Multi-classing? EQ Legends - What to try?

[Botten]

I am very excited about the prospects of a mishmash of different class abilities.

What 3 classes would even be best?

A mix of the holy trinity?
Warrior, Enchanter, Cleric for soloing?

Enchanter, Cleric, Druid for:
Pet, Complete Heal + Rez and ports, snares and Damage Shield?

I would even like a Bard, Cleric and Wizard for as a fast as possible traveling rezzer.

Monk, Shaman, Bard for safe pulls, haste+buffs+slow+heals and max haste with bard.

kjs86z2, Jamjam, DeathsSilkyMist, Loramin and others have extensive knowledge on game mechanics - I am sure they already have a race and multiclass idea in mind.

I wonder if EQ Legends will remove some of the more powerful abilities from a secondary and ternary class combos?

It should be great!

[Swish]

I'm hoping there isn't a solid meta or "S-Tier" trio that gets too strong because half of the fun with THJ was seeing different combos excel.

Hopefully also there's fun things like hardcore, the option to see what you can achieve with a 2-class combo and things like that to keep EQL interesting beyond that first blitz to max level/AAs.

[Evia]

This is easily the best part of the concept of EQ Legends/THJ. I have a lot of fun brainstorming different ideas of a good combination of classes.

Rn, my plan is to try a Bard/Rogue/Monk. The idea here is that I can fear kite solo, or be excellent support/dps/puller for a group. I think monk epic might clash with bard songs tho...so I've considered necro or sk over monk....i mainly like having FD in my toolkit. Monk or SK would help with being squishy tho...

[Mortdecai99]

I feel like there's no point in doing anything besides monk/enchanter/cleric

[Ciderpress]

Is it possible to do ranger/ranger/ranger?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

A triple multiclass does open up some interesting options, and it also imposes some interesting limitations. This post assumes Legends will be similar to P99 in terms of how everything works. If charm end up being weaker on Legends, for exmaple, that could change the analysis.

As a limitation example, Complete Healing has a 10 second cast. You need to be sure you can land CH solo if you want to multiclass Cleric for that purpose. In a traditional group, you would normally have a tank distracting the mob, so CH's are trivial to land. CH will be tough to land when fighting summoning mobs, unless you have a beefy pet like a charmed pet tanking instead. These things need to be thought through when tailoring your classes for the content you want to solo.

Gear plays another major factor in decisions. For example, an Enchanter + Cleric combo could use Manna Robe + CH for cannibalize. This would make Manna robes a LOT more expensive, so that may be a limitation you would want to consider when deciding between Cleric or Shaman for your cannibalizing needs. Every high powered mana using combo will probably want to cannibalize somehow for the fastest mana recovery times.

I feel like there's no point in doing anything besides monk/enchanter/cleric

If your primary playstyle is charming a big mob, CHing it, and flopping bad scenarios, then SK would probably be better than Monk. SK's have 3 different FD's, and are still quite tanky. Death Peace has an increased success rate too for FD. You probably wouldn't want to be DPSing along-side your hasted charmed pet, as a charm break would be on you almost immediately. SK Epic would also be better than Monk Epic, as Enchanters can haste themselves with better haste anyway.

[Vexenu]

It really depends on how they implement the mechanics of controlling three classes at the same time (i.e. if you are a Warrior/Cleric/Enchanter, can you auto-attack at the same time you're casting a CH and controlling your pet? If you're a Bard, can you keep songs going while casting other spells and meleeing?). It will also matter a great deal what class features from beyond the Classic timeline of P1999 are included. AAs alone are completely game-changing, for example, and hugely affect class capabilities.

So basically, unless you have inside info, I think it's too early to tell. I just hope the game maintains more of a slower pace. I never played THJ, but from the gameplay videos I've seen it looks straight up wacky to me. Basically just running around facerolling everything. You might as well just play an ARPG if you're into that sort of thing, IMO.

For me, at least, the appeal of EQ Legends is less about theorycrafting some OP build to faceroll the game with, and more about making the game more solo and casual friendly, and essentially streamlining the process of 3-boxing by combining all three classes into the same character.

[Duik]

New bard song. Split Personality: divides the character into seperate entities for 18 secs to allow CH or charm breaks etc.

Chanter may also gain this ability. Schitzophrenia also a good name for spell.

Upon merge, temp disorientation. I dunmo.

