What did people dislike most about luclin?

[DiogenesThaDogg]

I thought it was such a fun expansion, and the reasons people generally give to me for not wanting luclin to be released seem to fall flat. The most commonly repeated complaints I hear involve the bazaar and the nexus; but I honestly don't see how the existence of p99auctions.com or dial a port are so far removed from what is offered by those zones.

Please help me to understand why luclin draws so much ire, whether it's the art style, the length of some raid encounters, the keying/bane weaponing, the quests, the storyline, AAs, etc.

[kitao]

Time sink for VT was one for me.

[Sorn]

The art style!

[utenan]

I disliked most expansions because they trivialized previous content - Pauladal Caverns being a good example as well as more and more crazy gear being added to the game.

I also dislike anything that detracts from relying on other people / taking out social aspects of the game. The nexus was the first step in regards to making port classes less important but the pok books really took it too far. The same goes for the bazaar - luclin was the first step towards making everything convenient instead of relying on others - which is kinda what makes eq special and I think that's why people draw the line at velious when discussing "classic" everquest.

I also hated the contrast of the graphics. It looked like a different game.

[Brut]

New graphics, the whole little green men space thing, the lore was balls.
Felt like we interrupting this medieval dragon fantasy game and playing some Star Trek instead.

Awful zone design too. Hallways with merbs in em. Yay.

[big_ole_jpn]

zone and general art style bad, new models were really bad, a lot of VT was phoned-in (20 of the top raid bosses in Luclin are recolored/sized-up blobs from Kunark with 1 basic aoe spell and too much HP).

overall a fantastic expansion though -- ranger becomes a playable class, raid scene is more fun than Velious even with VT. Emp is probably the best encounter in all of EQ.

people like to hate on it because it's the "beginning of the end", but as you can see from P99, parking an EQ server at Velious breaks the game. I have a lot more sympathy for the design decisions made in Luclin/PoP that I used to agree were shit after experiencing long term Velious.

[Maelstrom]

The character and npc graphics and animations were horrible, and lacked the same charm as the originals.

The Nexus was the beginning of the end for porters. It felt like an airport.

The Bazaar didn't bother me as much, as it was easier to grab what you wanted when you wanted it.

The zones and zone layouts were great though. Places like Katta Castellum, Fungus Grove, Twilight Sea and Ssraeshza Temple were great and I still poke my head around them on another server from time to time.

[Nixtar]

Graphics for me... But I still had a lot of fun with it.

LDoN was by far the worst xpac in terms of raiding. Total borefest. Was the xpac which actually made me leave the game. Fun group content but the raids.... Ugnh...

[Jontheripper]

No nexus, no vahshir, no bazaar and id be cool with it.


Also no Beast lards.

[Evia]

New models were the worst thing about luclin. And the bazaar killing EC haggling. But I do find after using bazaar on Phinney that it's actually pretty cool.

[Aaramis]

Loved: the Shissar lore, and especially Ssra Temple. Great stuff there, and a lot of fun raiding those mobs. Also loved Vah'shir and beastlords. Akheva Ruins was also fun.

Hated: the whole "on the moon" concept; most of the other zones; VT grind was *horrible*; Nexus killed porters; Bazaar killed EC tunnel; and some of the xp zones made all 3 previous expansions null and void for leveling up.

[uohaloran]

Paludal Caverns is enough for me to hate the entire expansion.

[DemonFirebrand]

Luclin was a mixed bag for me. I didn't mind cat people or beastmaster or the moon so much, although I thought they were a little silly. I loved the model updates and I was really upset to find out that they were disabled on P1999.

But I thought then and still believe that the nexus and, more importantly, the bazaar were the first truly damaging blows to the game's integrity.

Then PoK ruined the game irrevocably and I quit.

[astuce999]

I think it's fascinating how the things we say we hated in Luclin/PoP are the same things we spend a lot of energy recreating here.

We're pretty much saying "please save us... from ourselves".

Consider this.

"The bazaar killed the EC tunnel".

P99: there's a live auction website and a wiki that lists prices, and a forum for auctions as well. Guilds have item and spell mules with online databases of what is available.

"PoK books killed ports".

P99: Everyone and their brother has a OT hammer, WC cap, Thurg potion. There's a guild whose sole purpose is to offer ports so that people can travel as painlessly as possible. Guilds have devoted porting characters solely for travel.

"Paludal Caverns trivializes prior content".

P99: Oasis > MM > CoM > KC > Seb is the path chosen by the overwhelming majority, over and over again. It really would just be replacing the one zone everyone goes to with another one.

Just some thoughts.

Astuce

[rollin5k]

When I first saw the new models and graphics that everyone was talking/excited about it was like having my heart ripped out. I think I threw up IRL..
I took one walk into the nexus or whatever it was and I literally never logged in again.
totally different artwork looks like absolute garbage and broke the game (started at kunark IMO but wasn't game breaking)

[pasi]

At the end of the day, a lot of EQ is visual.

Luclin made a lot of great changes to gameplay. However, the visual/aesthetic aspect of the expansion was complete shit.

[Danth]

What did I dislike most about Luclin?

The art style!

That. Higher polygon counts may have been desired, but the new models, monsters and locations were so ugly that they defeated the purpose. I believe a much better approach would've involved maintaining the original art style but with higher polygon counts, rather than fundamentally altering the game's appearance. I hated even having to look at the "new and improved" graphics. I disliked numerous other things about that expansion--cats on the moon, mounts, alphabet soup monster names, class balancing turned into an endless grind, stat bloat, and other issues I don't care to list at the moment. However, the hideous appearance of everything definitely sits at the top of my most disliked list for Luclin.

I write the above as someone who believes Luclin had some good in it. As a whole, Luclin wasn't a hopeless concept. I believe a good expansion was in there, peeking out from behind the layers of trash, trying to get out--but never got the chance.

Danth

[Foxplay]

Bane Weapons to kill literally just 2 bosses - 1 of them being a bottleneck to Vex Thal

Bane weapons where dumb and felt dumb

[Kotopes]

EQ up untill GoD was classic for me, I'd remove nexus, bazaar and PoK books alltogether however.

[Jimjam]

The change of artistic style.

[elwing]

Luclin was a quite good expansion, I have to admit art is strange, but it's not that bad. what killed it is the nexus and bazaar for sure. releasing luclin without these would be fine for me, I'd actually enjoy running there...

