Best SK Race for Questing

[flobee]

Hello all,

Considering rolling a fresh SK explicitly to do a ton of questing. Not all that interested in quickly leveling or really even being efficient with my time. Just want to do a casual tour of all the quests I've just out-leveled in the past. Looking to collect obscure quest gear and probably more or less avoid just EC decking myself out.

Since I'm set on SK for class I'm curious about what race people think would be best for achieving this? I assume Iksar would be a good choice as I seem to recall Cabilis having a ton of quests. Would I have a decent amount of questing to do as a Troll between Grobb/Oggok/Neriak? Or would I be better off with like a Human or Erudite due to faction etc?

Opinions appreciated.

[Encroaching Death]

Going based on feeling, I'd guess either Erudite, Dark Elf, Iksar, or Human.

Iksar has cool armor quests and Greenmist, Erudites have the weird ERU only items, Paineel stuff. Humans boil people.

[Allishia]

Ogre is min max cause no stun from front helps with spells.

Troll for Regen+ ability to use clickys.

Iksar has greenmist and Regen..but no fd pants (kunark armor click).

Dark elf for fashion which is really all that matters.

[Sarleon8503]

If you want to do a LONG quest, pick Iksar for the Greenmist quest. It is close to being an epic quest. Iksars also have the Dreadforge armor questline.

I am not 100% with the other races, but I think Erudites having some form of quests. Humans likely have some questing choices, but largely based on diety.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Troll if you mostly solo, Ogre if you prefer to group/raid.

Troll Regen on a Shadowknight specifically is going to give you way more bang for your buck when soloing over FSI. You will have a lot less downtime, and similar starting stats to an Ogre. You are going to be fear kiting a lot of the time, which means you aren't getting hit much, so FSI isn't doing a lot for you.

FSI becomes better in group/raid situations, because racial regeneration isn't very fast. You will probably have a healer, and they are going to be keeping you at safe HP levels, not your regeneration.

Iksar is generally the worst choice because you can't use Blood Ember clickies. Greenmist is not a very good weapon, and will get replaced by better ones. It's also not worth it to try and stack Epic + Greenmist. You will only get like 100 extra HP over simply procing Epic twice in a short timespan, and you will probably end up losing more HP due to losing DPS while swinging Greenmist.

EDIT: Quest-wise you can fix your faction on any race, so race isn't really a hard requirement, with the exception of Greenmist since it is Iksar only. So if doing the maximum number of quests possible is your primary goal, then maybe Iksar is the right choice. But you may regret it later if that goal changes.

[Danth]

Greenmist is not a very good weapon

What?? That's a heck of a "hot take," applicable only to a small portion of the player base. Remember that not everyone has interest in raiding north wing Tempole Veeshan. Most people do not reach level 60 at all. Most those who do reach level 60 do not raid at the high-end to a particularly great extent. The folks awash in high-end items are a minority of a minority. Greenmist is one of the best weapons out there for lower- and mid-range players and is at or near the best weapon a lot of those iksar shadowknights will ever have access to, and certainly one of the few that offers meaningful self-healing.

Iksars are a good choice for someone who wants to do a lot of the game's quests because Kunark and Cabilis was generally more fleshed out than the old world. The other races, any of them can do Darkforge. Dark elves get the Thex Mallet quest; Dark elves, humans, and erudites can all double-dip the necromancer quests their respective guilds offer. Humans can start in Qeynos which is the most-developed of the old world cities with a fair amount of low-level quests. I don't recollect anything particularly inspiring from the ogre or troll areas. Their areas always felt somewhat under-developed to me compared to the others.

Danth

[Encroaching Death]

What?? That's a heck of a "hot take,"

If you're only going by damage, it's slightly better than an Ebon Mace.

But it's a cool weapon. I like it. I wouldn't call it "bad".

[Danth]

A Shiny Brass Halberd is not a very good weapon in this era. Dark Reavers are also pretty outdated. An Ebon Mace is fine. Greenmist is excellent. I feel like some of the folks on this board are terrified of doing Blackburrow unless they have a 1:1 ratio weapon in their hands.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

What?? That's a heck of a "hot take," applicable only to a small portion of the player base. Remember that not everyone has interest in raiding north wing Tempole Veeshan. Most people do not reach level 60 at all. Most those who do reach level 60 do not raid at the high-end to a particularly great extent. The folks awash in high-end items are a minority of a minority. Greenmist is one of the best weapons out there for lower- and mid-range players and is at or near the best weapon a lot of those iksar shadowknights will ever have access to, and certainly one of the few that offers meaningful self-healing.

Iksars are a good choice for someone who wants to do a lot of the game's quests because Kunark and Cabilis was generally more fleshed out than the old world. The other races, any of them can do Darkforge. Dark elves get the Thex Mallet quest; Dark elves, humans, and erudites can all double-dip the necromancer quests their respective guilds offer. Humans can start in Qeynos which is the most-developed of the old world cities with a fair amount of low-level quests. I don't recollect anything particularly inspiring from the ogre or troll areas. Their areas always felt somewhat under-developed to me compared to the others.

Danth

Ebon Mace, Reaver, Shard of Night, and Argent Protector are all great weapons that are fairly cheap to buy. All of these weapons are easily obtainable by a casual player just farming plat by killing guards.