[Botten]

Does the new tank for raids become a warrior / monk (for HP / Max avoidance) with Paladin for Lay on Hands + aggro stuns?

[OriginalContentGuy]

No I'm busy.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Does the new tank for raids become a warrior / monk (for HP / Max avoidance) with Paladin for Lay on Hands + aggro stuns?

That would probably be the tankiest option. Don't forget self SoulFire clicks in emergencies. This does assume AA's don't change this somehow.

I think Warrior/Monk/Rogue would be the ideal raid tank though. This is because you can instantly swap from being a top DPS to being the next main tank if the current one dies. You could have like 20 of these players in your guild, and you'd always have enough tanks and DPS simultaneously.

Just imagine how much DPS you're doing when you are swapping between Abashi's and Rogue Epic for Backstabs.

[Evia]

What about Paladin/Enchanter/Monk for ultimate dungeon group tank?

[Swish]

I feel like I'm making a dozen characters before I settle on a combo I like.

[Khellendros]

Necro, Wizard, Shaman-- Dot, Blast, Lich, cannibalize, Life drain/tap, rinse repeat.

[grimthule]

I'm so excited to try this build out. I even made a video about it!
EQ Legends: Solo Raid Tank Necro?!
(https://youtu.be/5uPGq4dEj8w)

I'm also planning on doing some of the builds below.
I've been obsessed with thinking up builds, lol.

Halfling Ranger, Beast Lord, Shaman
Erudite Monk, Cleric, Enchanter
Dark Elf - Enchanter, Paladin, Druid

[Botten]

Necro, Wizard, Shaman-- Dot, Blast, Lich, cannibalize, Life drain/tap, rinse repeat.

Stacking Vexing Mordinia and Torpor could be pretty powerful.

While Lich + Canni dancing

Then spamming Jyll's Zephyr of Ice and Jyll's Wave of Heat and Jyll's Static Pulse could be interesting. Mix in some Necro ... Defluxes

Plus pet(s) damage.

I could see it.

[BradZax]

On p99 Monk/War/Shm would probably be pretty dope.

THJ was so different that my traditional theory crafting went out the window. Combing skills from AAs with other class AAs was the real bread & butter.

I dont think any of the skills in classic would really compound the same way.

So i feel like it'd be more traditional mechanic combos would be ideal.

like what could trio best, would probubly three class best here.

AOE slow, torp, monk dps and warrior armor and weapons would probably be pretty OP

Can rogue backstab while facing their target on p99? That was the thing that made them good on THJ.

But the ultimate combo by the end of that server was Pal War Mnk, combinging shield damage bonus, with warrior clickable AA damage bonuses, and Monk something that i forget.

[BradZax]

I'm so excited to try this build out. I even made a video about it!
EQ Legends: Solo Raid Tank Necro?!
(https://youtu.be/5uPGq4dEj8w)

I'm also planning on doing some of the builds below.
I've been obsessed with thinking up builds, lol.

Halfling Ranger, Beast Lord, Shaman
Erudite Monk, Cleric, Enchanter
Dark Elf - Enchanter, Paladin, Druid

Been watching you theory craft since your first video! Fun stuff! :o

[WarpathEQ]

On p99 Monk/War/Shm would probably be pretty dope.

THJ was so different that my traditional theory crafting went out the window. Combing skills from AAs with other class AAs was the real bread & butter.

I dont think any of the skills in classic would really compound the same way.

So i feel like it'd be more traditional mechanic combos would be ideal.

like what could trio best, would probubly three class best here.

AOE slow, torp, monk dps and warrior armor and weapons would probably be pretty OP

Can rogue backstab while facing their target on p99? That was the thing that made them good on THJ.

But the ultimate combo by the end of that server was Pal War Mnk, combinging shield damage bonus, with warrior clickable AA damage bonuses, and Monk something that i forget.

This

If EQL works similar to THJ than it seems all the THJ folks are aligned in that what we think about class strengths and weaknesses likely mean nothing and that all the power comes from what AAs are available and how those AAs create exponential power accross classes. This is where 99% of the power comes from based on feedback from THJ. Obviously EQL could be different...we will see.

[Skarne]

im gonna go bard / mnk / rog

[Anonymous]

wiz /dru / brd <Dial a Port>

[Anonymous]

rog / enc / shm

[BradZax]

wiz /dru / brd <Dial a Port>

https://i.imgur.com/BzoejYb.png

[jolanar]

I wish there was just classic EQ with multiclassing instead of whatever abomination we are getting.

