Laying claim to an entire zone?

[xTM]

This one's happened to me twice, so I figure it's worth an inquiry.

Been here about a month, give or take. Been swarming mostly since, well, mass homicide of mobs is efficient. I've been pretty strict about not pulling where folks are hunting and leaving enough stuff up for other bards to get in on the action (because there are always other bards, I think you all have at least 1 alt).

Which brings me to the question (TL;DR right here): Can a bard (or anyone AE killing, for that matter) actually claim to have an entire outside zone on camp?

Blue server if that matters (in case the rules differ on Red)

If you want to read more:

I ask this because twice now I have been told, in no uncertain terms and from two people who appear to be in high(er) end guilds, that I was encroaching on their 'camp'. 'Camp' meaning every normal speed mob in the entire zone.

Both times I ran a /who and spot checked my kill area prior to pulling (I track constantly and can tell if a zone has been pulled).

On one occasion, the guy was /anon and we appeared to start at the same time on opposite ends. No big deal; I conceded my mobs to him and went about my business only to be told by his wife about how I allegedly 'desynced' him and inconvenienced their PL session.

That irked me a bit (the oozing sense of entitlement that was present in the banter, specifically), but I chalked it up to a one time occurrence and moved on.

During the most recent incident this other guy straight up said "this is my zone, move along, you're wasting my time." To paraphrase. This particular guy said it was first come, first served to lay claim to all of BW.

Full disclosure: I was an asshole right back to him in my reply so no sympathy points are sought here. I did, however, walk away after offering up my mobs (he declined and opted to bring his own pull down on me). He logged soon after and I noticed that he didn't follow his own first come, first served policy upon relogging about an hour later.

I've gladly handed plenty of swarms over to other bards, worked out a pulling rotation, or just grouped up and shared the exp. Whatever it takes to have fun.

However, these 2 instances were a bit too similar so I felt I should ask since I'm still fairly new.

If this belongs in RnF, please relocate.

[Haloren]

This is the rule in the server PNP policy:

Zone Disruptions
Disrupting the gameplay for others in a zone is not allowed. This can include, but is not limited to:

* Monopolizing/Engaging/Occupying most or all of the mobs in a non-raid area. This can be with or without intent to kill.

Step 1: Talk to person and try to work compromise.
Step 2: Repeat step 1 until either a compromise is made or complete refusal by other party.
Step 3: Repeat step 1 then if all communication fails and player is still engaging in actual zone disruption above. Then petition for a guide to come assist you.

[Speedling]

To answer your question: no they cannot claim an entire zone.

Name and shame imo. Reputation is pretty significant here.

[Pokesan]

To answer your question: no they cannot claim an entire zone.

Name and shame imo. Reputation is pretty significant here.

[B4EQWASCOOL]

To answer your question: no they cannot claim an entire zone.

Name and shame imo. Reputation is pretty significant here.

So, where is the line? OP said that the evil bard in his story only pulled normal speed mobs. So, they left some... Is there a number they are required to leave? A%, perhaps?

Let us figure this out right meow!

[Swish]

Yikes, glad I'm not here anymore...same old entitlement, people who want to claim a zone or kite 90% of the mobs, or whatever.

[indiscriminate_hater]

You can claim all camps only if you're a bard

[jarshale]

Name and shame. There is a reason bards are universally hated.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Honestly though this is why (among other awesome reasons) everyone should have a bard on their account. Guy acts like dick, you aoe fear his shit or highsun some of his mobs while he's kiting. Game over

[webrunner5]

Bards on here are , and have been a Hot Topic. :(

You will end up being a Horse's Ass if you think you can take a whole zone. :mad:

I don't think it is sort of against the rules, Devs have sort of nixed Bards a bit, it is a Bard thingy, "Classic", but it still comes across as being a Dushbag. :eek:

Use common sense and it will work out. :cool:

[Kekephee]

I always thought it was really pathetic when I was exping in Burning Woods and some other bard would send me pissy tells being like EY WHY YOU TAKING MY MOBS THIS WHOLE ZONE BELONGS TO ME THAT'S THE RULES THIS IS ONE BARD ZONE

[maskedmelon]

Honestly though this is why (among other awesome reasons) everyone should have a bard on their account. Guy acts like dick, you aoe fear his shit or highsun some of his mobs while he's kiting. Game over

I like this suggestion.



And now, I shall be silent.... For a time....

[xTM]

To answer your question: no they cannot claim an entire zone.

