11 and dot com crash killed me. I used to be able to make $50 to $100 on a PC build and $500 to $10,000 on a server build profit. Nobody in the area could match my price because I could buy in bulk, mind you it was limited, but the credit account I had with my supplier was good enough to qualify. If I wanted to build the same now, I wouldn't make that....why? Because HP, Dell and Gateway are selling below cost. They make money off of the installed applications...they make kickbacks on the quantity of AMD or Intel they sell.

There is no way you can build a home machine for less than the cost of a prebuilt box.

Now, I do build my own, but the Core i7, 12GB ram, 3TB in OS drives (not the storage drives for games, music and vids), ATI 6970 and everything else I demand for my personal machine is quite exceptional compared to a HP box, but look at this:

CyberpowerPC Gamer Xtreme GX6105 Gaming PC - Intel Core i7-960 3.2GHz, 12GB DDR3, 1TB HDD, DVDRW, AMD Radeon HD 6870, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

Core i7 $290
12GB $100
HD $60
DVD $30
Vid $200
keyboard $20
Mouse $10
Case $70
Motherboard (x58 with sata iii, usb 3.0) $230
800W PSU $60
Win7 Home Premium $100 (with hardware purchase)

Comes to $1170, so is your time worth $29 to build? Well, don't forget the $60 to $100 for shipping all of those parts...and you are paying way more than the cost of that PC from CyberPower, which is more costly than even a similar HP/Compaq that is $900 + $230 for the video card, or Lenovo which is $1100 at CDW....and the shipping is lower and much faster on one PC than a bunch of parts.

Those come with excellent warranties also, where if something in your home built rig breaks you have to diagnose and fix it...wait for Asus or XFX or Crucial or Seagate or who knows to get you an RMA number and deal with 2-3 weeks of shipping back and fourth.

Honestly, unless you plan on builing something in the $1500+ price range for parts you absolutely will not save money in the long run. It is only then that CyberPower, Alienware and other boutique computers are more expensive than building your own.

So, do what you want, I tend to build mine because shelling out $3-4K for a light up case from Alienware isn't my thing, but when it comes to the PC I buy my mom or family, I just tell them to go to Best Buy or Walmart and pick one out that features everything they want, read the reviews on your phone or a web browser on the PC itself, and save us both some time and money.

[Gwence]

well I just mocked up a build in cyberpower and came out to a near $300 difference using fairly mid to high mid components. I'll post the specs later.

I didn't do your build because I think you're the only person on the planet who drops a shitty quad core lynnfield into the x58 chipset, 1366 is go big or go home my man.

He said he wanted a gaming pc not a dell and if u looking up alienware the cost is astronomical compared to self build, cyberpower does a decent job at keeping cost down and their selection is great but you're still saving money on a gaming machine by building it yourself, always.

[Saiene]

I just built a comp myself, and I know for a fact I saved at least $300ish over buying a pre-built one. I checked out the prices from cyberpower too. The only way the price would of been comparable, was if I had bought an open box pc, which would of maybe saved me $100 or so. Use the shell shocker deals form newegg, or look for coupons on http://www.techbargains.com/newegg_coupons.cfm. I'm 100 percent positive you can save some $ building, and as the other guy said, its also fun to build it yourself.

[pickled_heretic]

There is a certain alloy they use in manufacturing DDR2 that makes it more expensive than DDR3. DDR3 is the better ram, also happens to be the cheaper. As far as overclocking, it's not too difficult once you understand the concept. Do keep in mind that the larger the MB and the more powerful the processor your gonna need a larger PSU. You can probably build a decent machine for 600 bucks.

this is actually bullshit. DDR3 has a much higher latency than DDR2. DDR2 will outperform DDR3 until you reach higher clockspeeds. If you are looking for performance at a low price point you should stick with DDR2. You get what you pay for... cheaper DDR3 will not perform as well as equivalent DDR2. At identical price points the DDR2 will outperform DDR3 until you reach the higher performance RAM.

[Honest]

this is actually bullshit. DDR3 has a much higher latency than DDR2. DDR2 will outperform DDR3 until you reach higher clockspeeds. If you are looking for performance at a low price point you should stick with DDR2. You get what you pay for... cheaper DDR3 will not perform as well as equivalent DDR2. At identical price points the DDR2 will outperform DDR3 until you reach the higher performance RAM.

I agree that quality DDR2 will outperform cheap DDR3 but thats not what i was saying. DDR3 is only going to get better, where they have reached the ceiling with DDR2, and can no longer increase the frequency. There are advantages to DDR3, less power consumption. It has twice as many internal banks on it that DDR2. It can provide higher speeds at a lower voltage. But more importantly there will be better DDR3 out there. Most of the newer chipsets use DDR3. You shouldnt dump your current system, if its decent, just to get DDR3 for a 1-2% increase. Fact of the matter is DDR2 is more expensive. If you want to get a mobo that is going to support DDR2 as well SATA III and all the other new ports its gonna end up costing more money., then getting the same mother board that supports DDR3. Would you rather have a DX10 video card or one that supports DX11. There may not be many games that run in DX11 right now, doesnt mean there wont be in the future. Same difference here. No system will be "future proof" but you have more, cheaper, options than running a DDR2 system (which i do). But for me it was cheaper and more logical to stay with what i had. He is making a new system.

[Humerox]

Gwence is pretty much spot on with advice here.

If you OC go AMD or go home. Just watch the heat.

Their "Bulldozer" looks mean as hell.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/241762/amds_new_eightcore_bulldozer_fx_chips_touch_42ghz. html

That's a hell of a wallop for $245.00.

They put all other processors to shame with OCing too. Can you say 8.429GHz? 'Course the helium would be a little costly.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/239858/amd_breaks_overclocking_record_leaves_the_competit ion_in_the_dust.html

[Gwence]

well I'd say you would probably get better performance from the 2nd gen sandy bridge cpu's over AMD right now in terms of OC'ing. But I hadn't read that article on bulldozer that is a really hot price for an 8 core cpu lol. Although I'm always a bit weary of buying brand new tech for fear of potential recalls and bugs that pop up.

Intel really does piss me off with their pricing though.

[Feachie]

intel pricing sucks, but you get what you pay for. i wait about 2 weeks after launch, that's enough time to see what steppings are total crap and which ones are overperforming.

ivy > sandy > bulldozer. imho wait a couple months. no current boards will support ivy bridge core.

[Gwence]

intel pricing sucks, but you get what you pay for.

ivy > sandy > bulldozer. imho wait a couple months. no current boards will support ivy bridge core.

ivy bridge cpus are going to run on socket 1155 which has been out for a while now.

[Feachie]

ivy bridge cpus are going to run on socket 1155 which has been out for a while now.

doesn't matter, everything i've read thus far has said the same thing. current boards, even socket 1155 ones, will not work with ivy. qpi link too slow on current boards i bet.

[Gwence]

hmm interesting, all the reviews I've read said 1155 is going to be backward compatable.

[Feachie]

must have changed. all blogs and reviews i've read (i stopped reading in july) said it wasn't compatible, but now i see one by anandtech saying it is. meh.

[Gwence]

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/asus_unveils_three_new_ivy_bridge-compatible_motherboards

these might not be on the market in the US yet though, but their is a gen3 board from ASRock that's on newegg 1155 socket.