Introducing Project 1999: Green

[PureLo]

I'm curious how the list aspect will work with regards to experience groups, I combed through the thread so maybe it was already answered. I didn't see it expressly written by a dev or guide though.

Considering this is a new server and exp groups will be the norm for camps for the majority of the early life, this list "fix" seems like it is aimed at people who are moreso in a position to solo or at the very least are endgame ready to farm.

If there is a group camping it and you arrive on the scene to fill a slot, but aren't on the list... can the group still function normally and do a general roll and then you as the new person who joins still get the item? Or does it work that you have to wait your turn from the list within said group in order to be able to claim the item?

Will rolling dice be a thing of the past in these cases? It seems like a solid idea for what it is intended for by preventing hoarding... just wondering how it will work in the natural flow of how exp groups will be by having to cycle people in and out for certain group needs.

[soronil]

I'm curious how the list aspect will work with regards to experience groups

So first remember that the list is only for a select few items that get removed pretty early in the timeline. Guise, manastone, not sure what else.

The list works independently of groups. The expectation is that the people on the list aren't necessarily in the group camping the mob. The group is there for EXP, and for any non list loot. Being in the group that kills the mob, own its own, give you no rights to a "list" item.

The mob spawns... The group who is camping it gets to kill it. If the list item drops, the person at the top of the list gets the chance to loot it. They don't have to kill the mob themselves. Actually that would be KSing the group and against terms. If you are at the top of the list you just wait for the group camping the mob to kill it.

[Graventhel]

Long shot here but, is Paineel going to be included at launch? It's not classic but kinda is, and I'd love to level an Eru SK.

No one? In the original release when was Paineel patch in, anyway?

[BlackBellamy]

No one? In the original release when was Paineel patch in, anyway?

Historically it was like 10 months later.
edit: not confirmed for green https://wiki.project1999.com/EverQuest_Timeline

[Nagoya]

From another thread, I was thinking this question and someone else asked.

thanks buddy

[heartbrand]

I’ll donate 2500 if they wipe red or make a new red server

[Gustoo]

I can't do 2500 dollars but would also be on board.

Just to have a living pvp server I can jump on for some good times when I DO have time would be really worthwhile.

Given the population I feel like discord style would work well and also means we don't end up with it ever getting too stale even if things do go south.

Only thing I think would be bad is teams because of how hardcoded imbalance just ends up being lamesville. Any non classic adjustments would be highly suspect just like all the non classic adjustments that made red 99 bad.

Heres to hoping.

[Lojik]

I mean...how many people are against a red wipe v. for a red wipe? I don't see much reason not to except that Rogean et al probably don't want to set a precedent for randomly wiping characters.

[Gustoo]

They can dump toons to blue or leave red as is as permanent useless loot hoard and launch discord permadeath or real timeline rallos server.

[honeybee12874]

Theres probably like 10,000 names on blue 99 that have not been logged in for 8 years and are level 1 toons.

I think it would be pretty fair to nuke the full naked level 1 name camping toons to make green have some name options.

IIRC live did do something along the lines of deleting unplayed toons.

This sounds pretty fair to me, I think what I would do is first look at the player's account and see if they've played in the last 5 years or so. If yes, leave the account alone. If not, take a look at the characters on the account. If any of them are naked and Level 1, I would add an "_X" or something to the end of the name (that way, no characters are actually deleted, but the names are still freed up). I think that's a pretty fair compromise.

[Qtip]

I’ll donate 2500 if they wipe red or make a new red server

Wiping red would undermine everything this server stands for. And why would they put a new pvp server up so 20 people can play while spamming blue server chat with toxic posts? If anything have 2 blue servers up. Red has been a ghost town since it was formed.

[kwk2k7]

Has everyone forgotten the true classic experience was based on danger and uncertainty? This has been lost and is apparant the way everyone is excited them and their mom can get a manastone.
Havent any of you crawled out of your safe space in the last ten years? People should get that feeling of dread and uncertainty every now and again. Its good for you. Go learn some gang signs or something. Fall more than 20 feet. Pvp

[Gustoo]

Wiping red would undermine everything this server stands for. And why would they put a new pvp server up so 20 people can play while spamming blue server chat with toxic posts? If anything have 2 blue servers up. Red has been a ghost town since it was formed.

We don't need to get into it here, but red was not always a ghost town. Red has a very stillborn beginning all the way back to beta days. It had a custom non classic ruleset and gm corruption issues and all sorts of things that made it hard for the server to be a success.

A true classic server experience with proper timeline and an actual classic ruleset, or a classic discord old world only server that has "seasons" (classic was 1 season only) would allow the pvp to happen but in a less sad and dead way.

I think the best option given the pop is the discord server that has an end date where the winner is declared. The other best option would be an actual rallos zek item loot server. The next best option would be a custom teams no item loot server but I am less excited about that option because custom rulesets are easy to do wrong and are probably more effort than they are worth.

But really anything is worth while. Right now it is an orphan. Do something with the characters or leave them orphaned but changing it up would be fun. I would be able to pull 4 hours a week on a pvp server that wasn't in such a sad shape with nothing fun to do.

Part of the attraction of rallos zek rules is that you can do pvp at a variety of level ranges that is actually rewarding in its own way. You don't need to hit level 60 to start playing the game, you can play it at any level and try to do battle for zone control among your peers. The more you risk gear wise the better you are in battle, but you might lose it to someone. Its great.

[Gustoo]

This just in

Yes.
Yes.

Yes, but nothing I can explain right now.

Soon.

The glory

[canaway]

I just can't even ! Soooooo punowd for this

[TehHobbit]

You guys should make a new pvp server, or just wipe red then won’t have to deal with the resources for another server. No reason to keep it around, its dead as shit, 12 people on there the other day.

[Kados]

please get rid of the 25 mob AE rule! its not classic

[Videri]

please get rid of the 25 mob AE rule! its not classic

So why did they do it, then, Kados?