Name and shame imo. Reputation is pretty significant here.

I was initially against this; perhaps he was having a bad day and I just walked in on it, y'know?

But he just came back and tried to pull the entire zone while I was mid-pull, so here it is.

To reiterate, I wasn't the most polite with him, either. This wasn't a battle of etiquette or diplomacy. The guy straight up said "this is mine, leave," and I chose to challenge that assumption before he acted a fool. I checked here to see if his claim had any merit and it appears that it does not.

Before I post the screens, if someone with some juice in <Taken> wants to PM me, maybe we can talk about this dude? The guy's being social sandpaper in zone but I'm trying to counterbalance the whole "bards are assholes," vibe that I keep getting on P99 and I feel that the nuclear option of publicly shaming him right away wouldn't help.

[Swish]

In Oasis during the last double XP weekend... (last day, 1st June)

http://imageupload.co.uk/images/2015/06/01/Untitledc22f6.png

...the guy had picked clean whatever orcs had recently respawned, crocs, wandering undead, anything except Cazel/giants/spectres :/

[indiscriminate_hater]

In Oasis during the last double XP weekend... (last day, 1st June)

http://imageupload.co.uk/images/2015/06/01/Untitledc22f6.png

...the guy had picked clean whatever orcs had recently respawned, crocs, wandering undead, anything except Cazel/giants/spectres :/

Sux bro you should try red

[Calibix]

Sux bro you should try red

The irony is not lost on me.

[Swish]

Shit like that made me move to red. Obviously this before I quit blue... never looked back :)

[Tuljin]

Anyone ready for a fresh server yet?

[maskedmelon]

To touch back on the original question of "Is it ok to monopolize zones?" as others have already indicated, no, it is not ok. You were not wrong in the least ^^

[myriverse]

Bards can claim whatever they want. Doesn't mean a damn thing. Steal their mobs.

[myriverse]

Anyone ready for a fresh server yet?
You know things won't be different on a fresh server. Right?

[Champion_Standing]

Wipe it clean, ban all bards

[myriverse]

Wipes not classic.
Bards classic.

[Mesenkomaha]

Is there any rule against pulling a mob or two out of a bard's kite?

[Nixtar]

A good bard will send a tell to the parties around the area that it is ok to peel off mobs from his/her blob of mobs. If they don't, then feel free to peel mobs as you please. You're helping them avoid the massive train chasing them. You're being a good person. A thankless task, yes, but ultimately they will surely be grateful.

[Swish]

Is there any rule against pulling a mob or two out of a bard's kite?

They'd be quite the hypocrits for trying to petition for that... unofficially I'd do it ;)

[andvarion]

The strange thing is that it isn't actually very classic. I mean it's classic in terms of mechanics, and it was doable, but it was not at all rampant. Due to the risk involved and the capability of our PCs 15 years ago, most bards employed a much safer and nearly as lucrative solo method. It was actually also called swarm kiting, but involved charming. Sadly it doesn't work on P99 due to buggy pet aggro mechanics, from what I understand.

The method we use on P99 didn't become popular and abused until Planes of Power, and it was subsequently nerfed during Legacy of Ykesha so that those aoe songs would only affect 4 mobs at a time.

All that to say, I have no complaints about the issue. It's not the bard class that is the problem. The problem is the players that abuse it at the expense of others' enjoyment. All classes have some players like that. Fortunately, they seem to be the minority.

[Mojo24]

You know things won't be different on a fresh server. Right?

This + it'll be even worse because there will be more bards doing it since all you need is a cloth tunic and vendor instruments.

[Kekephee]

Is there any rule against pulling a mob or two out of a bard's kite?

Yes, officially, but they probably won't notice. But keep in mind that bard AE kiting is not as easy as it looks and there's like a 10% chance that bard will fuck up and die and then you will have a problem on your hands from social aggro.

[Pipip]

On red many bards will invite you to their groups for the xp bonus. Instead of being hated, they're loved.

My first exposure to swarming on P99 blue was a guy monopolizing Orc centurions in Crushbone and yelling at people for attacking any of his mobs. I can see why people hate bards there. It's a shame, they're one of the most useful additions to any group.

[ECDubz]

Usually if i am PLing someone on my bard i send out an announcement before each pull as if a CC has been called and should let me know where they or their group is so i can avoid the area or leave enough mobs for atleast 2 groups so i do not interrupt their gameplay. As long as you dont inconvenience their XP gain it shouldnt be an issue.