Greenmist really isn't very good sadly, even taking into account the proc. Having a Reaver + Blood Ember Gloves is going to be better than Greenmist.

The reason why Greenmist is a worse weapon compared to the ones I mentioned above is because you lose access to Blood Ember clickies. Those are going to help you way more than the proc from Greenmist. Shadowknights are constrained by their mana, so having a free snare clickie is huge. The ratios on all the weapons mentioned above (besides Ebon Mace) are also better than Greenmist. Ebon Mace isn't far off, its a 0.79 ratio compared to Greenmist's 0.82.

[Sarleon8503]

So about the questing, since that looks to be what this thread is about. I would say Iksar have the MOST race specific quests for Shadow Knights. However, a lot of random quests that don't look to be race specific. Hope this helps ya out.


Here are some quests that I can think of.
https://wiki.project1999.com/Ridossan%27s_Spirit
https://wiki.project1999.com/Darkforge_Armor_Quests

Erudite:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Experienced_Courier

Dark Elf:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Thex_Mallet_Quest

Iksar:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Dreadscale_Armor
https://wiki.project1999.com/Crusader%27s_Tests

[Snaggles]

I’m confused. Did anyone read the last two words of the thread topic?

If you are looking or do old-world quests at 55 even an iksar can do some via Shroud or Undeath. It lets you vendor in Oggok and Grobb too. You have the entire quest line from Cabalis including the very cool Greenmist and all the armor that are mid-level good.

Probably a human or erudite would let you do the widest variety though. They can faction up with almost anything. They are KoS in Oggok and Grobb but not with the sk GM’s. Again skeleton (shroud of undeath) or wolf form is a slight faction boost to start off quests with there. They don’t have issues in Neriak nor do trolls and ogres (iksars will without illusion or faction work).

All sk races except iksar can hang out in the Overthere outpost and grind the OT gate-mallet quest. Most Iksars will need to pay for a puppet strings charm click.

Good luck. Most faction is a temporary setback.

[Danth]

Picking iksar specifcally for Greenmist would be silly, I agree. It's not the item's fault if a person makes a decision for the wrong reasons. If a player's going to pick iksar anyway because he likes iksars, then other click items are moot and Greenmist is a very good available option for him to eventually work towards.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

So about the questing, since that looks to be what this thread is about. I would say Iksar have the MOST race specific quests for Shadow Knights. However, a lot of random quests that don't look to be race specific. Hope this helps ya out.


Here are some quests that I can think of.
https://wiki.project1999.com/Ridossan%27s_Spirit
https://wiki.project1999.com/Darkforge_Armor_Quests

Erudite:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Experienced_Courier

Dark Elf:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Thex_Mallet_Quest

Iksar:
https://wiki.project1999.com/Dreadscale_Armor
https://wiki.project1999.com/Crusader%27s_Tests

Any race can do any quest. You just need to adjust your faction. Some quests like Greenmist and Dreadscale Armor are only wearable by Iksar, but you could still do the quest for fun. So it depends on how much OP wants to rely on the gear he gets from questing vs. just doing the quests for fun. Darkforge and Dreadscale are comparable armor sets, so you could roll a Troll, do Darkforge, and then do Dreadscale later.

Iksar is definately not a bad choice if your primary goal is doing quests and wearing the items obtained from said quests, but again they are generally speaking one of the worst Shadowknight races due to not being able to wear Blood Ember. Just making sure OP understands the tradeoff.

Plenty of people start a character with a goal in mind, but change over time due to Everquest being such a long game. The more info OP has, the better. Less chance of regret later on.

Picking iksar specifcally for Greenmist would be silly, I agree. It's not the item's fault if a person makes a decision for the wrong reasons. If a player's going to pick iksar anyway because he likes iksars, then other click items are moot and Greenmist is a very good available option for him to eventually work towards.

Agreed!

[Snaggles]

The Greenmist comment is odd.

It’s a self-healing (2x a fungi when rolling) DoT that does 5dps. The weapon is solid fashion and 1h ratio. It has 25 friggin MR on it. SK’s just got a huge aggro nerf and the proc is an aggro one. It’s prob the best 1h tanking weapon outside a Jeldorin that only paladins can use.

1h’s are low dps. I haven’t used my Frostwrath in months. In the world of EQ fantasy drafts if I could trade it for a Greenmist for my paladin I would in a heartbeat.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

The Greenmist comment is odd.

It’s a self-healing (2x a fungi when rolling) DoT that does 5dps. The weapon is solid fashion and 1h ratio. It has 25 friggin MR on it. SK’s just got a huge aggro nerf and the proc is an aggro one. It’s prob the best 1h tanking weapon outside a Jeldorin that only paladins can use.

1h’s are low dps. I haven’t used my Frostwrath in months. In the world of EQ fantasy drafts if I could trade it for a Greenmist for my paladin I would in a heartbeat.

Blood Ember Gloves are going to save you more time than the regeneration you get from Greenmist. Time is what you are aiming to save when discussing HP/Mana regeneration.

Ratio-wise it isn't better than the Shard of Night, Reaver, or Argent Protector, all of which are easily obtainable by a casual player.

If you are an Iksar, as Danth said, you might as well get it. But Arget Proector + Blood Ember clickes is better from a time saving perspective than Greenmist with it's proc.

