Modified Limit System, Any comments tweaks accepted.

[baramur]

Improvised Bag Limit.

1st week of month. No Limit. Full server competition.

2nd week of month. 150 point bag limit.

3rd week of month 150 point bag limit.

4th week of month 150 point bag limit. (Month leader in kills 100 point bag limit.)


40 Point Mobs
Phara Dar
Trak
Cazic Thule
VS

30 Point mobs.
Sev, Inny, Fay, Noble Djorn

20 point Mobs.
Gore, Tal, Draco, Maestro, Xygozz, Hoshkar, Druushk, Siverwing, Nexona

Any mob found up for more then 4 hours will be open to engage free of limit.

[khanable]

I want to see a point system that caps any guild at 25% of the monthly spawns excluding VP


Keep VP FFA/FTE for competition, no bullshit training though

[quido]

I want to see a point system that caps any guild at 25% of the monthly spawns excluding VP

We know this is in BDA's interest. Fortunately, none of the top3 guilds support this. Time to get real, BDA, or get ignored.

[Yinikren]

Anything that limits the number of mobs TMO can bring in won't be accepted by them. Good thing you aren't the majority.

I think this idea is good, Baramur. Better than just limiting all the guilds to one week a month. This idea sounds much better for every other guild on the server.

Some prices might be a bit off for the effort/loot involved (Noble cycle) but I can dig this if my own plan falls through.

[quido]

I'm not against accepting reasonable limits. You guys are just wasting your time on a lost cause, though.

[Pullyn]

We know this is in BDA's interest. Fortunately, none of the top3 guilds support this. Time to get real, BDA, or get ignored.

Last I checked, TMO isn't raiding shit until they get on board with something the majority wants. That attitude isn't going to get you guys anywhere.

[khanable]

Last I checked, TMO isn't raiding shit until they get on board with something the majority wants. That attitude isn't going to get you guys anywhere.

Yup.

[quido]

We're being pretty reasonable. TMO isn't the only guild against your socialist suggestions. If you think BDA is going to get 1/4 of targets without competing in the least, you're dreaming.

Last I checked, BDA + Yinikren isn't a majority either. They're just an excessively whiny and derpy minority.

[Yinikren]

'Reasonable limits' are relative to the person holding the interest.

If you are holding out for a reasonable limit of 70-80% of the mobs, you're going to be sitting out a long time, per Rogean.

You aren't accounting for one guild where you can concede a bit and get away with it. You are accounting for at least 6 more guilds that want to raid... you're going to have to give quite a lot to account for the influx of players.

I fully expect any guild losing mobs to be against my idea. I fully expect every guild whose been oppressed to love it.

[quido]

I'm accounting for 3 guilds that don't like your dumb idea.

We fully intend to work with the other smaller more reasonable guilds to find something that they think is fair too.

[Yinikren]

I'm pretty sure no one's held a vote yet, superstar. Calm down, we are still planning.

[Troubled]

We're being pretty reasonable. TMO isn't the only guild against your socialist suggestions. If you think BDA is going to get 1/4 of targets without competing in the least, you're dreaming.

Last I checked, BDA + Yinikren isn't a majority either. They're just an excessively whiny and derpy minority.

Regular repops, variance reduced to +-4 hrs, no poops and no camp outs with true races isn't unreasonable to talk about either, along with not shitting on a force clearing a plane while CT/Inny/Draco pop. They should get first crack at it. Keeps competitive juices flowing and knocks out all the bullshit if people play nice.

[quido]

I'm pretty sure no one's held a vote yet, superstar. Calm down, we are still planning.

Just trying to lay the cut straight for you guys since I know things are difficult to understand.

[Yinikren]

I know it's hard not raiding, but don't worry, Jeremy, we will get through this. As a server. Where's your raid scene ideas anyway?

[cyryllis]

Cant we just completely remove variance and keep fte as sole rule? Seriously, id rather have 10 guilds sitting on spawn spamming for fte, everyone has an equal shot. Bye bye tracking, no more long poopsocks, no more need for batphones, and even small guilds of 10 people will have a shot at every single mob. Plus sitting there waiting for the mob spawn gives everyone time to socialize in say. Everyone wins...we all get more sleep, even casuals get a shot at trak, vs, etc and nobody can claim that the system excludes them. Hello staff this is the only solution we need

[Yinikren]

Guilds don't have an equal shot with FTE since it is 1) ping based and 2) whoever runs the most autofires gets the mob.

