Get rid of PNP rules

[Nizzarr]

Leave this:

Excessive bind camping
Excessive shit talking
Excessive corpse camping


Throw everything else out of the fucking window. GMs and obviously guides should have no say on how a whole server is interacting with eachother. Let the community handle themselves.

Inb4, lol 200 red pop. Pretty sure the blue server cant raid and is bored and all rolling on red as a "consequence".

[Colgate]

maybe if you and your guild didn't act like such cunts we wouldn't need the play nice policy

pras derubael

pras sirken

pras zade

[Holey]

maybe if you and your guild didn't act like such cunts we wouldn't need the play nice policy

pras derubael

pras sirken

pras zade

YES TARGET THE WHOLE GUILD

when i havent griefed one person. lol

[Mac Dretti]

Rules only entice trolls to run around geared in middle of 70v50 pvp crying IF U TOUCH ME I'LL PETITION U

[chu]

ppl love to loot
y they no scoot?

[Kinamara]

Just sounds like you have a dick in your mouth, and one in each hand while tears are running down your face.

It's not tears in Colgate's case.

[Nothxu]

I agree with this. I have heard people in the recent past say they aren't even going to bother with pvp for now because they don't like needing to worry about whether or not they could get banned. Some have either not started on the server, or stopped playing altogether.

I would be in favor of getting rid of the play nice policy, but leaving GMs with the authority to suspend / ban for extreme circumstances. It is just like having referees in a football game / basketball game. It is extremely frustrating for players when the referees take control of the game, instead of letting the game play out as it should. This is a pvp server and the current rules make pvp less enjoyable. They also create many opportunities to abuse the system, or require people to constantly "tell" on each other, or run fraps 24/7, or rule lawyer. I know the GMs cannot be enjoying their hundreds of petitions, and I would like to think the people petitioning don't like it either. Besides the people that just want to grief the server (Slathar, etc), is that really fun for anyone? What is more fun, killing your enemy on the battlefield or getting them banned for some silly reason?

I have heard that you are allowed one free kill at someone's bind spot if you were not involved in killing them. However, if you see that person naked going to retrieve their corpse (maybe one zone away from where they died), you aren't allowed to kill them because they are on a corpse run. This is just one example of how the rules are not clear, and people are just avoiding pvp altogether because it's not worth the risk.

TLDR: Remove the play nice rules, but leave in the authority for GMs to suspend / ban on extreme circumstances. These should be extreme! Mass corpse camping / blatant training of a raid, etc.

[heartbrand]

nope luv me some pnp

[Holey]

nope luv me some pnp

love you some pnp and you cant even control your guild to pnp LOL

[heartbrand]

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/0ZYlYYmfurQ/hqdefault.jpg

[XiakenjaTZ]

Keep the rules. Get rid of the people who can't seem to follow them.

[Nothxu]

We are finally getting some really awesome fights now with Red Dawn getting serious numbers and gaining levels. The PNP rules that were put in place came at the absolute worst timing with limited input from the people that actually play on the server (not the trolls on the fourm). We have had two massive pvp battles that have been tarnished by rule lawyering and banning / suspending players over rules that are not clear. We simply put too much of a time investment into our characters to risk getting them banned over something in the grey area.

[Mac Dretti]

That a keystone light?

[Dacuk]

i think the intent behind the pnp is great, they definitely need to be modified as they just dont make sense for current state of mass pvp. GMs, what do you think?

[Technique]

The only thing more shameful than imposing poorly conceived rules out of the blue and with no prior input from the community is doing so and then ignoring the fallout.

[Vile]

love the tears

[Holey]

hahahah mother fucker bringing irl to this shit? lets do it

[Vile]

hahahah mother fucker bringing irl to this shit? lets do it

^^^what you do irl brew?

[Colgate]

love the tears

[Vile]

lol who is that, just noticed

[vouss]

love the tears

[Kergan]

Despite the thread title, Nizzar clearly outlines scenarios where PNP/LNS rules would apply. I completely agree with punishing obvious offenders, but many of the bans/suspensions on both sides of this have been minor offenses.

If you truly cared about making the PVP on this server better you would be advocating a system that handles large scale PVP better.

There are just flat out too many rules. Who cares if someone gets rezzed back into the battle? That shit is impossible to track when its 100 person battle royale mayhem anyway. Save the punishment when the violations are obvious and egregious and we'll have a better server for it.

Or you can push for a ruleset that is convoluted and restrictive to further satiate your banlust until you get uncontested pixels...whatever.

[Holey]

^^^what you do irl brew?

not even wash cars, thats not even an asian Lmfao.
but i get the idea.

hb you got your shit coming bruh. dont worry.
gives me a reason to grief your fucking cockroaches everyday.
sad how you get so mad and you bring irl into this.

[Vile]

not even wash cars, thats not even an asian Lmfao.
but i get the idea.


wait, what? engrish? plz

hb you got your shit coming bruh. dont worry.
gives me a reason to grief your fucking cockroaches everyday.
sad how you get so mad and you bring irl into this.

you mad bro?



MORE dirty teeth tears plz

[Colgate]

not even wash cars, thats not even an asian Lmfao.
but i get the idea.

hb you got your shit coming bruh. dont worry.
gives me a reason to grief your fucking cockroaches everyday.
sad how you get so mad and you bring irl into this.

if that isn't actually what you do, why are you even concerned about "bringing irl into this"

[Elderan]

nope luv me some pnp

Was told today some Red Dawn were told to bag their items and run into combat and try and get killed. Then report it as a PNP violation.