[Snaggles]

All those 1hs are going to be close on dps because 1h sucks for dps. Those are droppable the Greenmist isn’t so again bad comparison. The Argent Protector is garbage, it’s a slow weapon that isn’t even the ratio of an Exquisite 2h.

Blood ember gloves are handy but it’s a 4 sec cast. You likely won’t use for solo and in groups clinging works fine and is cheap and fast. With the aggro nerf it’s prob the go-to spell to replace DC anyways. In most groups with even slightly difficult content druids and rangers are snaring anyways.

The greenmist is objectively a good weapon for tanking and some solo work (if only for a proc on runners). You can figure this out with a calculator.

Again the OP is asking for quest info. The Greemist is an extensive and cool quest. Let’s not neckbeard this one into a race war.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

All those 1hs are going to be close on dps because 1h sucks for dps. Those are droppable the Greenmist isn’t so again bad comparison. The Argent Protector is garbage, it’s a slow weapon that isn’t even the ratio of an Exquisite 2h.

Blood ember gloves are handy but it’s a 4 sec cast. You likely won’t use for solo and in groups clinging works fine and is cheap and fast. With the aggro nerf it’s prob the go-to spell to replace DC anyways. In most groups with even slightly difficult content druids and rangers are snaring anyways.

The greenmist is objectively a good weapon for tanking and some some work (if only for a proc on runners). You can figure this out with a calculator.

Argent Protector is a 42/49 weapon. That is a 0.85 ratio, where Greenmist is only 0.82. I believe you thinking of Argent Defender.

I use Blood Ember gloves all the time solo. Their long cast time isn't an issue at all. Shadowknights are most constrained by mana, not by HP. Saving the mana on not having to cast a snare is better than the HP gained from the proc.

You can even pair the gloves and the boots for mana-free fear kiting. I did that quite a bit in open area like Dreadlands.

Every race has access to the SK epic, so just aim for that if you want a lifesteal proc. It is also a cool quest.

[Danth]

For what it's worth there are things the wife and I could duo once my guy got his epic that we could not duo without, and a lot more things where the extra healing was a much larger help than extra damage would've been. Damage and mana saving is great for maximizing experience per hour, but not always best for raising the ceiling of what can be done once the exp bar is pegged. The epic took me over four years, realtime, to do and Greenmist offers similar healing for a much easier quest. It's a nice item for what it is.

Granted, I've come to accept that the above is probably as much or more of an exception than the high-end raiders are. Not very many lower or mid-range players push the limit very much, especially not if you aren't talking about charm classes. More usually at that level of player it's a case of level up then quit to some alt, for which ANY high-end weapons are superfluous.

I assume someone creating a character specifically for questing will quit by level forty if not sooner. Everquest, isn't, beyond the low levels. He might elect to use the character for other purposes later on, admittedly.

Danth

[Snaggles]

I know the difference between an AD and AP…

Sure, a turnkey Greenmist is like 15k. SK epic is like 180k or so if you aren’t in a raiding guild.

A lot of velious quests are fun and not racist against anyone. The gear is actually good. Hope that helps.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I know the difference between an AD and AP…

Sure, a turnkey Greenmist is like 15k. SK epic is like 180k or so if you aren’t in a raiding guild.

Argent Protector + Blood Ember Gloves is like 3K total on Blue if we are going off cost, and that combo will be better than Greenmist.

[Danth]

The main thing I wonder about with Greenmist is how much the extra ripostes generated by the fast speed are going to hurt. I expect taking extra 300's or 400's may in practice counteract much of its self healing, though its 25 AC plus shield AC plus iksar racial AC bonus will also counter-counteract some of that. I don't have an answer, yet! I've never been been able to trial myself against a similarly-equipped iksar shadowknight due to the latter's rarity.

Damage-wise, Greenmist will always outperform its ratio due to its special effect and it gives good account of itself for something that can be held in one hand. It should out-perform Shard of Night and against high AC targets I suspect it will also out perform Darkmetal Falchion or Massive Dragonclaw Shard.

Danth

[DeathsSilkyMist]

The main thing I wonder about with Greenmist is how much the extra ripostes generated by the fast speed are going to hurt. I expect taking extra 300's or 400's may in practice counteract much of its self healing, though its 25 AC plus shield AC plus iksar racial AC bonus will also counter-counteract some of that. I don't have an answer, yet! I've never been been able to trial myself against a similarly-equipped iksar shadowknight due to the latter's rarity.

Damage-wise, Greenmist will always outperform its ratio due to its special effect and it gives good account of itself for something that can be held in one hand. It should out-perform Shard of Night and against high AC targets I suspect it will also out perform Darkmetal Falchion or Massive Dragonclaw Shard.

Danth

It is true that the proc adds a bit of DPS, but the DPS difference will depend on how often you proc it. The other bad thing about Greenmist is the proc is 30 HP per tick over 8 ticks, vs. Epic which is 50 HP per tick over 5 ticks. This means proc overlap is a bigger problem. If you proc Greenmist twice in a minute, you are only gaining 300 HP and doing 300 damage over that minute, instead of the full 480 HP. This is assuming you proc it at 30 second intervals (255 DEX).

