People that use ‘lib’ as an insult I need your help.

[Jimjam]

I have a colleague from a relatively privileged background in middle England asked why ‘liberal’ is used as a dirty word in the states.

He is confused how the dictionary definition of liberal (social welfare, freedoms, open business) could be a bad thing in the country of liberty.

I’m lucky enough to had the opportunity to witness discussion from such honourable ‘lib hatin merkins’ as populate the p99 game and boards so did my best to offer an answer:

“Personally, I believe in the value of social programs. Not particularly due to morale or welfare arguments, but because I believe they are effective economic investments.

However, I feel many people that support such programs can be a little tone deaf or condescending (“why can’t people against these programs see they would be better off”) and fail to understand why someone that would benefit from it could be against it.

I’m involved in a computer game community which happens to include a good number of rural Americans, people that I never would have normally been able to converse with.

From my discussions with them, and from my knowledge of the emotional effects of unemployment from my company partner’s doctorate, these people are not interested in being financially better off due to social hand outs. They want real employment and economic opportunities, similar to how there used to be industrial and agricultural opportunity previously in the states. They don’t want to be non-contributors dependant on subsidies from blue city taxes. They want to be independent and in control of their lives.

For this reason, rightly or wrongly, they conflate liberal social welfare with a suppression of their ability to support themselves as individuals.”

I hope i put forward a decent, good faith representation for at least some ‘lib haters’ and was hoping you can either call me out if i am totally off the mark, or provide additional reasoning why some view ‘lib’ as a dirty word.

Please keep it civil and clean.

[magnetaress]

Old movies were the good guy with the gun would always disparage some 'liberal' politician or 'democrat'. Basically. Usually a soldier, detective, or cop on the front lines. Dealing with some choice a politician made.

Very old meme from the days before color film or technicolor.

Don't really feel like digging around youtube, but there is one really iconic scene were everyone's hero was like this, and it even stuck in my head forever. I didn't hate the character at the time. I personally thinkfeel that particular scene had a huge impact on a lot of people.

But ya, I think you hit the sentiment directly on the head. I would phrase it thus, There's an assertion that social welfare has the potential to hinder individual opportunity by creating a form of dependence or edging out less desirable employment and creating a certain class of people below poverty or below the middle class, thus entrenching them.

It may just be due to a lack of exposure, and so a lot of people that spent 50 years on a farm watching that movie and enjoying their tea, just are inclined to think this way. Understandibly, "they never needed help before". Now the economy is crashing, they don't want a hand out suddenly. (though not true as farming subsidies have been around forever), but it's an illustration of how this could work.

I think my disconnect is that this is some kind of polarized thinking, and in order to disparage one you have to rule it out completely having any positive effect. Which is troublesome.

Nothing is ever usually so clear cut.

Feel free to pass on my feelings and thoughts :D I publicly share them for just such a reason.

[Knuckle]

I have a colleague from a relatively privileged background in middle England asked why ‘liberal’ is used as a dirty word in the states.

He is confused how the dictionary definition of liberal (social welfare, freedoms, open business) could be a bad thing in the country of liberty.

I’m lucky enough to had the opportunity to witness discussion from such honourable ‘lib hatin merkins’ as populate the p99 game and boards so did my best to offer an answer:

“Personally, I believe in the value of social programs. Not particularly due to morale or welfare arguments, but because I believe they are effective economic investments.

However, I feel many people that support such programs can be a little tone deaf or condescending (“why can’t people against these programs see they would be better off”) and fail to understand why someone that would benefit from it could be against it.

I’m involved in a computer game community which happens to include a good number of rural Americans, people that I never would have normally been able to converse with.

From my discussions with them, and from my knowledge of the emotional effects of unemployment from my company partner’s doctorate, these people are not interested in being financially better off due to social hand outs. They want real employment and economic opportunities, similar to how there used to be industrial and agricultural opportunity previously in the states. They don’t want to be non-contributors dependant on subsidies from blue city taxes. They want to be independent and in control of their lives.

For this reason, rightly or wrongly, they conflate liberal social welfare with a suppression of their ability to support themselves as individuals.”

I hope i put forward a decent, good faith representation for at least some ‘lib haters’ and was hoping you can either call me out if i am totally off the mark, or provide additional reasoning why some view ‘lib’ as a dirty word.

Please keep it civil and clean.

Won't happen, I am not a liberal nor any type of maga idiot, but slurs are used to identify with the opposite party in a positive manner "i am not of thee, superiority" it doesn't have to make sense, it's an oversimplification grounded in camp band standing.

edit: referring to modern day usage by facebook warriors.

