Inquiry: Leaderboard Points

[quido]

I'd like to know how you guys think points on the leaderboard should function. Basically, how should it be different than it is now? Assume the board has access to what level the people are.

I have an idea of how I'd like to see it, but I'm curious to see what you people think without the ideas being fettered by ideas of my own.

Right now: people are worth 5 points base. Every time a person is killed in PvP, their killer steals 10% of their points. Penalties for people who have died recently.

Example change: All people level 55 or less start out worth 1/10 the points of people in range to 60 PvP. People with no kills are further penalized an additional 66%, and people with 1-2 kills are penalized an additional 33%.

What do you guys think is the right way to do it?

[Bodybagger]

kill value based on number of players you have killed. essentially a bounty. Players under a certain level and under a certain # of kills worth 0 points, to discourage griefers topping leaderboards, but allow people to continue griefing if they are just huge nolife hacks who can't cut it on their mains... added benefit of making hunting twinked griefers very lucrative point wise as they have lots of kills

Also, have a multiplier in play for K:D ratio, so uncontested twinks are really worth a lot more, than say, people who actively pvp and will have more normalized KDR's.

My personal ideas on how to make positive changes and make leaderboard more oriented towards more pvp for server.

[Ragnaros]

Idk im just sick of killing 30 people and they are all worth jack shot but when someone who has an ass load of points dies they get mad points, i think that promotes only pvping with a zerg and is just a retarded system....some people in vp loot are literally worth.0 points, i think a kil should.give you a base amount no matter what they are ranked

[Doors]

People under a certain level shouldn't be worth anything. This would really discourage low level CB and MM twinks.

[Doors]

Current model supports twink griefing pretty heavily. Level 10 everyone's worth .50 if you haven't died yet. That's a ton of points considering most people I kill at level 60 are worth .10 or less.

Maybe do the point system based on level brackets with it increasing based on current kill streak.

[Pseudechis]

A function of KDR and level IMO. Killing a 60 even with a horrible KDR should always be worth more than a level 10.

This will push the low level twinks right down the leader board and encourage pvp at level 60. Functioning KDR in means griefing folks is less lucrative than hunting big targets.

Lose 10% of points when you die.

Maybe everyone starts on 0 and if you kill someone you get their level in points multiplied by their KDR?

[Swish]

Add points per "pras" in the following 10-15 seconds after the kill (limit 1 point per character)

[Milton]

Add points per "pras" in the following 10-15 seconds after the kill (limit 1 point per character)

Move to resolved

[pgerman]

needs different brackets based on level imo

56+ would be the main bracket, or just make a main bracket specifically for the level 60s

leaderboards in EQ are flawed in so many ways tho considering all the different variables like level, class, group pvp, solo pvp, etc.

i would prefer just a YT tracker without stats

also a global /ooc tracker system

basically would like to make his shit zerg guild appear better than it is

[daasgoot]

Add points per "pras" in the following 10-15 seconds after the kill (limit 1 point per character)


Move to resolved

[gobletsmashing]

I think zones should have a modifier too ... you should get more points for killing someone in... say Plane of Hate ... than you should in Rivervale, Crushbone, etc... that would prevent more imawizards from griefing lowbies

[heartbrand]

basically would like to make his shit zerg guild appear better than it is

Says guy who ran Zerg guild in classic that merged into nihilum

[Cappa]

would like to shed my haterslay and blasty kills from level alongtimeago. definitly think it should move to brackets

[Pseudechis]

I think zones should have a modifier too ... you should get more points for killing someone in... say Plane of Hate ... than you should in Rivervale, Crushbone, etc... that would prevent more imawizards from griefing lowbies

If points are a function of level and the KDR of the victim and you start at 0-0 then most noob kills will give 0 points. A level 60 kill even on someone with a KDR of 0.1 will still give 6 points ( maybe 6 points could be the floor)and a kill on a 60 like deluxe will give a shit ton of points. I've over simplified the algorithm you could put a modifier on the back to bring the number of points down or something but regardless you will not have twinks at the top of the leader board no matter how many kills they get and nor should you because even the worst 60 kill will be worth more than most noob grief kills if you made the floor 0.1* level

