Dual Wield Ranger

[ghost182]

I'm looking for some feedback on different Dual Wield set-ups for new ranger. This is my 3rd ranger and i'm just bored of the woodsman's staff (sorry!).

So I should preface this by saying I used my starting points in dex this time around, although i wish i went wisdom or stamina. Anyway I am seriously considering rolling with the Steel Hilted Flint Dagger if my dexterity is over 200 when the time comes.

I'm curious what would be a good offhand to work with that? Lupine Dagger, Fayguard Parrying Dagger (which wouldn't proc as much in the offhand, and i find the range on the aoe to be manageable in group settings), Crystalline Short sword, maybe the flux bladed axe for another proc?

I'd also consider not using the steel hilted though, and if so what would be good? Lupine/CSS?

[Lartanin63]

So are we talking about for leveling or for like the 50+?
You said new ranger then talked about conflag dagger and fayguard. When time comes at the higher end I would use the fayguard main hand and CSS or a heavy hitter weapon in off hand. Low levels a lamintation and CSS or green jade broad sword works well. The stats are a nice bonus. Lupine is a good main hand as well If you can't get into HS.

[Troxx]

Lamentations suck.

For less than half the price Jace Mace ratio is superior. Stats are cool and all, but the point of your weapons is to kill things. 9/19 isn't terrible ... but it in no way is worth the hefty price.

[fiveeauxfour]

jade mace ratio is 9/18.

that 1 delay, for some, is worth the stats

[Troxx]

It it worth the stats while being double the price?

I'll maintain that for its price its a worthless piece of garbage. You've got a ton of slots to fill where stats can be had. You've only got 2 slots for doing a melee dps's primary job. It's nearly double the price and puts out less damage. IF they were the same price, there's a case to be made that adding 1 delay makes the stats worth it.

Cheap weapons that out-perform Lammy:
Spined Dragon Claws (10/21) 300-400p
Silken Whip of Ensnaring (14/28) 300-500p <-- $$ before aggro proc at 50

SWoE is one of the most under-rated awesome bargains out there. As commented on above, after level 50 you might find yourself with unwanted aggro issues ... but prior to 50 it really is hard to beat the value.


Better weapons that aren't dirt cheap but comparable in some cases:
Wurmslayer (beats the pants off 9/19 until level 60, and even then it's basically =)
CSS
Jade mace

Heck, Sarnak skullsplitter and green jade broadsword are just barely worse and they're nearly 1/10th the price. This doesn't even account for the various 2handers out there which will outperform Lamentation (especially at low levels), but the OP stated he was looking for DW.

Avoid the lammy and spend that money elsewhere imo. It's a fine weapon, don't get me wrong, it's just not priced well. Focus of your weapon slots should be dishing out damage. Save your lammy money and invest in the rest of your gear. If you're so loaded that you don't need that money for other slots ... you're loaded enough to buy weaponry a lot better than a lamentation to begin with. If your only concern is functional fashionquest ... I do happen to like the graphic on the lamentation ... so it is good for that I guess.

[Lartanin63]

Just wondering where are you pulling these prices from? You can pick up a lammy for 1.5k and a jade mace avg price is about the same? Lamentation average is 1.6k and Jade mace is 1.4k. I'm just wondering if you have any data for the dps for the weapons. I personally don't. I have used many of the weapons I have suggested. I've used a Lammy/Green jade broadsword on both my rangers I've played. So for 2k I've had the same 2 weapons for a long period of time.

[Troxx]

jade mace I have bought and sold (at least 3x for both buy and sell) for 1k-1100 several times in the last 9 months as I've played some alts.

I have yet to see lamentation anywhere near as cheap as JM (average price closer to 2k).

As for the rest of the weapons, price tracker on wiki is mildly useful for that sort of thing.

Prices and quoted availability reflect the blue server.

http://ahungry.com/eqauctions is also a good reference for more recent sale (and buy) prices within the last 24-96 hours

[dalaimoc]

I have bought and sold 6 Lammys so far. I usually buy around 1500 and sell around 1800 - 2000.
The +6 str, +6sta +30 hp x 2 is well worth the difference to the Jade Mace.

[Thiefboy777]

Lammy has always been priced high because it looks cool, I mean if you've got money to burn two matching swords looks pretty nice.

[ghost182]

this ranger is lvl 35. I'm just using spring wood staff at the moment and will probably swap to swarm caller from 46-50. Thats where my question is about a dual wield set up. Right now I'm leaning to steel hilted main hand and fayguard offhand

[ezri]

Check out the p99 wiki on dual wield (http://wiki.project1999.com/Dual_Wield).

Summary:
1. Low delay in offhand to skill up DW quickly
2. Weapon swings are independent, off-hand is not held up by the primary weapon.
3. The off-hand does not get a damage bonus so put your best ratio weapon in your primary hand.
4. Get as lower delay on your primary weapon as possible to take advantage of more damage bonus (without sacrificing ratio)
5. To skill up 1HS/1HB/Piercing quickly, put the weapon in main hand (unstated, but obvious).

You can also check out the Game Mechanics (http://wiki.project1999.com/Game_Mechanics#Melee_Combat_and_Damage) page on the wiki if your want blood coming out of your eyeballs :)

[Itap]

Out of curiosity, why are you leveling a 3rd ranger? Get bored of them 50+ ?

[koros]

I'm looking for some feedback on different Dual Wield set-ups for new ranger. This is my 3rd ranger and i'm just bored of the woodsman's staff (sorry!).