[Goodboy]

P99 forum moderators are slowly and systemically purging the conservative voices on this forum. If you wont believe me, look at the thread I just posted.

Sadly, American liberals are not free thinkers, nor do they allow freedom of thought or expression that runs contrary to their own ideology. Hence me being banned on this forum for having an avatar of the sitting President of the United States.

There is a lot of ambiguity in the word liberal, but at its root, classical liberals are good people that lien far more libertarian than to the left. Progressives and Socialists highjacked the word liberal as their own.

[Jimjam]

While you are entitled to your opinion, I don’t think that post is particularly in the spirit of the OP and could be viewed as a little inflammatory. I’m aware this thread could easily spin out and kindly ask you to reconsider whether your words will aid or hinder what I hope to be discussed and edit appropriately, knuckle, and I ask that with utmost respect.

[Cassawary]

Libs choose Smith and Keynes over Smith and Wesson. 😎

[Caroll]

P99 forum moderators are slowly and systemically purging the conservative voices on this forum. If you wont believe me, look at the thread I just posted.

Sadly, American liberals are not free thinkers, nor do they allow freedom of thought or expression that runs contrary to their own ideology. Hence me being banned on this forum for having an avatar of the sitting President of the United States.

There is a lot of ambiguity in the word liberal, but at its root, classical liberals are good people that lien far more libertarian than to the left. Progressives and Socialists highjacked the word liberal as their own.

You're a loser, a traitor, and a racist. Donald Trump is a failure who lost the White House, Senate, and House.

Kick rocks and never come back. And don't forget! All elections are rigged, never vote again. Leave that to the adults. Enjoy living in your shitty fly-over state.

[Jimjam]

P99 forum moderators are slowly and systemically purging the conservative voices on this forum. If you wont believe me, look at the thread I just posted.

Sadly, American liberals are not free thinkers, nor do they allow freedom of thought or expression that runs contrary to their own ideology. Hence me being banned on this forum for having an avatar of the sitting President of the United States.

There is a lot of ambiguity in the word liberal, but at its root, classical liberals are good people that lien far more libertarian than to the left. Progressives and Socialists highjacked the word liberal as their own.

So you’re saying they are called ‘lib’ ironically? I hope to pass on some of the thoughts in this thread, if everyone is happy for me to do so.

[Goodboy]

You're a loser, a traitor, and a racist. Donald Trump is a failure who lost the White House, Senate, and House.

Kick rocks and never come back. And don't forget! All elections are rigged, never vote again. Leave that to the adults. Enjoy living in your shitty fly-over state.

Seek employment

[Caroll]

Seek employment

Stop projecting. Good bye, loser. :D :D :D

Donald Trump lost. You like Donald Trump. You like losers. :) :) :)

[Goodboy]

So you’re saying they are called ‘lib’ ironically? I hope to pass on some of the thoughts in this thread, if everyone is happy for me to do so.

its kind of like the word Gay.

The word never meant homosexual until the homos coined it as their own.

And then it was used as a pejorative. Copy?

[Caroll]

its kind of like the word Gay.

The word never meant homosexual until the homos coined it as their own.

And then it was used as a pejorative. Copy?

Reporting this to administrators for hate speech. Your bigotry is unwelcomed.

[Jimjam]

I’ve called in the authorities, i regret believing this could be discussed in good faith for even a short period.

Thank you to those who actually made an attempt.

[Knuckle]

While you are entitled to your opinion, I don’t think that post is particularly in the spirit of the OP and could be viewed as a little inflammatory. I’m aware this thread could easily spin out and kindly ask you to reconsider whether your words will aid or hinder what I hope to be discussed and edit appropriately, knuckle, and I ask that with utmost respect.

I will say the usage is quite accurate, its a word people use without thought, didn't seem like you were asking the origins, but why its used as an insult today. It's an oversimplification of anyone that doesn't agree with their version of conservative party values to discredit someone else's opinion with name calling.

[Jimjam]

I will say the usage is quite accurate, its a word people use without thought, didn't seem like you were asking the origins, but why its used as an insult today. It's an oversimplification of anyone that doesn't agree with their version of conservative party values to discredit someone else's opinion with name calling.

Thank you for that context, it’s very helpful. I don’t blame you for the screaming gibberlings entering, I was naiive to believe they wouldn’t.

[budz2112]

P99 forum moderators are slowly and systemically purging the conservative voices on this forum. If you wont believe me, look at the thread I just posted.

