Group EXP distribution online tool

[r00t]

This online tool allows you to input the people in your group and will tell you how evenly the EXP distribution of the group is.

http://rantsandflames.com/xpcalc/

I made this tool a year or 2 ago but haven't had it hosted in awhile. I got the idea from a Java tool made by Wiseto, but made it more convenient by putting it online.

I hope you find it useful.

[Scrubosaur]

Man, those hybrids are greedy mofo's

[Sidelle]

This is pretty nifty. Thanks for sharing.

[Doors]

Calculator dumb I just do math on paper.

[Shannacore]

I DID NOT SEE THAT COMING

GOOSEBUMPS

?

[tristantio]

Sure the math is on? (Or maybe needs the hardcoded limits on grouping)

I can put in a 57 iksar necromancer with a level 9 barbarian warrior and it says the barb will receive xp.

[drktmplr12]

for creating and hosting this:

http://i.imgur.com/eoDJmFb.jpg

Sure the math is on? (Or maybe needs the hardcoded limits on grouping)

I can put in a 57 iksar necromancer with a level 9 barbarian warrior and it says the barb will receive xp.

i expected trist to show up saying something to this effect.

here are the results of my group last week... really abysmal #s:

http://i.imgur.com/Ix2mrsZ.png

[August]

Sure the math is on? (Or maybe needs the hardcoded limits on grouping)

I can put in a 57 iksar necromancer with a level 9 barbarian warrior and it says the barb will receive xp.

View source and click the .js embedded. You can see there is no level range check invoked at all, although would be trivial to implement.

Basically, it's total exp earned thus far (calculated by race, class, and level) for each player, and then it's that exp / sum(exp) for everyone in the group.

There is no check for race/class combo either (gnome monk is a distinct possibility!).

It is coded for best case scenario and nothing more. Fine for a tool of this sort, IMO.

[tristantio]

i expected trist to show up saying something to this effect

Haha, also your copyright is outdated :p

[Skittlez]

Thought bards would have taken more XP. Hmm, the more you know.

[Velerin]

One thing I realized as a mage if I add a low level guy (can pretty much just be afk or buff here and there) and get more exp per kill than if I solo with pet taking >50% of hp (pretty much always as a mage). Nice alternative to having to kill your pet every fight.

i.e. add someone much lower than you but still gets exp. You essentially give them free exp while you're getting close to full exp w/o killing pet

[r00t]

Yea right now you can put whatever input you want into it, as data sanitation isn't really necessary. "It is coded for best case scenario and nothing more. Fine for a tool of this sort, IMO."

However I will create a patch for the level check code either tonight or tomorrow. It could be convenient for lower levels to see if adding someone to their group will cause someone not to get exp.

[r00t]

Fixes
--------------------
* Added the level range checks
* Added individual reset buttons
* You can now only select valid race/class combos which makes picking easier

New version still hosted at: http://rantsandflames.com/xpcalc/

[bubur]

So if I play a troll/sk and my friend plays a halfling/rogue will we level at the same rate if we are always in a group?

I always knew the hybrids shared the penalty in a group, but does that apply to race as well?

Relevant to my current interests.

[Ciroco]

This calculator assumes that all group members obtain the same percentage of exp per kill, regardless of total experience. It makes sense based on the way the wiki describes group experience distribution, but go group with a wide range of levels/classes and you'll see that that's not true.

[Ahldagor]

Fixes
--------------------
* Added the level range checks
* Added individual reset buttons
* You can now only select valid race/class combos which makes picking easier

New version still hosted at: http://rantsandflames.com/xpcalc/

nice

[drktmplr12]

So if I play a troll/sk and my friend plays a halfling/rogue will we level at the same rate if we are always in a group?

Yes, until the velious patch that removes hybrid penalties. Race penalties will stay and they will not be shared.

[r00t]

This calculator assumes that all group members obtain the same percentage of exp per kill, regardless of total experience. It makes sense based on the way the wiki describes group experience distribution, but go group with a wide range of levels/classes and you'll see that that's not true.

I think that is perception bias, and the wiki is accurate, based on my own experience.

