What's the point of playing Ranger?

[Gugg]

Isn't a Ranger just a Druid with much weaker spells, no ports, no charm and no quad kiting?

[Andyman1022]

Having fun is the point of playing a ranger.. and fashion.

[Toxigen]

raid target speedbump

[Naethyn]

The first AoW was lost, because the raid did not have call of the predator.

[Gugg]

Having fun is the point of playing a ranger.. and fashion.

So the Ranger class is for the player who wants to be on a catwalk, and has more fun being weak than strong? Or the player who does one good thing on a raid for the 1% once in a blue moon.

And the Druid class is for the player who wants to heal, charm, port and quad kite?

[Naethyn]

Raid speedbumps are a critical role that happen every single week for the very largest targets.

[Gugg]

Raid speedbumps are a critical role that happen every single week for the very largest targets.

What does the Ranger bring to the table L1 through to L60 that a Druid doesn't?

[Encroaching Death]

I love playing my Ranger, but man, does this image explain the class:

https://i.ibb.co/gZ3pvrW/im-helping-memegenerator-net-im-helping-ralph-wiggum-meme-53948604.png

[Encroaching Death]

Ranger: "What is my purpose?"

Rick Sanchez: "You take DTs."

Ranger: "Oh god..."

Rick Sanchez: "Yeah, join the club."

[Naethyn]

What does the Ranger bring to the table L1 through to L60 that a Druid doesn't?

Ironically druids actually get powerful at 60 when they get potg. Until then I'd almost always want a ranger in my group.

[Encroaching Death]

Ironically druids actually get powerful at 60 when they get potg. Until then I'd almost always want a ranger in my group.

Druids have a much better DS and heals, but besides that, yeah...I'd rather have the reliable melee dps.

[Trelaboon]

Ironically druids actually get powerful at 60 when they get potg. Until then I'd almost always want a ranger in my group.

Even then, a Ranger is better in almost every single aspect of the game outside of raid mobilization.

[Toxigen]

If a druid isn't charming an animal, they're doing it wrong.

Hope this helps.

[Allishia]

Ranger are best bumps, lasting way longer than any other class that can bump+ snap agro. Usually don't need more than 1 or 2 druids on a raid for potg and maybe circles on some targets.

[Encroaching Death]

If a druid isn't charming an animal, they're doing it wrong.

Hope this helps.

True.

LF Chardok group

[Philistine]

Rangers are a great all around class to play. They can fill the dps, tank, or pull role in most xp groups; do ok dps on raids; have valuable raid buffs; cheap raid loot cus not many play them; and can do sweet raid bumping glory.

A ranger with all the toys has 90% self-haste, 50% slow, regen, sow, harmony, solid melee dps, some tankiness, great ATK buffs, and ok "shoot we don't have a druid" buffs.

[Gugg]

Rangers are a great all around class to play. They can fill the dps, tank, or pull role in most xp groups; do ok dps on raids; have valuable raid buffs; cheap raid loot cus not many play them; and can do sweet raid bumping glory.

A ranger with all the toys has 90% self-haste, 50% slow, regen, sow, harmony, solid melee dps, some tankiness, great ATK buffs, and ok "shoot we don't have a druid" buffs.

That's best case scenario though.

I picked Ranger because I didn't want to play a girly class. Druid is woman's work.

Things have got a bit easier now that I have a 100 point heal and proc buff. That last heal was a joke. I've got whips too and a 70's porno look.

I think Rangers should have got regen much earlier, in stages.

I think I'll save up for a Frostbite.

What's a raid speed bump?

[Philistine]

That's best case scenario though.

I picked Ranger because I didn't want to play a girly class. Druid is woman's work.

Things have got a bit easier now that I have a 100 point heal and proc buff. That last heal was a joke. I've got whips too and a 70's porno look.

I think Rangers should have got regen much earlier, in stages.

I think I'll save up for a Frostbite.

What's a raid speed bump?

Ah yes, for most (including me) the "with all the toys" comes at high level, if not 60. If we're talking leveling I think Rangers are even better as their dps doesn't really fall off too badly compared to pure dps classes until 55-60.

Bumping on a raid is when the Main Tank dies and someone other than another tank intentionally grabs agro and holds it for as long as they can survive without heals while another tank works on getting agro and the CH chain works on swapping to that tank. This requires the ability to pull agro quickly and to survive for a meaningful period of time without heals, meaning a useful disc is likely needed (most raid mobs will 1 -2 round pretty much anyone).

Rangers are great at it because they have strong agro spells (flame lick and snare) to pull agro and a long duration disc (Weaponshield) to hold agro without getting wrecked while the chain swaps and the next tank builds agro.

A good bump can save several (sometimes lots) of other dps from getting murdered or a tank from grabbing agro before the chain is solidly landing on them and getting wrecked, resulting in yet more bumps being needed and/or dps dying.

A good bump can make or break a raid, sometimes.

[Wharfrat]

Can we Sticky this thread please ?

[Gugg]

Ah yes, for most (including me) the "with all the toys" comes at high level, if not 60. If we're talking leveling I think Rangers are even better as their dps doesn't really fall off too badly compared to pure dps classes until 55-60.

Bumping on a raid is when the Main Tank dies and someone other than another tank intentionally grabs agro and holds it for as long as they can survive without heals while another tank works on getting agro and the CH chain works on swapping to that tank. This requires the ability to pull agro quickly and to survive for a meaningful period of time without heals, meaning a useful disc is likely needed (most raid mobs will 1 -2 round pretty much anyone).