Sadly, American liberals are not free thinkers, nor do they allow freedom of thought or expression that runs contrary to their own ideology. Hence me being banned on this forum for having an avatar of the sitting President of the United States.

There is a lot of ambiguity in the word liberal, but at its root, classical liberals are good people that lien far more libertarian than to the left. Progressives and Socialists highjacked the word liberal as their own.

Nope sorry free thinkers throughout history have been associated with liberalism, who will at any point if something proves them wrong, change their view to what is correct. YOu on the other hand just have your own opinion, and no MATTER WHAT or WHO tells you, you are wrong, you will never listen. To pretend conservative minds are free thinkers is probably one of the most laughable phrases in history. conservatism on the other hand is known to be stuck in their way, and despise change.

[Goodboy]

Nope sorry free thinkers throughout history have been associated with liberalism, who will at any point if something proves them wrong, change their view to what is correct. YOu on the other hand just have your own opinion, and no MATTER WHAT or WHO tells you, you are wrong, you will never listen. To pretend conservative minds are free thinkers is probably one of the most laughable phrases in history. conservatism only the other hand is known to be stuck in their way, and despise change.

I can tell by your response that you did not read my post in its entirety.

[budz2112]

Seek employment

Seek supporting not a 1 term loser, who never accomplished one thing during his presidency other than tax breaks for corporations and the rich, that didnt increase employment, wages, or the GDP. Obama's economy better. FACT

[budz2112]

I can tell by your response that you did not read my post in its entirety.

I read it, I disagreed with it. GET IT?

[charmcitysking]

a lot of triggered libs on this one

[Goodboy]

I read it, I disagreed with it. GET IT?

Yes thats fine that you disagree with me. Big deal. What is confusing is that, had you read my post in its entirety, I don't think you would have disagreed with me.

My post spoke highly of classical liberals. American liberals are not free thinkers.

[Arvan]

imagine thinking moderate americans "libs" as you say are in any way socialist

[Arvan]

Its really too bad they got rid of Civics class in the US cause all these kids are clueless about politics and left/right

[Vivitron]

I have a colleague from a relatively privileged background in middle England asked why ‘liberal’ is used as a dirty word in the states.

He is confused how the dictionary definition of liberal (social welfare, freedoms, open business) could be a bad thing in the country of liberty.

I’m lucky enough to had the opportunity to witness discussion from such honourable ‘lib hatin merkins’ as populate the p99 game and boards so did my best to offer an answer:

“Personally, I believe in the value of social programs. Not particularly due to morale or welfare arguments, but because I believe they are effective economic investments.

However, I feel many people that support such programs can be a little tone deaf or condescending (“why can’t people against these programs see they would be better off”) and fail to understand why someone that would benefit from it could be against it.

I’m involved in a computer game community which happens to include a good number of rural Americans, people that I never would have normally been able to converse with.

From my discussions with them, and from my knowledge of the emotional effects of unemployment from my company partner’s doctorate, these people are not interested in being financially better off due to social hand outs. They want real employment and economic opportunities, similar to how there used to be industrial and agricultural opportunity previously in the states. They don’t want to be non-contributors dependant on subsidies from blue city taxes. They want to be independent and in control of their lives.

For this reason, rightly or wrongly, they conflate liberal social welfare with a suppression of their ability to support themselves as individuals.”

I hope i put forward a decent, good faith representation for at least some ‘lib haters’ and was hoping you can either call me out if i am totally off the mark, or provide additional reasoning why some view ‘lib’ as a dirty word.

Please keep it civil and clean.

What you describe of "liberal" is a closer fit to the Bush-Clinton era ideologically driven policy dispute. People who disagreed with the liberals* did use the word with a negative connotation, but I don't think that captures what you see today.

These days when I see "the libs" used I usually see it in the context of our culture war. The way this culture war is played is you round up some of the worst examples of people or behavior that you can associate with other side of the political/cultural aisle, and tar them with it as if it fully represents them. So "the libs" is an insult because it's a phrase that you use when you talk about how the libs are burning down their cities and taking your guns.

*Even there, "liberal" usually meant Democrats, or more specifically the less centrist Democrats, and did not necessarily match the definition of liberal used in other contexts.

[budz2112]

a lot of triggered libs on this one

We call this projection

[Caroll]

American liberals are not free thinkers.

Neat claim. Do you have any evidence? You're entitled to your own opinion, but you aren't entitled to your own facts.