A limit per guild on what they can engage per week still seems to be the easiest option to get multiple guilds raiding. Multiple, as in more than 2.

[quido]

I'm enjoying my vacation - I'm out of town on my laptop which I don't like playing EQ on anyways.

I've stated my ideas and know that (pending ironing out some specifics) the system has the largest base of support. You'll see it formally laid out soon enough.

[khanable]

Cant we just completely remove variance and keep fte as sole rule? Seriously, id rather have 10 guilds sitting on spawn spamming for fte, everyone has an equal shot. Bye bye tracking, no more long poopsocks, no more need for batphones, and even small guilds of 10 people will have a shot at every single mob. Plus sitting there waiting for the mob spawn gives everyone time to socialize in say. Everyone wins...we all get more sleep, even casuals get a shot at trak, vs, etc and nobody can claim that the system excludes them. Hello staff this is the only solution we need

autofire

300 people in a single zone

[Yinikren]

You don't know it has the largest support if it hasn't been discussed by any but your own. I will however continue waiting with bated breath.

[cyryllis]

We never needed autofire to win fte..on noble or anything else. All you do is make a hotkey x 5 that does /tar whatever and make the other 5 slots an instant click dispell stick. Then you target nothing and spam the shit out of your keyboard for a minute or two. This method is how you get fte...autofire claims are a joke. If your internet sucks, make friends with someone who has a solid connection

[khanable]

.autofire claims are a joke. If your internet sucks, make friends with someone who has a solid connection

okay, if not autofire than he with lowest ping wins?

It's still putting FTE at an unfair advantage in some sense

I can't imagine Europa having the best connections ever.

[baramur]

Dunno so far ive liked mine the best lol gives 1 week of free full competition between everyone. Gives 3 weeks, where big guilds will have to decide what items are really needed. Jeremy i think you fail to realize TMO will adhere to what the server decides or TMO will not raid, its really that simple, but people are trying to make systems that work both for competition and sharing. VP should be included in this. It is still raid mobs.

[Ele]

We never needed autofire to win fte..on noble or anything else. All you do is make a hotkey x 5 that does /tar whatever and make the other 5 slots an instant click dispell stick. Then you target nothing and spam the shit out of your keyboard for a minute or two. This method is how you get fte...autofire claims are a joke. If your internet sucks, make friends with someone who has a solid connection

Is it reasonable to anyone that 20-100 people face roll their keyboards for minutes, if not hours, at a time not to kill the boss, but only to attempt to get that sweet yellow FTE text for an opportunity to engage?

[cyryllis]

I would think you of all people would support classic timers and removal of variance

[Yinikren]

I am 100% for the reduction or removal variance.

[Clark]

We know this is in BDA's interest. Fortunately, none of the top3 guilds support this. Time to get real, BDA, or get ignored.

lol

[Garguren]

The only thing TMO wants (or at least Jeremy) is to be allowed to raid what they want and the guilds who are close to them or want similar targets (BDA/Taken) to be required to kill less targets so those guilds who do not even participate in the raid scene can have a chance.

[Alarti0001]

I'm accounting for 3 guilds that don't like your dumb idea.

We fully intend to work with the other smaller more reasonable guilds to find something that they think is fair too.

5-6 guilds now.

[quido]

Look, I really want to make this better for the nonhardcores here. But if a small faction of people is going to cockblock progress because they're not getting exactly what they want, and want to turn this into a "collecting votes" sort of situation, they're going to be sorely disappointed.

If you want to play hardball.... I'm game. There's a better way, though.

[Garguren]

I'm very curious what your plan is Jeremy to make things better for the non hardcore. Because everything I've seen you post thus far continues to allow you to have complete control of the top end and everyone below you share the lesser stuff.

[Yinikren]

Pretty much what Garg said.

By default, in order to make Rogean happy and let you guys raid again, you aren't going to be happy with your own plan. You simply have to account for too many guilds. My plan does that.

I am all ears, however.

[khanable]

if a small faction of people is going to cockblock progress

LOL

[Alarti0001]

I'm very curious what your plan is Jeremy to make things better for the non hardcore. Because everything I've seen you post thus far continues to allow you to have complete control of the top end and everyone below you share the lesser stuff.

how do you figure that?

[quido]

I'm very curious what your plan is Jeremy to make things better for the non hardcore. Because everything I've seen you post thus far continues to allow you to have complete control of the top end and everyone below you share the lesser stuff.

