Does agility and dexterity do anything?

[MOBSTER_MACK]

Does agility and dexterity do anything?

If you use:

2x +7 agi +7 dex Black Pearl Velium rings
Or
2x +6 str +6 dex Fire Emerald Velium rings

Versus

2x +6 ac +65 hp Velium Fire Wedding rings

Will you solo kill same NPCs with more HP remaining after each victorious won fight?

[Jimjam]

The stats fill different roles. Hp/ac make you straight up tankier. Dex and agi are more about speeding up levelling some of your melee skills*.

The dex/agi will help a little for normal fights if you use procs or crits, or if you are close to a threshold for getting an avoidance boost (75 agi is the big one).

In the vast majority of situations I imagine hp/ac will be better.


*its a flawed implementation as most levels are so long your skills will be maxed by the time you ding regardless of stats.

[Samoht]

AGI does basically nothing in this game. DEX will improve your procrate if you're using proccing weapons.

Do not use black pearl rings.

STR will increase your damage output making things die faster.

Fire emerald can be an okay choice in the right circumstances.

HP/AC will allow you to soak more damage, meaning you live longer.

Almost all my characters wear 5/55 or 6/65 rings.

Melee classes + shaman + enchanter. They're just that good.

[starkind]

The ac from agi doesn't count towards the softcap for your class.

It was useful on live to enchanters doing a lot of mezzing.

110 hp is pretty meaningless later on. It's very significant under lvl 30 so everyone gets overly attached to their baby rings.

[Naethyn]

HP > ALL

[kaev]

HP > ALL

Exception: Playing a nightblind race (applies only on Green) outdoors solo, if glowing stone band is your only wearable vision item it is worth a lot more to survival (and successful single pulls) during the dark part of the night than 65hp.

Otherwise 100% agree.

[tycohunden]

I once got close to max agi through buffs for some reason in plane of sky, when it was time to leave I attacked the key master dwarf and the fucker who usually hits you for 32k MISSED, and MISSED TWICE, at which point he stopped fucking around and DT'd me...
Conclusion: AGI is the most powerful stat.
I believe in AGI Santa!
Don't forget we're dealing with code written far along into the future, for us in our time capsule. No one knows what rules really are at play!

[Allishia]

I once got close to max agi through buffs for some reason in plane of sky, when it was time to leave I attacked the key master dwarf and the fucker who usually hits you for 32k MISSED, and MISSED TWICE, at which point he stopped fucking around and DT'd me...
Conclusion: AGI is the most powerful stat.
I believe in AGI Santa!
Don't forget we're dealing with code written far along into the future, for us in our time capsule. No one knows what rules really are at play!

Yes I agree, agility is the best stat and makes you dodge more hits /nod. The ac is real and better then shield ac! :p

[Naethyn]

If only verant didn't give monks the block skill and instead knights and warriors got it when a shield is equipped and it was based on agi.

[Tunabros]

nothing matters for tank except for HP

everything else can be stacked up with velious gear

[Naethyn]

CHA is hard to max.

[Danth]

Will you solo kill same NPCs with more HP remaining after each victorious won fight?

No. typically not, unless you're below 75 agility. The mitigation granted by 12 AC from two 6/65 rings will average out to greater damage reduction than the avoidance gained by 14 agility. Furthermore unless you're a paladin (who can readily self-heal) the higher hitpoints from the HP/AC rings means you can bind wound that much higher.

Gearing for dexterity has some merit if you're reliant on weapon special effects.

I do not fully agree with the "HP>ALL" crowd, specifically not with the "all" part. Some of us aren't getting complete heals all the time. Eventually most tank types wear basically similar equipment anyway because you have to use what's available.

