Iksar necro XP penalty

[mjrau]

I was reading on P99 wiki that Iksar necros used to level slower than the other races and was wondering, even though it probably wont make much difference in the earlier game, how much does it effect later game levelling? i used to play DE in the good ol' days and was gonna try the same this time but have been dabbling with an iskar. so my question is...is the health regen worth the xp penalty?

[Kasilis]

yes, Iksar have been created to be Necromancers. They'll regen 11 more hp/tick than non-iksar with lvl 50+ sitting. Means you only loose 10hp in demi lich form for example compared to 20hp+ as a non iksar race while medding. Means no need to waste Mana on bad mana intensive life taps. Means better use of dmg per mana. Leads to shorter downtime. Leads faster exp.
I don't know if an iksar necro can kill 20% more mobs because of the regeneration, but it is damn useful. Plus leveling isnt everything. You'll be much stronger Necromancer than the rest because of your regenrationskills.

[Nuggie]

I think of it this way. The highest level you can reach on this server is 60. It is now available. After you reach the cap the exp penalty will not matter. but you will still be left with the advantage of the higher regen.

[Bassracerx]

if it was your first char i would advise against iksar necro. if you already have a high lvl main and this is gunna be like a twinky alt then i would so the xp penalty wont matter much because alts are more about the jurney then the destinaiton anyways.

[mjrau]

Its not my first char, thats a 16 enchanter. Might as well enjoy the trip, little hard to get groups in australian time so i thought either druid or necro

[Nagash]

Iksar have a 20% xp penalty (like trolls), see http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-29249950.html

Necro have a 10% xp penalty like every INT caster (can't fins the source).

End result: total xp penalty is 28% (1-0.8*0.9) so yes, an iksar necro will level slower than most other combination (the only worst ones involves hybrid classes (sk, pal and bard).

Now coming to playing one as your first toon, remember one thing: what do you play for? I play for fun and can't give a rat's behind regarding my leveling speed, do you? Once you're at level 60, this won't matter anymore (and xp penalty didn't affect AA xp). Necro is a great class to start with as it's very powerful and will let you enjoy the game solo when you can't find a group but also farm some nice stuff to get some cash. Only you can tell if the class/race combo is for you, I sure enjoy mine :)

Please feel free to correct my statement if inaccurate.

Nagash/Petitpas

[Bubbles]

If you're rolling a new necro and looking for the best option possible and don't go iksar, you might as well roll a gnome warrior. :)

[redghosthunter]

ISK Int. blows... Go ERU. More INT = more drains and spells period. Who would not like to have a few more spells to throw ??? People just have a hard on for ISKs .

[dredge]

.

[Kassel]

ISK Int. blows... Go ERU. More INT = more drains and spells period. Who would not like to have a few more spells to throw ??? People just have a hard on for ISKs .

INT = super easy to cap with items
Regen = ?????

[Mardur]

ISK Int. blows... Go ERU. More INT = more drains and spells period. Who would not like to have a few more spells to throw ??? People just have a hard on for ISKs .

Higher mana pool doesn't matter when you're oom. Mana regen > mana pool. Iksars have a greater ability to benefit from their mana regen spells.

[Bubbles]

ISK Int. blows... Go ERU. More INT = more drains and spells period. Who would not like to have a few more spells to throw ??? People just have a hard on for ISKs .

This is offset slightly by higher Iksar STR/STA.. Trust me when i say STR is by far the most important stat for a chinese plat-farming class like a necro.

My pal Karsten would be proud to know that at 107 STR, I may in fact be the 'strongest necro on the server'.

But yeah, unless you are seriously levelling to 60 at Dino in OOT, max mana isn't ever going to matter much on a necro. We arent a 'NUKE TILL OOM THEN DIE' kind of raiding class like wizards, or a "HEAL TILL OOM THEN DIE" raiding class like clerics or a combo of the two like Shamy Druid etc... I guess you could claim a necro could be mana pumping for a full raid encounter, but even then a few extra INT/Mana isn't going to make or break anything.

Necro all about mana/hp regen, and max hitpoints. While it's true the higher your base INT being higher will free you up to go +Hps all the sooner, you are still better off in the long run grabbing the extra Iksar regen and maybe wearing, say, a Giant Reminder String or Braided Cinch Cord over a (lol) Thick Banded belt.

