Raid Suspension: Inglorious Basterds

[Sirken]

Inglorious Basterds is under Raid Suspension From the next Class C Nagefen and the next Class C Talendor & will be suspended from Veeshan's Peak starting at 12:01am EST Monday March 16th, and ending at 12:01am EST Friday March 20th for the following violations of the following raid policy:



Stalling on Nagafen (3/1)
Stalling/Kiting Talendor, conceding the mob, then killing it anyway (3/8)
Volume of Offenses



Explanation:

First, i have told all the guilds that they will be allowed 1DA or ~18 seconds, after that, it would be considered a stall. all guilds were told that stalling would be watched for.

Second, you absolutely can not ever concede a mob, and then kill it anyway. i dont care what the reason is.

Third, Third, this is now the fifth time that IB has received a raid punishment as a guild.

[Erati]

not trying to troll but how do these suspensions affect the new "version" of IB?

do both Rampage and IB absorb the punishment bc Rampage is mostly IB or can a new guild tag make it too murky to pin these sanctions on Rampage?

the ruling on this question could open a can of worms, and Im sure other guilds are very curious ab it.

[Ella`Ella]

Suspensions have always been on all players in the violating guild at the time of the infraction.

[Erati]

Suspensions have always been on all players in the violating guild at the time of the infraction.

Thats what remembered, and I doubt Rampage will go against that for Nag/Tal or M-F VP

Pretty unique situation where a guild splits n the former full enity gets suspended the following day while the new guild belongs to neither class.

thanks for responding !

[Sirken]

if i remember correctly, this has only happened one other time, and it involved TMO using Enraptured to circumvent a raid suspension. Enraptured was created by TMO and used by TMO as an alt guild prior to the suspension coming down. I also watched TMO leadership telling members to get tagged in Enraptured to circumvent punishment, and i didn't allow it. it was literally the exact same leadership and was specifically ordered to be used to avoid punishment.

this is not the case with Rampage, and so i did not treat them that way. and as i told TMO, if they want to disband their guild to form another guild, if they want to wipe dkp, if they want to shut down the TMO website, if they install new leadership, and if they did all that without knowing that the suspension was coming (to ensure it wasnt being done to circumvent me), then id be ok with it. and that was why I told Rampage that they would not be suspended.

That said, multiple staff members have reviewed this decision, and it has been decided that these punishments will still remain with any players that were IB tagged at the time of the incident, as well as any players that are currently tagged under IB.

[Hokushin]

if i remember correctly, this has only happened one other time, and it involved TMO using Enraptured to circumvent a raid suspension. Enraptured was created by TMO and used by TMO as an alt guild prior to the suspension coming down. I also watched TMO leadership telling members to get tagged in Enraptured to circumvent punishment, and i didn't allow it. it was literally the exact same leadership and was specifically ordered to be used to avoid punishment.

this is not the case with Rampage, and so i did not treat them that way. and as i told TMO, if they want to disband their guild to form another guild, if they want to wipe dkp, if they want to shut down the TMO website, if they install new leadership, and if they did all that without knowing that the suspension was coming (to ensure it wasnt being done to circumvent me), then id be ok with it. and that was why I told Rampage that they would not be suspended.

That said, multiple staff members have reviewed this decision, and it has been decided that these punishments will still remain with any players that were IB tagged at the time of the incident, as well as any players that are currently tagged under IB.



Thank you for letting us know of this update. Since we were informed differently prior to this post, any former IB will be forfeiting next Nexona to spawn. Hopefully this will clear up any complications regarding this matter.

[Ella`Ella]

Thank you for letting us know of this update. Since we were informed differently prior to this post, any former IB will be forfeiting next Nexona to spawn. Hopefully this will clear up any complications regarding this matter.

We will not be accepting a forfeiture of the next Nexona. The well known policy is that all players tagged under a guild during a violation carry that suspension with them regardless of guild tag. This was directly violated by a guild whose leadership is 8/12 former IB that were subject to the suspension. Rampage, although not previously responsible for the infractions in whole, is now responsible for not managing the behavior of the majority of its member base.

http://i.imgur.com/DKpIXGr.png

We will also not be accepting a forfeiture of Nagafen that these same members assembled to claim FTE on.

