Cleric or Shaman

[oldmanwithers]

I have a friend coming back to play on Green with me, and we're looking at doing some duo action and occasionally grouping as well. He'll more than likely go warrior, or some tank based class. I never played a healing class in EverQuest, but almost in every other MMO since then I have.

So I'm curious, which would best compliment a duo the best, a cleric or shaman? In theory we'd be in for the long run, but play time probably limit us from end game dungeon raids....if that matters. And for either class suggested, does race for selected class matter that much?

As for druid, I never really considered playing one... Just never got the warm an fuzzy from druids, but welcome to hear input on that class as well if it would be a wiser choice.

Thank you for any input and/or advice.

[rajax]

Cleric has the advantage of being all you need to get a larger group going for harder areas. Less gear needs as well for your whole career. Shaman has the more diverse toolbox your duo will appreciate traveling around and has my vote for most interesting priest class to play personally. Lots of shaman on green though who would group with your Cleric.

If you really don’t have an opinion between the two I’d be inclined to go Cleric if your buddy plays warrior and probably the Shaman with a paladin or Sk as they will appreciate the buffs and slow more and have some limited tools to split up a spawn the Shaman lacks.

Race to me is entirely 99 % cosmetic. With the possible exception of playing a night blind race on Green. Depending on your graphics card and drivers and Green’s lighting implementation people are getting strange results. That said: Play what you like the look of especially how their armor looks. Gear will fix stats in time. Just consider how easily a time your level 1 erudite cleric is going to have reaching your wood elf buddy in Greater Fay if that’s where you want to start out together.

Druid is clearly a fan favorite and the ability to port when you get bored of the current area shouldn’t be overlooked but it feels like 40% of the players I run across are Druids and porting seems pretty widely available.

[loramin]

Honestly, both will be great.

But if you plan to duo exclusively (and not form groups with other people) I'd tend to think the Shaman's lower healing abilities will be more than made up for by their far better utility abilities (SoW, slow, far better buffs including haste, etc.) and better damage dealing potential (DoTs, pet, and JBB at 45 ... well, someday when Kunark comes to Green).

[kjs86z]

As loramin said, if your plan is to mostly duo, the shaman is going to be your best choice.

I'd recommend picking the same race for ease of starting in same area so you can log in and immediately be together.

Troll shaman + troll warrior would probably be my pick due to the racial regen, but there are upsides to barbarian and ogre as well. Go with what you guys decide is the coolest and have a great time leveling up.

[Gustoo]

Ogre Shaman and SK is a pretty supreme buddy combo.

Can do good guy Barbarian version (with warrior) for good guy action with inferior stats and racial benefits but goodly demeanor and true heroism.

[Snaggles]

A cleric has an ability split pulls while a sham doesn't (not really at least). I think it really depends on if your bud wants to roll a class that can pull singles or not. Otherwise your grind spots will be more limited.

Likewise will this person will be with you through the entire grind? Besides select undead spots the sham, even on Green, is much more adept at soloing.

Edit: I like the idea of picking two of the same race, easier group-up right out of the gate. Don't min-max, keep it easy and murder those rats/bats together. Druids are less optimized than shams/clerics but ports are really nice.

[oldmanwithers]

I really appreciate all the input and advice. As for the whole starting race, I'm kind of seeing what he will pick and then sorta base my choice off of that. Though we do have enough common sense to pick something that we're able to meet up together with relative ease.

As it stands, with the amount of responses, it seems like it roughly 3 to 2 in favor of the shaman. If I remember correctly, shamans typically get their heal spells a circle below the cleric and are more of a "regen" type of class yeah? They're still able to efficient pull off heals, even as a main healer of a full group? I mean, i do love a challenge... Something that keeps me busy is more entertaining to play. Granted, i want to be viable and "needed" at the end of the game.

Again, thank you for all the information and recommendations.

[loramin]

If I remember correctly, shamans typically get their heal spells a circle below the cleric and are more of a "regen" type of class yeah? They're still able to efficient pull off heals, even as a main healer of a full group? I mean, i do love a challenge... Something that keeps me busy is more entertaining to play. Granted, i want to be viable and "needed" at the end of the game.

Yes and no. Yes Shaman get regeneration buffs and Clerics don't (but regen is slow to the point of almost being a non-factor when you think of healing). Yes they are worse healers (I'm not sure "a circle behind" is always true, but something like that).

But the other thing is, Shaman get slow, and especially in the second half of your leveling it makes a huge difference. If you slow a mob to half speed, then that's like healing half of all damage that mob will do with a single slow spell ... and the slow line of spells gets up to 70%.

As for being the main healer of a full group, while slowing? No, Shaman definitely can't do that. In a duo you'll heal just fine, but in a full group you'll want a Cleric (or at least a Druid or another Shaman) healing ... and if you're a Cleric you'll definitely want a slower, because both are key roles.

[ChooChoo Train]

Shaman + monk/SK is great.

[oldmanwithers]

As for being the main healer of a full group, while slowing? No, Shaman definitely can't do that. In a duo you'll heal just fine, but in a full group you'll want a Cleric (or at least a Druid or another Shaman) healing ... and if you're a Cleric you'll definitely want a slower, because both are key roles.

