Range slot item display bug **IMPORTANT**

[Jimjam]

I have discovered, with the help of a fellow player, the most heinous bug to affect rangers, and indeed all combatants of the bow and fashionquesters of the range slot.

I always argued that rangers perhaps fulfil an important role in this game, but my confidence in this position has been shattered.

It has been brought to my attention that items in the ranged slot DO NOT DISPLAY TO OTHER PLAYERS.

This bug occurs both when a ranged attack is used and even when a ranged item is unequipped and reequipped. Warriors are looking ridiculous shooting arrows out of their offhand shield whilst hugging their primary weapon tight.

I think we can all agree this visual display bug is devastating in terms of fashionquest and makes rangers unplayable from this perspective.

Please fix <3

[nilbog]

So, I've been working with this and have a few questions.


Currently on my dev server, I have:
-Ranged items displaying (to the player and other players) when first equipped, or when range attack is activated.


Questions so far:

1. Should all range items be displayed? For example, if I have a 1hs in primary, 1hb in secondary, and an Idol of the Thorned in ranged. If I click the Idol to my cursor, and reequip it in the ranged slot, should players only see a 'bag' displayed on one hand? This is the way I remember it but wanted more opinions/evidence.

2. If a player has nothing equipped in primary or secondary slots, but has something equipped in ranged. Should the ranged item take display precedence over empty primary/secondary slots, or should it only appear when used or reequipped?

Any input or collaboration would be appreciated.

[CrazyPro]

1. Should all range items be displayed? For example, if I have a 1hs in primary, 1hb in secondary, and an Idol of the Thorned in ranged. If I click the Idol to my cursor, and reequip it in the ranged slot, should players only see a 'bag' displayed on one hand? This is the way I remember it but wanted more opinions/evidence.

As far as I know, your character should be shown holding the last item that you equipped/used, so yes. If you hit ranged attack, even with a non-weapon in your ranged slot, it should swap to your character holding that item in their offhand, and if you turn on auto attack, it will swap to you holding your mainhand/offhand.

2. If a player has nothing equipped in primary or secondary slots, but has something equipped in ranged. Should the ranged item take display precedence over empty primary/secondary slots, or should it only appear when used or reequipped?

Just went on live to test this, if I have nothing in my primary or secondary slots, it will show me holding my ranged slot item in my offhand, and then when I zone out it will just show me empty-handed until I reequip my ranged item, when pressing ranged attack it does not swap to show my ranged item after zoning until I first turn auto attack on and then off. When I use auto attack it swaps to my bare fists, when I use bash with my ranged item showing it does not swap to my fists.

[CrazyPro]

Also that reminds me of a bug I found awhile back, where if you press ranged attack with a corpse targeted and a throwing weapon in your ranged slot, it just adds it (visually) to your offhand without making your primary disappear.

https://i.imgur.com/a67Uzl5.png

[Jimjam]

Also that reminds me of a bug I found awhile back, where if you press ranged attack with a corpse targeted and a throwing weapon in your ranged slot, it just adds it (visually) to your offhand without making your primary disappear.

https://i.imgur.com/a67Uzl5.png

I remember being in PoK and seeing a bug that let you display primary and range together, but I have no idea whether these types of bugs predated PoP and if so by now long.

Nilbog I haven’t found evidence to answer your questions beyond memory and testimony like in this thread of “this is how I remember it”. I do have a question for you though: have you tested this while under illusion that doesn’t show equipped weapons (i.e. wolf form) just to make sure nothing janky happens there?

[CrazyPro]

have you tested this while under illusion that doesn’t show equipped weapons (i.e. wolf form) just to make sure nothing janky happens there?

99% sure they literally can't display weapons at all whatsoever because they literally have no attachment points on the model for the weapon to go.

[Jimjam]

99% sure they literally can't display weapons at all whatsoever because they literally have no attachment points on the model for the weapon to go.

Yeah, this is what I’m worried about - that the new code is compatible with that. I’d hate to have a crash when spitting fletch in doggystyle!