[Swish]

Maybe the server needs red server XP added? So much PL'ing, there's obviously a demand for it.

[Shjade]

Maybe the server needs red server XP added? So much PL'ing, there's obviously a demand for it.

Except, as threads like this demonstrate, the community on blue is capable of finding ways to level without needing to have experience handed to them.

Red needs the boost because without it, hardly anyone could stand to play there (as, I believe, was demonstrated when the boost was removed, yes?).

It's almost as if the community on that server is too toxic for most people to be around without major incentives and, indeed, for many even with said incentives.

Hunh.

[Tuljin]

The Blue community fucking sucks, too.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

nerf bards

[Swish]

Except, as threads like this demonstrate, the community on blue is capable of finding ways to level without needing to have experience handed to them.

Red needs the boost because without it, hardly anyone could stand to play there (as, I believe, was demonstrated when the boost was removed, yes?).

It's almost as if the community on that server is too toxic for most people to be around without major incentives and, indeed, for many even with said incentives.

Hunh.

Lets not turn this into a thread about red server vs blue server, people get upset. I was just saying a faster XP rate could help everyone on blue to hit 60, as there's so much corner cutting where it's possible to do so.

[Calibix]

Lets not turn this into a thread about red server vs blue server, people get upset. I was just saying a faster XP rate could help everyone on blue to hit 60, as there's so much corner cutting where it's possible to do so.

90% of people getting PL's are alts of people with max level/highly-geared mains. Lets not pretend that the whole server is doing it.

[Champion_Standing]

90% of people getting PL's are alts of people with max level/highly-geared mains. Lets not pretend that the whole server is doing it.

But you just described about 90% of the playerbase, so yeah...the whole server is doing it.

[Spyder73]

Have 52 Bard and have never swarmed, not even once - Can confirm the Bard hate is alive and well. I am treated like a second class citizen when LFG in KC. I think I am going to try to learn to swarm so I can make the fat plat PLing once I get the 54 AoE Snare...You people drive Bards to swarming with the min/max/hybrid hate. Look in the mirror and you will see the true criminals.

[Lamil]

I've grouped with some great bards in KC.... Jsin, Chantuer (sp?), and Graftix. Not sure who is giving you the hate in KC as most groups I've been in are happy to have a bard.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Have 52 Bard and have never swarmed, not even once - Can confirm the Bard hate is alive and well. I am treated like a second class citizen when LFG in KC. I think I am going to try to learn to swarm so I can make the fat plat PLing once I get the 54 AoE Snare...You people drive Bards to swarming with the min/max/hybrid hate. Look in the mirror and you will see the true criminals.

They drove me to the dark side. You people with your ideas of hybrid exp justice and your notion of camps. YOU DREW FIRST BLOOD

[perditionparty]

I've grouped with some great bards in KC.... Jsin, Chantuer (sp?), and Graftix. Not sure who is giving you the hate in KC as most groups I've been in are happy to have a bard.


Ive grouped with all these people too.

Bards are great, especially when you have no enchanters available.

[Shjade]

The Blue community fucking sucks, too.

This is not inaccurate.

[DarthMartigan]

I think the "first come first serve" mindset in BW is one that you can argue against by server rules, but if you want to be a bard that swarms you should abide by it. At 56, I get 2 blue bubs or so on a pull of all of BW, so if someone else is about the same level doing the same thing it's a waste of time for both of us. A swarm of 40 mobs takes the same amount of time as 80.

I think if you are a bard in BW and want to be a decent human being, the following two things are super helpful:

1. Don't play /role or /anon. Yesterday a dude got killed trying to respond to me asking if he was swarming. I felt a little bad, but had he just owned that he was a bard pulling a zone no one would have minded. No one on this server is trying to level off hornets/skellies/apes that isn't a bard (or if they are, they aren't doing it often).

2. Respect other bards. If someone is in zone already, send them a tell asking to let you know when they leave. If you are in the zone and someone enters, politely ask them to leave. If they don't, they are terrible. Maybe send them a tell asking to go every other, but that sucks.

It sucks that the community hates us because some bards are pretty awful people, but we shouldn't treat each other (or the community) the same way back. We pull whole zones, and when the zone are empty, it's fine. We should be able to do it with some level of politeness towards each other.

