Warrior alt - dexterity build

[Troxx]

I played a warrior as a main for over a decade on live. I've avoided making one here so far but haven't gotten around to it. If I ever do, I'll likely break from the norm and dump all my starting stats into dexterity - likely hafling (sneak/hide are unique), but dwarf if not for the fashion quest and barrel rolls (starting stats are a bit better). Either choice for starting dexterity and small size.

Key items I've found so far being cloak of shadows, silver chitin wrist (1 or 2), and RBG (haste and another 8 dex).

How high could you push a warrior's dexterity with buyable gear that isn't insanely pricey? 115 innate (counting 25 bonus to dex). If I manage another fungi, that sets me back 10 dex. I'm a long way off from financing him but I may start looking for items on my primary characters.

[Samoht]

How high could you push a warrior's dexterity with buyable gear that isn't insanely pricey?

255? Dex gear isn't particularly expensive because pure dex gear isn't good or desirable. This is just a bad idea. A stamina focused warrior with a simple Boon of the Garou is going to be a much better tank.

[Jimjam]

I did this, its 'fun' for a gimmicky alt if you are into that.

I doubled up on gimmicks and wear all black armor too. Despite that concession I still hit 200 dex unbuffed with very little spent.

Blackened Alloy Mask I found to be a decent if little known item. Carnal pauldrons pretty common rotquest while you camp your cloak of shadows.

[Lemonhead]

I would say 150-175 is a good number to shoot for. Its almost impossible to break 200 with buyable gear without seriously gimping yourself, especially wearing a fungi, but really the returns aren't that great anyways.

I'll throw you my parsing numbers when I get a chance and find my notebook.

[Lemonhead]

Ok, this was done with a level 40 warrior with a fungi in oermafrost, using the wall healers to have up to 30 minute single fights. Each dex value has around 60 minutes of data and 80-100ish procs. I used 2 weapons. It was almost exactly half the procs for the off hand. I will give the data for just main hand (using both the off and main hand data).

80dex | 1 proc per 65.3second | 2698 seconds of data

93sec | 55.8 | 1254

99dex | 55.6 | 2854

102dex | 51.4 | 2977

130dex | 48.2 | 2955

160dex | 43.5 | 2757

So, this isn't perfect, but I think I there's enough data here to dig a formula out. Maybe I'll work on it sometime. Or if someone else wants a fun project, go nuts.

There might be a jump somewhere in the lower values (like Agi and AC), but I'd have to parse more at low there to find it. There also might not be. That's why I did 99 and 102. hoping to find it at 100, but doesn't seem to be there. The 80 dex is somewhat out of line, but really not out of the rng possibility.

Ok, well, hope that helps. That was the most damage ever done to an ice goblin, I'd imagine. I think one got up to 50k before the healers messed up their rotation finally =P

[Troxx]

Yeah I figured getting much over 175 would be rough.

[Aesop]

I push Troll on everyone bc you can roll a warrior with:

STR 120
STA 120
AGI 90
DEX 95

+innate regen, +slam pre-55 +look like a boss in custom helm (IDK about females, never seen one in a custom helm in game).

Halflings are cool too.

[Lhancelot]

I push Troll on everyone bc you can roll a warrior with:

STR 120
STA 120
AGI 90
DEX 95

+innate regen, +slam pre-55 +look like a boss in custom helm (IDK about females, never seen one in a custom helm in game).

Halflings are cool too.

Trolls do wear nice custom helms. This doesn't change the fact they scratch their asses constantly and wear a diaper under their armors, and require a shrink all the time like ogres do.

I love small races, they all have nice starting dex, are very small making targeting easy with good dungeon crawling ability without shrinking, and aren't overplayed like warrior fatties and iksar are.

Go halfling, gnome, dark elf, or dwarf. They simply add an element of fun and novelty to the warrior class you can't get when you choose the typical min/max races.

[Aesop]

I'll buy Halfling or Dark Elf

But gnomes and dwarves are disgusting.

Wood Elf female gets a pretty dope custom crown for a warrior as well.

[Troxx]

Yeah as an alt I'm avoiding the temptation to simply min/max a large race. A dexterity loaded hobbit (or dwarf) will level faster, hold aggro better, and still have more than enough hp to get any job done.

[Samoht]

I love small races, they all have nice starting dex, are very small making targeting easy with good dungeon crawling ability without shrinking, and aren't overplayed like warrior fatties and iksar are.

I'm getting frustrated with having to jump on stairs in Velious. Never had that problem before.

[Lhancelot]

I'm getting frustrated with having to jump on stairs in Velious. Never had that problem before.

I kind of get this actually.

On my halfling I was killing aviaks in SK, and went up the tree house and found I have a ton of trouble pulling the birds off their platforms unless I used arrows.

If I tried to use taunt or walk up and hit them, sometimes I couldn't lol.

Yeah, I guess being small does have some disadvantages.