[aaezil]

please get rid of the 25 mob AE rule! its not classic

It is classic gameplay however

[Gustoo]

No one knew how to break the game with AE's in 1999

even 25 mobs is insane. Folks would just run dissonance while in a group doing normal PVE stuff.

The meta game breaking mega AE action was basically discovered in P99 and would have crashed computers from 1999-2001

So..whats classic?

[Dolalin]

Well, I've found evidence the AoE target limit was just 4 mobs until September 1999.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=334283

[Rogean]

The 25 Mob AE Limit will be in place, but we will evaluate this and change as necessary.

We have received evidence (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=334283) that ALL spells and songs were limited to a max of 4 mobs per cast/pulse until September 1999. This will be in place for Launch.

[Tethler]

The 25 Mob AE Limit will be in place, but we will evaluate this and change as necessary.

We have received evidence (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=334283) that ALL spells and songs were limited to a max of 4 mobs per cast/pulse until September 1999. This will be in place for Launch.

Hahaha, awesome

[kabouter]

This is great news, as much as I love playing a bard swarm kiting isn't fun.

Guess we won't see level 50's within 2 days :D

[Ivanix]

stoked
into it
will be there

[Sheriff_Cockroach]

I took off the week following release weekend. Gonna stock up on weed. Lets go!

[Khaleesi]

+1 , simple solutions to complex problems, truly professional!

What?

Lists is a terrible idea, to service carebears and people whom can't achieve getting items in the normal way.

Talk about a big government approach to a low resolution problem that is and was managed by players
A system by players that is poor is still a better system than something forced upon us by the feeding hand.

Remember all the niggles and silly tweaks done to the raiding system instead of letting it be classic? ;all the groans about invisible lines and player counts in zones, and other ridiculous stipulations?

Lists will be that and more.

And wasn't one of the rebuttals by staff why they couldn't provide services that they'd like to, because they're so busy with nonsensical things that take up their time?
Once again, enter Lists.




And yet in the same breath, they're going to merge levelled up and geared up players into blue, all complete with items that have not dropped in some cases a decade ago - from a different server.
Forgetting how unbalanced that is, it completely disregards every effort they ever made to keep blue classic by ensuring the items were removed as expected for the past ten years.
What absolute level of Snoop Dogg high did Nilbog have to get to, to think this would ever work?

I guess the way to view this is, Green is not a classic server. It's a custom server with some classic influence.

Green should be an explicitly and uncompromising classic server that has one custom allowance, which is PVP in certain raid zones.

[Nilstoniakrath]

What?

Lists is a terrible idea, to service carebears and people whom can't achieve getting items in the normal way.

Talk about a big government approach to a low resolution problem that is and was managed by players
A system by players that is poor is still a better system than something forced upon us by the feeding hand.

"Managed" by players? Managed, yeah, as in, cabals of characters up 24/7 locking down camps in perpetuity by people sharing accounts and handing them off to their buddies when they go to bed, ignoring other people asking to be next on the list, corpsing lore items, etc etc etc

Bitch all you want about the proposed formal list procedure on Green, point out that ANY system will suffer from attempts to game the system, it will still be better than the alternative. You know who you are, your bad faith exploiting and lawyerquesting is what brought this on and you have no one else to blame

[Gustoo]

List is gr8 idea. The above.poster knows what's up
Without pvp those psycho lock down guys in this game get to do sinister things.

And green ain't going to have pvp. It's going to be as classic as possible. Which means no 1 swuad permapharming manastone. Everything about green is a full classic effort it's going to be amazeballs.

The thing that's not classic is our own Intel on the game and some changes are made to compensate that.

A handful of.manastones going to blue server in 4 years isn't going to break anything. Many mamabones are lost. Red had way more recent bone farming than blue and there is probably like 30 in the hands of people who still have access to their accounts.

Won't be a problem. Server staff all Einstein level genuises let's stop doubting them especially since rogain said something is in the pipes for pvp.

Much pras staff.

[lecompte]

Very exciting times.

[Danne]

Will Discord PvP server still happen?

[Shrubwise]

Will Discord PvP server still happen?

It's not looking good for this year. Next year doesn't look good, either...

[Gustoo]

Frankly we have no idea what rogean and team have in store pvp wise. They hinted that something is in the works. I hope it is something classic like discord or rallos zek server.

[BlackBellamy]

Everquest PvP is like this idealized dream, where people imagine all this fun they would have doing it. I played my entire career on Tallon Zek, and EQ PvP winds up being one of two things: You're either getting ganked at the zone line or you're camping a spawn and then you're stunned and blasted to smithereens. And now your corpse is getting camped too. Now, I love that shit but the vast vast majority of people do not. They think they do but after getting rolled a couple of times they realize what's up. The Zek servers populations were consistently the lowest, and that's because if you weren't hardcore and if you didn't have infinite patience and time you would be driven off the server. This is why P99 red will never succeed. There's just never going to be like 500 people consistently into it, and you're not going to have a viable server with less.

[Gustoo]

Thats part of why I think discord is the best option.

Regular resets with actual winners and then another batch of weirdos get a shot.

Classic era only so population won't be an issue.

Gotta fix track though for hunting down those fools.



For me the idealized version of PVP has nothing to do with level 60. Level 60 game not really something I enjoy a whole lot. I like the journey and I like battling on that journey or setting up to battle at a specific part of that journey.

When you get to 60 and you're all dragon looted out the whole dynamic is a lot different.

[loramin]

Gotta fix track though for hunting down those fools.

I believe player tracking has on Blue at least been working for a little while now (I want to say since 2-3 patches ago?) But maybe there's some code to prevent it still on Red?

