Paladin or Shdowknight?

[mojojellyfish]

I need a break from casters and would like to try out one of the hybrid melee classes. I like the idea of derping around in dungeons, so I have ruled ranger out for now, since they seem to be better suited for outdoor zones.

My favorite way to play is a small group of maybe 2 or 3. However, I think something that can also solo decent in a pinch would be nice, as groups can be hard to come by nowadays. Shadow knights seem great because of feign death, but they seem to mostly rely on fear kiting. Chasing down a mob constantly doesn't sound like something I would enjoy, I would rather just face tank and chill for the most part. Can shadowknights solo at all without fear kiting?

Paladin seem like a great alternative. Maybe a bit more dangerous in dungeons on days I have to solo , especially with some of the comments I've seen about root and lull potentially getting nerfed soon. They do have the added benefit of being more desirable on raids as well.

I'm really torn, and could use some advice! P99 was my first experience with EQ and I have only played casters, so I still feel like a noob. I have about 30 or maybe 35k I can use for jboots and some gear for them.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I need a break from casters and would like to try out one of the hybrid melee classes. I like the idea of derping around in dungeons, so I have ruled ranger out for now, since they seem to be better suited for outdoor zones.

My favorite way to play is a small group of maybe 2 or 3. However, I think something that can also solo decent in a pinch would be nice, as groups can be hard to come by nowadays. Shadow knights seem great because of feign death, but they seem to mostly rely on fear kiting. Chasing down a mob constantly doesn't sound like something I would enjoy, I would rather just face tank and chill for the most part. Can shadowknights solo at all without fear kiting?

Paladin seem like a great alternative. Maybe a bit more dangerous in dungeons on days I have to solo , especially with some of the comments I've seen about root and lull potentially getting nerfed soon. They do have the added benefit of being more desirable on raids as well.

I'm really torn, and could use some advice! P99 was my first experience with EQ and I have only played casters, so I still feel like a noob. I have about 30 or maybe 35k I can use for jboots and some gear for them.

It sounds like you've made up your mind already to go Paladin. Let me link you a video of me fear kiting in Seb. If you think that looks more fun than you thought, go SK. Otherwise go with what you are already leaning towards.

https://youtu.be/mI_IJ_F1GCY?feature=shared

[Dundrige]

Paladin all the way. Shadowknights are scum of the earth and pathetic.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Paladin all the way. Shadowknights are scum of the earth and pathetic.

You've already taken the first step towards becoming a Shadowknight.

"Let the hate flow through you." - Emperor Palpatine, Level 70 Shadowknight.

[Snaggles]

It mostly comes down to what you want to play (and do). To a lesser degree who you want to group with.

In a duo/trio as a puller (w/o a monk around) especially in undead zones, a SK is the stronger pick.

As a support/tank with a puller but and potentially without a priest healer, the Pally is a stronger pick. Stuns, buffs, healing between fights, LoH and Rez can save the adventure or at least help recover it.

[Zuranthium]

I have about 30 or maybe 35k I can use for jboots and some gear for them.

If you're choosing the meh Pally, should focus on getting Deepwater Breastplate and the best weapon possible with whatever money left after that.

[Danth]

Can shadowknights solo at all without fear kiting?

Yeah. Fear kiting is good tool, but it's not a fulltime thing. At low-mid levels shadowknights facetank about as well as paladins do. At higher levels paladins' self healing pulls ahead and the paladin becomes noticeably better as an anvil to let mobs smash themselves against. However, by that point the shadowknight has profoundly superior dungeon mobility and escapability, so it balances out in its own way.

Both classes have some issues to be aware of. Paladins run the risk of future nerfs to root and lull spells. Always has--lulls in particular were known to be too good on P99 even during P99's beta, yet here we are 15+ years later with those spells still being in that state. Maybe they'll get changed in a couple more months--or maybe, never. Who knows? As far as we players are concerned, it's a dice roll. Shadowknights, today, have to deal with Disease Cloud being broken with no indication on when or if it'll be fixed. Doesn't matter much at 60 but holding aggro on a low/mid level SK is highly annoying without their primary tool, as other spells are both higher level and cost a lot more mana.