Rangers are great at it because they have strong agro spells (flame lick and snare) to pull agro and a long duration disc (Weaponshield) to hold agro without getting wrecked while the chain swaps and the next tank builds agro.

A good bump can save several (sometimes lots) of other dps from getting murdered or a tank from grabbing agro before the chain is solidly landing on them and getting wrecked, resulting in yet more bumps being needed and/or dps dying.

A good bump can make or break a raid, sometimes.

Ah, I see. News to me but I don't raid or at least I haven't for years.

[Philistine]

Ah, I see. News to me but I don't raid or at least I haven't for years.

I didn't plan to raid on p99 but when I got high enough I decided to give it a go and have found it to be my favorite part of the game.

Might be worth a go!

[loramin]

I picked Ranger because I didn't want to play a girly class. Druid is woman's work.
:rolleyes:

[magnetaress]

https://i.ibb.co/gZ3pvrW/im-helping-memegenerator-net-im-helping-ralph-wiggum-meme-53948604.png

Also.

Pretend wizard
Pretend rogue

Halfling rangers should definitely be a thing.

[loramin]

Halfling rangers should definitely be a thing.

The Halflings have Druids, and they have Warriors ...

https://media.tenor.com/odyVsZbC-OYAAAAC/why-not-both-why-not.gif

[Snaggles]

The ranger is a very fun class to play. With quality gear or even just practice they can punch way outside their weight class. They can solo tough targets, perform in groups, and save a raid from wiping.

Their spell and gear kits are quite extensive. The more you think about these things the more plans materialize. Snare and summon arrows for example…figure it out.

As for druids, good druids (like bards, necros, and rangers) are a marvel to witness. Bad ones just afk and reinforce tropes. If you don’t care to get good or try just play a rogue. There are still good and bad rogues out there but even a keyboard drooler can meet the threshold for acceptable value.

Note: I cannot stress enough if you are a smart player you don’t need the best gear to perform. It’s why you have spell book. If you rush into battle like a warrior you will quickly realize you aren’t. Also assuming druids are “women’s work” is strange and wrong on so many levels, mainly as that isn’t a thing. SMH…

[Cen]

Rangers do a lot more sustained damage then a druid by a mile. That's the main advantage. They also come with tons of utility along with that damage, a lot shared with druids.

If I were balancing old EQ I might have given them 4-5 self port spells to key areas and better bow mechanics for support but rangers are a fine class that does respectable damage.

[Ennewi]

If I were balancing old EQ I might have given them 4-5 self port spells to key areas and better bow mechanics for support but rangers are a fine class that does respectable damage.

Could have had a different, unused port location clicky for each of the 3 quested Velious breastplates, maybe a 4th with the 1 from PoH. IMO Tolan's clicky should've sent the ranger to the ruins outside in front of the Mistmoore zonline, or the rings right by Kelethin, instead of the Gfay zoneline even though the wizard spires being right nearby is pretty convenient.

[Toxigen]

Rangers are garbage and everyone knows it.

You're welcome.

[Andyman1022]

Ah, I see. News to me but I don't raid or at least I haven't for years.

What race is your ranger, Troll?

[Encroaching Death]

I will always die on this controversial hill:

Rangers are better pullers than Monks*

*in outdoor zones

[Cen]

I will always die on this controversial hill:

Rangers are better pullers than Monks*

*in outdoor zones

I agree with you 100%.. harmony is a guarantee easy mode single pull that's way easier and less annoying to do then feigning and refeigning just right :p Its on my top 10 most powerful spells/powers in the game (though feign death beats it as a whole on that list) its still way better for specifically pulling outdoors then feign is. Who's gonna argue that anyway though? You'd be crazy to

[Snaggles]

Even in indoor zones a ranger can pace a pull. Long duration root, pull 2 others. Switch target and toss grasping roots (about 30 seconds). Now in theory you have three spawns about 30 seconds apart. In Chardok lull animal can make for an easy split.

Monks are awesome. It sometimes takes some time for them to work. In low pressure situations with undead especially even SK’s can put pull them. Undead lull, snare, FD. Pick a zone like HS and profit.

[Ghost of Starman]

Super fun class with lots of neat clickies and good fashion, amazing tracking good mobility and an unlimited clickie port.

there is no class gating on p99 raiding so no real downsides since you'll be accepted on any raid, I just wish bow dmg was a real thing as I enjoy ranged melee.

[Raj]

Super fun class with lots of neat clickes and good fashion, there is no class gating on p99 so no real downsides since you'll be accepted on any raid, I just wish bow dmg was a real thing as I enjoy ranged melee.

TakP for super fun rangering, my friend! :cool:

Sadly the population of actual different individual players was rather low last time I had a look-see over there at its population numbers. :(

[Jimjam]

Even in indoor zones a ranger can pace a pull. Long duration root, pull 2 others. Switch target and toss grasping roots (about 30 seconds). Now in theory you have three spawns about 30 seconds apart. In Chardok lull animal can make for an easy split.

Monks are awesome. It sometimes takes some time for them to work. In low pressure situations with undead especially even SK’s can put pull them. Undead lull, snare, FD. Pick a zone like HS and profit.

So you've put timer on the first two mobs at 30 second intervals. Out of the remaining 2 mobs you've aggroed one can be snared to give a bit of time between these two chasing you arriving in camp.

Likewise, you can drop a snare onto rooted mobs to further build the delay of it hitting camp.

It's quite fun trying to moderate the time the different adds take to hit camp so they arrive just as the previous mob dies.