Danth

[Tunabros]

CHA is hard to max.

charisma is only needed for divine intervention

and OP doesnt seem to be going that route in hardcore raiding

but that being said divine intervention (from my experience) always seem to not

proc despite having decent charisma (talking like 90+ ish?)

anyways, if i ever see a warrior taking off gear to put on charisma gear

im stopping my ch chain and /guildleave

that being said charisma is pretty useless

[Allishia]

charisma is only needed for divine intervention

and OP doesnt seem to be going that route in hardcore raiding

but that being said divine intervention (from my experience) always seem to not

proc despite having decent charisma (talking like 90+ ish?)

anyways, if i ever see a warrior taking off gear to put on charisma gear

im stopping my ch chain and /guildleave

that being said charisma is pretty useless

Ya I dunno about all the divine hype. My dark elf buffs to like 120 something cha but even without Cha buff it always fires...I guess maybe ogres need it I dunno

[Jimjam]

Charisma gets that extra gold out of that cracked staff and lets you afford one, maybe even two more bandages. That extra charisma is worth literally hundreds of hp ;).

[Grumph]

Charisma gets that extra gold out of that cracked staff and lets you afford one, maybe even two more bandages. That extra charisma is worth literally hundreds of hp ;).

Big brain long game high status pro strats right here!

[Naethyn]

CHA is the only stat end game warrior doesn't cap, and the "best" warrior races are the worst at it.

[Tunabros]

true tbh

i always thought charisma for end game raiding were more for monks when pulling

than warriors

[starkind]

I always just decide what number I like seeing big and just go for it.

Once u got a pair of jagged bands, Dwarven workboots, you're pretty much going to be ok.

[starkind]

Charisma>Agility>dexterity>wisdom>ac>strength >intelligence>stamina>mana>hp

[long.liam]

AC and HP are the two most important for Tanks. Procs are nice but only a small part of hate generation. White damage is most of it.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

It depends on your class, level range, what content you are doing, and how many people you are playing with. OP hasn't stated his class, level, or player count preference, but I will assume non 60 Warrior for now that solos and groups.

Levels 1-40:
HP Regen, Max HP, Haste, and decent ratio weapons are all you need. Mobs level 1-39 are not balanced for players running around with +15HP regen from a Fungi, +500HP from gear, 20%+ Haste, and decent ratio weapons. Everquest stat scaling is very end game oriented. This means you are getting little returns from STA/WIS/INT in terms of HP/Mana. Most proc weapons are 45+, so DEX is basically useless. AGI always scales poorly past 75, and STR/ATK don't matter too much with damage caps and low skill caps (more misses). CHA also doesn't matter, as you are not getting Divine Intervention at low levels. Resistances generally aren't too necessary at this range, as the HP and HP Regen will soak the lower damage spells. They are only really useful if you are fighting a magic caster that can do things like root, slow, etc. AC is obviously good, but this level range isn't balanced for people running around with good gear, so if you have something like 140 worn AC (the equivalent of a full set of Fine Plate), you will be above average already. If you have a Fungi, +500HP, and 20%+ Haste, you can easily hit 140 worn AC or more.

Levels 40-50:
This is a bit of a grey area, and highly depends on what gear you have access to. Mobs start hitting much harder (which means Max HP and HP Regen are doing less for you), you are still waiting on clickies/proc weapons, and stat scaling/skill levels are starting to get good. In general I would say just stick to whatever equipment you have already, and hopefully you have some good clickies/proc weapons waiting to be used. Resistances may start to matter here, depending on what you are fighting, but in general there are still plenty of Warrior mobs you can fight for simplicity, both in Solo and Group content that give good XP. At this level range you can also start using some of the better easy to get hate generation weapons, if you prefer to group.

Levels 50-59:
During this phase of the game most equipment has opened up in terms of procs and clickies, stat scaling is good, and spell casters start to get nasty. At this point you should go for a more balanced approach. Get swappable resistance gear for nasty casters and lower level raids. Make sure you have enough HP, STA, AC, and HP Regen to not die. While it is difficult to give a one size fits all answer, you honestly don't need much more than 1k AC and 3kHP. Once you have achieved that, you can start raising STR/DEX/ATK (and haste if you can afford it) for faster kill speeds. Faster kill speeds mean more kills per hour, which means more XP and loot. If you prefer to group, get the best hate generation weapons you can. If you prefer to solo, get as many clickies and utility proc weapons as you can, those will help more than stats. You still need to grind to 60, and most solo/group content does not need more than 1k AC and 3kHP. This is because mobs hit harder, which means Max HP and HP Regen are doing less for you. Unless you are raiding on a different character and giving raid loot to your Warrior, the amount of good STA and +HP items you have available to you haven't changed much since the lower level ranges. For example, 130 HP (Two 6/65 Rings) is the equivalent of one max hit from a mob at this level range. If a fight was decided by 130 HP, the problem was the encounter and your skill level, not your equipment.

