Value of classes on red vs blue

[Mirana]

Hey all,

Considering rolling here but I'm on the fence as to what character to make. I was hoping someone could enlighten me about which classes are more/less viable than on blue due to pvp.

For instance, enchanters are gods on blue. However, are they less useful on red due to difficulty landing spells on players through massive MR? Rogues are top tier melee damage on blue, but are they less useful here due to an abundance of crowd control etc? Hybrids are less played on blue due to the exp penalty, but are they more valuable here due to the versatility that they bring (Pally chain stuns, lay on hands, ranger tracking, etc).

Just wondering those sorts of questions, would appreciate some input. For anyone that enjoys making lists, a tier list discussion would be interesting :)

[Ando]

Wizards are considered kings of pvp due to burst, which is a big turnaround from blue.

Also no one cares about hybrid exp penalty due to group exp bonus so SKs and Pallys are a lot more common, with SKs being better in pvp due to higher damage and HT.

[MavstabYoudead]

every class has it's value. enchanters and rogues are both top pvp classes. comes down to playing what you like though.

if you want to be a high melee dps but have more versatility and survivability monk may be a good option.

if you want to be a caster type wizard will get you a lot of kills and you have the ability to get away pretty quick. enchanters are going to be targeted pretty early in pvp encounters but if you stay alive you make a huge difference for your squad.

[PVP Cleric]

In reading posts like this on the forums when picking a class for red, I got the impression that things don't change a whole lot from blue to red. Clerics, enchanters, rogues, bards, they're all still the classes everyone wants for PVE and PVP both. Classes that sometimes get shunned on blue are more accepted here, like hybrids, and especially druids and wizards, but they still don't seem like they're overall amazing like those first few I listed.

That's my noob red opinion anyway.

[Infectious]

Play what you want. Every class has pros and cons. Some classes do the killing(rogue,monk,wiz) other classes play support(enc, shm, bard). There is no right answer though. Pvp 1 vs 1, 3 vs 3, group, outdoors.... There are so many factors.

[Bodybagger]

There is an important scale that comes into play on red99.... because of how PVP works in EQ... and it's one I've been wanting to make a thread about and discuss further with people but we can start here since you asked. You have X being survivability, and Y being killing power... but where does each class fall on here?

A Cleric, Paladin, and Bard, can all be very hard to kill (assuming outdoors on bard) but don't possess huge killing power. A Wizard (to an extent mage as well I suppose) or rogue has big killing power but less survivability when targeted... etc. etc.

I'd love to see a detailed graph where people rank each of the 14 playable classes on each scale, perhaps with a third and final scale for utility/versatility, and plot them out. This would more accurately represent a character selection for most people based on play style, when coming to red, because PVP really will alter what classes you enjoy playing compared to blue a lot of times.

[Mirana]

Appreciate all the responses.

I'm less concerned about "playing the best class" and moreso just want to understand key differences between red and blue as it relates to class value. I'm not really a min/maxer (in fact, I tend to take the road less traveled), I'm really just curious about variances in class perception between the two servers.

As I was posting this, Bodybagger posted above me, and this sentence is kind of what I'm driving at "PVP really will alter what classes you enjoy playing compared to blue a lot of times."

[MavstabYoudead]

if you don't have the plat over here to twink out a melee class roll a caster.

[gobletsmashing]

A lot of it is gear dependant too, obviously, so play what you like - everything is good at high enough level and good enough gear

[Bodybagger]

Give you an example.... Playing a healer class here vs a caster.... you can essentially heal til they OOM, as nukes aren't as efficient as heals generally. Running OOM 1 nuke away from scoring a kill sucks when all you can do is cast to kill. So in that sense a pure caster can be hell form some people unless you are more or less always prepared with FM for attacks.

Versatility is biggest factor for me I think though, and gear dependency, as being new to server you won't have it, so some classes are worthless without it. I enjoyed shaman on blue, but I love shaman on red. I love mage on blue but barely enjoy it on red as it has NO versatility... pet classes are tough as you have to gate away if you get caught with your pants down low mana or something, though that's most any caster class... gate or plug... really that's everyone I suppose... but I don't plug.

