Best group tank?

[|tda| fatal]

Hey all,

Rolling a new tank on green with like maybe 10k for gear. Wondering what the best group tank would be for end game dungeon fun. I don’t plan on raid tanking with this char just looking to play with a friend and do fun hard group content. They will be playing a Druid but nothing set in stone. Does paladin have the best snap aggro since the patch that nerfed disease and poison dot hate? I’m guessing sk has a harder time with aggro now right? Or would they be better in the end with fd pulling in dungoens? Also what race should I pick? :D

[patrick210]

Root is best agro, what i heard.

[Jimjam]

S K cos it is fun to play dress up with the little boney boy. Fill inventory with cheap items like bard instruments and shovels for visual appeal.

[kjs86z2]

with 10k its paladin or sk

[Ennewi]

Either knight works. Paladin benefits from having deepwater bp and soulfires, particularly helpful with a druid healing in end game dungeons. 10k budget at least covers deepwater helm and standard HP gear, plus a decent weapon. The paci nerf is going to make single pulls more of a pita for paladins but two classes with root (pal/dru) and one with snare (dru), should be fine, plus harmo for outdoor dungeons. The shd having feign death is hard to overlook, especially for the tougher dungeons. Until death peace is memmed, BE legs make split pulls ezpz though, again, outside the 10k budget but should be affordable by the time they can be clicked.

[Vexenu]

If your friend is dead set on a Druid, go Paladin. If you can talk your friend into going Shaman, go SK. Pal/Dru is a great casual duo and will have no trouble leveling, but Shm/SK is much, much stronger at endgame.

[kjs86z2]

Hey all,

Rolling a new tank on green with like maybe 10k for gear. Wondering what the best group tank would be for end game dungeon fun. I don’t plan on raid tanking with this char just looking to play with a friend and do fun hard group content. They will be playing a Druid but nothing set in stone. Does paladin have the best snap aggro since the patch that nerfed disease and poison dot hate? I’m guessing sk has a harder time with aggro now right? Or would they be better in the end with fd pulling in dungoens? Also what race should I pick? :D

Take that 10k and put it into an enchanter or necro if you don't have one already.

Knight + druid is going to be painfully slow unless the druid is willing to charm animals. Him just sitting there healing you is going to suck balls.

[Crede]

I'd prob go Ogre SK with your budget if you dont care about looks. druid snare + fear kiting you can kill nonstop. Also make the druid charm animals eventually as kjs said. Pally will have the edge though for tight dungeon stuff for awhile, SK just has a higher ceiling in the end game. Dorf pally with the cultural armor would be a good alternative.

[Vexenu]

Knight + druid is going to be painfully slow unless the druid is willing to charm animals. Him just sitting there healing you is going to suck balls.
I've done this and it's not too bad if the Paladin is twinked well (admittedly 10k is kinda low budget for what you'd want). It's basically just Paladin tank and spank soloing but with a Druid supporting with thorns, heals/regen, snares, DoTs, etc... Very steady and easy XP, but obviously not as fast as a good charm duo. Falls off really hard 50+ compared to SK/Shm, but a perfectly viable duo for casual play.

[enjchanter]

Paladin
Next question

[|tda| fatal]

Appreciate the replies although no one really responded to the aggro question. Can sks still get snap aggro or not after nerf? Also we will be puging too not just duoing

[Jimjam]

They still got snare and ac debuffs. Does the attack debuff make much hate too?

[Crede]

Appreciate the replies although no one really responded to the aggro question. Can sks still get snap aggro or not after nerf? Also we will be puging too not just duoing

Pallies have better snap aggro after nerf. Stuns & flash of light sks can no longer compete w/ without blowing a lot of mana on snares/atk debuffs. With that being said though if you are leaning towards SKs the silver lining may be the blood ember gauntlets(if you don't go iksar). Just chain that mofo and go ogre for less interrupts, you should be fine.

TLDR - go pally unless you want that SK utility - fd/snare/fear/invis/coolest epic ever.

