Ranger: dual wield 1HS or use 2HS?

[Bardolap]

Apologies if this has been asked before, but searching the forums for short, commonly-used words doesn't get the results that I'm looking for.

I have a level 45 ranger and am wondering what the DPS comparison is between using a 2HS vs dual wielding 1HS weapons.

Currently using Lamentation (9/19) primary and Sarnak Skullsplitter (12/26) secondary. How doest that compare to either Nature's Wrath (29/44) or Silver Swiftblade (16/24)?

What kind of dmg/del should I look for in a 2H weapon to be equivalent? How does double atttack affect primary/secondary weapon attacks?

[Toxigen]

woodsmans staff and a swarmcaller is all you need til epics

Rip uses some big 2 hander from ToV on his big dick ranger parses.

[Snaggles]

DW is more fun but unless you have a Swiftblade of Zek or raid 1hs and epic, 2h is going to do better. Less damage shield woes, bigger ripostes (more a concern than the number you will take), can cast without the same penalty.

I would probably get a Silver Swiftblade and Swarmcaller. At 30 swap to an Argent Protector. Woodsman or Exquisite is better but for the hard stuff you can cast Firestrike between AP swings without much loss of DPS. Making it easy to put down targets like Dyrna, especially if she has a damage shield active. It’s also slow so your bow hits get a higher damage bonus later on.

Keeping all skills trained is annoying.

[Zuranthium]

You should be using a high delay 2H and swapping to a high damage offhand inbetween primary swings if you're willing to put the effort in.

Argent Protector 2H with Green Jade Axe offhand is cheap and a huge upgrade over your current setup. Argent Protector on its own will be better than the 1-handers you're using.

[Keebz]

Double attack triggers independently on your off hand but you have to roll a swing with your offhand that round, so it's less command than a primary swing.

For reasons other people have pointed out (ripostes, damage shields, casting between spells, etc.) I prefer 2h. On super high AC raid targets (not a current concern for you) dual wield can be better for DPS though.

You'll basically need a Woodsman Staff of Exquisite Velium X to out do your current dual wield setup.

[Solist]

Whatever crack zuranthium is on he's a moron. So it's to be expected.

You use a woodsmans staff or exquisite X till you get epics.
You offhand swiftwind and then upgrade your mainhand intermittently until it's a baton or kriezenn's.

If you loot a Meljeldin and get yourself some 41% haste in a different slot, it's BiS for DPS on most mobs.

You still keep a 1h set for tunare/AoW/KT/vyemm where baton/kflame and swiftwind parses higher. But then you also don't do this as if you bring ANY OTHER CLASS you'll do more dps. You bring a ranger to bump. To bump you need to know your consistent aggro output, and doing that with a 2h like meljeldin or primal 2h is very easy to keep yourself in the top 5 for aggro so you're only a disc and lick away from a bump.

Or dont bring a ranger. Both of mine are now bots. Noone even uses them I don't think.

If you're a complete loser like me you get a bfg and fuck around with that tripe. Do it once to get it out of your system then delete it and wish you used the plank on something else and useful.

Swarmcaller/woodsmans is the real 'epic' until Meljeldin however if you can get haste elsewhere.

Earthcaller is a nice thing to swap in as you can also use a shield of the rainbow hues while trying to get a slow proc on dragons or even HoT trash etc, lot more stats to carry than a swarmcaller to achieve the same thing.

[Zuranthium]

You're the moron who is ignoring factual game mechanics and giving bad advice.

Argent Protector on its own is within 1 DPS of the Woodsman Staff, and it gives +AC and boosts to various other stats, while also being much cheaper, and the higher delay already allows for spellcasting to be better weaved inbetween attack swings. When using an offhand swap with the Argent Protector, it is better DPS than Woodsman Staff.

[Solist]

Nobody is doing that.

If there was an advantage, we would be doing it.

There is no advantage. Go get me a 10 minute video of you doing it, footage of hands.

fucking muppet.