[Hokushin]

Two completely different circumstances. New guild formed before a suspension vs making a guild after a suspension in order to cheat the system. Rampage was informed by staff that the suspension did not affect us. It wasn't until after Nexona we were informed differently, so if you are refusing our concession then you are only making the staffs job harder.

[Ella`Ella]

I agree that Rampage members that were not a part of Inglourious Basterds during the violations/suspensions should have been allowed to raid. However, the majority of their players and the raid leaders of these encounters were under raid suspensions from their engagements as Inglourious Basterds.

Players like Raev and Cucumbers had nothing to do with Inglourious Basterds, thus they should have and were free to raid whatever content they want. However, none of the legacy IB members should have participated and it was a conscious decision by your new leadership in Rampage to go ahead and participate anyways, putting you in violation of observing your raid suspension for Nagafen and Nexona. Also, there are still petitions pending against Inglourious Basterds, which have not been resolved yet.

As 2/3rds of Rampage leadership and 75% of rampage membership is Inglourious Basterds, leadership should be held responsible for the actions of their guild and a collective max suspension should be served for knowingly violating policy and further for manipulating the situation to try and circumvent. These actions are truly in poor spirit in observance of the game and the rules we have in place.

Some additional facts to consider when stating that Rampage is a totally new guild;

-The website is the same IB website, predating back to Transatlantic Rampage
-Both guilds are also keeping independent spreadsheets of archived DKP for loot distribution awards
-Majority of leadership (2/3) is IB Legacy
-75%+ Membership is IB Legacy
-Guild Leader of Rampage is IB Legacy Guild Leader
-IB members and leadership still had alts tagged in IB during the suspension where they raided as Rampage

[Hokushin]

I agree that Rampage members that were not a part of Inglourious Basterds during the violations/suspensions should have been allowed to raid. However, the majority of their players and the raid leaders of these encounters were under raid suspensions from their engagements as Inglourious Basterds.

Players like Raev and Cucumbers had nothing to do with Inglourious Basterds, thus they should have and were free to raid whatever content they want. However, none of the legacy IB members should have participated and it was a conscious decision by your new leadership in Rampage to go ahead and participate anyways, putting you in violation of observing your raid suspension for Nagafen and Nexona. Also, there are still petitions pending against Inglourious Basterds, which have not been resolved yet.

As 2/3rds of Rampage leadership and 75% of rampage membership is Inglourious Basterds, leadership should be held responsible for the actions of their guild and a collective max suspension should be served for knowingly violating policy and further for manipulating the situation to try and circumvent. These actions are truly in poor spirit in observance of the game and the rules we have in place.

Some additional facts to consider when stating that Rampage is a totally new guild;

-The website is the same IB website, predating back to Transatlantic Rampage
-Both guilds are also keeping independent spreadsheets of archived DKP for loot distribution awards
-Majority of leadership (2/3) is IB Legacy
-75%+ Membership is IB Legacy
-Guild Leader of Rampage is IB Legacy Guild Leader
-IB members and leadership still had alts tagged in IB during the suspension where they raided as Rampage


When Dan joined TMO recently during an IB suspension and killed 6 Dragons under the TMO tag, does this mean TMO should be suspended?

[Ella`Ella]

Had TMO leadership not gone to staff to immediately alert them that a (former) member of ours was in violation of policy, then absolutely we should have been suspended - providing you petitioned within the 7-day statue of limitations.

However, here at TMO we value integrity on this server and connected with staff to remedy the situation immediately. Our leadership took all the necessary measures to ensure that we will not tolerate players breaking the spirit of the rules or the observance of them. Herein is the difference, as Rampage leadership tried to conceal their violation of policy and manipulate a unique situation to circumvent the standards that all players are held to.

http://i.imgur.com/uqWK9kd.png

Sorry, Dannyl - nothing personal.

[Hokushin]

Unfortunately, <Rampage> was told we were not suspended, as were you told the same thing.

http://i.imgur.com/dNSCdbh.png


Similar to last years suspension of the A-Team when they were told something was OK by Sirken, but then Rogean said it was not. Which resulted in the suspension being Repealed.

http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139810



Offering you next Nexona was not because we are guilty of doing anything intentionally wrong, but because we Value integrity just like you. If you do not accept it, then I hope you at least stop wasting our server staffs time with frivolous petitions.

[Ella`Ella]

I'm just curious where integrity, or the value thereof, comes into play. For violating a suspension or for kiting Nexona towards Hoshkar?