You support this?

[Tubzy]

I'm a nobody that rarely even plays but just my two cents whether this pnp policy has a negative or positive effect it is still a stupid idea.

I still have no idea how the system works in the slightest myself. Like if someone kills me I loot my corpse and leave then what if they follow me to the next zone can they kill me there and then I'm banned from both zones? Are you allowed to buff and heal yourself before you leave or does that mean you can be killed again? What if someone just wants to grief me while I'm leveling and kills me in the zone I'm leveling in every hour and logs off am I still barred from that zone?

There has to be a simpler system that's just as effective and easier to enforce and abide by. Preferably a system that is actually coded into the game and not at the discretion of GMs who could be unpredictable at times. One GM could have spilled his coffee on his keyboard and decide to ban a few guys permanently and one day adopts a puppy and decides 1 day suspensions are fair. Whether they intend to be or not there will be bias.

I was finally finding the time to start playing and having fun but the past and present random and intense intervention of GMs has put me off entirely. Simply put I don't trust this server at all, it isn't reliable and consistent enough to invest time into.

[Colgate]

i was told that elderan bought nizzar a computer and donates hundreds of dollars every month to this server

quite possibly the most pathetic thing i've seen on here, ever

[Vile]

Was told today some Red Dawn were told to bag their items and run into combat and try and get killed. Then report it as a PNP violation.

You support this?

was told today by some Nihilum...

can play that game as well...

you suck just a little less than your daddy nizzar. his tears are more delicious!

[Vile]

i was told that elderan bought nizzar a computer and donates hundreds of dollars every month to this server

quite possibly the most pathetic thing i've seen on here, ever

bro, we're like bros... <3

[Vile]

this thread has been slain by cwall and vile

[Nothxu]

Colgate stop shitting on the thread.

"OH LIKE I SHIT ON YOU AT THE BOTB"

Yes, please keep it in game.

[Kraftwerk]

You're a fucking faggot.

[HeisChuck]

Colgate stop shitting on the thread.

"OH LIKE I SHIT ON YOU AT THE BOTB"

Yes, please keep it in game.

Like colgate did you to at botb bro

[Colgate]

Colgate stop shitting on the thread.

"OH LIKE I SHIT ON YOU AT THE BOTB"

Yes, please keep it in game.

http://i.imgur.com/WnZAiBr.jpg

yikes 37% even after i let you beat on me for 10 seconds while i crouched and typed in /shout

[Tubzy]

oops sorry I refreshed in post and it reposted what I said last page lol.

[HippoNipple]

Despite the thread title, Nizzar clearly outlines scenarios where PNP/LNS rules would apply. I completely agree with punishing obvious offenders, but many of the bans/suspensions on both sides of this have been minor offenses.

If you truly cared about making the PVP on this server better you would be advocating a system that handles large scale PVP better.

There are just flat out too many rules. Who cares if someone gets rezzed back into the battle? That shit is impossible to track when its 100 person battle royale mayhem anyway. Save the punishment when the violations are obvious and egregious and we'll have a better server for it.

Or you can push for a ruleset that is convoluted and restrictive to further satiate your banlust until you get uncontested pixels...whatever.

The current rules are meant to make the current system with no variance work. It is a way to go somewhere, have a fight, then let the winner have the PvE they fought for.

In the past Nihilum would literally pvp for 8 hours if they had to, to push back PvE content to a time where others had to go to work so PvE would once again not be contested. It had nothing to do with who actually won the initial PvP fight, but who had the time to continue to come back for hours on end after getting killed.

If you don't want variance or a system that helps limit the zerging of a guild then you need to have a decent compromise or solution to provide.

[s1ckness]

nope luv me some pnp

[Snufz]

PnP is clearly working, 220 population.

Enemies of server health are enemies of PnP

[k9quaint]

love the tears

Nihilum can't deal with it.

[runlvlzero]

2 many level 60 red dawns griefing pixels all over Norrath.

Think of the bits and SQL server.

[Sirken]

GMs and obviously guides should have no say on how a whole server is interacting with eachother. Let the community handle themselves.

because the community has thus far shown us how amazing it is at this right?

rules will be fine, and shouldn't effect people that dont try to slip past them. follow the rules or leave. those are your choices :)

[Technique]

love the tearsMost people who're "crying" just want to play a game without ambiguous, even contradictory, external rules supplanting the game's own internal ones.

I don't see anyone complaining about no longer being allowed to ride your naked ass from zone-to-zone leaving a trail of corpses all the way back to your bind. Most just want to be able to PvP on a PvP server without needing to launch a fucking full-blown public inquiry into whether it's legal to attack another player with a red nametag who cons threateningly.

If you enjoy turning a dry, blind eye to the absurdity fostered by the new PnP, know that xerophthalmia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerophthalmia) is a disease.

And so are you.

[Colgate]

:(

[runlvlzero]

Most people who're "crying" just want to play a game without ambiguous, even contradictory, external rules supplanting the game's own internal ones.

I don't see anyone complaining about no longer being allowed to ride your naked ass from zone-to-zone leaving a trail of corpses all the way back to your bind. Most just want to be able to PvP on a PvP server without needing to launch a fucking full-blown public inquiry into whether it's legal to attack another player with a red nametag who cons threateningly.

If you enjoy turning a dry, blind eye to the absurdity fostered by the new PnP, know that xerophthalmia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerophthalmia) is a disease.

And so are you.