With the advent of the Staff of the WaterWalker, Fire Plat Wedding Rings, Golden Bracers, HBCs, as well as all the new kunark lewtz flowing around, you're going to be just fine as an iksar maxing out both INT to 190+, STR, and having pretty massive HitPoints for a caster. Probably the only thing you're going to have to grind is a mask (PMM off Rokyl, Tobrins (gl), etc) or the end game BCG/Hierocloak combo.

You just simply aren't going to be a FM -> OOM caster class as a necro. Accept that. In most experience groups when you hit 40m you'll be shocked, unless you are just chain nuking or being CC or something. And even then you'll need faster pulls to catch up on hitpoints far more than you'd ever need to 'slow puills to med'.

meh, i've rambled enough.

[odiecat99]

INT = super easy to cap with items
Regen = ?????

[Swish]

Kind of mentioned already but you don't need a massive INT pool unless there's scope for something tragic to go wrong, and even then you can FD.

If you're fear kiting you're medding through the actual fight itself anyway, right? ;)

[Selly]

Holy necro batman, But yes Iksar are by far the best race min max wise for a necro. Total mana pool doesn't matter nearly as much as Hp / Hp Regen imo.

[fishingme]

leveling up iksar necro isn't bad. Hurts at 54, but hurts at 54 for everyone.

[Kieu]

Iksar blow. I really don't care what anyone has to say about how they're so amazing. They're not that amazing, and they look like dog shit. You don't need the regen, and sure as hell don't need to look like a fool either.

[Tecmos Deception]

Wow necro.

But yeah, a non-iksar necro would be dinging 60 when an iksar necro is something like halfway through 58. Is that worth the extra regen? You bet your ass it is. And as far as iksar int goes? Whatever, just put 25 points into it and gear for hp and bam, you're an uber necro.

[Lojik]

Wow necro.

But yeah, a non-iksar necro would be dinging 60 when an iksar necro is something like halfway through 58. Is that worth the extra regen? You bet your ass it is. And as far as iksar int goes? Whatever, just put 25 points into it and gear for hp and bam, you're an uber necro.

Except Iksar can kill with less downtime, so that would mitigate the exp difference, possibly offset it. I admit I don't like the iksar look, but that's the only reason I'd choose not to go lizard. Also FoB and surrounding area great newbie spot.

[Tecmos Deception]

I'm not really convinced that iksar regen makes for significantly faster XPing though. It is such a small boost from 1-50, and even after that it just means an iksar will need to use fewer lifetaps to keep his HP up than a non-iksar would, so he can use a more efficient dot in place of the lifetaps, but that isn't going to be a very big difference I wouldn't think.

I think it is a bigger deal at 60, when the regen is active during longer and harder fights or where it can be used to recover from trouble while FD and still leaving lich on, for melee classes (since the hp are directly their source of power), and for shamans (since they can choose to canni more often if they want to). That said, if I were making a necro, I wouldn't even think twice about making him an iksar.

[Ephirith]

Iksar blow. I really don't care what anyone has to say about how they're so amazing. They're not that amazing, and they look like dog shit. You don't need the regen, and sure as hell don't need to look like a fool either.

You take that back

[Swish]

They're not that amazing, and they look like dog shit.

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

http://i.imgur.com/sN1pc2n.gif

[amateur]

standing/FD/sitting HP regen at level 60
iksar: 12/14/18
Non-Iksar: 4/5/7

so either you want an easier time maintaining hp during lich or you want to level quicker. those are really the only things that matter

edit:
I should say that iksar/troll regen is negligible from other races from 1 to 50 and really wont make any difference. so unless youre in it for the long haul and go 50+ than race wont matter

[Lyssia]

Erudite Necromancer and the Mantle of Souls. End of discussion

[Swish]

standing/FD/sitting HP regen at level 60
iksar: 12/14/18
Non-Iksar: 4/5/7

so either you want an easier time maintaining hp during lich or you want to level quicker. those are really the only things that matter

Why not hit 60 with the better regen? You don't know what you're not missing with the 20% penalty anyway as a necro. 40 and 45 seemed to sail by at the spectres.

