Warrior questions

[spoil]

I don't know anything about warriors but I want to roll a melee character to twink on a new server and warrior seems like a good choice because it can dps, tank and is useful in raids. I'm always going to be a chanter main but it's more fun to gear out a melee.

Obviously I'm tempted to go Ogre, especially with access to the guise of the deceiver. There's no getting around the FSI and then the great stats. So I'm interested in the other races. Is Barbarian warrior clearly the 3rd best option, or is slam vs. kick not that significant?

I also have a little question about religion, specifically on a barb. Any compelling or interesting reason to not go agnostic, keeping in mind I'll have a guise.

[Crede]

Monks a better choice for pretty much all the reasons you mentioned. If you’re set on raid tanking though FSI isn’t a huge deal since they fixed it a few years ago. If you plan to solo a lot troll is a good option for regen and also good stats. Slam has a higher skill cap than bash and kick and kick doesn’t stun until lvl 55

[spoil]

Definitely going with a war, not planning on soloing and the server pop is crazy now but I have some decent 'twink' gear to start like Rubicite BP, Executioner's Axe and SSOY. Will have some questions about gear later for anyone who wants to indulge me.

[PatChapp]

If you plan on using a guise you lose FSI and slam anyway. Pick what you like, you already have some of best gear you can currently get.

[Crede]

If you plan on using a guise you lose FSI and slam anyway. Pick what you like, you already have some of best gear you can currently get.

You sure about that? Thought guide retained FSI

[justdavid]

Warriors are a great choice for a melee character, as they can deal decent damage, take a lot of hits, and be useful in any group or raid. They can also wear any type of armor and wield any type of weapon, which makes them easy to twink.

Ogre is definitely the best race for a warrior, as they have the highest strength, stamina, and FSI (Frontal Stun Immunity). FSI is very important for a tank, as it prevents you from being stunned by mobs that face you. Ogre also has the highest base HP and AC among all races.

The second best race for a warrior is Iksar, as they have the highest agility and innate AC bonus. Agility affects how often you dodge attacks, and AC affects how much damage you take. Iksar also has natural regeneration, which helps with downtime and survivability.

The third best race for a warrior is debatable, but I would say Barbarian is a good option. They have high strength and stamina, which affect your damage and HP. They also have slam, which is a special attack that can stun enemies. Slam is better than kick, as it can interrupt spell casting and give you more time to react.

As for religion, it doesn’t matter much for a warrior, as most of the gods are neutral or good. You can choose to be agnostic, which means you don’t worship any god and don’t have any faction penalties or benefits. You can also choose to worship Brell Serilis, the god of the underworld and the patron of dwarves and gnomes. Brell Serilis has some followers in Norrath, such as the Coldain dwarves and the Runnyeye goblins. You can also use your guise of the deceiver to change your appearance and faction temporarily.

[Snaggles]

If you have moderate raiding goals an ogre will be easier to stam cap. Most our guild warrior bots are ogres for that reason. Bash immunity (FSI is misleading) really only helps with a shaman and SK. It might cost you a swing cycle. Being able to slam is very nice, mostly for leveling up. Kick at 55 is passable though since it can interupt casters.

Iksars are popular mostly on looks. The AC bonus is nominal. I understand about 30 or so. It’s the only race that can’t use an incanadine breastplate for invis or cobalt armor (the bracer is shrink). Shrinking for most fights is very important so you have to burn ant pots or group with a sham or warrior with a cobalt to get shrunk.

I soloed a gnome warrior up with 40% spell haste arms. It was fun and very easy. I wouldn’t count a gnome out from one of the top picks for this reason alone. Plus the dex click is like 30 and stacks with anything outside Avatar. Halfling sneak is really good too. The evil races have 15-20% exp penalties which sucks for a solo person. An ogre walking around with 50 more unbuffed strength than most is a dps bump and slam is handy, I’m not sure it makes up for the xp penalty. Straight dps wise 40% haste is legit good and saves you from having to quest the eyepatch of plunder (only 20% haste)

[PatChapp]

If you have moderate raiding goals an ogre will be easier to stam cap. Most our guild warrior bots are ogres for that reason. Bash immunity (FSI is misleading) really only helps with a shaman and SK. It might cost you a swing cycle. Being able to slam is very nice, mostly for leveling up. Kick at 55 is passable though since it can interupt casters.