[heartbrand]

because the community has thus far shown us how amazing it is at this right?

rules will be fine, and shouldn't effect people that dont try to slip past them. follow the rules or leave. those are your choices :)

Hey Sirkdawg. Will the simulated repops be occurring on red also or just blue?

[runlvlzero]

Hey Sirkdawg. Will the simulated repops be occurring on red also or just blue?

Offtopic.

[HippoNipple]

I completely understand why there are people that are against PnP. I also understand that they don't understand the macro of how it effects game play. It isn't meant to grief player that don't know how to play nice. If implemented correctly and governed so that players are not able to take advantage/exploit the rules the PnP will:

1) help players get their corpse and move on without being griefed over and over in small scale pvp

2) change how big scale pvp works - 1 kill per character with no bind rushing

This allows guilds to fight over PvE content, as a PvP server should, and then allow the victor time to do whatever PvE content they just won in PvP.

I'm not saying RD has done everything 100% but they haven't resisted it as blatantly as Nihilum has either. For a guild leader to speak out against a system that shows common decency and respect among competing guilds is disgusting.

The server would be much more fun if some decency could be shown and guilds were able to do mass PvP, respecting the winner, and not breaking the rules. For this to happen guild leaders need to accept this and be role models. They should be willing to meet with other guild leaders and push for a compromise. Guides will listen if you are reasonable and would most likely listen to spokesman from Nihilum and Red Dawn if they agreed. Grow up and be men about it.

As long as all these level 60's follow a leader who is too blinded by his own arrogance and greed to push for a healthier server everyone will suffer. We will be forced to deal with people getting banned/suspended because their leader supports those that cheat/exploit the current rules to get an edge on the competition. Going up against a guild doing this also puts competing guilds in a tight spot since they have to willingly sit by and be beaten by those breaking the rules or break some themselves.

This server deserves a number one guild with a better leader.

[Technique]

For a guild leader to speak out against a system that shows common decency and respect among competing guilds is disgusting.I don't see any people speaking out against the spirit of the policy, just the flawed, inadequate implementation of it.

[HippoNipple]

Most people who're "crying" just want to play a game without ambiguous, even contradictory, external rules supplanting the game's own internal ones.

I don't see anyone complaining about no longer being allowed to ride your naked ass from zone-to-zone leaving a trail of corpses all the way back to your bind. Most just want to be able to PvP on a PvP server without needing to launch a fucking full-blown public inquiry into whether it's legal to attack another player with a red nametag who cons threateningly.

If you enjoy turning a dry, blind eye to the absurdity fostered by the new PnP, know that xerophthalmia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerophthalmia) is a disease.

And so are you.

It's comments like these that hurt the server. Can't embrace good competition and try to move forward instead of sitting in the filth this server has become over the years. You can still PvP on this server and do whatever you want as long as it isn't griefing. Were you killing that many people on corpse runs prior to the rule changes that ruins so much fun for you?

I understand there will be individuals like this that are small minded or just want to see the world burn but the problem is when a guild is lead by one of these individuals. Nizzar needs to give up his ego and become a guild leader this server can respect. I'm not trying to say he needs to step down or be banned, but he needs to man up and stop being a scum lord.

[HippoNipple]

I don't see any people speaking out against the spirit of the policy, just the flawed, inadequate implementation of it.

It is hard to talk compromise to fix a system when guild leaders speak out in blatant disregard for the rules applying to him or his guild.

As I mentioned, have Heartbrand and Nizzar compromise on a system that fixes problems like rezzing in mass pvp or corpse runs.

It isn't rocket science to figure out as long as the leaders could police their players but until both leaders have made it clear they are striving for a system like this there will be no progress.

[Sektor]

nope luv me some pnp

[runlvlzero]

I completely understand why there are people that are against PnP. I also understand that they don't understand the macro of how it effects game play. It isn't meant to grief player that don't know how to play nice. If implemented correctly and governed so that players are not able to take advantage/exploit the rules the PnP will:

1) help players get their corpse and move on without being griefed over and over in small scale pvp

2) change how big scale pvp works - 1 kill per character with no bind rushing

This allows guilds to fight over PvE content, as a PvP server should, and then allow the victor time to do whatever PvE content they just won in PvP.

I'm not saying RD has done everything 100% but they haven't resisted it as blatantly as Nihilum has either. For a guild leader to speak out against a system that shows common decency and respect among competing guilds is disgusting.

The server would be much more fun if some decency could be shown and guilds were able to do mass PvP, respecting the winner, and not breaking the rules. For this to happen guild leaders need to accept this and be role models. They should be willing to meet with other guild leaders and push for a compromise. Guides will listen if you are reasonable and would most likely listen to spokesman from Nihilum and Red Dawn if they agreed. Grow up and be men about it.

As long as all these level 60's follow a leader who is too blinded by his own arrogance and greed to push for a healthier server everyone will suffer. We will be forced to deal with people getting banned/suspended because their leader supports those that cheat/exploit the current rules to get an edge on the competition. Going up against a guild doing this also puts competing guilds in a tight spot since they have to willingly sit by and be beaten by those breaking the rules or break some themselves.

This server deserves a number one guild with a better leader.

The irony is this? How many people in RD have common decency... the word you so boldy use?

Like... 10 out of 76.

Mcloven... maybe a few others.

All the core members are either ex Azreal scumbags or account strippers or people who spent weeks greifing players who challenged them at the manaston camp.

It's like if Al'queda all of a sudden said it stood up for womens rights as an excuse to assassinate every male president we elected.

Oh the irony and the B.S. runs thick here.

Will it ever change?

