Stupid question - maybe ?

[iddqd]

Hello,

This is probably a stupid question - but using your mouse sofware for keypress is bannable ?

Because i think i just learned the hard way if it is...

[Madbad]

Did it automate anything? If so then yes.

[Madbad]

5. You may not use third-party programs on Project 1999.

The use of any third-party programs on Project 1999, including but not limited to, Macroquest/Macroquest2(MQ/MQ2), ShowEQ(SEQ), or any other program that interacts with the Everquest Titanium Client, is strictly prohibited. Use of any third-party programs will be detected and will result in the permanent banning of your account(s). No exceptions will be made, and once a ban has been enacted for violation of this rule it will not be reversed.

This is not limited to programmable keyboards or other input devices that creates multiple inputs for a single keystroke or automated task.

Wineq2 by Lavishsoft is the exception to this rule. In addition, any program that strictly reads log files is acceptable.

[iddqd]

I have nerve damage in one of my arms.

This is not limited to programmable keyboards or other input devices that creates multiple inputs for a single keystroke or automated task.

I read that to mean that they are OK.

But one key to launch an ingame macro.

Anyway, i really enjoyed my time on p99 - it really took me back to my university days! The community is excellent, and have had great fun getting to know some of you a little bit!

[Mentathiel]

If you just got banned, petition for more information. As long as you were not boxing or trading real-world currency for plat at the same time, you might be on a week's suspension rather than losing your account. They might also be able to explain what you did wrong and how to avoid it in future.

If you do need to automate certain tasks, you would be amazed what the (completely legitimate) macro system can do for you. The game is filled with mechanics which are either harder (bards twisting) or nigh-impossible (rogues evading) to do effectively without macros.

There is also nothing wrong with mapping a few mouse-buttons to each activate a single macro in-game, so you might find you do not even have to relearn your control-system.

[iddqd]

If you are banned, how do you petition ingame ?

[Mentathiel]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=25 is the petition forum; it's all hidden from public view. I think in-game petitions are only really for urgent in-game stuff like getting stuck or name changes.

[Dyson]

I'm a bit concerned about this on two counts:
1) I play on a Linux machine using Wine. I hope that's not detected as 3rd party program.
2) Awhile back I got a Roccat Nyth Mouse with 12 "programmable" keys. I haven't done anything with them yet (because, lazy), but I was planning on setting the 12 keys on the side of it to motion and spellcasting. The idea was to make playing my bard less painful.
Unfortunately, EQ doesn't let me set one character to be controlled by mouse/WASD and all the others to be controlled by the cursor keys, and I never really adapted to the mouse / WASD control method.

So would setting the 12 buttons to my number and cursor keys, for spellcasting and movement, count as "macros"?
As I could set up a single-key macro sequence of something like, "/cast 1, /pause, 10, /stopsong, /cast 2" etc in the game itself, could I assign one of the keys to this such an in-game macro?

I'm not going to do a thing until I know for sure it won't get me banned. My bard can wait.

[loramin]

I'm a bit concerned about this on two counts:
1) I play on a Linux machine using Wine. I hope that's not detected as 3rd party program.

No, WINE is not a problem. Lots of us (myself included) play on Linux via WINE, and many more use WINE-related software to run on Mac.


2) Awhile back I got a Roccat Nyth Mouse with 12 "programmable" keys. I haven't done anything with them yet (because, lazy), but I was planning on setting the 12 keys on the side of it to motion and spellcasting. The idea was to make playing my bard less painful.
Unfortunately, EQ doesn't let me set one character to be controlled by mouse/WASD and all the others to be controlled by the cursor keys, and I never really adapted to the mouse / WASD control method.

So would setting the 12 buttons to my number and cursor keys, for spellcasting and movement, count as "macros"?
As I could set up a single-key macro sequence of something like, "/cast 1, /pause, 10, /stopsong, /cast 2" etc in the game itself, could I assign one of the keys to this such an in-game macro?

I'm not going to do a thing until I know for sure it won't get me banned. My bard can wait.

I'm no GM, but the heart of the rule is simple: don't use stuff outside the game to let you do things other players can't do without such outside stuff.

So for instance, binding individual keys to individual mouse buttons is allowed; you're just pressing something different, but fundamentally you're doing the same thing as everyone else (one button press, whether on your mouse or keyboard = one action).

However, the moment you map more than one in-game action to a single button press (eg. if you make clicking your 4th mouse button trigger a "TAB press followed by a 0.5 pause followed by an "ALT + 1" keypress) you're cheating (because regular players can't do that).

[Mentathiel]

So would setting the 12 buttons to my number and cursor keys, for spellcasting and movement, count as "macros"?
As I could set up a single-key macro sequence of something like, "/cast 1, /pause, 10, /stopsong, /cast 2" etc in the game itself, could I assign one of the keys to this such an in-game macro?

As long as each mouse-press is the equivalent of a normal mouse-press for anyone else, I think it's all good. The in-game macros are completely legitimate, your mouse-buttons are just equivalent to single key-presses, so what could go wrong?

