WTB Ban for trainer

[Envious]

Abacaab admitting to training.

http://poopspant.com/fresh/red12.png

Per rules, can we get a ban? Even if it is beta? Since you have banned people for hacking or whatever already?

[Syriusly]

lol some people never change.

[Doors]

No faggot. Go away.

[pickled_heretic]

not training, he taunted a npc under the control of players. the enchanter could have hidden or invised to stop it from following him.

[Harrison]

Abacaab admitting to training.

http://poopspant.com/fresh/red12.png

Per rules, can we get a ban? Even if it is beta? Since you have banned people for hacking or whatever already?

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?p=416835#post416835

You sound butthurt, but, you said yourself you don't want trains policed. So stop being a hypocrite, pussy.

[pojab]

control pet maybe?

[pickled_heretic]

abacab even said in his msg he's not kos to frogs. this isn't training, it's taking advantage of a player who isn't paying attention. the enchanter in question should have invised or zoned to make sure his wandering pet didn't pull a train.

[GhostofSalty]

Lord Abacaab

[Scribbles]

giggled +rep abacab

[Diggles]

well, his MASSIVE DONATIONS didn't get his first account unbanned, what's wrong with getting his second put in it's place?

[GhostofSalty]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?p=416835#post416835

You see in that thread: Envious supporting no policing of trains.
You see in this thread: Envious crying about trains.

Conclusion: Envious is a bitch.

~

[Kungen]

Wow, way to be a pathetic loser Envious. Good job ABACAAABA

[God-King Abacab]

Running someones pet through a zone is fair game PvP... I you're going to sit there being all fat as fuck with your slow reaction time then you probably had it coming.

[Softcore PK]

For shame, Abacab :(

[Daldaen]

I soloed Eye of Veeshan. Just because I typed it to you doesn't make it true!

[Sorath]

I like abacaab he isnt a fag like most of you pussys.

[fistses]

On live, playing a necro, I feared a shaman's pet in PoFear to aggro CT and have him death touched during a duel... I count that as a victory. Then I killed him again when his guild called bullshit and attacked mine.

[Envious]

I consider it legit, but it is training. Which is against rules, etc, etc...

Pulling pets, mobs into aggro'ing NPCs, or fearing NPCs people are fighting into other NPCs is training imo. /shrug.

[Masq]

envious = toolbag

[Envious]

Funny shit, you clowns all jump my case for trying to keep GMs out of PnP and having the community enforce the rules.

Rules bring GMs into the fray, now you all call me a tool for wanting them enforced.

Man. Some people are never happy.

[Softcore PK]

Did you post in the petition forum? I'd be interested in knowing if the GMs would give him a stern talking to!

lol

[canardvc]

"WTB Ban for trainer"

having the community enforce the rules

Ban and community rules ? Did I miss anything besides a pretty empty thread ?

Unless a GM is affiliated with some random guild, banning someone will never be some "community enforced rule", sorry

[Harrison]

I consider it legit, but it is training. Which is against rules, etc, etc...

Pulling pets, mobs into aggro'ing NPCs, or fearing NPCs people are fighting into other NPCs is training imo. /shrug.

Your opinion means shit.

[God-King Abacab]

Funny shit, you clowns all jump my case for trying to keep GMs out of PnP and having the community enforce the rules.

Rules bring GMs into the fray, now you all call me a tool for wanting them enforced.

Man. Some people are never happy.

I would believe this if you wern't lying through your teeth.

You're not attempting to levy a ban on me the "better of the community" you're attempting to levy this ban so you could get some satisfaction out of banning my account and removing me from the server.

You're like the old lady who calls the cops on kids smoking pot, not to better the community because you're helping reduce gang violence or some shit but because you're so bitter and alone that the only enjoyment you gain is from the suffering and drama of others,

Which in this case does make you a tool

[Crenshinabon]

Small scale train to a group in guk is pretty dang low scale unless he is doing it to you guys over and over again. This is a silly thread. Its guk, trains will happen.

Only zones worth any salt to oversee no training imo are raid zones.

