No love for wizards in groups?

[serjordanmormont]

Title says it all. I see a lot of hate on the forums for wizards (except raids). Whats the deal with that?

In my limited experience they do pretty great damage which I would have thought would be desirable in groups as well.

Only issue I see is they sometimes do too much damage and pull aggro from the tank.

[Necabo]

I didn't experience much hate concerning grouping while I was leveling. I think the key is making yourself a valuable member of a group, which, for a wizard, is doing more than just damage.

We are the masters of the arcane; thus, we should show off our prowess. In a typical group, I'd perform the following functions: nuke (obviously), crowd control with root, nullify damage shields, and evacuate (which saved many groups). If I was in a group with no druid or magician, then I'd sometimes apply O'Keils as one damage is better than no damage.

Also, when my mana was drained (I avoided going to 0m once I was able to evacuate), I'd typically meditate to 50m or 60m and then start working again rather than waiting until I was at 100m. That seemed to keep me more effective, and inevitably there would be a chance to meditate to 100m when we'd have to take a break for a healer to meditate.

I think the lack of love for wizards in groups comes from two things: 1. a few suck wizards who afk forever to meditate (giving the rest of us a bad reputation). 2. ignorance concerning what our class brings to a group.

[jolanar]

From a min max perspective, there are better choices for most grouping situations. People on the forums tend to only care about min/max. Whereas people in the actual game playing are more forgiving and mostly just don't want to group with asshats regardless of class.

Wizards are pretty great to have around in "oh shit" situations, assuming they are smart enough not to dump all their mana on random trash mobs. Not just evac, but all the things mentioned by Necabo above.

[serjordanmormont]

I didn't experience much hate concerning grouping while I was leveling. I think the key is making yourself a valuable member of a group, which, for a wizard, is doing more than just damage.

We are the masters of the arcane; thus, we should show off our prowess. In a typical group, I'd perform the following functions: nuke (obviously), crowd control with root, nullify damage shields, and evacuate (which saved many groups). If I was in a group with no druid or magician, then I'd sometimes apply O'Keils as one damage is better than no damage.

Also, when my mana was drained (I avoided going to 0m once I was able to evacuate), I'd typically meditate to 50m or 60m and then start working again rather than waiting until I was at 100m. That seemed to keep me more effective, and inevitably there would be a chance to meditate to 100m when we'd have to take a break for a healer to meditate.

I think the lack of love for wizards in groups comes from two things: 1. a few suck wizards who afk forever to meditate (giving the rest of us a bad reputation). 2. ignorance concerning what our class brings to a group.


That sounds like a pretty solid explanation. Pretty much make use of all your tools and be smart about your mana to stay useful. Got it.

[trite]

Title says it all. I see a lot of hate on the forums for wizards (except raids). Whats the deal with that?

In my limited experience they do pretty great damage which I would have thought would be desirable in groups as well.

Only issue I see is they sometimes do too much damage and pull aggro from the tank.

Wizards are notorious AFKers....rogues, monks and even extra warriors are much more reliable DPS

[dcbone86]

Wizards are notorious AFKers....rogues, monks and even extra warriors are much more reliable DPS

This. Brb AFK OOM for every 2 out of 3 fights.

[Victorio]

Wizard sustained dps is weak in a fast pulling group and they die easily. Lots of good cheap weapons float around which make melee far better at low and mid levels. Their utility is too low to make up for their other weaknesses at high levels. They're good for raiding and Chardok aoe.

[myriverse]

I see a lot of hate on the forums
No need for any qualifiers. Forums are where you go for hate.

[Naethyn]

Wizards are great for hole groups so you can port out at the end. A wizard who aoe stuns a pull to help enchanters/healers out is a great addition. A wizard who single target chain stuns a really hard caster can prevent ice comets. Root is usually a good enough cc. I agree with not wanting a sit there and hit 1 button wizard (or any class really).

[Vallanor]

If you're min-maxing, a wizard is a pretty poor addition to a group. Luckily min-maxing in a seventeen year-old game is totally absurd and not that common at lower levels.

Join a group, use all your abilities, don't go AFK too much, and have fun reliving the good old days. Most people will be more than happy to have you along.

[mr_jon3s]

The problem is people don't know how to wizard. The waste mana over nuking mobs and then afk. If your nuke does 20-30% of the mobs hp you shouldn't be nuking the mob at 10% unless its on someone other then the tank or the tank is going down.

