Remove the auction sites

[Kelor]

Bring back some fun to EC, its no fun when everybody knows prices of every thing.
On live i remember you had to study prices to do well in EC / Bazaar, now all any one does is checks P99auctions.

[Lhancelot]

I just don't like how the sites can be easily manipulated by buyers/sellers. The sites also make it much harder to score on deals from sellers because it only takes them 5 secs to check the "average" price of an item in the past month. I suspect there's no way to remove them so you just got to accept them for their good and bad.

[Nuggie]

Less people getting scammed is a good thing, friend.

[Pokesan]

really feel badly for the poor parasitic resellers!

[Chaboo_Cleric]

Less people getting scammed is a good thing, friend.

Bad for business. Imagine if Wallstreet had this sort of thing. You sick degenerate bastard.

[skarlorn]

the websites ruin immersion

just like this RANT is ruining my server chat

[mr_jon3s]

Down with auction sites up with the bazaar.

#luclin2072

[Baa]

Long live the auction site!

[AzzarTheGod]

really feel badly for the poor parasitic resellers!

Yeah. not classic.

this shit sucks, daddy 'gean please make them take the site down.

[Brocode]

So first you want to remove knowledge from common people, then you want then to be inferior over your superiority for knowing prices, then you want to abuse them overpricing because thats the fun of EC? Sounds more like the fun for you being a scammer.

Man Up thats the 2016 market, deal with it.

[beel]

I just don't like how the sites can be easily manipulated by buyers/sellers.

Ok, you want fair markets without manipulation. Aka. right prices.

The sites also make it much harder to score on deals

wait what?

[tiadashi]

really feel badly for the poor parasitic resellers!

resale is a valid way to make money in p99, i see no problem with it - and it works just fine with the "auction" sites, plenty of plat to be made

[AzzarTheGod]

Please shut it down. Its not classic its disgusting. Price checking on a website with a live update database of /auctions.

Cant believe anyone is defending this tripe. Its sick.

[mropey]

I don't see you bitching and moaning about the other 700 things not classic about this server. Move on, rat.

[AzzarTheGod]

I don't see you bitching and moaning about the other 700 things not classic about this server. Move on, rat.

Rogean, please realize that this quote above is the mens rea (the state of mind) of the people supporting the bot-tracking site.

Also please realize that this website requires an in-game bot to parse the auction, and is likely using an IP exemption to accomplish this.

If the staff is aware of this and supports the site, we should know about it. Any guides know if the tracker received an exemption specifically for the tracking?

Tracking for the Wikipedia is understandable, but I think there is a big difference between tracking item averages and tracking WTS bids. One is obviously much further away from classic than the other.

[radda]

Please shut it down. Its not classic its disgusting. Price checking on a website with a live update database of /auctions.

Cant believe anyone is defending this tripe. Its sick.

no one takes you seriously dude, we all know you couldnt careless

[AzzarTheGod]

no one takes you seriously dude, we all know you couldnt careless

Everyone knows I joke with the best, but at the end of the day I care about classic EQ.

I had a staunch career of serious posting (Probably some odd 2,500 posts prior to me posting with new humor and flair. If you read just RNF I can see how you would draw this conclusion. Pokesan can vouch.

Ad hominem is all you have eh? Again, this is the mens rea of the supporters of in-game bots with IP exemptions tracking WTS bids.

[radda]

Everyone knows I joke with the best, but at the end of the day I care about classic EQ.

I had a staunch career of serious posting (Probably some odd 2,500 posts prior to me posting with new humor and flair. If you read just RNF I can see how you would draw this conclusion. Pokesan can vouch.

Ad hominem is all you have eh? Again, this is the mens rea of the supporters of in-game bots with IP exemptions tracking WTS bids.

And?

[poena.dare]

I like it and I hope it continues to work.

I sell some things much higher than the p99auctions average price. Ppl send me irritated tells. I calmly explain my costs are higher than average. Sometimes I negotiate. Sometimes my pricing strategies backfire.

I sell some things much lower than the average p99auctions average price. The site helps me unload those items quickly.

Above all else, being a pragmatist is Classic behavior.