Someone mind digging up heartbrands teams99 quotes, how he is gonna grief teams99, and wants to form a guild solely for the purpose of griefing teams99?

You guys only want these rules because it's the only way you can compete with the dregs of the server and poor leadership.

Lastly why is Nihilum and only a few flowers complaining? Because there's no one left outside of RD because of your toxic BS and people are quite literally so week in the knees they join the eziest guild to survive in on this box. And bluebies don't know any better.

[heartbrand]

It's like if Al'queda all of a sudden said it stood up for womens rights as an excuse to assassinate every male president we elected.



It's EXACTLY like this, can't believe this runlvlzero guy figured me out. FUCK

[Sirken]

Hey Sirkdawg. Will the simulated repops be occurring on red also or just blue?

we just finished hog tying blue.

Red is next

[HippoNipple]

The irony is this? How many people in RD have common decency... the word you so boldy use?

Like... 10 out of 76.

Mcloven... maybe a few others.

All the core members are either ex Azreal scumbags or account strippers or people who spent weeks greifing players who challenged them at the manaston camp.

It's like if Al'queda all of a sudden said it stood up for womens rights as an excuse to assassinate every male president we elected.

Oh the irony and the B.S. runs thick here.

Will it ever change?

Someone mind digging up heartbrands teams99 quotes, how he is gonna grief teams99, and wants to form a guild solely for the purpose of griefing teams99?

I don't know if people think you are a liar or insane, but I do know that no one values your opinion.

As far as McLoven, I'm glad he decided to join. I personally talked to him in game 2 days ago about the fun to be had in the guild. It looks like he joined because of it.

[heartbrand]

we just finished hog tying blue.

Red is next

I think simulated repops perfect way to get more competition. Today is a great example, Red Dawn in the middle of a hate clear, boom random repop, we're getting inny, rushing other targets everyone scrambling. Much better than variance. The repop friday was thrilling as FUCK minus the time it happened.

[Stasis01]

The person who uses raid corpse camping, high playtime world corpse camping and experience grp killing, wants the PNP reverted. The guy controlling all spawns and doing anything required to make other guilds not only give up but break apart and quit or join Nihi with a MASSIVE gear advantage/level advantage wants the rules reverted.

This rule goes against the entire model of Nihilum, unfortunately the GM's understand it's also keeping this server low population and extremely frustrating and toxic. The population growth will reflect this if rules are enforced brutally, especially to Nihilum throwing a fit and trying to rule lawyer/bend each individual situation, such as not letting my cleric res me.

I think they'll get it, and the box will have a chance, this is just a case of people in power scared to lose some of it, even though they abuse that power and ruin the entire dream of red99. Fucking pirates.

[runlvlzero]

http://lamarapprovesofkoolaid.ytmnd.com/

http://users.content.ytmnd.com/6/5/9/659b90111d92bd03fc846e7bbee5109b.jpg (http://lamarapprovesofkoolaid.ytmnd.com/)

[Nizzarr]

hey stasis

Situation: A rogue zones into seb, runs down to the ledge and kills a shaman soloing. That shaman has a friend come and ress him, the rogue kills the cleric at the entrance before he can get to that shamans corpse. The cleric then comes back into the zone for LNS. The cleric is allowed to loot his corpse at the entrance.
Question: Does this cleric have the right to sooth down to the shaman and ress him?
Our current interpretation: The cleric must loot his corpse, and then leave without buffing, killing or anything else.
Sirken says: You are correct

fuck you stasis, you rule lawyering easy bake erudite.

[Colgate]

easy bake erudite?

[Andis]

holy mad detected

taking it down a noch nizzar

i dont want you to pop a blood vessel

[Mac Dretti]

Orange and purplestuff all a brotha needs

[Andis]

hey stasis

Situation: A rogue zones into seb, runs down to the ledge and kills a shaman soloing. That shaman has a friend come and ress him, the rogue kills the cleric at the entrance before he can get to that shamans corpse. The cleric then comes back into the zone for LNS. The cleric is allowed to loot his corpse at the entrance.
Question: Does this cleric have the right to sooth down to the shaman and ress him?
Our current interpretation: The cleric must loot his corpse, and then leave without buffing, killing or anything else.
Sirken says: You are correct

fuck you stasis, you rule lawyering easy bake erudite.

that is exactly correct

tell the shaman he will get his rez, when the zone is clear, or bring a grp and push this rog out

learn2eq bra

[Stasis01]

You're defining the rule down to the inch that you can grief to, both people died PVP - you are trying to enforce the maximum line you can move up to with douchebaggery.

I guess Sirken took the side of you, I don't really care - It's your mentality behind those actions.

It's the reason you roll to a Nagafen with your VP clearing guild and try to sit on their corpses all night, or use POH or POF for an example - you hunt down weaker opponents and corpse camp them all night, or fuck with their CR the next day also if they died at Trakanon.

[Mac Dretti]

http://bobcesca.thedailybanter.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/2/files/2012/07/obama_laughing.jpg

[Nizzarr]

You're defining the rule down to the inch that you can grief to, both people died PVP - you are trying to enforce the maximum line you can move up to with douchebaggery.

I guess Sirken took the side of you, I don't really care - It's your mentality behind those actions.

It's the reason you roll to a Nagafen with your VP clearing guild and try to sit on their corpses all night, or use POH or POF for an example - you hunt down weaker opponents and corpse camp them all night, or fuck with their CR the next day also if they died at Trakanon.

im following the rules and you arent.