I love rogue but pvp don't enjoy them all that much... everyone can see invis which ruins my favorite part of being a rogue. It's just jousting for backstabs *Shrug*

Gearing characters is hugely different coming to red though. Items that had almost no value before are incredibly expensive, and vcie verca, because of resists. All lsots you go for resists > all else, and then othe rstats good for oyu like int/wis or stam/str are considered a bonus after haha

[Sear]

pulling from live experience moreso than this server, but I'll bite as someone who played both blue and red:


All of the hybrid classes (except maybe Ranger) seem better tolerated on Red and more common. SK especially is one of the stronger pvp classes, whereas on blue no one gives a fuck about them and they sit LFG in EC for eight hours.

People like bards on blue, but I'd say they're even more important on red especially for mass pvp.

Necros might be slightly more valuable on red. Mages less so. I cannot remember how important wizards are on blue, but they are solid on a red server especially 1v1 pvp. Enchanters are not any less valuable on red than blue. They are great here - especially while tashan/debuff lines remain broken.

Comparable to blue where players will only want a cleric, the other two priest classes have bigger roles on red. Shamans are broken (overpowered) right now in any pvp situation.

Monks have a bit more value on red, whereas on blue the non-pulling monk just functions as inferior-to-rogue dps. Warriors are strong in pvp but not as valuable as they are on a blue server. Rogues are in the same boat.

[gobletsmashing]

This is my idea of a quick look at it

Demand / PvP / PvE

Casters

Enchanter - Med / Low / High
Magician - High / Med / High
Necromancer - High / Med / Low
Wizard - Med / High / Med

Priests

Cleric - High / Low / High
Druid - Low / High / Med
Shaman - Med / High / High

Melee

Monk - Low / High / Med
Rogue - Low / High / High
Bard - High / Low / Med
Ranger - Med / High / Med

Tanks

Warrior - High / High / High
Paladin - Low / Med / Low
Shadow Knight - Low / High / High

[Bodybagger]

I made a new thread more to the effect of what I was interested in feedback from everyone on. We don't need any new info on how classes pve, I don't think any brand new to EQ players are joining p99 red lol.

Didn't mean to derail this one if I did. Hoping to see people expand on it in a helpful way for getting new PVP oriented players having a good time killing one another on red99

[iiNGloriouS]

If you don't make a ranger and get a Windstriker; based on your forum name, I will be extremely disappointed.

[Infectious]

This is my idea of a quick look at it

Demand / PvP / PvE

Casters

Enchanter - High
Magician - Low
Necromancer - Low
Wizard - High

Priests

Cleric - Low
Druid - Med
Shaman - High

Melee

Monk - High
Rogue - High
Bard - High
Ranger - Low

Tanks

Warrior - Med
Paladin - Low
Shadow Knight - Med
Fixed that for you. That is strictly grading pvp.

[Malone88]

Most melees (except Bard) are tough to start with because they need to be geared.

Druids/Wizards are great to start with because of burst damage/mobility.
Druids additionally get Track, Buffs, and Heals which make them very tough
to kill 1v1 if played well.

Shamans/Enchanters got a boost recently because of resist code change. With
Tash/Malo, they can land alot more spells that previously were resisted by
players with good MR gear, like roots and mezzes.

My $0.02

[HippoNipple]

This is my idea of a quick look at it

Demand / PvP / PvE

Casters

Enchanter - Med / Low / High
Magician - High / Med / High
Necromancer - High / Med / Low
Wizard - Med / High / Med

Priests

Cleric - High / Low / High
Druid - Low / High / Med
Shaman - Med / High / High

Melee

Monk - Low / High / Med
Rogue - Low / High / High
Bard - High / Low / Med
Ranger - Med / High / Med

Tanks

Warrior - High / High / High
Paladin - Low / Med / Low
Shadow Knight - Low / High / High

If these were randomly mixed up they would have a better chance of being accurate.

[gobletsmashing]

If these were randomly mixed up they would have a better chance of being accurate.

LOL - well at least we got a discussion going - Id be interested in seeing the new post bodybagger made.

[Mirana]

Well I'm glad I got some interesting conversation going, I wasn't sure what to expect :)

Thank you all for your feedback, helped a lot!