New Troll Warrior

[tcm666]

Hey all just a quick question from someone who has never played a warrior.

So i've got it in my head that i want to roll a troll warrior but i'm not sure where to put starting stats. I've scowered the boards looking for this info and found some useful information but it seems very convoluted at the same time. My question is do I go full dex and 5 in strength or stamina? If it helps i will be playing this toon pretty casually and will have access to a fungi so i'll be soloing a bit and grouping but dunno if i'll ever get to raid stuff. i have a bunch of other toons in the 50's so can farm stuff and get gear easy enough.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

For starting stats on a Warrior the two choices are generally Stamina or Charisma.

If you think you will ever change your mind about raiding, dump into Charisma for the extra chance of https://wiki.project1999.com/Divine_Intervention procing. Trolls get a lot of Stamina to start with already, but they are rather smelly, so their Charisma is low. Raid gear for Warriors generally doesn't have Charisma either, so it will be harder to get this stat up later on.

If you know for absolute certainty that you will never raid, then dumping into Stamina is fine. It will allow you to have more HP in more situations, depending on what buffs your current group has access to, as well as what gear you have access to.

Do not bother dumping into Dexterity or Strength. They are very easy to cap with buffs. As an example, with https://wiki.project1999.com/Focus_of_Spirit , https://wiki.project1999.com/Mortal_Deftness , and https://wiki.project1999.com/Maniacal_Strength you are already getting +120 to Strength and Dexterity. You are a Troll, so your starting Strength is already enough to wear plate just fine. Trolls also have a decent starting Dexterity, higher than Ogres and Barbarians. Strength is fairly easy to get on gear as well. Dexterity is a bit harder to find on gear, but there are enough options for you to make up any Dexterity you think you may be lacking.

Stamina has less buffs available for it, you mostly will just have https://wiki.project1999.com/Riotous_Health . That being said, Stamina is pretty easy to get on Velious era gear. It is a common stat.

[Jimjam]

Don't think too hard about it. I've done all sorts or races and dumped all different starting stats (except wis and int ... maybe next warrior :D). All combos have worked perfectly adequately.

Str is great at lower levels when you might be picking up a lot of heavy vendor loot and not yet have weight reducing bags. Dex is good for late 30s+ grouping / solo procs, but it is really easy to cap with buffs (as I sure you know boon of garou adds +100, shaman can easily add +100 at 60) so if you're planning on playing with shamans or raiding I'd suggest avoiding dex.

Sta is great at 50-60 while you are still gearing up, but once you hit the cap it's useless (beyond maybe freeing up a buff slot).

Agility doesn't do much after 75. Except for when incapacitated, you will beg for more agility when a shaman NPC uses the cripple line on you and you're encumbered to hell.

If you are gonna be doing loads of main tanking eventually charisma is the only thing that won't easily(!) max out with gear/buffs. So yeah, if you're planning on getting divine intervened then that may be the winningest choice. You'll also do a little better from some vendors while levelling up too.


I hope these thoughts/observations have been useful. What ever you pick don't bother regretting your choice - at some part in your character's career the choice will be useful.

[Crede]

Dex if you plan to mostly solo/group occasionally.
Stamina if you want to raid
Cha if you're a hardcore minmaxer

[eqravenprince]

Why not make your solo life a heck of a lot better levels 1-50, pump it all into strength. Dex barely makes a difference, it's just too random on procs, strength consistently gives higher DPS numbers.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Why not make your solo life a heck of a lot better levels 1-50, pump it all into strength. Dex barely makes a difference, it's just too random on procs, strength consistently gives higher DPS numbers.

Trolls already start with high Strength, and it's easy to get Strength gear/buffs. OP says he can give his new Warrior a Fungi, so I doubt he's hurting for cash when it comes to filling his other slots.

[Philistine]

For starting stats on a Warrior the two choices are generally Stamina or Charisma.

If you think you will ever change your mind about raiding, dump into Charisma for the extra chance of https://wiki.project1999.com/Divine_Intervention procing. Trolls get a lot of Stamina to start with already, but they are rather smelly, so their Charisma is low. Raid gear for Warriors generally doesn't have Charisma either, so it will be harder to get this stat up later on.