[Swish]

I wish there was just classic EQ with multiclassing instead of whatever abomination we are getting.

https://zam.zamimg.com/images/1/1/11c4169b176689b27148abc049a6213c.jpg

It's coming, they won't be able to resist themselves...

[thoradinDaDorf]

https://zam.zamimg.com/images/1/1/11c4169b176689b27148abc049a6213c.jpg

It's coming, they won't be able to resist themselves...

what on EARTH

[Vexenu]

From watching the streams, one of the biggest changes that is glossed over is the out-of-combat health/mana/stamina regen. It looks as if your character will regen 4% of each per tick, so with just one minute of downtime you regen a full 40% of each. And since you don't have to sit to med, your "downtime" can be running around looking for other mobs. This has huge implications, as it turns a lot of the classic EQ XPing meta on its head.

Traditionally, XPing is all about prioritizing efficiency over a long session to get more kills per hour. Mana and health regen were always the bottleneck of how many mobs you could kill, and thus how much XP you could get. So spells like Lich, Clarity, Chloro were very powerful, along with Bard regen songs, and items like the Fungi Tunic. But when you have massive out-of-combat health/mana regen, those things are much less impactful. Instead, what matters a lot more is in-combat burst damage. If you can kill mobs very quickly, you can then resume your enhanced out-of-combat regen before doing it again. For this reason I think Mages will be one of the strongest classes, due to their unique combination of burst and sustained DPS. Wizards I also expect will be considerably better than in classic (read: actually viable for XP outside of quadding), especially if they give them some sort of special nuking stance, which seems likely.

It also looks like the difficulty of the mobs is much, much easier than classic EQ, even on the highest difficulty setting. The devs were running around Befallen at level 5-10 and easily killing mobs 5+ levels higher than them in newbie gear. It really seems like they are going for a very "inclusive" experience in this regard, meaning that you can play just about any class combination and find success. There won't be much of a need to min/max unless you want to solo on the highest difficulty level. Even then, it doesn't seem like it will be as difficult as P99 solo. For example, I think a lot of people are going to roll Enchanters thinking that charm will be necessary, but that doesn't seem to be the case at all. In fact, it will probably end up being more trouble than it's worth in most cases.

Also, with no XP loss on death and respawning at the zone entrance, death itself loses almost all of its sting. This seriously devalues the entire Feign Death spell/ability, which is another huge change from classic. Pulling also seems much less important, and most people will probably be crawling through dungeons rather than camping certain areas.

It doesn't look like an ideal class meta for grouping/raiding will even develop, simply because there doesn't seem to be much of a need for it. Maybe the raiding will be substantially more difficult (I hope so), but from what I've seen, even on level 4 difficulty, a four-man group won't have much trouble unless they start playing extremely recklessly.

Overall it's clear that this is going to be a VERY different game from classic EQ. It's much more casual-focused and emphasizing fun and QoL over hardcore challenge. For this reason I don't think it's even worth trying to come up with a min/max class combo. You're literally better off just playing whatever you think will be the most fun, because the game simply doesn't appear to be difficult enough to justify min/maxing. Oh, and the loot system they have in place completely negates farming items, so there is zero incentive to roll a traditional "power" combo (i.e. ENC/CLR/MAG or MNK/SHM/ENC, etc...) thinking that this will allow you to farm difficult camps. Items are going to be extremely cheap because they will be very easy to acquire. This also means there is very little incentive to even farm plat. This really looks like a version of EQ that is heavily focused on encouraging solo and small group dungeon play for most of the leveling experience, where the player will gain XP while personally looting most of his own gear.