Level 60:
Once you have maxed out your level, most Warriors want to raid. This means stacking as much HP as possible and capping STA, while trying to sprinkle in AC and resistances when you can, by getting gear that gives you all three. The reason why you stack HP for raiding is because you are generally getting healed by a CH chain, so more HP means more efficient heals, and more room for CH chain error. Some raid bosses basically ignore AC and Resistances, which is why Max HP ends up being the best all around stat. However, some raid bosses DO need AC and Resistances, so if you ONLY get Max HP, you will end up swapping out gear, which means you are lowering your HP. Most Warrior raid loot is quite expensive due to it being highly contested, so you need to pick your battles in terms of what gear you spend DKP on, unless you are a hardcore raider with something like 50% attendance. For example, lets look at the leg slot, which were debated recently in other threads. For Warrior Legs, the top three items are 1. Wurm Hide, 2. Koi Greaves, 3. SS Greaves. Buying Koi Greaves for 200 DKP is a pretty big waste, as they only give you +4AC and +15HP over SS Greaves, which are fairly easy to get. You also lose the +MR from the SS Greaves. It is much better to either save that DKP for Wurm Hide, or use it on another slot for a better upgrade. At the end of the day BiS Warrior gear is giving you great AC, HP, and Resistances all at the same time, and those are the items you want to shoot for when spending your DKP. This will allow you to maintain all three of those stats very well, without having to switch out gear and sacrifice one for the other.

[zati]

^ This guy can EQ. /clap. i wish this forum had a reputation or points sys so i could 1+ ya, and -1 all the "herpderp hp is everything, no explanation, never stepped outta tov" posts

[Philistine]

^ This guy can EQ. /clap. i wish this forum had a reputation or points sys so i could 1+ ya

I second this! I may not always agree with everything said, but I can count on thoughtful, well explained presentation of information/opinion/etc. when I see Shamwowi post.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

^ This guy can EQ. /clap. i wish this forum had a reputation or points sys so i could 1+ ya, and -1 all the "herpderp hp is everything, no explanation, never stepped outta tov" posts

I second this! I may not always agree with everything said, but I can count on thoughtful, well explained presentation of information/opinion/etc. when I see Shamwowi post.

Thanks! Glad I could help:)

[greenspectre]

I don't remember where, but Meathookk on green tested AGI as a 60 monk vs cliff golems and a huge AGI difference made actual zero difference in damage taken against NPC's, but against players in dueling it mattered. Wish I knew where the link was, as it is wiki-worthy material. I now totally ignore AGI on gear.

[Jimjam]

Agi boosts the avoidance score (alongside the defense skill). The biggest boosts are between 50 and 75. Technically there are improvements to your avoidance score after 75, but these are smaller and if you are facing blue cons or under the chances are your avoidance stat is so far beyond their accuracy parsing wouldn’t shoe any difference.

I suspect parsing may show improvements for agility 75+ against whites, yellows and reds but this improvement would be far overshadowed by the jump between 69 and 75 agi.

But who has the time to parse 100 hours of chain healing vs yellow/ red under controlled conditions?

[Jimjam]

Personally I view agi as a secondary carry stat - a way to mitigate encumbrance. It is also handy if you are fighting somewhere with enemies that cast a lot of incapacitate. Feels good to drop 50 agi but still be above 75 ‘penalty’.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Yeah AGI isn't worth purposely getting items for sadly. Its a nice bonus if you happen to get it on an item with other stats, as it does increase AC a little bit. I think its something like 4 AGI per 1 AC or something. Its been a while since I tried to figure out the formula, but it is pretty minimal sadly. I have no idea how the avoidance score increase works, nor have I tested it.