[Naethyn]

I went all into DEX and it was a mistake and here is why. At level 60 a shaman can get your STR and DEX caped very easily with two buffs. STA only has one buff. Quality of life would have been much better with STA instead of DEX. Another thing to note, a warriors STA provides the same value of hp all the way to 255, when most stats fall off after 200. Also, procs are basically worthless until you can use yaks at 38, and DEX will only really help you while leveling to 60. The warrior is weakest from 40-50. At 55 your kicks stun which is a huge boon to non slam races.

For the true min maxer (considering only best in slot items,) CHA would be the best stat to raise as it is what divine intervention triggers off of and little of the best gear has it.

[Troxx]

It's hard to take you seriously after this gem:


Bloodpoint is really good aggro, and the healing/damage is a factor.


Counter points:

-yaks are shitty weapons at this point in the timeline
-Wrapped entropy serpent spine procs at level 1, arguably strongest aggro weapon in game due to its insane proc
-I won't always have a pocket shaman
-I won't always have a pocket ench with boon
-shamans can't double stack dex until level 60
-dex gear can always be cycled out as I level
-I won't be poopsocking raid targets so ... min/max need not apply

For the grouping and light raiding game, a warrior is only as good as his ability to generate threat. A high AC high dex build will make for a pretty good quality of life from the start. With only level 60 and raiding in mind, stamina is the "best" way to go, but even at that point a gnome warrior putting all his starting stats into intelligence can tank the content easily in content appropriate gear.

[Naethyn]

I don't really follow your counter points, and it is OK if you don't take me seriously, but know I've been playing this exact build for a while. I created my warrior as an AC + Dex warrior. I leveled my blacksmithing and created a full set of enchanted full plate back when it required jacinths to create. I had a blast, it was a good time, and I'm not trying to sway you away from such. I'm just letting you know what the ultimate result is.

You'll find your AC very strong until the mid 30's. Fortunately, by then mobs will start to live long enough for procs to matter. My only suggestion is having a bag of 10 wooly spider silk nets, I wish I had done them sooner.

[Nixtar]

For the true min maxer (considering only best in slot items,) CHA would be the best stat to raise as it is what divine intervention triggers off of and little of the best gear has it.

*fails cha check*
Gods be like, "F** that guy, I ain't saving his ugly ass."

[Lhancelot]

My only suggestion is having a bag of 10 wooly spider silk nets, I wish I had done them sooner.

How much do they cost to recharge? When do you use them, on raids or even during groups?

[Naethyn]

21pp can use all 3 charges. I use them for groups or solo and only on raids as a last resort. A bag of 10 nets changes the way a warrior is played and saves groups. I use them on every class esp int casters cause instant root is just so useful.

[jolanar]

I get that Shamans can max out your str and dex at high levels, but sometimes people on the forums act like every random low level will have a level 60 shaman following them around casting avatar.

+1 for root nets. Everyone should have a bag of them.

[Samoht]

I get that Shamans can max out your str and dex at high levels, but sometimes people on the forums act like every random low level will have a level 60 shaman following them around casting avatar.

Yeah, but you cannot reallocate stats or change race once you get 60, so they need to be correct from the start.

[Troxx]

At the same time 25 stamina doesn't make/break a warrior's ability to tank (and do so trivially) any raid mob in the game.

[Naethyn]

At the same time 25 stamina doesn't make/break a warrior's ability to tank (and do so trivially) any raid mob in the game.
It absolutely matters for the two hardest mobs to tank - AoW and Tunare. Without 255 sta you cannot survive a round of max hits, and are far more likely to die. A tank with 1750 AC still gets max hit so only HP really matters for these events as a tank.

[A1rh3ad]

I usually stick to the wiki because it's accurate on how much stat gear is accessible to you. It even includes multiple gear lists on different tiers you should be reaching. If you cant easily get the gear it recommends it gives you an approximation on what gear you should pay for and what you should pass on except free gear that adds some form of stat/ac better than your own.

[Troxx]

It absolutely matters for the two hardest mobs to tank - AoW and Tunare. Without 255 sta you cannot survive a round of max hits, and are far more likely to die. A tank with 1750 AC still gets max hit so only HP really matters for these events as a tank.

Cleric aegolism - 1100hp
focus- 405hp
Max hp buffs with capped stamina: 1505hp.


AoW quads and flurries for 1154 and flurries - unslowable. Damage potential on a bad round? Just under 7k.

Tunare quads and flurries for 960 but is slowable. Damage potential on a bad round? 5760 max + 800hp proc (resistable).

Using Dtoxx as an example (half elf):

http://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:Detoxx

If he (as a half elf) dumped 25 stamina into starting stats he'd have an unbuffed stamina of 105 at character creation. As he is geared, his unbuffed hp with 246 unbuffed stamina is 4314hp. With max raid buffs he would cap out at less than 6000hp.

