Sneak/FD Memblur

[Daldaen]

This has been mentioned many times, but it certainly deserves its own thread.

Sneak + FD when used in conjunction are vastly overpowered and not-classic.

This is the problem:


If you aggro any number of mobs (1 or 100 it doesn't matter)
You FD
You activate a successful Sneak


Once you stand, with sneak active, you are guaranteed a 100% chance that EVERY mob you previously had aggro on will memblur.

This is wrong, and there is no evidence I can find to support this ever being on live.

When standing from an FD every mob should have a random chance at membluring itself. This chance should increase based on successive FDs. So for 1 or 2 mobs you have a decent shot of membluring them, but it isn't guaranteed (RNG based) Atleast until they get back to their spawn points.

However now, you can guarantee a successful blur on any number of mobs due to this bug. It has persisted for far too long.

[EQsale]

This has been mentioned many times, but it certainly deserves its own thread.

Sneak + FD when used in conjunction are vastly overpowered and not-classic.

This is the problem:


If you aggro any number of mobs (1 or 100 it doesn't matter)
You FD
You activate a successful Sneak


Once you stand, with sneak active, you are guaranteed a 100% chance that EVERY mob you previously had aggro on will memblur.

This is wrong, and there is no evidence I can find to support this ever being on live.

When standing from an FD every mob should have a random chance at membluring itself. This chance should increase based on successive FDs. So for 1 or 2 mobs you have a decent shot of membluring them, but it isn't guaranteed (RNG based) Atleast until they get back to their spawn points.

However now, you can guarantee a successful blur on any number of mobs due to this bug. It has persisted for far too long.

That is not correct

[Pint]

It is correct as long as the sneak was successful and nothing is facing you. Something that ppl are also not mentioning is that monks can exploit this in combat to wipe their aggro, essentially a very op version of rogue evade.

[EQsale]

so a monk FDing in combat too wipe his aggro is considered a exploit now? really

[Daldaen]

FDing to drop you on aggro, or to have a chance at a Memblur when in combat is working at intend.

What isn't working is being guaranteed a 100% chance Memblur if you are standing from your FD with Sneak active. That is being used by every monk on the server and it's pretty broken.

There's a reason monks had to /quit out a lot on live. They almost never do here, and when they do it's usually not because of uncertainty on aggro dump.

[Pint]

so a monk FDing in combat too wipe his aggro is considered a exploit now? really

yes when it works 9/10 times

[Colgate]

That is not correct

yes it is

didn't play a monk on live and can't remember shit about FD mechanics, but i will agree that the way it currently works is incredibly overpowered/stupid

[eisley]

yes it is

didn't play a monk on live and can't remember shit about FD mechanics, but i will agree that the way it currently works is incredibly overpowered/stupid

it's actually not true as OP wrote it, there is one minor but important distinction:

memblur only occurs if the monk stands while the mob is facing away. if it's facing you (even out of aggro range) it will reaggro, unless it otherwise blurred randomly

[Bones]

it's actually not true as OP wrote it, there is one minor but important distinction:

memblur only occurs if the monk stands while the mob is facing away. if it's facing you (even out of aggro range) it will reaggro, unless it otherwise blurred randomly

This. It's just not really noticed because monks almost always sneak + stand when the mobs they are trying to split are all facing away and pathing back toward their spawn.

[Colgate]

it's actually not true as OP wrote it, there is one minor but important distinction:

memblur only occurs if the monk stands while the mob is facing away. if it's facing you (even out of aggro range) it will reaggro, unless it otherwise blurred randomly

yea no shit, don't think anyone thought otherwise though

[Ikon]

I know this is an old thread but the OP was right. FD -> Sneak only worked on low level mobs but only because FD always memblurred 100%. Read the quotes, read the thread, this is one month after Velious released.

35th+ level mobs don't always clear your name on the taunt list when you FD. One way to double check if they are headed back after you (and you can not actually see them behind a wall or such) you can press the sneak button before you get up, when you get up, do a "c"on to see if they are indifferent. If they have their back toward you and had a sucessful FD blur, and they con indifferent, you know that guy fell for it!


Autumn, what he said was sneak, then stand up from the feign and con the mob going back. If it's indiff, it memblurred. If it glares/scowls (assuming it's not an always scowls mob), it's time to hit the dirt.



I use this all the time. The sneak isn't memblurring you, the sneak is checking if you memblurred.



On lvl31- mobs (It's 32+ that don't always memblur, not 35), you can sneak and stand up as soon as they turn around to go back, saving you a little time.

Think about it this way. Say you are pulling something through all the twists and turns of Guk and have to feign it. Well once it starts going back to its spawn point/wandering path it will get out of visual range. To test to see if it is memblurred if you stand and sneak, chances are you are behind the mob still, So if its memblurred, and you stand up sneaking it should con indifferent.



IF you stand up sneaking, and it scowls:



1) Its still aggro'd on you, and its coming back to beat the living snot out of you.



OR



2) Its facing you and has been blurred.



At least that is my take on the tactic.

What this means for you is that when a mob has you on the hate list, they'll be scowls at your or threateningly, even while sneaking.



So when you FD and the mobs wander off, hit your sneak button. Then when you stand up con the mob, if it's indiff faction then you're not on his hate list. If it's scowls/threateningly then FD immediately, he'll still be running back.



In my experiences I've found that it works best after you FD, to FD 3 or 4 more times, whether or not you feel like hitting sneak during these is up to you, but re-sneak right before standing up. It seems to work best that way.


http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?8889-Skill-tips-Sneak

[Raev]

At one point we had what I thought was a much more classic implementation of Sneak: it did not clear FD aggro, and all that mattered was your position relative to the NPC rather than its position relative to other NPCs. Then Haynar changed things to the current implementation about 1.5 years ago with no evidence that I could see.

Daldaen, what was the best evidence we dug up on classic assist and sneak mechanics? I remember checking Autumn's sneak guide and not finding any evidence that sneak had that double cone check.

There are about 5-10 classic mechanics changes that would really help this server: removing binds in TOV, classic FD/sneak mechanics, lazy aggro after a certain distance, First Brood dragons getting a weaker dragon fear, PCs resisting spells in general a bit better, NPC AE procs being single target only, automatic repops (restrain yourself from adding stupid gui defeaturizing, Daldaen. This list is far more important).

It's not classic, but I would also add a required level of 50 to the fungi tunic. Right now practically every xp group is either dominated by a fungi melee or screwed by the twink clearing half the zone.

Sadly, the chance of this happening appears to be 0.0.

[vouss]

Cry more faggot or buy one lf my fungis and l2p

[Notaa]

A lot of things about this server aren't classic, but please make us /q out all the time for the sake of classicness!

[Ikon]

A lot of things about this server aren't classic, but please make us /q out all the time for the sake of classicness!
Its not for the sake of classicness its for the sake of requiring skill to pull and more importantly because the current mechanic being used is the Newbie mechanic for newbie characters killing level 32 or lower monsters.

Why don't we just have mobs turn and flee on this server, even if they're dragons. Or why not just remove enrage so melee are not "forced" to turn off attack. How about we get Trak to cast aoe sicken instead so we're not "forced" to buff our poison resists. We could maybe put Torpor on Drixies so we're not "forced" to kill guardian wurms for it.

Your argument is retarded. This is a classic server. You're not "forced" to log on. There are other servers where you can solo and duo kill anything you like if that's what you want.

No one was made to /quit out on live they did so because it was easier than fd flopping till aggro was cleared.