Take for example when Pimento and I levelled up together. We were a barbarian shaman and a human paladin. As a barbarian, I had a 5% exp penalty, and as a paladin, she had a 40% exp penalty. Our base xp for a level 1 is 1000 XP to level. So I needed 1050XP and she needed 1400XP. In order for us to stay the same level as we grouped together without me out levelling her, she would need a bigger split of every mob we kill: 1400/(1050+1400)=57.1% to my 1050/(1050+1400)=42.9%. The calculator reflects this.

[Shannacore]

good job bab

[Ciroco]

I think that is perception bias, and the wiki is accurate, based on my own experience.

Take for example when Pimento and I levelled up together. We were a barbarian shaman and a human paladin. As a barbarian, I had a 5% exp penalty, and as a paladin, she had a 40% exp penalty. Our base xp for a level 1 is 1000 XP to level. So I needed 1050XP and she needed 1400XP. In order for us to stay the same level as we grouped together without me out levelling her, she would need a bigger split of every mob we kill: 1400/(1050+1400)=57.1% to my 1050/(1050+1400)=42.9%. The calculator reflects this.

Yeah, I have heard similar things from people who level together. I think the issue comes in with level differences. This is easy to test; go have a level 59 duo with a level 40.

[August]

This calculator assumes that all group members obtain the same percentage of exp per kill, regardless of total experience. It makes sense based on the way the wiki describes group experience distribution, but go group with a wide range of levels/classes and you'll see that that's not true.

Calculator is not broken, it is just displaying bad (well, misleading) information. The 'XP to Level' field is showing TOTAL experience needed to get to that level, as in, if you started from level 1 - not how much experience is needed, in this level, to level.

Let's take your example of a 40 and a 59. Let's choose something neutral - HUMAN WARRIOR.

First off, plug in the numbers:

40 HUMAN WARRIOR = 13.9% = EXP TO LEVEL = 74880000
59 HUMAN WARRIOR = 86.1% = EXP TO LEVEL = 462102750

Now, remember, that number is actually the TOTAL exp you'd have. To find out the actual number, tone the levels down on the tool to 39 and 58, to find the starting point:

39 HUMAN WARRIOR = EXP TO LEVEL = 64064520
58 HUMAN WARRIOR = EXP TO LEVEL = 403881840

So, Experience NEEDED to level:

40 WARRIOR = 74880000 - 62064520 = 10,815,480
59 WARRIOR = 462102750 - 403881840 = 58,220,920

So now let's make up an imaginary mob. Let's say the mob awards 1 million exp when it dies.

59 Warrior = 1,000,000*.861 = 861,000 exp
40 Warrior = 1,000,000*.139 = 139,000 exp

Mobs needed to level:

59 Warrior = 58,220,920 / 861,000 = 67.62 mobs to level
40 Warrior = 10,815,480 / 139,000 = 77.80 mobs to level

Clearly, each is not getting the same amount of experience. BTW, this was with two classes in a HELL level, which is why they're so close, actually. Change the 40 warrior to a 41 warrior and watch:

41 WARRIOR = 80637570 - 74880000 = 5,757,570 exp needed to level = 14.9% exp
59 WARRIOR = 462102750 - 403881840 = 58,220,920 exp needed = 85.1% exp

Mobs needed to level:

59 Warrior = 58,220,920 / 851,000 = 68.414 mobs needed to level
41 Warrior = 5,757,570 / 149,000 = 38.641 mobs to level

Now the tables have turned, and the 41 warrior is leveling almost TWICE as fast as the 59!

This is due to what's known as the "HELL MOD". Hell Mod is used in calcuation of total exp needed to level = level^3 * class_penalty * race_penalty * HELL_MOD.

Whenever your hell mod increments, 'total exp needed' takes a shift upwards as it compounds into the equation. While you're in the same hell mod, your only change is in your Level^3.

This is why you see the differences - especially in the 50s. Almost every level has a new hell mod (and they jump twice in 'super hell' - 54 and 59). The idea of 'leveling at the same time' only applies when all the entities are within the same hell subgroup.

Math.

[r00t]

I suppose it is slightly misleading. I should probably clarify the XP #'s, changing the first field to 'Total XP Needed' and add another field for the difference named 'XP Needed to Lvl'. Is that still confusing, better suggestions?