[Danth]

Other way 'round in practice because P99's so streaky. You aren't getting those procs in nice 30 second intervals. I've been using Innoruuk's Curse for what, 6 years or so? Either of them will quite often "waste" procs when they fire off back-to-back. Even with maximum DEX the epic effect falls off fairly often. Greenmist would stay on far more consistently--consistently enough that once it fires you can just about plan on it getting that 300/min. With IC I expect my proc uptime is more like 75 per cent or so, maybe a little more, maybe not, but either way they're a lot closer than you might expect at a glance.

I do not know that they're close enough for Greenmist and it's associated higher AC to overcome the difference plus Greenmist's higher incoming riposte rate. That's something I'd like to have trial'd sometime, but I've never had the chance. I know Greenmist is nice, but I don't really know *how* nice it is. I also believe Greenmist's effect lacks a resist modifier, which would harm it in areas with very resistant opponents, like the named in Velketor's castle. Again, I've not had opportunity to witness the true impact of this in practice.

Danth

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Other way 'round in practice because P99's so streaky. You aren't getting those procs in nice 30 second intervals. I've been using Innoruuk's Curse for what, 6 years or so? Either of them will quite often "waste" procs when they fire off back-to-back. Even with maximum DEX the epic effect falls off fairly often. Greenmist would stay on far more consistently--consistently enough that once it fires you can just about plan on it getting that 300/min. With IC I expect my proc uptime is more like 75 per cent or so, maybe a little more, maybe not, but either way they're a lot closer than you might expect at a glance.

I do not know that they're close enough for Greenmist and it's associated higher AC to overcome the difference plus Greenmist's higher incoming riposte rate. That's something I'd like to have trial'd sometime, but I've never had the chance. I know Greenmist is nice, but I don't really know *how* nice it is.

Danth

Innoruuk's Curse is much more efficient on proc overlap, that is why it feels better. If you proc Innoruuk's curse twice within 12 seconds, you are already getting 350/500 possible damage out of it. You will also get more damage if you proc it within the last three ticks of the minute. This is because it does 50 damage over 5 ticks, so you get more per tick, and it falls off sooner (which is actually good). Innoruuk's Curse can do it's full 500 damage over a minute at 255 DEX.

With greenmist, if you proc it twice within 12 seconds, you are only getting 300/480 possible damage out if it. That is also the ceiling of damage per minute, since that would be 10 ticks already.

How long the proc stays on is never really a benefit, since you won't be at full life in a fight anyway. The only good thing about Greenmist is the longer proc means it will apply the debuff a bit longer. But the debuff is pretty small, so I would be surprised if it made any significant difference.

[Snaggles]

Ripostes almost dont matter at all, even tanking like HoT at 60. Let alone blue con xp stuff.

I wouldnt say the GM is better than the epic (not even close). Better proc, way better dps with the last iteration of the damage bonus. But as a pleb tanking weapon that goes well with a flurry or Sevelak shield the GM is solid. 25 MR again is really nice. Even if it doesnt land the proc does aggro, again...great.

It's a brilliantly fun quest. I just wish I didnt dislike iksars and especially their 2h swing animation. If I had a RL buddy who wanted to start the same race and do a bunch of the town quests id go Iksar all the way, probably do all the armor quests too. Plus grinding in HK wouldnt be so friggin annoying since you actually fit in the hallways.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Ripostes almost dont matter at all, even tanking like HoT at 60. Let alone blue con xp stuff.

I wouldnt say the GM is better than the epic (not even close). Better proc, way better dps with the last iteration of the damage bonus. But as a pleb tanking weapon that goes well with a flurry or Sevelak shield the GM is solid. 25 MR again is really nice. Even if it doesnt land the proc does aggro, again...great.

It's a brilliantly fun quest. I just wish I didnt dislike iksars and especially their 2h swing animation. If I had a RL buddy who wanted to start the same race and do a bunch of the town quests id go Iksar all the way, probably do all the armor quests too. Plus grinding in HK wouldnt be so friggin annoying since you actually fit in the hallways.

Oh yeah, I am sure the quest is fun. I have considered making an Iksar SK and doing something similar to what OP wants to do (rely on drops/quests). I just don't have the time, and I think I would miss Blood Ember items too much. I honestly wish Greenmist was better, because then it would offset the lack of Blood Ember more.

I think what Danth was talking about in terms of Riposte is how much extra damage you take vs. what you heal. Greenmist is basically giving you 300 HP/Minute assuming you proc twice per minute. But if you are fighting a mob that does 140 damage per hit, you may end up taking at least 280 damage in that minute by triggering two more ripostes. So Danth wants to know if using a 1H sword like Greenmist would end up causing enough Ripostes to cancel out the healing. I don't think he was suggesting you need to heavily worry about Ripostes in general. If that is the case, then technically you aren't getting any healing with Greenmist when compared to using a 2h weapon like Argent Protector. At that point you are just getting 300 damage per minute via the procs.

However, when soloing you will typically be fear kiting anyway. This means you aren't going to be riposted much, but you also are not going to need the Greenmist's healing as much. Fear kiting is the reason why Blood Ember typically out-performs the Greenmist DoT. Saving a bunch of mana on Snare and/or Fear means you can spend more time fear kiting, and less time meditating. Mana is the bottleneck when fear kiting typically, not HP, because fear kiting heavily reduces how much damage you take.