[Raj]

So you've put timer on the first two mobs at 30 second intervals. Out of the remaining 2 mobs you've aggroed one can be snared to give a bit of time between these two chasing you arriving in camp.

Likewise, you can drop a snare onto rooted mobs to further build the delay of it hitting camp.

It's quite fun trying to moderate the time the different adds take to hit camp so they arrive just as the previous mob dies.

It is with some hesitation and embarrasment I will admit I dabbled for a month or 2 on a TLP live server during its limited/vanilla timeline. Yes the easier mechanics made it play quite differently than P99 but it was still fun chain-pulling kobolds and bats etc for at least a couple hours for a 4 or 5-man group in SolB as a ranger in just the manner you described. :cool:

Keeping an eye on track just makes it even more fun competing for mobs or nameds against other players or groups in the area... Filling in as the tank occasionally can be fun too and everybody should hopefully know that generally ranger snap aggro beats that of monks by a pretty wide margin. :cool:

[Snaggles]

So you've put timer on the first two mobs at 30 second intervals. Out of the remaining 2 mobs you've aggroed one can be snared to give a bit of time between these two chasing you arriving in camp.

Likewise, you can drop a snare onto rooted mobs to further build the delay of it hitting camp.

It's quite fun trying to moderate the time the different adds take to hit camp so they arrive just as the previous mob dies.

Exactly.

Depending on the distance maybe open with a snare. Enveloping Roots (1 min and 1.8 sec cast is great) one and grasping the second. Or whatever works for you.

Having a cheap 13 min snare and 3 root types is pretty great. This assuming you aren’t even snare parking via zoning to split the camp up really nice.

It’s a great point to stack snare. You are just making life easier for everyone. Without a Druid in the group keeping a charmed pet snared also keeps the risk lower once buffed/torched.

[Trelaboon]

Ranger is probably my favorite all-around class. Assuming this was like the old Firiona Vie server and I could only play one character, that’s what I’d pick. Fortunately it’s not and I’ve been able to fully embrace my alt-itis.

I love dual wield DPS classes. They have a 40% haste cloak, a good slow weapon in their epic, an easy obtained 40% haste also in their epic. They do competitive DPS, they have the best fashion quest in the game. They’re a blast to play all around!

[Jimjam]

C3P0 with twin lightning prods god tier fashion (all Ewoks agree).

[Gugg]

:rolleyes:

I completely forgot that you prefer bi-sexual female Iksar who wear blue lipstick and have big swollen cauliflowet ears from boxing, and that you think people like me should be sent to hell for being aligned with nature which you call "misogynistic".

M28sfX2nCPg

[Bockscar]

What does the Ranger bring to the table L1 through to L60 that a Druid doesn't?

The ability to be a decent tank and melee DPS in groups. Both are pretty valuable because of the grouping "meta," i.e. chain-pulling forever. There's a general shortage of tanks, especially early on in a server's lifespan when people haven't made their twink warriors and SKs yet. And since most group content is so easy that a ranger can tank it just fine, it's nice to have a tank that also does respectable DPS and provides snare as part of their aggro rotation, meaning all mobs are always snared by default. It's much more cumbersome for a druid to do that, and costs them more because that mana spent on snares and lost from missing med ticks takes away directly from the only thing a druid does: cast spells. A ranger can spend all their mana on snares without sacrificing any meaningful aspect of their contribution to the group. Same goes for pulling with Harmony. Rangers are fantastic pullers in outdoor zones, arguably the very best. If a druid had to do it, they'd do little else since each pull effectively costs them a bunch of mana through not medding.

If you were to put together some theorycrafted min-maxed optimal party, maybe a ranger wouldn't find a place in it; but that's generally not the reality in the game, so for a party that can't pick the ideal lineup of classes, ranger checks more of the "nice to have in the group" boxes than a lot of other classes. It's much easier to assemble a party that covers the necessities if there's a ranger. Their asset package is much more universally applicable to the way people play the game than the one druids have. Add a ranger and you have a tank, snarer, one DPS spot covered, and a top-tier puller if outdoors. A much better tracker, too, if the group is poaching named mobs. These things are simply much more useful to a group than what the druid can do.

Druids don't really do anything well. Unless the tank is really twinked, a druid can't comfortably be the group healer on their own, and it's especially hopeless if there's no enchanter. Their DPS in a group setting is unimpressive as well, possibly the very worst of all the classes that can possibly be considered for the role of DPS, having all the same problems as wizards but even less powerful nukes and no mana regeneration whatsoever until level 60. People like to theorize about this Swiss Army Knife druid concept where you heal a bit, DPS a bit and whatnot, but the fact of the matter is that a fucking paladin could do the same thing better, and it's just not something that the gameplay calls for in the first place.

There's practically no combination of classes you can put in a party that makes druid a good choice for an additional member. Healing can be covered by a cleric or even a shaman who's diligent about canni-dancing. Damage shields have a relatively narrow window of meaningful contribution; early on they last so short a time that it's almost a full-time job to maintain them, and later on they have no real impact. Besides, a magician can do it, and there's not exactly a shortage of those. Groups go out of their way to invite mages. Once you're 60, PotG becomes a really nice buff, but then you're done with leveling and there's probably very little incentive to group at all anymore as it has always been far more profitable to farm money and buy the stuff you need compared to grouping and hoping to win the greed roll on a valuable item.

The druid's class design simply doesn't apply very well to the way the game is really played. Groups don't want to port around a bunch, and people are so experienced with EQ that evac is very rarely needed. The grinding meta is chain-pulling low blues for hours on end and the druid's DPS package is particularly terrible in such a setting. Druid buffs are dogshit until level 60. It's just not a class that offers much to the grouping environment. Of all the classes, this is the one that most clearly displays how little the original developers knew about the way people would play the game years later.

