Fear/Hate Training rules

[Splorf22]

So first let me say that I was not on for this whole mess, so I am going off of posts only. That being said, I think this quote by Sirken is worth some discussion (about whether The A-Team was asking for it by being at the West Wall).

i understand it's probably past your bedtime, you're probably pretty sleepy and need a nap, so i'll save you the task of having to spend more than 30 seconds thinking about something before you post some kind of moronic comment like MM is not a raid zone. no shit MM is not a raid zone, that was not the comparison that was being made. the comparison was that kids who cry about getting social aggro from the kites because they are in the SW corner of the zone deserve their fate for being dumber than a bag of rocks, just like kids that hang out at the MM zoneline who complain about constant training in MM are also dumber than a bag of rocks and deserve their fate.

Let's change the zone to KC. The general consensus is that if you set up camp at the zone out (usually a bunch of soloers) you're going to get trained periodically because that's just what happens: no one is going to sit there and die rather than zone out.

I don't think that applies here. A) I hold guilds of players to a higher standard than random noobs in kc and b) these are trains that are intentionally created to save time, not 'omg wtf do i do panic'.

I think we need to see some extremely clear rules and Derubael maps here, and the more I think about it, the more I think either set of rules is pretty dumb: if you allow trains, then people WILL get run over (and hey, everyone has a first time), and if you don't, then it's going to be a silly leapfrog race. Which is why I think EQ 'competition' is silly. Regardless, let's make it clear exactly what kind of silly we are going to have here.

[Yaolin]

I think training ALL of Fear in order to engage Draco/CT is awesome... said no one in a non-Zerg guild ever. Draco/CT and Innoruuk FFA's are shit shows and always will be if the first guild into the zone with 24+ doesn't get 30-60minutes to engage. Pure numbers, as always will win out if nothing is changed.

I'm fine with whatever, but we all know CT kills are ridiculous. Hell the more people there are in the zone, the less the DT's actual hurt the guilds that are actually engaging and that's just awesome.

~Yao

[Sirken]

just dont hunt in the SW corner when CT is up. the kiters have to take certain paths to avoid the DT cycle crap.

why must it be the SW corner? because you need the mobs at the opposite end of CT or they will wipe your face.

why not reposition CT? because the rest of the mobs in the zone will catch you and wipe your face.

why not say they aren't allowed to kite the trash away? because it's classic as fawk, it was exactly what any competent guild did on my live server, and has been a legit tactic since forever.


TL;DR
Hunting in SW corner with CT and QQing about getting trained is like signing up to the secret service and then complaining when u actually take a bullet for the pres.

just avoid the whole thing, be smart, know how the zone works. sincerely trying to help you here,

Sirks

[Aeolwind]

Just curious, what about dread/fright/terror? If they are aggro on the kiter he should catch a DT long before he (the kiter) gets to the SW corner.

Reason we never did it on live was due to DT's. While we enjoyed killing our bards playing with it, it just never panned out right. Generally, he'd eat one before he made the 2nd lap around he zone in mound.

Also, CT should be roaming from the Fire in the west back towards the east, is he not roaming?

[quido]

I don't think it works that way here - DT cycle is pretty screwy

[Aeolwind]

I don't think it works that way here - DT cycle is pretty screwy
Prob gonna have to poke around in there again. Sigh, I hate that script.

[quido]

I'd be really curious to see it.

[Aeolwind]

I'd be really curious to see it.

It cannot be unseen. You'd have a better chance at survival staring at Azathoth for an hour.

[Yaolin]

So 1 bard and 3 golem sacrifices = win?

[Splorf22]

Sirken, I don't think you understood my point. You need to state unequivicoally one of the following:

a) IF YOU TRAIN SOMEONE IN FEAR WE WILL FUCK YOU UP

or

b) WE SUPPORT FEAR KITES; IF YOU ARE IN DERUBAEL-AREA-X YOU ARE FFA

or

c) whatever

but my point is currently you are just saying 'well this is what they do' and the relevant point is what YOU are going to do

[Lostprophets]

Just my 2cp here..

I think it's reasonable to Propose Option D - Make people clear the zone and not train period in Fear (when other guilds are around...you see a guild forming up...don't dare start up that bard kite). there's a no train policy in the PnP, let's as a server enforce it in Fear on a CT Pop.

Once the Devs fix the CT DT Cycle, it's going to be an absolute clusterf-ck again otherwise.

Back in the Transcendence vs. IB days it was a race to clear as fast as possible (no kiting involved) and the First Guild to have 2 Golems down wins First shot at CT... In the uncommon circumstance that 3 guilds each get a golem it should be First FTE on Draco and Successfully Kill him...they get first shot at CT...would be kinda cool to bring that policy back for repops and such as it was one from when Fear first opened on P99.

[Splorf22]

A B & C are all correct statements

what am i going to do? i'm going to sit back and either A) watch kids get wiped because they dont understand how fear works, or B) watch kids move out of the way because they do understand how fear works.

Sirken I would appreciate a really clear answer to this: if 'kid guild x' is at the west wall, and they get social aggro from a kite and therefore are trained, will the training player/guild be suspended or not?

[Sirken]

Sirken I would appreciate a really clear answer to this: if 'kid guild x' is at the west wall, and they get social aggro from a kite and therefore are trained, will the training player/guild be suspended or not?

fraps it, petition it, and i'll look at it with at least one other staff member.

if it looks intentional, yes.

if it looks like "kid guild x" put themselves in harms way to purposely get another guild banned, no.


im not going to punish players because other players are too stubborn or too dumb to not play in traffic.


clear enough?

<3
Sirks

[Splorf22]

im not going to punish players because other players are too stubborn or too dumb to not play in traffic

You keep using this traffic analogy and I have no idea why. First, mobs and players can cover every inch of the zone; they are not restricted to concrete roads. Second, if you hit someone with your car you are responsible. Period. It doesn't matter if they were playing in traffic or not.

[Sirken]

You keep using this traffic analogy and I have no idea why. First, mobs and players can cover every inch of the zone; they are not restricted to concrete roads. Second, if you hit someone with your car you are responsible. Period. It doesn't matter if they were playing in traffic or not.

/facepalm. let me try again

fraps it, petition it, and i'll look at it with at least one other staff member.

if it looks intentional, yes.

if it looks like "kid guild x" put themselves in harms way to purposely get another guild banned, no.

im not going to punish players because other players are too stubborn or too dumb to avoid putting themselves in harms way. you have two choices; if you dont want to play on a server with other guilds go play InstancedRotationBox, or, L2PoF

clear enough?

<3
Sirks


edit- and for the record, if some dummy is playing in traffic and i hit him with my truck, he deserves whatever happens to him, and i wouldnt even slow down to see if he was ok. stupid people shouldnt be catered to, it only encourages them to continue their stupid behavior.