The "free thinking" folks you voted with and vocally support, in the past 36 hours, have:

1.) Killed a cop in the name of "freedom."
2.) Took down an American flag and replaced it with a Trump flag.
3.) Waved the Confederate flag inside the Senate and Capitol building.
4.) Chanted death threats towards the Vice President.
5.) Constructed a "gallows" for "enemies of the people" while wearing shirts that said "Murder the Media."

These are your free thinkers. I hope you enjoy being associated with all of those things, because you are part of it.

[budz2112]

Yes thats fine that you disagree with me. Big deal. What is confusing is that, had you read my post in its entirety, I don't think you would have disagreed with me.

My post spoke highly of classical liberals. American liberals are not free thinkers.

I already told you I did read it, try to keep it up. Your wrong, and you will never change your thoughts.. Hence conservative. There is no debating a conservative they just deflect and deny, on the other hand I have long debates even with thoughts I disagreed with, with liberals.

[booter]

P99 forum moderators are slowly and systemically purging the conservative voices on this forum. If you wont believe me, look at the thread I just posted.

Sadly, American liberals are not free thinkers, nor do they allow freedom of thought or expression that runs contrary to their own ideology. Hence me being banned on this forum for having an avatar of the sitting President of the United States.

There is a lot of ambiguity in the word liberal, but at its root, classical liberals are good people that lien far more libertarian than to the left. Progressives and Socialists highjacked the word liberal as their own.

nah they are banning openly racist posters, who just happen to all be conservatives

[Goodboy]

Neat claim. Do you have any evidence? You're entitled to your own opinion, but you aren't entitled to your own facts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cMYfxOFBBM

You'll notice that I never said conservatives have the market cornered on free thinking. You really need to work on your reading comprehension.

You have done nothing but use personal attacks, accuse me of racism, threaten me with bans, call me a nazi, while I have remained mostly respectful. I dont know what has caused such animosity to well up in you, but its something that you need to take a deep look at.

[budz2112]

"mostly respectful" Now that is one BIG LEAP lollll.. Literally names himself goodboy too. Hmm its not like your like all the trolls on the internet who name themselves exactly the opposite of what you are. Tell me one good thing trump has done.

[Cassawary]

https://youtu.be/47TgUnrIArQ

[imperiouskitten]

https://youtu.be/47TgUnrIArQ

lmao

[magnetaress]

https://youtu.be/47TgUnrIArQ

https://www.politicalpersonality.org/match/astute-logician/

Astute Logician

You are a champion of science, logic, and pragmatism.
Astute Logicians are grounded in reality and are known for their unique perspectives and vigorous intellect. With a deep analytical mind, you can methodically solve political problems using objective reasoning and expert analysis. Though not a public campaigner, you strongly advocate for sustainable economic growth, government accountability, and science-first education.

I am kind of chuckling at this, but its heartwarming :D

[Cassawary]

https://www.politicalpersonality.org/match/astute-logician/

Astute Logician

You are a champion of science, logic, and pragmatism.
Astute Logicians are grounded in reality and are known for their unique perspectives and vigorous intellect. With a deep analytical mind, you can methodically solve political problems using objective reasoning and expert analysis. Though not a public campaigner, you strongly advocate for sustainable economic growth, government accountability, and science-first education.

I am kind of chuckling at this, but its heartwarming :D

I got social guardian =\

Politicians often refer to your personality type as the “silent majority.”

[Knuckle]

i find that the majority of people who are strongly identified with party lines tend to defend their party as their own personal child.

[budz2112]

Good thing I have been registered no party for my entire voting history

[magnetaress]

I got social guardian =\

Politicians often refer to your personality type as the “silent majority.”

I love that you teach me a lot.

[imperiouskitten]

i find that the majority of people who are strongly identified with party lines tend to defend their party as their own personal child.

it's really sad. can't talk to either of them. as soon as you say a cross word this chip inside their brain goes off and they hallucinate that you are named Cleetus or have pink stringy hair.

We need to classify a new form of mental disability, the one that allows the TV and peer pressure to cause a lot of emotional turmoil leading to real-world lashing out and political radicalization on scant evidence for dubious causes.

[DoodyLich666]

Poobrain

[magnetaress]

Poobrain

Have not heard that one in awhile.

I think some people are very susceptible to brainwashing, indoctrination, etc. I believe that economic poverty, bad food, toxic poisons in the environment, lack of opportunity, domestic abuse, drugs, violence, all increase the likelyhood of someone suffering this susceptibility.