[Danth]

You're right, Shamwowi, in how I am thinking of Riposte. Except I'm thinking more in terms of 300/400 hitters you'll face in higehr-end duo/trio areas. One extra riposte here and there from something like that would potentially cancel out most of Greenmist's healing.

There's something to factor in for AC as well. A typical lower- or mid-range player won't have access to Temple Veeshan drops, so usually you see a Greenmist paired with an Atramentous Shield. 25 AC on the Greenmist plus 28 on the shield is 79 or 80 displayed AC in-game, plus another what, 40 or so from Iksar racial benefit? He'll have well over 100 more AC than a comparable Troll/Human/Etc who wields Innoruuk's Curse. That has to account for something and should counteract some of the extra riposte damage. Probably we'd have to try a couple of similar shadowknights side by side to see its true effectiveness. I don't know any Iksars. The ones I did have long since stopped logging in.

I'll say this, I like my IC just fine. I borrowed a Reaver once and the IC was more damage over time due to the proc being worth more than the 5 delay.

Danth

[Crede]

Oh yeah, I am sure the quest is fun. I have considered making an Iksar SK and doing something similar to what OP wants to do (rely on drops/quests). I just don't have the time, and I think I would miss Blood Ember items too much. I honestly wish Greenmist was better, because then it would offset the lack of Blood Ember more.

I think what Danth was talking about in terms of Riposte is how much extra damage you take vs. what you heal. Greenmist is basically giving you 300 HP/Minute assuming you proc twice per minute. But if you are fighting a mob that does 140 damage per hit, you may end up taking at least 280 damage in that minute by triggering two more ripostes. So Danth wants to know if using a 1H sword like Greenmist would end up causing enough Ripostes to cancel out the healing. I don't think he was suggesting you need to heavily worry about Ripostes in general. If that is the case, then technically you aren't getting any healing with Greenmist when compared to using a 2h weapon like Argent Protector. At that point you are just getting 300 damage per minute via the procs.

However, when soloing you will typically be fear kiting anyway. This means you aren't going to be riposted much, but you also are not going to need the Greenmist's healing as much. Fear kiting is the reason why Blood Ember typically out-performs the Greenmist DoT. Saving a bunch of mana on Snare and/or Fear means you can spend more time fear kiting, and less time meditating. Mana is the bottleneck when fear kiting typically, not HP, because fear kiting heavily reduces how much damage you take.

I've done 4 different SK builds(someday I might finish off with DE & Erudite).

The Greenmist was a somewhat enjoyable quest if you're into that, but I ended up quitting due to Iksar animations. Both the bash spin animation & the 2hs(even after the user fix) are still bad. Iksars only good animations IMO are the 2hb & 2h pierce.

I would agree at how useful the Blood Ember clickies are, which paired with epic are even better. The blood ember clickies are really incredible that I would not recommend anyone going iksar, the gloves/pants are free splits all day long. The boots are a good tool to use in conjunction with undead fears to balance mana. My troll SK would usually cycle in epic usually when the mob fleed and I would back the pet off as well. I had around 170 dex so I had pretty good rng with procs. Between blood ember, crown of narandi, fungi, and epic, I could go for a long time without running oom. The epic procs allow you to do some tanking as well to save mana. To just fear kite 24/7 is silly, it is really a balancing act of managing hp/mana. SKs can out xp any other melee if you know where to go. It's an amazing class that unfortunately aren't utilized much in raids but that shouldn't stop anyone from playing one.

[Keebz]

I wanna Erudite or Iksar.

Erudite: gets erudite noob quests and warrens/stonebrunt stuff. Decent faction means you should be able to do most of the old world quests with minimal work.

Iksar: gets access to sweet Iksar quests. Theoretically can do old world quests with enough faction work and time.

Honorable mention DE: they can do all the evil-race quests pretty easily and maybe some quests in Freeport. Unfortunately there are not a ton of these.

[Crede]

I wanna Erudite or Iksar.

Erudite: gets erudite noob quests and warrens/stonebrunt stuff. Decent faction means you should be able to do most of the old world quests with minimal work.

Iksar: gets access to sweet Iksar quests. Theoretically can do old world quests with enough faction work and time.

Honorable mention DE: they can do all the evil-race quests pretty easily and maybe some quests in Freeport. Unfortunately there are not a ton of these.

Erudite has cool lore and Odus is a neat continent, you could spend a ton of time there leveling between warrens, kerra, stonebrunt, and the hole if you have some gear for solo stuff. Could also go over to qeynos. Def go female though.

DE are also cool, but just so common. Iksars have terrible animations.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I've done 4 different SK builds(someday I might finish off with DE & Erudite).

The Greenmist was a somewhat enjoyable quest if you're into that, but I ended up quitting due to Iksar animations. Both the bash spin animation & the 2hs(even after the user fix) are still bad. Iksars only good animations IMO are the 2hb & 2h pierce.

I would agree at how useful the Blood Ember clickies are, which paired with epic are even better. The blood ember clickies are really incredible that I would not recommend anyone going iksar, the gloves/pants are free splits all day long. The boots are a good tool to use in conjunction with undead fears to balance mana. My troll SK would usually cycle in epic usually when the mob fleed and I would back the pet off as well. I had around 170 dex so I had pretty good rng with procs. Between blood ember, crown of narandi, fungi, and epic, I could go for a long time without running oom. The epic procs allow you to do some tanking as well to save mana. To just fear kite 24/7 is silly, it is really a balancing act of managing hp/mana. SKs can out xp any other melee if you know where to go. It's an amazing class that unfortunately aren't utilized much in raids but that shouldn't stop anyone from playing one.