[Jimjam]

Everquest PvP is like this idealized dream, where people imagine all this fun they would have doing it. I played my entire career on Tallon Zek, and EQ PvP winds up being one of two things: You're either getting ganked at the zone line or you're camping a spawn and then you're stunned and blasted to smithereens. And now your corpse is getting camped too. Now, I love that shit but the vast vast majority of people do not. They think they do but after getting rolled a couple of times they realize what's up. The Zek servers populations were consistently the lowest, and that's because if you weren't hardcore and if you didn't have infinite patience and time you would be driven off the server. This is why P99 red will never succeed. There's just never going to be like 500 people consistently into it, and you're not going to have a viable server with less.

Me and my pals were RPimg highway men in LFay. We'd demand their money and their camp or we'd take it by force. Of course pretty much everyone refused, but those who didn't were allowed to leave with their life (but empty pockets).

One guy we killed and (looted his money) was so mad he rolled a lvl 1 high elf wizard and trained the dark elf camp on us. Either he rage quit or a CSR had been watching our antics because we never saw him log on again (in this iteration of red training was a no-no).

[Gustoo]

Glorious times.

[Nagoya]

EQ PvP in a nutshell: people having fun at the expense of someone else's fun and calling it fun for everyone cause that's how you remember it.

Can't make this shit up ^^
Thanks for reminding us why EQ PvP will never really be a good thing, unfortunately.

(PS: I'm 100% for having a new pvp server for you guys to have an illusion of fun (and/or real fun whatever) none-the-less, sounds good in my book go for it ^3^)

[Nilstoniakrath]

Everquest PvP is like this idealized dream, where people imagine all this fun they would have doing it. I played my entire career on Tallon Zek, and EQ PvP winds up being one of two things: You're either getting ganked at the zone line or you're camping a spawn and then you're stunned and blasted to smithereens. And now your corpse is getting camped too. Now, I love that shit but the vast vast majority of people do not. They think they do but after getting rolled a couple of times they realize what's up. The Zek servers populations were consistently the lowest, and that's because if you weren't hardcore and if you didn't have infinite patience and time you would be driven off the server. This is why P99 red will never succeed. There's just never going to be like 500 people consistently into it, and you're not going to have a viable server with less.

Everquest PvP is good at level 50+, in raid zones, when guilds/groups are going at it over high end mobs. Deleveled twinks ganking true noobs in low level zones is just pathetic

[loramin]

EQ PvP in a nutshell: people having fun at the expense of someone else's fun and calling it fun for everyone cause that's how you remember it.

Can't make this shit up ^^
Thanks for reminding us why EQ PvP will never really be a good thing, unfortunately.

(PS: I'm 100% for having a new pvp server for you guys to have an illusion of fun (and/or real fun whatever) none-the-less, sounds good in my book go for it ^3^)

This is why the next Red P99 server needs to be teams!

PvP attracts griefers ("killers" in the Bartle taxonomy of player types (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_taxonomy_of_player_types)). If you have all vs. all PvP (in any game), those griefers will direct their attention to the most vulnerable, ie. low level characters. This naturally discourages server growth (see Red).

But with any kind of team-based PvP, that killer/griefer energy is channeled. Instead of the griefer being a reason to quit the server, the griefer just becomes another villain for the players of the other team to defeat.

There's a reason why successful MMOG PvP is team-based (WoW, DaoC, etc.)

[Riiyan]

Can we get some type of donation feedback prior to server releasing? Like are we on track with the current donations to procure new equipment? Is this going to be a problem at current donation rates?

[loramin]

Can we get some type of donation feedback prior to server releasing? Like are we on track with the current donations to procure new equipment? Is this going to be a problem at current donation rates?

Historically that hasn't been Rogean's style. P99 isn't a non-profit, so they don't have to disclose anything: your money essentially goes into a black box. In fact, Rogean mentioning that the new Green hardware is expensive is probably the closest he's ever come to giving any info whatsoever about P99's finances.

To be clear, I'm not trying to imply that anyone is secretly profiting off P99. All it takes is a little "back of the envelope" math to realize that clearly isn't the case. I'm also not suggesting that the (relatively tiny) Project 1999 should file as a 501c non-profit org :)

I'm just saying, this is a small fan project, and they seem to have an attitude of "we'll take what we can get in donations, we'll pay for the rest out of pocket, and doing anything more (like providing transparency) is too much hassle". That's worked for them in the past, and it hasn't stopped people from donating in spite of it.

[BlackBellamy]

...it hasn't stopped people from donating in spite of it.

I donated based on past value :) This way I can't be disappointed about how I spent it.

[Nagoya]

This is why the next Red P99 server needs to be teams!

PvP attracts griefers ("killers" in the Bartle taxonomy of player types (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_taxonomy_of_player_types)). If you have all vs. all PvP (in any game), those griefers will direct their attention to the most vulnerable, ie. low level characters. This naturally discourages server growth (see Red).

But with any kind of team-based PvP, that killer/griefer energy is channeled. Instead of the griefer being a reason to quit the server, the griefer just becomes another villain for the players of the other team to defeat.

There's a reason why successful MMOG PvP is team-based (WoW, DaoC, etc.)

I did enjoy Warhammer: Age of Reckoning quite a lot and I understand what you mean.

However, as the other poster said, EQ PvP, team or not, is often zone line ganking or killing someone camping something, etc. It is not only the team or no team, but the very design of the game that doesn't make for a very healthy PvP in my opinion.

And I like the vibe of an EQ PvP server believe me (we had fun with Shrub for a tiny bit on that Rallos Zek server eh! Hi Shrub /o/) - but I always feel that in the end the game wasn't meant for this.

That being said, I have like 7 toons on Red, and if there is a new PvP server on Project 1999 I will probably play as well ;)

[Nagoya]

Historically that hasn't been Rogean's style. P99 isn't a non-profit, so they don't have to disclose anything: your money essentially goes into a black box. In fact, Rogean mentioning that the new Green hardware is expensive is probably the closest he's ever come to giving any info whatsoever about P99's finances.