[khanable]

I remember people would quote allalhazam prices on live which was arguably worse

Wts Iksar beserker club 20k

[poena.dare]

An Air Elemental for President 2016!

[RedXIII]

Whats funny is that some people are really trying to scam the prices by pretending they are selling the item for a much lower price. Later they come to you and say: "Hey but the avg price in p99 auct is XXX, i am not paying all that".

Do what i do, and dont flex your prices. Stay firm and make people pay what you are asking.

RIP fungi prices... damn lowballers.

[Jimjam]

I like it and I hope it continues to work.

I sell some things much higher than the p99auctions average price. Ppl send me irritated tells. I calmly explain my costs are higher than average. Sometimes I negotiate. Sometimes my pricing strategies backfire.

I sell some things much lower than the average p99auctions average price. The site helps me unload those items quickly.

Above all else, being a pragmatist is Classic behavior.

I like your style, I always price low on the rare occasion I visit EC, I just want to be in and out; someone else can make the rest of the profit with resale.

On the other hand, when I was levelling my wizard, I was buying gnoll scrolls for less than everyone else. When people told me other people paid more I'd just say "fine, wait for them to log on and in the mean time continue losing x PP each time you have a duplicate scroll rot".

I think too many people are too concerned with getting the exact price on the wiki/whatever instead of focusing on what things are worth to them.

[Daldaen]

Just implement the Bazaar please.

No one has ever had a meaningful interaction with someone in EC. You can still haggle with AFK traders and they can get back to you, but you run the risk of the item being bought up so stop low balling and pay the price asked.

[Tuurin]

To be honest, the auction sites make EC function almost exactly like the bazaar did, and for all of those purists out there it's not surprising they don't like it. But that's the reality of our current emu- you can basically walk into the zone, look up the what's being sold and how much it costs, go to that "bot" and buy it- no real haggling, etc.

Furthermore, you can do most of that while not even in EC- just need to have a mule parked there for when you make a deal. So really it's even more automated that the old bazaar. At least with the bazaar you had to actually go there (or again have a mule parked there) to check on prices and see what's for sale. With the app you can look up EC without even being logged into EQ- hell, you can even do it on your phone if you want.

[yyrkoon]

I had a staunch career of serious posting (Probably some odd 2,500 posts prior to me posting with new humor and flair.

basically you spent the few last months shit posting red99 forums every single day, all day. most people gave up on these forums because of your and chaboo's spam.

now that the red forums are almost empty you two come to blue forums

fuck off back to red

nobody likes you here

[Freakish]

Fungis down to 30k yet?

[Chaboo_Cleric]

It really ruins the entrepreneur spirit of starting in the slums and making yourself rich in EC. That site is the worst thing ever for the game. Might as well close the entire EC Tunnel down and just put in the bazaar. It's literally the same crapshoot. The people who want this type of site are bad at EQ and love having an advantage. At this point, you might as well throw maps in the game, and nexus ports.


Really damn shame to see a classic experience ruin it's way of commerce.
Way to go liberals , hand hold some more.

[aMindAmok]

Im all for the auction site even though Ive never used it. Thing is nobody wants to spend all their time in ec except for people playing WalletQuest. So what if the price of fungie has dropped since the site became available (saw at 40k I think recently) It just shows how over inflated the price was. You just dont like everyone being able to see that. The only people that buy that crap are other WalletQuesters and someones rich alt. I hope the market crashes on all the items so maybe some of them stop being perma camped.

[Mendo]

Just implement the Bazaar please.

No one has ever had a meaningful interaction with someone in EC. You can still haggle with AFK traders and they can get back to you, but you run the risk of the item being bought up so stop low balling and pay the price asked.

This brings up a good point. What is the real reason we loved EC and hated the Bazaar? In EC the economy was organic and you actually had to chill there and wait for someone to sell what you needed, maybe you got lucky and got someone in a rush. Maybe you got someone who was a pro trader and the goods were to expensive for you. Either way you had to sit there and interact with other human beings. Auction sites remove that. When I want something I can run around and play the game, not sitting in EC. While playing I just have the auction site up and when I see the item I want I send that guy a tell and offer the price the auction site told me was a good price. EC is no longer EC when I can do this.