[August]

I suppose it is slightly misleading. I should probably clarify the XP #'s, and add another field for the difference named 'XP Needed to Lvl', and the first field to 'Total XP Needed'. Is that still confusing?

Yeah, Total EXP and EXP to Level i think are probably good - right now it just says 'XP to level'.

I'm not sure that it will alleviate the pervasive anecdotal evidence - I think that is due more to the myth that 'everybody levels at the same rate'. This is obviously not the case in a hell level - which is also common knowledge, but rarely goes together.

The biggest thing at play here is the HELL_MOD, and most people don't realize that it is constantly upticking in the 50s (and every 5 levels prior starting at 30). They just know 'hell level'. Every increment increases that levels 'XP needed to level' by an additional factor that they determines 'percentage'.

Also, I notice you're using some hell mods that aren't exactly matching up w/ other sources.. For example I see this w/ a search:

51 1.5
52 1.6
53 1.7
54 1.9
55 2.1
56 2.3
57 2.5
58 2.7
59 3.0
60 3.1

Which does not dovetail with the tool. Do we know which set is used in P99?

[r00t]

I got the hell level mod table being used in the tool from the wiki:

http://wiki.project1999.com/Game_Mechanics#Experience_Requirement_by_Level

However stratics has your table:

http://web.archive.org/web/20020612225100/http://eq.stratics.com/crmaps/eqexp.html

They're identical up to level 54. If this other one is proven more accurate for P99 I can update it.


This post is relevant: http://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=241471&postcount=39

[August]

I got the hell level mod table being used in the tool from the wiki:

http://wiki.project1999.com/Game_Mechanics#Experience_Requirement_by_Level

However stratics has your table:

http://web.archive.org/web/20020612225100/http://eq.stratics.com/crmaps/eqexp.html

They're identical up to level 54. If this other one is proven more accurate for P99 I can update it.


This post is relevant: http://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=241471&postcount=39

Based on leveling here, I'm more inclined to believe your source. With the table I posted, 55+ is just as heinous as 54 - 54 is just the first level to realy suck, followed by suckage up to 59, where it really sucks.

Regardless, I hope this discussion is shedding some light on why not everyone always 'levels at the same speed' and how experience is distributed in groups.

[r00t]

I added the extra header so there is XP to Lvl and Total XP, commas for the xp values, and made the select boxes smoother when you change your mind.

[Clark]

Calculator dumb I just do math on paper.

lol

[Zuranthium]

Calculator dumb I just do math on paper.

No paper required! Just follow this simple guide for forming a party:

1.) Enchanter
2.) Cleric
3.) Monk/Warrior/Shadowknight
4.) Rogue/Monk/Warrior
5.) Rogue/Monk/Warrior/Shaman - if they are willing to canni every tick
6.) Pick the best DPS you can get if #3 is Shadowknight, otherwise pick the best DPS who can snare reliably

[Cecily]

Why would you need a warrior or shadow knight?

[Zuranthium]

Each choice is listed in order from most favorable to least favorable. #3 is the tank spot.

[Bazia]

1.) Enchanter

Done

[r00t]

New updates from suggestions I got

- Level inputs now only accept numbers
- Added zone exp mods and mob calculations. So now you can find out how many mobs you have to kill of a certain level in a particular zone to ding.
- Added a string you can copy and paste to your group that will show the breakdowns.

http://rantsandflames.com/xpcalc/

Two people with different xp mods but who are the same level need the same # of mobs to ding.

Does anyone know the calculation for when mobs turn green? Always seemed like to me there was a curve to it, but maybe its just a fixed level.

Any errors lemme kno

[Clark]

Man, those hybrids are greedy mofo's

[Gonzo Joe]

Man, those hybrids are greedy mofo's

Only slightly more greedy than Iksar Necromancers (32%) and less greedy than Iksar Monks (44%). But hey, Hybrids get all the exp penalty press, so they're the only ones with penalties, obviously.

No paper required! Just follow this simple guide for forming a party:

1.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform Crowd Control duties
2.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform Healing duties
3.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform Tanking duties
4.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform DPS duties
5.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform DPS / Offhealing duties
6.) Someone who knows what the shit they're doing and can perform DPS and Snaring duties

FTFY

[Gonzo Joe]

Also, really cool tool Poblano. I've used it a hell of a lot since you posted it on the site.