Live modern EQ1 would dominate wow...

[starkind]

If it was way less grindy. Had a catchup mechanic. And older content could be more easily solo exploreded.

[Baler]

if EQ came out today, it would be considered indie trash.

[Mblake1981]

So you want WoW, brilliant thinking there.

Edit: No but to address your post, it wouldn't work. It would be a different game and would fall in line with the inspirations of WoW. It is hard to escape the gravity of its black hole.

[starkind]

The level designers in EQ are still the best. Basically what makes or breaks an MMO are those textured rocks and little beds and campfires in the goblins homes.

[Baler]

The level designers in EQ are still the best. Basically what makes or breaks an MMO are those textured rocks and little beds and campfires in the goblins homes.

Only because EverQuest was the first big 3d mmo. You can't account for EQ being first 3d popular mmo if it came out today.

You'd also see UO being an a bigger influence. Because the eq team and wow team admitted they took several nods from UO.

UO was the first big mainstream mmo.

Before that you had aol neverwinter nights.

[Mblake1981]

Meridian 59 as well.

But I would point out that thinking "would dominate wow" would only lead to being some hand-me-down version of it. It has made itself into the most convenient that gameplay is judged by it (Op).

I judge games by EQ, all fall short. They can't "Get the spices right"

PfxabSYFs88

My point takes place when you consider that computer games took a back seat to multiplatforming, WoW might be the last 'Big' Windows game. You couldn't find that on a console.

With Windows 11 sporting Android Apps it doesn't paint a good looking future. "Don't you all have Desktops?"

[Nocht]

I highly doubt it, especially with modern gamers. EQ was great largely due to the mystique the game had, stuff like youtube and wiki would absolutely destroy that effect.

[Mesocyclone]

Name one modern 3d mmorpg that has visual paperdoll gear on the characters and monsters (weapons). How big is the item database, 25,000+? Best MMO ever hands down, none are in the same ballpark.

[myrddraal]

What are you talking about lol.

Im pretty sure you can start with a character boosted to like level 85, buy XP potions, get double XP aas and a ton of other tools like defiant gear to get you "good enough" until high level group content.

[unsunghero]

What are you talking about lol.

Im pretty sure you can start with a character boosted to like level 85, buy XP potions, get double XP aas and a ton of other tools like defiant gear to get you "good enough" until high level group content.

This. I boxed 2 chars from level 1 to 115ish on live

If you want to pay $15/mo (insane for a game this old), it unlocks the highest tier of merc. If you wanted to box 2 chars, you could literally sit afk and the highest tier of tank merc with the healer merc alone would completely chew through old content without the healer merc’s mana even dropping. Even trains aren’t a problem because the highest tier of mercs don’t run (the lower tiers do run from too many adds)

Then there’s the defiant gear. We’re talking about like +10-15 per stat for every single stat on like a level 20 piece of gear. Your stats are crazy with it, the only downside is the weapon ratios were crap if I remember right. It becomes completely obsolete eventually and is the sign of a new player if you are still wearing it past a certain level however. Oh and defiant gear has a chance to drop from any mob in the game and is sold for dirt cheap on the bazaar

Then there’s all the things you can buy from the shop. Exp pots, clarity pots, super fast mounts. Luckily no insane gear, just transmogs

But basically the entire beginning expansions to the game were completely trivialized by mercs and defiant gear. I don’t remember ever being in danger of dying on my box duo until long after I had replaced all my defiant gear and moved into current expansion content

The only real grind on live is AA’s. I believe I had about 12,000 on each char which was all the remotely useful stuff maxed. Live did require a lot more micro with all the additional abilities and cooldowns you unlock with AA’s though

Once you got to current expansion content it became difficult. After house of Thule I believe is when mob health started taking humongous jumps to where if you didn’t have competitive group gear you could be fighting trash mobs for 20 minutes trying to chew through their health. And mobs zipped around at lightning speeds and did 5,000-10,000 damage quads so if a blue got into melee range of my casters for even a split second at level 115, my rune/shield was gone and I was dead in less time than I could hit the harmshield button

[Mblake1981]

If I had all the monies and some help for a studio...