Using YOU as an example: http://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:Naethyn

Ignoring the fact that you shamelessly fluff your magelo stats/hp with two weapons that you hopefully don't use while tanking and won't hold aggro with (proc-less Blade of carnage and swiftblade of zek) once you exhaust the aggro-lead you might have from mallet-ing - 4300hp with 36 stamina room for improvement. You still cap out your hp about 1000hp less than a worst case scenario AoW quad. A Casually raid geared warrior with ~3k unbuffed hp (buffed to 4.5 to greater than 5k hp) will tank circles around you while under defensive (assuming you are not). You're a human - starting stamina 85. By your own logic you shouldn't be able to tank things compared to an ogre with starting stamina ~50 points higher than your own.

That's 1 roundable by tunare with an unresisted proc.
That's 1 roundable by AoW by over 1000hp.

Point is, if you don't plan on a complete heal hitting after literally every single round, no warrior in p99 will survive these mobs 100% of the time outside of defensive. All warriors on this server are easily stomped by the biggest/baddest mobs once defensive falls. After that, it's a combination of ac, luck, DI, runes, and the tightness of the complete heal chain. With defensive UP - a casually raid geared tank will survive these mobs immeasurably better than the most well equipped raid geared warriors out of discipline.

So, tell me again how you "can't survive one round" with less than 255 stamina? With 255 stamina you still can't survive one max round from the Avatar of War. A new dwarf warrior with all stats placed into dexterity will have a whopping 5 less stamina and 40 more dexterity than Aftermath's guild leader. Bear in mind that most if not all of these targets were killed very shortly after velious launch --- in kunark gear.

TLDR version: any warrior of any race with ANY randomly chosen stat distribution (even a woodelf warrior with +25 intelligence on character creation) can tank these mobs interchangably with adequate gear. 25 stamina makes or breaks nothing.

[Naethyn]

You're forgetting this. https://wiki.project1999.com/Disciplines

But don't take advice from me, someone who has been actually tanking Velious for over a year.

[Troxx]

Don't bother listening to me, a guy who raid tanked Velious content live and beyond for longer than the p99 sever has existed.

Point is, starting stats mean nothing at the high end raid game. Ogre/iksar with all to stamina is the min/max choice when you only have bleeding edge raiding in mind. For levels 1-59 and prior to raid gear a warrior with a dexterity and AC focus (not to idiotic degrees) will function a lot better for groups. Said warrior WILL have fewer hp and it still won't matter at those ranges. Group content is tankable by rangers. A tank is only as good as his ability to hold aggro - and that is the Achilles heel of the grouping or casually raiding warrior on p99.

I have no plans of playing the sock-shitting raid game here. This warrior might or might not even hit 60.

[Naethyn]

Ogre/iksar with all to stamina is the min/max choice when you only have bleeding edge raiding in mind.
You haven't been listening at all.

[Troxx]

I've been listening ... your input just isn't entirely accurate.

My initial question was very narrow in scope: how high could you push a warrior's dexterity without factoring in ridiculously expensive rare items. I'm not really interested in whether you think my new warrior having dexterity as a starting stat is a good idea or not.

[Jimjam]

Cougar claw earrings instead of orc fangs is a cheap dex option.

http://wiki.project1999.com/Bracer_of_Scavenging is a cheap, rounded wrist.

You probably don't want to sacrifice velium hp rings (but you could, I did on my dex alt).

Darkmail gauntlets.

Rotquest a spectral bow in trakanon's teeth.

[Spyder73]

I thought agro on raid targets is pretty meaningless because the meta is to dump midnight mallet charges and other clickies into target so you gain perma hate...could probably turn attack off and still hold agro?

[Yuuvy The Destroyer]

Doubtful.

[Cecily]

I thought agro on raid targets is pretty meaningless because the meta is to dump midnight mallet charges and other clickies into target so you gain perma hate...could probably turn attack off and still hold agro?

Yeah pretty much. Raiding here sucks w/ mallets. Very hard to be bad at rogue. People still are, which I find fascinating, but it's almost impossible to pull agro on a raid target if you wait a few seconds to get to low on ramp order and evade when it pops. Don't plow enrage.. duck before you drop below 35%... Really all there is to it.

[IFSNews]

Be interesting to nerf mallets to have a cast time (esp. since so many other things that trivialized raiding were also nerfed). Could still use them to pull initial aggro but couldn't just insta all 5 charges and balls out dps from the start.

Even on smaller mobs like trash in HoT I never have any problems pulling aggro even if I attack from the start. I let the tank get a couple rounds of auto attacks off and start with an auto attack then evade, then go all out from there evading whenever it pops.

[Bubbles]

The couple of times i got into random basement pickup groups in karnors on my full Skyshrine Armors 60 raid warrior some mid-50s monk would inevitably tank 80% of the time mobs were in camp.

Yes, monks.

Never underestimate how terrible and/or lazy some people are at this game.