[Rumham]

You can’t multiclass getting killed to a system freeze and message someone in zone to ask for anyone with cleric sbd they are just like oh I’ll log on my epic cleric you messaged the right guy and what was a run from FV to HHK becomes a fulll xp friendship won’t even take your plat Rez. That’s why I’ll never play EQL. Outside of that it will also be filled with the plague that is live…. Bot and RMT unchecked. Sounds like you are set up to multiclass a travel toilet a foot pump sink and no way to dry your hands. Enjoy the pink eye you call EQL

[Duik]

You can’t multiclass getting killed to a system freeze and message someone in zone to ask for anyone with cleric sbd they are just like oh I’ll log on my epic cleric you messaged the right guy and what was a run from FV to HHK becomes a fulll xp friendship won’t even take your plat Rez. That’s why I’ll never play EQL. Outside of that it will also be filled with the plague that is live…. Bot and RMT unchecked. Sounds like you are set up to multiclass a travel toilet a foot pump sink and no way to dry your hands. Enjoy the pink eye you call EQL

Think of EQ:L as a cocktail.bar, mix any 3 drinks and you may experience something.
However mixing 3 bad classes wont give you a headache or a hangover.
3 miss matched aloholic bevvies may have side affects.

Alcohol.

[Knuckle]

I think there are probably two types of builds that would make the most sense for the highest difficulty solo raid content, and that's what I am focusing my theory crafting on at the moment.

First and foremost, I understand this is a HIGHLY custom version of the game where class balance/power is significantly different, but since I am operating off pure hypothetical and the basic info I've seen in videos, I will first audit out classes that I feel will not fit into any "highest difficulty build".

1.Druid. This is the easiest class cut for me, as anything they can do, other classes perform better. I understand there are going to be some changes to make them more viable, but I would rate them as "unessential" at this time. Even their general utility is limited since there are now 4 SoW classes and additional methods of world travel to diminish teleports value, especially since they can be swapped to as a secondary teleport loadout.

2. Ranger. I know bows are getting significant beneficial changes including melee range. I don't know enough about their changes to say, I am definitely using this class in classic for the hardest content. Exception might be the t-staff bow in plane of sky, if its truly unresistable by any npc target, this may move them into usable tier for hardest content.

This reduces the 560 possible class combinations down to 364!

This is still a pretty large list, the next criteria for hardest content in my theory crafting is the ability to SLOW the mob. This means one of the classes in each class combination Must include: Shaman, Beastlord, Enchanter, Rogue, Bard.
Running a quick table array IF statement in excel resolves this problem for us.

This reduces the combinations down to 280.

We run the same type of formula to verify that there is a tank class of Paladin/Sk/War.

This reduces the combinations down to 135.

We want to ensure there is a healer and a tank class in every possibility.
A SUM formula with COUNTIF resolves this to ensure SK/PAL/War = exactly 1 for each three class combination.

This reduces the combinations down to 120.

We use a similar formula to ensure there is a cleric or shaman included for healing.
This brings our possible combinations down to 42!

We are finally down to the nitty gritty, we have met the criteria of having exactly one tank class, one form of slow, and one form of significant healing.
Some final audits are to eliminate redundancy in classes where the overlap may be less desirable. So I will be eliminating: Shadow knight + Necromancer / Paladin + Cleric / Shaman + Beastlord.
This brings us down to 33 viable "Max Raid Difficulty Solo" Specs down from the original 560 combinations.

Of these 33 Specs, I listed 22 as "Top Tier" For Solo max difficulty raid content, but included a tier list for all:

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/708040826210746371/1504536907860803634/bored_eq_excel.png?ex=6a0758af&is=6a06072f&hm=d4a3d5b41c31ee5e3116d9bc74779323079e12bb00d9d17 6326c91a822ce667e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1485&height=633

All that being said, I'll probably do something like Beast Lord/Berserker/Bard just to play some new classes I've rarely explored, and level up a raid combo later.
I imagine many combinations I eliminated will potentially be better than any remaining class combo I listed, I imagine the class changes/world balancing will wildly change results.
Also just because I got bored of the exercise, I did not explore the pet stacking dynamic as I do not know how pet aggro and chain summoning will work yet.

Edit: I was referring to mage pet as being tied for strongest, but not with enchanter pet which charmed pets would be the strongest, but with summoned pets I imagine DPS optimized is closely matched with beastlord pets.

[Knuckle]

From watching the streams, one of the biggest changes that is glossed over is the out-of-combat health/mana/stamina regen. It looks as if your character will regen 4% of each per tick, so with just one minute of downtime you regen a full 40% of each. And since you don't have to sit to med, your "downtime" can be running around looking for other mobs. This has huge implications, as it turns a lot of the classic EQ XPing meta on its head.