[gobletsmashing]

If points are a function of level and the KDR of the victim and you start at 0-0 then most noob kills will give 0 points. A level 60 kill even on someone with a KDR of 0.1 will still give 6 points ( maybe 6 points could be the floor)and a kill on a 60 like deluxe will give a shit ton of points. I've over simplified the algorithm you could put a modifier on the back to bring the number of points down or something but regardless you will not have twinks at the top of the leader board no matter how many kills they get and nor should you because even the worst 60 kill will be worth more than most noob grief kills if you made the floor 0.1* level

Still might be fun to have a zone modifier -- give the better zones better points, more encouraging pvp in dungeons etc over towns or newb zones etc

[Milton]

A kill is a kill

[Pseudechis]

Still might be fun to have a zone modifier -- give the better zones better points, more encouraging pvp in dungeons etc over towns or newb zones etc

Agree but shouldn't be exponential. Either way the goal of the leader board should be to encourage pvp and eliminate the twinks dominating the top 100

[pgerman]

Says guy who ran Zerg guild in classic that merged into nihilum

not the guy you think i am bud

[Ragnaros]

new season jesus christ

[Crazycloud]

On SZ the higher level you were the more points you were worth.

[Bodybagger]

Your worth should be based upon your PVP worthiness. You PVP worthiness is based on your ability to kill other players. So again, as per my first response, system that makes you valuable only once you're achieved a certain number of kills or after a certain level, I.E. players under lvl 30 are worth 0 points unless they have 10 kills to their name, so you have to earn your way onto the leaderboard by killing other PK's or get to lvl 45+ or something where people default to having a base value no matter what, and then a bonus value based on K/D ratio and/or total kills.

Again, encourages the hell out of PVP, and makes PVP against PVP'ers worth more than PVP against random people trying to level up

[Samsung]

Make a 56-60 Leaderboard. Just record all YTs but don't count them unless they are 56+

[HippoNipple]

How do you know who is 56+ without GM assistance?

[quido]

For the sake of argument, let's just assume I do. New season isn't coming without level data.

[Guido]

def time for new season tho

[Bodybagger]

I'd be okay with a 56+ only leaderboard as well, as it eliminates drive for lower level pvp entirely, but also sad because I like low level pvp, I just want griefing less incentivized and legitimate pvp encouraged, which that system does nothing to accomplish or encourage.

[Pikrib]

For the sake of argument, let's just assume I do. New season isn't coming without level data.

Remove the lvl 9 pvp. Being able to YT someone and not be YT'ed yourself is super lame. I would prefer a level based system, the higher your level the more points you are worth. A lower level killing a higher level should result in a higher percent taken.

[Pseudechis]

Remove the lvl 9 pvp. Being able to YT someone and not be YT'ed yourself is super lame. I would prefer a level based system, the higher your level the more points you are worth. A lower level killing a higher level should result in a higher percent taken.

This needs Sirken to change though. Totally agreed with it though.

[fred schnarf]

Idk im just sick of killing 30 people and they are all worth jack shot but when someone who has an ass load of points dies they get mad points, i think that promotes only pvping with a zerg and is just a retarded system....some people in vp loot are literally worth.0 points, i think a kil should.give you a base amount no matter what they are ranked

this makes alot of sense if points or pvp even mattered, but it dont, yellow text should be removed as should this leaderboard

it has no place in eq

[erog84]

The reason the twinks get so high on leaderboard is because they kill so many people. Not their fault most high levels are scared of pvp. To even it out some though people should never start with points. They only get points as they kill other players

[Pumpkinlatte]

People under a certain level shouldn't be worth anything. This would really discourage low level CB and MM twinks.

Agreed. The leaderboard only promotes scummy play by people focused on their leaderboard points, and has probably hurt the server more than it has helped.