In raiding, both classes are a bit sub-par, but rangers have a very useful tactical tool in Weaponshield, as well as the ability to do high damage from outside the range of AoEs in one fight per 72 minutes. They're also ideal raid target scouts, hacks notwithstanding. Meanwhile, druids basically just bring PotG and that's more or less all a raid cares about. The rest is half-assed spot heals and the bitch duty of porting a raid if necessary. They don't even have any must-have ports for raiding, that's all wizards. Circle of Summer/Winter give five more resists than the generic resist buffs that half the classes have, so the only relevant part of that is the modest convenience of the druid version being group buffs. Druid is a crap class in raids while ranger is middle of the pack with decent DPS, a good melee buff and meaningful tactical value.

Druid is obviously a convenient class if your ambition in life is to fuck around on your own and do relatively inconsequential things. Porting around the world and farming easy targets is what the class excels at. But then you've saddled yourself with a character that has such an unimpressive activity as its main forté and isn't really wanted in any other aspect of the game. To some, porting around and root-rotting shit or PLing/taxi-servicing for money is what they want, and then druid is a good choice. It's just not something that can be called "bringing anything to the table," in my book.

[Raj]

C3P0 with twin lightning prods god tier fashion (all Ewoks agree).

[Encroaching Death]

Rangers are fun to play.

Every class is useless in its own way.

You're going to be useless no matter what.

Might as well have fun.

[Toxigen]

The ability to be a decent tank and melee DPS in groups. Both are pretty valuable because of the grouping "meta," i.e. chain-pulling forever. There's a general shortage of tanks, especially early on in a server's lifespan when people haven't made their twink warriors and SKs yet. And since most group content is so easy that a ranger can tank it just fine, it's nice to have a tank that also does respectable DPS and provides snare as part of their aggro rotation, meaning all mobs are always snared by default. It's much more cumbersome for a druid to do that, and costs them more because that mana spent on snares and lost from missing med ticks takes away directly from the only thing a druid does: cast spells. A ranger can spend all their mana on snares without sacrificing any meaningful aspect of their contribution to the group. Same goes for pulling with Harmony. Rangers are fantastic pullers in outdoor zones, arguably the very best. If a druid had to do it, they'd do little else since each pull effectively costs them a bunch of mana through not medding.

If you were to put together some theorycrafted min-maxed optimal party, maybe a ranger wouldn't find a place in it; but that's generally not the reality in the game, so for a party that can't pick the ideal lineup of classes, ranger checks more of the "nice to have in the group" boxes than a lot of other classes. It's much easier to assemble a party that covers the necessities if there's a ranger. Their asset package is much more universally applicable to the way people play the game than the one druids have. Add a ranger and you have a tank, snarer, one DPS spot covered, and a top-tier puller if outdoors. A much better tracker, too, if the group is poaching named mobs. These things are simply much more useful to a group than what the druid can do.

Druids don't really do anything well. Unless the tank is really twinked, a druid can't comfortably be the group healer on their own, and it's especially hopeless if there's no enchanter. Their DPS in a group setting is unimpressive as well, possibly the very worst of all the classes that can possibly be considered for the role of DPS, having all the same problems as wizards but even less powerful nukes and no mana regeneration whatsoever until level 60. People like to theorize about this Swiss Army Knife druid concept where you heal a bit, DPS a bit and whatnot, but the fact of the matter is that a fucking paladin could do the same thing better, and it's just not something that the gameplay calls for in the first place.

There's practically no combination of classes you can put in a party that makes druid a good choice for an additional member. Healing can be covered by a cleric or even a shaman who's diligent about canni-dancing. Damage shields have a relatively narrow window of meaningful contribution; early on they last so short a time that it's almost a full-time job to maintain them, and later on they have no real impact. Besides, a magician can do it, and there's not exactly a shortage of those. Groups go out of their way to invite mages. Once you're 60, PotG becomes a really nice buff, but then you're done with leveling and there's probably very little incentive to group at all anymore as it has always been far more profitable to farm money and buy the stuff you need compared to grouping and hoping to win the greed roll on a valuable item.

The druid's class design simply doesn't apply very well to the way the game is really played. Groups don't want to port around a bunch, and people are so experienced with EQ that evac is very rarely needed. The grinding meta is chain-pulling low blues for hours on end and the druid's DPS package is particularly terrible in such a setting. Druid buffs are dogshit until level 60. It's just not a class that offers much to the grouping environment. Of all the classes, this is the one that most clearly displays how little the original developers knew about the way people would play the game years later.

In raiding, both classes are a bit sub-par, but rangers have a very useful tactical tool in Weaponshield, as well as the ability to do high damage from outside the range of AoEs in one fight per 72 minutes. They're also ideal raid target scouts, hacks notwithstanding. Meanwhile, druids basically just bring PotG and that's more or less all a raid cares about. The rest is half-assed spot heals and the bitch duty of porting a raid if necessary. They don't even have any must-have ports for raiding, that's all wizards. Circle of Summer/Winter give five more resists than the generic resist buffs that half the classes have, so the only relevant part of that is the modest convenience of the druid version being group buffs. Druid is a crap class in raids while ranger is middle of the pack with decent DPS, a good melee buff and meaningful tactical value.