Actually go look through my post history then, particularly from Supremacy's (Ungriim's) thread from last night.

[khanable]

Actually go look through my post history then, particularly from Supremacy's (Ungriim's) thread from last night.

i'm socialist casual scum and refuse to do work

provide me with links or I reject you

[quido]

oh well

[Ella`Ella]

Can we please consolidate these "Idea" posts into a single thread? I'm losing track of which posts that we're considering and which posts are totally fucking retarded.

[Byrjun]

Look, I really want to make this better for the nonhardcores here. But if a small faction of people is going to cockblock progress because they're not getting exactly what they want, and want to turn this into a "collecting votes" sort of situation, they're going to be sorely disappointed.

Holy shit, really.

[Yinikren]

I will work on consolidating the ideas into a single thread for discussion. They tend to get lost, however, which is why I originally suggested making posts for each one so they don't get lost in 50 pages of people defending their honor and pixels.

We really need raid forums.

[YendorLootmonkey]

I will work on consolidating the ideas into a single thread for discussion. They tend to get lost, however, which is why I originally suggested making posts for each one so they don't get lost in 50 pages of people defending their honor and pixels.

We really need raid forums.

Maybe put them in the Guild Discussion forum, where the Sky Rotation thread is... this is about guilds working stuff out, should be fine to put in there I would think.

[Yinikren]

Good idea Yendor. The ideas are still in the works though, so I didn't want to just drop a thread that doesn't necessarily have GM enforcement yet.

[Fountree]

Was gonna say, just give BDA the mobs already and stop their crying!

[Happyfeet]

So BDA just wants to go from getting only Vox and sometimes Inny if Taken isn't there, to getting 1/4 of the mobs once FE/IB and TMO exhaust their 25% for the week?

Sounds like a terrible plan for everyone.

[Troubled]

Regular repops, variance reduced to +-4 hrs, no poops and no camp outs with true races isn't unreasonable to talk about either, along with not shitting on a force clearing a plane while CT/Inny/Draco pop. They should get first crack at it. Keeps competitive juices flowing and knocks out all the bullshit if people play nice.


Hi, quit trying to throw us under the bus.

[Geofizzle]

So BDA just wants to go from getting only Vox and sometimes Inny if Taken isn't there, to getting 1/4 of the mobs once FE/IB and TMO exhaust their 25% for the week?

Sounds like a terrible plan for everyone.

But TMO doesn't like it, TMO doesn't get unbanned NA NA NA NEENER LOL. TMO Agrees to everythig or dies like Rogean says. Its the only fair way for these poor lvl 1s with rusty longswords in EC...cmon think about them once in awhile u dunce.

[Yinikren]

This wasn't BDAs plan. They just like my plan because it helps people who aren't in TMO.

[Geofizzle]

This wasn't BDAs plan. They just like my plan because it helps people who aren't in TMO.

You tell em! We're brothers in arms against the great Satan

[Yinikren]

Damn straight. Baramur actually remodeled off of my original idea, but its the same basic concept.

[Happyfeet]

Damn straight. Baramur actually remodeled off of my original idea, but its the same basic concept.

Well Baramur's idea is a fucking joke. So PD, which none of you can kill and most don't even have keys for, counts as nearly 1/3 of our allowance for the week? OOOOOOOOOk

So we can kill 3 mobs a week if they drop anything we actually need, makes plenty of sense.

[Geofizzle]

I say just give any guild not TMO all the mobs in vp, and if they don't like it they can send a PM direct to Rogean cuz he makes the rules anyawys lol. GMs tell us how to be better to our fellow elf and iksar and we can play better. Just like the government of the US and the NSA tell us how to be better ppl as well.

[Yinikren]

Sorry Happy, have to price the mobs so that more than one guild can raid. No way around that.

Three mobs a week per guild sounds like a pretty good milestone. You just get the honor of competing for tougher mobs Grats!

[Happyfeet]

Sorry Happy, have to price the mobs so that more than one guild can raid. No way around that.

Three mobs a week per guild sounds like a pretty good milestone. You just get the honor of competing for tougher mobs Grats!

If we get 3 mobs per week, you can just have them all, cause I and others will just quit. So GL with that.

We worked hard to get where we are; our DKP structure, our leadership, our trackers and tracker toons, our strategies we've developed, among many other aspects. If you think it's fair that you get 1/4 of the mobs for doing basically nothing, then grats on being spoon fed loot and I hope you feel so accomplished!