[Sporkotron]

P99: there's a live auction website and a wiki that lists prices, and a forum for auctions as well. Guilds have item and spell mules with online databases of what is available.

Still kills haggling and an actual interaction based economy, also many people don't use those things because they're not offered in game. Anything that discourages interaction is a major red flag for P99. The Nexus and Bazaar are exactly that.

P99: Everyone and their brother has a OT hammer, WC cap, Thurg potion. There's a guild whose sole purpose is to offer ports so that people can travel as painlessly as possible. Guilds have devoted porting characters solely for travel.

This sounds like someone who has been level 60 and raiding for too long, most people on p99 aren't in a high end raiding guild and don't have all those things you mentioned. So what if there is a guild that is devoted to porting? It still encourages interaction between players, which is what P99 should be all about.

"P99: Oasis > MM > CoM > KC > Seb is the path chosen by the overwhelming majority, over and over again. It really would just be replacing the one zone everyone goes to with another one."

More importantly, it trivializes classic content. Its more important in my opinion that the classic EverQuest zones be populated. As soon as an expansion makes day one zones completely obsolete then you've gone too far on a server like p99. Paludal does exactly that in ways neither Kunark nor Velious ever did.



To me, it sounds like you like a lot of other people have worn out the content available and want more to be added. Well, too bad. P99 is a time capsule that is designed to capture the classic EverQuest experience, not an ongoing time delayed progression server that goes on forever. If you've become bored of the classic content, then move the hell on and be happy that other people will be able to experience it for years to come.

[Jimjam]

As soon as an expansion makes day one zones completely obsolete then you've gone too far on a server like p99. Paludal does exactly that in ways neither Kunark nor Velious ever did.

I agree with this. If old content gets made obsolete, why not just release the new content as a stand alone game/sequel? Feel free to reply and tell me why this is a bad idea, I'm sure there are lots of reasons why!

[fadetree]

I didn't *hate* anything about luclin, and I loved the original tier of AA. I thought the cats were kind of dumb, and the zem in Paludal was a terrible idea. I loved PoP, but I thought the books kind of trivialized travel.

After PoP is where my idea of classic EQ ends.

[LenkoCambria]

I didn't *hate* anything about luclin, and I loved the original tier of AA. I thought the cats were kind of dumb, and the zem in Paludal was a terrible idea. I loved PoP, but I thought the books kind of trivialized travel.

After PoP is where my idea of classic EQ ends.

I was just about to post all of this myself. This is exactly how I feel. I even liked the graphics update. Took some getting used to, but I did enjoy it.

[azeth]

the thing i dislike most about Luclin is that it will never be added to P99.

[Tankdan]

The Bazaar was 10x better than EC, get off your nostalgia boners. The same people crying about EC being classic are the FIRST ones to use websites like p99auctions to find their shit, hypocritical neckbeards.

VT was spread out over multiple days, people had fun in it because the rewards paid off.

Ssra Temple was a challenging zone that lasted the entire expansion.

Mid/High leveling zones were awesome.

Nexus Scion made porting less of a thing? Who the fuck cares. Telling a random druid to come get you is overrated.

At the end of the day Devs don't want Luclin, so P99 is pretty much dead.

[Yuuvy The Destroyer]

Shitty luclin graphics
Seru bane
Shissar bane
Camping vt key parts that were not in game yet

[Daldaen]

Nothing.

It was a great expansion, and doesn't need anything changed.

Character models are a choice set those on or off to your liking.
Bazaar beats out EC every time because it doesn't waste your time not playing the game to sell some crap. Plus it actually allows for a low level market.
Nexus is a non-factor. It's just another version of boats. 15 minute wait to travel between 5 select zones, porters still are desired.
Raid content was actually legit, with mechanics beyond 1-2 AEs, Rampage and Flurry. You now had adds spawning with mobs, different add immunities with mez/slow, etc.
Focus effects make gearing a caster actually worth while. The power of casters actually increase with foci like melee do with weaponry. Wow. So good.
AAs bring into balance many classes in the raid scene.
Innate Crits for wizards makes them top tier raid DPS coupled with above changes
Long duration buffs allows you to buff once at the beginning of the raid and not have to continually refresh them unless you're doing long 5+ hour raids.


Nothing about Luclin was bad. Wtb it on P99 please.

[xKoopa]

Playing on zek and lovin these sweet luclin models

[Salamarr]

"Paludal Caverns trivializes prior content".

P99: Oasis > MM > CoM > KC > Seb is the path chosen by the overwhelming majority, over and over again. It really would just be replacing the one zone everyone goes to with another one.

Back then I remember on my old server there were so many players, you needed some new zones to level up your alts in because even the traditional ones were still packed.

Fast forward to Phin, yes most gather at PC to level their alts.

[xKoopa]

I remember finding a spot in paludal where mobs would just ignore you

Made a lvl 1 necro and soloed 1-18 without ever moving lol

[kgallowaypa]

The Vah Shir reminded me of Chris Roberts, Wing commander: heart of the Tiger...That shit belongs in space not in my EQ fantasy dragon game.

[Portsche]

I remember finding a spot in paludal where mobs would just ignore you

Made a lvl 1 necro and soloed 1-18 without ever moving lol

Right about there...

http://i.imgur.com/Q1k3YeS.jpg

[xKoopa]

Right about there...

http://i.imgur.com/Q1k3YeS.jpg

Yea that one corner on the cliff LOL

[thufir]

Paludal Caverns by far. Got mentioned a lot in this thread because it killed the low level game, but imo it's the main reason to hate Luclin. Nothing could be less immersive for a game's newbies to roll a new character in Norrath, promptly take the Nexus port to the moon, and go to some nondescript caverns to kill bandits for 30 levels. Great if you are a raider rolling a new to-be-max-level character, terrible for the rest of the game.

Corollary to this is AAs. Again, raiders loved this because it gave them a reason to spend thousands of hours on their main character and provided some character balance. Bad for everyone else who didn't have those thousands of hours or did have them but didn't want to spend them in a single MMO. Added detriment of further killing the low end game because people who might have normally rolled alts are busy getting their 59th AA point on their main or whatever.

And of course there's the feel. If you are a raider and could care less about immersion and more about fight difficulty and pixels Luclin had a lot going on - high end content for months and mobs with a million hit points to shake your sticks at. If part of what you liked about EverQuest was walking across the long expanse of West Karana or exploring the dungeons of old Guk, Luclin basically killed this for you. You went from a thriving fantasy world to cats on the moon and a bazaar full of static adventurers that you could buy adventuring gear from by right clicking on them.