I believe some people have an innate resistance to it, survivors, people who've learned to prosper in the face of adversity, can be some of these people. I don't think political ideology particularly makes one more or less susceptible, initially. I've known enough people from many different political viewpoints long enough to watch them even grow and change, I am impressed.

I wonder if American conservativism is salvageable from that perspective, and I think about it. I hope so. Because I believe it's important to have more than a single voice, party, or belief system in a democracy.

[charmcitysking]

We call this projection

case in point

[budz2112]

case in point

That you are being triggered, yeah seems like it.. Cant blame you, after the whole world saw what you people support on wed how could you not be

[imperiouskitten]

oh yeah he's mad. this is the greatest forum bloodbath since the fall of the Society of Retarded Posters

[charmcitysking]

That you are being triggered, yeah seems like it.. Cant blame you, after the whole world saw what you people support on wed how could you not be

https://i.imgur.com/k6FTjRt.gif

[budz2112]

I know truth is hard, Gifs are an easy cover though

[HalflingSpergand]

I think that the most american person there is hates the government. It was supposed to be a no government government now its a cesspool of degeneracy (libs)

[Grubbz]

I think that the most american person there is hates the government. It was supposed to be a no government government now its a cesspool of degeneracy (libs)

The next 4 years is going to be HIGHLY entertaining. Can't wait to see everything Biden does being blamed on Trump.

[budz2112]

Don't worry grubbz biden is not stupid enough to say a election is only valid if he wins. but nice try

[Wrekt]

I've read, "Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds." Maybe it has something to do with that. Hope this helps you on your quest.

[Cassawary]

I've read, "Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds." Maybe it has something to do with that. Hope this helps you on your quest.

That's pretty similar to what the KPD said about the Iron Front prior to 1933

[Jibartik]

As a libtard, I love using the word libtard. I said it once like super casually once and some guy chortled so hard. I love it. Great word! Lib is like saying the word without the hard tard.

[Wrekt]

That's pretty similar to what the KPD said about the Iron Front prior to 1933

And they were right.

Fascist: I want to kill people x in a genocide.

Antifascist: I want to stop fascists from genocide.

Liberal: Whoa, there has to be a middle ground here... How about we kill ONLY half in a genocide?

Hope this clears it up.

[Cassawary]

And they were right.

Fascist: I want to kill people x in a genocide.

Antifascist: I want to stop fascists from genocide.

Liberal: Whoa, there has to be a middle ground here... How about we kill ONLY half in a genocide?

Hope this clears it up.

After Hitler, our turn! (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_fascism)

[Jibartik]

Human: One way or another we're going to have to eliminate the other guys.

[Cecily]

Social Guardian


You are the epitome of humbleness, integrity, and diversity.

Social Guardians are typically open to new ideas while guarding against social injustice. You strive for a balanced approach to economic growth and environmental sustainability. Generally, you are politically moderate, compassionate, and passive in expressing viewpoints.


Future Fulfillment

You like to be of service to others and enjoy seeing the fruit of your labors. Not too keen on being a public figure and not a big fan of dealing with company politics, you work best when you can help support a cause or others from the sidelines.
People with your personality type are known to be the backbone of the community: working as nurses, teachers, or counselors. In these positions, you can make a genuine impact on people’s lives without having to be in the spotlight.
In politics, the best way for you to get involved is to support a community organizing event or to volunteer your time to a political campaign where you can. If you are really invested in making change, sometimes the best way to make an impact for others is to run for office yourself.


https://i.imgur.com/vbZSJzs.png

[feniin]

So many white nationalists are suddenly banned. Thanks for finally cleaning up the place, mods. I'm glad there's some sanity around here.

[Jibartik]

lol if you say it like this: so many white, nationalists are banned, I'm glad.

It makes it sound like you're just a racist globalist hehe

Its funny how language works, one little comma is all it takes.

[Lune]

When your ideology is such a cancer to society that even google and apple join in on the chemo

https://i.imgur.com/d6XXhVa.jpg

[imperiouskitten]

i hope the locking of that thread is a signal which will be obeyed. I will obey it. thanks admin

[Cecily]

As a social guardian, it's my responsibility to hunt down monsters, where ever they lurk.

[budz2112]

Seems like your the one thats been trolling

[imperiouskitten]

admins are my heroes lately

[bubur]

I have a colleague from a relatively privileged background in middle England asked why ‘liberal’ is used as a dirty word in the states.

He is confused how the dictionary definition of liberal (social welfare, freedoms, open business) could be a bad thing in the country of liberty.