[Zuranthium]

Nobody is doing that.

That's their choice. It remains a great option for anyone who wants to do it, and new players should be aware of it so they can make the choice. It's especially relevant when not having much haste. There's no reason aside from laziness to sit there and wait 4 seconds between every attack round. You can get extra attack swings in that period of time without a stressful exertion.

Also, at the most basic level this IS being done. It's calling jousting. You equip your highest damage weapon for the first swing against an enemy to maximize that first swing, and then swap to the better ratio weapon after the first swing if you're fighting something that's standing still. It's your own lack of expertise in the game to not understand this. Keep showing how wrong you are, it's funny.

[Troxx]

Nobody is doing that.

This.

If bandolier function was present on p99 it would be possible but so annoying that I wouldn’t be doing it. Bandolier, however, is not on p99 so unless you’re using some hack program - I’d argue that doing it would either not be possible or (if possible in short bursts) sustainable.

Nobody is doing it.

[Jimjam]

move cursor to primary, attack off, click primary, move cursor to bag, click bag, move cursor to secondary, click secondary, attack on, attack off, click secondary, move cursor to bag, click bag, move cursor to primary, click primary, attack on.

Assuming DCOTS and decent worn haste, you have to go through those mouse moves, clicks and attack toggles every 2.5 seconds (skipping the attack toggles if you're feeling spicy).

Considering the terrible client ui click detection that is just asking for missed 2hs swings, for the chance of getting maybe one, perhaps two, 34 damage max swings (best case scenario).... how about no.

I love to experiment with this kind of stuff, but it just doesn't work reliably in practice.

[Zuranthium]

You can manually swing weapons. You don't need to turn auto attack on/off.

It only requires tiny movements of the cursor to swap the weapons. Bag slot should be sitting right next to the primary/offhand slots on screen. You go in a tiny triangle, clicking between the 3 slots.

More difficult cycles than this are performed by competitive gamers.

[Duik]

Anyone else see the similarities between Zuranthium and DSM? Factual facts and "letting people know" stuff?
Questionable 1% of 1% tactics extolled as legitimate and common.
Anywho i have an idea, rangers use their best bow but use it like Hawkeye does, ranged AND melee. Arrows (exploding) are used as close quarters peircing weapons.
Genius.

[Zuranthium]

Jousting has been common ever since 1999. It's especially important in PvP. You don't know what you're talking about if you're trying to say otherwise.

It's only 1 weapon swap at the start of a fight in PvE. Not difficult. Every melee should have the highest damage weapon they can get for that purpose. Dual wielding with a 2-hander is an extension of the technique.

[Jimjam]

You can manually swing weapons. You don't need to turn auto attack on/off.

It only requires tiny movements of the cursor to swap the weapons. Bag slot should be sitting right next to the primary/offhand slots on screen. You go in a tiny triangle, clicking between the 3 slots.

More difficult cycles than this are performed by competitive gamers.

I remember the Kunark manual discussing pressing x for offhand. Never managed to work outmanual attack myself. Please do share your experiences of how you get it to work in titanium.

You don’t do triangles. You do Vs. 1-> bag-> 2-> bag-> 1. Have you actually tried it?

Doing Yoshimitsu’s ten hit combo in Tekken II a couple of times isn’t comparable to a 4 hour grind doing 6 button clicks every 2 and a half seconds on top of all the targetting, positioning, casting, communicating, etc you are also doing.

[Troxx]

I remember the Kunark manual discussing pressing x for offhand. Never managed to work outmanual attack myself. Please do share your experiences of how you get it to work in titanium.

You don’t do triangles. You do Vs. 1-> bag-> 2-> bag-> 1. Have you actually tried it?

Doing Yoshimitsu’s ten hit combo in Tekken II a couple of times isn’t comparable to a 4 hour grind doing 6 button clicks every 2 and a half seconds on top of all the targetting, positioning, casting, communicating, etc you are also doing.