[Madbad]

give us more info!

[fastboy21]

Something like this is definitely against the rules (clear statements by GMs, some linked/quoted above).

I've never actually heard of anyone being banned for this alone though. I would suspect it has to do more with what you are doing with it than that you used a macro on a programmable Razor-like mouse.

Generally speaking, if your macro is doing something that you could physically do then you're probably okay (no logic, simple key presses, etc.). If you are running the same macro while AFK then you're in big trouble.

I've known players that have used tab targeting macros on their necros, for example, while camping a ph. I suspect that if a GM comes along and questions them that they would be okay IF they are actually at their keyboard and not AFK clearing the area with their macro.

Nonetheless, please post a follow up either way to let other folks know what you got called on here.

[jacobar]

Hello,

This is probably a stupid question - but using your mouse sofware for keypress is bannable ?

Because i think i just learned the hard way if it is...


Agree with the others, say what you were doing, please elaborate

[loramin]

I've never actually heard of anyone being banned for this alone though.

While this is likely true, to me it comes down to this: some people are cool with cheating as long as they don't get caught ... but I'm of the opinion one doesn't need to cheat in a 20-year old elf sim even if you can get away with it.

And to be clear, I have some serious RSI issues (being a programmer/EQ addict will do that to you, plus I shattered my wrist back in high school being dumb). I would LOVE, LOVE to program something with my Steam controller (and I'm sure I could) to automate all the tradeskill clicks, because they are just so hard on my wrists.

But instead of cheating I put on a wrist brace and do them the same way as everyone else, because if I'm not willing to do that what am I doing playing here? I should be programming speed run bots or something instead.

[fastboy21]

While this is likely true, to me it comes down to this: some people are cool with cheating as long as they don't get caught ... but I'm of the opinion one doesn't need to cheat in a 20-year old elf sim even if you can get away with it.

And to be clear, I have some serious RSI issues (being a programmer/EQ addict will do that to you, plus I shattered my wrist back in high school being dumb). I would LOVE, LOVE to program something with my Steam controller (and I'm sure I could) to automate all the tradeskill clicks, because they are just so hard on my wrists.

But instead of cheating I put on a wrist brace and do them the same way as everyone else, because if I'm not willing to do that what am I doing playing here? I should be programming speed run bots or something instead.

I'm in agreement with you as far as my personal play style, but I've met more than a few people over the years that love EQ AND love finding all kinds of game-breaking exploits, short cuts, etc. to "beat" the game.

It isn't my cup of tea, but I don't think there is any shortage of folks who genuinely have fun playing "classic" EQ by looking for all kinds of ways to get around its quirky demands.

[loramin]

I'm in agreement with you as far as my personal play style, but I've met more than a few people over the years that love EQ AND love finding all kinds of game-breaking exploits, short cuts, etc. to "beat" the game.

It isn't my cup of tea, but I don't think there is any shortage of folks who genuinely have fun playing "classic" EQ by looking for all kinds of ways to get around its quirky demands.

In-game I 100% respect (and encourage) that. Hell, I started http://wiki.project1999.com/Advanced_Techniques_Guide to document such cleverness for newer folks.

But when you do it out of game it's cheating, plain and simple. You're saying to everyone else on the server, "screw you, I don't care if you play fair, I'm going to cheat and you can't catch me".

It doesn't matter whether you're right or not about getting caught. Personally I will hope that you do, but whether you do or not I won't play that way (even if it would mean relief for my wrists).

(and by "you" I don't mean you Fastboy, I mean hypothetical cheater X)

[Xaeophi]

No Autoclickers!! But you can have gina that will let you know when that mob with the huge spawn variance actually pops and it'll let you know from across the room or wake you up if youre in bed sleeping.

[fastboy21]

No Autoclickers!! But you can have gina that will let you know when that mob with the huge spawn variance actually pops and it'll let you know from across the room or wake you up if youre in bed sleeping.

Yeah...this is where I was going with some of my comments. The standby rule from p99 has been simple: Gina, Gamparse, even a map overlay is all okay because "all they do is read your log file" --- easy to understand, easy to know if you are in compliance. good.

autoclicker (razor programmable mouse macro for example) to forage afk or hit kick/backstab for you is against the rules.

Tell me though, which is more game changing/breaking...setting a gina parse macro to tell you a mob is gating or to tell you exactly how many seconds you have left on your mez spell without any effort or someone running a simple click macro to auto kick?

I'm not saying p99 has it wrong, I'm saying I honestly don't know how to completely defend the rule when the allowable 3rd party software is so powerful/useful.

I'm also uncomfortable (when I can't even completely defend the rule) white knighting and saying that playing the game "according to the rules" arbitrarily set is somehow morally superior. The guy using auto backstab isn't an immoral cheater to me that deserves to be banned for the good of the project/community.

I play by the rules because I don't want to get banned and because I respect the people who made them, but I can't go so far as to look down my nose on someone for "playing wrong" morally for running a programmable keyboard to do simple stuff especially when not afk.