I’m lucky enough to had the opportunity to witness discussion from such honourable ‘lib hatin merkins’ as populate the p99 game and boards so did my best to offer an answer:

“Personally, I believe in the value of social programs. Not particularly due to morale or welfare arguments, but because I believe they are effective economic investments.

However, I feel many people that support such programs can be a little tone deaf or condescending (“why can’t people against these programs see they would be better off”) and fail to understand why someone that would benefit from it could be against it.

I’m involved in a computer game community which happens to include a good number of rural Americans, people that I never would have normally been able to converse with.

From my discussions with them, and from my knowledge of the emotional effects of unemployment from my company partner’s doctorate, these people are not interested in being financially better off due to social hand outs. They want real employment and economic opportunities, similar to how there used to be industrial and agricultural opportunity previously in the states. They don’t want to be non-contributors dependant on subsidies from blue city taxes. They want to be independent and in control of their lives.

For this reason, rightly or wrongly, they conflate liberal social welfare with a suppression of their ability to support themselves as individuals.”

I hope i put forward a decent, good faith representation for at least some ‘lib haters’ and was hoping you can either call me out if i am totally off the mark, or provide additional reasoning why some view ‘lib’ as a dirty word.

Please keep it civil and clean.

everyone that disagrees with progress is a fucking fat idiot

thank you for your forward representation of the american situation, you forgot the fat part

fat idiots fat are the ones that fatty fat mcgee that disagree with the old white politician who win fatty fat

ur fat (and poor)

[Knuckle]

everyone that disagrees with progress is a fucking fat idiot

thank you for your forward representation of the american situation, you forgot the fat part

fat idiots fat are the ones that fatty fat mcgee that disagree with the old white politician who win fatty fat

ur fat (and poor)

They did say obesity is 70% in American adults now I think? Crazy to think. I think one pain point of all this educational trimming is P.E. is an afterthought in the modern service industry world, despite the fact that people operate mentally and physically better with a healthy body?

Physical fitness is often in the news today, but it has long been a national concern. New programs to help keep Americans fit were a hallmark of John F. Kennedy's administration.
After World War II, many Americans worried that US citizens, especially the young, were growing overweight and out of shape. The nation's economy had changed dramatically, and with it the nature of work and recreation changed. Mechanization had taken many farmers out of the fields and much of the physical labor out of farm work. Fewer factory jobs demanded heavy labor. Television required watching rather than doing. Americans were beginning to confront a new image of themselves and their country, and they did not always like what they saw.

[Gwaihir]

Ive changed my opinion. 90% of you need to be exterminated through population control measures a la vaccinations, sterilization, economic ruin, and squallid conditions brought about by your own drug addled degeneracy. Carry on, fine folks.

[magnetaress]

Ive changed my opinion. 90% of you need to be exterminated through population control measures a la vaccinations, sterilization, economic ruin, and squallid conditions brought about by your own drug addled degeneracy. Carry on, fine folks.

Don't let the anger strangle you like it did me.

Praise the Lord.

[budz2112]

"admins are my heroes lately"

Lol i created my account to counter a certain group of posters lies, and a day later they are all banned. what to do now

[Jibartik]

I mean, progress is cool, but what is it really?

Is it advancments in philosphy? Because we're still far behind the greeks there, building culture out of what plato's metaphors.

Is it science? The ability to refine sugar more efficiently and feed more people? We throw away more than we consume, so that seems suspect.

Is it wokeness? Because we free' d the slaves 8,000 years ago too and ended many tyrannical empires, so we've been there done that.

What is progress, if you think about it?

How have we progressed as a society in the last 10,000 years?

Society changed when we invented the written word.

It changed again when we invented the printing press.

And then again when we invented the computer/internet.

It seems the only thing that has progressed humanity, is our ability to talk to each other and record history.

So by defacto, progress, is actually: the investment in our memory of the past.

Pretty fuckn weird if you ask me. :o

[magnetaress]

I mean, progress is cool, but what is it really?

Is it advancments in philosphy? Because we're still far behind the greeks there, building culture out of what plato's metaphors.

Is it science? The ability to refine sugar more efficiently and feed more people? We throw away more than we consume, so that seems suspect.

Is it wokeness? Because we free' d the slaves 8,000 years ago too and ended many tyrannical empires, so we've been there done that.

What is progress, if you think about it?

How have we progressed as a society in the last 10,000 years?

Society changed when we invented the written word.

It changed again when we invented the printing press.

And then again when we invented the computer/internet.

It seems the only thing that has progressed humanity, is our ability to talk to each other and record history.