[Softcore PK]

Low scale, sure. But why should only max level characters being trained count as a train? And unintentional trains do happen all the time in guk, but that hardly has anything to do with this. Fact is, Abacab intentionally trained a group of players, which is against the rules.

[Kassel]

So if i am fighting a mob and a get jumped, if i decided to FD off the mob and it then hits my attacker is that considered "training?" or do the rules of the server dictate that i have to man up and continue to get hit by the mob and the player?

[Softcore PK]

FD in that case would not be a problem, your attacker chose to go after you while you were engaged with npcs.

[Amuk]

I think everyone knew envious was a tool before this thread, let it die noone cares.

[Mafakka]

control pet maybe?

Can't control a chanter pet. Maybe you can kill it if you knew where it was going.

[Lazortag]

I think for it to count as a train, you should have aggro on the mobs at some point.

[Softcore PK]

I think intent is what should matter.

[Softcore PK]

Actually, this is an exploit. Kind of worse than a regular train, considering he caused several pve exp deaths at no risk to himself.

[Tombom]

Tell me sir PK how will the gm staff regulate player intent in any sort of fair and balanced way?

DUMB

[juicedsixfo]

Invis yourself next time

[juicedsixfo]

And *just a feeling* but I'm pretty sure the idea behind the no training rule (and probably the only time you'll see it enforced) is to stop more higher end blatant training à la 30 of one guild in Fear and 1 guy of another guild zones in and wipes them. That's the stuff you can prove. "I was just there exploring" won't work.

If you think they're going to respond to 200 petitions from Unrest every day you're sadly mistaken. That shits just part of the game.

But, if this thread leads to anything, it should be that you shouldn't be able to taunt/attack people's pets that are outside your range. And to keep invis memmed.

[pickled_heretic]

considering he caused several pve exp deaths at no risk to himself.

and what if i mez a group's healer in the middle of a pull? i have no intention to actually kill anyone myself, just "cause several pve exp deaths at no risk to myself." well?

[Nerfbat]

I think causing a PvE death is more humane... you have longer to rez the corpse to get your exp back. I think trains should be mandatory in pvp, spread the word.

[Diggles]

blind the tank and fear the mobs!

[Softcore PK]

Tell me sir PK how will the gm staff regulate player intent in any sort of fair and balanced way?

DUMB

This is very true (not the DUMB part lol), I guess I should have been more clear. Intent should be a deciding factor, but not the only deciding factor. Unintentional trains should of course be punished the same as any intentional train.. within reason. What I was really trying to say was that the mechanics of the train should not matter. The end result of the train is the same whether it was an exploit like this, or a monk FD.

Often times it is obvious when a train is intentional. We all know this. And in those cases, intent really should come into account when deciding on a punishment.

And *just a feeling* but I'm pretty sure the idea behind the no training rule (and probably the only time you'll see it enforced) is to stop more higher end blatant training à la 30 of one guild in Fear and 1 guy of another guild zones in and wipes them. That's the stuff you can prove. "I was just there exploring" won't work.

If you think they're going to respond to 200 petitions from Unrest every day you're sadly mistaken. That shits just part of the game.

But, if this thread leads to anything, it should be that you shouldn't be able to taunt/attack people's pets that are outside your range. And to keep invis memmed.

The rules concerning training on live probably did come about more because of higher level trains than anything else. And of course they were enforced more in those areas. But that is not to say that all queries about training made by anyone lower than 50 are completely ignored. Try to be reasonable here; I am in no way trying to compare this to the everyday trains we see in CB, Unrest or Upper Guk. This is a different matter entirely, and it is a different matter because it was obviously not an accident. It's a known exploit, and a player admitted to doing it. This does not mean that the player should be punished right away, that's not how these things work. An isolated incident such as this with no real hard evidence (fraps or GM watching) is never cause for suspension. But I'm sure by doing this, and admitting to it, this player has caught some unwanted GM attention. They will be less likely to do it in the future (hopefully) because of this. And this is a good thing :)

and what if i mez a group's healer in the middle of a pull? i have no intention to actually kill anyone myself, just "cause several pve exp deaths at no risk to myself." well?