Iksars are popular mostly on looks. The AC bonus is nominal. I understand about 30 or so. It’s the only race that can’t use an incanadine breastplate for invis or cobalt armor (the bracer is shrink). Shrinking for most fights is very important so you have to burn ant pots or group with a sham or warrior with a cobalt to get shrunk.

I soloed a gnome warrior up with 40% spell haste arms. It was fun and very easy. I wouldn’t count a gnome out from one of the top picks for this reason alone. Plus the dex click is like 30 and stacks with anything outside Avatar. Halfling sneak is really good too. The evil races have 15-20% exp penalties which sucks for a solo person. An ogre walking around with 50 more unbuffed strength than most is a dps bump and slam is handy, I’m not sure it makes up for the xp penalty. Straight dps wise 40% haste is legit good and saves you from having to quest the eyepatch of plunder (only 20% haste)

Op is playing on quarm, gnomes arent really viable until velious gear. For p99 I 100% agree

[Jimjam]

p99 uses a ac hard system different to classic and live. Also presumably different to Quarm, so it may be difficult to apply experience of iksar / ac bonus from here to there.

I'm really bad at finding relevant code on github, tbh that isn't my skillset domain, anyone able to pull the server AC calculations from quarm's open source so we can see at what point iksar bonus is calculated?

[Toxigen]

Its everquest, play what you think looks cool.

[Crede]

Iksar wars not being able to use shrink bracer is a deal breaker for me. If a class can be troll, go troll. Otherwise DE/human for peak fashion.

[spoil]

Its everquest, play what you think looks cool.

That's a huge factor in my decision. For my 2nd chanter on p99 I went human for the looks mainly, but also the stats are pretty good. Likewise barbarian seems like a solid choice for a warrior. Now it's just a small question of religion which I know little about -- there's no good reason to go Tribunal that I'm aware of, Rallos has some cool stuff for classic (and maybe post-velious) but with DE illusion will it knock me down from apprehensive to dubious in any evil cities?

p99 uses a ac hard system different to classic and live. Also presumably different to Quarm, so it may be difficult to apply experience of iksar / ac bonus from here to there.


I hear AC is king on PQ relative to p99 but I don't know the source for that.

[Keebz]

On Quarm, players do not appear to be able to push mobs, so FSI seems even less useful there.

Barbarian is a very reasonable warrior race. Pull the trigger if you're into it.

For religion, Rallos is pretty neutral but slightly evil leaning. It will give you better faction with giants in Velious and might make you dubious to the OT outpost in Kunark. Dwarves will definitely not like you though. I have no idea about Tribunal.

While I'm here, I will say warriors aren't so much useful on raids, as they _are_ the raid. You are often a single point of failure. You need to be a deputy raid leader in a sense, because you have to know the encounter well, direct people and be very communicative about everything that's happening. I know plenty of well geared warriors who are fairly useless because they can't do the above.

[Jimjam]

Decent RZ cultural after SoV… maybe pop, not sure.

[bcbrown]

I'm really bad at finding relevant code on github, tbh that isn't my skillset domain, anyone able to pull the server AC calculations from quarm's open source so we can see at what point iksar bonus is calculated?

I have no familiarity with EQ's codebase, but looks like this might be it: https://github.com/SecretsOTheP/EQMacEmu/blob/main/zone/attack.cpp#L4917-L4930

if (level < 10)
{
acSum += 10;
}
else if (level > 35)
{
acSum += 35;
}
else
{
acSum += level;
}

This snippet is unchanged for Quarm from the upstream initial source release.

[Snaggles]

Op is playing on quarm, gnomes arent really viable until velious gear. For p99 I 100% agree

I should have assumed Quarm, lol.

[spoil]

For religion, Rallos is pretty neutral but slightly evil leaning. It will give you better faction with giants in Velious and might make you dubious to the OT outpost in Kunark. Dwarves will definitely not like you though. I have no idea about Tribunal.

While I'm here, I will say warriors aren't so much useful on raids, as they _are_ the raid. You are often a single point of failure. You need to be a deputy raid leader in a sense, because you have to know the encounter well, direct people and be very communicative about everything that's happening. I know plenty of well geared warriors who are fairly useless because they can't do the above.

Yeah, warrior is going to be a challenge because because I have a lot less general knowledge of the game than most players. But I am interested in getting good which is more than you can say for a lot of players.

Like today was my first time ever at the King camp in Guk. We got a few spawns and one sword that went to the enchanter. I wasted a good roll on that shitty crown. But anyways I have 8 months to soak up a lot of classic knowledge.