So by defacto, progress, is actually: the investment in our memory of the past.

Pretty fuckn weird if you ask me. :o

Progress is when we become a collective tribe focused on a goal other than ego and id fulfillment. We are still obsessed with longevity, food, luxury and our offspring and the dopa we get from our erogenous zones.

7 of 9s borg in voyager seeking perfection through their exploration of the universe. Was progress. Forget exactly what episode it was. Two parter about what the borg were really after. We were just mold on a peach in the multiverse to them.

That's what we are. We can't even really escape this gravity well. We are defined by it.

In terms of, we, us.

[Jibartik]

Progress is when we become a collective tribe focused on a goal other than ego and id fulfillment. We are still obsessed with longevity and our offspring and the dopa we get from our erogenous zones.

This could be right, but that could mean that it's going back even further, to when we were just ants :o

Maybe our individualism is what makes us unique. And that's why it's so painful when we exorsize it.

The best food, the best drink, the best drugs, all are bad for you....

Maybe the best philosophy is too?

Or perhaps that is a divine clue to stay away from it.

We may never know.

Or we're dust in the wind and literally all of it is a construct lol

[budz2112]

progress is a bad way to state what you want the future to be. What should happen is that we should always look at ourselves and ask if what we are doing is good for ourselves and fellow Americans, as well as our future generations, as well as being faithful to the laws and constitution our countrymen set up for us. And if at any point we realize we are not in the right, or doing things vastly different to what they setup, we should be able to accept that and change. Being able to change, and accept your beliefs are wrong are the key to "progress"

[Jibartik]

What if you're not american..

[magnetaress]

I'm a sovereign so that's not my problem! /s

Jk

[budz2112]

Funny you said that because I was going to mention doing good for all of humanity, but thats a hard game to play, mainly because we all have our own set of laws and ideals. And it gets tricky trying to advocate for everyone. But the last sentence of that post goes for everyone

[Jibartik]

Uh oh, there we go with that individuality again.

It's almost like maybe that is something we should embrace instead of shed?

Unless being a mammel or insect or virus is > being a human.

Things that make me go Hmmmm.

[Gwaihir]

It's nice to see more people growing increasingly immune to the Japhethian logical inversion.

"Have you thought about the single cellular organisms you're decimating every time you use sanitizer?!"

[magnetaress]

Uh oh, there we go with that individuality again.

It's almost like maybe that is something we should embrace instead of shed?

Unless being a mammel or insect or virus is > being a human.

Things that make me go Hmmmm.

I've had my particular brand of individuality carved out of me by the mob and the free, and I replaced it with god.

I promise you don't want the alternative, and I feel better this way. :o :p :cool: :eek: :rolleyes: :eek:

Won't work so long as individuals can abuse their power over other individuals. And exploit other individuals. "Because they felt like it". With no correction, or repercussion. There needs to be course correction. Guidance. And consensus. Consideration. Otherwise we just break into a bunch of angry monkeys with machine guns aimed out our own selves and the human species collectively commits suicide without a collective will. We lose our humanity and stop being individuals at that point. No matter how free we think we are.

[magnetaress]

Double posting because, this deserves it's own space.

Individuals don't exist without the collective protection of individuality.

[Jimjam]

mammel =! human

Things that make me go Hmmmm.

Nice Lizardmen conspiracy theory.

[Lune]

Ive changed my opinion. 90% of you need to be exterminated through population control measures a la vaccinations, sterilization, economic ruin, and squallid conditions brought about by your own drug addled degeneracy. Carry on, fine folks.

You know, if you've got a problem with everyone you meet, if everyone but you is an asshole, chances are, you're the one that's the asshole. Consider that perhaps you should have sterilized yourself rather than procreate with meth-addled white trash wife (Projecting, anyone?) Future generations will treasure those genetics.

[Jibartik]

Moral of the story:

https://i.imgur.com/029m4Ya.png

[magnetaress]

Moral of the story:

https://i.imgur.com/029m4Ya.png

If it's a sponge bob square pants cup (I don't think it is) but if it is, you're doing somethin right.

[imperiouskitten]

You know, if you've got a problem with everyone you meet, if everyone but you is an asshole, chances are, you're the one that's the asshole. Consider that perhaps you should have sterilized yourself rather than procreate with meth-addled white trash wife (Projecting, anyone?) Future generations will treasure those genetics.

big bazingo doinked

[Blingy]

tl;dr both sides are making massive assumptions about each other based on partial information from their favorite source of information.

I have a colleague from a relatively privileged background in middle England asked why ‘liberal’ is used as a dirty word in the states.