[Colgate]

im following the rules and you arent.

why are you currently suspended on multiple characters then

[Sektor]

why are you currently suspended on multiple characters then

lol

[maverixdamighty]

hey stasis

Situation: A rogue zones into seb, runs down to the ledge and kills a shaman soloing. That shaman has a friend come and ress him, the rogue kills the cleric at the entrance before he can get to that shamans corpse. The cleric then comes back into the zone for LNS. The cleric is allowed to loot his corpse at the entrance.
Question: Does this cleric have the right to sooth down to the shaman and ress him?
Our current interpretation: The cleric must loot his corpse, and then leave without buffing, killing or anything else.
Sirken says: You are correct

fuck you stasis, you rule lawyering easy bake erudite.

yet you guys didn't do that in regards to dragging in solb, you hypocritical piece of trash.

[Mac Dretti]

yet you guys didn't do that in regards to dragging in solb, you hypocritical piece of trash.

http://coedbc.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/shaq-gif-2.gif

[Stasis01]

im following the rules and you arent.

If I kill some dude and his cleric, I'll let the cleric res him instead of being a loser - all good brother.

[HippoNipple]

hey stasis

Situation: A rogue zones into seb, runs down to the ledge and kills a shaman soloing. That shaman has a friend come and ress him, the rogue kills the cleric at the entrance before he can get to that shamans corpse. The cleric then comes back into the zone for LNS. The cleric is allowed to loot his corpse at the entrance.
Question: Does this cleric have the right to sooth down to the shaman and ress him?
Our current interpretation: The cleric must loot his corpse, and then leave without buffing, killing or anything else.
Sirken says: You are correct

fuck you stasis, you rule lawyering easy bake erudite.

This is a clear example of why the new rules don't work. Someone leading the number one guild has to ask what he can get away with instead of just doing the right thing.

The next time you are about to be a dick head Nizzar, just ask, what would Heartbrand do and let his leadership guide you.

The answer to your question, as a guild leader, would be:

Message both players and let them know you will not interfere as they get their corpses and you will allow the cleric to rez as long as they both gate afterwards.

[Mac Dretti]

If I kill some dude and his cleric, I'll let the cleric res him instead of being a loser - all good brother.

But ur fellow RD bluebies will cry and petition it for banquest. Better safe than sorry and tell them to Gtfo of zone.

[HippoNipple]

But ur fellow RD bluebies will cry and petition it for banquest. Better safe than sorry and tell them to Gtfo of zone.

The victor can grant free passage if he wishes. It is what any respectable player would do, ya scum bag.

[Stasis01]

All that matters is the raid application and even Nizzar can't bend that. Guilds will have a chance, all this minor bullshit just proves he's an asshole, and doesn't care about population/competition.

[HippoNipple]

All that matters is the raid application and even Nizzar can't bend that. Guilds will have a chance, all this minor bullshit just proves he's an asshole, and doesn't care about population/competition.

It really is just an alternative to variance that is meant to allow PvP and PvE without hours of head ache from zerging. I don't know why anyone would fight it unless they just don't understand that.

[Mac Dretti]

The victor can grant free passage if he wishes. It is what any respectable player would do, ya scum bag.

Good thing we won 130 man pvp and started rezing RD for them to LnS


What kind of cry babies would turn around and take that respectable gesture as anything else and cry to petition quest. Maybe I should stop rezing RD and AZ after pvp if all we are awarded with is tears and spam.

[Smedy]

PNP Great, just needs some tweaking in certain situation, especially concerning "alts" situation, i feel like rogean needs to find a way to identify a player by other means then character cause having to fight a guild where everyone has 5 alts is crazy, you lns as a player, not as a character, no alts welcome once you die, that would be absolutely great.

1 big fight, make it count

[maverixdamighty]

PNP Great, just needs some tweaking in certain situation, especially concerning "alts" situation, i feel like rogean needs to find a way to identify a player by other means then character cause having to fight a guild where everyone has 5 alts is crazy, you lns as a player, not as a character, no alts welcome once you die, that would be absolutely great.

1 big fight, make it count

think this was brought up on blue about capming chars for pve and nothing could be done.

[Mac Dretti]

Give pnp to actual groups and legit people being griefed. Not this B'S of go ahead and run into a chaotic 130 man war zone screaming LNS or petition and get people banned when their aoe ' s hit you

[HippoNipple]

Good thing we won 130 man pvp and started rezing RD for them to LnS


What kind of cry babies would turn around and take that respectable gesture as anything else and cry to petition quest. Maybe I should stop rezing RD and AZ after pvp if all we are awarded with is tears and spam.

No one stated that Nihilum doesn't have members that rez people and can act respectable. There are good people on this server but until the leaders can act with decency and push for guild wide values we will have to put up with these situations that include account bans.

PnP is a good thing. People trying to bend the rules to grief or gain an advantage in large scale PvP is not good. If you have good ideas share them with your leader and hope he had the decency to meet with other guild leaders to implement a system that works.

If guild leaders of relevance agreed to a system that needed some type of hard coding or gm enforcement I bet Sirken/Nilbog would listen.

At the end of the day Retti we just need leadership that can lead and not just down pixels. If you are saying you are a good person that respects players then I ask you why you would follow someone who is not. If Nizzar wants to change his attitude he has the chance to but if he doesn't Sirken made it clear more bans are coming. People on both sides will suffer if the leaders of this server can't act as men.

[HippoNipple]

Give pnp to actual groups and legit people being griefed. Not this B'S of go ahead and run into a chaotic 130 man war zone screaming LNS or petition and get people banned when their aoe ' s hit you

Claiming ignorance to get around the rules will not save you.

