Level 55 thru 60 Shaman Spells

[dbparden]

Are all of the level 55 thru 60 Shaman spells must have or are some not worth the plat because you rarely if ever use them? I have lots of earlier spells i have never loaded once!

[Legidias]

Torpor or bust

[kjs86z]

https://wiki.project1999.com/Shaman#Level_55

Scroll down from there.

You decide.

[Danth]

If you're leveling you can make do without many of them. Even after being 60 for a long time some of them don't see much or any use.

--The group buffs see very little use because a) few people want the same buffs, and b) even when they do they want the good versions, not the weaker group versions. That they're weaker than the single-target versions which don't cost regeants anyway (unlike the Cleric symbol line) severely damages the desirability of these group buff spells.

--Spirit Quickening seems junky. It doesn't seem to stack with regular haste. Keep an eye out in case this changes in the future, but right now it's easily ignored.

--I've never seen a need or use for Voice of the Berserker.

--Avatar gets used only in extreme rarity. The cost of emeralds is a nuisance, as is the long recast time and short duration. You can live without it. Primal Avatar requires a Sleeper's Tomb key to obtain. By the time a Shaman has it, many of the people he'd be casting it on will have primal weapons of their own, weakening its utility.

--The AE slow has a few very specific uses, but in general it doesn't get memorized often. It doesn't last as long as the regular slow, doesn't slow as much, and if some monsters resist you can't easily tell which ones. If you lack this spell you probably won't notice much.

--If you have Cannibalize 2 (some players quest/buy it, some don't) you can probably skip Canni3 and not mind too much. If you skipped Canni2, you probably want Canni3.

--In addition, you can live without the 55 pet (it's only a very slight upgrade over the 49 pet) and the two high-level damage-over-time spells (Pox and Bane; the 49 spells can serve, if need be). Likewise if you lack the top AC buff (Shroud of the Spirits) you can keep using the older one. All these spells are nice to have and WILL see a lot of use but they're luxuries, not strict necessities. The older versions of the same spells can continue getting the job done if necessary.

I'll consider it a given you'd have any of the vendor-bought spells if you want them, so nice spells like Chloroblast are a given. Of the spells you have to obtain as drops or purchase from players, you definitely want Canni4, Malo, Focus of Spirit, and Torpor. Those four are the most important in my experience, followed by the "luxury" spells listed above (the 55 pet, pox and bane, shroud, etc) that aren't strictly necessary but which are nonetheless nice to have and used often.

Danth

[dbparden]

Thanks Danth! Thats what I was looking for.........

[jacobi]

Danth pretty much said it all, however i will add my 2 pence on the order you acquire the (55-60) luxury dot spells.

Bane of Nife / Pox of Bertoxx: Shamans tend to struggle with dps, meaning some fights can take ages, while you torpor/canni and wait for dots to melt stuff. I would say get Bane of Nife to help with this, but not Pox (if trying to save plats). Bane works on poison resists, like Envenomed Bolt, so it's unlikely to be resisted after a malo. Whereas Pox involves switching a bunch of spell gems to debuff Disease resists (malo doesn't do disease). That can get tiresome to do on every mob, and a Pox resist kinda stings, losing such a large chunk of mana.

[dbparden]

Thanks Jacobi!

Eventually I want them all.......after Torpor.

[loramin]

--In addition, you can live without the 55 pet (it's only a very slight upgrade over the 49 pet) and the two high-level damage-over-time spells (Pox and Bane; the 49 spells can serve, if need be). Likewise if you lack the top AC buff (Shroud of the Spirits) you can keep using the older one. All these spells are nice to have and WILL see a lot of use but they're luxuries, not strict necessities. The older versions of the same spells can continue getting the job done if necessary.

Danth pretty much said it all, however i will add my 2 pence on the order you acquire the (55-60) luxury dot spells.