Druid is obviously a convenient class if your ambition in life is to fuck around on your own and do relatively inconsequential things. Porting around the world and farming easy targets is what the class excels at. But then you've saddled yourself with a character that has such an unimpressive activity as its main forté and isn't really wanted in any other aspect of the game. To some, porting around and root-rotting shit or PLing/taxi-servicing for money is what they want, and then druid is a good choice. It's just not something that can be called "bringing anything to the table," in my book.

I hit ctrl + f, typed "charm" and came up with 0 results. TLDR.

Filing this under "mediocre-at-best player who has never raided competitively chimes in on druid with zero first hand experience."

[Snaggles]

Uhhh there is a lot wrong in that.

I’m stuck on the concept that DS’s aren’t that useful and there are no shortage of mages on p99. I tear up a bit when tanking and someone DS’s me. It’s rare but like finding a $20 in an old coat.

When I play my ranger I always throw a DS in the MT as a test of how bad the mages/druids are sandbagging their duties. You don’t want to know how often it lands.

[Toxigen]

Also since its been determined that BiS knights do more damage than BiS rangers its official...there is zero point in playing a ranger unless you actually enjoy speedbumping raid targets.

[Snaggles]

Also since its been determined that BiS knights do more damage than BiS rangers* its official...there is zero point in playing a ranger unless you actually enjoy speedbumping raid targets.

*who don’t have legacy meme weapons and 8dmg arrows*

[Renault]

I hit ctrl + f, typed "charm" and came up with 0 results. TLDR.

Filing this under "mediocre-at-best player who has never raided competitively chimes in on druid with zero first hand experience."

Basically right. I think there's a list of OP abilities in this game, including but not limited to: Charm, Slow, Feign death, CH, Defensive discipline, backstab.

Then there's a secondary list of abilities that are useful that include lull, mana regen, root, snare, and fear.

Rangers have none of the OP abilities outside of a 50% slow proc (willsapper gets 35%) and only a few of the secondary abilities. The ranger 'sweet spot' is a super geared melee dps (slow proc + sky haste cloak + worn haste) who because of their spells can solo light blues outdoors better than a pure melee. That can be fun, but it's not worth much either in a group or a raid situation.

Compare that to a SK that gets FD, snare, fear, does similar end-game dps, and is also tankier.

[Snaggles]

True, a ranger WS bumping AoW during a tank transition is no big deal. Often people just use a SK with Leechcurse instead.

In fact those attack buffs are pretty non OP too. Every rogue has 65 extra attack power because at least one raider ignored everyone telling them their class sucked for 59 levels.

[Crepido]

There's a reason rangers got huge buffs in luclin and PoP, finally boosting their archery. Because up til then they are bad warriors or bad rogues. WS sure ! might as well have that player level a warrior and use a riposte discipline or defense and live just as long if not longer no ?

If you're arguing a BIS ranger can do this or that, what about him being a different class with BIS stuff ? couldn't he be a monk and do the same ?

[Toxigen]

True, a ranger WS bumping AoW during a tank transition is no big deal. Often people just use a SK with Leechcurse instead.

In fact those attack buffs are pretty non OP too. Every rogue has 65 extra attack power because at least one raider ignored everyone telling them their class sucked for 59 levels.

You cherry picked the 1 target where clean tank swaps are the most important of a successful kill (outside of having enough clerics).

Not saying ranger speedbumps aren't important to have - they are, but for that same AoW would you rather have 5 rangers and 1 druid (prob cant charm due to potg requests) or 5 druids w/ snared wolf pets and 1 ranger (just get the poor bastard some twitches before the pull and he can full buff the entire raid).

Just playin devil's advocate here. Obviously in the real world you're gonna have tons of rangers and druids because people refuse to log on cleric bots in 2023.

[Snaggles]

There's a reason rangers got huge buffs in luclin and PoP, finally boosting their archery. Because up til then they are bad warriors or bad rogues. WS sure ! might as well have that player level a warrior and use a riposte discipline or defense and live just as long if not longer no ?

If you're arguing a BIS ranger can do this or that, what about him being a different class with BIS stuff ? couldn't he be a monk and do the same ?

A ranger can build build aggro quicker with flame lick than almost any other class and their parry disc lasts 2.5 times longer than a warrior or monk. Having a 60 warrior blow their disc CD for 9 seconds of riposte is stupid. Monks frequently bump but it’s easier with rooted targets since they just have to be in range. Anything that moves will chase aggro rank so they would need to dump an entire scepter of the forlorn into the target (equiv to a couple flamelicks).

My argument is a 60 ranger with no gear at all can bump better than any other class every 72 minutes. If you never lose a MT that’s great, you don’t need a bump. A ranger still provides a lot of attack power to a raid. Some would argue you only need one ranger to get this benefit but often with a large guild even one 60 ranger in attendance is a coin flip.

Plus this whole thread assumes someone only had one class they main. It’s not 1999 anymore. I play a ranger for when it’s in the area or can provide a real benefit. When not, I play one of my other four 60’s or a raid bot.

[Snaggles]

You cherry picked the 1 target where clean tank swaps are the most important of a successful kill (outside of having enough clerics).

Not saying ranger speedbumps aren't important to have - they are, but for that same AoW would you rather have 5 rangers and 1 druid (prob cant charm due to potg requests) or 5 druids w/ snared wolf pets and 1 ranger (just get the poor bastard some twitches before the pull and he can full buff the entire raid).

Just playin devil's advocate here. Obviously in the real world you're gonna have tons of rangers and druids because people refuse to log on cleric bots in 2023.

Cherry picking is the point of EQ, lol.

Bumps are good non-stall, stalls though. Lose a couple rangers on a rooted dragon you buy 40 seconds for the real engage team. A ranger can also peel off a flurry and tank it without heals. Or help with a preslow on certain targets.