[Lojik]

I'm not really convinced that iksar regen makes for significantly faster XPing though. It is such a small boost from 1-50, and even after that it just means an iksar will need to use fewer lifetaps to keep his HP up than a non-iksar would, so he can use a more efficient dot in place of the lifetaps, but that isn't going to be a very big difference I wouldn't think.

I think it is a bigger deal at 60, when the regen is active during longer and harder fights or where it can be used to recover from trouble while FD and still leaving lich on, for melee classes (since the hp are directly their source of power), and for shamans (since they can choose to canni more often if they want to). That said, if I were making a necro, I wouldn't even think twice about making him an iksar.

Up to level 10ish it makes a diff, then again from 20-30ish. 50+ starts to be a big deal again, and 50+ will take up 1/2 your leveling time anyway.

[Vexenu]

Erudite Necromancer and the Mantle of Souls. End of discussion

This is a very nice item you can get with some high level help at any level. And it's right up there with the PoSky shoulder, which is much more of a pain to acquire.

There are also a few popular mid-range Necro items that Iksars can't use, including:

GEBs
Golden Bracer
Golden Chitin Bracer
Tome of Miragul

Given the disparity in starting INT between an Iksar and Erudite (85 vs. 117) and the added INT on the easily obtainable non-Iksar gear, an Erudite Necro is going to have a noticeably larger mana pool than a comparably geared Iksar, on the order of several hundred points 50+.

For example, assuming 1 INT = 10 mana (around lvl 50ish), the Erudite's 32 INT racial advantage, the GEBs and the Mantle of Souls alone total around 500 extra mana (and that's factoring in the mana from BIS non-raid gear an Iksar would be using, like a Squallsurge Shawl (+50mana) and Grave Sandals (2 INT, +10 mana). Bond of Death costs 360 mana and returns 720 health. At 60, Iksar sitting regen is 18 vs. non-Iksar at 7, so the Iksar regens approximately +66hp per minute over the Erudite. A liched Necro will regen approximately 500 mana per minute at 60 regardless of race. The Erudite/DE mana pool advantage allows for a cast of Bond/Vexing that nullifies the Iksar regen.

My Necro is a level 54 Iksar geared for HP and is sitting around 1500 HP self buffed, with 2000 mana and 155 INT. An Erudite Necro with identical gear plus GEBs and Mantels of Souls would be around 200 INT with 2500 mana and the same 1500 HP.

All that said, Iksar is still the better Necro race, since max mana isn't really that important over a long grinding/farming session and the regen allows for increased long term efficiency. But if we're talking about short term efficiency starting from full health, full mana, the Erudite is going to enjoy an advantage. They will also make better mana batteries for obvious reasons, although as an Iksar it's nice to be able to med while liched with Regrowth on and lose no health.

So basically, for long term farming sessions, the Necro is indeed the superior race. But for short bursts, the Erudite is unquestionably better due to their much higher mana pool nullifying Iksar regen. If you're making a Necro to farm (95% of people) go Iksar, if you're making one for PvP (more taps) or raiding (lol wut), go Erudite. The conventional wisdom of "go Iksar or go home" with Necros is technically correct, but the Erudite definitely has some considerable advantages as well which should not be overlooked.

[Tecmos Deception]

Doh :p

[Kieu]

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

http://i.imgur.com/sN1pc2n.gif

But its true :(

Either way, the regen will never be detrimental to a necros needs. I'm not sure why anyone thinks they have less downtime from it, sure... I have to cast a tap or two every 10 minutes. Woah lol

Not sure where people get these crazy illogical mathematical equations from, that make it seem like anything but iksar have a harder time leveling. You mean an iksar does.

[koros]

You read his statement wrong Tec.

[Issues]

iksar necros "easier" to play just longer to level.

int is easy to cap...yes, but any good necro is stacking +hps not plus int, so not likely even a erudite necro will cap int. so that argument is moot.

necromancer comes down to the player controlling it just like any other class. no race will help that. Using spells properly is all that matters.

/thread

[citizen1080]

Bubbles said iksar are the best...end of story

Best necro on server hands down. And a gnome to boot...if he had rolled iksar he would have taken over the world by now.

[aresprophet]

iksar necros "easier" to play just longer to level.

int is easy to cap...yes, but any good necro is stacking +hps not plus int, so not likely even a erudite necro will cap int. so that argument is moot.

necromancer comes down to the player controlling it just like any other class. no race will help that. Using spells properly is all that matters.