[Yinikren]

I would love to say I have some sympathy, but I don't. See my sig. I apologize.

Rogean called you guys out as the biggest issue for raiding on this server. He's holding your suspensions until you agree to some kind of raid fix.

You were at the top of the molehill. You will NEVER be satisfied with a decision the rest of the server will agree with because it will automatically involve you guys losing mobs to other guilds.

You guys can work with us and agree to something that benefits everyone with mobs, or you guys can continue to stay suspended - it makes no difference to me. I am not saying this to hold it over your head, I am saying this that you guys are in no position to try and claim 80+% of the mobs like you used to.

believe me - lots of guilds would love to never see you guys raid ever again. My point system, and this one as well, still gives you mobs. There is no rotation. You raid just like normal and compete for targets just like normal. All that's changed is you can't kill every fucking mob that spawns each week.

[MaksimMazor]

Casual scum

[Byrjun]

If we get 3 mobs per week, you can just have them all, cause I and others will just quit. So GL with that.

Why does TMO keep using quitting as a threat. If the options are other guilds don't get to experience any content, or all of TMO quits the server, I'll choose the latter 100%. And I have friends in TMO.

Less melodrama more pushing towards a fair raiding system.

[Fazlazen]

Improvised Bag Limit.

1st week of month. No Limit. Full server competition.

2nd week of month. 150 point bag limit.

3rd week of month 150 point bag limit.

4th week of month 150 point bag limit. (Month leader in kills 100 point bag limit.)


40 Point Mobs
Phara Dar
Trak
Cazic Thule
VS

30 Point mobs.
Sev, Inny, Fay, Noble Djorn

20 point Mobs.
Gore, Tal, Draco, Maestro, Xygozz, Hoshkar, Druushk, Siverwing, Nexona

Any mob found up for more then 4 hours will be open to engage free of limit.

this is fucking dumb, especially since 90% of you guys cant even enter VP. How can you even allow points for mobs you couldnt possibly kill...

[Yinikren]

You spend points not having to compete with casual scum. There are no free mobs.

[Ele]

I would think you of all people would support classic timers and removal of variance

I support both of those. That doesn't take away from the reasonableness (or lack there of) for people to spam aggro clickies for minutes/hours waiting for a spawn with or without variance.

[khanable]

I'd rather see the points exclusive to things outside of VP

Keep VP FFA. No limit. FTE rules, no trains. Compete until you hate your life.

[Ele]

Compete until you hate your life.

That's why some people "compete".

[Yinikren]

Mobs outside of VP would need a points increase if that was the case, because you are taking away one of the main reasons they would go there - to spend points NOT having to compete with every other guild.

The idea is still to moderate mob intake per guild so more guilds get attempts.

[Fazlazen]

Mobs outside of VP would need a points increase if that was the case, because you are taking away one of the main reasons they would go there - to spend points NOT having to compete with every other guild.

The idea is still to moderate mob intake per guild so more guilds get attempts.

So basically, having a force of player keyed to VP should penalize you.

[Yinikren]

No. You don't get penalized by getting better quality mobs. The idea of my thread (which is not this one, btw) is that guilds have to decide what mobs to pursue each week. You don't get VP handed to you for free. You get to go there and not have to compete with casual scum for normal mobs.

[Happyfeet]

Least that makes sense Cucumber. I'm not threatening to leave so I get what I want, I'm simply telling you what I am going to do if this carebear shit gets fully implemented.

I'm the first to invite other guilds on our raids (e.g. Talendor with Europa was fully my idea a few weeks ago) but I'm not going to stick around to kill 3 mobs a week. You all who are still leveling and gearing up have things to do in this game besides raid, I ONLY log in to raid. You have to see the difference.

And trying to count VP mobs against us is just nonsense. And it's not like we're not willing to accept some sort of agreement, but most of your attitudes are "You either do what we say or big mean rogean is gonna keep you suspended" and that's a bullshit attitude to have. Trust me, the idea proposed in this thread, is not going to be the one used - it's trash.

[Yinikren]

I've said it before, I will say it again - you will not like any of the raid terms you are going to have to agree to and abide by because none of them benefit your guild.

[Fazlazen]

which lead to your suspension, an RMT business coordinated within your ranks, and being shitty to the rest of the server for the sake of being able to claim dominance in RNF.