TL;DR: if you loved raiding you'll love Luclin, if you played the game for other reasons than to get to the high end game you will hate Luclin, and that's probably why you're seeing such a dichotomy of opinions about it.

[thufir]

"Paludal Caverns trivializes prior content".

P99: Oasis > MM > CoM > KC > Seb is the path chosen by the overwhelming majority, over and over again. It really would just be replacing the one zone everyone goes to with another one.

Just some thoughts.

Astuce

Sorry, but this just isn't true. It only seems this way to people who take this route. I've literally never taken it on this server. My characters have occasionally hit those zones but never spent very much time in any of them (except Sebilis, but Sebilis was also the end game dungeon on Live during this era and is in fact less full on p99 than it was on Live). You can go to other zones off the leveling path and find groups because this server is still thriving, no matter how it seems to raiding types.

If you replace everything within levels 1-30 with Paludal, nobody goes to the other zones because the PC ZEM is too ridiculous. There's no reason to go anywhere else, and in fact nobody did on Live. Doesn't anyone else remember how empty these low level places were in Norrath after Luclin got released? Remembering and not caring is an option, but saying PC didn't kill 'em is not correct.

[xKoopa]

I played pvp on live so paludal rarely saw more than 15 players

Old school dungeons were thriving cuz PC so danger

[Izmael]

Luclin would have been a great expansion if it wasn't in Everquest. It didn't belong there.

Also, just off the top of my head:

- terrible player models
- terrible mob models and names
- all outdoor zones had terribly low framerates on comps back then and ugly as shit and looked the same
- Nexus sucked ass
- previous content was trivialized to a much larger extent than however much Kunark or Velious trivialized previous content (AAs, overpowered items)
- Soulbinders took away some of the player interaction
- VT was a terrible zone that was probably secretly sponsored by Blizzard
- Ring events who were essentially barely disguised time sinks



Good things about Luclin were imo:

- Beastlord is a fine class (though EQ didn't need it)
- Vahshir is a fine model (not needed either)

... that's it.

[Izmael]

Forgot - obviously Bazaar was a terrible thing to add to EQ.

[Vandil]

My main in Live was a Dark Elf SK.

Disliked:
- New player/NPC models. They all looked rounded and goofy and animated oddly. Except for the Dark Elves, they looked pretty decent.
- In my guild we called Luclin "Lag-land". You pretty much needed to buy a new video card if you had any hopes of kiting or raiding.

Liked:
- Nexus teleporters from Wizard Spires was handy.
- The Grey was a really fun (and deadly) zone.
- The Shaira (sp) quest early in the expansion that gives you an ALL/ALL white robe. Use to keep that in my bag to pretend my SK was a Necro, complete with a scythe.

[xKoopa]

^dark elf sk master race

Luclin made dark elves so hot

[eqravenprince]

Original EQ before the plane of hate/fear/sky - perfect in my opinion. Every zone was accessible. No ridiculous twink gear. Mostly a group centric game as raiding was a small novelty on a couple mobs. The epitome of what I think an MMORPG should be.

Kunark - The beginning of the end, added ridiculous twink gear, added many easy outdoor zones to level up in which were very limited in original EQ past level 25. And increased the grind by adding 10 levels which were all basically hell levels.

Velious - Not a bad expansion, twink gear wasn't amped up as much as Kunark, great faction work and nice quests, no new levels or aa grind.

Luclin - AA's increased the grind even more, super fast leveling in PC Sony gave up on caring about low levels, made twinking even easier with the bazaar, made travel even easier with ports, stupid lore, and the character models were horrendous people get attached to the look of their character.

And lastly, I left EQ around Luclin because Dark Age of Camelot came out and while I did not play that game terribly long, I never really came back to EQ with the same addiction as from 1999-2001.

[Jmcwrestling]

Honestly, its just the new character models for me. Will never be convinced to like them.

[snead]

P99: there's a live auction website and a wiki that lists prices, and a forum for auctions as well. Guilds have item and spell mules with online databases of what is available.

Still kills haggling and an actual interaction based economy, also many people don't use those things because they're not offered in game. Anything that discourages interaction is a major red flag for P99. The Nexus and Bazaar are exactly that.

P99: Everyone and their brother has a OT hammer, WC cap, Thurg potion. There's a guild whose sole purpose is to offer ports so that people can travel as painlessly as possible. Guilds have devoted porting characters solely for travel.

This sounds like someone who has been level 60 and raiding for too long, most people on p99 aren't in a high end raiding guild and don't have all those things you mentioned. So what if there is a guild that is devoted to porting? It still encourages interaction between players, which is what P99 should be all about.

"P99: Oasis > MM > CoM > KC > Seb is the path chosen by the overwhelming majority, over and over again. It really would just be replacing the one zone everyone goes to with another one."

More importantly, it trivializes classic content. Its more important in my opinion that the classic EverQuest zones be populated. As soon as an expansion makes day one zones completely obsolete then you've gone too far on a server like p99. Paludal does exactly that in ways neither Kunark nor Velious ever did.



To me, it sounds like you like a lot of other people have worn out the content available and want more to be added. Well, too bad. P99 is a time capsule that is designed to capture the classic EverQuest experience, not an ongoing time delayed progression server that goes on forever. If you've become bored of the classic content, then move the hell on and be happy that other people will be able to experience it for years to come.

there isn't much interaction in porting it goes like this
/who all dial
/tell superporterguy hey i need a port from wc to wakening lands
superporterguy tells you, be there soon
*hand superporterguy plat*
*superporterguy ports*
you tell superporterguy, thanks
superporter guy tells you, thanks

such immersion. when you're going grocery shopping do you tell me you specifically go to the clerk to have a full blown conversation or do you just go to the automated check out and get the hell out of there?

[Sporkotron]

there isn't much interaction in porting it goes like this
/who all dial
/tell superporterguy hey i need a port from wc to wakening lands
superporterguy tells you, be there soon
*hand superporterguy plat*
*superporterguy ports*
you tell superporterguy, thanks
superporter guy tells you, thanks

such immersion. when you're going grocery shopping do you tell me you specifically go to the clerk to have a full blown conversation or do you just go to the automated check out and get the hell out of there?

I go through the line and I chat with the checker, I don't use the self check because if I'm going to pay retail markup I might as well have them scan and bag my groceries for me.