[|tda| fatal]

Pallies have better snap aggro after nerf. Stuns & flash of light sks can no longer compete w/ without blowing a lot of mana on snares/atk debuffs. With that being said though if you are leaning towards SKs the silver lining may be the blood ember gauntlets(if you don't go iksar). Just chain that mofo and go ogre for less interrupts, you should be fine.

TLDR - go pally unless you want that SK utility - fd/snare/fear/invis/coolest epic ever.

Those gloves seem dope, and cheap. I’m guessing you can’t click them until 45? And the cast is 2.5 seconds or is it different on the gloves clicky?

[Snaggles]

The Druid and pally spell books have the least conflicting. You get a ton of buffs, stuns and even a solid rez.

The SK mainly has FD for pulling. With a little CHA gear the paladin has a serviceable Lull though which likely works quicker. Plus the Druid CC game is very strong. Targeted AE root makes a bad pull less freaky.

Outdoors SK fear and Druid snare is huge for quality of life. That said, harmony + thorns + regen makes grinding very easy. Other big advantage for a SK would be that taps heal faster than pally celestial cleansing. Leechcurse also helps for healing in a pinch (it’s like a self-only 72min HoT). Probably a better duo for killing a nasty named but less good for general use tanking. I’ve saved so many people with LoH.

The real question is what do you want to play? Aggro isn’t an issue for a healer+melee. SK’s can still keep aggro off rogues, their aggro spells are just more expensive to chain cast.

[Snaggles]

By the way, you didn’t ask but it’s fun and weird, can also go:
Ranger + Cleric: Harmony, snare and fear everything outdoors
It is a pretty meh dungeon duo.

The knight + Druid works great. Monk and Druid too. I just found leveling the Ranger and cleric to be more annoying and having them at 60 is very handy.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I'd pick SK. Druid already covers a lot of the Paladins toolkit with heals, lulls, and roots. Fear kiting is generally better for preventing spell casting compared to stuns as well.

SK's are still great at holding agro. Even without disease cloud you should be able to hold agro in most scenarios. This is especially true when you get better gear. I rarely have mana issues in groups with Flowing Thought and Blood Ember Clickies.

Those gloves seem dope, and cheap. I’m guessing you can’t click them until 45? And the cast is 2.5 seconds or is it different on the gloves clicky?

Correct, you can't click Blood Ember Armor until level 45. Cast time is 5 seconds for gloves. I use my blood ember gloves all the time. The casting time generally isn't an issue, and the mana savings are well worth it.

[Crede]

And if you can scrape together cash or raid eventually for Blood Ember Greaves you can do mana free splits all day w/ gaunts + pants. Given both spells are 60 mana a pop, the mana saving is pretty ridiculous from the clickies.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

And if you can scrape together cash or raid eventually for Blood Ember Greaves you can do mana free splits all day w/ gaunts + pants. Given both spells are 60 mana a pop, the mana saving is pretty ridiculous from the clickies.

Yeah I love my BE greaves. Use them as often as I can, barring a scenario where Deaths Peace is the safer option.

[Crede]

Yeah I love my BE greaves. Use them as often as I can, barring a scenario where Deaths Peace is the safer option.

Yea they are great not only for the mana saving but also having a FD that can be chain casted until Death Peace at least as the regular FD spell has a horrible recast time.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Yea they are great not only for the mana saving but also having a FD that can be chain casted until Death Peace at least as the regular FD spell has a horrible recast time.

That's right. Especially at levels 45-59, not having to wait for normal FD to pop back up is a godsend. And BE greaves are still useable if you are OOM for whatever reason.

[Ennewi]

Paladins do have fear undead. Between that and druid snare + animal fear, more than enough fear kiting options for that duo. Just have to know where to look.

Granted, regular fear is more ideal and SKs also get polished obsidian great axe but still, the option is there for both.

[Crede]

Paladins do have fear undead. Between that and druid snare + animal fear, more than enough fear kiting options for that duo. Just have to know where to look.

Granted, regular fear is more ideal and SKs also get polished obsidian great axe but still, the option is there for both.

I did a paladin/druid duo. It was fun looking for mobs for the Druid to charm but fell flat in the mid 40s as the Druid couldn’t keep up with heals on unslowed mobs. Sk will just be a much better complement being able to fear anything.