As duo/trio components, which class is "better" basically depends on who they're with, as Snaggles said. Personally I like my shadowknight better as a main at 60, but I like paladins better as alts in the lower-middle level range. That's just me though and I make no claim for that specific comment beyond personal opinion.

If you're careful with your equipment purchases, you can mostly buy stuff either class can wear and future-proof yourself so you can ultimately try them both out in time for little additional cost.

[Zuranthium]

At low-mid levels shadowknights facetank about as well as paladins do. At higher levels paladins' self healing pulls ahead

I think SK's facetank better than Paladins actually, when factoring in DPS (killing something faster = taking less damage). SK lifesteal abilities in total damage+healing are about the same mana efficiency as Paladin healing, Asystole is more efficient than a heal, and then the big difference maker is the SK pet.

Of course, for solo exping at Level 45+, this ignores the benefit Paladins have with Deepwater Breastplate to reduce downtime, compared to an SK that only facetanks. But for taking down a single difficult NPC (and not using Soulfire charges), I think the SK is putting up better numbers. And if you're in a good group that is perma pulling and keeping the tank attacking most of the time, then an SK is also generating better numbers, thanks to the pet DPS.

[kjs86z2]

pally if you're into weird / off meta duos and trios

pally if you want to raid (useful buff, SK is easily the worst raid class)

SK prob better for your average soloer simply because of FD...more forgiving

i enjoyed solo on my pally but was giga twinked

[Crede]

Play them both IMO. Both great classes in their own right and you can trade Crown of Narandi between them. If you have to choose, SK has a higher ceiling and they have the coolest epic w/ a great proc. But paladin if you just want to casually kill stuff easier.

[CrazyPro]

paladin if you want to spam divine strength on tanks in raids
shadowknight if you want to have fun and don't care about raid viability

[jolanar]

Play them both IMO. Both great classes in their own right and you can trade Crown of Narandi between them. If you have to choose, SK has a higher ceiling and they have the coolest epic w/ a great proc. But paladin if you just want to casually kill stuff easier.

Agree with this take. If you love one you will most likely love the other too. There are times on my SK where I think having root/lull/heals would be OP, and there are times on my Pally where I wish I could snare/fear/FD etc.

[shovelquest]

Why not both? OH i know.. fricken DBG! :o

[Duik]

Why not both? OH i know.. fricken DBG! :o

Something something suck a fat one.

[Trelaboon]

Paladin is my favorite class in the game and SK, while I think looks really fun to have at 60, really doesn’t interest me while leveling. I have one at 53 I’m really struggling to level. Holding aggro is way more obnoxious/mana intensive, I absolutely can’t stand fear kiting, and recovering health takes way longer, assuming you get hit during fights. Some of the things I do love about them though, is the feign death, the ability to summon a pet is neat, having access to not only invis (one of my biggest Pally complaints) but especially an instant invis clicky. Their epic is also way nicer than Paladin epic (another big complaint of mine. Paladin epic is basically useless)
Paladin just resonates with me though. I love being able to lull. I love being able to root. The little mini torpor you get at 59 is so nice. The 90% rezz is amazing to have when you’re 60 and just die somewhere and want your exp back, or if your buddy dies and isn’t worried about the 6% lost. I love the Deepwater Helm/BP while leveling. The epic is really easy, so despite being terrible, you can get it fairly easily pre-60 and have it for leveling.

[boromn]

As others have kind of already illuded to, I think it's more about personality than which is "better". I played a pally on live all the way up to around lvl 100. I have also boxed SKs in that time and started with a SK here.

For me, it's about being a protector knight and face tanking rather than a dark character that also spend a lot of time chasing mobs when fear kiting (you can still kind of do this with undead as a pally but not well lol). I gave up on my SK at 30 and rerolled back to my usual paladin and I just feel more connected to the character, which I think is the bigger part of it.

