New Meta - Revert Recharge Item Nerfs

[furny]

Real talk. This Server is 15 years old with people constantly complaining about "stale" meta and how smaller guilds can't compete.

Instead of reverting back to this ridiculous poopsock meta, why not just revert the item recharge cast times, recharge cost, and lifetap un-resistibility?

The reason these were nerfed, in the first place, are over a decade old for players no longer on the server and no longer applicable. Reverting these custom changes back would not only restore the "classic" claim of the server, but also give guilds like PL, Gravity, SS, (not riot), ect... a fighting chance again to low man content with classic items.

I could even see a beneficial side effect of this also helping casual players kill content that they can no longer find groups for.

[Jimjam]

Certainly un-nerf lifetap imo

[questever]

I'm not in the raid scene, but curious whom the top guilds are competing for the high end content

[loramin]

I'm not in the raid scene, but curious whom the top guilds are competing for the high end content

Might not be perfectly up-to-date, but https://wiki.project1999.com/Blue_Guilds#Raid_Guilds

[Keebz]

Certainly un-nerf lifetap imo

[Zuranthium]

Item recharging is dumb and not something that's supposed to be in EQ.

[Vexenu]

The fact that they nerfed the entire line of lifetap spells instead of just Ivandyr's Hoop itself is still one of the most inexplicable and ridiculous decisions made in the history of this project.

[zelld52]

Real talk. This Server is 15 years old with people constantly complaining about "stale" meta and how smaller guilds can't compete.

Instead of reverting back to this ridiculous poopsock meta, why not just revert the item recharge cast times, recharge cost, and lifetap un-resistibility?

The reason these were nerfed, in the first place, are over a decade old for players no longer on the server and no longer applicable. Reverting these custom changes back would not only restore the "classic" claim of the server, but also give guilds like PL, Gravity, SS, (not riot), ect... a fighting chance again to low man content with classic items.

I could even see a beneficial side effect of this also helping casual players kill content that they can no longer find groups for.

the whole point of this meta change is that it can be implemented without changing anything about the server databases or codes. the GMs are hosting this meta change - but the developers are only interested in restoring classic EQ (which it seems like theyve done and theyre finished)

its even in the announcement, that the CSR is hosting this meta change because they dont have any acces to change any scripts on the server, etc

[furny]

Item recharging is dumb and not something that's supposed to be in EQ.

except.... it was and... is classic.

[loramin]

Item recharging is dumb and not something that's supposed to be in EQ.

except.... it was and... is classic.

You're both right. It's unclassic to not have recharging because people absolutely did it on live ... but if you have it, the whole game becomes unclassic. In classic 99+% of Mages did not have root; if you allow the nets then most Mages (unclassicaly) will have root.

Personally I think recharging should be something introduced later. After all, on live no one knew how to recharge on day one: they had to learn about it from others.

It'd be fun if the devs staggered it to simulate live (eg. after six months of play each player has a 10%/month chance to unlock recharging) ... but a much more realistic implementation would just be to start a server with no recharging, and allow it (say) a year into Velious.

[shovelquest]

Personally I think recharging should be something introduced later. After all, on live no one knew how to recharge on day one: they had to learn about it from others.

My friend told me "There's some way to recharge items with vendors but I haven't figured it out" back in real99 and that was the way it be for me and my friends until p99 unlocked this epic and enjoyable feature for my peasant everquest skills.

[Zuranthium]

except.... it was and... is classic.

No, the EQ devs never wanted it in the game and simply didn't know how to write code to recognize item charges on vendors. As soon as they figured out how to do that, item recharge was removed from the game. Not to mention, these items were far less known by the player base back then, and the mechanic itself wasn't known by everyone either.

[Tewaz]

I say just revert midnight mallet nerf.

It's stupid.

People that would be turning in rubies for that are instead camping 12-16 hours at Gagnar.

Pointless.

[Zuranthium]

These items are all bad game design to begin with. People shouldn't be gaining access to things like Root, Snare, Blind, Slow etc from clickies, particularly in a spammable form.

[shovelquest]

These items are all bad game design to begin with. People shouldn't be gaining access to things like Root, Snare, Blind, Slow etc from clickies, particularly in a spammable form.

https://i.imgur.com/XFqhHcI.png

[Impact1983]

Item recharging is dumb and not something that's supposed to be in EQ.

What a weak argument. Intention has nothing to do with it. It was in the game, period. If you want to get into it, the game was never intended to be stuck in Velious for 10 years either with full guilds in Vulak loot.

The fact of the matter is that the server is on the decline with a dwindling player base. Changes need to be made (or reverted in this case) to attract players back and/or increase the enjoyment of the game.

Just because people know about something now, that was not widespread before, doesn't make a difference. I would argue many people originally came back to re-live the game with that increased knowledge on the second time around. If not, you wouldn't have had tons of manastones, fungi staves, CoS, Lockets, hogresh beds, BFGs, etc farmed into oblivion.

[cd288]

Real talk. This Server is 15 years old with people constantly complaining about "stale" meta and how smaller guilds can't compete.