[Loke]

Bad for business. Imagine if Wallstreet had this sort of thing. You sick degenerate bastard.

Is this sarcasm? You realize there are literally hundreds of websites that provide price histories for just about every financial instrument you can think of, right? The only people on Wall Street making money in arbitrage are using HFT.

[aMindAmok]

This brings up a good point. What is the real reason we loved EC and hated the Bazaar? In EC the economy was organic and you actually had to chill there and wait for someone to sell what you needed, maybe you got lucky and got someone in a rush. Maybe you got someone who was a pro trader and the goods were to expensive for you. Either way you had to sit there and interact with other human beings. Auction sites remove that. When I want something I can run around and play the game, not sitting in EC. While playing I just have the auction site up and when I see the item I want I send that guy a tell and offer the price the auction site told me was a good price. EC is no longer EC when I can do this.

I get it and you are right to a certain extent. I only use the wiki to check prices for things I want. Its not all that acurate but its fine for me. Because its there I see no reason why we cant have another tool to do that same thing. However, I dont like the idea of buying from a bot. I want a living person on the other end of that sale.

I think people should have to be at their keyboard if the want to sell something and not using an ip exemption. Anyone with 2 accounts on should have 2 people at 2 seperate keyboards/computers or be banned for boxing. The tools are fine if all the other sever rules apply.

For me all want to know is historic prices. I dont need live auction info. If I want that then I can visit EC. So, on that part, I can see why people are upset.

[baloen]

Was I the only person that used EQ Prices before the Bazaar?

https://web.archive.org/web/20001205120500/http://www.eqprices.com/

Site appears to be gone now, but you can still see snippets of it archived going back to 2000. I don't recall how they generated their data for pricing.

[maskedmelon]

The auction sites are pretty slick if you farm the same items often. You just post sell messages from a few different toons (as many as you like really) off and on for 20% or more than you want to sell for to keep the average up. The. When you are ready to sell, you can do so at your desire price point and be below average making buyers think you are offering a great deal ^^ You can do the same as a buyer if you plan your purchases. Just log in periodically post a sell message on different toons and log out ignoring any tells or just letting people know someone else beat them too it. Then once the average price has fallen to or below your price point log in for an hour or two to find a seller or just monitor the site for when a seller pops on ^^ Works great since very few people actually sit in EC to trade anymore.

[myriverse]

Bring back some fun to EC, its no fun when everybody knows prices of every thing.
On live i remember you had to study prices to do well in EC / Bazaar, now all any one does is checks P99auctions.
You still have to study prices.

[xKoopa]

Was I the only person that used EQ Prices before the Bazaar?

https://web.archive.org/web/20001205120500/http://www.eqprices.com/

Site appears to be gone now, but you can still see snippets of it archived going back to 2000. I don't recall how they generated their data for pricing.

I used this site alot back in the day

[myriverse]

Please shut it down. Its not classic its disgusting. Price checking on a website with a live update database of /auctions.

Cant believe anyone is defending this tripe. Its sick.
What idiot, in 2000, was paying more than the posted price on the several sites that kept track of prices?

[Pokesan]

gonna forum lawyer this site out of existence

wipe it off the map

[korilla]

it's 2016 man...everyone knows the price of everything.

[Axlrose]

Unfortunately, with the "ease" of travel, there is just one region for the game. Whereas a game like Eve has numerous regions and each has it's own market flair. Yes, Eve does have its Bazaar - Jita; but if you wish to make money as a trader, many times traveling to those other regions to "buy low and sell high" can be quite beneficial.

[Mendo]

Unfortunately, with the "ease" of travel, there is just one region for the game. Whereas a game like Eve has numerous regions and each has it's own market flair. Yes, Eve does have its Bazaar - Jita; but if you wish to make money as a trader, many times traveling to those other regions to "buy low and sell high" can be quite beneficial.

I miss Gfay as the market zone for my server

[aMindAmok]

GFay is my go to place to get newbie gear. People still auction there a bit but youre not going to find top teir gear there.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

Auction sites aren't going anywhere, deal with it neckbeards!

[lowner411]

If you really don't like the auction sites, there are a few options. First, ignore them. Second, join a guild that doesn't buy stuff in EC, only from each other. Or third, go play Red, since there is no viable economy there.