From my experience it can be used in many different ways. Some people use it as an insult, others a compliment and even some as either an adjective or political stance. There are 4 different things at play IMO; two are beneficial IMO and two are why we're currently in the shit-show the world is watching unfold.

Thing one: A liberal will define what they perceive themselves to be, their stances and expectations of society either through private enterprise or public/gov't intervention. Example: Nationalized healthcare for all paid for with tax money. Everybody gets access to professional health services. This is simply one example (there are a lot more, this is simply one topic among many).

Thing two: A conservative will define what they perceive themselves to be similar to above. However many conservatives want to limit the amount of gov't intervention (perceived as hand-outs). Using the example above, people that want to spend their hard earned money on healthcare can choose to purchase insurance but they object to being forced to pay taxes for it (weather they are directly paying taxes for it or not).

Thing three and four are nearly identical but also polar opposites at the same time. Both conservatives and liberals project what they believe the opposite side stands for based on what they've been exposed to through various places (ie, websites, social media, broadcast news, etc.)

Since you mentioned "liberal is used as a dirty word" first I'll offer what my conservative friends use liberal as (and please note, this is paraphrasing what my conservative friends say; NOT what I believe). Liberals fight for equality on all fronts through forced gov't intervention. Liberals don't think anybody should be held accountable for poor decisions in their past which leads to problems today and the future. Liberals want public funding for mentally ill people that are mentally ill because of decisions made in the past. The downtrodden made their bed (ie, did drugs in highschool) and have fried their brain to the point of not being able to hold down any sort of job; why should people that made good decisions throughout their life be made to support others bad decisions. Liberals also think anybody that "succeeded" in life only got there through liberal/social programs; not their own hard work. A conservative that works 80 hours a week and makes a lot of money should be able to keep and use their money as they see fit; not have it taxed into oblivion.

Conservatives calling liberals "snowflakes" mostly stems from the belief that liberals call whatever gov't agency/authority to take care of any situation rather than deal with the situation themselves. Many conservatives would rather hash things out between themselves rather than call the police, city council, code enforcement, *insert any gov't agency here*. Conservatives think liberals will instantly call whichever outside gov't agency if there's any chance of an unfavorable resolution.

The flip side to the above two paragraphs are what liberals perceive conservatives to be. Once again, paraphrasing what my liberal friends say about conservatives (NOT what I personally believe). Conservatives are a bunch of uneducated gun happy gruff assholes that wouldn't know social graces if it bit them in the ass. Conservatives just want to drive their earth destroying monster trucks and hunt everything into extinction. None of them care about poor people and don't understand how bad it is to tell people "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" when they've never needed help. Liberal cities also support their back-woods ways that let them have great public education, good roads and all the other amenities that go along with liberal policies. They're simply too stupid to admit they don't know how good they have it because liberals are paying taxes to support their way of life.

He is confused how the dictionary definition of liberal (social welfare, freedoms, open business) could be a bad thing in the country of liberty.
There is a dictionary definition and a social definition; they don't always agree with each other.

I’m lucky enough to had the opportunity to witness discussion from such honourable ‘lib hatin merkins’ as populate the p99 game and boards so did my best to offer an answer:

“Personally, I believe in the value of social programs. Not particularly due to morale or welfare arguments, but because I believe they are effective economic investments.

However, I feel many people that support such programs can be a little tone deaf or condescending (“why can’t people against these programs see they would be better off”) and fail to understand why someone that would benefit from it could be against it.

I’m involved in a computer game community which happens to include a good number of rural Americans, people that I never would have normally been able to converse with.

From my discussions with them, and from my knowledge of the emotional effects of unemployment from my company partner’s doctorate, these people are not interested in being financially better off due to social hand outs. They want real employment and economic opportunities, similar to how there used to be industrial and agricultural opportunity previously in the states. They don’t want to be non-contributors dependant on subsidies from blue city taxes. They want to be independent and in control of their lives.

For this reason, rightly or wrongly, they conflate liberal social welfare with a suppression of their ability to support themselves as individuals.”

I hope i put forward a decent, good faith representation for at least some ‘lib haters’ and was hoping you can either call me out if i am totally off the mark, or provide additional reasoning why some view ‘lib’ as a dirty word.

Please keep it civil and clean.

This sums up things pretty well IMO. It would have been nice if things remained civil but oh well.

There's a lot more to what I've been exposed to and how I feel but this is turning into a novel already.

[Jimjam]

Great post Blingy, thank you for expanding.