Take original - velious as the starting point. Use the original engine with the textures updated (ElfHD). Expand on the old world. There is all that land, ocean and AIR to fill with things to do, other places to level. You could support far more players on a single server with this amount of space.

It would make no money as the core game doesn't sit well with WoW influenced players. WoW was made to 'fix' the problems EQ had. The problems are why I play.

[A Knight]

If it was way less grindy. Had a catchup mechanic. And older content could be more easily solo exploreded.

That would be ok to add Wow questlines. I could do some kind of WOW level up bonus or rest exp, I just would still want hard coded classic EQ around.

As far as the last point, it would be complicated. We would still have to find a way that melee suck but can solo. All I can think of is melee damage is lowered per group member added. Would be interesting if a rusty weapon was viable for solo. I have thought of "out of game lore context" ideas like this. (Can't think of another name.) Where it would be a cool idea, but the idea is so complicated and the complicity makes the game feel out of place, that it makes it a bad idea.

I'm down for any version of an MMORPG that is above a 6.5 rating. Just as long as EQ classic is around.

[Jibartik]

Me looking at New World:

https://i.imgur.com/jC3mQue.png

[A Knight]

Oh sorry, I thought you said if EQ classic was released today.

[Nocht]

Take Valheim/ARK and inject it with EQ and you could have a serious contender.

I would limit the server size to around 1,000 and just create multiple shards that any player could travel to and from. Allow private server hosting like in ARK:Survival Evolved and let players keep to themselves and guilds if they want to. It would solve a lot of the issues mmorpgs have with overly toxic players being disruptive.

The next great mmo would have to be more sandboxy than a themepark imo.

[Mblake1981]

Me looking at New World:

https://i.imgur.com/jC3mQue.png

haha

[A Knight]

I still have hope for Pantheon. I probably won't be able to try it for another year with the things are going, unfortunately. I don't know if their first alpha was released yet, last time I check it sounded soon.

If Pantheon fails, I think the best hope for a new, extremely fun, enjoying classic EQ for the first time feeling game, would be to throw in very odd random ideas, and randomly generate something.

[Ooloo]

Wow is tailored for the bitchmade. EQ1 isn't. There are far more bitchmade people. It says nothing about which game is better, only which is more popular.

[Tunabros]

if EQ came out today, it would be considered indie trash.

[Ooloo]

Being able to fully loot other people's corpses with /consent in early EQ is the most naive decision in mmo history. And it came *after* UO!

[starkind]

Take Valheim/ARK and inject it with EQ and you could have a serious contender.

I would limit the server size to around 1,000 and just create multiple shards that any player could travel to and from. Allow private server hosting like in ARK:Survival Evolved and let players keep to themselves and guilds if they want to. It would solve a lot of the issues mmorpgs have with overly toxic players being disruptive.

The next great mmo would have to be more sandboxy than a themepark imo.

This does seem cool

And yeah. Sandbox all the way.

And don't destroy emergent gameplay immediately to try and control subscription time.

And f2p and botting or gameplay that encourages botting and automation is what really hurts subscriptions.

[Nocht]

I would go buy to play. It worked for ARK, you just gotta downsize on the server size. Give people the option to run their own servers and partner with the company that rents them.

One thing ive learned from years of observing mmorpgs is that people don't really want to play with everyone and will form smaller communities within the larger servers. Allow the sweaty players options to keep to themselves away from the casuals and it would be beneficiary to all.

[starkind]

I would go buy to play. It worked for ARK, you just gotta downsize on the server size. Give people the option to run their own servers and partner with the company that rents them.

One thing ive learned from years of observing mmorpgs is that people don't really want to play with everyone and will form smaller communities within the larger servers. Allow the sweaty players options to keep to themselves away from the casuals and it would be beneficiary to all.

u r very eloquent and full of deep knowledge, thank u for echoing my thoughts in a more coherent form

[HalflingSpergand]

Being able to fully loot other people's corpses with /consent in early EQ is the most naive decision in mmo history. And it came *after* UO!

I liked it, it forced you to take the risk and find out if you could trust someone or else get it yourself

[Jimjam]

I liked it, it forced you to take the risk and find out if you could trust someone or else get it yourself

The devs weren’t naiive that thefts would happen - eq was a wild west horror survival - potential betrayal with /consent was by design.

