The single line that tells me the ToV change will not work

[ajohnymous]

“Leapfrogging, while technically not against the rules, is still an asshole move.”



ToV is FILLED with asshole moves. With this dungeon crawl adjustment, competing guilds are going to sit around the corner from a Target and wait for someone else to kill the final trash mob. Stand offs will be a regular occurrence.

The type of person sitting at their computer who’s primary priority is getting raid loot has and will continue to bend and push rules to get what they want. Recently, those players have been straight up breaking rules because there’s been zero direct staff involvement in ToV. Leapfrogging will occur. It will happen on the first perma rooted dragon to spawn this Friday.

I love what N and R do for this community. I mean it. Bringing such a diverse group of people across the world together through a collective fondness is a wonderful experience. I’m a sentimental bastard and this server hits home for me, but, guys, if you think the type of person who places this video game as a priority above their job, their health, and their livelihood won’t pull “asshole moves,” then you are seriously out of touch.

This change is a band aid at best, but a step in the right direction. Regardless of what direction you guys take on this, clear, specific rules need to be written and regular, direct staff involvement to enforce those rules needs to happen. “The first guild to clear to X location has the rights to kill Y,” or, “The first guild to clear 51% of Y’s guards has the rights to kill Y.” Followed by, “That guild has Z amount of time to do so, if that time expires, the next guild with an FTE message has the rights to kill Y.”

R and N, you guys obviously have outside lives and priorities above policing all the types of people on this server (which I’m glad for). If you guys want to act like business owners and stay behind the scenes removed from the daily operations, you need a general manager. Otherwise, we’ll be back here in another handful of months having the same conversations.

Thank you for what you do for this server and for taking a step in the right direction.

[branamil]

Reminder: It's a free game that people volunteered to make for you so that you could have fun.

[Daloon]

Can't wait.

See you in ToV!

[Wonkie]

in classic if you acted like a asshole too much people would shun you

[DMN]

in classic if you acted like a asshole too much people would shun you

Depends. Sometimes the assholes were the majority and non assholes shunned.

[Legidias]

in p99 if you act like an asshole too much, people just say concede

[Lobster1071]

It would be THAT difficult to iron out a set of rules where if a guild was clearly forming first to go after a particular ToV target, leapfrogging by another guild is not allowed? If that guild fails, they concede...as how it is with other mobs outside of ToV?

[Daloon]

It would be THAT difficult to iron out a set of rules where if a guild was clearly forming first to go after a particular ToV target, leapfrogging by another guild is not allowed? If that guild fails, they concede...as how it is with other mobs outside of ToV?

Yeah it's called Coirnav, Selo, Mangler, Agnarr, Phinigel, Lockjaw, Ragefire, and Fippy Darkpaw server.

[ajohnymous]

Yeah it's called Coirnav, Selo, Mangler, Agnarr, Phinigel, Lockjaw, Ragefire, and Fippy Darkpaw server.



Must we post like this here? Isn’t R and F enough?

[ajohnymous]

It would be THAT difficult to iron out a set of rules where if a guild was clearly forming first to go after a particular ToV target, leapfrogging by another guild is not allowed? If that guild fails, they concede...as how it is with other mobs outside of ToV?

I don’t think ironing out the rules is difficult, it just doesn’t get done. With every raid target contested by multiple guilds, if the first guild fails another guild will immediately engage and kill it.

The issues don’t arise from guilds failing to kill targets, they come from a relatively small group of people who bend, push, then break rules. When they do this, guild to guild communication and cooperation breaks down, the staff are having to deal with petitions, and the overall atmosphere of the raid scene deteriorates.

[ajohnymous]

Reminder: It's a free game that people volunteered to make for you so that you could have fun.

I remind people of this often, but receiving money in exchange for your time doesn’t effect how much the players and staff care about the server. I happen to be a player that cares a lot about this community.