You have 20 of every epic piece banked and being sold in EC for whatever price you say because of the monopoly.

QUit crying about not be able to monopolize the content anymore. The raid scene is a changing, per Rogaen.

I cant wait for you and others to quit after these threats.

you really sounds mad at something... or somebody =D

[kotton05]

I blame AoE chardok for leveling people to TMO apps

[Garguren]

I don't think any guild deserves a handout of mobs. I just want to see it be a slightly more fair chance. Everyone in TMO seems to want to poop on BDA and dismiss them as an inferior guild. Yet we've been in VP we've killed the majority of the targets available (VP was before my time so I don't know what all was killed in there).

We simply refused to take part in the complete garbage that was VP / top end targets. We do not require people to poopsock, we do not require camped toons. We still put in tracking as hard as every other guild we still mobilize as fast as anyone else.

All I want to see is a raid scene that doesn't require the BS garbage that has ruled for so long. High end targets should require more then who can log in their 45th alt the fastest.

I am all for every guild (who wants to put in the time via tracking ect) to have a fair shot. Everyone wants to see the smaller guilds get a chance at raid targets, yet they do nothing currently to even Try to have a shot. Its hard to justify everyone simply stopping everything they can do so a guild who has done no work at all can slowly get people to log in and try to engage a target.

Rewards should go to those who put in the effort. However make the effort more about a good race and less about logging in pooped / alt toons and insta engage.

[quido]

Trying to engage in a serious discussion with Anthrax, Yendor, or Yinikren is futile. Do yourselves and favor, guilds, and keep these people out of the process when the time for formal negotiations comes.

[quido]

The fact that you don't even see the difference between those people is a testament to your blind stupidity.

[Yinikren]

I feel like I should defend my honor or someshit here, but my sig does that anyway. Thank you.

Still waiting on your ideas to allow 6-8 guilds the ability to raid on this server.

[quido]

Metallikus making shit up putting words in people's mouths for about the tenth time in 24 hours.

[Yinikren]

He's not, its from another thread. I said that 3 mobs per guild per week is probably a good milestone and Happyfeet started QQing about how he does nothing but raid and would quit if that was the case.

[Fazlazen]

Everyone in TMO seems to want to poop on BDA and dismiss them as an inferior guild. Yet we've been in VP we've killed the majority of the targets available (VP was before my time so I don't know what all was killed in there).



HAHAHAHAHA =P

[Happyfeet]

I almost thought the next sentence was more hilarious, "We simply refused to take part in the complete garbage that was VP / top end targets."

They just don't want pd loot, it's cool

[Turp_SmokinPurp]

TMO wants to dictate terms to the rest of us while they are on suspension for being shitheads. Its time to get some other opinions, views, ideas posted from the rest of the server's raiders (haven't heard much from divinity or Europa). All I see is tmo circle jerks dominating the threads with "if u guys do this carebear shit and only let us kill 3 mobs a week, we are leaving the server".

"Its time to get some other opinions, views, ideas posted from the rest of the server's raiders"
First off this quote by you... Have you only been reading the TMO comments in each thread? Because I believe every thread made about this in server chat was started by another guild or another raider besides TMO. And each is full of comments from OTHER NON TMO raiders. Of course you have your exception of a few select TMO that comment in every thread lol. Did TMO start even 1 thread about this topic yet though?
Ok you want some mobs. That is cool. And is being worked out...
A small give away of mobs monthly should of happened months/years ago (I know some TMO claims we tried it already (1 dragon a month? lol an normally was gore) but in reality most ideas like this was shot down fast by TMO leadership with the claim of "that has been offered/tried months ago".
So of course the old leaders in TMO do not want to give up even 1 mob. It is just the attitude some of the guild takes. Until GM forced. Which is now taking place + leadership changes so you will see some free mobs coming.

Now...
YOU ARE VERY VERY DUMB if you do not think the "Care bear" that some are calling for, will kill the server . Now I agree a few dragons or loots would not hurt. But that poll showing half the people wanting 0 competition and making everyone "equal" is just plain stupid!! Socialism EQ 101 . It would not work! It is not what this server was built on!
Why are you on project 1999 if you want a new age game where everyone has an equal chance?
There are 100's of games out there that offer instances, no corpse runs, and all around fair play. Example I raid 20+ hours a week for a dragon sword to kick your ass in PvP, Than people complain to the forums and now you can buy one with RMT or easy to attain currency in game. That type of game is everywhere. Go get it.