To be clear, I'm not trying to imply that anyone is secretly profiting off P99. All it takes is a little "back of the envelope" math to realize that clearly isn't the case. I'm also not suggesting that the (relatively tiny) Project 1999 should file as a 501c non-profit org :)

I'm just saying, this is a small fan project, and they seem to have an attitude of "we'll take what we can get in donations, we'll pay for the rest out of pocket, and doing anything more (like providing transparency) is too much hassle". That's worked for them in the past, and it hasn't stopped people from donating in spite of it.

good one loramin.
riiyan's post history makes me affraid that his question was not innocent at all.
a donation is by definition a gift, no strings attached.
give if you want, don't give if you don't want.
don't worry for their finances they don't need an accountant.

[Gustoo]

On red 99 all pvp sub 60 was grief because normal people weren't trying to engage in pvp at level 20 in unrest because they stood to lose exp (non rezzable) and time and fall behind on grinding. If all 15 noobs in zone band together and kill the griefer in max droppable gear he is back there in 5 minutes smashing them with nothing lost at all.

That's because no item loot and bad custom ruleset.

On item loot ganking this lone wolf fool for loot is priority 1 for anyone with a brain it's way more fun to try to get an fbss than to kill a few more ghouls.

Other would be griefers also make other griefers targets because there is something to actually gain.

Griefers also think twice before coming out with the big guns and start to bag gear like losers and therefore become easy to kill when things get dicey. All in all rallos zek rules 1000x better for lowbie nakeds who have nothing to lose. All mellee can use free banded for life and casters literally need nothing to pwn other nakeds in classic era

A majorly broken mechanic that I'm sure staff won't bring back is the old deleveling mechanic which allowed players to retain their full skill level despite character level decrease. These deleveled epic psychopaths were truly unkillable zone bosses and the sinister joy of those griefers may never be heard in games again except in the halls of vallhalla. This was the major thing that broke the above game play on live.

That deleveling isn't possible here (while retaining skills) and epic weapons I believe have level requirements here which changes things as well.

[Gustoo]

Teams with large level range and again zero reward for lowbie to fight just encourages the same garbage can grief that red 99 saw. Bad team gets to see it as their job to grief enemy team in noov zone until enemy team hi levels come to defend it. Those defenders always have better things to do and never get anything except hero points for defending the lowbies. This is a bad dynamic and is basically going to result in same problems seen on red99 custom pvp server.

And I am skeptical about super custom teams server given our track record here.

So back to rallos or discord.

[Cyph]

Historically that hasn't been Rogean's style. P99 isn't a non-profit, so they don't have to disclose anything: your money essentially goes into a black box. In fact, Rogean mentioning that the new Green hardware is expensive is probably the closest he's ever come to giving any info whatsoever about P99's finances.

To be clear, I'm not trying to imply that anyone is secretly profiting off P99. All it takes is a little "back of the envelope" math to realize that clearly isn't the case. I'm also not suggesting that the (relatively tiny) Project 1999 should file as a 501c non-profit org :)

I'm just saying, this is a small fan project, and they seem to have an attitude of "we'll take what we can get in donations, we'll pay for the rest out of pocket, and doing anything more (like providing transparency) is too much hassle". That's worked for them in the past, and it hasn't stopped people from donating in spite of it.

I was about to post something similar but thankfully we have other people that share this mindset. Maybe we could have some indication to what a donation and amount would cover, for example, "A $50 donation covers the operational cost of [something] for [duration].".

[Videri]

PvP attracts griefers ("killers" in the Bartle taxonomy of player types (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_taxonomy_of_player_types)).

Wow Loramin, very interesting! I had heard of some kind of four-quadrant taxonomy, but I hadn't read into it much. It seems as though there is a competing four-quadrant model, as well. I might start a thread about this.

If you have all vs. all PvP (in any game), those griefers will direct their attention to the most vulnerable, ie. low level characters. This naturally discourages server growth (see Red).

But with any kind of team-based PvP, that killer/griefer energy is channeled. Instead of the griefer being a reason to quit the server, the griefer just becomes another villain for the players of the other team to defeat.

There's a reason why successful MMOG PvP is team-based (WoW, DaoC, etc.)

Hmm, food for thought.

[loramin]

I was about to post something similar but thankfully we have other people that share this mindset. Maybe we could have some indication to what a donation and amount would cover, for example, "A $50 donation covers the operational cost of [something] for [duration].".

I agree that would be nice ... and really in general I'm a very pro-transparency person. If you're going to beg people for money, I feel you owe them an honest explanation of where it's going.

But since P99 isn't "begging" for your money, they're just sort of saying "we're paying for all this so you can play here, and we wouldn't mind some help", I think BlackBellamy had it exactly right. You can donate ...

based on past value :) This way I can't be disappointed about how I spent it.

Also, another challenge to releasing a "monthly cost of operations" number is that Rogean hosts the P99 servers the old school way (he builds a physical machine and installs it in a data center; no AWS here). So there's both fixed monthly data center hosting costs, unplanned non-monthly costs (eg. a hard drive failed and needs replacing), and planned non-monthly costs (eg. the new Green server). Not to mention of course Rogean's time: even if he never paid a single hardware cost or hosting fee, if Rogean just charged us half his professional rate this project would likely go belly up in a month or two ;)

I get the sense that Rogean isn't trying to keep those numbers a secret so much as he doesn't want to take the time to review his receipts and bank statements and such to calculate that number ... and again, he's ok with losing whatever people aren't willing to donate as a result, because he knows most still will:

based on past value :)

[loramin]

Wow Loramin, very interesting! I had heard of some kind of four-quadrant taxonomy, but I hadn't read into it much. It seems as though there is a competing four-quadrant model, as well. I might start a thread about this.



Hmm, food for thought.

Yeah, I'd love to see a separate thread on it.