They were naiive that players wouldn’t be complacent in their trust and would be crybabies when they gave their stuff away to someone untrustworthy.

[Jibartik]

Valhiem I thought literally would become a wow compeditor haha

[Mblake1981]

Allow the sweaty players options to keep to themselves away from the casuals and it would be beneficiary to all.

Here comes multiplatforming with Bioshock to save us all.

Valhiem I thought literally would become a wow competitor haha

You did? that is off base by a mile.

Edit: Some players were on this board comparing it to classic EQ. Broken minds.

[Jibartik]

Did u play it? it had the spark joy.

if it were a public server based game I think it would be going strong today.

Was basically Minecraft meets Warcraft.

[Nocht]

Valheim is still in early access it could get better. ARK was a shit show when it first launched in EA and actually developed into a nice game.

[Mblake1981]

This does seem cool

It's not EQ.

Imagine disliking something so much that the only part of it you get off on is bothering people on message boards.

[Mblake1981]

Did u play it? it had the spark joy.

if it were a public server based game I think it would be going strong today.

Was basically Minecraft meets Warcraft.

Oh hell no. In this day an age games are ruined by Youtube. Back in the day it would have interested me alone on its themes (maybe) but my interest can be sated by a simple click now. Ease, convenience.

Leveling a druid by killing High Keep guards.

https://i.imgur.com/wELPFfv.jpg

It's very sad that twenty years of 'progress' was mostly console based regressions, so much that some asshole like me is stuck on it still.
'Gaming' is bigger than ever, queefs compete in tournaments, mega companies promoting, getting called up by Ninja
that you still can't beat it. https://wiki.project1999.com/Fay_Gate

[Mblake1981]

ooLO2xeyJZA

/

https://i.imgur.com/yKCizmv.jpeg

[Shawk]

Well have I got a executable for you! Unreal Engine 4!!!

AZqBWxFc69E

Made this project a few months back while learning the basics of UE4 UMG (GUI) and while learning SIDL for EQ1. Since I have added a lot more + networking which is why I recommend UE4 because it makes networking *replication* very straight forward.

[Mblake1981]

https://i.imgur.com/AfbWEFQ.png

https://i.imgur.com/eMRzdRb.jpg

[Mblake1981]

43qp2TUNEFY

[Whale biologist]

Well have I got a executable for you! Unreal Engine 4!!!

AZqBWxFc69E

Made this project a few months back while learning the basics of UE4 UMG (GUI) and while learning SIDL for EQ1. Since I have added a lot more + networking which is why I recommend UE4 because it makes networking *replication* very straight forward.

Eventually someone will have the attention span to finish a project like this and the internet will be good again. :)

[Mblake1981]

The flexible and animated UI would be nice to have for any future Windows game. I have a long standing disagreement with multiplatforming as they must be controller compatible. A regression from a desktop computer. EQ is a desktop computer game.

What if the UI for eq reflected your race, class and diety choice. Gnomes would be all gears and tinkering stuff.

[Mblake1981]

That last new piece of hardware for computers (related to games) was the Ageia PhysX card around 07. Nvidia bought them and incorporated the technology (Geralts hair hah)

EQ doesn't have physics like that, its completely better for it. Flowing capes are gross (DAoC).

I favor the older design before they went hog wild for consoles that lead into mobile. There was little hope for the Rebels during the PC vs. Consoles wars, the leaders were secret members of the console empire. They lasted long as they could. Today you can only find remnants of them if you know where to look, mostly in those old cantinas on planets people have long forgot.

[Gwaihir]

Only because EverQuest was the first big 3d mmo. You can't account for EQ being first 3d popular mmo if it came out today.

You'd also see UO being an a bigger influence. Because the eq team and wow team admitted they took several nods from UO.

UO was the first big mainstream mmo.

Before that you had aol neverwinter nights.

No. It's because EQ was a solid 3D MMO based upon the DND 3.5 ruleset, which was not conducive to "class balance" whatsoever in it's inception.