[Bodybagger]

The reason the twinks get so high on leaderboard is because they kill so many people. Not their fault most high levels are scared of pvp. To even it out some though people should never start with points. They only get points as they kill other players

As stated, this removes twink griefers from leaderboard. Start with 0 points unless you're over lvl 50, then you're automatically worth a point. Get points killing other players, so griefers get no points killing harmless cloth newbs who haven't killed anyone but get big points killing other twinks who kill and grief lots of newbs.

And 50+ you're worth points as are all bets are off. I would imagine coding already exists to verify player level under 52 for nag/vox type encounters, I don't know if that could easily be crossed over to YT for point spurposes, or if its easy enough for them to code in whatever arbitrary level is selected in order to encourage healthy PVP on PVP server.

[Tassador]

I got 90 mana and 2 anon players in zone unconfirmed levels.... Fades away!

[laowllol]

The leaderboard only promotes scummy play by people focused on their leaderboard points, and has probably hurt the server more than it has helped.

These players are going to be scumbags whether there are points involved or not.

With a little intelligence you can use the leaderboard to determine who deserves the ranking and who does not. Its a useful tool in this way.

Example:

http://r99pvp.com/showplayer.php?p=Imawizard&ks=1

Just omit this character in your mind and count rank two starting at the next non-low-lvl-twink.

[Ragnaros]

all I know is that im sick of killing idiots worth 0.05 points jesus fuck

[Doors]

ragnaros was worth 0.05 points until he farmed mrbigs

[mdjenkins]

I support any method of calculating a leaderboard that allows me to sell my points to those that care about such things.

[quido]

he also can't spell "moran"

[Ragnaros]

ragnaros was worth 0.05 points until he farmed mrbigs

prove it? where are the leaderboard logs?
thought so nerd, go back to scrubbing your "girlfriends" feet

[gobletsmashing]

I'm not sure if this has already been suggested (and I know you've already thought of this), but just throwing it on the discussion. Need to code this so you can easily cut / paste to forums, etc.

[Amplitude]

prove it? where are the leaderboard logs?
thought so nerd, go back to scrubbing your "girlfriends" feet

lol

[Smedy]

prove it? where are the leaderboard logs?
thought so nerd, go back to scrubbing your "girlfriends" feet

actually lol'd

well played young padawan

[gobletsmashing]

If the goal here is to show what pvp skill a person has - another modifier that could exist is negative modifiers for uni-camping. I've played other games where this happened. I'll give an example - If someone kills X times in the same zone consecutively, starting with the 11th you start to get a negative percentage of points. Again, a kill is a kill, but if the leaderboard wants to reflect the true pvp skill, this would help. This way 'griefers' who want to wall-camp in CoM wont show up so high on the leaderboard.

http://i.imgur.com/zuMRNxw.png?1

[Kergan]

Sorry to bump this but wanted to get my 2 cents in and it was posted while I was on vacation.

Use a EQ2 style system. Basically at some threshold you "level up" in PVP in to one of 5 tiers or so. In EQ2 you got titles representing your level, there were 10:

Hunter
Slayer
Destroyer
Champion
Dreadnaught
General
Master
Overseer
Overlord
Warlord

Basically the way it worked is you get a point modifier (both how many points are lost by the victim and how many gained by the victor) based on how far above or below the person was from you in the 10 level system. So an Overlord killing a Hunter would be worth nothing, a Destroyer killing a Hunter would be worth 25% or something of max, a Champion killing an Overseer might be worth 200%, etc.

The system basically ensures that farming new/bad players is next to worthless and if you want to move up the leaderboard you must engage targets of roughly equal or greater points. In this style system you wouldn't even need to worry about character level as the newb farmers would quickly rank themselves out of getting any points from farming those zones and stagnate around the 3rd or 4th tier.

Just my thoughts.

[BarackObooma]

Neat system Kergan

[BardPop]

Repeat kills zero out quick goblet. If you can code the leaderboard by level that would be great, but how is that even possible? My best idea was to it by zone, ie people killed in low level dungeons would give less then those killed in high level dungeons, non dungeons would remain .5 except city zones that contained a starting area could possibly be a low mod.