I think that that "meta-MMOG design" stuff is fascinating, and really helps you understand why games succeed or fail. Ance once you start thinking that way (in terms of groups of players and what they're each looking to experience in their game) it seems painfully obvious in retrospect: of course the successful games are the ones that create a place where every different type of player can play and have fun in their own way.

I don't necessarily think the Bartle taxonomy is the best or anything, but I do especially like their take on the "Killer" archetype, because I think it explains so much (though certainly not everything) about why WoW/DaoC/SWG/etc. succeeded with PvP and EQ didn't.

[aaezil]

Deleveled twinks ganking true noobs in low level zones is just pathetic

Part of the reason why red is dead right meow

[Gustoo]

Yeah I'm just going to reiterate that classic everquest without item loot doesn't give anyone sub level 50/60 to PVP except for contesting loot targets.

When it comes to normal pop grinding through levels, they just run away to a shittier zone to avoid the pvp battle, so pvp doesn't happen and when it does it is an inconvenience.

The only thing that makes griefers worth fighting is item loot, when you get to take a valuable piece of gear from them when you and your noob gang manage to kill a guy.

Low level griefers are usually not grouped because if they could get a group together, they would probably kill some actual content.

Either way they are actually worth killing when they can be looted, and the old naked player killer is a much softer target and O.K. to deal with.

You're always going to have that naked wizard swinging by to try to get a cheap shot on a low HP player, that will never stop. With item loot its actually worth fighting the real twinks.

Also posting videos of twinks running away as the visible graphics on their items go away as they're bagged is always nice and shameful for those dudes.


Even though I mainly want a rallos zek full classic timeline server, I think the best server for this community is discord permadeath because it lets people win and go down in history, and then the server resets and everyone gets to go through the fun time again. The server gets more and more dead as competition gets eliminated..then it resets.

Its worth a try anyways and this kind of server is expected to wipe so there is no p99 ethos risk there.

[Benanov]

The only thing that makes griefers worth fighting is item loot, when you get to take a valuable piece of gear from them when you and your noob gang manage to kill a guy.

On Rallos the griefers were all wearing solely nodrop shit already, it was just a way to take your stuff. Item loot was awful.

[Gustoo]

That mainly comes to play in velious when you can get stuff like the cool thurg no drop stuff.

Junk from Lguk is worse than banded so they aren't hi threat and easy to smash. There will always be bad guys being disruptive under all rulesets. The biggest pvp problem (super twinks) are actually a fun part of the game when there is item loot.

The garbage you are wearing when you get killed in unrest is not impactful to your ability to enjoy the game. The fluidity of item ownership also creates a way more enjoyable economy. Items were cheap.

The players are a lot different 20 years later. People know that there is more than 1 place to level up for one thing.

[honeybee12874]

Wow Loramin, very interesting! I had heard of some kind of four-quadrant taxonomy, but I hadn't read into it much. It seems as though there is a competing four-quadrant model, as well. I might start a thread about this.

Just checked it out, I'd never heard of it either! I'm trying to decide whether I'm a Socializer or an Explorer. I'll be looking out for a separate topic on this! :D

[Riiyan]

All I want to know is if we are on track to procure new equipment because the man said we need new equipment, y'all read into shit way to much. Both me and My g/f have channeled 100 together so far this year. I honestly just want to know if we are on track, ya know alil transparency. Cause i'm going to be playing green and new equipment and no problems would be nice.

[Nagoya]

All I want to know is if we are on track to procure new equipment because the man said we need new equipment, y'all read into shit way to much. Both me and My g/f have channeled 100 together so far this year. I honestly just want to know if we are on track, ya know alil transparency. Cause i'm going to be playing green and new equipment and no problems would be nice.

good finances & good equipment does not guarantee no problems, so that question would not answer your inquiry. they don't owe you any transparency. he said he's gonna buy new equipment, with or without the donations. donations will just help reimburse some or all of the cost. that % is nobody's business.

[Cyph]

Thanks Loramin, I appreciate the honest reply. I'm also surprised that it's all physically hosted, a rarity these days!

[loramin]

There will always be bad guys being disruptive under all rulesets.

This gets back to my original point. You're right that there will always be players who fall under the "Killer" archetype, ie. people that want to play a certain way. But the game decides how those players get to realize those urges.

A good/team-based PvP approach channels such players: they become a part of the game for players on the opposing team to overcome. Also, typically such games ensure a baseline level of fairness: a level 60 in WoW can't show up at the level 1 zones and start killing at will, because the game prevents it.

Without that though, in a free for all system, the natural playstyle such "Killer" players will gravitate towards is "griefing" ... which is no fun for anyone but the griefer.

Thanks Loramin, I appreciate the honest reply. I'm also surprised that it's all physically hosted, a rarity these days!

Yeah Rogean is "old school" in many ways, not just when it comes to EQ :D

Seriously though, I get the impression he already has a cage in a datacenter for non-P99 reasons (eg. his real business). If said cage happens to have room for a few P99 servers, that's very likely the most cost efficient way to run this place (better than even AWS I'd imagine).

[GhostCow]

I've said for a long time now that this is all it would take to get me playing again and now here I am. I'm excited to get my roommates playing for the first time. I'll have to get them to make accounts and apply for IP exemption well in advance so we can be ready to go on day 1

[GhostCow]

I'll do my best to get them to make accounts tonight. Thanks for letting me know!

[loramin]

I'll do my best to get them to make accounts tonight. Thanks for letting me know!

Heh, I deleted my post because I was afraid it sounded pedantic and not useful, but I guess you saw it before I did and it was useful :)

Good luck!

P.S. The missing post just recommended getting the IP exemption ASAP.

[Vizax_Xaziv]

Deleveled twinks ganking true noobs in low level zones is just pathetic

Which is PRECISELY why Red99 became Dead99. Everytime I've tried to play there (have a Cleric in his mid-30s) our playtime was ruined by de-leveled mega-twink griefers. We're talking level 35 iksar monks in FULL NTOV gear griefing people wearing cloth and leather.