Traditionally, XPing is all about prioritizing efficiency over a long session to get more kills per hour. Mana and health regen were always the bottleneck of how many mobs you could kill, and thus how much XP you could get. So spells like Lich, Clarity, Chloro were very powerful, along with Bard regen songs, and items like the Fungi Tunic. But when you have massive out-of-combat health/mana regen, those things are much less impactful. Instead, what matters a lot more is in-combat burst damage. If you can kill mobs very quickly, you can then resume your enhanced out-of-combat regen before doing it again. For this reason I think Mages will be one of the strongest classes, due to their unique combination of burst and sustained DPS. Wizards I also expect will be considerably better than in classic (read: actually viable for XP outside of quadding), especially if they give them some sort of special nuking stance, which seems likely.

It also looks like the difficulty of the mobs is much, much easier than classic EQ, even on the highest difficulty setting. The devs were running around Befallen at level 5-10 and easily killing mobs 5+ levels higher than them in newbie gear. It really seems like they are going for a very "inclusive" experience in this regard, meaning that you can play just about any class combination and find success. There won't be much of a need to min/max unless you want to solo on the highest difficulty level. Even then, it doesn't seem like it will be as difficult as P99 solo. For example, I think a lot of people are going to roll Enchanters thinking that charm will be necessary, but that doesn't seem to be the case at all. In fact, it will probably end up being more trouble than it's worth in most cases.

Also, with no XP loss on death and respawning at the zone entrance, death itself loses almost all of its sting. This seriously devalues the entire Feign Death spell/ability, which is another huge change from classic. Pulling also seems much less important, and most people will probably be crawling through dungeons rather than camping certain areas.

It doesn't look like an ideal class meta for grouping/raiding will even develop, simply because there doesn't seem to be much of a need for it. Maybe the raiding will be substantially more difficult (I hope so), but from what I've seen, even on level 4 difficulty, a four-man group won't have much trouble unless they start playing extremely recklessly.

Overall it's clear that this is going to be a VERY different game from classic EQ. It's much more casual-focused and emphasizing fun and QoL over hardcore challenge. For this reason I don't think it's even worth trying to come up with a min/max class combo. You're literally better off just playing whatever you think will be the most fun, because the game simply doesn't appear to be difficult enough to justify min/maxing. Oh, and the loot system they have in place completely negates farming items, so there is zero incentive to roll a traditional "power" combo (i.e. ENC/CLR/MAG or MNK/SHM/ENC, etc...) thinking that this will allow you to farm difficult camps. Items are going to be extremely cheap because they will be very easy to acquire. This also means there is very little incentive to even farm plat. This really looks like a version of EQ that is heavily focused on encouraging solo and small group dungeon play for most of the leveling experience, where the player will gain XP while personally looting most of his own gear.

Yes, it is literally that. Group up with your homies and roll through some dungeons. Or do it solo. Looks pretty chill either way. If it was just classic eq again with multiple classes people would bitch forever about how unfair certain class combos are. They are doing a lot of fun stuff with this so I am definitely checking it out. I like the new kerran/froglok races and how the textures are implemented. Iksars get a starting city near north ro. Auto song twisting, extra spell gems AAs. Some classes we havent seen in a classic environment. Actual robe graphics for every race.
Can tell lots of attention to detail etc, but everyone is expecting Classic EQ when we already have 4 flavors of that.

[Vexenu]

We are finally down to the nitty gritty, we have met the criteria of having exactly one tank class, one form of slow, and one form of significant healing.
Some final audits are to eliminate redundancy in classes where the overlap may be less desirable. So I will be eliminating: Shadow knight + Necromancer / Paladin + Cleric / Shaman + Beastlord.
This brings us down to 33 viable "Max Raid Difficulty Solo" Specs down from the original 560 combinations.

Of these 33 Specs, I listed 22 as "Top Tier" For Solo max difficulty raid content, but included a tier list for all:

I agree with your general analysis here, especially in terms of needing to balance a build between DPS/tanking/heals/slow. But the intricacies of the unique EQL systems will probably throw a wrench in leaning too heavily on the classic EQ meta for accurate theorycrafting. For example, the stance system is hugely impactful. WAR, SK and PAL get a defensive stance that reduces incoming damage 50%, with the reduced damage instead drawing down endurance on a 1:1 basis. Rogues, Monks, Rangers, Bards and Beastlords get Evasive stance, which avoids 95% of attacks entirely, with the avoided damage drawing down endurance at a 1:2 basis.