People wanted to be able to play DND in a world where they didn't have to rely on a DM to clumsily put together their adventures: that, and an extensive lore system based upon esoteric cosmology. In a perfect world, I'd enjoy querying the mythos designers for the conceptualizations built into the EQ universe.

[Whale biologist]

No. It's because EQ was a solid 3D MMO based upon the DND 3.5 ruleset, which was not conducive to "class balance" whatsoever in it's inception.

People wanted to be able to play DND in a world where they didn't have to rely on a DM to clumsily put together their adventures: that, and an extensive lore system based upon esoteric cosmology. In a perfect world, I'd enjoy querying the mythos designers for the conceptualizations built into the EQ universe.

3.5 came out way after EQ, gaylord.

[Gwaihir]

3.5 came out way after EQ, gaylord.

Whatever. 3rd edition released publicly shortly after, and EQ was already designed on the D20 ruleset, which is why damage interval is designed the way that it is.

[Mblake1981]

https://i.imgur.com/AUGG4V2.png

https://i.imgur.com/9nPwB5D.png

https://i.imgur.com/Cb8IjQw.png

[Mblake1981]

GNG3I0oWaJo

[Mblake1981]

EQ is a solid Windows 3D MMORPG.

ftfy

You know they later stripped out racial vision because it got in the way. Remove all the flavor from the steak before you serve it.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=284891

https://i.imgur.com/yIWDKWC.png
https://i.imgur.com/Q1qqAWX.png

https://i.imgur.com/7L76VQa.png
https://i.imgur.com/5ZmH1Rj.png

[Mblake1981]

Coming soon to Windows 11 for all you men of brains.

j6XRbwii8WM

Hey guys, I have a great idea. Lets use mobile influences combined
with console dumbing down for your Desktop games.

https://i.imgur.com/s6HYUQ2.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Bpc5d3b.jpg

[Mblake1981]

liquor before beer, never fear

https://wiki.project1999.com/Bleeding_Brain

https://wiki.project1999.com/Skull_Ale

G'night, fools

[Danth]

You know they later stripped out racial vision because it got in the way. Remove all the flavor from the steak before you serve it.

That series you linked wouldn't be nearly such an entertaining read if it were written by a native english speaker or ran through modern grammar/sentence-check software. It isn't just games that are becoming more normalized and "vanilla" and boring. Lots of things seem like they're on some sort of path toward dull uninspired singularity. Heck, I can't even tell most cars apart anymore except by the badges. Too much design by committee and focus groups out there lately. I don't know that quality can be produced by people who are overly worried about offending or displeasing others. That sort of thinking gets you Soviet apartment blocks--efficient and functional and dreary as can be.

It's the norm for our era. It'll change, as all things do with time, but probably not soon enough to do you or I much good.

Danth

[Whale biologist]

“[..]Although personally, I think cyberspace means the end of our species."
Yes? Why is that?"
Because it means the end of innovation," Malcolm said. "This idea that the whole world is wired together is mass death. Every biologist knows that small groups in isolation evolve fastest. You put a thousand birds on an ocean island and they'll evolve very fast. You put ten thousand on a big continent, and their evolution slows down. Now, for our own species, evolution occurs mostly through our behaviour. We innovate new behaviour to adapt. And everybody on earth knows that innovation only occurs in small groups. Put three people on a committee and they may get something done. Ten people, and it gets harder. Thirty people, and nothing happens. Thirty million, it becomes impossible. That's the effect of mass media - it keeps anything from happening. Mass media swamps diversity. It makes every place the same. Bangkok or Tokyo or London: there's a McDonald's on one corner, a Benetton on another, a Gap across the street. Regional differences vanish. All differences vanish. In a mass-media world, there's less of everything except the top ten books, records, movies, ideas. People worry about losing species diversity in the rain forest. But what about intellectual diversity - our most necessary resource? That's disappearing faster than trees. But we haven't figured that out, so now we're planning to put five billion people together in cyberspace. And it'll freeze the entire species. Everything will stop dead in its tracks. Everyone will think the same thing at the same time. Global uniformity. [..]”

https://i.imgur.com/RG0BS1U.gif

[Arteker]

No. I would not even work , everquest like most rpgs of his time come to be from the 80s generation wich grow with ADD and other rpgs of the age.

the players shaped these games , u just had to look at the names of players back then wich would try to blend into the game with roleplaying names .