If its everquest you like but want it easy , than their are plenty of other servers to pick that offer what you want.

It is not just TMO that would leave if they totally redid this server . A lot of people would go. Why do you think EQ live has died out? Yet this server thrives? It is because of competition / nostalgia / classic everquest. Take out the nostalgia factor here an care bear the game like you want Metallica. A hell of a lot more than TMO would leave / quit. I guarantee it.
This server was made around competition an classic. Take that away and you will have just another EQ Emulator.

[Splorf22]

YOU ARE VERY VERY DUMB if you do not think the "Care bear" that some are calling for, will kill the server

You know I love you, Turp, but this is silly. If the GMs were to enforce a rotation it would in no way kill the server. For every hardcore/neckbeard/etc that left, 3 casuals would join or come back.

[Yinikren]

I agree with Loraen. If we get more people who WANT to raid because the server isn't under a monopoly... Then we are in a good place indeed. You saw how many people returned when TMO got their accounts banned and raid suspended. People were waiting for a reason to come back.

[khanable]

You know I love you, Turp, but this is silly. If the GMs were to enforce a rotation it would in no way kill the server. For every hardcore/neckbeard/etc that left, 3 casuals would join or come back.

yup

[Turp_SmokinPurp]

You know I love you, Turp, but this is silly. If the GMs were to enforce a rotation it would in no way kill the server. For every hardcore/neckbeard/etc that left, 3 casuals would join or come back.

Was not talking just a rotation here.
I have seen guilds calling for instances, no corpse runs, pok books, all dragons repop weekly, monthly, 0 competition is wanted, guilds lesser than IB FE TAKEN DIV BDA AND TMO getting free kills....
Do you think a guild just made yesterday should be included?
It is just way to silly some of the non sense I have read this week. If it was just IB FE TAKEN DIV BDA AND TMO. Than yes I agree to SOME type of rotation but, you want 100% no competition too bro? Killing competition and having 0 competition ON ALL mobs rotated WOULD hurt the server. I do not believe that some random guild that does not try AT all even when TMO is suspended should be included in any damned rotation for free mobs.
I left A-Team out because they did not attempt 1 mob yet. If they show they can try, than they deserve too.

[Garguren]

A rotation of the 6 major raiding guilds has some potential but I would like to make a slight tweak. Lets use Trak as the example. Rather then having one guild clear for this weeks trak, make it two. So the rotation would be comprised of 3 - 2 guild rotations. This promotes competitiveness and keeps the mobs moving amongst the guilds.

How to decide which guilds are paired I don't know for sure yet. I'm thinking something along the lines of the current guild + the guild who killed it the last time or a tiered guild system. Rank all the guilds 1,2,3 ect. 1 and 2 paired, 3 and 4 ect.

Expanding on this idea we would keep variance as it is (though ideally a bit more reasonable say max 1 day +/-. The first guild set of guilds in the rotation would get their crack at the first mob who spawns. (Regardless of what it is that's their mob for this rotation).

The next mob that spawns goes to the next set in the rotation ect. Also make it so if a mob has remained alive for say 12 hours, its ffa / moves onto the next person in line.

This in theory would keep a constant rotation and remain competitive while not guaranteeing any guild all the mobs.

Also VP would remain FTE and not be included in these rotations. As your guild gets the trak kills they can test the waters in VP at their own pace.

[Yinikren]

It seems like a good idea, but the rotations would never be able to change otherwise someone would get stuck competing with TMO each week... And that would just open animosity imo if the same guild keeps winning. Better to keep it even I think.

Also, rotations, handing out mobs, bush towers, etc.

[Garguren]

I think it would be good to have a constant flow of the guilds competing against different guilds. Some guilds use different tactics then others depending on the mob that spawned it could work really good or not work at all.

Also just thought about it, any guild wanting to be added into the rotation is free to compete on any target. If the beat the two guilds rotating they (in some way) are added to the rotation (this could be difficult if 1 guild had to be added, but perhaps they would be added randomly to a rotation).

[Yinikren]

I don't think any guilds who haven't raided are sitting here spitting out ideas.

[Ravager]

If we get 3 mobs per week, you can just have them all, cause I and others will just quit.

Sounds good to me. Then my friends who quit because they couldn't get one dragon in a month without putting in 160 hours of 'competition' against parked alt armies can come back and be tickled pink to get 3 mobs per week. My friends are nicer than you too.

