NToV Hatchlings flagged Charm immune

[Daldaen]

http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158514&highlight=Hatchling

Basically the Hatchling Drakes near Eashen and the hatchling Wyverns near Ikatiar should all be charmable by Enchanters. They're supposed to be 45-46~ so even Allure should work on them.

They didn't have exceptionally high MR either. If the concern is still the same as it was 3 years ago, just throw a non-classic MR value on the green variety of drakelings so that they cannot be reliably charmed to slow Vyemm or Kreizenn. Even then they have a 20-21 level differential between themselves and Lord Dragons. No spells will be landed proc'd by them anyways.

Enchanters for too long have been ultra useless in ToV on P99, especially if you're crawling and not doing massive trains that might need a memblur cast.

[Knowmercy]

hear hear

[Caiu]

Make the Slime Mist and Thunder Blast hatchlings flagged uncharmable if it's still the concern. bump

[Daldaen]

Because I didn't include the mob names that need to be changed:

A Crimson Claw Hatchling
A Shard Wyvern Hatchling
a skyseeker hatchling
A Wyvern Hatchling
an ebon wing hatchling
An Emerald Eye Hatchling

These all need to be flagged charmable.

[Caiu]

List accurate except for:

a skyseeker hatchling
An Emerald Eye Hatchling

Which was stated previously that their procs were the reason they are all currently flagged uncharmable. Another day another Daldaen attempt to skew rules in favor of his guild.

[Rygar]

Curious to see if this is implemented if the big dogs will indeed use these on boss fights. If enchanter dies from pet break or AoE may cause a lot of problems during engage.

I've no idea where these are located, but I hope this won't lead to a few chanters and a shaman / cleric keeping HoT on perma farm status if these pets can tank decently.

[Meldor]

I would love to see it implemented, give those enchanters some love.

[EQsale]

Another day another Daldaen attempt to skew rules in favor of his guild
I personally would not want to see ench/clr/monk 3manning HOT so please ignore this request.

[Caiu]

I'm not knocking Dald or his accomplishments to the server. Simply a gentle ribbing because lets be real none of us are without bias. But it was stated by Kanras that those two hatchlings were the problem children. I propose you make a a new thread with the revised list and all relevant links. Mayhaps the gods will hear of the Enchanter plight after a few years of bumping.

[Erati]

Dald's only bias is for classic EQ to be pure and correct in mechanics.

Enchanters are useless outside of the tash/slow/memblur duties of ToV raiding, in fact Daldaen no longer raids here so this post has actually nothing to do with his guild affiliation either.

Daldaen 0% (0/147) 0% (1/405)

one day maybe he will spent his 4K DKP on something who knows

[Freakish]

I usually have our enchanters do clarity, rune, haste, dispels, cripple. You literally cut out half of their duties to make your point.

[Caiu]

Dald's only bias is for classic EQ to be pure and correct in mechanics.

Enchanters are useless outside of the tash/slow/memblur duties of ToV raiding, in fact Daldaen no longer raids here so this post has actually nothing to do with his guild affiliation either.

Daldaen 0% (0/147) 0% (1/405)

one day maybe he will spent his 4K DKP on something who knows

An yet he is a member of your guild hence bias. It doesn't matter I said my piece. Flag those two proccing hatchlings uncharmable and be done with it. Simple as that.

[Baler]

Dead link, dead link, dead link,..
Speculation, rumors, he says she says..

Any site archives? This post isn't even a personal thing so don't make it into one. Please don't flip out on me i'm not saying this isn't a bug.
Hrm.
Wayback Machine doesn't have that page archived.
OP's link, links to another p99 thread where 'therune' site is unavailable which has no archive I've seen, 'eqcleric' also unavailable and 'tski.co.jp' patch notes for luclin era eq.

[Caiu]

Only hard evidence it seems is
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1663781&postcount=9
This mentions nothing of charming however.

As you say the other links are dead and unable to be waybacked. More research must be done it seems. I will look and I suggest others do so as well. As it stands there is no sufficient evidence that any of them should be flagged charmable.

[pasi]

Unless things have changed since I jerked around on beta, the devs know these were charmable in live. The issue being players having access to non-MR slows with npc casting resists being what they were. There's also the lesser issue of starting CoV faction wars with GoV to kill shit.

Charming hatchlings wasn't common practice until Luclin implemented dire charm. Enchanters would cast a normal charm on them, bring them to HoT, junk buff, break charm, and then cast dire charm on them. If you lead with a detrimental spell like tash, you would aggro 30 other hatchlings. If you led with dire charm, you topslotted a 3 hour cool down in a zone where every other npc dispels.

[Caiu]

Then again a simple matter of flagging those two particular hatchlings uncharmable. bump.

[Daldaen]

Unless things have changed since I jerked around on beta, the devs know these were charmable in live. The issue being players having access to non-MR slows with npc casting resists being what they were. There's also the lesser issue of starting CoV faction wars with GoV to kill shit.