So basically this means that your tanks benefit from extremely high AC paired with defensive stance + heals, while your DPS classes benefit more from slow + burst DPS. Defensive stance gives more sustain, while evasive is shorter lived but allows you to avoid damage almost entirely for its duration. Basically what I'm getting at is that if your burst DPS is high enough, you probably don't even need a traditional tank class in your build. For example, something like CLR/ROG/BRD should be very viable. Cleric AC/HP buffs make the Rogue fairly sturdy as a tank, heals give sustain, Rogue DPS is through the roof with Bard self-haste, Bard is also slowing to make tanking easier. Cleric buffs + bard songs pump your resists to insane levels for raid kills. I've also considered BRD/SHM/WIZ. Slow/Malo the mob, pop evasive stance, and start dropping nukes. Slow+Evasive means you aren't even taking damage, so as long as your mana pool is deep enough you should be able to kill almost anything very quickly.

I think you're also right about Druids being very "meh" in EQL. I would also throw Necros into that camp, as well. Warriors also seem less attractive due to PAL and SK bringing defensive stance in addition to utility. And Monks go down a notch since FD is much less useful in a meta featuring instancing, respawn at zone-in, and no XP loss on death. And while I expect that Enchanters will still be extremely powerful, I think their power will decline substantially relative to other classes. Due to the much faster paced nature of the game compared to classic EQ (and the very high out-of-combat health/mana regen), damage-over-time spells and any sort of "efficiency killing" strategies (i.e. root rotting, fear kiting, quad kiting, reverse charming) will be much less appealing. The EQL meta seems to be about killing very quickly. Your build needs to combine burst DPS and just enough sustain (some combination of tanking/avoidance, heals, and slow) to get through fights. But you really don't gain anything by fighting "efficiently" in the classic EQ since, because you regen so much out of combat. So in this regard, the ideal build is very heavy on DPS and has only "just enough" defense to survive tough fights.

I'm also interested to play around with Beastlords. They seem very strong, and I think will be especially good if paired with an SK/PAL. The BST has dual wield and block, the tanks bring double attack and parry. So combined you have an extremely sturdy quadding tank with a nasty pet. Throw in a Bard or Cleric third wheel and you're off to the races. I'm a bit torn between starting with that build, or doing CLR/MAG/RNG, which I think will be very solid 1-50 and scale well into Kunark with the Ranger and Mage epics (Ranger self-hasting with Cloak, slowing with Epic, flexibility of fighting in melee or using bow, combined with Mage Epic pet + Cleric heals/buffs? Yeah, that's gg).

Another factor to consider is the item upgrade system and the ANY slots. Given that shields are the most stat-heavy items in the game, they are an obvious choice for the ANY slots. Something like the Shield of Stalwart Seas will be absurdly powerful when upgraded and stuffed in the ANY slot. Get that to +7 or above and you're potentially looking at something absurd like 80AC and +50 STR/STA from a single item. I believe they've said that stat caps have been raised to something like 500, so there's definitely a lot of room to run with upgrading items.

Ultimately, while this sort of theorycrafting is fun, from what I've heard it seems like almost any reasonable build will be solo-raid viable on anything but the highest difficulty. So I really think that just playing a combination of classes you find enjoyable/cool-looking is the actual EQL meta.

[kjs86z2]

what do berserkers do

[Knuckle]

I agree with your general analysis here, especially in terms of needing to balance a build between DPS/tanking/heals/slow. But the intricacies of the unique EQL systems will probably throw a wrench in leaning too heavily on the classic EQ meta for accurate theorycrafting. For example, the stance system is hugely impactful. WAR, SK and PAL get a defensive stance that reduces incoming damage 50%, with the reduced damage instead drawing down endurance on a 1:1 basis. Rogues, Monks, Rangers, Bards and Beastlords get Evasive stance, which avoids 95% of attacks entirely, with the avoided damage drawing down endurance at a 1:2 basis.

So basically this means that your tanks benefit from extremely high AC paired with defensive stance + heals, while your DPS classes benefit more from slow + burst DPS. Defensive stance gives more sustain, while evasive is shorter lived but allows you to avoid damage almost entirely for its duration. Basically what I'm getting at is that if your burst DPS is high enough, you probably don't even need a traditional tank class in your build. For example, something like CLR/ROG/BRD should be very viable. Cleric AC/HP buffs make the Rogue fairly sturdy as a tank, heals give sustain, Rogue DPS is through the roof with Bard self-haste, Bard is also slowing to make tanking easier. Cleric buffs + bard songs pump your resists to insane levels for raid kills. I've also considered BRD/SHM/WIZ. Slow/Malo the mob, pop evasive stance, and start dropping nukes. Slow+Evasive means you aren't even taking damage, so as long as your mana pool is deep enough you should be able to kill almost anything very quickly.