[Vexenu]

Dwarves make great Warriors, and their STA/DEX is actually quite close to an Ogre who pumps DEX at creation as advised. (125 STA, 90 DEX for the Dwarf, 132 STA, 95 DEX for the Ogre). The Ogre has more STR of course, but even minimally twinked it's not that big of a deal, and the ability to wear small armor pretty much offsets it. Dwarf warrior has a tremendous aesthetic and practical size advantage over the Ogre, as well, especially in the tight Classic dungeons. Only real downside is that you can't slam, but hey, if you really wanted to interrupt casters that bad, you should have rolled a Paladin, jack.

[Troxx]

Its everquest, play what you think looks cool.

This.

For p99 I rolled dwarf for fashionquest and barrel roll. If I was playing on Quarm where Luclin graphics are an eventuality (unless you disable and want to never be able to use a horse) … I would personally go either barbarian, human or Iksar.

In my opinion for Luclin graphics (male):

Ogre: personally hate the way they flail spastically graphic in combat; retard charge looking forward run
Troll: always standing awkardly with lumbar lordosis and pot belly, melee looks way too stiff
Barbarian: sexy AF with beard, ponytail, Arnold Schwarzenegger body type, and kilt!
Humans: not bad to look at - a solid choice
Iksars: much like barbarians minus the beard but plus a tail
Half elf: lol no
Wood elf: lol no, scrawny at the joints
Dark elf: same as above
Dwarf: goofy looking imo unlike classic graphics
Halfling: meh … could be worse … but not a fan
Gnomes: surprisingly cool looking in plate and decent melee animations (an honorable mention)

Ultimately, when/if I roll a warrior there barbarian is probably my go to

[Toxigen]

gnome war god tier

[Troxx]

Yeah I loved grouping with project illusion capable enchanters. Gnomes have some cool facial hair and head hair options. Proportionally for their size they look pretty beefy and have good animations.

[spoil]

Going with an agnostic barb. Got most of the gear so far, won some more loot in Guk so pretty twinked now. Just gotta figure out what to buy in the tunnel, Hooded Black Cloak would cost most of my saved plat around 2.5k but seems worth it.

[Toxigen]

Whats your haste item?

Most important thing.

Also Staff of Battle is your best bang for your buck on a budget....throw in some hp rings, orc fang ears, and you're good to go.

[spoil]

This is on PQ.


Ears - Golden Amber Earring x 2
Fingers - Golden Fire Wedding Ring x 2
Neck - Rubicite
Head - Skull-shaped Barbute
Face - Rubicite
Chest - Rubicite
Arms - Rubicite
Back - Hooded Black Cloak
Waist - Flowing Black Silk Sash
Shoulders - Rubicite, Bloodstained Mantle
Wrists - Crafted, Rubicite
Legs - Rubicite
Hands - Dark Mail Gauntlets
Feet - Dwarven Work Boots
Primary - Short Sword of the Ykesha
Secondary - Short Sword of the Ykesha, Shield of the Slain Unicorn
Range - Runed Bone Fork
2H - Executioner's Axe


I have >1k left to spend, so can upgrade a little bit but basically done.

[Keebz]

Platinum Stamina earrings are pretty good bang for your buck in classic. Hero bracer is barb usable. Glowing bone collar will get you some more hp. There's probably some more +mr stuff you want for dragons.

Idk twinkng in classic is pretty limited.

[spoil]

The biggest question: pump STA or DEX for my starting stats?

[Keebz]

Given you're on quarm, a barb and it's classic era, probably dex. If you really want to make the "correct" choice you need a spreadsheet where you plan your gear throughout the expansions. Personally, I wouldn't be too concerned though as you'll cap both eventually (Velious) assuming you raid.

[Jimjam]

This is on PQ.



I have >1k left to spend, so can upgrade a little bit but basically done.

Are you skipping platty fire weds entirely until velium?

[Samoht]

Ogre also has the highest base HP and AC among all races.

This just isn't true, lol.

First, there's no real AC difference. AGI may change the amount of AC displayed, but it's negligible, and ogres are not going to be top AGI. Second, iksar will get a displayed AC bonus, but once again, it's also negligible.

Next, HP while leveling might be slightly higher, but at level 60, all warriors cap STA at 255 and wear the same gear, so stats are... say it with me now... negligible. The only exception is CHA.