By your logic EQ lost nothing by adding PoK, and we all know that isn't the case.

It's interesting to learn that there are people on P99 that are total cool with the way modern MMOs are playable without ever actually interacting with another person and wish p99 was like that for whatever reason. Personally, I think MMOs started sucking nuts when they were made more solo friendly.

[Sprawlz]

there isn't much interaction in porting it goes like this
/who all dial
/tell superporterguy hey i need a port from wc to wakening lands
superporterguy tells you, be there soon
*hand superporterguy plat*
*superporterguy ports*
you tell superporterguy, thanks
superporter guy tells you, thanks

such immersion. when you're going grocery shopping do you tell me you specifically go to the clerk to have a full blown conversation or do you just go to the automated check out and get the hell out of there?

This is exactly how it worked back then except that you would type /who all dru 39 60 or something, depending on where you needed to go.

[Lhancelot]

This is exactly how it worked back then except that you would type /who all dru 39 60 or something, depending on where you needed to go.

Back, you! Back to the EC tunnel! BACK!!!! :p

[Sprawlz]

Back, you! Back to the EC tunnel! BACK!!!! :p

Lol, I'm actually about done with EC. I'm sure people will miss that...special Sprawlz store.

[Daldaen]

I don't get the clinging to low levels and Paludal Caverns hate.

The first 20-25 levels of EQ are a joke. In any game, the beginning leveling up process is an already-live tutorial where you're figuring out the basics.

Are you REALLY having a huge amount of fun on a ranger at level 8 before it has any spells? Most classes suck at low levels until they get more spells and abilities that give them definition. Before this point everyone is basically the same. They've got a weapon and they can auto attack. Neat.

PC added an avenue for people to congregate, fly through those crappy levels until classes are actually fleshed out. Clerics get their 0% res, Enchanter's get their charm and AE mez, Hybrids picked up their pets, warriors/rogues get dual wield, monks get FD, Wizards/Druids get their self ports, etc.

That's when the game actually starts to get good. The novelty of Blackburrow and Crushbone is nice for a bit, and people still grouped there (and they still are actively on Phinigel even with PC out). But I just don't see the love of the extremely low level game.

[thufir]

I don't get the clinging to low levels and Paludal Caverns hate.

The first 20-25 levels of EQ are a joke. In any game, the beginning leveling up process is an already-live tutorial where you're figuring out the basics.

Are you REALLY having a huge amount of fun on a ranger at level 8 before it has any spells? Most classes suck at low levels until they get more spells and abilities that give them definition. Before this point everyone is basically the same. They've got a weapon and they can auto attack. Neat.

PC added an avenue for people to congregate, fly through those crappy levels until classes are actually fleshed out. Clerics get their 0% res, Enchanter's get their charm and AE mez, Hybrids picked up their pets, warriors/rogues get dual wield, monks get FD, Wizards/Druids get their self ports, etc.

That's when the game actually starts to get good. The novelty of Blackburrow and Crushbone is nice for a bit, and people still grouped there (and they still are actively on Phinigel even with PC out). But I just don't see the love of the extremely low level game.

I don't get your raiding love. 40+ people sitting around for hours doing what the officers tell them to do. Spend the better part of a day grinding through trash or killing a single boss for no xp in the desperate hopes of getting some slight upgrade that you'll do what with exactly? Increase your DPS by some tiny number so you can brag about it to your parser?

If you are a warrior, I kinda get it; you need stuff. If you are any other class, well, to each their own. You like to raid, so you love Luclin. I don't, so I hated it. Neither of us is going to understand the other any time soon.

I have a lot of fun with the 1-30 game and still do. It's not about the class mechanics so much as it is about exploring things people rarely see.

[big_ole_jpn]

Forgot - obviously Bazaar was a terrible thing to add to EQ.

Not really. I was nostalgic about EC tunnel once too but as it turns out, Bazaar is far preferable.

[Izmael]

Not really. I was nostalgic about EC tunnel once too but as it turns out, Bazaar is far preferable.

Talk about taking human interaction out of the game.

[skarlorn]

the art is fucking garbage

[Lhancelot]

I don't get your raiding love. 40+ people sitting around for hours doing what the officers tell them to do. Spend the better part of a day grinding through trash or killing a single boss for no xp in the desperate hopes of getting some slight upgrade that you'll do what with exactly? Increase your DPS by some tiny number so you can brag about it to your parser?

If you are a warrior, I kinda get it; you need stuff. If you are any other class, well, to each their own. You like to raid, so you love Luclin. I don't, so I hated it. Neither of us is going to understand the other any time soon.

I have a lot of fun with the 1-30 game and still do. It's not about the class mechanics so much as it is about exploring things people rarely see.

It's interesting because at least you understand that although you don't share his enthusiasm for raiding, you do recognize that he enjoys it just as you enjoy lowbie stuffs and that it's really just a matter of different perspectives.

What seems to be the trend though are the hardcore raiding types tend to look down on others who don't share their grand scheme of raiding mobs that require a zerg force following the screaming commands of pixel fiending neckbeards.

It's as if those who don't enjoy the raiding scene are lesser beings or something, lacking intellect and complexity because they enjoy lower level activities.

I too prefer the ambience of when I am leveling a character, from 1-59 basically.

What I have experienced in the raid scene here has only left me with disappointment and it has nothing to do with having trouble grasping how to play a higher lvl toon.

Lower level activities are easier to do solo or with a small group and lack the toxicity the raiding scene brings.

That's been my personal experience, anyway.

[big_ole_jpn]

Talk about taking human interaction out of the game.

yet redacted is way more social of a server than p99 with bazaar (and it even has limited boxing) because it isn't a claustrophobic mouse colony (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_sink) that only paranoid sicko autists are willing to suffer playing.

the mechanics aren't everything, EQ is about what emerges from those mechanics

[surron]

yea you luclin/pop lovers need to try out redacted cause its the better server even with pok books. people still need ports to kunark/velious/luclin and people still auction shit all the time

[maskedmelon]

Have to agree that EC tunnel in 2016 sucks ass because of things like p99auctions. By normalizing prices it constricts liquidity and and sours people's attitudes making them feel like someone is trying to swindle them for offering to sell/but at a price deviating from the value advertised on the site by some nerd cycling wtb/wts /auctions across 10 different characters.

[Odann]

yea you luclin/pop lovers need to try out redacted cause its the better server even with pok books. people still need ports to kunark/velious/luclin and people still auction shit all the time

IIRC there was a book that ported you right to the Overthere.