So I should preface this by saying I used my starting points in dex this time around, although i wish i went wisdom or stamina. Anyway I am seriously considering rolling with the Steel Hilted Flint Dagger if my dexterity is over 200 when the time comes.

I'm curious what would be a good offhand to work with that? Lupine Dagger, Fayguard Parrying Dagger (which wouldn't proc as much in the offhand, and i find the range on the aoe to be manageable in group settings), Crystalline Short sword, maybe the flux bladed axe for another proc?

I'd also consider not using the steel hilted though, and if so what would be good? Lupine/CSS?

Steel Hilted will net about 20 raw dps from the proc (not counting resists) at max dex.

It will do about 40% of the melee dps of a jade mace. If jade mace does less than ~35 dps mainhand, at any point in time, you'll do more damage (with significantly higher variance) with the steel hilted. AKA it's fine as a fun weapon if your dex is there, especially pre 60.

[ghost182]

Out of curiosity, why are you leveling a 3rd ranger? Get bored of them 50+ ?

Just for fun, they'll all be 60 eventually. One for naggy/vox, and two for parking on different raids or for tracking.

Steel Hilted will net about 20 raw dps from the proc (not counting resists) at max dex.

It will do about 40% of the melee dps of a jade mace. If jade mace does less than ~35 dps mainhand, at any point in time, you'll do more damage (with significantly higher variance) with the steel hilted. AKA it's fine as a fun weapon if your dex is there, especially pre 60.

That's good information. how would you equate the proc dps in offhand?

[fennixad]

I am not 100% sure about this, but i belive Lecompete with a hilted and dex gear out dps monks and rogues on high AC mobs many times. im trying to get 200+ dex gear with my ranger and check hilted vs woods

[koros]

Just for fun, they'll all be 60 eventually. One for naggy/vox, and two for parking on different raids or for tracking.



That's good information. how would you equate the proc dps in offhand?

Halve it

[ghost182]

Was wondering about another dual wield combo. I've heard that in an ideal world we would be able to use the moss covered 1hb in MH (to apply the dmg bonus as often as possible) and a wurmslayer for offhand, great ratio. Since that's not possible would a good similar combo be the rat whip in MH (similar 1:3 ratio like the moss covered) and the green jade axe in OH (similar to wurmslayer as a high dmg better than 1:2 ratio), thoughts?

[Troxx]

Revultant whip I used on my ranger paired with swiftwind deeply into luclin.

Not many people parsed or min/max'd at the time and I never parsed it but the damage output was respectable .... very respectable on high ac mobs where your DB makes such a big chunk of your damage output.

Anyone out there parsed it compared to other more generic weapon choices?

EDIT: Found some old posts here:

"damage wise, whip is a terrible offhand... the only reason whip would be any good is at max level with main hand damage bonus and the 14 delay and still it is less dps than a lupine dagger or jade mace."

No numbers to back it up but at least some anecdotal info.

EDIT: More numbers

"So fayguard at 200 str is 4.2*9+12= 49.8 divided by rate /17 = 2.93
Revultant at 200 str is 4.2*5+12= 33/14 = 2.375
Earthcaller at 200 str is 4.2*14+12=70.8/24 = 2.95

And, of course, this doesn't really talk to how much damage you may actually do unless we are talking about a mob with zero mitigation. I have a few thousand parses but I cant tell what weapons I was using or what haste I had at the time. My head hurts."

Key there is assuming no mitigation. I'd wager it will depend a lot on your level vs what you are fighting. Your attack vs the mobs ac ... your str ...

The lower your attack, the higher the mobs ac, the higher the mobs level to yours, the lower your str ... all of these favor damage that leans heavily on applying the damage bonus end of the equation which is not mitigated at all --- and none of these can be accurately evened out in a one size fits all type of a deal. On a high level velious mob with insane ac, the revultant whip might pull ahead over newer weapons with better ratios.

From back in the day i remember it was steady, predictable, no frills damage output that was pretty respectable. On mobs with a DS though ... ouch.

[Clark]

Wurmslayer/Edge of the Nightwalker

Unless your haste is very low to none that is the best combo.

Edge of the Nightwalker/Jagged Blade of Mourning isn't too bad as well.

[Roguejm11]

jade mace I have bought and sold (at least 3x for both buy and sell) for 1k-1100 several times in the last 9 months as I've played some alts.

I have yet to see lamentation anywhere near as cheap as JM (average price closer to 2k).

As for the rest of the weapons, price tracker on wiki is mildly useful for that sort of thing.

Prices and quoted availability reflect the blue server.

http://ahungry.com/eqauctions is also a good reference for more recent sale (and buy) prices within the last 24-96 hours

I have seen several people selling Lamy's for 1500-1600 all week long. For some people that have played a long time and have already acquired a lot of PP, its not about money. To argue the difference of 400-500pp for a weapon when someone has 50k in the bank... Your argument is invalid.

[eqgmrdbz]

If you are soloing, i would stick with fast weps like Jade Mace and Lammies, you are still using the Swarmcaller to slow mob first right? But in a group with class who can haste you, i would go for higher damage Wurmy or SWoE. As for proc weps, i guess they can be fun if the proc goes off, If you are grouped with a Shammy you might consider that a better option.

[Heebo]

Try to use Swiftwind and Earthcaller.

[Wiley]

Cheap weapons that out-perform Lammy:
Spined Dragon Claws (10/21) 300-400p
Silken Whip of Ensnaring (14/28) 300-500p <-- $$ before aggro proc at 50


would this combo out perform a silver swiftblade? planning on fear kiting furry woodland creatures depending of course on if/when they do that update, which would negate worrying about fast weapons and riposte correct?