[Ravager]

"Its time to get some other opinions, views, ideas posted from the rest of the server's raiders"
First off this quote by you... Have you only been reading the TMO comments in each thread? Because I believe every thread made about this in server chat was started by another guild or another raider besides TMO. And each is full of comments from OTHER NON TMO raiders. Of course you have your exception of a few select TMO that comment in every thread lol. Did TMO start even 1 thread about this topic yet though?
Ok you want some mobs. That is cool. And is being worked out...
A small give away of mobs monthly should of happened months/years ago (I know some TMO claims we tried it already (1 dragon a month? lol an normally was gore) but in reality most ideas like this was shot down fast by TMO leadership with the claim of "that has been offered/tried months ago".
So of course the old leaders in TMO do not want to give up even 1 mob. It is just the attitude some of the guild takes. Until GM forced. Which is now taking place + leadership changes so you will see some free mobs coming.

Now...
YOU ARE VERY VERY DUMB if you do not think the "Care bear" that some are calling for, will kill the server . Now I agree a few dragons or loots would not hurt. But that poll showing half the people wanting 0 competition and making everyone "equal" is just plain stupid!! Socialism EQ 101 . It would not work! It is not what this server was built on!
Why are you on project 1999 if you want a new age game where everyone has an equal chance?
There are 100's of games out there that offer instances, no corpse runs, and all around fair play. Example I raid 20+ hours a week for a dragon sword to kick your ass in PvP, Than people complain to the forums and now you can buy one with RMT or easy to attain currency in game. That type of game is everywhere. Go get it.

If its everquest you like but want it easy , than their are plenty of other servers to pick that offer what you want.

It is not just TMO that would leave if they totally redid this server . A lot of people would go. Why do you think EQ live has died out? Yet this server thrives? It is because of competition / nostalgia / classic everquest. Take out the nostalgia factor here an care bear the game like you want Metallica. A hell of a lot more than TMO would leave / quit. I guarantee it.
This server was made around competition an classic. Take that away and you will have just another EQ Emulator.

100%, no rules, no "carebear" competition killed the Red server. If it's Everquest you want hard, you're on the wrong server.

[Autotune]

I think the casual raiding guilds should keep pushing these point systems. There are only 3 guilds who are supposedly against it and there are tons of other guilds that could be for it.

Majority rules and the monopolizers seems to be afraid of being point systemed!

[radditsu]

I think the casual raiding guilds should keep pushing these point systems. There are only 3 guilds who are supposedly against it and there are tons of other guilds that could be for it.

Majority rules and the monopolizers seems to be afraid of being point systemed!

If you skew the system so that one guild can get more than 51%(or more) of mobs over a month then it would work. Uber guilds need to be uber. Competition gotta compete for dragons

[Ravager]

If you skew the system so that one guild can get more than 51%(or more) of mobs over a month then it would work. Uber guilds need to be uber. Competition gotta compete for dragons

No they don't. If they did, they'd be on Red where competition is the point.

[radditsu]

The point if red is to get up at 6am and fight dragons with no competition. Have you even kept up with that server? It's just silly.

[Happyfeet]

Sounds good to me. Then my friends who quit because they couldn't get one dragon in a month without putting in 160 hours of 'competition' against parked alt armies can come back and be tickled pink to get 3 mobs per week. My friends are nicer than you too.

They are? I'm about as fair and nice as they come. Anyone who knows me has seen me travel across the world to rez, port, buff, and hand out loot all the time to randoms. You don't know me.

Your friends who couldn't get a single dragon didn't try hard enough, cause we don't camp out for many dragons UNTIL our competition does. e.g. if a smaller guild camped at Naggy or Vox we typically wouldn't move chars there until a larger guild did.

[sedrie.bellamie]

I think the casual raiding guilds should keep pushing these point systems. There are only 3 guilds who are supposedly against it and there are tons of other guilds that could be for it.

Majority rules and the monopolizers seems to be afraid of being point systemed!

this seems well thought out and an informed opinion

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkPKV3hKZ0saXIHAryBtg74KHO61wJL vlT3MJOLoxYx8TGybIb8A

[radditsu]

this seems well thought out and an informed opinion

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkPKV3hKZ0saXIHAryBtg74KHO61wJL vlT3MJOLoxYx8TGybIb8A

I smell a wiff of riverwater and wooden crossing apparatus

[YendorLootmonkey]

Trying to engage in a serious discussion with Anthrax, Yendor, or Yinikren is futile. Do yourselves and favor, guilds, and keep these people out of the process when the time for formal negotiations comes.