In my experience the more extensive a classes skill/spell kit the more varied the results. A good rogue does amazing damage, a bad one does less but still competes. Whether lack of gear or just not positioning quickly. Rangers, druids, bards, necros, enchanters and so on…can be inspiring or horrible. I’ve seen AoW’s with an excess of SK’s and druids. The wolves spent more time attacking players than the AoW. The SK’s were having issues peeling and helping the druids.

In that specific AoW we killed it but needed a second shot. I bumped the first time and was just a melee the second. I did like 14k damage and died at 20% which still wasn’t bad for swinging normal ToV weaps.

[Gugg]

There's a reason rangers got huge buffs in luclin and PoP, finally boosting their archery.

So on P99, Rangers are permanently bugged. They can't and never will be able to use a bow properly. On P99, they will always be incomplete and broken.

Being bugged/broken is classic?

[Snaggles]

So on P99, Rangers are permanently bugged. They can't and never will be able to use a bow properly. On P99, they will always be incomplete and broken.

Being bugged/broken is classic?

Please explain what you mean and I can explain how you are wrong.

Yea no AM3 or EQ AA's. We know this.

[Gugg]

Please explain what you mean and I can explain how you are wrong.

Okay, try and keep up. I will talk S L O W L Y.

1. Rangers being outdoor hunters are supposed to be experts with bows that's why their inventory screen has a bow and quiver graphic. With me so far?

2. On P99, Rangers aren't experts with bows and they never will be so a Ranger on P99 is like a Rogue without BS.

Explain how I'm wrong.

[Andyman1022]

You're not wrong, just an asshole lol

[Snaggles]

Okay, try and keep up. I will talk S L O W L Y.

1. Rangers being outdoor hunters are supposed to be experts with bows that's why their inventory screen has a bow and quiver graphic. With me so far?
(this isnt a point or a question...sure, I guess)

2. On P99, Rangers aren't experts with bows and they never will be so a Ranger on P99 is like a Rogue without BS.
(this is vague and doesnt advance your point. I've killed Lucan 30 times with my bow solo, a rogue cant.)

Explain how I'm wrong.

I've played a ranger here for a decade. I'm trying to help.
Is your point bow damage doesnt out dps rogues? If so, congrats.

[Snaggles]

Wait, I keep seeing people say Knights out DPS rangers at endgame? What?

Context is important...

[Gugg]

Is your point bow damage doesnt out dps rogues? If so, congrats.

No, my point is that a Ranger on P99 isn't a Ranger.

Just like if a Rogue didn't have BS he wouldn't be a Rogue.

[Snaggles]

No, my point is that a Ranger on P99 isn't a Ranger.

Just like if a Rogue didn't have BS he wouldn't be a Rogue.

Good point. Why focus on facts when you can rely on lore and "your gut".

I'm really thinking you shouldnt play a ranger. It's an uphill battle to convince you they can be good and frankly we have enough bad ones as-is.


PS: Done with arrows...

https://i.ibb.co/FXgSk2F/556-B4924-70-A1-409-B-AAE3-7-AD289636990.png (https://ibb.co/sCy0pnZ)

[Toxigen]

I wanna see a ranger plucking Vyemm from up top with the wizard army.

Go gettum, Legolas.

[Crawdad]

What's the point of playing Ranger?

It appeals to players who want to play a fighter and want access to nature-themed spells. You should try it, its fun.


Isn't a Ranger just a Druid with much weaker spells, no ports, no charm and no quad kiting?

Congrats, you figured out Verant didn't know what to do with hybrids.

[Cecily]

I'd prefer people think rangers are awful so it's easier to get gear. Took me like 8 months to get my SEoC because, I assume, I'm so inspiring that new rangers kept showing up. My Tolan's BP was super, super expensive. Imagine not getting your sky cloak on your first sky raid. It's horrifying to think about. I missed a wave of like 5 new rangers.


Fungi, Epics, Sky Cloak. Get those 3 and class is pretty good. Sucks till then. I'd also suggest Sword of Rile.

[Snaggles]

I'd prefer people think rangers are awful so it's easier to get gear. Took me like 8 months to get my SEoC because, I assume, I'm so inspiring that new rangers kept showing up. My Tolan's BP was super, super expensive. Imagine not getting your sky cloak on your first sky raid. It's horrifying to think about. I missed a wave of like 5 new rangers.


Fungi, Epics, Sky Cloak. Get those 3 and class is pretty good. Sucks till then. I'd also suggest Sword of Rile.

100%. I've always been a "chip on the shoulder" gamer. If everyone decided it was the class to play I'd probably try to find a less popular one to spend time with, lol.

I actually have only done like 3 sky raids since our raid day doesnt align with my game schedule. Double loot drop got me it finally. It's fun being a weird squishy monk!

[Jimjam]

No, my point is that a Ranger on P99 isn't a Ranger.

Just like if a Rogue didn't have BS he wouldn't be a Rogue.

Is this the bullshit ‘rangers are rangers, why aren’t they good at range’?

The ‘range’ in ranger refers to them journeying far and wide, not them shooting bows.

[Gugg]

Good point. Why focus on facts when you can rely on lore and "your gut".

I'm really thinking you shouldnt play a ranger. It's an uphill battle to convince you they can be good and frankly we have enough bad ones as-is.