If you know for absolute certainty that you will never raid, then dumping into Stamina is fine. It will allow you to have more HP in more situations, depending on what buffs your current group has access to, as well as what gear you have access to.

I want to preface my post here with the fact that I respect DeathSilkMisty and enjoy his thoughtful and data driven analysis of topics. I don't mean any disrespect here.

Personally speaking, I disagree with the recommendation to go with CHA if folks plan to raid. I raid with a modestly geared warrior (6100 hp and working on it!) and I'm not anywhere close to capped on my basic melee stats. Granted there's a shammy there 9 times out of 10 to help fix that, but if I hadn't gone max STA on creation I even with shammy I wouldn't be maxed out (can you tell I didn't go ogre? :p)

While I get that CHA may the ultimate BIS or near BIS min/max choice, to get there folks will probably spend years regretting not putting it in something more immediately useful.

Just my 2 cp, of course!!

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I want to preface my post here with the fact that I respect DeathSilkMisty and enjoy his thoughtful and data driven analysis of topics. I don't mean any disrespect here.

Personally speaking, I disagree with the recommendation to go with CHA if folks plan to raid. I raid with a modestly geared warrior (6100 hp and working on it!) and I'm not anywhere close to capped on my basic melee stats. Granted there's a shammy there 9 times out of 10 to help fix that, but if I hadn't gone max STA on creation I even with shammy I wouldn't be maxed out (can you tell I didn't go ogre? :p)

While I get that CHA may the ultimate BIS or near BIS min/max choice, to get there folks will probably spend years regretting not putting it in something more immediately useful.

Just my 2 cp, of course!!

Oh yeah, Stamina is a good choice on Warrior. It still helps in raids, especially if there are dispelling mobs. I just want OP to know that CHA is the hardest to max, so it is the best choice in the long run.

Judging by his post, he probably isn't going to be a raider. However, Warriors are naturally best suited for raiding on P99, so OP may change his mind down the road. A lot can happen between character creation and being level 50+.

In your case it sounds like you didn't go Troll/Ogre, so for a smaller race it's a bit tougher to cap Stamina.

To the other posters, I still wouldn't recommend Strength or Dexterity, as it is easy to get heavily buffed, even outside of raids. Groups do not Stat/Gear check, so it isn't like you are going to be dropped from a group if your Proc Rate/White Damage isn't at peak optimization. If a group just doesn't want a Warrior as a tank, you will get screened that way. If you heavily solo it isn't going to make or break your character either. You can always get bad luck when it comes to damage/procs. Strategy, understanding the game, and proper gear is what you need to be a successful soloing Warrior.

[eqravenprince]

Trolls already start with high Strength, and it's easy to get Strength gear/buffs. OP says he can give his new Warrior a Fungi, so I doubt he's hurting for cash when it comes to filling his other slots.

I'm strictly talking solo, grouping is easy and stats barely matter. So with that being said, show me a gear list that gets him to 255 strength while soloing. So he needs 137 strength from gear if he doesn't put any points into it. I don't think it's easy like you suggest.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I'm strictly talking solo, grouping is easy and stats barely matter. So with that being said, show me a gear list that gets him to 255 strength while soloing. So he needs 137 strength from gear if he doesn't put any points into it. I don't think it's easy like you suggest.

My baby Gnome Warrior is getting +80 something STR right now with standard Velious Era gear and an Iksar BP equipped. I don't have the exact equipment list on me at the moment since I am not in a position to log in right now.

When you hit 45 you are getting another +25 from https://wiki.project1999.com/Cobalt_Boots , and an additional +20 with https://wiki.project1999.com/Cobalt_Gauntlets if you don't mind managing the buff. It's really not that hard to get a lot of Strength if you want it, and both of those Cobalt pieces are cheap.

So at 45 my Gnome Warrior would have +125ish Strength with just normal stuff you could buy in EC.

[Allishia]

Ya I would do sta then rest into cha...it's so easy to max str on war. Especially now, gear is dirt cheap.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Cobalt_Boots
+25 str clicky buff if you solo.

[eqravenprince]

My baby Gnome Warrior is getting +80 something STR right now with standard Velious Era gear and an Iksar BP equipped. I don't have the exact equipment list on me at the moment since I am not in a position to log in right now.