By engaging a group in pvp, you are putting yourself at risk. They can fight back, you know..

[Billbike]

GM witness or fraps, or it didn't happen.

[pickled_heretic]

Unintentional trains should of course be punished the same as any intentional train.. within reason.

holy shit are you serious? what is "within reason?"

By engaging a group in pvp, you are putting yourself at risk. They can fight back, you know..

how is taunting a pet not "engaging a group?"

[Softcore PK]

holy shit are you serious? what is "within reason?"

Within reason is kinda what lots of people here were saying. A noob training CB/GFay zoneline because of an accidental train should not be punished. Especially here with the messed up pathing. But causing an enemy raid to wipe, even if done accidentally? Not cool.

how is taunting a pet not "engaging a group?"

I'm really not sure what happened. Maybe they could have attacked him, maybe he was out of range. In this case it doesn't matter. He pulled the enchanter pet, and immediately ran behind NPCs that conned kos to the group. They could not follow, without dying.

[God-King Abacab]

I'm really not sure what happened. Maybe they could have attacked him, maybe he was out of range. In this case it doesn't matter. He pulled the enchanter pet, and immediately ran behind NPCs that conned kos to the group. They could not follow, without dying.

PvP is situational, in this situation I used faction yo my advantage to come out on top. I'm sorry if you;re offended by my superior logic and fighting skills to win over the RBF camp, but perhaps you should play better and not sit around with stupid ass pets?

[Softcore PK]

PvP is situational, in this situation I used faction yo my advantage to come out on top. I'm sorry if you;re offended by my superior logic and fighting skills to win over the RBF camp, but perhaps you should play better and not sit around with stupid ass pets?

It's great that players can hide behind npcs that other players are kos to; this is a very important part of the game. I always loved the dark elves in CB, nuking the elves from the safety of the orcs. But you took this a step too far. What you did was not pvp, it was an exploit to train npcs onto a group of people.

This isn't SZ..

[God-King Abacab]

It's great that players can hide behind npcs that other players are kos to; this is a very important part of the game. I always loved the dark elves in CB, nuking the elves from the safety of the orcs. But you took this a step too far. What you did was not pvp, it was an exploit to train npcs onto a group of people.

This isn't SZ..

Not my fault bro.

If you don't want your pet to run off and get you ganked here are some choices you can make to prevent this incident from happening again:


Warrior
Rogue
Ranger
Wizard
Cleric
Druid
Monk
Paladin


In short no one is telling you to play some gimp ez mode class, but when you choose to play a pet class expect to have numerous aggro trains rolling through as you attempt to PvP in dungeons.


Pet class + dungeon = trains

"it's simple math guys"

[juicedsixfo]

All the Enchanter had to do was invis himself. Or someone root Abacab (not with these resists anyway).

Now if you can taunt pets outside of your level range and it doesn't flag you, that's another story.

[Softcore PK]

I can just see this being done far too often. A way of training and avoiding responsibility for it.

[God-King Abacab]

All the Enchanter had to do was invis himself. Or someone root Abacab

Seriously, there were 6 of you leveling in that hallway, 4/6 of you were pet classes aside from the two shamans... Meaning you had plenty of opportunity to root/mez/blind and DPS my single warrior down with ease.

Or you could've broken the pet instead. However, you allowed yourself to get steamrolled due to faction and that is no one's fault but the victim.

[Softcore PK]

Just so we're clear, you're not referring to me, right? My highest beta char is 4 and she's a paladin.

[juicedsixfo]

I was speaking hypothetically, as I wasn't there either – cause if I was that wouldn't have even happened!

[God-King Abacab]

Just so we're clear, you're not referring to me, right? My highest beta char is 4 and she's a paladin.

I'm speaking in general terms here, having a pet class is more than pressing "attack" and soaking up free xp. If you have no idea how to control your pet and use the back off command or pop it when it starts to trail off the you have no business crying when you get steamrolled due to residual aggro

[pickled_heretic]

I'm really not sure what happened.

annnd... you're trying to get this guy banned? have you heard of the salem witch trials before?