I think you're also right about Druids being very "meh" in EQL. I would also throw Necros into that camp, as well. Warriors also seem less attractive due to PAL and SK bringing defensive stance in addition to utility. And Monks go down a notch since FD is much less useful in a meta featuring instancing, respawn at zone-in, and no XP loss on death. And while I expect that Enchanters will still be extremely powerful, I think their power will decline substantially relative to other classes. Due to the much faster paced nature of the game compared to classic EQ (and the very high out-of-combat health/mana regen), damage-over-time spells and any sort of "efficiency killing" strategies (i.e. root rotting, fear kiting, quad kiting, reverse charming) will be much less appealing. The EQL meta seems to be about killing very quickly. Your build needs to combine burst DPS and just enough sustain (some combination of tanking/avoidance, heals, and slow) to get through fights. But you really don't gain anything by fighting "efficiently" in the classic EQ since, because you regen so much out of combat. So in this regard, the ideal build is very heavy on DPS and has only "just enough" defense to survive tough fights.

I'm also interested to play around with Beastlords. They seem very strong, and I think will be especially good if paired with an SK/PAL. The BST has dual wield and block, the tanks bring double attack and parry. So combined you have an extremely sturdy quadding tank with a nasty pet. Throw in a Bard or Cleric third wheel and you're off to the races. I'm a bit torn between starting with that build, or doing CLR/MAG/RNG, which I think will be very solid 1-50 and scale well into Kunark with the Ranger and Mage epics (Ranger self-hasting with Cloak, slowing with Epic, flexibility of fighting in melee or using bow, combined with Mage Epic pet + Cleric heals/buffs? Yeah, that's gg).

Another factor to consider is the item upgrade system and the ANY slots. Given that shields are the most stat-heavy items in the game, they are an obvious choice for the ANY slots. Something like the Shield of Stalwart Seas will be absurdly powerful when upgraded and stuffed in the ANY slot. Get that to +7 or above and you're potentially looking at something absurd like 80AC and +50 STR/STA from a single item. I believe they've said that stat caps have been raised to something like 500, so there's definitely a lot of room to run with upgrading items.

Ultimately, while this sort of theorycrafting is fun, from what I've heard it seems like almost any reasonable build will be solo-raid viable on anything but the highest difficulty. So I really think that just playing a combination of classes you find enjoyable/cool-looking is the actual EQL meta.

Yeah this theory craft was specifically for the most difficult content at the highest setting solo. My assumption is these challenges will be more difficult to compete without a solid way to sustain hp/mana for extended duration and/or survive burst. I think they are balancing some of the gods/dragons for this including replacing death touch with other mechanics, which I can only guess will be flurry.

Either way I agree those stances do greatly change the approach in some ways, in other ways maybe not. Monk value still seems high to me simply because of how high their cap on skills are, I know they also get block which is a defensive skill that I do not know that any class gets which provides more value to the tank class aspect.

As far as Pal/SK getting defensive stance, that seems like a big deal, I am curious what they are giving warrior to offset this, as they are pretty meh in the tank dept if all three classes can pop defensive.

[Vexenu]

what do berserkers do
Pure melee DPS like Rogues but use 2H weapons instead of daggers. The Devs have stated that they reworked Berserkers more than any other class, though, so we'll see what they came up with exactly. But I imagine their core gameplay will remain largely unchanged: big melee DPS.

Yeah this theory craft was specifically for the most difficult content at the highest setting solo. My assumption is these challenges will be more difficult to compete without a solid way to sustain hp/mana for extended duration and/or survive burst. I think they are balancing some of the gods/dragons for this including replacing death touch with other mechanics, which I can only guess will be flurry.

Either way I agree those stances do greatly change the approach in some ways, in other ways maybe not. Monk value still seems high to me simply because of how high their cap on skills are, I know they also get block which is a defensive skill that I do not know that any class gets which provides more value to the tank class aspect.