[Mac Dretti]

For example isosceles is in a fit of rage and doesn't k ow why he was slain 4 times last night while he bind rushed and thought he could selos a full group but still remain immune from LnS clause

[runlvlzero]

RD coming to stasis defense, but hey sure as hell wouldn't come to anyone else's defense. They would do the same thing Nizzar is doing, yet if someone like me spoke up they would just LOLLOLOL.

Such fucking hypocritical double standards.

I suppose your gonna let me rez both me and chewie and soda and everyone else if we ever have pvp?

[HippoNipple]

RD coming to stasis defense, but hey sure as hell wouldn't come to anyone else's defense. They would do the same thing Nizzar is doing, yet if someone like me spoke up they would just LOLLOLOL.

Such fucking hypocritical double standards.

I suppose your gonna let me rez both me and chewie and soda and everyone else if we ever have pvp?

Yes, and we will allow you to raid and roll for loot as well. Chewie himself has taken advantage of this.

The reason people don't listen to you is because you write insane things on these forums. Your own guild speaks out against you.

[HippoNipple]

For example isosceles is in a fit of rage and doesn't k ow why he was slain 4 times last night while he bind rushed and thought he could selos a full group but still remain immune from LnS clause

Bringing up things on a case by case basis is obviously for trolling on these forums. I'm not going to say I haven't done it as well. If you want something done then message heartbrand and ask him to look into it. /Petition if you think it is warranted.

I'm not saying Heartbrand is going to kick every player that is accused of something but he is a reasonable guy and will get the point across. More players have been kicked from RD in the last month than Nihilum has kicked since day one of the server. Players that have been proven toxic to the values of RD have been kicked.

Actions in game will speak louder than what is said here. If you want real change then you should start with your guild leader and see what he can offer you as a solution.

[raka]

pnp > nizzar

[Mac Dretti]

Bringing up things on a case by case basis is obviously for trolling on these forums. I'm not going to say I haven't done it as well. If you want something done then message heartbrand and ask him to look into it. /Petition if you think it is warranted.

I'm not saying Heartbrand is going to kick every player that is accused of something but he is a reasonable guy and will get the point across. More players have been kicked from RD in the last month than Nihilum has kicked since day one of the server. Players that have been proven toxic to the values of RD have been kicked.

Actions in game will speak louder than what is said here. If you want real change then you should start with your guild leader and see what he can offer you as a solution.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/46694/shaq-o.gif

[heartbrand]

Posts Per Day: 41.28

[Mac Dretti]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6r9g8X88q1r9etf5o1_500.gif

[Buhbuh]

Or you could maybe, you know, come together with other guild leaders to form some kind of compromise that doesn't completely fuck the server's population again and again?

The only reason these rules are in, Nizzar, is because you and every other guild leader has too much pride to give even an ounce of respect to each other to talk about how to behave on this server.

These rules would be gone immediately if you were in Teamspeak with Chewie, Lite, Heartbrand, and any other people they feel are relevant to the conversation to draft some sort of guidelines.

Otherwise, stop complaining about it. You're doing it to yourselves, and that's exactly how GM's see it.

[HippoNipple]

Or you could maybe, you know, come together with other guild leaders to form some kind of compromise that doesn't completely fuck the server's population again and again?

The only reason these rules are in, Nizzar, is because you and every other guild leader has too much pride to give even an ounce of respect to each other to talk about how to behave on this server.

These rules would be gone immediately if you were in Teamspeak with Chewie, Lite, Heartbrand, and any other people they feel are relevant to the conversation to draft some sort of guidelines.

Otherwise, stop complaining about it. You're doing it to yourselves, and that's exactly how GM's see it.

Agree 100%. I'm glad the GMs have enough insight to realize they have to push until the server can figure it out on their own. We have had 2 years to figure it out and Nizzar's policy of us policing it ourselves involves pushing raid mobs to spawn at times the competition can't log in. That system is terrible for everyone, including Nihilum.

The PnP needs to stay while at the same time guild leaders need to get together and come up with an agreement so these bans aren't enforced going forward. The warranted bans will keep the truce honest.

[runlvlzero]

Yes, and we will allow you to raid and roll for loot as well. Chewie himself has taken advantage of this.

The reason people don't listen to you is because you write insane things on these forums. Your own guild speaks out against you.

Lies, I asked in /ooc if floewrs were welcome on raids, you said no, flowers won 1 roll and you forbad them from coming on any other raids without detagging

you have done ZERO to foster a multiguild server raid environment.

Edit, also, "Your own guild" you mean the spies we let you have in our guild because they are basically non-factors? Barda-cannibis, doesn't speak for flowers. NOR do I. But hey I been on this server long enough to accrue a reputation at least. Unlike some.

[Rellapse36]

you have done ZERO to foster a multiguild server raid environment.

So how many open raids has your guild led?

[Mac Dretti]

I've been to numerous foh raids

If u played longer than last few months u would know a thing or 2

[Rellapse36]

Posts Per Day: 41.64

[Mac Dretti]

Bump

[Rec]

I blame UO and trammel for the start of all this play nice silliness

[Technique]

I blame UO and trammel for the start of all this play nice sillinessThe Trammel facet of a UO shard is the equivalent of a blue EQ server.

As for playing nice in UO, in all the years I was on live (98-01) and freeshards, I never once heard anything akin to a PNP proposed, let alone imposed, and this in a game where death left you a ghost standing at the foot of your corpse, helpless to do anything but watch your killers loot all your belongings.