PS: Done with arrows...

https://i.ibb.co/FXgSk2F/556-B4924-70-A1-409-B-AAE3-7-AD289636990.png (https://ibb.co/sCy0pnZ)

You're suffering from best-case-scenario-itis. It seems there's a pandemic on P99 of this disease. The infected have a tendency to eliminate L1-L59 from the equation aswell as group orientated players.

The bow and quiver graphic on the Ranger inventory screen is there from level 1 though. It doesn't just suddenly appear when you ding 60 and join a raiding guild. It's there from day one, the bow being an integral part of the class....except on P99 it's not.

Rangers should be better than all classes at bows from a very young age and they should get stronger as they level up, just like Rogues with piercing weapons.

I'm thinking from a games design perspective, you're thinking more from a petty personal bias.

Also, Lore is vital...Lore is where all the classes come from in the first place einstein. Without Lore you wouldn't have Rangers.

[Snaggles]

Rangers have double damage on non-rooted targets, bow crits, a bow disc, some powerful ranger-only bows, a high bow skill cap, and the ability to make very nice arrows via fletching. There are even a bunch of bow quests for rangers.

Sorry you are fixating on a quiver icon instead of actually playing a game for fun. Consider rerolling an ogre warrior.

[Cecily]

Congrats on your cloak! That's a game changer. Glad you got lucky on 2x. I'd suggest not engaging with the obvious troll unless it amuses you.

[Gugg]

Is this the bullshit ‘rangers are rangers, why aren’t they good at range’?

The ‘range’ in ranger refers to them journeying far and wide, not them shooting bows.

No, it's "why does my Ranger have a bow and arrow graphic on his inventory screen when I can't hit shit with a bow and why are there so few bows to choose from and why is that Rogue and Warrior and SK just as good at me with a bow?"

https://i.ibb.co/4dWVWJp/ranger-bow.png

...and there's also "why is every other Ranger I've seen (whether it's in a movie, book or another game) an expert with bows and this one isn't?"

Then there's the fact that 'traveling far' is what an arrow does so range is relevant to bows.

[Cecily]

Bendy branch goes pew.

[Jimjam]

No, it's "why does my Ranger have a bow and arrow graphic on his inventory screen when I can't hit shit with a bow and why are there so few bows to choose from and why is that Rogue and Warrior and SK just as good at me with a bow?"

https://i.ibb.co/4dWVWJp/ranger-bow.png

...and there's also "why is every other Ranger I've seen (whether it's in a movie, book or another game) an expert with bows and this one isn't?"

Then there's the fact that 'traveling far' is what an arrow does so range is relevant to bows.

Arrowgone dngas about bows mate.

[Gugg]

Congrats on your cloak! That's a game changer. Glad you got lucky on 2x. I'd suggest not engaging with this guy. He is an obvious troll because rangers aren't manly at all.

You're looking at it from the perspective of a petty poopsock who's pretending to be a ranger in a 23 year old broken game. Maybe you want them to be broken so nobody plays them except you.

I'm looking at it from the point of view of a games design perspective. Rangers aren't Rangers on P99.

Rangers are supposed to be good with bows like Rogues are with daggers.

It's not rocket science.

Telling me they are good with bows at L60 with BIS is BS.

[Snaggles]

Bendy branch goes pew.

Haha. I'm certainly done with this one. I cant top that :D

[Gugg]

Haha. I'm certainly done with this one. I cant top that :D

Good, go back to living a lie pretending you're wise, strong and heroic and take that pond life with you.

It should be illegal for pond life like you two to play and speak on behalf of rangers (or any race/class for that matter).

You two should be gasoline in my truck fuel tank, not giving opinions.

I guess I have to put up with the bad if I want the good, and u two seem happy to be bad so at some point we'll meet. I'll be the one waving hello/goodbye to you as you enter my fuel tank. You'll be the one carrying me to the beach.

[Encroaching Death]

No, it's "why does my Ranger have a bow and arrow graphic on his inventory screen when I can't hit shit with a bow and why are there so few bows to choose from and why is that Rogue and Warrior and SK just as good at me with a bow?"

...and there's also "why is every other Ranger I've seen (whether it's in a movie, book or another game) an expert with bows and this one isn't?"

Then there's the fact that 'traveling far' is what an arrow does so range is relevant to bows.

https://cdn.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/2559883/87227856.jpg


Velious brought much more bows that are great.

SK's skill cap for Archery is only 75, and Rangers get the special Double Damage Bonus at 50 and Trueshot at 55.

Many earlier renditions of Rangers in media did not actually focus on their skills with bows, but rather their skills with a blade or blades.


I'm sorry for being such a ******.

[Cecily]

Please man up and play a highelf cleric lady.

[Gugg]

https://cdn.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/2559883/87227856.jpg


Velious brought much more bows that are great.

SK's skill cap for Archery is only 75, and Rangers get the special Double Damage Bonus at 50 and Trueshot at 55.

Many earlier renditions of Rangers in media did not actually focus on their skills with bows, but rather their skills with a blade or blades.


I'm sorry for being such a ******.

Et tu brute?

Well first of all, a Knight in full plate being just as good with a bow as a bow specialist is up to 75 skill is dumb.

Warriors and Rogues having the same skill level as a bow specialist is also dumb.

"Special" double attack bonus at 50? Why is double attack considered "special" when it comes to bows? Melee double attacks aren't special so why are you saying double attacks with bows are? Ranged attacks should get double attacks early on just like melee attacks do.

Trueshot: L55, 2 min every 72 min. How often can Rogue Backstab and from what level?

Compared to melee weapons, high level bows are rare, difficult to get and costly and the low level ones are very, very slow....and Warriors + Rogues have the sameskill level.