When you hit 45 you are getting another +25 from https://wiki.project1999.com/Cobalt_Boots , and an additional +20 with https://wiki.project1999.com/Cobalt_Gauntlets if you don't mind managing the buff. It's really not that hard to get a lot of Strength if you want it, and both of those Cobalt pieces are cheap.

So at 45 my Gnome Warrior would have +125ish Strength with just normal stuff you could buy in EC.

You are right as usual. I didn't even realize those str buffs existed on gear. /bow

[tcm666]

Hey guys thanks for all the replies so far!
So I really had no idea about the charisma thing being a stat for warriors but even after reading the suggestions I don't think i'd ever really get that far into raiding to justify putting the points into charisma when most of this toons life will be solo/group. I've played on this server since 2015 and have hardly raided so it probably won't happen. To clarify the fungi is borrowed and I definitely am not super rich but I do plan on putting maybe 4k into this toon over time and to start off with just some hand me down weapons from other toons (wurmslayer and lamy to start and will get a staff of battle) and will try to round out the character with cheap lower end gear like mithril and crusty depending on what I can find. that being said I think i'd put points into stam and dex? would half and half be ok or all stam 5 dex?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Hey guys thanks for all the replies so far!
So I really had no idea about the charisma thing being a stat for warriors but even after reading the suggestions I don't think i'd ever really get that far into raiding to justify putting the points into charisma when most of this toons life will be solo/group. I've played on this server since 2015 and have hardly raided so it probably won't happen. To clarify the fungi is borrowed and I definitely am not super rich but I do plan on putting maybe 4k into this toon over time and to start off with just some hand me down weapons from other toons (wurmslayer and lamy to start and will get a staff of battle) and will try to round out the character with cheap lower end gear like mithril and crusty depending on what I can find. that being said I think i'd put points into stam and dex? would half and half be ok or all stam 5 dex?

If you are confident on remaining casual, it won't matter too much either way. 20 into Stamina and 5 into Dexterity sounds like the best choice for you if you want to be safe.

[demokatt]

I have a troll warrior.. I spent enough to get max STR with a fullset crustecean armor and the +25 from cobalt boots. the rest in STA

[Robersonroger38]

I’ve level almost all the warrior race’s to 40-50’s except barbarian , half elf, troll , ide go all dex if planning solo, ogre, halflin has been the most fun out of the bunch! Good luck on stat choices!

[demokatt]

For solo only I think nothing can compete with gnome though..
Mine has 76% self haste for a cost of 5 pp per 20 minutes.

[Danth]

So I really had no idea about the charisma thing being a stat for warriors

I would put money on charisma being largely irrelevant to over 95% of all warriors ever created on P1999. Yes, it has its place, as detailed above, but understand that place is VERY niche and applies only to the absolute highest-end characters, beyond where most players ever reach.

[Keebz]

Either Dex or Sta imho. Charisma is extremely niche. Pre-Avatar, I find Dex annoying to cap and all the good gear incidentally has 10-15 Stamina on it, so I went 20 Dex 5 Sta. No Regrets.

[Crede]

I experiment with a lot of different builds. I recently did a dwarf war solo build and went all dex. I solod until lvl 57 and finally gave up and grouped until 60.

While the procs are nice, it’s hard to rely on dex. I think strength is the only melee stat that matters when leveling. It’s the most noticeable getting increased attack and better hits. Stamina is nice if your goal is to be a raid tank. While charisma is technically the min max, 99.9% of people never get to that point. If charisma really mattered that much, we’d be seeing a lot more wood elf/human/half elf wars

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I experiment with a lot of different builds. I recently did a dwarf war solo build and went all dex. I solod until lvl 57 and finally gave up and grouped until 60.

While the procs are nice, it’s hard to rely on dex. I think strength is the only melee stat that matters when leveling. It’s the most noticeable getting increased attack and better hits. Stamina is nice if your goal is to be a raid tank. While charisma is technically the min max, 99.9% of people never get to that point. If charisma really mattered that much, we’d be seeing a lot more wood elf/human/half elf wars

The reason to dump into Charisma is simply because the starting stats aren't going to make a huge difference, especially on a Troll. They have higher Strength and Stamina than the small races. It's their Charisma that is low.