Edit, this is a good idea

"you got titles representing your level, there were 10:"

Hunter
Slayer
Destroyer
Champion
Dreadnaught
General
Master
Overseer
Overlord
Warlord
If we don't implement the title idea to stop people from getting points from killing lowbies, we should implement it just for fun even if high titles still get points low lv titles. Would have to make it a part of the Yt of course, soandso [Overlord] kills soandso [Deadnaught] etc. Would just be a cool way of letting server know who the high titles were and how the competition was

[Biaxil]

Repeat kills zero out quick goblet. If you can code the leaderboard by level that would be great, but how is that even possible? My best idea was to it by zone, ie people killed in low level dungeons would give less then those killed in high level dungeons, non dungeons would remain .5 except city zones that contained a starting area could possibly be a low mod.

Edit, this is a good idea

"you got titles representing your level, there were 10:"

Hunter
Slayer
Destroyer
Champion
Dreadnaught
General
Master
Overseer
Overlord
Warlord
If we don't implement the title idea to stop people from getting points from killing lowbies, we should implement it just for fun even if high titles still get points low lv titles. Would have to make it a part of the Yt of course, soandso [Overlord] kills soandso [Deadnaught] etc. Would just be a cool way of letting server know who the high titles were and how the competition was
This sounds like a good idea, but what happened on nagafen server in eq2, was when someone got a high title, they stopped pvping. Many became title huggers and wouldn't pvp unless it was a sure win.

[Rangerest]

That happens here already

[BardPop]

Well the ranking system is already in place on r99pvp.com, and in my experience most of the top guys all seem to play

[Kergan]

This sounds like a good idea, but what happened on nagafen server in eq2, was when someone got a high title, they stopped pvping. Many became title huggers and wouldn't pvp unless it was a sure win.

Same server I played on, and I somewhat agree. But that was mostly at the beginning because they hard capped the amount of people at the upper tiers. Eventually they made it so dying wasn't as big of a penalty as the benefit of killing and you could eventually earn the top ranks over time.

[Krickets]

This is at its heart is a group and raid game. The point of a pvp server in my opinion is to have groups and raids contest named spawns or camps. End the global kill text and provide level 60 raid targets announced in global text when they die and when they respawn (I'm talking about major spawns like Trak etc). Give a one hour heads up on spawns in global text so all guilds know where to be if they want to contest.

End the kill text because it encourages leaderboard whores to roll a rogue,wizard or shaman, or worse, some decked out twink who has next to no chance of death. Well played clerics, chanters, and other support will not be in the back seat since they rarely get global kill text.

Group versus solo ganking, naked kills, ambushes on people engaged in pve at low health, none of this is pvp it's another form of griefing.

To be clear, i'm not suggesting any of the above should be outlawed, just no more global text for guys seeking /ooc pras from idiots.

I know it's not classic, and frankly I don't care, but group pvp around named highly contested spawns seems to be the funnest pvp I have engaged in. I'm sure there is something exhilarating about hanging around teleportation rings fully buffed and ready to go for the gank, but this doens't need to be celebrated by global kill text. Provide a /who all guild function that lets the server know all the named kills a particular guild has downed in the last week for clarity on whose "winning".

In my experience the server will know through word of mouth who the best pvpers are, not a leaderboard that can't discern the context of the kill, ie twinks, group gang bangs vs. solo. etc.

The caveat to this is if you want to keep global text, make it only apply to guild leaders and officers. The assumption being their in the best position to mobilize a competing group and will have a high value placed on them in pvp due to the yellow text.

Just some thoughts.

[Formshifter]

get rid of the leaderboard and let the YT do the talking. might get rid of some of the twink fire giants like Iool farming lowbie kills

[fred schnarf]

leaderboard is privately hosted and the only way to get rid of it is to get rid of yellow text

which has no place in eq anyway