/thread

I stopped playing my necro at 54 when I did the math and realized I should have made an Iksar

Although the extra leveling time, faction issues, and lack of a couple good pieces of plate gear would be significant annoyances, they become basically irrelevant at 60. 11 extra hp per tick is like a permanent 5.5 mana per tick (if I remember the ratio right). That's huge.

I think the no-plate problem becomes somewhat worse in Velious with a couple of excellent pieces, but it's been so long I don't remember. And factions are equalized there, I think. Iksar don't start off any worse with Coldain unless I really forgot something. But the power than having extra innate regen in Velious brings is big. Plus raid fights get long and regen is king during those.

[Galvatar]

Go Dark Elf, you get hide.

[Clark]

Iksar Necro is a good choice if you made the character after Kunark. Just don't go Iksar shaman because they can't use jbb. DE necro isn't bad for hide (but you have fd so isn't that important). Gnomes get the ladies though.

[Clark]

But its true :(

Either way, the regen will never be detrimental to a necros needs. I'm not sure why anyone thinks they have less downtime from it, sure... I have to cast a tap or two every 10 minutes. Woah lol

Not sure where people get these crazy illogical mathematical equations from, that make it seem like anything but iksar have a harder time leveling. You mean an iksar does.

EQUATIONS

[Swish]

The best thing about being an iksar necro is you can kill pretty much whatever you want without worrying about faction issues. Everyone hates you anyway so #YOLO ;)

[Kieu]

EQUATIONS

Someone showed the math lol, the hp regen is situational in certain cases. Or it can be beneficial, all in all. Play what you want. Never seen a Iksar do better just cause he is an 'iksar'. It's about the player, never is going to be about the race you choose. If you're bad at management, you're just going to fail either way.

[applesauce25r624]

#YOLO ;)

speak for yourself !

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/23/Apu_Nahasapeemapetilon_(The_Simpsons).png

[odiecat99]

iksar necro best necros >.<

[aresprophet]

Go Dark Elf, you get hide.

Hide is nice, but a Circlet of Shadow does the trick better 99% of the time

if you're going AFK a lot though it has its uses

[Clark]

Hide is nice, but a Circlet of Shadow does the trick better 99% of the time

if you're going AFK a lot though it has its uses

Ya Hide skill is important if you have a girlfriend/wife.

[Anesthia]

Ya Hide skill is important if you have a girlfriend/wife.

Sorry to go RnF on you, but single is better.

[odiecat99]

Hide is nice, but a Circlet of Shadow does the trick better 99% of the time

if you're going AFK a lot though it has its uses

[Bubbles]

sup Bob! long time no see!

As for the necro'd necro thread, one thing i'd like to add about the Erudite is.....

If you are starting from scratch, Erudites (and Human, but jesus never be human!) can wear Flayed Skin armor, which has some pretty awesome stats (ac hps str int etc) looks decent if you are into light purple... and can be found really cheaply in EC, Dreadlands, and off just about any vendor (though the plat cost off vendor is kinda ugly for some pieces).

I started a human necro untwinked just for fun a few months back and got it to 29 pretty quick, only thing i gave her starting out was some pieces of flayed skin and it's pretty solid stuff.

With the high int and equipment options Erudite is a pretty solid race. Terrible starting area though lol.

[fishingme]

Ya Hide skill is important if you have a girlfriend/wife.

I only listen to my gf when she says "lets have sex". Feign death works perfect for that occasion.

[citizen1080]

/wave

sup Bob! long time no see!

As for the necro'd necro thread, one thing i'd like to add about the Erudite is.....

If you are starting from scratch, Erudites (and Human, but jesus never be human!) can wear Flayed Skin armor, which has some pretty awesome stats (ac hps str int etc) looks decent if you are into light purple... and can be found really cheaply in EC, Dreadlands, and off just about any vendor (though the plat cost off vendor is kinda ugly for some pieces).

I started a human necro untwinked just for fun a few months back and got it to 29 pretty quick, only thing i gave her starting out was some pieces of flayed skin and it's pretty solid stuff.

With the high int and equipment options Erudite is a pretty solid race. Terrible starting area though lol.