The reason why you don't see as many wood elf/human/half elf warriors is because they don't get a great racial like Regeneration or FSI. Those are going to help you more when soloing than 25 points anywhere. They also have slam, which can be helpful against casters without needing to swap to a shield.

For OP Dexterity and Stamina are better, but again it won't really do much. Being a Troll with Regeneration is giving him way more bang for his buck.

Warriors are designed for raiding on P99, and you never know if you will change your mind about it later.

[Troxx]

I would put money on charisma being largely irrelevant to over 95% of all warriors ever created on P1999. Yes, it has its place, as detailed above, but understand that place is VERY niche and applies only to the absolute highest-end characters, beyond where most players ever reach.

More like 99%

I would not ever recommend building your entire existence around divine intervention.

Given starting stats on troll I recommend pumping up dex.

[Kich867]

I experiment with a lot of different builds. I recently did a dwarf war solo build and went all dex. I solod until lvl 57 and finally gave up and grouped until 60.

While the procs are nice, it’s hard to rely on dex. I think strength is the only melee stat that matters when leveling. It’s the most noticeable getting increased attack and better hits. Stamina is nice if your goal is to be a raid tank. While charisma is technically the min max, 99.9% of people never get to that point. If charisma really mattered that much, we’d be seeing a lot more wood elf/human/half elf wars

I'd agree with this. When I did my dwarf warrior solo-self found run to 43 or whatever I got him to, my biggest regret was not putting all points into strength.

For a fairly new player without access to a huge amount of gear, or someone like me who deliberately was starting with no money / no grouping / only using gear I killed/quested for/crafted myself, the strength objectively would've been the best choice.

In retrospect I also would've been a troll for it since it would've cut my kill time and heal times down considerably.

[Allishia]

Cha was only for ogres and trolls who have crazy str/sta already. Dex is kinda meh.

I choose dark elf, ofc I wouldn't put anything into cha, all mine went to sta and I'm only 100 base. Ogres and trolls start with way more than that and more str and same or more dex....only stat they are God awful at is cha which makes di chance better. Since they will cap sta easy and definitely cap str np at all.

But yes if I never planned on raiding on an ogre or troll I would put most points into sta then rest dex...since you likely won't cap sta in group gear with base of 118 or whatever troll has.

[wagorf]

Either Dex or Sta imho. Charisma is extremely niche. Pre-Avatar, I find Dex annoying to cap and all the good gear incidentally has 10-15 Stamina on it, so I went 20 Dex 5 Sta. No Regrets.

Coming from a troll war with full tov/vp/st gears, I agree to the above.

I put all into dex and I don't regret. But if you don't think you are getting full raid gears, then 20 dex 5 sta, 15 dex 10 sta are both good options. Even WITHOUT full raid gears (such as before when i was wearing full SS armor along with best non-raid items like cloak of flame/matchless shoulder/turtle belt/eyepatch plunder/living thunder ear) I still couldn't cap sta.

Ignore the put all into cha comment - that only applies to full bis which will take you years to acquire.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Ignore the put all into cha comment - that only applies to full bis which will take you years to acquire.

You can cap STR/STA/DEX well before BiS raid gear with buffs. It will just depend on how much you like to group. A level 60 Shaman can buff your STR and DEX by 120 each, and STA by 50.

[Jimjam]

That is true, but it uses a lot of buff slots, and some shaman get grizzly(!) if you ask for double str/dex.

It’s nice to have decent strength when double str focus isn’t available too.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

That is true, but it uses a lot of buff slots, and some shaman get grizzly(!) if you ask for double str/dex.

It’s nice to have decent strength when double str focus isn’t available too.

STR is easy to get on gear. My Gnome warrior has +80 STR just from normal Velious era EC gear. You can get another 45 from Cobalt Gauntlet/Boot buffs when you don't have STR buffs available. For a troll having +125 STR self buffed is basically capped.

It's only 4 buff slots for FoS, STR, DEX, and STA. In a group you probably aren't maxing out buff slots on a Warrior. Shamans generally are fine with giving all the buffs, they just get annoyed if you don't mention STR or DEX until after they FoS you hehe.