[Cwall]

bluebies gettin all flustered up in here

[Diggles]

annnd... you're trying to get this guy banned? have you heard of the salem witch trials before?

salem witch trials started because two girls thought they saw a witch, got a shit load of attention after that trial, and started saying people they didn't like were witches

this is one guy making a random guess

how the fuck is that any comparison

[pickled_heretic]

salem witch trials started because two girls thought they saw a witch, got a shit load of attention after that trial, and started saying people they didn't like were witches

this is one guy making a random guess

how the fuck is that any comparison

and what happened to the people they accused? even assuming witchcraft was a legitimate crime were they given a fair trial?

[Diggles]

comparing death sentence to a ban on a beta server
lmao

[Aadill]

PvP solves everything.

[Softcore PK]

I don't want him banned for this one instance.

[pickled_heretic]

comparing death sentence to a ban on a beta server
lmao

the sentence wasn't being compared.

[chawgtar]

Would it be ok if Aba attacked the enchanter first to aggro pet and then ran? I really don't see the problem here. If you ban for this then what about if 2 people enage a group of 4 realize they can't win so they run to the guards and the enchanters pet aggros the guards does that constitute training? What about if its done in a dungeon? I don't think using faction advantage in PvP should ever be considered punishable.

[Softcore PK]

But he didn't do any of that, from what I can tell. He taunted the pet and ran into NPCs knowing full well it would cause this train, without trying to attack them at all. It's a SZ tactic.

[Silentone]

Im confused, are you seriously asking his beta character to be banned? like he cant make another account? oooooh nooooo dont ban his beta toon

[Dalem]

I was asking where the line is drawn since all of those events cause the same end result using the same means with the same intent just different methods of implementation

[Kevlar]

This isn't anything like training guards or KOS mobs onto a group that is unprepared or engaged with someone else.

If anything its some kind of strange reverse train, the pet did the training. Pets train stuff in dungeons all the time, this one just had a little help. Its why most raids tell their players "NO PETS". Pay attention to your pet or suffer the consequences.

[God-King Abacab]

Two years later and people still crying about Abacab trains

[pojab]

ban envious for intentionally training his own group like a jerk

[Scribbles]

cry


to



gm

[JarL]

That is called out playing someone and/or clever use of game mechanics, not training.

[Envious]

The problem here is that the intent was to bring unintended or on aggro'd mobs onto a group to kill or make them run. That's training.

If this is kosher, would aggro'ing a NPC they pulled, taking it deep into a dungeon, and FD'ing it and the adds off be considered training? It's the same thing. Control your pulls?

I want precedents set now, so I know what I can and can't do when server goes live.

Cause I can promise everyone one thing, people will eventually be petitioning this, and I want a precedent I can refer to when defending myself or accusing someone else.

[Aadill]

Once written, utilize this:

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=46129

[Envious]

K... Clarify.

[Sprinkle]

i dont care if he trained i dont want abacab banned , i want his guild to be a smashing success


i need the pvp targets

[Envious]

i dont care if he trained i dont want abacab banned , i want his guild to be a smashing success

i need the pvp targets

Sounds like your in Fish Bait.

[Kevlar]

The problem here is that the intent was to bring unintended or on aggro'd mobs onto a group to kill or make them run. That's training.

If this is kosher, would aggro'ing a NPC they pulled, taking it deep into a dungeon, and FD'ing it and the adds off be considered training? It's the same thing. Control your pulls?


No, it would not be the same thing unless the NPC in question was a charmed pet. Then it would be fair game just like this. Controlling your pet is part of the job. If a PC chased him through the dungeon aggroing all the mobs abaca was non-kos to, who is the trainer? Same deal with a pet.

[Envious]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=46129

I like the intentionally causing Exp loss by introducing aggro'd NPCs to a player or players.

It's the same thing with a pet or NPC.

[Nirgon]

Repeatedly petitioning training on players and when investigated each time with no results should earn someone a "boy who cried wolf" punishment.

[Kevlar]

I like the intentionally causing Exp loss by introducing aggro'd NPCs to a player or players.

It's the same thing with a pet or NPC.

It isn't the same thing. He never had aggro on the NPCs.