[Wallicker]

Rooted cleric dragons with no way to mana sieve or stun seems like a bigger issue

[Misek84]

Everyone always says that the raid scene is toxic, that people are assoholes in tov, that repops cause a shitstorm in tov. I just disagree. For the last 3 months with very minimal staff involvement, if any, i just dont see this toxic environment everyone always says is happing. Sure issues happen but they are usually unintentional. Sure guilds train others but its accidentally with the the trainer conceding. Sure disagreements happen between guilds but they are usually resolved by guild leaders. Considering the mechanics of the game (pulling across zones, aggro, etc) i see the raid scene as a testament to to the good not the asshole behavior everyone always says is happening. It is as if people just keep repeating the raid scene is a shitshow when its not in hopes of getting changes they want to the game.

With regards to the rooted mobs. Seems cool and will bring back crawling. Would be better if instead of rooting mobs there would just be some mechanic that causes mobs to return to spawn if pulled to far. Thus allowing classic fight mechincs (pushing, pulling) but not allow stuff like pulling to zone every raid mob.

[twill86]

I'm just excited that it should keep AM/AG ect locked down in ToV longer on earthquakes to open up other targets.

[aaezil]

Everyone always says that the raid scene is toxic, that people are assoholes in tov, that repops cause a shitstorm in tov. I just disagree. For the last 3 months with very minimal staff involvement, if any, i just dont see this toxic environment everyone always says is happing. Sure issues happen but they are usually unintentional. Sure guilds train others but its accidentally with the the trainer conceding. Sure disagreements happen between guilds but they are usually resolved by guild leaders. Considering the mechanics of the game (pulling across zones, aggro, etc) i see the raid scene as a testament to to the good not the asshole behavior everyone always says is happening. It is as if people just keep repeating the raid scene is a shitshow when its not in hopes of getting changes they want to the game.

With regards to the rooted mobs. Seems cool and will bring back crawling. Would be better if instead of rooting mobs there would just be some mechanic that causes mobs to return to spawn if pulled to far. Thus allowing classic fight mechincs (pushing, pulling) but not allow stuff like pulling to zone every raid mob.

DA idol / DA earring pulling is cheesy and not classic. All it does is reward the guild that spends the most time camping Idols and winning Ring war clickfests.

Sorry you're bad at everquest!

[Arkanjil]

DA idol / DA earring pulling is cheesy and not classic. All it does is reward the guild that spends the most time camping Idols and winning Ring war clickfests.

Sorry you're bad at everquest!

That's funny...winning should mean you aren't inherently bad...

[enjchanter]

I'm just excited that it should keep AM/AG ect locked down in ToV longer on earthquakes to open up other targets.

Wrong
Tov will be killed last while everything else will be priority

[feniin]

That's funny...winning should mean you aren't inherently bad...

If only the ring war rotation/roll wasn't killed by assholes who think their time/pixels is more important than everyone else's

[ajohnymous]

DA idol / DA earring pulling is cheesy and not classic. All it does is reward the guild that spends the most time camping Idols and winning Ring war clickfests.

Sorry you're bad at everquest!


It took much, much more than just camping the Idol camp to successfully pull a dragon to zone in clean. We put in a ton of effort running scrimmages and tests on our private server, organization, maps, charts, and way more than I can keep track of. Our entire DKP system was restructured to support ToV participation and support. It was a great experience building a team and it made getting loot that much more rewarding.

[Rimitto]

[B]direct staff involvement to enforce those rules needs to happen.

Just ban the server. Everyone that isn't in this guy's guild is clearly evil, and heretics and probably the anti-quellious.
Infact we should probably just give him GM status so that he can ban all the people that he doesn't like. Especially if they're trolls, ogres, or iksars. Those are the dirty ones.


TL:DR - you can't control peoples own free will. You may think you can, but you can't. Didn't you ever watch Bruce Almighty? Trying to control people's actions never works, and inevitably, borns evil in yourself. Additionally the concept of telling people what they can and cannot kill in an mmo designed to be an online version of dungeons and dragons isn't really the best idea in the world. :rolleyes:
Here's a small concept idea... now stay with me on this... If someone does something that seems wrong and you don't like it... you could... tell them that you don't like it.
And if you still don't like it and they continue to do it and you think it will bother other people you could.... tell others about it... forewarn them about person X or guild Y.
And if you really really REALLLY want to get into the idea of roleplaying that the person X or guild Y is absolutely evil, then you could... wage some sort of war against them..