[Jimjam]

The starting levels are great fun if you don't twink; earning that full set of cloth, filling up on back packs, finding a two hander to sharpen up and get those 1 hit kills on xp mobs. Getting strong enough to fight animals and turn them into armour. Awesomes! Lots of meaningful upgrades and progressing through content at a nice pace.

[thufir]

It's interesting because at least you understand that although you don't share his enthusiasm for raiding, you do recognize that he enjoys it just as you enjoy lowbie stuffs and that it's really just a matter of different perspectives.

What seems to be the trend though are the hardcore raiding types tend to look down on others who don't share their grand scheme of raiding mobs that require a zerg force following the screaming commands of pixel fiending neckbeards.

It's as if those who don't enjoy the raiding scene are lesser beings or something, lacking intellect and complexity because they enjoy lower level activities.

I too prefer the ambience of when I am leveling a character, from 1-59 basically.

What I have experienced in the raid scene here has only left me with disappointment and it has nothing to do with having trouble grasping how to play a higher lvl toon.

Lower level activities are easier to do solo or with a small group and lack the toxicity the raiding scene brings.

That's been my personal experience, anyway.
imo, small group activities require a lot more intellect and complexity than raiding activities, even at low levels.

Everyone in a group is expected to pull their own weight. You're expected to know and use your class abilities. People get shocked if you haven't bought Spell X or Ability Y. You can experiment with new things to do and new abilities you have learned and usually you will be rewarded for doing so.

In a raid most classes are gimped. For example, pet classes shouldn't use their pets. A cleric who isn't participating in the CH chain is probably wrong. Enchanters turn into buffbots. Mostly, you do a specific subset of activities that is restricted by your raid leader. Very few people on a raid use their class abilities as much as they could be. And indeed, most of the time you don't have to. The warrior who AFKs after he pops defensive is a real thing.

Some people like this, that's fine, I get the joy of killing something enormous and getting a shot at some BiS item. But other parts of the game are more enjoyable to me, so I prefer to focus on them.

I'm not really surprised that Daldaen doesn't understand, how could he? He's so focused on stuff with acronyms and his long ago progression through xpacs that most of us never cared about. But he's emblematic of the raiding mindset here, the kind of guys who think the server will just keel over if it doesn't Progress(tm), never understanding why other people might play EverQuest, notwithstanding that there's hundreds of other people in other zones every day doing things they like to do that aren't raiding.

[Naethyn]

Make p99 great again. Bring on Shadows of Luclin.

[mr_jon3s]

Nexus Scion made porting less of a thing? Who the fuck cares. Telling a random druid to come get you is overrated.

I am playing on phinny and nexus scion does shit. If you didn't start on Odus or Faydwer you had to run to dreadlands or North Karanas to get to nexus. People still ask for pick ups and ports but usually its just to the nexus and then from there you get buffed and ask one of the many wizard/druids for a port to where ever you want to go.

[Jimjam]

I am playing on phinny and nexus scion does shit. If you didn't start on Odus or Faydwer you had to run to dreadlands or North Karanas to get to nexus. People still ask for pick ups and ports but usually its just to the nexus and then from there you get buffed and ask one of the many wizard/druids for a port to where ever you want to go.

This raises a point. People say Pok/nexus cut down on interaction, but actually they were great hubs to get buffs and find people to form new groups with.

[Brut]

Iunno, having one central where everyone flocks at is kinda meh.
Makes cities empty. See: PoKnowledge.

[big_ole_jpn]

cities are empty on p99, only exception is freeport due to tunnel

[icedwards]

imo, small group activities require a lot more intellect and complexity than raiding activities, even at low levels.

Everyone in a group is expected to pull their own weight. You're expected to know and use your class abilities. People get shocked if you haven't bought Spell X or Ability Y. You can experiment with new things to do and new abilities you have learned and usually you will be rewarded for doing so.

In a raid most classes are gimped. For example, pet classes shouldn't use their pets. A cleric who isn't participating in the CH chain is probably wrong. Enchanters turn into buffbots. Mostly, you do a specific subset of activities that is restricted by your raid leader. Very few people on a raid use their class abilities as much as they could be. And indeed, most of the time you don't have to. The warrior who AFKs after he pops defensive is a real thing.

Some people like this, that's fine, I get the joy of killing something enormous and getting a shot at some BiS item. But other parts of the game are more enjoyable to me, so I prefer to focus on them.

I'm not really surprised that Daldaen doesn't understand, how could he? He's so focused on stuff with acronyms and his long ago progression through xpacs that most of us never cared about. But he's emblematic of the raiding mindset here, the kind of guys who think the server will just keel over if it doesn't Progress(tm), never understanding why other people might play EverQuest, notwithstanding that there's hundreds of other people in other zones every day doing things they like to do that aren't raiding.

How much interaction do you really have with raiders on this server anyways? It's not like Detoxx is in Blackburrow yelling "CONCEDE!!" anytime you aggro a gnoll carrying a cracked staff.

[thufir]

How much interaction do you really have with raiders on this server anyways? It's not like Detoxx is in Blackburrow yelling "CONCEDE!!" anytime you aggro a gnoll carrying a cracked staff.

Not much. I don't think you're understanding the context of that post though. I don't care if people raid, people should be allowed to do what they want to do. But when raiders come through all like, "I don't understand why people like doing these things that don't lead to raiding", or "why don't they like this xpac just because it killed these things that people shouldn't like doing", it's a little whatever.

[Maelstrom]

Lol, I'm actually about done with EC. I'm sure people will miss that...special Sprawlz store.

We surely won't miss that price gouging. :eek:

[icedwards]

Not much. I don't think you're understanding the context of that post though. I don't care if people raid, people should be allowed to do what they want to do. But when raiders come through all like, "I don't understand why people like doing these things that don't lead to raiding", or "why don't they like this xpac just because it killed these things that people shouldn't like doing", it's a little whatever.

I don't think anyone's trying to tell you how to enjoy your time on this server. People, raiders or casuals, are entitled to whatever opinion they want about the future of the server. Anyone expecting content beyond Velious is setting themselves up for disappointment though.

[thufir]

I don't think anyone's trying to tell you how to enjoy your time on this server. People, raiders or casuals, are entitled to whatever opinion they want about the future of the server. Anyone expecting content beyond Velious is setting themselves up for disappointment though.