As far as Pal/SK getting defensive stance, that seems like a big deal, I am curious what they are giving warrior to offset this, as they are pretty meh in the tank dept if all three classes can pop defensive.
I believe the devs said they added block to Warriors and Rangers (although I'm sure at a lower skill cap than Monks get). Beastlords also have block.

If you look at this site, you can see a lot of the changes they've announced on the lefthand sidebar: https://everquestguides.com/legends/

[kjs86z2]

You guys are really killing me. I was dead set on playing monk / enchanter / xx (undecided).

Now it sounds like both just aren't great since no need for FD or clarity and charm not being as strong since player characters will be hitting a lot harder.

[Evia]

You guys are really killing me. I was dead set on playing monk / enchanter / xx (undecided).

Now it sounds like both just aren't great since no need for FD or clarity and charm not being as strong since player characters will be hitting a lot harder.

Same. I was starting to lean into Cleric/Enchanter/Monk...but now idk.

What about Rogue/Ranger/Monk for ultimate melee dps machine? Or maybe Rogue/Monk/Bard?

Can you not stack pets? So like, necro/beastlord/magician wouldnt work for 3 pets right?

[BradZax]

Same. I was starting to lean into Cleric/Enchanter/Monk...but now idk.

What about Rogue/Ranger/Monk for ultimate melee dps machine? Or maybe Rogue/Monk/Bard?

Can you not stack pets? So like, necro/beastlord/magician wouldnt work for 3 pets right?

Thj was 3 pets, I never played that class but I think emp did.

I had a sk/bst/rog that was a dwarf and he was so rad with his two skeleton bros and daggers and black armor and scar on his eye.

Watching another video, it looks like they are going hard into the THJ system of combo'ing AAs from different classes, not classic p99 class combos.

https://i.imgur.com/5pGxJpz.png

54SCHKlnW8o

[Vexenu]

You guys are really killing me. I was dead set on playing monk / enchanter / xx (undecided).

Now it sounds like both just aren't great since no need for FD or clarity and charm not being as strong since player characters will be hitting a lot harder.
Same. I was starting to lean into Cleric/Enchanter/Monk...but now idk.

What about Rogue/Ranger/Monk for ultimate melee dps machine? Or maybe Rogue/Monk/Bard?
You guys are looking at this through a P99 lens where Enchanters are far and away the most powerful solo class, and where Monks are the best solo melee class (and where FD is one of the most powerful abilities in the game in general). So it makes sense that you'd think ENC + MNK + CLR, SHM, BRD, MAG, etc... would result in the best EQL class. But this really seems to be an entirely different experience they're going for, one where pretty much any reasonable combination of classes can solo effectively. There is no need to rely on OP charm mechanics to solo in EQL, and for that matter nor is there really any reason to try to become more powerful than the next guy, due to the way that loot and instancing works. This is not meant to be a hardcore, competitive type of MMO where players compete for a limited number of spawns. For better or worse, this is going to be more like, "Everyone who shows up and plays gets a participation trophy". The focus is on the individual player (or optionally bringing a few friends) running through dungeon instances for loot. There is not really going to be a meta of "build the most powerful solo monster character you can and farm powerful items to sell for plat", because 1) Every other player can easily farm the same item, and 2) Items can only be traded once before binding to the player, greatly reducing their resale value. This is why my biggest concern with EQL is not that it won't be fun, but simply that it will be so easy that it quickly becomes boring. The game is very much geared toward the casual player.


Can you not stack pets? So like, necro/beastlord/magician wouldnt work for 3 pets right?
No stacking pets. But pet classes get something called a "pet window" which allows for a limited number of permanent gear slots for their pet. The more powerful pet classes get more gear slots, and if you have more than one pet class, they are additive. For exmaple, I believe the Mage gets the standard four slots and an additional +3, while the necro gets +2. So if you were a Necro/Mage you would get +5 slots. Also, if you charm, your pet will automatically equip the gear in the pet slot, and if it dies it won't lose it. So that makes charming pretty fun. Charm just won't be wildly OP compared to everything else like it is in P1999, since player characters in general will be much stronger and mobs will be weaker.

[Evia]

This honestly makes EQL sound even cooler to me. I think I might just pick my favorite 3 Classes and smash them together and have fun. Less concerned about "min/maxing" it.

Which means I'll play Rogue/Bard for sure...just dunno on the 3rd class just yet.