[Tuljin]

Wipe it clean

[Swish]

I think the "first come first serve" mindset in BW is one that you can argue against by server rules, but if you want to be a bard that swarms you should abide by it. At 56, I get 2 blue bubs or so on a pull of all of BW, so if someone else is about the same level doing the same thing it's a waste of time for both of us. A swarm of 40 mobs takes the same amount of time as 80.

I think if you are a bard in BW and want to be a decent human being, the following two things are super helpful:

1. Don't play /role or /anon. Yesterday a dude got killed trying to respond to me asking if he was swarming. I felt a little bad, but had he just owned that he was a bard pulling a zone no one would have minded. No one on this server is trying to level off hornets/skellies/apes that isn't a bard (or if they are, they aren't doing it often).

2. Respect other bards. If someone is in zone already, send them a tell asking to let you know when they leave. If you are in the zone and someone enters, politely ask them to leave. If they don't, they are terrible. Maybe send them a tell asking to go every other, but that sucks.

It sucks that the community hates us because some bards are pretty awful people, but we shouldn't treat each other (or the community) the same way back. We pull whole zones, and when the zone are empty, it's fine. We should be able to do it with some level of politeness towards each other.

If more necros, mages, other camp classes did this at camps it would save a lot of wasted journeys and prevent you losing part of what you're camping in some instances.

[Dynheart]

After playing on this server I've noticed a few things VS actual classic:

Playing a Paladin/SK/Ranger back in the day (I remember, I played one from '99-02/03ish). Sure you were heckled, but not denied groups due to min maxing. People back then just wanted XP. Now you were denied groups if word got around that you sucked. I've seen this happen to many monks/enchanters/clerics/wizards. But because of some Hybrid XP penalty? Not a chance...and we knew even knew about even back then too.

Bards. I've never seen Bards played the way they are being played now. Pulling an entire zone and pinching away at the entire zones worth of mobs for an hour. I do remember it was quite a site to see a bard kiting 6, 7, 8 mobs. Not 30 or 40. On is not like the other here. Obviously one doesn't interfere with others like the other either. We can blame it on the tech or whatever. I believe it's the EQ's mindset nowadays. Make a toon, get to max level ASAP so you can farm for plat.

Classic had a sense of community. MMO's nowadays, that includes P99 and Live, are more about what can I solo/box. What will level me the fastest. So Paladins/SKs/Rangers are already excluded (with the few exceptions out there that really don't care). That would include the people who just roll bards because the server promotes soloing anyway...may as well solo the whole zone, eh.....all at once.

I don't know. People say MMO's aren't the same. But I feel the MMO community isn't either. That's why we have a "classic" server forcing group centric classes (Paladin/SK/Ranger) to solo because of a design flaw, and a bunch of Bards soloing to 60. I guess things will look up for the Hybrids here soon, but that still doesn't change the mindset.

[maskedmelon]

After playing on this server I've noticed a few things VS actual classic:

Playing a Paladin/SK/Ranger back in the day (I remember, I played one from '99-02/03ish). Sure you were heckled, but not denied groups due to min maxing. People back then just wanted XP. Now you were denied groups if word got around that you sucked. I've seen this happen to many monks/enchanters/clerics/wizards. But because of some Hybrid XP penalty? Not a chance...and we knew even knew about even back then too.

......

Classic had a sense of community. MMO's nowadays, that includes P99 and Live, are more about what can I solo/box. What will level me the fastest. So Paladins/SKs/Rangers are already excluded (with the few exceptions out there that really don't care). That would include the people who just roll bards because the server promotes soloing anyway...may as well solo the whole zone, eh.....all at once.



There is a place without class discrimination and a greater sense of community. Where players are invited to groups regardless of class or skill or gear and where bards invite others to join in the xp rain of their swarm kites ^^ PM me if curious. Some folks here get rustled if you discuss it openly.

[thufir]

There is a place without class discrimination and a greater sense of community. Where players are invited to groups regardless of class or skill or gear and where bards invite others to join in the xp rain of their swarm kites ^^ PM me if curious. Some folks here get rustled if you discuss it openly.

Oh come *on*.

[KylonOrina]

This + it'll be even worse because there will be more bards doing it since all you need is a cloth tunic and vendor instruments.

Who needs a cloth tunic? Go naked!

[Swish]

Oh come *on*.

He's right, some things are taboo.

[Shjade]

There is a place without class discrimination and a greater sense of community. Where players are invited to groups regardless of class or skill or gear...

Lord of the Rings Online?