I agree with you on all particulars.

Daldaen was like "I don't understand why anyone cares about the low level game or that Paludal Caverns killed it" and that's what my subsequent posts were about.

I think it's fine to raid or be casual here, and nobody should expect Luclin. That's what we signed up for, and that's what we're getting.

[mr_jon3s]

Iunno, having one central where everyone flocks at is kinda meh.
Makes cities empty. See: PoKnowledge.

Most cities are empty on p99 with most people flocking to EC. People are always going to gather into one place because it just makes it easier to get what you want.

[kaev]

Have to agree that EC tunnel in 2016 sucks ass because of things like p99auctions. By normalizing prices it constricts liquidity and and sours people's attitudes making them feel like someone is trying to swindle them for offering to sell/but at a price deviating from the value advertised on the site by some nerd cycling wtb/wts /auctions across 10 different characters.

If it wasn't for them damned kids gettin on my lawn all the time!!!!!!!

You're right about p99auctions being just as easily manipulated as every other attempt to "keep EC profiteers honest".

Whoever was complaining about raider mentality, welcome to the year 2000. The "kids" who get active playing EQ during Kunark really pushed the hell out of that attitude, my friends and I used to blame it on tham having grown up playing video games. We were, of course, far superior in all ways having been socialized into gaming via pen&paper roleplaying and board wargames, those damned kids shoulda stayed off our lawn dammit!

Luclin sucked tho. The models were ok, but the animations were utter crap, and the old low-level game was given the same treatment as the raid game had already received earlier, destroyed by the "Hey look guys! It's Shinier! It Trivializes Old Content! Did We Mention That It's Shinier?!!!" that Verant/SOE used to sell new expansion packs.

[Zekayy]

What did I dislike most about Luclin?



That. Higher polygon counts may have been desired, but the new models, monsters and locations were so ugly that they defeated the purpose. I believe a much better approach would've involved maintaining the original art style but with higher polygon counts, rather than fundamentally altering the game's appearance. I hated even having to look at the "new and improved" graphics. I disliked numerous other things about that expansion--cats on the moon, mounts, alphabet soup monster names, class balancing turned into an endless grind, stat bloat, and other issues I don't care to list at the moment. However, the hideous appearance of everything definitely sits at the top of my most disliked list for Luclin.

I write the above as someone who believes Luclin had some good in it. As a whole, Luclin wasn't a hopeless concept. I believe a good expansion was in there, peeking out from behind the layers of trash, trying to get out--but never got the chance.

Danth

[Zekayy]

I also hate the iksar luclin fd it's just not the same

[Zekayy]

Make p99 great again. Bring on Shadows of Luclin.

Go play live if you want that

[Boonsly]

Awful zone design too. Hallways with merbs in em. Yay.

What's a merb?

[Sporkotron]

Most cities are empty on p99 with most people flocking to EC. People are always going to gather into one place because it just makes it easier to get what you want.

This simply isn't true to the extent it was on live. Go to any city on p99 and you'll at very least find a couple of 1 - 9 players leveling up in their newbie zone. After the nexus and especially after PoK on EQlive all those old beloved zones were completely empty at all hours.

That's what adding shit like Paludal caverns and the Nexus does, turns the actual classic content into ghost towns via convenience. It totally goes against the purpose of P99, which is to preserve the classic EQ experience.

[mr_jon3s]

This simply isn't true to the extent it was on live. Go to any city on p99 and you'll at very least find a couple of 1 - 9 players leveling up in their newbie zone. After the nexus and especially after PoK on EQlive all those old beloved zones were completely empty at all hours.

That's what adding shit like Paludal caverns and the Nexus does, turns the actual classic content into ghost towns via convenience. It totally goes against the purpose of P99, which is to preserve the classic EQ experience.

Yes you may find a couple on p99 but most end up in the EC area. Back in the day most noobie zones were filled with noobs till most people figured out the best places to level.

[Sporkotron]

Yes you may find a couple on p99 but most end up in the EC area. Back in the day most noobie zones were filled with noobs till most people figured out the best places to level.

Yup, they're nowhere near as filled as EQlive, no sense making the situation tremendously worse by adding content that makes all other cites and zones obsolete like ShadowHaven and PC.

[Jimjam]

This simply isn't true to the extent it was on live. Go to any city on p99 and you'll at very least find a couple of 1 - 9 players leveling up in their newbie zone. After the nexus and especially after PoK on EQlive all those old beloved zones were completely empty at all hours.

That's what adding shit like Paludal caverns and the Nexus does, turns the actual classic content into ghost towns via convenience. It totally goes against the purpose of P99, which is to preserve the classic EQ experience.

I think people might have causality reversed.

I remember on the eve of luclin most the newbie areas were pretty thin, and the lack of players hurt immersion. Having a place where the masses could gather and play together (instead of having a pseudo 1 player experience). I think PC may have been added BECAUSE the newbie areas were thinning each other out, rather than PC being the original cause of the thin newbie areas. Devil's advocate: PC was the needed coup de grace to dieing zones that kept the mmo in the early game.

[lonmoer]

I want more expansions.

[Foxplay]

Make p99 great again. Bring on Shadows of Luclin.

So much of it would be crushed in the first day...and then months of buttfukery over zones and spawns to bleed out luclin shards oh boy would that be ever so much fun. The race for bane-weapons and the all important first Emperor Ssra kill might be interesting though. However whichever guild gets Emperor Ssra first essentially Auto-wins the server

Pretty sure Awakened and Aftermath both would have no problem absolutely destroy most of Luclin without any AA points at all day 1

[Detoxx]

Graphics for me... But I still had a lot of fun with it.

LDoN was by far the worst xpac in terms of raiding. Total borefest. Was the xpac which actually made me leave the game. Fun group content but the raids.... Ugnh...

There was raids in LDoN? Could have fooled me!

[xKoopa]

Ldon raids were the same as group.. except hard ass raid bosses

I remember a couple pieces of loot surfaced from "hard" difficulty raids and it was insane for the timeline but nobody raided that shit cuz it was horribly boring

[thufir]

I think people might have causality reversed.

I remember on the eve of luclin most the newbie areas were pretty thin, and the lack of players hurt immersion. Having a place where the masses could gather and play together (instead of having a pseudo 1 player experience). I think PC may have been added BECAUSE the newbie areas were thinning each other out, rather than PC being the original cause of the thin newbie areas. Devil's advocate: PC was the needed coup de grace to dieing zones that kept the mmo in the early game.
Then why haven't those zones died here? Some are sparsely populated, but very few are dead. I remember not too long ago bumping into other players on Kerra Island of all places.