Bane of Nife / Pox of Bertoxx: Shamans tend to struggle with dps, meaning some fights can take ages, while you torpor/canni and wait for dots to melt stuff. I would say get Bane of Nife to help with this, but not Pox (if trying to save plats). Bane works on poison resists, like Envenomed Bolt, so it's unlikely to be resisted after a malo. Whereas Pox involves switching a bunch of spell gems to debuff Disease resists (malo doesn't do disease). That can get tiresome to do on every mob, and a Pox resist kinda stings, losing such a large chunk of mana.

Jacobi hit the nail on the head here with "Shamans tend to struggle with dps", but I disagree with both him and the last bullet point in Danth's (otherwise awesome) list. While it's technically true that "All these spells are nice to have and WILL see a lot of use but they're luxuries, not strict necessities", that's a little misleading: you can level without them, but all three (your new pet spell and new DoTs) will directly impact your DPS/how fast you level, and that should make them extremely high on your list to acquire IMHO.

Also, I've never in my entire Shaman career used the disease debuff, but I've also never had problems landing Pox. Maybe Jacobi was doing some very disease-resistant mobs at that level?

[Ostepop]

I debuff disease on cliff golems. Also, group stat buffs are nice for buffing lower level players, not much else.

[Troxx]

Torpor/canni4 > malo > the rest. I would not spend any money on the other spells until you’ve set aside and saved enough for those 3. At times I’d love to have the group buffs (stamina in particular). I’m ashamed to say I don’t have bane or pox yet but my shaman is a part time gig at best.

Edit: 55 pet is actually a fairly large upgrade and well worth it. It’s max hit may only be one higher but it’s 3 levels higher which helps a lot defensively and offensively; a lot more than the hit numbers would suggest. Additionally it has 15% more hp. I always think of my pet as a good sustained dot, a potentiall offtank/emergency tank; and reclaimable emergency mana pool. On all 3 fronts it is noticeably better than 49 pet. On xp trash max buffed 55 pet is about 10dps sustained higher than 49 ... mostly due to being 3 levels higher. 25 extra sustained dps from a pet helps a lot over time; about the equivalent of a permanent 150/tick dot rolling on stuff you’re killing (vs 49 pet being a ~90/tick dot.

[Danth]

...While it's technically true that "All these spells are nice to have and WILL see a lot of use but they're luxuries, not strict necessities", that's a little misleading...

Fair. I didn't necessarily need to list Pox and Bane (or the 55 pet) since they're important spells a Shaman WILL want--which is outside the real purpose of this thread. I mentioned them since they're a little lower priority than a few other spells if a Shaman's working on a limited budget.

Insidious decay, I didn't mention that one only because I forgot it's a quest spell and not vendor-bought. Its relative use depends on what you fight. The wife and I fight a lot of high-HP, long-lived, high-level resistant opponents where both Insidious Decay and Malo see regular use. A different player who fights different things might not use it at all. I'll call that one situational to specific players' needs, but it's so cheap that there's little reason not to buy it regardless.

Danth

[dbparden]

A lot of great information here. Thanks for the input everyone!

[derpcake2]

the stat buffs can be stacked with focus, i feel that makes them pretty important, i'm guessing you don't group with people with maxxed melee stats often

the 55 pet is a decent upgrade over the 49 one

dots aren't important unless you are going to solo, and if you are, you need a pretty large manapool to use them reliably, it is far easier to weave e-bolt into a canni-torpor rotation then it is to do bane due to its high initial cost

insidious decay is great for mobs like yeldema, like danth said

you want both canni III and canni IV, since cycling those two gives significantly faster manaregen then recasting canni IV, this is the difference between a wipe and a win

[Darkatar]

Likewise if you lack the top AC buff (Shroud of the Spirits) you can keep using the older one.

I feel like I should point out that shaman AC buff is inferior to even a paladins AC buff, you're not missing much either way.

[derpcake2]

Also, I've never in my entire Shaman career used the disease debuff, but I've also never had problems landing Pox. Maybe Jacobi was doing some very disease-resistant mobs at that level?