The EQ Ranger has a bow and arrow graphic and so do Tolkiens Rangers.

[Gugg]

I'd prefer people think rangers are awful so it's easier to get gear.

That sums you up; no loyalty, no honor, just a braindead parasite with the IQ of a garden worm who wants something for nothing. Becoming a fossil fuel to run my 6.7 litre turbo diesel is your true purpose in life.

Please man up and play a highelf cleric lady.

Follow your own advice by not responding to me. Go back to your pond, scum.

[Jimjam]

Et tu brute?

Well first of all, a Knight in full plate being just as good with a bow as a bow specialist is up to 75 skill is dumb.

Warriors and Rogues having the same skill level as a bow specialist is also dumb.

"Special" double attack bonus at 50? Why is double attack considered "special" when it comes to bows? Ranged attacks should get double attacks from a young age just like melee weapons.

Trueshot: L55, 2 min every 72 min. How often can Rogue Backstab and from what level?

Compared to melee weapons, high level bows are rare, difficult to get and costly and the low level ones are very, very slow....and Warriors + Rogues have the sameskill level.

The EQ Ranger has a bow and arrow graphic and so do Tolkiens Rangers.

Plenty of warriors historically were archers. Eq lore is they are masters of all weapon types.

Class icon doesn’t mean main dps option either.

Are we really arguing warrior should dps through bash and paladins through headbutt?

https://wiki.project1999.com/images/C_warrior.gif https://wiki.project1999.com/images/C_paladin.gif

[Gugg]

Let's face it, Verant had a bias against good races and classes and that's why Rangers are so gimped when it comes to ranged attacks.

AA's gave players the opportunity to help Rangers become Rangers.

AA's also gave players an escape from the monopoly that Iksar have on the Necro class due to their OP racial regen.

TIL classic means permanently broken.

[Gugg]

Plenty of warriors historically were archers. Eq lore is they are masters of all weapon types.

Class icon doesn’t mean main dps option either.

Are we really arguing warrior should dps through bash and paladins through headbutt?

https://wiki.project1999.com/images/C_warrior.gif https://wiki.project1999.com/images/C_paladin.gif

The plate helm with angelic wings and holy book would indicate a righteous knight.

The sword and shield would indicate a gladiator.

The dagger would indicate backstabber.

The bow, arrow and quiver graphic would indicate what? In Jimjam's world, a ballerina.

The Ranger text on the character creation screen talks about deadly ranged attacks and how the Ranger's bow is a welcome addition to a group adding a good deal of damage. It also mentions how Rangers can hunt solo.

[Jimjam]

Gladiators used comical combos of weapons like fishing spear and net because it was entertaining.

Rangers hunt? They manage to get bunnies perfectly fine with their bows.

[Snaggles]

Still stuck on the animated class icons? Wow.

I dont know if we should keep posting to entertain you or just tape a laser pointer to a spring.

[Gugg]

tape a laser pointer to a spring.

You just described EQ. How many 60's do you have?

[Gugg]

Gladiators used comical combos of weapons like fishing spear and net because it was entertaining.

Rangers hunt? They manage to get bunnies perfectly fine with their bows.

In your crazy chaotic world anything is possible Jimjam. But more importantly, all the bad things are possible.

Protip: if you create a universe with chaos, and then go live in it, you run the risk of somebody beneath you forcing you to eat shit in your own universe.

[Jimjam]

In your crazy chaotic world anything is possible Jimjam. But more importantly, all the bad things are possible.

Protip: if you create a universe with chaos, and then go live in it, you run the risk of somebody beneath you forcing you to eat shit in your own universe.

What are you doubting? The existence of the fisherman themed Retarius Gladiator that fought with trident and net, or that ranger characters are able to 1 shot snow bunnies in game?

Pretty sure I wouldn't be the one on a faecal diet if I was the one on top. Regardless, I don't view people as beneath me. I don't really care about status. You are sharing some vulgar fantasies though.

[magnetaress]

When u bow hunt smol game u use Blunt arrows and less powerful bows. Works great.

Also it's clear gugg never played classic vanilla ranjur. Even player made bows and arrows would bring down HGs.

[mycoolrausch]

So on P99, Rangers are permanently bugged. They can't and never will be able to use a bow properly. On P99, they will always be incomplete and broken.

Being bugged/broken is classic?

Yes. Rangers are not unique in this regard. Wizards in luclin get a higher effective casting level so their nukes actually land, efficient nukes that aren't target based banes, spell crits, reduced threat, and other assorted massive buffs that turn them into an actual real class. Druids get actual heals. Etc.

P99 is the era of monks/chanters/shamans/necros.

The broken and unbalanced classes makes the game interesting. You can swap between mowing down content on a walking god (a geared velious monk) and turning basic encounters into an interesting and fun challenge on something sub optimal (druid).

[Encroaching Death]

Is there a way to implement the good stuff from Luclin and remove the bad?

Like on another server?

[Snaggles]

Is there a way to implement the good stuff from Luclin and remove the bad?

Like on another server?

Yea go play on TAKP.

[Gustoo]

Rangers are strong melee. They may not parse right but one to 50 they’re strong. I think the gap between them at knights is larger than it should be in this server at level 60 but I’m probably wrong about how it “should” be.

They’re way better melee than druids, so to say they’re like Druid’s but worse is only in the respect of their spells. In this way they are the same as all hybrids like sk for nec and pal for clr

Except rangers have good dps.

Adequate DPS and a lot of utility means they’re a great class.

[Encroaching Death]

Yea go play on TAKP.

Is that what they do?

Sounds badass, really