Agreed!

[Keebz]

Oh yea there's the cool bertox stuff in qeynos as well. I think you can do all those quests as a erudite, but not sure. Assuming erud can do both, that's a nod over human/bertox.

[flobee]

Thanks all for the feedback!

[Sweeper41]

Ebon Mace, Reaver, Shard of Night, and Argent
Greenmist really isn't very good sadly, even taking into account the proc. Having a Reaver + Blood Ember Gloves is going to be better than Greenmist.

The reason why Greenmist is a worse weapon compared to the ones I mentioned above is because you lose access to Blood Ember clickies. Those are going to help you way more than the proc from Greenmist. Shadowknights are constrained by their mana, so having a free snare clickie is huge. The ratios on all the weapons mentioned above (besides Ebon Mace) are also better than Greenmist. Ebon Mace isn't far off, its a 0.79 ratio compared to Greenmist's 0.82.

Disagree. You do not need any blood ember to solo to 60. Greenmist proc is worth cause it can stack with other weapon procs, so you just switch out when you get one. Greenmist is easy to obtain if you put in the work and buy 1 MQ for around 4k.

Also a casual doesn't have the 30k+ to drop on pants they would only use to save themselves 60 mana. Also having to switch pants just to click during some kinda near death encounter will just get you killed. Blood Ember is overrated. Fun to have but you already have all the tools you need in your spell book.

[Sweeper41]

I've done 4 different SK builds(someday I might finish off with DE & Erudite).

The Greenmist was a somewhat enjoyable quest if you're into that, but I ended up quitting due to Iksar animations. Both the bash spin animation & the 2hs(even after the user fix) are still bad. Iksars only good animations IMO are the 2hb & 2h pierce.

I would agree at how useful the Blood Ember clickies are, which paired with epic are even better. The blood ember clickies are really incredible that I would not recommend anyone going iksar, the gloves/pants are free splits all day long. The boots are a good tool to use in conjunction with undead fears to balance mana. My troll SK would usually cycle in epic usually when the mob fleed and I would back the pet off as well. I had around 170 dex so I had pretty good rng with procs. Between blood ember, crown of narandi, fungi, and epic, I could go for a long time without running oom. The epic procs allow you to do some tanking as well to save mana. To just fear kite 24/7 is silly, it is really a balancing act of managing hp/mana. SKs can out xp any other melee if you know where to go. It's an amazing class that unfortunately aren't utilized much in raids but that shouldn't stop anyone from playing one.

You talk like players can't survive without it. Please. Fun to have but you do not need any of that armor. Also switching pants everytime you want to FD is annoying. Money is better spend on a pre nerf CoS or Crown then any Blood Ember. I never had mana issues even before I got a crown.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Disagree. You do not need any blood ember to solo to 60. Greenmist proc is worth cause it can stack with other weapon procs, so you just switch out when you get one. Greenmist is easy to obtain if you put in the work and buy 1 MQ for around 4k.

Also a casual doesn't have the 30k+ to drop on pants they would only use to save themselves 60 mana. Also having to switch pants just to click during some kinda near death encounter will just get you killed. Blood Ember is overrated. Fun to have but you already have all the tools you need in your spell book.

Blood Ember is still useful at 60, and it isn't difficult to get a better ratio weapon or Epic by the time you hit 60.

Greenmist is more overrated than Blood Ember. Mana is the bottleneck on an SK, not generally HP. Blood Ember saves you a lot of mana, where Greenmist doesn't.

If you are fighting a mob that cannot be feared (where Blood Ember is useless), you are generally doing solo challenge stuff, and at that point you are probably raid geared, which probably means you have your Epic. Casual players aren't going to be soloing Cliff Golems.

I do agree if you are specifically making an SK with the purpose of never reaching level 60, Greenmist can be fun to get. But you will feel the loss of Blood Ember at lower levels too, so it isn't a clean win.

[Toxigen]

Disagree. You do not need any blood ember to solo to 60. Greenmist proc is worth cause it can stack with other weapon procs, so you just switch out when you get one. Greenmist is easy to obtain if you put in the work and buy 1 MQ for around 4k.

Also a casual doesn't have the 30k+ to drop on pants they would only use to save themselves 60 mana. Also having to switch pants just to click during some kinda near death encounter will just get you killed. Blood Ember is overrated. Fun to have but you already have all the tools you need in your spell book.

FD has a 15 second recast time and it can fail, making blood ember good.

Sorry you don't got 30k hope this helped.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

FD has a 15 second recast time and it can fail, making blood ember good.

Sorry you don't got 30k hope this helped.

Exactly. You save mana on FD too by using the pants. It adds up if you are pulling a lot, or getting unlucky.

[Danth]

Blood Ember legs are a near-miraculous lifesaver through 59 for that reason, and even at 60 during Kunark. Once you're 60 in a Velious setting, Death Peace has a 4 second recast, reducing Blood Ember to the status of mana-saver during the splitting phase of a camp.