Seeing as it's your alt and not main, however, I would try both and see which is more "you". Keep in mind you don't get a lot of the functional skills until post 30 in each.

[kjs86z2]

paladin makes for a sleeper great duo with charming classes

just gotta play a little differently

[Naethyn]

Paladins buffing ds while they watch the ogre sk tank his vyemm gf.

[kjs86z2]

Paladins buffing ds while they watch the ogre sk tank his vyemm gf.

it must be fun having every single mob uncontested so you can do stupid shit like SK tanking unslowable dragons

blue is deader n a doornail

[Ennewi]

it must be fun having every single mob uncontested so you can do stupid shit like SK tanking unslowable dragons

blue is deader n a doornail

Another way of looking at it is, the server is (d)evolving due to the sheer amount of BIS level 60 characters and lack of new content, allowing for certain strategies to be employed that were never attempted in classic, whether in a solo or raid setting.

As for the OP, IMO test out both knight classes to level 30 plus; the hybrid xp penalty is a thing of the past and there are even xp bonuses every now and then.

I did the same and then recognized which playstyle fit my preferences more. However, keep in mind that the lull line is due for a nerf, making the PAL spellbook even less diverse, whereas no such nerfs are planned for the undead SHD version.

Both classes can look forward to s-tier clickies for QoL improvements. SHD wins out in terms of mana recovery due to Soul Defiler. PAL wins out in terms of HP recovery thanks to Deepwater Breastplate. SHD still has the option of procing epic off of Holgresh eyes, but that's more tedious and expensive comparatively.

PAL has a higher piercing skill than SHD, but the two BIS knight weapons are 2H Slashing, so that discrepancy is of little consequence when all is said and done.

At raid level, one outshines the other, mainly because there is no shortage of MNKs to pull where otherwise SHD would be able to fill that role. Where SHD mostly only trash tanks, PAL also gets to buff, off-heal, and SoulFire click.

IMO knights should have received a few auras that slowly drained mana, that way they could contribute much more even when the tank list was already set. Join a party, apply aura, ask for c2, swing at mob's backside.

[kjs86z2]

IMO knights should have received a few auras that slowly drained mana, that way they could contribute much more even when the tank list was already set. Join a party, apply aura, ask for c2, swing at mob's backside.

lifesteal aura from SKs would be sweet

and maybe like an armor + resists aura from paladoods

[Ennewi]

Yeah, to backtrack, I meant drain mana for the knight's resource cost to maintain whichever aura was active.

SHD "attrition" aura could grant all party members lifetap proc. Another version could decrease feign death fail chance, encouraging a SHD to be in with the pull team but also in range for the aura to apply.

PAL "battalion" aura could enhance all worn AoB of party members. Another version could reduce the duration of debuffs/dots effecting party by X ticks.

[Crede]

Sk for sure if soul defiler is an option. Mana is a huge bottleneck later on. If not then sk if you want fd otherwise pally.

[Wakanda]

For me the race choices are more intriguing than the class choices a lot of times. IE. An Erudite Paladin or SK are more interesting than a Dwarf Paladin or Ogre SK.

[Ennewi]

Or halfling PAL and gnome SHD.

[Snaggles]

Or halfling PAL and gnome SHD.

This is my only wish for p99.
Well, a throwaway wish is for /autofire but I’ll take adorbz alts over that…

[Crede]

Or halfling PAL and gnome SHD.

gnome SK with haste arms would be the ultimate solo build. I think one still exists on this server from the person who pointed out it wasn't classic

[Ennewi]

PAL with HLF sneak and hide racials would be pretty great, especially considering SHD gets hide but none of their available races have sneak. Vendor wherever, sneak pull if the nerf ever gets reverted/adjusted, use less invis charges, etc.

SHD with GNM size would of course have wall vision and ease of access to stalking probes versus elder beads.