[Vizax_Xaziv]

I did enjoy Warhammer: Age of Reckoning quite a lot and I understand what you mean.

However, as the other poster said, EQ PvP, team or not, is often zone line ganking or killing someone camping something, etc. It is not only the team or no team, but the very design of the game that doesn't make for a very healthy PvP in my opinion.

And I like the vibe of an EQ PvP server believe me (we had fun with Shrub for a tiny bit on that Rallos Zek server eh! Hi Shrub /o/) - but I always feel that in the end the game wasn't meant for this.

That being said, I have like 7 toons on Red, and if there is a new PvP server on Project 1999 I will probably play as well ;)

I played PVP-teams back on Live and I can say that it also has alot to do with both the game being so gear-dependent as well as being purely non-instanced. At MOST you have two "top-tier" guilds battling it out over the best raid mobs/gear who in turn go and use that gear to grief the far lesser-geared players.

Ultimately one of those two guilds ends up winning out gaining a monopoly on all the best items and locking anyone else out from competing w/ them in PVP.

[Olidaen_Delacroix]

Yay, can't wait !

[Saboteur]

I searched this thread and the forum in general and didn't see anyone pose this question.

Will we need a fresh install or can we copy and overwrite?
I would suspect we could copy our existing install and overwrite with the green server initial files. I have copied my original install across Mac and Windows systems with whatever patch we were on without issue. Any guidance in advance would be great.

OT: I can't wait and taking the day off. I started on live in Dec 99, moved to EQMac on Al'Kabor in '03 on and off till they pulled the plug in ~'13. Found a new home here but missed the launch.

[Gustoo]

We benefitted greatly from the alkabor influx in 2013 and are happy to have guys from that server while being sad that it was closed out. It was a cool Frozen in time part of classic eq.

[loramin]

I searched this thread and the forum in general and didn't see anyone pose this question.

Will we need a fresh install or can we copy and overwrite?
I would suspect we could copy our existing install and overwrite with the green server initial files. I have copied my original install across Mac and Windows systems with whatever patch we were on without issue. Any guidance in advance would be great.

OT: I can't wait and taking the day off. I started on live in Dec 99, moved to EQMac on Al'Kabor in '03 on and off till they pulled the plug in ~'13. Found a new home here but missed the launch.

You do not need two separate folders. Our era system is built into the client files when necessary. For example, the spells file contains multiple versions of the same spell. When the client logs into the server, the DLL receives information from the server on which era should be applied, and the DLL then loads the correct spells for that era.

[Saboteur]

Excellent! Thanks for response.

[Susanbanthony]

Cool

[Riiyan]

good finances & good equipment does not guarantee no problems, so that question would not answer your inquiry. they don't owe you any transparency. he said he's gonna buy new equipment, with or without the donations. donations will just help reimburse some or all of the cost. that % is nobody's business.

No body asked you and nobody said anything about percentages, move along.

[Muggens]

Grass is always greener on Green99

[beeshma_nameless]

Haven't played since 2011 on P99 - loved the time I played here :)

Logging back in now to this form, 8 years later, to post - KUDOS! And I hope to be on this server :)

Something is really missing in our brains - we so love the experience from 20 years ago haha :)

Cheers

Beeshma
Ronninn

[LiQuid]

How will Green handle characters of the same name rolling back into blue after it reaches the end of Velious and resets? Like if I want to play a new version of Plush on green what happens to my original Plush when they merge together on blue? The idea of having a Guise on Plush after all these years on p99 got me super excited but I'm scared about having to do the 1-60 again and having to farm torpor and all that kinda stuff

[DMN]

How will Green handle characters of the same name rolling back into blue after it reaches the end of Velious and resets? Like if I want to play a new version of Plush on green what happens to my original Plush when they merge together on blue? The idea of having a Guise on Plush after all these years on p99 got me super excited but I'm scared about having to do the 1-60 again and having to farm torpor and all that kinda stuff

They will add a character to your green name when/if it gets migrated to blue(ie. Plushx). I also imagine they will allow petitions afterwards on blue to change the name if you had this happen to you.

[loramin]

They will add a character to your green name when/if it gets migrated to blue(ie. Plushx). I also imagine they will allow petitions afterwards on blue to change the name if you had this happen to you.

... if they don't just add a /rename command or something. I'm not sure the staff will have the time to manually rename 1/8th (or whatever it is) of Green's population after they come to Blue.

[Wodahs]

New arrival here, never played EQ or P99, however I'm hoping to try it out when the new Green server launches.

One question tho: I'm going through the getting started guide, and it says to get the newest patch files from this sub-forum. Are the files for playing on the upcomming green available yet? And do they coin-side with the October 8th patch notes I see at the top?

Much appreciated

[Verityn]

... if they don't just add a /rename command or something. I'm not sure the staff will have the time to manually rename 1/8th (or whatever it is) of Green's population after they come to Blue.

I've worked on similar SQL databases that Everquest uses. Since we're just dealing with a database of player names one could create a script to change everyone's name at once. I'm just not sure how easy it would be to pull the current player name and desired player name from a stack of petitions unless petitions are also kept on a SQL database or can be converted to simple text.

I just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents because I haven't thought about SQL databases in so long.

[Wodahs]

Completely new player here. Never played EQ or P99, trying to get setup for Green Launch to try the game out. Will there be any different patches needed to download, or can the upcomming green server be accessed with an install of the game that can connect to the current blue server?

Cheers

[Talinthis]

nice. would be great if i could even log on, lol. game only runs if i put my processor to 4.2Ghz and i cant do that anymore for some reason with a somewhat recent windows update. i havent been able to play for a few months. oh also rip iksar.

[caldknocker]

So I don't have chars on Blue, but I have chars on red... I don't want anyone to steal my Red chars name...

[loramin]

So I don't have chars on Blue, but I have chars on red... I don't want anyone to steal my Red chars name...