[Jimjam]

I guess I'm just salty that permafrost is generally empty for low level stuff. Goblins so much fun!

[Crom]

The character and npc graphics and animations were horrible, and lacked the same charm as the originals.

The Nexus was the beginning of the end for porters. It felt like an airport.

The Bazaar didn't bother me as much, as it was easier to grab what you wanted when you wanted it.

The zones and zone layouts were great though. Places like Katta Castellum, Fungus Grove, Twilight Sea and Ssraeshza Temple were great and I still poke my head around them on another server from time to time.

/This

[maskedmelon]

I never played Luclin much because I am just not interested in playing at Spaceelf, Slayer or Extranorrathians. I prefer to explore ancient ruins and pillage lost dungeons, battle bandits and beasts and masters of foul magics.

[mr_jon3s]

Then why haven't those zones died here? Some are sparsely populated, but very few are dead. I remember not too long ago bumping into other players on Kerra Island of all places.

Because people keep joining the server playing for a bit then quitting. So new players stay in starting zones because they don't know where to go because the last time they played this game was 15+ years ago.

[thufir]

Because people keep joining the server playing for a bit then quitting. So new players stay in starting zones because they don't know where to go because the last time they played this game was 15+ years ago.
"stay in starting zones"? I wouldn't call kerra isle, befallen, upper guk, blackburrow, crushbone "starting zones". They are viable low level dungeons, all of which would be replaced by Paludal Caverns tomorrow if Luclin was released here.

I also find it interesting that you think everyone is "playing for a bit, then quitting". That isn't my experience. Some quit, sure. I meet a fair amount of excited noobs in earlier zones that I see again in later ones.

[Sporkotron]

Because people keep joining the server playing for a bit then quitting. So new players stay in starting zones because they don't know where to go because the last time they played this game was 15+ years ago.

Hahaha, from what orafice did you pull that story?

"Newbie zones aren't deserted because new players stay in starting zones and then quit because P99 is just ever so confusing and they don't know where to go. We should completely kill all those zones by adding non-classic one size fits all replacement content and then people won't be confused and stop playing. That'll make the classic server WAAAAAAAAAAAYYY better, having all the classic zones be completely empty all the time."

[thufir]

Hahaha, from what orafice did you pull that story?

"Newbie zones aren't deserted because new players stay in starting zones and then quit because P99 is just ever so confusing and they don't know where to go. We should completely kill all those zones by adding non-classic one size fits all replacement content and then people won't be confused and stop playing. That'll make the classic server WAAAAAAAAAAAYYY better, having all the classic zones be completely empty all the time."

Yeah, this was the theory of a high end raider who hasn't bothered playing a nontwinked alt in a very long time and thinks everyone is quitting because very few "new" players have joined the raiding scene.

That this very scenario is proof there is a lower level game thriving where they don't bother looking for it has not occurred to him. What, thinks the raider, is there to do in this game that isn't raiding or preparation for raiding? After all, the low level game is deadly dull; who would play it on purpose? Most of those 1000+ players online are probably dumb newbies who will quit at any time.

[Lothian]

It being in space, and detracting from old world low level content.

Anyone who says "the models" was clearly too lazy to just turn them off.

[Sporkotron]

Yeah, this was the theory of a high end raider who hasn't bothered playing a nontwinked alt in a very long time and thinks everyone is quitting because very few "new" players have joined the raiding scene.

That this very scenario is proof there is a lower level game thriving where they don't bother looking for it has not occurred to him. What, thinks the raider, is there to do in this game that isn't raiding or preparation for raiding? After all, the low level game is deadly dull; who would play it on purpose? Most of those 1000+ players online are probably dumb newbies who will quit at any time.

Yeah, I had the same idea when someone in this thread was like: "Everyone just goes from Oasis to Unrest, MM, LGuk,etc" That totally sounded like the perspective of some raid guild shut in that hasn't played with anyone aside from their close nit band of poop sockers in months.

There are people everywhere leveling on p99, but if all you do is log in and wait for your raid leader to tell you what to do then you'd probably never know that.

[Sorn]

Anyone who says "the models" was clearly too lazy to just turn them off.

Actually, I remember they strongly encouraged you to switch to the new models (EX: you couldn't use horses/see mounted toons properly without luclin models until recently) and over time tried really hard to phase out the old ones through total lack of support on the graphics side...nowadays if you use classic models with non-classic gear, you get weird stuff like dark purple leather that's obviously just tinted (especially on Iksar monks, who end up looking like they took a dunk in the dye tank along with their armor because their scales are also tinted).

Recently they added a low polygon version of the Vah Shir models. The only real reason they retained the old models before the progression servers was for users who couldn't get their hands on a powerful enough graphics card.

[Alanus]

While I enjoyed AA making my paladin into pretty much a soloing machine during Luclin/PoP, AA really screwed the raid scene up. They tuned content for AA, where you had to rely on crap like MGB in order to kill certain mobs. That kind of stuff sucked.

[big_ole_jpn]

Recently they added a low polygon version of the Vah Shir models. The only real reason they retained the old models before the progression servers was for users who couldn't get their hands on a powerful enough graphics card.

had to lol at this because it seems recent to me too. It's been literally 10 years since they added the low poly Vah Shir.

[Sorn]

had to lol at this because it seems recent to me too. It's been literally 10 years since they added the low poly Vah Shir.

Really? I only remember their original model.

The 'no old models on horses' thing was definitely only changed recently. I saw the patch notes last month on that :)

[Lothian]

Actually, I remember they strongly encouraged you to switch to the new models (EX: you couldn't use horses/see mounted toons properly without luclin models until recently) and over time tried really hard to phase out the old ones through total lack of support on the graphics side...nowadays if you use classic models with non-classic gear, you get weird stuff like dark purple leather that's obviously just tinted (especially on Iksar monks, who end up looking like they took a dunk in the dye tank along with their armor because their scales are also tinted).

Recently they added a low polygon version of the Vah Shir models. The only real reason they retained the old models before the progression servers was for users who couldn't get their hands on a powerful enough graphics card.

I remember that as well, and it would make sense for them to encourage people to use the new models. The fact is the option was still there. But I agree with you.