[HippoNipple]

The Trammel facet of a UO shard is the equivalent of a blue EQ server.

As for playing nice in UO, in all the years I was on live (98-01) and freeshards, I never once heard anything akin to a PNP proposed, let alone imposed, and this in a game where death left you a ghost standing at the foot of your corpse, helpless to do anything but watch your killers loot all your belongings.

Was there large scale raiding in UO? I only played for like a week and got bored of playing a game where you were forced to macro so I honestly don't know. If there wasn't raiding then it is irrelevant.

If there was raiding it is another game and is most likely still irrelevant.

[Technique]

The PNP here lacks any special provisions for raiding-related mass pvp, which is one of its worst flaws, so questioning whether UO is relevant based on whether it had raids or not (it didn't) is what's irrelevant.

[Stasis01]

Seemed to work perfect in Kith, Nihilum lost people got their bodies and left, no one was mad - it wasn't dragged out for hrs.

It was just fun.

[thisuserwasbannedlol]

only nihilum seems to not like the rules, wonder why

[rusty81]

We are finally getting some really awesome fights now with Red Dawn getting serious numbers and gaining levels. The PNP rules that were put in place came at the absolute worst timing with limited input from the people that actually play on the server (not the trolls on the fourm). We have had two massive pvp battles that have been tarnished by rule lawyering and banning / suspending players over rules that are not clear. We simply put too much of a time investment into our characters to risk getting them banned over something in the grey area.

I think the Mob Training helped that along with GM's there watching. This from your guild leader.

Maybe its time for someone in Nihili to overthrow the leadership? I propose a Mutiny! I have met tons of great people in that guild and I know most of them would never Train or Grief but when you support a leader that does.... Maybe that is the real issue here.

MUTINY

[Kergan]

I think the Mob Training helped that along with GM's there watching. This from your guild leader.

Maybe its time for someone in Nihili to overthrow the leadership? I propose a Mutiny! I have met tons of great people in that guild and I know most of them would never Train or Grief but when you support a leader that does.... Maybe that is the real issue here.

MUTINY

Nizzar is the only one keeping these bloodthirsty fucks in check most the time. :)

[Mac Dretti]

Seemed to work perfect in Kith, Nihilum lost people got their bodies and left, no one was mad - it wasn't dragged out for hrs.

It was just fun.

If I had gotten home 5 minutes earlier and was there we would a won 100%

Good strategy to engage while I'm mobilizing

[Elderan]

I think the Mob Training helped that along with GM's there watching. This from your guild leader.

Maybe its time for someone in Nihili to overthrow the leadership? I propose a Mutiny! I have met tons of great people in that guild and I know most of them would never Train or Grief but when you support a leader that does.... Maybe that is the real issue here.

MUTINY

There have been 5 major battles from red dawn and nihilum and there were zero trains on the Nihilum side.

POF (Your own enc trained you)
POH (You guys tried to train us after we cleared you out)
Trak (Your own guildmate trained you)

[rusty81]

There have been 5 major battles from red dawn and nihilum and there were zero trains on the Nihilum side.

POF (Your own enc trained you)
POH (You guys tried to train us after we cleared you out)
Trak (Your own guildmate trained you)

I think the major battles were all good and fun, I am talking of the reason the said accused is *suspended.

I guess the GM's were wrong. You should petition if this is false info.

Like I have said in the past I have no problems with Nihilium, personally I rather like most members in the guild. Now I can't put this first hand because I haven't experienced it so from me it's really all hearsay. but it almost looks like a lot of these so called "issues" stem from your own leader.

So my original proposal of Mutiny still stands.

[Kergan]

I think the major battles were all good and fun, I am talking of the reason the said accused is *suspended.

I guess the GM's were wrong. You should petition if this is false info.

Pretty sure nobody was banned from any of those fights for training? Am I wrong?

[Elderan]

I think the major battles were all good and fun, I am talking of the reason the said accused is *suspended.

I guess the GM's were wrong. You should petition if this is false info.

Sirken thought Tarran(Dwarf) was Thumperx(Dwarf).

Tarran trained you guys. HB admitted Red Dawn trained themselves, after the fact.

Thumperx was suspended a few days until the matter was cleared up.

[rusty81]

Sirken thought Tarran(Dwarf) was Thumperx(Dwarf).

Tarran trained you guys. HB admitted Red Dawn trained themselves, after the fact.

Thumperx was suspended a few days until the matter was cleared up.

I stand corrected.

[heartbrand]

Sirken thought Tarran(Dwarf) was Thumperx(Dwarf).

Tarran trained you guys. HB admitted Red Dawn trained themselves, after the fact.

Thumperx was suspended a few days until the matter was cleared up.

Tarran trained us. I have no idea who was behind the wheel of Tarran but sources told me it was Agatha. If it wasn't then I'm sorry.

[chu]

Sirken thought Tarran(Dwarf) was Thumperx(Dwarf).

Tarran trained you guys. HB admitted Red Dawn trained themselves, after the fact.

Thumperx was suspended a few days until the matter was cleared up.

racial profiling

[Kergan]

racial profiling

lol

[maverixdamighty]

Sirken thought Tarran(Dwarf) was Thumperx(Dwarf).

Tarran trained you guys. HB admitted Red Dawn trained themselves, after the fact.

Thumperx was suspended a few days until the matter was cleared up.

agatha/jupe have access to tarran and maybe even max. someone has been logging into these accounts and deleting needed spells and binding them in remote locations for some time now.