[Pyrion]

DD damage generally is the weakest source of damage. Wizards excel in DD efficiency.... but they are only 10 to 20% more efficient than the all the other casters which have a lot more tools to do damage (except cleric). When you compare damage done by a mage + pet against a wizard its not even funny. The pet alone will outdamage the wizard, and not by a small margin.

That's why people who want fast xp don't like wizards in their groups. Literally every other class will contribute more to damage. Of course there are situations where the other abilities of wizards become important...

The cruel thing is that newbies choose to play wizards because they think they get the best damage class and then... they get disappointed quickly.

[Reece15]

If you're min-maxing, a wizard is a pretty poor addition to a group. Luckily min-maxing in a seventeen year-old game is totally absurd and not that common at lower levels.

Join a group, use all your abilities, don't go AFK too much, and have fun reliving the good old days. Most people will be more than happy to have you along.

[Gia]

I can tell you as someone who is freshly leveling their first character (32 cleric currently) that I just grouped with a Wizard in HHK and it was great.

Like most people are saying on this thread, I support the idea of playing what makes you happy. It's about you having fun and enjoying the game. If anyone really denies you a spot in their group JUST because you're a wiz...you don't wanna group with that a-hole anyway :)

[Karta]

I can tell you as someone who is freshly leveling their first character (32 cleric currently) that I just grouped with a Wizard in HHK and it was great.

Like most people are saying on this thread, I support the idea of playing what makes you happy. It's about you having fun and enjoying the game. If anyone really denies you a spot in their group JUST because you're a wiz...you don't wanna group with that a-hole anyway :)

As a ranger and returning from a long break from live, I am finding this already when looking for groups.

[Troxx]

The problem is people don't know how to wizard.

No, the problem is that wizards are (unfortunately) just a terrible class in groups. Sustained damage potential is arguably the worst in the game other than clerics.

In every situation you might want the niche abilities of a wizard, a Druid would make a better choice.

Wizards are really only good for:
-fast raid burst
-porting to hate/sky
-quadding
-porting for money

[maskedmelon]

No, the problem is that wizards are (unfortunately) just a terrible class in groups. Sustained damage potential is arguably the worst in the game other than clerics.

In every situation you might want the niche abilities of a wizard, a Druid would make a better choice.

Wizards are really only good for:
-fast raid burst
-porting to hate/sky
-quadding
-porting for money

^ This, wizards are awful dps. At best, very good wizard can make a mediocre addition to a poor group. I readily accept any LFG wizard to my groups though. It affords me the great satisfaction of moral supremacy for my magnanimity.

[Sodors Finest Poster]

Magician can nuke nearly as well, has very relevant damage shields and has sustained dps via pet.

Its like comparing Percy to Spencer. No contest really.

http://i.imgur.com/k6YPNCd.png

[clacbec]

I Enjoy my wiz tho, it was my First 60 on this server

[Spyder73]

Wizards are one of the worst classes to group with for a variety of reasons

1) Bad DPS for virtually every camp compared to melee/pet casters
2) OOM AFK Syndrome
3) They don't synergize well for small groups (worst possible combo for almost any class? I think thats safe to say)
4) re-read 1, 2, and 3

[Nexii]

Wizards have amazing AoE. But it's diffcult to find enough of them (and the AoE CC) to make it work for an exp group.

[renordw]

I have a 56 wizard and a 54 shaman. I can outDPS my wizard on my shaman simply by spam clicking my Jaundiced Bone Bracer. I wish we got crits or something.

[Morningbreath]

I was going to say that wizards are halfway balanced on Red because the twinking community...err economy is almost non-existent but that's not really true. It just means the pet/charm classes are that much more powerful.

Apart from their lack of sustained damage, wizard damage is wildly inconsistent. They usually vary between overnuking and pulling aggro and doing nothing at all because they don't have any mana to contribute anything.

It wouldn't take rocket science to balance the class in exp groups but since this server is doomed to continue repeating the mistakes of 1998-99 in 2016 and beyond, we just have to live with it.

[EobarrdThawne]

Yeah they're great for ports/evacs, it is hard due to some people that abuse the AFK, the thing is you hit so hard per cast you don't' really need to be casting the entire time. Just quad kite when you can and hope for groups.