[Vandil]

The AAs for run speed and mana regen made life extra fun for my Dark Elf SK. I think I also got enough AAs for "Leech Touch" to heal myself with my Harm Touch. Made solo fear-kiting better because i could outrun things without Jboots/SoW, less downtime for mana, and the heal was nice.

And, of course, Dark Elf models were glorious.

[mr_jon3s]

Yeah, this was the theory of a high end raider who hasn't bothered playing a nontwinked alt in a very long time and thinks everyone is quitting because very few "new" players have joined the raiding scene.

That this very scenario is proof there is a lower level game thriving where they don't bother looking for it has not occurred to him. What, thinks the raider, is there to do in this game that isn't raiding or preparation for raiding? After all, the low level game is deadly dull; who would play it on purpose? Most of those 1000+ players online are probably dumb newbies who will quit at any time.

I am not a raider p99 raid scene sucks. Where I am getting my lowbies quit is because I have made mutli alts grouped with people added them to my friends list and usually after a week or 2 they just stop playing.

[thufir]

I am not a raider p99 raid scene sucks. Where I am getting my lowbies quit is because I have made mutli alts grouped with people added them to my friends list and usually after a week or 2 they just stop playing.
Bummer. Doesn't happen to me. Maybe they're playing more alts? Or do you think everyone plays the same character all the time?

[Kowalski]

Moon pussy : http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Moon%20Pussy

[Blitzers]

Anything past velious sux, plz stop these pointless threads.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

So many invested emotions in this thread! I love you guys! Don't change please!

[Latex]

yet redacted is way more social of a server than p99 with bazaar (and it even has limited boxing) because it isn't a claustrophobic mouse colony (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_sink) that only paranoid sicko autists are willing to suffer playing.

the mechanics aren't everything, EQ is about what emerges from those mechanics

wtf is this redacted shit? what server are y'all talking about? is this censorship or self-censorship? so many questions.

[Zekayy]

AAs ruined the game they really did. Especially for warriors I mean they had an AA where all warriors had the frontal immunity like why? That completely shits all over ogres. Then you had an AA for enchanters that made KEI last like 5 hours. Not classic.

[Cenii]

the thing i dislike most about Luclin is that it will never be added to P99.


this

[fadetree]

AAs ruined the game they really did. Especially for warriors I mean they had an AA where all warriors had the frontal immunity like why? That completely shits all over ogres. Then you had an AA for enchanters that made KEI last like 5 hours. Not classic.

yeah! And adding actual damage to archery and making the first actual fix to a class that had been ignored since beta...er, wait.

[nyclin]

AAs ruined the game they really did. Especially for warriors I mean they had an AA where all warriors had the frontal immunity like why? That completely shits all over ogres. Then you had an AA for enchanters that made KEI last like 5 hours. Not classic.

Yeah, boy do I hate having a good reason to play my main outside of raids. So terrible. And fixing all of the issues with hybrids, wow.. just horrible.

[Sporkotron]

Yeah, boy do I hate having a good reason to play my main outside of raids. So terrible. And fixing all of the issues with hybrids, wow.. just horrible.

Oh, so instead of making alts, people can just grind endlessly on one toon? Oh, I'm sure that didn't have fucking awful effects on the low end game.

Oh wait, it fucking destroyed it. That's right.

[Salamarr]

Oh, so instead of making alts, people can just grind endlessly on one toon? Oh, I'm sure that didn't have fucking awful effects on the low end game.

Oh wait, it fucking destroyed it. That's right.

WOWOWOW dayem, salty as fuck. Lets be honest, back then they were catering to the majority of their audience. Nothing was stopping anyone from making an alt. Nothing was stopping anyone from holding hands in the shire hunting fire beetles.

[Sporkotron]

WOWOWOW dayem, salty as fuck. Lets be honest, back then they were catering to the majority of their audience. Nothing was stopping anyone from making an alt. Nothing was stopping anyone from holding hands in the shire hunting fire beetles.

Except that they needed to constantly grind AA to be competitive.

[Salamarr]

Except that they needed to constantly grind AA to be competitive.

If you enjoy the lower level game play, who cares what was going on at the top? Didn't you have like minded friends to play with that liked to play your way?

[Jimjam]

TIL raid characters farming AA in PC is what killed the low end game ;).

[Sporkotron]

If you enjoy the lower level game play, who cares what was going on at the top? Didn't you have like minded friends to play with that liked to play your way?

That's retarded, and you know it.

You know this server is about maintaining the classic EQ experience, right? You know whats not classic? Everyone grinding AA, and all the classic zones being completely empty because nobody makes alts anymore.

[Sporkotron]

TIL raid characters farming AA in PC is what killed the low end game ;).

Characters farming AA + PC being a convenient automated port way and making all other content obsolete absolutely destroyed the low end game.

You were almost there, but then you went retard.

[Salamarr]

That's retarded, and you know it.

You know this server is about maintaining the classic EQ experience, right? You know whats not classic? Everyone grinding AA, and all the classic zones being completely empty because nobody makes alts anymore.

It's not retarded. What's retarded is people spewing their venom in a thread about an expansion that will never hit P99. You also speak in over generalizing rhetoric. I made lots of alts back during that time. People made their own choices, just as you did. Are they wrong for how they decided to spend their time playing the game whether it was grinding AA or hunting fire beetles on their 8th character in freeport? The glory in it all, and still is, is that you were free to choose.

[Sporkotron]

It's not retarded. What's retarded is people spewing their venom in a thread about an expansion that will never hit P99. You also speak in over generalizing rhetoric. I made lots of alts back during that time. People made their own choices, just as you did. Are they wrong for how they decided to spend their time playing the game whether it was grinding AA or hunting fire beetles on their 8th character in freeport? The glory in it all, and still is, is that you were free to choose.

Venom? Did I hurt your wittle fee fees by insulting the space pussies?

I was just explaining why Luclin sucked nuts, and anyone who wants it is a fucking moron. It wasn't that complicated.

[Salamarr]

Venom? Did I hurt your wittle fee fees by insulting the space pussies?

I was just explaining why Luclin sucked nuts, and anyone who wants it is a fucking moron. It wasn't that complicated.

Lol, get some friends.

[Sporkotron]

Lol, get some friends.

no u, lol

[Lhancelot]

I was just explaining why Luclin sucked nuts, and anyone who wants it is a fucking moron. It wasn't that complicated.

This is 100% your opinion, of course. You realize that, right? Even you could probably mention some good things about Luclin, if you were being honest. :p