[runlvlzero]

I think guild leaders should def be excepted from the rules, they should be griefable.

[Nizzarr]

I think guild leaders should def be excepted from the rules, they should be griefable.

sure, you mean like two weeks ago?

[runlvlzero]

sure, you mean like two weeks ago?

should be able to bind camp the leader of these zergs, otherwise theres no consequence for running a guild that's anticompetative and harmful to the server

Not a jab at u Nizzar. Sorry u got banned. Thats not grief its metagaming and dumb. Before pnp u could get 12 players with a beef against 1 player and teach them a lesson.

the simple stupid: Grief is a necessary part of a PvP community, eliminating it or trying to is bad. It will just recycle into worse/different forms.

[HippoNipple]

should be able to bind camp the leader of these zergs, otherwise theres no consequence for running a guild that's anticompetative and harmful to the server

Not a jab at u Nizzar. Sorry u got banned. Thats not grief its metagaming and dumb. Before pnp u could get 12 players with a beef against 1 player and teach them a lesson.

the simple stupid: Grief is a necessary part of a PvP community, eliminating it or trying to is bad. It will just recycle into worse/different forms.

Nope

[runlvlzero]

glad to know jerks get a free pass to LNS and keep being jerks on this server

wouldn't want to interfere with their petitioning by making them zone every once in awhile

[HippoNipple]

glad to know jerks get a free pass to LNS and keep being jerks on this server

wouldn't want to interfere with their petitioning by making them zone every once in awhile

You won't have to worry about anyone petitioning you for kills. You couldn't break the anti grief policies if you tried.

[runlvlzero]

Ezri - 8-0 vs RD alts in guk, how much rage in your TS cause an ungeared scrub floored you folks without anything but a rubi BP and a 1k weap?

[HippoNipple]

rubi BP and a 1k weap?

Must be nice. Wish I could sport pixels like that.

[freez]

Ezri - 8-0 vs RD alts in guk, how much rage in your TS cause an ungeared scrub floored you folks without anything but a rubi BP and a 1k weap?

tragedy might have to lay it down on ezri next time I swing thru guk

[HeisChuck]

PNP best thing to happen to server since Amelinda was removed from office

[Vile]

PNP best thing to happen to server since Amelinda was removed from office

[tarran]

http://gyazo.com/0b26c33fd576866edbe2751dfcf312eb.png

[HippoNipple]

This server needed a PnP to help the newer folks that don't have level 60 characters in their back pocket, but enforcing PnP in large scale battles is ludicrous as this clearly benefits Red Dawn (eg the guild with a large volume of non factors) since it is harder to mentally track breaches when you are dealing with names that are unfamiliar.

The GMs will more likely to notice a Tune being killed in PvP and coming back to fight in the same battle, than say some random Red Dawn player.

LnS should also be optional, not mandatory. Maybe if it as simple as an emote tag, like having an 'AFK' tag next to a player. For example, /LNS will throw a LNS tag on your character for an hour and you cannot participate in PvP while you have that tag up. This also implies that you automatically forfeit any camp you enter that comes under contest until the LNS tag is lifted by the timer.

The GMs have not been acting biased, they have banned those blatantly breaking the rules. I know people have broken the rules on both sides and not been caught but breaking the rules right in front of GMs is either ignorant or blatant disregard for the rules.

As for your last paragraph about some sort of tag next to your name it is not a bad idea. I would be happy with a simple LNS tag you put on yourself that brings you unanon while you have it above your head. If you don't have the tag up then you are fair game for another kill. If you want to be respected as far as the PNP goes you would have to sport the tag.

[runlvlzero]

dood hippo u got better than that, don't fool, how long u been tryin to play this game?

[HippoNipple]

dood hippo u got better than that, don't fool, how long u been tryin to play this game?

huh?

[runlvlzero]

tragedy might have to lay it down on ezri next time I swing thru guk

my body is ready, what level tragedy now, redcon still? u wouldnt dare fight me even, without circlet of shadows twink

[freez]

my body is ready, what level tragedy now, redcon still? u wouldnt dare fight me even, without circlet of shadows twink

hes 45

oh ya I forgot ur the idiot pally that told me he was saving his coin for a CoS

when I asked why u replied

"cant pallys click CoS?"


I stopped grouping with flowers that day in guk.



im still wearing stat less leather in 6 places. come @ me brew

[Not_Kazowi]

should be able to bind camp the leader of these zergs, otherwise theres no consequence for running a guild that's anticompetative and harmful to the server

Not a jab at u Nizzar. Sorry u got banned. Thats not grief its metagaming and dumb. Before pnp u could get 12 players with a beef against 1 player and teach them a lesson.

the simple stupid: Grief is a necessary part of a PvP community, eliminating it or trying to is bad. It will just recycle into worse/different forms.

Sorry bro but most of us don't have time or the patience to play here when a hoard of career virgins can camp you at your bind for 4 hours and keep you from playing Everquest.

Your whole street justice mentality doesn't work because you have kids that play entirely too much and get off griefing anyone and everyone they get the chance to.

That is bad for the community, people that have just started playing or have never wronged anyone don't understand why Tune or others are killing them repeatedly while they try to XP or CR.

Now that PNP is in place everyone can go about their merry way and continue playing Everquest instead of having their corpse camped by a group of VP geared 60s with nothing better to do.

[Clark]

Throw everything else out of the fucking window. GMs and obviously guides should have no say on how a whole server is interacting with each other. Let the community handle themselves.

+100 intrawebs, agreed let the people play. On both servers.