[Arteker]

No. It's because EQ was a solid 3D MMO based upon the DND 3.5 ruleset, which was not conducive to "class balance" whatsoever in it's inception.

People wanted to be able to play DND in a world where they didn't have to rely on a DM to clumsily put together their adventures: that, and an extensive lore system based upon esoteric cosmology. In a perfect world, I'd enjoy querying the mythos designers for the conceptualizations built into the EQ universe.

i gotta say i stoped caring about dnd because i feelt than the older rule set was better and bland than old one.

[Mblake1981]

https://i.imgur.com/XAPwvjI.png

No. I would not even work , everquest like most rpgs of his time come to be from the 80s generation wich grow with ADD and other rpgs of the age.

the players shaped these games , u just had to look at the names of players back then wich would try to blend into the game with roleplaying names .

The Fantastic Adventures of Tablechair the Barbarian and his trusty sidekick Starbucks Coffeebrew

[Gustoo]

I liked it, it forced you to take the risk and find out if you could trust someone or else get it yourself

agreed, it was pretty cool in old days. YOu don't just let any random corpse drag for you.

[Mblake1981]

https://i.imgur.com/RG0BS1U.gif

rxqHVoZ0fzc

https://i.imgur.com/Qp6da9D.png

[starkind]

there will obviously never be another game like eq probably ever again maybe until we do it in VR iteration

or w/e the next fad is to take after PCs and movies and stuff

but it still won't be EQ it'll be something a lil diff

it has to be hard enough 2make and full of enough limitations and niavety 2 make a wierd buggy strange unique game like eq was made by basically poor ppl on an extended line of massive credit like verant and 989 and sony eq was supposed to be making sports games but they did all this work and had to make a studio to pump something out b4 it was truly finished and was patched a bunch

EQ was some rich persons love letter to nerds and Brad's dreams. aka firiona vie

[Mblake1981]

there will obviously never be another game like eq probably ever again maybe until we do it in VR iteration

Be my guest to flail your arms around like an idiot. Remember to share photos so we can make jokes.

or w/e the next fad is to take after PCs and movies and stuff

Mobile phones and social media already did.

but it still won't be EQ it'll be something a lil diff

more than just a 'lil'

it has to be hard enough 2make and full of enough limitations and niavety 2 make a wierd buggy strange unique game like eq was made by basically poor ppl on an extended line of massive credit like verant and 989 and sony eq was supposed to be making sports games but they did all this work and had to make a studio to pump something out b4 it was truly finished and was patched a bunch

Yep.

EQ was some rich persons love letter to nerds and Brad's dreams. aka firiona vie

It was one of the developers. One of his table top games had an elf city named Firiona Vie. Keith Parkinson turned that into the elf chic with huge knockers that we all appreciate today. EQ developers later turned into an elf city with the same name.

https://loreofnorrath.wordpress.com/2021/04/19/an-interview-with-bill-trost-2004/

Bill Trost

But my good friends Kevin Burns (EQoA) and Tony Garcia (EQ2), along with all the other designers and artists contributed incredibly to the content design and quest creation. A great many of the now familiar characters and places of Norrath actually came from an old pen and paper RPG campaign world I created as a teenager. Tony was a player in that campaign so he and I worked well together and had similar goals for what we wanted the world of Norrath to be. It is incredible and very surreal to hear people talk about all the names of our old characters and such. “Firiona Vie,” for example, was actually in my original campaign an ancient Elven city, not a hot Elf babe. Here is a bit of previously unrevealed trivia: the name, “Firiona Vie,” in that campaign, translated from Elvish meant “The Flowering Place.” It seemed to be a fitting name for EQ’s beautiful Elven spokesmodel.

-----

Hey guys, have you heard about WoW?

https://i.imgur.com/AfIduFW.jpeg

[Rick Sanchez]

The zone design in this game is still second to none.

[Muggens]

Anyone talking about Mortal Online 2? It looks good, but I dont have the PC for it to try it out myself.