Gotcha ok. Good to know the limitations. Its been so long since I played, I really can't remember the group composition from back then. I'm sure I did group with two priest classes, at times, but I just tend to remember a single one in the group. Thank you for the input.

[oldmanwithers]

Shaman + monk/SK is great.

Funny enough, that is something I have considered as well. I don't now if my buddy would be down to play a monk, but it's worth an ask. How well can the monk tank, if it's a duo? I figure down the line it'd be more of a full group combo, but that's just due to lack of knowledge/aged knowledge.

[Penish]

Originally Posted by loramin View Post
As for being the main healer of a full group, while slowing? No, Shaman definitely can't do that. In a duo you'll heal just fine, but in a full group you'll want a Cleric (or at least a Druid or another Shaman) healing ... and if you're a Cleric you'll definitely want a slower, because both are key roles.


Yeah any shaman who's using a top tier slow will run out of mana in a group.. granted using anything outside a 60 mana charge of walking sleep to slow a non raid target is excessive.. play how you want.. lol.......................... (Fyi, shaman & monk is juicy)

[loramin]

Monks aren't yet at their peak of power on Green (on Blue/in Velious they already are). That being said, even in classic they're fairly beefy, and a good duo for a Shaman (and that duo will only get better over time). But that's for duoing: in a full group you'll likely want a non-Monk tank.

And I should note that unconventional groups can do fun things sometimes, so I could hypothetically see a level 60 Shaman with Torpor healing an entire group (maybe even with only a Monk to tank) at a less stressful camp ... but for the most part what I said before is true, and full groups will want a slower and a healer (plus a tank and several damage-dealers/DPS ... one of whom should be able to pull).

[Linfang]

I like the idea of monk/shaman in terms of synergy with spells and abilities. If your monk friend gets FD pulling down pat you can do single pulls. Also as mentioned shamans mitigate damage buy slow/haste. The faster you can drop a mob the less actual healing you need. Plus monks have good Dodge skills so they mitigate damage also.

Yea Tank/Cleric is more direct but I think Shaman/Monk is more fun imo. After all if your not having fun it negates the whole reason you installed the game go begin with.

[Snaggles]

Yea sham's really shine with Torp in velious for healing.

That said, on green you can still slow over 50%, buff haste, chloro, and canni while tossing greater healing. Certainly a viable Swiss Army Knife caster to fit with any melee.

[Gustoo]

The shaman is better with a melee because of slow and haste. The slow spells cut your need to heal by that percentage so fully mitigate your gimper heals.

Being an ogre means you're better melee yourself at low level so those levels are highly bashful.

Cleric is my favorite class but shaman all the way for a melee duo. The biggest real disadvantage of cleric is no mana regen, which the shaman gets. With a melee you guys can just shred and shred.

He should be an SK or Monk for feign death pulling though.

[oldmanwithers]

I appreciate all the input from everyone. I ended up rolling a troll shaman, and my buddy ended up going with a monk. Obviously still only into the single digit levels, but we're both enjoying it thus far. Can't wait till things get a little more spicy, and the classes start to truly shine. Again, thank you all for your help.

[Gustoo]

Good luck!

[Linfang]

I appreciate all the input from everyone. I ended up rolling a troll shaman, and my buddy ended up going with a monk. Obviously still only into the single digit levels, but we're both enjoying it thus far. Can't wait till things get a little more spicy, and the classes start to truly shine. Again, thank you all for your help.

Nice! I lovey Troll Shaman. Fatties for the win. I will keep an eye out for your guys im new myself . -Linfang.

[Danth]

Necromancer makes a fine Shaman partner if the other player doesn't like melee life. There's quite a bit of synergy between the two classes and the Necromancer retains the advantage of feign death splitting. Clerics seem to pair best with Enchanters and also shine with Warriors for a relatively brief period during Kunark when Donal's breastplate click is pre-nerf. Melee/Cleric duos have the obvious benefit of being a nice basis for forming larger groups.

I believe Loramin downplays Shaman healing capability somewhat. Perhaps that's for the best since it'll tend to leave a newer player pleasantly surprised in the long run as he develops the capabilities of his character.

Danth

[loramin]

I believe Loramin downplays Shaman healing capability somewhat

I may have, but I think it might be more accurate to say that context matters, and in some contexts I was accurate and in some I may have undersold our healing.

A Shaman at 60 with Torpor is very, very different from a level 6 Shaman healing with Inner Fire ... and so are Shaman of various levels in-between (and as a side note to new Shaman reading this, you should use Inner Fire, not Minor Healing, because its actually a more efficient healing spell).

So when I said that "one circle behind was about right" (or whatever I said), I didn't mean to suggest Shaman are always exactly one healing spell behind. I just meant that's roughly correct, and I was too lazy to do a more accurate level-by-level breakdown :)

[cearobinson]

So when I said that "one circle behind was about right" (or whatever I said), I didn't mean to suggest Shaman are always exactly one healing spell behind. I just meant that's roughly correct, and I was too lazy to do a more accurate level-by-level breakdown :)

Loramin, people really seem to love to pick apart your words. I don't know why, I think you seem like a hella cool dude who just loves to share information. Keep fighting the good fight, man.

[loramin]

Loramin, people really seem to love to pick apart your words. I don't know why, I think you seem like a hella cool dude who just loves to share information. Keep fighting the good fight, man.

:)