At the end of the day, picking a race based on stats alone may make the game easier to start, but it will not matter by the time you're raiding. STR may make looting easier when you're collecting crushbone belts, but you will pretty much be capped on any melee character while grouped or raiding when you're 50+.

So there's really 3 things to consider:

1) Do you want to take advantage of stats/racials to make leveling easier? If so, pick troll, ogre, iksar.
2) Do you want to have access to skills that warriors otherwise would not have like sneak or castable haste? Pick halfling for sneak+hide, gnome for haste, dark elf for hide (lol), wood elf for wtforage.
3) Do you want to look a certain way? Being a large race sucks in a lot of places, so a cobalt bracer would be necessary. Having access to a guise helps offset the size problem, too, but they will not be readily available on every server.

There's no fault to picking any specific path, tho. they've all got their perks. Don't take shit from anybody else.

At the end of the day, the only person you have to answer to for your decision is yourself.

[Troxx]

Samoht = Jesus

Listen to this man!

[spoil]

Are you skipping platty fire weds entirely until velium?

At the moment they're like 1k/pair, compared to >200 for the golden rings.

I have some good pieces but I haven't been farming guards or something with the quick respawn. Some people really made bank before Secrets nerfed it.

[Duik]

Samoht = Jesus

Listen to this man!

Jesus wore sandals so unless he was a monk his AC prolly sucked. Other than that, info was indeed gold.

[spoil]

Got to 11 with a nice stash of gnoll fangs for when I'm ready to leave BB. My defense is capped and most of my combat skills. I've been using slam over kick, mainly because the stun is useful for fleeing mobs when I can't pull near a green one.

Any smart plays for using my training points now or down the line?

[Jimjam]

I dumped my points into archery, but it hasn’t really helped afaik. Didn’t find a half decent bow yet though.

[Samoht]

I wouldn't spend points on combat stuff. You don't really even need archery skill unless you're zerker bow kiting.

The most important thing to spend points on is going to be bind wound so that you use fewer bandages and hit the cap sooner.

There's no real reason to save points, tho. At 60 they just sit there until you want to learn languages or work on tradeskills, but a lot of tradeskills are really easy to start without dropping points. Plus you can only train up to like 20.

[Jimjam]

Do kited mobs have higher regen on Quarm? Or just high base regen?

A while back I was kiting a level 20 rogue doing about 6-10 damage every 5 seconds or so and it's regen easily laughed it off. I'd have thought they'd only do 1/tick at that level.

I remember being able to kite down hill giants at 17 on test server (admittedly with a trueshot longbow instead of a basic longbow). Doesn't feel right that xp mobs were undentable.

[Jimjam]

Sorry, I got a further Quarm warrior related post, so I hope yu don't mind me dropping it in here-

on p99 off hand weapons with procs are decent when duall wield skill is low (as the procs can still happen even when dual wield fails to cause a swing).

I've noticed that on Quarm procs only happen in offhand at the same time as a swing. Is the successful proc check forcing a swing, or is it only possible to proc on a successful dual wield?

Anyone already worked it out before I go off the deepend?

[spoil]

Think an exe axe 25/50 is better than dual-wielding SSOY 8/24? Level 22, too low for either proc.

[Jimjam]

Imo dw is pretty crap at low skill, but really you want to be swapping every couple of levels to keep those skills capped.

If I had to choose I’d take the exe axe cos low delay weapons will devour your hp when facing damage shields (lots of these at fungus mutant, najena and on barbed bone skeletons - all likely targets for your XPing).

[Duik]

Deepend deepend.

[Zuranthium]

Think an exe axe 25/50 is better than dual-wielding SSOY 8/24? Level 22, too low for either proc.

Weapon swapping to an offhand Kicsh Der Pavz inbetween swings of the Executioner's Axe is best.

Brazen Brass Kilij, Sharkjaw Cutlass, and Shield of the Slain Unicorn are also good for the offhand, same base damage just no proc.

[spoil]

Can bash mitigate any incoming damage, like besides interrupting a spell? Or is there basically no point to using slam over kick until higher levels when slam has a higher skill cap? I got to level 27 now, one good thing about playing solo is all my skills are capped, I made a kick + taunt macro to keep that leveled as well.

I was reading that on PQ wort pots got a heavy nerf, an 8-second cast time. What will that mean for raiding, will guilds need more warriors or something?

[Jimjam]

They’ll probably lock down serpent blood pots or something instead.