On the other hand I'm not overly impressed with my insta-click circlet that I've had for the past decade-plus, either. I wouldn't sell it, but if I log on the wife's 55 SK alt which does NOT have one, neither do I miss the thing overmuch. No single one of these types of items could be called necessary. Blood ember is nice because it can stack with other pieces or other mana saving items; the cumulative effect of saving 60 mana here, 60 there, maybe some worn regen, can add up to a fair reduction in time spent meditating.

(edit) To be sure, the effect that saving meditate time has on a player depends on what he's doing. At 60, more or less timing named, who cares about an extra couple minutes spent sitting? So, no, it doesn't necessarily matter in all cases, just access to those click effects is an option the iksar uniquely lacks in return for what I might call a nice but not world-shattering pseudo-epic.

Danth

[Toxigen]

Blood Ember legs are a near-miraculous lifesaver through 59 for that reason, and even at 60 during Kunark. Once you're 60 in a Velious setting, Death Peace has a 4 second recast, reducing Blood Ember to the status of mana-saver during the splitting phase of a camp.

On the other hand I'm not overly impressed with my insta-click circlet that I've had for the past decade-plus, either. I wouldn't sell it, but if I log on the wife's 55 SK alt which does NOT have one, neither do I miss the thing overmuch. No single one of these types of items could be called necessary. Blood ember is nice because it can stack with other pieces or other mana saving items; the cumulative effect of saving 60 mana here, 60 there, maybe some worn regen, can add up to a fair reduction in time spent meditating.

(edit) To be sure, the effect that saving meditate time has on a player depends on what he's doing. At 60, more or less timing named, who cares about an extra couple minutes spent sitting? So, no, it doesn't necessarily matter in all cases, just access to those click effects is an option the iksar uniquely lacks in return for what I might call a nice but not world-shattering pseudo-epic.

Danth

Agreed, especially with pre nerf CoS.

I leveled my necro a while back with one...sure it was nice but I was never in a single scenario where it saved me an immense amount.

Maybe I'm just a better player...but I did do a ton of undead charming where the regular invis wasn't going to help anyway. It wound up being a luxury / travel item that freed up a spell slot.

Your situational awareness / "plan of attack"...positioning, awareness of mob pathing routes, respawns, etc...is going to be far more valuable than any one single item (except maybe stuff like fungi, Z heart, and narandi crown).

Play more efficiently.

[Ennewi]

You talk like players can't survive without it. Please. Fun to have but you do not need any of that armor. Also switching pants everytime you want to FD is annoying. Money is better spend on a pre nerf CoS or Crown then any Blood Ember. I never had mana issues even before I got a crown.

Blood Embers aren't crucial must-haves, though it doesn't seem like anyone was suggesting that. Blood Embers also aren't frivolous toys. They're a perk. Once the player can afford them, why not get them? SKs tend to know ahead of time when FD will be needed, but can also put them in the same easily identifiable bag so there isn't a frantic search for the clicky in emergencies. Sowed and training down into the Hole to reach mimics or fallen erudites? Swap in BE legs or keep them on cursor. Dragging corpses after a group wipe but LOM with pathing mobs all over? BE legs. Raid is wiping and OOM due to mana drain? BE legs again.

[Ripqozko]

Blood Embers aren't crucial must-haves, though it doesn't seem like anyone was suggesting that. Blood Embers also aren't frivolous toys. They're a perk. Once the player can afford them, why not get them? SKs tend to know ahead of time when FD will be needed, but can also put them in the same easily identifiable bag so there isn't a frantic search for the clicky in emergencies. Sowed and training down into the Hole to reach mimics or fallen erudites? Swap in BE legs or keep them on cursor. Dragging corpses after a group wipe but LOM with pathing mobs all over? BE legs. Raid is wiping and OOM due to mana drain? BE legs again.

or you can afk and let the rogue do it, then go make a sammich. i prefer the sammich.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Yeah I am not sure where this weird idea comes from where people think we are saying you "can't survive" unless you have X item or racial. I have never claimed this, nor do I see other people doing so. We are simply discussing which perks are better, for people who care about that sort of thing. If you don't care, don't worry:)

[Ennewi]

or you can afk and let the rogue do it, then go make a sammich. i prefer the sammich.

https://i.imgur.com/XdlNrDR.gif

[Keebz]

For Raiding, the BE clickies are almost useless--once in a very blue moon BE legs will be clutch though. For Solo/group, it depends, but I'm maybe using gloves/legs a handful of times. If grouped, I'd probably have clarity and solo I am often in call of bones form so the mana savings are less a concern. They are all occasionally useful, but it's not like I use them all the time. In all settings, however, I do get hit a fuck ton, so extra Iksar AC would theoretically be tight, but idk how noticeable it would be.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

For Raiding, the BE clickies are almost useless--once in a very blue moon BE legs will be clutch though. For Solo/group, it depends, but I'm maybe using gloves/legs a handful of times. If grouped, I'd probably have clarity and solo I am often in call of bones form so the mana savings are less a concern. They are all occasionally useful, but it's not like I use them all the time. In all settings, however, I do get hit a fuck ton, so extra Iksar AC would theoretically be tight, but idk how noticeable it would be.

Agreed. You are correct that in theory an Iksar is the best raiding race, due to them having the best mitigation possible, and you won't be using Blood Ember (or Greenmist) anyway.