Make a character with the name on Blue.

[loramin]

Completely new player here. Never played EQ or P99, trying to get setup for Green Launch to try the game out. Will there be any different patches needed to download, or can the upcomming green server be accessed with an install of the game that can connect to the current blue server?

Cheers

Rogean has said that they've figured out a way to juggle things such that you'll only need one installation, and it will automatically switch between the "blue code" and the "green code" based on which server you pick.

They'll likely be a patch you need to apply, but other than that everyone should just have Green available as a server.

[gprater]

DUDE. Great solution! Seriously did not see something like this coming.

I agree, I love this idea, but i also like my circa 2005 secondary hot bar which apparently is too far away from classic to allow. When did lists enter the game? I didnt get to play classic and stopped playing live more than 10 expacks ago.

Not trolling, just wondering which is farther away from classic.

thanks for any replies

[loramin]

When did lists enter the game? I didnt get to play classic and stopped playing live more than 10 expacks ago.

They both were never in the game, and at the same time have always been there :)

Here's the thing: live had paid GMs, ie. salaried employees whose only job it was to serve EverQuest players. They had at least one per server, plus on top of that they had a bunch more "guides", ie. players who volunteered to do customer service work in exchange for free playtime.

By definition, P99 can't have either of those, because they're not allowed to charge players to play here. This means that what we have instead is a very few, very kind, 100% volunteers, who generously give some of their free time to help players who fall through the world or get in fights with each other.

Speaking of fights, back in the day on live those paid CS people used to resolve fights by ... you guessed it: lists. Don't believe me? Read the instruction manual Verant gave their GMs/Guides back in the day: http://wiki.project1999.com/Kunark_Era_Customer_Service_Guidelines

So while /list is a 100% P99 mechanism, and only exists because we don't have paid staff, what it does is 100% classic (and honestly Verant probably would have done the same thing if they thought of it: remember they didn't even realize they needed a Play Nice Policy until Kunkark, so they clearly didn't anticipate player fights over camps being as common).

[Iswin]

This is great news! Thank you to the p99 staff.

[ccs88]

Will the classic UI be in place at launch, as in the one on the tutorial disc?

[3d_glasses]

So I have read you should be able to access both blue and green without having to install anything separately, can anyone confirm this is true? I have not tried BETA.

If I start a character now on green BETA will it get erased at launch?

[magusfire24]

So I have read you should be able to access both blue and green without having to install anything separately, can anyone confirm this is true? I have not tried BETA.

If I start a character now on green BETA will it get erased at launch?

Right now you need separate installs. They are on different patches.

Also yes any beta toons get wiped at launch on Friday. Beta is for leveling fast to test content before launch.

[3d_glasses]

Will you able to start Thursday the night before?

[magusfire24]

Will you able to start Thursday the night before?

Can only play green beta before Friday. Beta will start Friday afternoon from what I hear. They will say more as it gets closer to launch.

[Deathrydar]

Can only play green beta before Friday. Beta will end Friday afternoon from what I hear. They will say more as it gets closer to launch.

Fixed

[magusfire24]

Fixed

lol. meant to say Green will launch that afternoon. Too early!

[Jhaerik]

Damn I was hoping for boxing.
Ahh well, always Classic WoW. :)

[luciacute]

I like the work you're doing. Greetings.

[Aboo]

So bard songs will only hit 4 targets for the first 6 months?

[gaunu]

Will the beta files work for the launch on Friday, or will a new set of files be released at that time?

[magusfire24]

*shrug* We will find out around that time for sure. Check project99.com on Friday

[westtell4]

Will this have the original stone ui ? Or a crappy titanium default

[slayer69]

A quick note to say whatever you did to the P99 files has really increased the stability of changing characters. Previously, when I would go to the character select screen more than 2 times, I would crash - without fail. Last night I switched characters at least 6 or 7 times without issue! Thank you!

[aspomwell]

I tend to crash when returning to the char select screen about 2/3 of the time. Vanilla install following the getting started wiki.

Since I only really play 1 char it's not an issue, but everynight when I camp out I can expect it to crash.

[magusfire24]

Will this have the original stone ui ? Or a crappy titanium default

Both. a melding of the two . As much stone UI as they could get to work with the current client.

Log onto green beta if you want to see what they have so far. Impressive

[westtell4]

Both. a melding of the two . As much stone UI as they could get to work with the current client.

Log onto green beta if you want to see what they have so far. Impressive
I'm thinking about it but I don't have the client anymore and I don't have a DVD drive in my computer for the titanium install

[Danth]

Both. a melding of the two . As much stone UI as they could get to work with the current client.

Log onto green beta if you want to see what they have so far. Impressive

It's a simulation of the alternate/fullscreen UI (particularly as it appeared during velious), which had both translucent windows and some "stone" assets in a seemingly random mix. There are some things like the original trainer window which simply cannot be properly replicated on the Titanium client, however.

Danth

[Bisonzabi]

So is "custom content" ever going to happen on blue or is that the carrot on the stick?

[DMN]

I tend to crash when returning to the char select screen about 2/3 of the time. Vanilla install following the getting started wiki.

Since I only really play 1 char it's not an issue, but everynight when I camp out I can expect it to crash.

Change the compatibility for eqgame to windows xp sp3.

It still crashes occasionally for me when ganging characters or sometimes logging them in, but it's a lot better than without changing compatability.

[senahsandman]

Anyone know where to get the most recent patch for P99 Green?

[Devlin666]

What time tomorrow ??? Or should I say today already???

[Sillyturtle]

Announce post said early afternoon. That's all we know.

[Atada]

Early afternoon EST. I

[Zade]

Which one of you clowns stole my name lol

[Serek]

Which one of you clowns stole my name lol


I was thinking the exact same thing.

[3d_glasses]

Im missing the joke...HAS GREEN STARTED YET?!?!?