I agree with Jimjam, it can be nice to prevent you from going under 75 when encumbered.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Just cast Deliriously Nimble on my Shaman to test it out.

Without the buff I have 90 AGI and 1204 AC.
With the buff I have 142 AGI and 1217 AC.

So it is basically 4 AGI per 1 AC once you are above 75 AGI. At least on a Priest, not sure if the formula changes for Tanks, or if it is affected by the softcap. Not great to be honest, but again it is a nice bonus stat if you happen to get it on an item with other good stats. It never hurts to get a bit of extra AC. Something like a 6+ Neck or Hierophant Cloak would be giving you at least 1 bonus AC with the AGI it has, for example.

[Naethyn]

AC displayed in inventory has almost nothing to do with "real AC" that is actually calculated in damage.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

AC displayed in inventory has almost nothing to do with "real AC" that is actually calculated in damage.

That is a good point, I am not sure if it is simply a client bug that is causing AC to increase with AGI on the sheet, or if it is actually increasing it.

As previously stated by multiple people in this thread, it is generally agreed upon that AGI is basically the least useful stat in PvE (unless someone has some data to say otherwise). So It isn't worth going out of your way to stack it. All you need is 75 AGI to avoid the AC penalty, and you are good. As Jimjam points out, it can be useful when trying to avoid going under 75 when encumbered or debuffed, but that is a pretty niche case.

[long.liam]

I think it's because Avoidance AC and Mitigation AC are totaled into displayed AC, but Avoidance AC has a separate softcap from Mitigation AC above which has minimal increases in Avoidance.

[greenspectre]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=389704&highlight=agility

That's the post with intricate parse damage, check the agility section.

[Jimjam]

As I understand it, displayed AC is a composite stat that gives a rough idea of your combined mitigation and avoidance. It isn’t actually directly used in any equation itself.

[demokatt]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=389704&highlight=agility

That's the post with intricate parse damage, check the agility section.

Interesting read.. especially when it comes to meele STR. It does affect damage output but it was far less then I thought. Barely noticable if u have 170 or 255 if Im playing atleast.
Which is good since my war is gnomie *grin*

[oldschoolguy]

Ahi affects dodge and armor
Decent affects your miss rate

Iirc

[oldschoolguy]

Ahi affects dodge and armor
Decent affects your miss rate

Iirc

auto correct got me on that one.

Agi = more dodges (that's all I remember it doing)
Dex = you hit more often (miss less).

However, I don't remember how much nor I even know the value of each one. The only one that's known is Stamina scaling your HP and Str is 10 Str = 1.7% dmg increase.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

auto correct got me on that one.

Agi = more dodges (that's all I remember it doing)
Dex = you hit more often (miss less).

However, I don't remember how much nor I even know the value of each one. The only one that's known is Stamina scaling your HP and Str is 10 Str = 1.7% dmg increase.

Dex does not affect hit chance sadly. It would be more useful if it did. I am not suprised you think that though. There was a lot of misinformation back during live. The Kunark strategy guide actually states Dex is used for hit chance, but it isnt true. DEX is used for increasing proc chance on proc weapons.

AGI does help with dodge, but very minimally from everything I hear. Havent seen any good data to suggest otherwise. Just stay above 75 AGI to avoid the big penalty you get from being under 75.

[oldschoolguy]

Dex does not affect hit chance sadly. It would be more useful if it did. I am not suprised you think that though. There was a lot of misinformation back during live. The Kunark strategy guide actually states Dex is used for hit chance, but it isnt true. DEX is used for increasing proc chance on proc weapons.

AGI does help with dodge, but very minimally from everything I hear. Havent seen any good data to suggest otherwise. Just stay above 75 AGI to avoid the big penalty you get from being under 75.

Thanks, that's good to know. There was so little we knew back then, so yeah a lot of my info might be outdated or wrong these days. I play enchanter right now, and half the time I wonder if what I'm doing or gearing even matters the way I think it does. Trial and error.