However, Shadowknights are the worst raiding class in the game. You should never really be aiming to min/max a Shadowknight for raiding hehe. Blood Ember is going to be superior to Iksar mitigation and Greenmist in most solo/group situations. Solo/group is where you want to min/max as a Shadowknight.

[Jimjam]

Minmax SK is 8 10 slot bags full of bone chips for pet tracking :)

[Keebz]

SK is somewhat limited, but also underrated. Great at tagging, can do train outs, can tank 32k stuff just fine, etc. For example, when lots of wanding is involved in a messy pull, sometimes the decisiveness of a nice shadow vortex works wonders. Unfortunately, most hybrid tanks want to be _tanks_ for velious raid mobs, which is generally _not_ on the menu.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

SK is somewhat limited, but also underrated. Great at tagging, can do train outs, can tank 32k stuff just fine, etc. For example, when lots of wanding is involved in a messy pull, sometimes the decisiveness of a nice shadow vortex works wonders. Unfortunately, most hybrid tanks want to be _tanks_ for velious raid mobs, which is generally _not_ on the menu.

I agree they are underrated. And they see a bit more play in VP, which is nice. I am just saying generally speaking SK's are scorned in raids. You are logging onto a guild bot more than doing SK specific things hehe. So I wouldn't recommend min/maxing for raiding, unless your dream is to specifically make the best SK raider there is.

The problem is Necromancers can pull in the same manner that SK's can, but they have access to Harmshield and DA Earring. That makes them the better option most of the time. Shadowknights would be MUCH stronger in raids if they had access to Harmshield, since they would basically just be a tankier Necro with more FDs. Un-nerfing lifetaps would help a ton too. They need to just nerf Ivandyrs Hoop instead of nerfing all lifetaps IMO.

[Keebz]

Harmshield and sight graft would be killer for sure, but death peace and general tankiness is a real advantage over necro for tagging/pulling in raid zones. Necros excel much more at bone walking and DA training. They don't really overlap in roles except for the occasional train away.

[Crede]

Harmshield and sight graft would be killer for sure, but death peace and general tankiness is a real advantage over necro for tagging/pulling in raid zones. Necros excel much more at bone walking and DA training. They don't really overlap in roles except for the occasional train away.

Sks really got the shaft on spells compared to a Necro when you look at a pally compared to a cleric which basically get a lesser form of everything besides blur. They really shoulda given them harmshield, call of bones(yes I know there’s a weapon) and sight graft.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Sks really got the shaft on spells compared to a Necro when you look at a pally compared to a cleric which basically get a lesser form of everything besides blur. They really shoulda given them harmshield, call of bones(yes I know there’s a weapon) and sight graft.

Agreed. When you need a tanky puller, Monks generally fit the bill. When you need a DA puller with a pet, Necros generally fit the bill. SK's are just in a weird middle ground where they don't have a good tank disc, and they don't have any DA abilities outside of Idol.

[Crede]

Agreed. When you need a tanky puller, Monks generally fit the bill. When you need a DA puller with a pet, Necros generally fit the bill. SK's are just in a weird middle ground where they don't have a good tank disc, and they don't have any DA abilities outside of Idol.

Yea it wasn’t until later where SKs and aoe taunt made them pretty much essential to win raids.

[ya.dingus]

isnt death peace a non-fail fd?

[Jimjam]

Idk. You can fuck up fd even when it don’t fail. Human error is a thing.

[Toxigen]

Idk. You can fuck up fd even when it don’t fail. Human error is a thing.

casters

[Encroaching Death]

casters

I strut along with the iron-clad safety of Feign Death with utmost confidence.

Then I accidently aggro five wizard caster mobs deep in a dungeon and suddenly realize I am mortal.

And shit my pants.

[Toxigen]

I strut along with the iron-clad safety of Feign Death with utmost confidence.

Then I accidently aggro five wizard caster mobs deep in a dungeon and suddenly realize I am mortal.

And shit my pants.

I do all this except I shit my pants first.

[Encroaching Death]

I do all this except I shit my pants first.

Better to stew in the shit, than shit in the stew

[greatdane]

Sks really got the shaft on spells compared to a Necro when you look at a pally compared to a cleric which basically get a lesser form of everything besides blur. They really shoulda given them harmshield, call of bones(yes I know there’s a weapon) and sight graft.

They did later on, just not in this timeline :( Harmshield is actually a level 50 SK spell starting in... Luclin? PoP? And they get the skelly lines eventually.

[pasi]

Harmshield was a little over a month before PoP launch.

SK got a mini lich in the form of deathly temptation in Luclin. The Yelinak sword was still better though.

SKs were trash from Kunark to Omens of War.

[greatdane]

We were gods on PvP servers during Luclin and PoP. Every 72 minutes, anyway.

[pasi]

Super HT (PoP, Luclin was Leech Touch) and Touch of Innoruuk were pretty incredible for that, yeah.

It was nice of them to throw knights a bone with a free Emp/Seru horse too.

[rubicaant]

Most fun i've ever had is questing Dreadscale and Greenmist, feels so immersive. If you're a relatively new player or at least not loaded/high end, these items will last a long while also. And while Greenmist doesn't have the highest end stats possible, the 25 MR is super nice, and an excellent proc while leveling.