There's really a million ways to deal with drama (which this is) and none of them invoke the power of "YOU CANT PLAY ANYMORE BECAUSE I SAID SO!!!".

[Arkanjil]

If only the ring war rotation/roll wasn't killed by assholes who think their time/pixels is more important than everyone else's

So anyone who wins the ring war turn in is an asshole? Cuz AM certainly doesn’t always win it...

[branamil]

Imagine waking up on crisp Sunday morning on April 7th, 2019 and getting really upset about 16 bit dragons and composing a terse diatribe about it

[Wonkie]

Depends. Sometimes the assholes were the majority and non assholes shunned.

is that true on p99 blue? too many sharks not enough fish?

[Swish2]

It'll be fun to see how this plays out. Leapfrog attempts are an almost certainty.

[feniin]

So anyone who wins the ring war turn in is an asshole? Cuz AM certainly doesn’t always win it...

Would say you win more than 50% of them. Probably close to 2/3 these days.

[Lothisu]

I wouldn't be surprised if the dragons became unrooted at a certain percentage to allow for push and positioning. That or the dragons that CH simply won't CH.

[mattydef]

With an unclassic 100+ people per guild raiding tov weekly something tells me you guys should be able to dedicate some players to offtank multiple mobs while also killing the boss.

[DMN]

is that true on p99 blue? too many sharks not enough fish?

Probably a little too subjective to properly gauge. Everyone is an asshole in someone else's account.

[Misek84]

DA idol / DA earring pulling is cheesy and not classic. All it does is reward the guild that spends the most time camping Idols and winning Ring war clickfests.

Sorry you're bad at everquest!

Dude did u even read my post or are you just trolling? If your a troll just stay in rnf. I was saying that stuff in tov have been alot more civil than people say on these forums. Unless your trying say the use of DA idols is in itself considered asshole behavior. No one likes the use of DA idols but thats what the game is based on rules/mechanics. If i used your logic, than a guild using DA idols is creating a toxic environment/are assholes but if they dont use DA than they suck at EQ cause other guilds would and you wont get any mobs? Either, take out DA items use for everyone or dont bitch about guild using them. I’m guessing you’re the bad one at EQ since you cant compete so you want to vilify the use of DA for everyone EXCEPT your guild cause thats the only way u can get mobs?

[Troxx]

Forcing guilds to commit to lengthy clears to just get to these mobs will hopefully encourage people to dedicate whole nights/evenings to these raids. Maybe ... just maybe it will work itself out such that higher up guilds come to an agreement with regards to picking/choosing which mobs they chase and leaving content up for others.

If not, I anticipate a lot of burnout from the warmbodies who like the convenience of preparking and logging in for 5-10 minutes at a time to harvest pixels.

Burnout of this crowd could open up content to those who would like to be able to plan a raid for any given night of the week and know there’s going to be a dragon up somewhere to kill.

[Legidias]

inb4 time-based DKP inflation

[Gohie]

Multiple instances and upon entering Flag the account for that instances is yours. Don't hate me its Monday.

[aaezil]

Dude did u even read my post or are you just trolling? If your a troll just stay in rnf. I was saying that stuff in tov have been alot more civil than people say on these forums. Unless your trying say the use of DA idols is in itself considered asshole behavior. No one likes the use of DA idols but thats what the game is based on rules/mechanics. If i used your logic, than a guild using DA idols is creating a toxic environment/are assholes but if they dont use DA than they suck at EQ cause other guilds would and you wont get any mobs? Either, take out DA items use for everyone or dont bitch about guild using them. I’m guessing you’re the bad one at EQ since you cant compete so you want to vilify the use of DA for everyone EXCEPT your guild cause thats the only way u can get mobs?

You are obviously terrible at everquest. Im saying da idol/earring pulls to zoneline are bad/cheesy/not classic and have no place on a velious box.

Whats wrong - cant compete without cheesy tactics? Sorry you’re bad at everquest!