Instead of reverting back to this ridiculous poopsock meta, why not just revert the item recharge cast times, recharge cost, and lifetap un-resistibility?

The reason these were nerfed, in the first place, are over a decade old for players no longer on the server and no longer applicable. Reverting these custom changes back would not only restore the "classic" claim of the server, but also give guilds like PL, Gravity, SS, (not riot), ect... a fighting chance again to low man content with classic items.

I could even see a beneficial side effect of this also helping casual players kill content that they can no longer find groups for.

I hate to break it to you but unnerfing these things would only result in making things easier for the larger guilds.

Also, seems sort of the opposite of EQ mentality to make changes with the goal of making it easy to take down raid targets. If you're a smaller guild, yeah it sucks that there's some content you can't do, but that's always been the case in classic EQ. That's a decision you make as a player when you decide what guild to join. Asking to make things easier for a smaller guild is like deciding to go to Taco Bell and complaining you can't buy a large pizza there. You can make a different decision on the guild you're a part of.

Also kinda lol to include PL on that list.

[Kubaton]

Same age old crying and innacurate claims from all sides... It never changes, ever, not even the topics... cycles after cycles...

Heres a thought. Play classic on live, or better yet try a modern game that actually runs properly with todays technology without having an IT background to keep it functional.

Overall... my new observation is that P99 is almost if not already dead. I've seen this trend before.. With Red. P99 days are numbered



I've seen more people playing at 3am on xmas eave yrs back than I do now.

Its not classic, it never will be! Classic does exist on live

Amazing

[Jimjam]

I hate to break it to you but unnerfing these things would only result in making things easier for the larger guilds.

Yes but also no. Things are trivial for the larger guilds disirregardlessfully. Let SKs have their battletaps back.

[Duik]

disirregardlessfully

Making words great again Jimbo. I appreciataficationist it muchfullnessly.

[loramin]

Making words great again Jimbo. I appreciataficationist it muchfullnessly.

I thought it was perfectly cromulent.

[Naethyn]

https://imgur.com/qxkpNpw.jpg

[Duik]

I thought it was perfectly cromulent.

Dont go throwing you fancy real words around now mate!

[-Catherin-]

My two bladestoppers approve this message

[Troxx]

No thanks.

Game is more interesting without recharges.

[Croco]

No thanks.

Game is more interesting without recharges.

How can it be more interesting when nothing changed? People just use different clickies.

Tanks swapped from mallets to scepters and instead of rampant soulfire clicks everyone packs a reaper.

It was just more unclassic changes from the supposed paragons of classic everquest.

[Snaggles]

The small guilds still benefit from over two decades of knowledge and computer tech. Voice chat wasnt even readily available until Vent was launched. Free accounts also means each person can have an entire poker hand of choices to log off/on depending on the need.

Small guilds couldn’t summon a 20 cleric chain with a couple BiS warriors to kill KT over 45 minutes, lol. They sure didnt have the same number of Bane wizards. Most large guilds didn’t even have those numbers.

The nerfed recharges are not classic and annoying. Same with rooted dragons. With enough players these days nothing is holding a big guild back except themselves or another big guild. IMHO, tweaking the code to prevent “cheating” isn’t the way. Just ban repeat offenders. That’s resulted in more raid burnout than anything else.

[eisley]

Recharge nerf and rooted dragons ended this game for me. I have 6 pairs of puppet strings and had so much fun solo/duoing all sorts of ridiculous things with them (and sneak pulling, wort pots, slowstone amber, mallet, root nets, bladestopper, soulfire).

Both changes just made the game less fun. Functionally they had little to no effect on anything outside of making the game less fun.

Ultimately, did these un-classic nerfs make the game or more or less popular?

[Jimjam]

Recharge nerf and rooted dragons ended this game for me. I have 6 pairs of puppet strings and had so much fun solo/duoing all sorts of ridiculous things with them (and sneak pulling, wort pots, slowstone amber, mallet, root nets, bladestopper, soulfire).

Both changes just made the game less fun. Functionally they had little to no effect on anything outside of making the game less fun.

Ultimately, did these un-classic nerfs make the game or more or less popular?

I understand your position, but devil's advocate suggests the fun in the game is having a bunch of friends do all those different abilities and working as a team to share awesome adventures.

[Kaedain]

which is ultimately the downfall of all MMO honestly, people just wanna play ARPGs basically, when they could just go play diablo if they wanted that.. MMO was always about the group aspects and playing with other people

[Naethyn]

The Little Blue Truck is a children's story that is a great parable for valuable lessons that can be also learned from everquest.

[eisley]

I understand your position, but devil's advocate suggests the fun in the game is having a bunch of friends do all those different abilities and working as a team to share awesome adventures.

I certainly don't disagree with you. I raided frequently and had many elf friends as well. I didn't mean to imply I was a troglodyte.

That said, many of my best memories of this game involve clickies (fungi king island farming, duoing monk epic and parts of others, duoing and even later soloing Hate minis, etc)

Maybe I'm in the minority but I do feel the recharge nerf accomplished nothing at all other than making the game less fun.