It's because we call TMO out for what it is and we don't fall for your spin-doctoring, and you hate that. It's okay, we understand. :) Here's some more calling out for you:

We get it. The only thing wrong with the points system is it limits TMO after their points are spent for the week/month. Because so long as everyone has points to spend, it is full competition for FTE on the mobs just the way you guys want it to be. You know, the "competition" you all say you want. It's there so long as you don't blow through all your points trying to dominate everything, which is the exact issue Rogean wants us to solve. This solves it.

The problem you have is when your cup runneth dry and other guilds still have points to spend. You are too afraid that some guild you deem not "worthy" might get something you would rather go to either yourselves or another guild. And that, my friend, is just pure greed speaking. Admit it. Otherwise, what exactly is the problem with TMO sitting out a few mobs after they have gone after what mobs they wanted, killed them, and spent all of their points for the period? Are you THAT seriously afraid of losing pixels after 2 years of getting 80% of the non-VP content and mostly having VP to yourselves? Unbelievable.

[Autotune]

It's because we call TMO out for what it is and we don't fall for your spin-doctoring, and you hate that. It's okay, we understand. :) Here's some more calling out for you:

We get it. The only thing wrong with the points system is it limits TMO after their points are spent for the week/month. Because so long as everyone has points to spend, it is full competition for FTE on the mobs just the way you guys want it to be. You know, the "competition" you all say you want. It's there so long as you don't blow through all your points trying to dominate everything, which is the exact issue Rogean wants us to solve. This solves it.

The problem you have is when your cup runneth dry and other guilds still have points to spend. You are too afraid that some guild you deem not "worthy" might get something you would rather go to either yourselves or another guild. And that, my friend, is just pure greed speaking. Admit it. Otherwise, what exactly is the problem with TMO sitting out a few mobs after they have gone after what mobs they wanted, killed them, and spent all of their points for the period? Are you THAT seriously afraid of losing pixels after 2 years of getting 80% of the non-VP content and mostly having VP to yourselves? Unbelievable.

Hello there, friend, my name is Jeremy! What you suggest, friend, is socialism and socialism is bad. "Can we all say... BAD, Socialism is what?.... that's right kids... BAD!"

I'm sorry friend, I don't mean to rain on your party, but points are socialism. I won't say how or why they are, just know that they are and that's all that needs to be said.

Please Believe me.

[Ravager]

The point if red is to get up at 6am and fight dragons with no competition. Have you even kept up with that server? It's just silly.

Seriously? You don't see any irony here?

[YendorLootmonkey]

Hello there, friend, my name is Jeremy! What you suggest, friend, is socialism and socialism is bad. "Can we all say... BAD, Socialism is what?.... that's right kids... BAD!"

I'm sorry friend, I don't mean to rain on your party, but points are socialism. I won't say how or why they are, just know that they are and that's all that needs to be said.

Please Believe me.

LOL... get out of my head.

[Ravager]

Hello there, friend, my name is Jeremy! What you suggest, friend, is socialism and socialism is bad. "Can we all say... BAD, Socialism is what?.... that's right kids... BAD!"

I'm sorry friend, I don't mean to rain on your party, but points are socialism. I won't say how or why they are, just know that they are and that's all that needs to be said.

Please Believe me.

I had to look at your name to tell you two apart!

[radditsu]

Seriously? You don't see any irony here?

Yeah once a week too! Red competition so fierce

[Droog007]

If we get 3 mobs per week, you can just have them all, cause I and others will just quit. So GL with that.

We worked hard to get where we are; our DKP structure, our leadership, our trackers and tracker toons, our strategies we've developed, among many other aspects. If you think it's fair that you get 1/4 of the mobs for doing basically nothing, then grats on being spoon fed loot and I hope you feel so accomplished!

TMO: Please stop acting like doing all you did to evolve this ridiculous meta-game actually fucking entitles you to something. You were publicly castrated for a reason - get with the fucking program. People are sick of the way you jealously hoard the content on this nostalgia server.

[antracus]

[QUOTE=Happyfeet;1243050]If we get 3 mobs per week, you can just have them all, cause I and others will just quit. So GL with that.

Sounds like a great idea.