Can someone explain the giving pets a torch thing?

[Tethler]

I always see people doing it, and I had a few questions. The following questions are based on my current understanding (which may not be accurate) so feel free to correct any misconceptions in that are implied in my questions.

1. If a pet can already dual wield, is there a benefit to using a torch and a weapon over 2x 1h weapons?

2. Is it ideal to use on both charmed pets AND summoned pets, or is it mostly a function of enabling dual wield on a charmed mob type that doesn't naturally dual wield?

3. 2h + torch allows what? dual wielding with harder hits?

4. Does giving weapons/torches have any effect on charmed pets that can't visibly display equipped weapons? (druids charming animal pets for example)

5. Is there any other important aspect im overlooking in my questions?

To wrap up, what are the general best practices regarding weapon/torch equip mechanics? Always use X, or use X until a certain level, depending on pet type do X, etc?


Thanks for any help! <3

[Vasarious]

1)Torch is secondary only. An npc usually only hits with primary, so putting something in its off hand makes it quad. 1 torch (or lantern) takes up less inventory space.

2) not certain about summoned pets, some stuff on the wiki says some auto dual wield but i dunno if thats accurate. Weapons force it tho.

3) a lot of times what you see as the 2h sword on a charmed pet is a mith 2h sword used for the worn haste. Torch forces off hand weapon and therefore quad.

4) giving items including weapons to non humanoid npcs doesnt work. Spiders or wolves wont use weapons, or other item for that matter (im prettt sure)

[Rathnir]

1. If a pet can already dual wield, is there a benefit to using a torch and a weapon over 2x 1h weapons?

Convenience, mostly. Torches are everywhere, and cheap, and light weight. Shields, Lanterns, Lutes, Secondary only weapons also force this effect. JUST the torch forces dual wield, so only 1 inventory slot taken up.

2. Is it ideal to use on both charmed pets AND summoned pets, or is it mostly a function of enabling dual wield on a charmed mob type that doesn't naturally dual wield?

It will force charmed pets to dual wield (if they can). Summoned pets have a very specific range where they can dual wield but don't do so innately (Somewhere in this link (https://wiki.project1999.com/Pet_Guide#Dual_Wielding) is a more specific answer. )

3. 2h + torch allows what? dual wielding with harder hits?

Mostly this is to allow the pet to proc specific 2 handed weapons, while also dual-wielding. Runed Blade, for example, can let the pet Rune itself. This plus a torch lets pet Rune and Quad.
Pet hits are determined by weapon damage x 2 + 1. So the Runed Blade having a base damage of 26 x 2 + 1 = 53. So pets that hit below 53 innately will now hit for 53.

4. Does giving weapons/torches have any effect on charmed pets that can't visibly display equipped weapons? (druids charming animal pets for example)

Animals can't dual wield (Shaman pets, charmed rats, gorillas etc.). They can't equip weapons at all, to my knowledge. So "display" I don't think is the correct term. Kobolds and Goos, for example, quad, without having a graphic change. It's a model/creature type specific event.

5. Is there any other important aspect im overlooking in my questions?

Procs. It's almost always about the procs.

To wrap up, what are the general best practices regarding weapon/torch equip mechanics? Always use X, or use X until a certain level, depending on pet type do X, etc?

IF charming AND you want it to quad THEN add torch.
IF charming AND you want special procs THEN possibly something besides/in tandem with torch.

[Vasarious]

1)Torch is secondary only. An npc usually only hits with primary, so putting something in its off hand makes it quad. 1 torch (or lantern) takes up less inventory space.

2) not certain about summoned pets, some stuff on the wiki says some auto dual wield but i dunno if thats accurate. Weapons force it tho.

3) a lot of times what you see as the 2h sword on a charmed pet is a mith 2h sword used for the worn haste. Torch forces off hand weapon and therefore quad.

4) giving items including weapons to non humanoid npcs doesnt work. Spiders or wolves wont use weapons, or other item for that matter (im prettt sure)

Sorry, forgot - also the dam/del doesnt matter on npcs with weapons. Their damage is based on level, and their delay is 30 so you dont get a benefit from weapons with high dmg or low delay (worn haste does count tho, as well as procs of course). Torches are super cheap and take up relatively little inventory space compared to using multiple weapons, but any secondary only item works the same. Just make sure they are holding something in their off hand, primary can remain empty.