Yeldema resists at least 15% of pox casts without debuff.

[loramin]

Yeldema resists at least 15% of pox casts without debuff.

There you go: in the entire time I've played on P99 I've never soloed Western Wastes dragons (my guild does them after HoT raids sometimes, so I already have my +6 necklace and never had a need to go back and solo them). But I have been meaning to (for fun) at some point, so now I've learned a valuable lesson: I'll need my disease debuff :)

Still, I don't think many Shaman leveling to 60 are soloing WW dragons.

[Danth]

you want both canni III and canni IV, since cycling those two gives significantly faster manaregen then recasting canni IV, this is the difference between a wipe and a win

Using a cooldown reset item a Shaman keeps up with Torpor selfheals using just slot1-Canni4. This is confirmed via a glance at the cast time and health consumption rate: You can cast Canni4 twice per Torpor tick, and two casts of it consumes a Torpor tick. As such mana cannot regenerate more quickly since self-healing is already maxxed out. Why use Canni III? Are you doing it straight, without a cooldown reset?

--------------------------------

Loramin: West Wastes dragons aren't that much fun to solo, I don't think. Takes a Shaman the better part of half an hour to whittle them down. Wife and I duo those (her Shaman, my SK) a fair bit, lot more fun with 2 or 3 people than fighting 'em alone. Maybe go out and do it once just to say you did, as a Shaman rite of passage. If you do, and choose not to cheese the AE (I refuse to do so on general principle), keep about 4 junk buffs up in slots 1-4. That'll protect you from dispell acceptably well. resisting the AE also resists the dispell, so resist gear is useful. Yeldema doesn't have an AE and doesn't flee until about 3% life if you want to do it more easily (good one to start with), and he's an easy pull too.

Danth

[loramin]

Maybe go out and do it once just to say you did, as a Shaman rite of passage.

Yes, it's exactly that :) And thanks for the tips, will definitely use them!

[derpcake2]

Using a cooldown reset item a Shaman keeps up with Torpor selfheals using just slot1-Canni4. This is confirmed via a glance at the cast time and health consumption rate: You can cast Canni4 twice per Torpor tick, and two casts of it consumes a Torpor tick. As such mana cannot regenerate more quickly since self-healing is already maxxed out. Why use Canni III? Are you doing it straight, without a cooldown reset?

of course you use a clicky in between

how much you regen doesn't matter, its perfectly fine to canni faster then torpor heals, it frees up cast time which is huge

try it when solo shm at a raid or something

[Danth]

of course you use a clicky in between

how much you regen doesn't matter, its perfectly fine to canni faster then torpor heals, it frees up cast time which is huge

try it when solo shm at a raid or something

Allright, I went ahead and tried alternating. The wife's Shaman (Lendia) has 3154 mana, no fungi tunic but had regrowth and other standard selfbuffs (stamina, focus, etc) on. Using Torpor and Canni4 alone, starting from full HP zero mana I was able to regenerate to full mana and near full health (> 90%) in 3 minutes 18 seconds. When I alternated between Canni3 and Canni4 it took me 3 min 37 seconds to do the same thing. In either case my spellcasting uptime was effectively 100%. In neither case could I canni significantly faster than Torpor heals.

Doing the same thing using only CanniIII, it took me 5 minutes 18 seconds to reach full mana and near full health. This could be improved upon somewhat (I got some "spell recovery not met" messages), but even with optimum timing it would be very much slower than using either above method.

To be frank I was surprised the alternating method kept up as well as it did, being only about a third of a minute slower to full/full. As it stands, alternating Cannibalize spells amounted to doing significantly more work for somewhat less return, and it sacrifices an additional spell gem slot, too. Anyhow, if you feel like I'm doing something incorrectly or mistaking what you're trying to say, let me know. I'm always out to learn new ways of doing stuff. Within my present knowledge any play style, canni4 seems to replace all previous canni spells in all situations.

Danth