[Baugi]

-Ranged items displaying (to the player and other players) when first equipped, or when range attack is activated.

Activating range attack didn't cause ranged item to be displayed to other players.

https://web.archive.org/web/20011117153442/http://www.aethie.com/TalismanToVN.wmv
0:03 - 0:07

[sammoHung]

Activating range attack didn't cause ranged item to be displayed to other players.

https://web.archive.org/web/20011117153442/http://www.aethie.com/TalismanToVN.wmv
0:03 - 0:07

I think this was a Luclin thing, when the new fancy bows were added and new player graphics, they updated this. I concur, I don't believe ranged items showed to other players in Velious era.

[nilbog]

Nilbog I haven’t found evidence to answer your questions beyond memory and testimony like in this thread of “this is how I remember it”. I do have a question for you though: have you tested this while under illusion that doesn’t show equipped weapons (i.e. wolf form) just to make sure nothing janky happens there?

No, I haven't done any specific animal illusion testing. I also haven't committed anything while working on this - mostly wanted to familiarize myself with the system while working on other display-related issues.

Evidence so far seems to indicate players couldn't see other players ranged items. Is that only while activating ranged attacks? What about while not attacking, and equipping a bow - should other players see the change to a bow?

[Baugi]

What about while not attacking, and equipping a bow - should other players see the change to a bow?

I think equipping must have caused it to be displayed. This picture reportedly from Nov 16, 2001 shows another player holding a bow.

26099

src: https://web.archive.org/web/20230924032843/https://www.firesofheaven.org/threads/first-everquest-3-screenshots.9033/page-2

[nilbog]

The more I look into this, I think it may have been an intermittent issue between the client and the server. I'd like to know if there is any evidence of someone displaying a ranged weapon while range attacking, because that seems that is what should be happening.

[Baugi]

Best I could find is this image from 11/2001 to further confuse the issue.

26100
src: https://web.archive.org/web/20201020233745/https://legacyofsteel.net/gallery/2001-11

[BradZax]

lmao good old classic clown show equipment.

[CrazyPro]

Best I could find is this image from 11/2001 to further confuse the issue.

26100
src: https://web.archive.org/web/20201020233745/https://legacyofsteel.net/gallery/2001-11

Possibly the same bug I found on p99?

[Belambic]

Wasn't the BFG visible in the ranged slot?
It would have been rather pointless if it wasn't to have that graphic.

[Baugi]

Wasn't the BFG visible in the ranged slot?
It would have been rather pointless if it wasn't to have that graphic.

BFG was mostly used primary afaik?

I found a bow tantalizingly close to being shot -

26106

src: https://web.archive.org/web/20010723033541/http://www.trysor.com/afterlife/index2.cfm?pictureid=221

Would it be blasphemy to suggest it's probably fine to fix obvious visual bugs even if they were classic?

[CrazyPro]

Would it be blasphemy to suggest it's probably fine to fix obvious visual bugs even if they were classic?

Would be cool to have the classic bug with illusions where with bear/skelly form and whatnot the illusion would inherit armor textures and tints, so you'd have a skeleton with the dark skeleton arms if you had leather arms for example and if you were wearing blue shoes, you'd have blue skeleton feet. Panda bear fashionquest too.

[nilbog]

Would it be blasphemy to suggest it's probably fine to fix obvious visual bugs even if they were classic?

I'm currently of the opinion that players could see ranged weapons firing at certain points in the classic timeline. I can understand how this would be difficult to manage over time, due to all the different states between the client knowing what a player should personally 'see', versus what the server 'sent' for other players to see at different moments.

Waiting to see if anyone can produce evidence contrary to what has been posted.

Currently on my dev server I have ranged weapons displaying to others if they are fired. Also ranged items in general being displayed to others (they are not currently). And, after a ranged 'throwing' weapon used, visually disappearing if it was expended. Will wait on more feedback.

[Makken]

Is there good evidence of in-era (1999-2001) complaints about ranged weapons (and bows in particular) not being visible to other players? I would think that if people could not see ranged weapons/bows on live in era, we would see some trace of that issue.