[magusfire24]

Im missing the joke...HAS GREEN STARTED YET?!?!?

you can log into green to make your character to reserve a name. That is it till launch

[Baler]

Which one of you clowns stole my name lol

Hey Zade welcome back, I've been thinking about that beach photo a lot. lollll

[GigaSausage]

i dont think character creation is working for names reserved on Blue. it just hangs for me.

[GigaSausage]

i dont think character creation is working for names reserved on Blue. it just hangs for me.

its just coming straight up rejecting the name now.

[Netherzul]

So excited to log in, power game non stop for a solid 10 days straight because I'm unemployed living off food stamps and other forms of government assistance.

I consume content as quickly and incoherently as possible because why? I don't know why, I don't think anyone does anymore. 50 levels? I'll not sleep 3 days straight, drink 29 mountain dews and/or monster energy drinks to get there in as little time as possible, damaging my body, my sanity and my grip on reality. Is it fun? Fuck no, it's not fun at all. It's just what I do and I've never asked myself why.

During this content consumption, I will survive off of banquet tv dinners that are a notch above literal garbage, because its all I can afford when all I do is play video games, which in turn feeds into my anxiety, which is why I refuse to leave the house to get a job and become a productive member of society. I've never touched a girl and honestly if I ever did, I'd spunk my jorts in an instant, leading to embarrassment and further loneliness.

On my path to level 50 and beyond, I will become the most toxic human being most of you have ever met, because I am projecting my insecurities, self loathing and anger onto others in an attempt to cope with how sad and pathetic my life has become. Did you catch the part where I've never touched a girl and even if I did, I'd cream my jorts? I'm 35 years old for fucks sake!!! I will steal your camps, your mobs, I will train you and I will make you hate me....because no one hates me more than me.

Once I have achieved notoriety, my career on p99 green can either take two paths, the first being to immortal glory as the guild leader of some exclusive only guild, where agoraphobia/living in a basement/SS tier neckbeard/emotional manchild/literal psychopath will be requirements for membership. Oh and you ABSOLUTELY MUST NOT be employed, for a minimum of 5 years. How else can we get you to sit on spawns for days on end without logging out? Keep in mind, this process will be 100% verified, either requiring therapist transcripts, copies of prescription receipts, pictures of SS level neckbeards etc. We will farm the same mobs over and over again, like we have been for the past 10 years, to accumulate an enormous amount of platinum for one of two reasons, the first being for absolutely no reason at all or the second being...you know what (not sure if I can mention this here despite this being a joke I don't want this comment removed). The second reason will ultimately get myself and the 15 other people I share accounts with, banned, resulting in a re-roll to Daybreak progression servers, joining guilds such as Faceless or Relentless Insomnia. Or maybe just a re-roll on P99. Who knows? I don't. Not yet.

The second fork will lead me to infamy, becoming outcast from the server, in total exile, resulting in a re-roll to another character, where, like an idiot, I will let 4-5 people know who I really am, in turn, having myself exposed once I have invested hundreds of hours of time into said character. This cycle may continue, I may wisen up and not tell anyone who my new character is, or I might just quit altogether. And by quit, I mean stop playing for a few days.


In the end, what I'm really trying to say is, all in all, Everquest is to blame for every last one of my problems.

[Kaosfury]

I'm looking forward to playing, I play on the blue server but I came very very late so most folks were considerably out leveled me, and spread far across the map, it's going to be nice starting over with folks and actually grouping up and doing some things.

Met my wife like 17 years ago playing EverQuest

[Dragonslayer]

WTH? They update the patch again and not link it on the front page? Was playing yesterday and now have the box of doom, saying my files aren't correct??

[Deathrydar]

WTH? They update the patch again and not link it on the front page? Was playing yesterday and now have the box of doom, saying my files aren't correct??

It is on the front page...

[Dragonslayer]

It is on the front page...

50H or the one on the top now V52?

[Dragonslayer]

50H or the one on the top now V52?

50H was yesterdays patch and is now a dead link

[Deathrydar]

50H was yesterdays patch and is now a dead link

Correct. It is now v52 for both blue and green.

[drummer944]

Saying I am missing DSETUP.DLL

[Quatch]

v52 worked for me and I was able to create my first char on green.

[Euphoric]

Saying I am missing DSETUP.DLL



https://www.project1999.com/files/P99Files52.zip

[xr30]

Saying I am missing DSETUP.DLL

The new v52 patch is needed. https://www.project1999.com/ at the very top welcome page and click https://www.project1999.com/files/P99Files52.zip

[BlackBellamy]

Saying I am missing DSETUP.DLL

Your antivirus is flagging it as a false positive. You need to disable antivirus or whitelist that file or the whole install.

[Proven Guilty]

ITS HAPPENING GREEN LOCKED AND NAME CHANGED :O

[drummer944]

Thanks!

[Flowe]

I know when things get settled where I have moved. I will be donating. As much as I can to help out. I missed out on starting of the green. Because of my move. Thank you again. For all that you all have been doing. I miss playing and hope to be back soon.

[Linkage]

Making blue suffer by being down is not what I call progress.

[DaNecro]

praise tunare for the dedication by P99 staff/devs to put out Green/Teal amidst all the complaining from naysayers. You guys ROCK. thank you for volunteering your service/time/expertise amen

[3d_glasses]

praise tunare for the dedication by P99 staff/devs to put out Green/Teal amidst all the complaining from naysayers. You guys ROCK. thank you for volunteering your service/time/expertise amen

V true... this (extremely vast) game is NOT FREE ENOUGH!!!!!

[YatilGoldenborn]

What does it mean "Legacy items cease to drop"? I'm semi new here, just trying to get a feel for everything.

[greenspectre]

What does it mean "Legacy items cease to drop"? I'm semi new here, just trying to get a feel for everything.

Legacy items typically refer to Box of Abu-Kar, Guise of the Deceiver, Manastone, and Rubicite Armor.