[Jimjam]

Reckless strength is a decaying buff and I don’t remember it stacking. Is there a trick? Short duration too. May not even last a single sonic bat!

You’re projecting. Many shaman are unaware of, or simply refuse, to double buff. It’s not a case of carelessly asking after the fact.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Reckless strength is a decaying buff and I don’t remember it stacking. Is there a trick? Short duration too. May not even last a single sonic bat!

You’re projecting. Many shaman are unaware of, or simply refuse, to double buff. It’s not a case of carelessly asking after the fact.

Then those are bad Shamams. I've never denied people myself, or seen a Shaman deny someone.

The decaying buff stacks, it's like Yaulp. You can click it again to refresh it if needed. Its only 20 STR, so if you don't want to use it you still have 105STR from my example.

[Jimjam]

You used this combo on your gnome recently?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

You used this combo on your gnome recently?

I had a Troll Warrior on live from 1999-2005 or so. They stacked. I also have used Yaulp + a Strength buff on my 24 Cleric on P99. I would be highly surprised if they didn't stack on P99. But I am sure a high level Warrior can chime in if I am wrong.

Let's assume worse case though and say they don't. 105 Strength is still a lot of Strength, +80 from equipment and +25 Strength from the Cobalt Boots buff. Just having FoS would put a Troll at 255.

[Jimjam]

I remember trying to use the combo years ago, but then getting rid of it.. I can't remember if it was just disappointment /lack of bag space or it not stacking. That is why I ask.

Strength of the Kunzar and Reckless Strength are both slot 1, so that also made me think maybe they didn't stack, rather than reckless strength just being annoying to use.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I remember trying to use the combo years ago, but then getting rid of it.. I can't remember if it was just disappointment /lack of bag space or it not stacking. That is why I ask.

Strength of the Kunzar and Reckless Strength are both slot 1, so that also made me think maybe they didn't stack, rather than reckless strength just being annoying to use.

Yeah I wish I could test it. Sadly the buff line page https://wiki.project1999.com/Buff_Lines has left out Reckless Strength completely lol. But as you can see there are a LOT of strength lines. My guess is it falls under one of the short duration buff lines. I just tested Yaulp and Reckless Strength on my Cleric. Both of those do stack, so it isn't on the Yaulp buff line.

Speaking of Yaulp though, I forgot about https://wiki.project1999.com/Mask_of_War, which is a Yaulp clickie Warriors could use hehe.

If they don't stack, that would be such a silly thing. Cobalt Boots and Cobalt Gauntlets are part of the same armor set, and the Boots buff is 100% better. The Gauntlet clickie would be completely useless if you could only use one.

[wagorf]

You can cap STR/STA/DEX well before BiS raid gear with buffs. It will just depend on how much you like to group. A level 60 Shaman can buff your STR and DEX by 120 each, and STA by 50.

Of course shm buff will cap it......the OP is just starting a new war and you expect lvl 60 shm to be around 24/7 lol.

Can the op even get to HoT armor + best non-raid items? If not, then put points in dex + sta.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Of course shm buff will cap it......the OP is just starting a new war and you expect lvl 60 shm to be around 24/7 lol.

Can the op even get to HoT armor + best non-raid items? If not, then put points in dex + sta.

The point of thinking about starting stats IS thinking about the end game. Stats scale with level, so they get better when you... level. He isn't going to notice any difference for the first 30 levels or so.

[Jimjam]

Okay I got the cobalt items to double check, and reckless strength overwrites Kunzar. Kunzar is blocked by reckless strength.

Don't bother with the gloves unless you can't find the boots.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Okay I got the cobalt items to double check, and reckless strength overwrites Kunzar. Kunzar is blocked by reckless strength.

Don't bother with the gloves unless you can't find the boots.

Thanks for testing that out. Wow that is garbage, and might be a bug. I am certain they stacked on live, but maybe I am thinking out of Velious Era. I couldn't say for certain exactly when on the timeline it was.

[Jimjam]

You may be right about how it used to be - if you think Reckless Strength competed with Yaulp, that would also mean reckless strength also stacked with Kunzar.

Not here and now sadly though.

Kunzar also doesn't stack with the recourse effect of Steal Strength.