Even if we were shown a clip of someone (ANYone) doing it flawlessly for as little as 2 minutes with an AP or Tantors tusk … a case still would not be made that situationally attempting to do so might be prudent.

On raids every ranger will be rocking 100% haste. The cycle isn’t gonna be possible with raid 2hander delays rocking 100% haste

[Snaggles]

Nobody is doing that swap. Jousting is turning off a button, waiting and turning it back on when optimal. It works because of logic and being able to time it with a single click. The only time I’ll do a multi-weapon swap is to prep for a BFG disc.

I don’t have a BoF but my silver whip and claw only get used for the MR and rune proc. Otherwise the Meljeldin outperforms it on average. You can jolt between swings without a notable dps loss which is something you can’t do with DW. Plus, even if the raid mob is flipped at enrage you won’t eat a riposte sandwich.

Any ToV weapon + Epic is a great upgrade for a ranger. If left to pick, I’d prefer a Shovel or Meljeldin and even a spiked seahorse belt. It doesn’t look as cool or is as fun, but very functional.

Note:

Ratio considering damage bonus at 60

Tantor: 2.483
Woodsman: 2.657

Better 2h’s have less delay than 60 like the Tusk which is 3 second delay at 100% haste. Even a shovel of the harvest is just over 2 seconds haste capped. Ie: no point playing swap games.

[Ripqozko]

2h way better, this with my cek sword like a month ago


/GU Derakor the Vindicator in 171s, 151k @882 | Junar 18133@(113 in 160s) | Paijun 15708@(96 in 163s) | Inappropriate 15482@(99 in 155s) | Ripqozko 14417@(87 in 164s) | Scather 13672@(88 in 154s) | A storm giant berserker 11778@(92 in 128s) | Mashiara 10812@(79 in 136s) | Jobekn 7893@(47 in 166s) | Carboload 7614@(45 in 167s) | Jener 7359@(44 in 164s) | Blackduck 5259@(44 in 118s) | Dirtydiana 5067@(50 in 101s) | Gonober 4024@(42 in 95s) | Tiras 3381@(21 in 154s) | Flutin 2301@(16 in 142s)

[Snaggles]

Honorable mention for Jobekn.

Upper end of the parse is fun to be on. Its better not being below the mage pet…

[Zuranthium]

You don’t do triangles. You do Vs. 1-> bag-> 2-> bag-> 1. Have you actually tried it?

That's a triangle. Well, it's a ^ shape more specifically (assuming bag directly above the 2 weapon slots), but same thing. 3 points to click and you just keep going back and forth the same with each weapon.

On raids every ranger will be rocking 100% haste.

Should be 99%*, but anyway that amount of haste is often not available. It's not even possible until Level 60. The OP is level 45 and it doesn't seem like they have a top haste item either.

[skulldudes]

aforementioned, woodsman and swarmcaller best u can buy (the latter more for utility of proc) and argent protector is a strong budget pick over woodsman. now never look inside this thread again for your own sanity op, lol

[Troxx]

I’ll be honest, at 59 I do more dmg with swarmcaller/woodsman than I do with swiftwind and 10/18 combo - and that’s even factoring in the lost haste having to fall back on my 34% belt.

If I got an earthcaller id probably just use that though because I hate weapon swaps

[Gustoo]

Just use 2x SSOY vanilla warrior meta cuz no one knew better and they look like 1999 status. pVE is easy even when you steal all the aggro w the bad dps YAKS

Max out all your weapon skills
Use woodsman and swarm caller
And the best 1 handers as you get em

[Toxigen]

woodsmans staff and a swarmcaller is all you need til epics

[Snaggles]

If I got an earthcaller id probably just use that though because I hate weapon swaps

I started carrying a Swarmcaller again once I got my Meljeldin.
I figure if people are relying on ranger slow it’s even less left mouse clicks than the EC.