I have a lot of other questionable ideas, too.

[mcbizzler]

I have a lot of other questionable ideas, too.

Pray tell.

[Quidello]

All you had to do back in the day was ask your guild or /ooc to price an item. And being fully immersed meant reading 1000s of these price calling messages, giving you an idea of what most common items were worth. If we're going to ban the auction sites, why don't we just ban the wiki too and make people buy a hard cover strategy guide for fifty dollars.

Don't remember who said it, but really stand firm on your prices. I've had so many times where people would try to shave off 500 or 1000 plat from my already more than fair price, only to proceed to buy the item after I say something like "***pp is already a great price." Truth is, I enjoy giving people who will actually use the item a good deal, but now that everyone has mules in EC, you never know if they're just a reseller looking to start a rip-off chain.

[tristantio]

Shut em down!

[Lhancelot]

Shut em down!

This is akin to Oppenheimer denouncing the atom bomb.

[AzzarTheGod]

Rogean, please realize that this quote above is the mens rea (the state of mind) of the people supporting the bot-tracking site.

Also please realize that this website requires an in-game bot to parse the auction, and is likely using an IP exemption to accomplish this.

If the staff is aware of this and supports the site, we should know about it. Any guides know if the tracker received an exemption specifically for the tracking?

Tracking for the Wikipedia is understandable, but I think there is a big difference between tracking item averages and tracking WTS bids. One is obviously much further away from classic than the other.

Additionally,

If the IP exemptions for the bots used to collect this data are sanctioned and the management is fully aware of it (Rogean, nilbog),

Then I will digress, as it would be obvious that the staff have made a conscious decision/ruling on the collection and parsing of auction data by in-game bots with IP exemptions.

I think we need to determine whether the bots are management (not staff per se) sanctioned or not, before raising any further protest.

That's what is most logical to me. This issue can be swept under that umbrella. Are the bots sanctioned or not? Did the staff (and more importantly, the management of the project) approve of the IP exemption for the bot specifically, or was it done behind their back?

[MiRo2]

If the IP exemptions for the bots used to collect this data

P99 Auctions uses a program for people to download to push log data to it's site. There have been several times that I've looked at it where there were 0 contributors and nothing was being reported.

[AzzarTheGod]

P99 Auctions uses a program for people to download to push log data to it's site. There have been several times that I've looked at it where there were 0 contributors and nothing was being reported.

Lets see the source that proves this is the method for collection.

On red server we have seen IP exemptions for bots to collect data for PvP reasons, it turned into collecting data for ALL auctions and OOC. Why would an auction bot not receive an exemption?

And why would the operators of these data collection sites not be using a bot?

Again, if the data is being collected in-game legally I have no problem with it. If its being done underhandedly without consent, behind the staffs back, then I have a problem with it.

User submitted data, eh? I remain highly skeptical that this is the case. Unless the operator comes forward and can verify that claim, I will remain skeptical as bots are commonplace.

And we already have seen bots get exemptions and/or be illegally placed in the game using red server as an example.

[MiRo2]

I'm sure short of the owner of the website posting irrefutable evidence show this is where they get their data from you'll continue with your current argument, but here is what I'm referencing.

Thank you for participating in the development of P99's new, premiere auction management system. We're just getting started and can't wait to bring you all the modern features of an in game auction system for Project 1999. New content, features, bug fixes etc. will be released every few weeks as we push toward a full production release. This is a community backed project and much like other auction trackers that P99 has adopted we require the use of your auction logs to gather and maintain a current list of auctions in the tunnel. At the bottom of this page is a link to the tracking assistant which will watch your logs for auctions and submit them to the auction house. It also acts as a desktop notification system to alert you when new items you are looking for are up for auction.

[Raev]

No one has ever had a meaningful interaction with someone in EC.

Agreed. If getting 500 'would you trade your Fungi tunic for my 12 items from Crushbone' tells is the highlight of your day, you need to do something better with your life.

[Swish]

If you dont like auction sites dont use thrm, its not rocket science.

However if you dont usually enjoy pvp you might enjoy reassessing that opinion on a fun and friendly server where everyone is welcome.