[enjchanter]

clickies are annoying, keep them nerfed

[Keebz]

I say remove all the wands and make people tag with bows and javs.

[shovelquest]

Clickies make this game cool.

If everyone was limited to play how their class was designed we'd all be playing World of Warcraft.

[Naethyn]

Not all classes can use.

Line of sight issues.

You want to make level playing fields. Sow only. All zones. All mobs. Wands/face aggro only. Thats zero barrier to entry, and no bullshit dex build windstrikers, no bards dominating 3 zones (they still hold a massive advantage with their skillsets) etc.

Sounds terrible ngl. Bards having an advantage for their epic, and rangers having the coolest bow, and humans having the best javelins are what make it interesting. I hope they don't normalize every event into the same bland thing.

[shovelquest]

"this game is unbalanced, some no life addict has 50 million plat and all these clickies that make his monk as powerful as my enchanter!"

GTFO here IMO and just farm the clickies. Im happy HHK orcs are valid camp targets 25 years later.

[Swish]

bro how am i supposed to solo Emperor Chottal if I can't have my 69 clickies ready to go?

[roks1]

The small guilds still benefit from over two decades of knowledge and computer tech. Voice chat wasnt even readily available until Vent was launched. Free accounts also means each person can have an entire poker hand of choices to log off/on depending on the need.

Small guilds couldn’t summon a 20 cleric chain with a couple BiS warriors to kill KT over 45 minutes, lol. They sure didnt have the same number of Bane wizards. Most large guilds didn’t even have those numbers.

The nerfed recharges are not classic and annoying. Same with rooted dragons. With enough players these days nothing is holding a big guild back except themselves or another big guild. IMHO, tweaking the code to prevent “cheating” isn’t the way. Just ban repeat offenders. That’s resulted in more raid burnout than anything else.

Actually the largest setback all players face raiding is the fact that resists are not classic not even remotely, the boss level being so far above the players seems to be part of the modern (not classic) equation, whereas in the old velious days having 140 - 180 resists was more than enough for almost every single encounter. Lets not forget dragon fear is still set to resist like a Lure spell. The spell EVEN NOW on lucy modern day is MAGIC (0) check, 150 mr + or bard group would render tanks virtually immune to dragon fear or if not, susceptible for a mere tick of the effect.
Without a way to effectively resist ae's with equipment you wont have small guild strike teams like the elden days unless they are already full of equipped and fed raiders. I understand that having things be harder is a longevity idea " " but it also is a longevity decreaser because at this stage, since you can't effectively resist, a small strike crew guild of high skill players with increasingly good gear simply can't handle the requirements.

In case you doubt, remember that the hardest creature on the face of norrath is Sontalak, not Tunare or the Avatar of War. Why? AE that is procced, and is based on the position and direction of the tank -- who is feared by dragon fear the fucking stupid lure resist fear. Semper fry.

[Jimjam]

Nothing about mob ATK or spell resists has ever been classic here. Everything is massively over tuned.

https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/showthread.php?t=40543

Very interesting thread on trying to discover classic melee mechanics including mob stats. I was surprised at how low they appear to claim mob mitigation ac should be.

[shovelquest]

https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/showthread.php?t=40543

Very interesting thread on trying to discover classic melee mechanics including mob stats. I was surprised at how low they appear to claim mob mitigation ac should be.

https://i.imgur.com/LCREHu3.png

[Snaggles]

Actually the largest setback all players face raiding is the fact that resists are not classic not even remotely, the boss level being so far above the players seems to be part of the modern (not classic) equation, whereas in the old velious days having 140 - 180 resists was more than enough for almost every single encounter. Lets not forget dragon fear is still set to resist like a Lure spell. The spell EVEN NOW on lucy modern day is MAGIC (0) check, 150 mr + or bard group would render tanks virtually immune to dragon fear or if not, susceptible for a mere tick of the effect.
Without a way to effectively resist ae's with equipment you wont have small guild strike teams like the elden days unless they are already full of equipped and fed raiders. I understand that having things be harder is a longevity idea " " but it also is a longevity decreaser because at this stage, since you can't effectively resist, a small strike crew guild of high skill players with increasingly good gear simply can't handle the requirements.

In case you doubt, remember that the hardest creature on the face of norrath is Sontalak, not Tunare or the Avatar of War. Why? AE that is procced, and is based on the position and direction of the tank -- who is feared by dragon fear the fucking stupid lure resist fear. Semper fry.

I agree and remember, p99 is Nintendo hard compared to live. Still, my guild never got close to killing AOW at this point in the progression. In this case the disadvantage does not hold back progression unless a guild has other issues…tactic, attendance or composition. Crank up the cleric dkp bonus until people log them in. Also resists are only a factor for a few fights, Klandi and Sont specifically.

I’d still argue a lot of toxic people ruining the fun for others has been the main issue. It’s a common trend in EQ and society in general.

[Pint]

bro how am i supposed to solo Emperor Chottal if I can't have my 69 clickies ready to go?

Just do it on a paladin