[greatdane]

If there isn't anyone who can snare, and the group is in a place where snare matters, SK is the best. This is particularly true in places like Sebilis where most mobs will have SoW because there's shaman mobs buffing everything through the walls and shit. Since an SK is probably using Clinging Darkness for aggro, it ensures all mobs are always snared, which is very useful. SKs are also able to get to most parts of any dungeon, so if replacing a tank and the replacement has to get there on their own, an SK usually has an easier time than a paladin. Pacifying your way to the bottom of Chardok isn't exactly practical. Any crit resist and you just die automatically.

If the healer isn't a cleric, paladin is the best because their buffs will be useful. It's especially good with a shaman healer since there's no redundancy between them. If there is a cleric in the group, paladin isn't anything special. Flash of Light is a shitty spell for tanking, and while stuns are good aggro, they cost too much mana and have longish cooldowns. It works, but it's nowhere near as clean as an SK who can just spam Clinging Darkness. The difference is especially significant in groups without an enchanter. In the earlier levels, paladins also face the issue of getting their first stun at level 30 and the next at 49.

Overall, SK is more flexible. Better mana sustain, provides snare, has both types of invis plus FD to travel to any group without assistance, and brings the situational ability to split problematic pulls if the puller isn't a monk. In some group setups, that can make the difference between being able to break a camp or not. There's almost never any situation where a paladin's class tools determine what a group can or cannot do, and the class is kind of bad without mana regen buffs.

[Snaggles]

I soloed a ranger and pally to 60 like 7 years ago with horrible gear and prior melee patches. My Ranger had no fungi and a woodsman staff until 57.

In the proposed Druid+tank duo, you always have snare. You can fear undead or animals. Outside the classic “dungeon crawl” which is fun but rarely exp efficient for a duo, most outdoor zones would be ripe for grinding blues. Animals in Oasis, Overthere, Emerald Jungle, Wakening Lands, Eastern Wastes, Western Wastes. Undead is a bit more sparse but dreadlands, burning wood, CoM and Lower Guk (sketchier fearing), trak’s teeth, Karnors, and some others.

The Druid can eventually pick up ES legs for click healing a tank at 11hp/sec (4.5x a fungi).

I only mentioned the ranger and cleric duo as those were my worst solo experiences. Getting both to 60 that way would teach both people how to pull, CC, and manage their resources. You be would have no restrictions regarding snare/fear or invising around live or undead.

Ultimately, I think the OP and their friend should pick the classes they feel most passionate about playing. Also, the ones they want at 60 since that is the goal. Outside some really bad duos, most have a viable path to 60, even if a different class would be much more efficient (like shaman instead of Druid).

[Jimjam]

/agree

The most viable path to 60 is the fun one.

[Ripqozko]

I did a paladin/druid duo. It was fun looking for mobs for the Druid to charm but fell flat in the mid 40s as the Druid couldn’t keep up with heals on unslowed mobs. Sk will just be a much better complement being able to fear anything.

both druid and pally can heal jsut fine with click legs or bp

[Gloomlord]

Given all the equipment and spells they get access to, Paladin is definitely the better knight and better group tank.

[kjs86z2]

at least if they do druid + SK they will have a port bot for when the druid player realizes their mistake and rolls a shaman

bonus points too the SK can help FD plvl the shaman

[Jimjam]

at least if they do druid + SK they will have a port bot for when the druid player realizes their mistake and rolls a shaman

bonus points too the SK can help FD plvl the shaman

This is a really good point. When I rerolled from dru + SK (+ enc) to dru + war (+ enc) the druid was kind enough to provide a lot of PL and help get me back into xp range. As such, dru / sk is a good team from the perspective they both let each other reroll - you are less locked in!

[Crede]

Have the Druid solo to 60 via animal charming and then you have a potg bot which is gonna be the best PL spell for your sham and sk and it will also solve any sk mana problems holding aggro win/win

[Jimjam]

Have the Druid solo to 60 via animal charming and then you have a potg bot which is gonna be the best PL spell for your sham and sk and it will also solve any sk mana problems holding aggro win/win

🤣

Best tank is druid, move to resolved.