[Vasarious]

[COLOR="darkgreen"]Mostly this is to allow the pet to proc specific 2 handed weapons, while also dual-wielding. Runed Blade, for example, can let the pet Rune itself. This plus a torch lets pet Rune and Quad.
Pet hits are determined by weapon damage x 2 + 1. So the Runed Blade having a base damage of 26 x 2 + 1 = 53. So pets that hit below 53 innately will now hit for 53. [/COLOR

If this is the case then i wasnt aware of it, ive never noticed a damage difference with what a mob was holding, but then i never really experimented with it. Learn something every day i guess

[DMN]

Sorry, forgot - also the dam/del doesnt matter on npcs with weapons. Their damage is based on level, and their delay is 30 so you dont get a benefit from weapons with high dmg or low delay (worn haste does count tho, as well as procs of course). Torches are super cheap and take up relatively little inventory space compared to using multiple weapons, but any secondary only item works the same. Just make sure they are holding something in their off hand, primary can remain empty.

If the weapon damage is higher than their base damage, it will increase the damage of the pet to the weapon damage. This is mostly irrelevant at higher levels but can be particularly important at lower ones.

[Izmael]

Weapon damage (unlike the delay) can affect pet's max hit fot very low level pets.

Give a rusty scythe to a level 1 enc animation, and it will increase its max hit a little. Tested on many chars.

[Tethler]

Awesome. Thanks for the responses! Appreciate you all sharing your knowledge.

[kjs86z]

Also you can give a pet a 2h w/ a nice effect like Swarmcaller, Staff of Undead Legion, etc....then give it a torch and it will still quad + proc.

[Secrets]

It should be also noted that this functionality is not classic and needs to be fixed.

[Crede]

It should be also noted that this functionality is not classic and needs to be fixed.

I posted this is a bug thread a few months ago.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=317325&highlight=torch

[Buellen]

I know here enchanter animation benefit from higher damage weapons increasing there damage , but i do not rem this being so back in 1999. Then again i don t know if this was due to the delay of weapon given to pet helping them back then. I do remember playing a young enchanter back then and trying to give my animation a rusty two hander and various other weapon and it would never replace its basic weapon unless i gave it daggers.

[Jimjam]

Giving the pet a light source also makes it easier to find it in the dark too!

[Sacer]

It should be also noted that this functionality is not classic and needs to be fixed.

It was in a patch note like 1 - 2 years ago, at the time everyone stopped using a torch for a little while but slowly realised it was still working.


And the pet wiki is correct, between like level 20 and 44 summoned pets can dual wield if you equip their offhands, once the pet got innate dual wield it's useless.

[DMN]

I know here enchanter animation benefit from higher damage weapons increasing there damage , but i do not rem this being so back in 1999. Then again i don t know if this was due to the delay of weapon given to pet helping them back then. I do remember playing a young enchanter back then and trying to give my animation a rusty two hander and various other weapon and it would never replace its basic weapon unless i gave it daggers.

From what I recall the pet would always equip the fastest weapon. Their attack speed would then be modified by it. I think at some point they normalized the pet attack speed, however, but i'm not sure exactly when.

[Buellen]

Correct and that fastest weapon teneded to be their animations basic weapon pet had. So when you gave it a 2hander it would not use it.

Here on p1999 enchanter pet can equip 2handers like fs two handed sword at level 1. they done check to see which is fastest weapon.

[DiogenesThaDogg]

Tome of the eternal gives the same effect as torch (secondary only so forced dual wield) but has -10 MR, making it perfect for enchanter pets.

[Tethler]

It should be also noted that this functionality is not classic and needs to be fixed.

I thought that might be the case. Wasn't sure if unclassic, or just one of those things that wasn't common knowledge back in the day.

[Karok]

I always wanted to try and give a lower level pet a weighted axe to see if they do in fact hit for 90 with it. Has anyone tried this before?

Edit: well crap wiki says no

[Danth]

I always wanted to try and give a lower level pet a weighted axe to see if they do in fact hit for 90 with it. Has anyone tried this before?

Edit: well crap wiki says no

The weighted axe was fairly notorious (and effective) for that use on eq-live, which is why it's specifically disabled here. You can try some of the other high-damage weapons like Oggok Cleaver if you like. The 20-ish damage weapons that regularly drop in Great Divide certainly make weak low-level pets hit for in the 40's.

Danth

[Secrets]

I always wanted to try and give a lower level pet a weighted axe to see if they do in fact hit for 90 with it. Has anyone tried this before?

Edit: well crap wiki says no

They're supposed to, based on the hand it's equipped in. Just another nonclassic thing here :(

[Zipity]

Oggok cleaver on a low level pet will hit for 80s but it’s kinda finicky. There are however a few good weapons that will make pets starting at lvl 1 to hit for 60+ and others that they will just eat! There is no list of these weapons on wiki that I know of but it seems most weapons with a damage bw 20-34 will work on any level summoned pet and pet will do 2x damage with it.