Charming hatchlings wasn't common practice until Luclin implemented dire charm. Enchanters would cast a normal charm on them, bring them to HoT, junk buff, break charm, and then cast dire charm on them. If you lead with a detrimental spell like tash, you would aggro 30 other hatchlings. If you led with dire charm, you topslotted a 3 hour cool down in a zone where every other npc dispels.

This... but very little in HoT or NToV/WToV dispels. Glimmer Drakes are about the only ones and that's when they elect to cast that spell from the default Druid set.

Largely, on P99 even if this change gets implemented it wouldn't be used because no one currently classicly crawls NToV. But hopefully one day when you must start at Ikatiar/Eashen stairs and work your way up, Enchanters will be able to fill another role of charming by grabbing a hatchling pet and helping their raid with DPS.

I could see some adventurous Enchanters try to single a hatchling out and Charm it into HoT hoping it doesn't break on the way in. But most everyone CoTHs into HoT and doesn't do a normal break on P99, so you couldn't even use the pet until after clearing the front two wurms and two pathers, at which point you probably don't even need the pet to do what you're doing, it would just make the game more fun (and more importantly classic).

[trite]

This... but very little in HoT or NToV/WToV dispels. Glimmer Drakes are about the only ones and that's when they elect to cast that spell from the default Druid set.

Largely, on P99 even if this change gets implemented it wouldn't be used because no one currently classicly crawls NToV. But hopefully one day when you must start at Ikatiar/Eashen stairs and work your way up, Enchanters will be able to fill another role of charming by grabbing a hatchling pet and helping their raid with DPS.

I could see some adventurous Enchanters try to single a hatchling out and Charm it into HoT hoping it doesn't break on the way in. But most everyone CoTHs into HoT and doesn't do a normal break on P99, so you couldn't even use the pet until after clearing the front two wurms and two pathers, at which point you probably don't even need the pet to do what you're doing, it would just make the game more fun (and more importantly classic).

Summon companion is an enchanter usable spell....pet guard, gate/coth and summon

I posted a thread about making these things charmable a long time ago or responded to one. Did find a discussion by dev and how they didn't want to give raids the slow ability of hatchlings. I'd be all for making them charmable though.

[Caiu]

Yes coth doesn't break charm/disperse pets as it should nor should summon companion work on charmed entities. bump for the chanters.

[Daldaen]

What Caiu said is correct. CotH should kill pets and summon companion shouldn't work on NPCs that are charmed. Only summoned pets.

But alas, so many things need fixing :/.

[Caiu]

I think those three being fixed along with binds removed and we could finally say ToV is out of beta lol. One step at a time.

edit: oh and luclin roaming drakes removed as well. sigh.

[Daldaen]

I think those three being fixed along with binds removed and we could finally say ToV is out of beta lol. One step at a time.

edit: oh and luclin roaming drakes removed as well. sigh.

I'm more inclined to just accept Luclin era NToV and push for perma rooted Lords/Ladies, and much more importantly, the implementation of the Ring of Vulak event. Would be great to see guilds crumble to that event. They struggle with just 1 or 2 adds on top of a named dragon in camp. Would love to see them handle triple Flurry wave 13 or 4 wurm waves or the carrion waves. But alas, a topic for another thread.

This thread is about removing an unclassic Charm immunity flag implemented on all hatchlings in NToV. If the dev position is still one of concern for the balance against raid targets, I don't really care if you flag the green and blue hatchlings high MR or outright immune to prevent their use for their proc abilities against raid targets.

[pasi]

This... but very little in HoT or NToV/WToV dispels. Glimmer Drakes are about the only ones and that's when they elect to cast that spell from the default Druid set.


I figured all the cleric drakes/wurms + SK drakes would cast nullify or cancel frequently. That on top of the shimmer/glimmer druids. Admittedly, never spent a lot of time in EToV despite the armor being good. We were dumb on live and armor farmed in WToV Telk room.

[wwoneo]

^

[Daldaen]

Member chanter being a fun raid class? I member.

[Daldaen]

Member?

[Daldaen]

Bump

[Naethyn]

I want this.

[Raev]

The Vulak Ring would be cool to see here, but don't kid yourself that Aftermath wouldn't crush it with 130 overgeared single boxed toons, even with the general overtuning of NPCs here. I'm sure they'd wipe a few times figuring it out but they'd have it down within a weekend.

On topic, I kind of feel like there is a 'classic unless it helps players' attitude on these forums. If I were a GM I would sympathize with the NPCs too; they are just undermanned and outgunned vs the huge P99 player base. But the reality is only a huge departure from classic would make it mildly challenging, and that is not in the cards, so why not fix these kind of things? Personally I think it would be cool to see some enterprising guild of 30 players kill Vyemm with a slime mist slow vs the usual 100 man zerg.

[Telin]

For now, the wyverns and non-slowing drakes will be charmable.

Pending update.

[Triiz]

For now, the wyverns and non-slowing drakes will be charmable.

Pending update.

Gasp. Thanks for making Enchanter's more than buff bots Telin.

[Baylan295]

Gasp. Thanks for making Enchanter's more than buff bots Telin.

You forgot goalies, but amen.