Am I the only one

[Skittlez]

That wants to smash in the faces of people who constantly think they need buffs when they are completely unnecessary?

Like... When I am in a full group and we have a Monk, Enchanter, Mage, Warrior, Paladin, and Shaman (me), I just feel like I should only be thinking about the Monks/tanks health and keeping regen up on them and my self. Oh, and haste of course for the melee. Not a fucking +24 str buff that has no noticeable effect on their dps unless you do hours and hours of comparing and analysis.

I never mind casting Regen/Haste, those are a necessity, just not all that other shit. I mean seriously. We aren't raiding bro, in fact, we are outside and 2 zones away from the nearest dungeon where the real tough guys are at.


Now this makes me sound like I just don't like to buff, but, that's not the case. Only whenever we DON'T need buffs and people pester the fuck out of me.

[indiscriminate_hater]

what if tank is overweight and losing agility? WAT THEN SKITTLEZ??

[Reguiy]

Why wouldn't you buff strength? Along with haste it's the only stat that has any affect on dps.

[Skittlez]

Why wouldn't you buff strength? Along with haste it's the only stat that has any affect on dps.

Cause I have low health due to spamming canni, greater heal, regen, and quickness. Why would you want the healer to have to take a break and slow the xp rate down because people just 'have' to have their buffs? If you take out all that extra downtime from having to buff, you can just deal with mob after mob after mob after mob. It's only a small difference, but given how long it takes to level in EQ, those extra mobs you squeeze in really make the difference in the long run.

It's just like how I never buff my self when I am soloing. Why? Because I have to waste extra time just sitting there watching my mana bar fill back up when I could have used that mana for that Scourge DoT that just faded. It just wastes too much time if you aren't doing something really worth while.

[Andervin]

dexplzkkthx

[radditsu]

Because slowing, healing, hp buffing, hasting, rooting cause the tank sucks at aggro, (just root tank til 51 guys geez), canni dancing, dogdog positioning, and anal with your mom takes enough mana. Live with jaundiced buffs.

[khanable]

If I group with a shaman and they don't immediately give me str/sta/dex/agi/talis I /q and add them to ignore later on when they're not online anymore.

[radditsu]

Another note. I always slowed with the second to worst slow too.

Deal with it. :)

[Reguiy]

Cause I have low health due to spamming canni, greater heal, regen, and quickness. Why would you want the healer to have to take a break and slow the xp rate down because people just 'have' to have their buffs? If you take out all that extra downtime from having to buff, you can just deal with mob after mob after mob after mob. It's only a small difference, but given how long it takes to level in EQ, those extra mobs you squeeze in really make the difference in the long run.

It's just like how I never buff my self when I am soloing. Why? Because I have to waste extra time just sitting there watching my mana bar fill back up when I could have used that mana for that Scourge DoT that just faded. It just wastes too much time if you aren't doing something really worth while.

Sounds like you need a real healer. Also could I get your IGN so I can grab a CHA buff every time I'm going to vendor my trash?

[Thulack]

Made the wrong class if you dont want to buff people with more then 2 things.

[Spitty]

Your idea of "unnecessary buffs" and mine are completely different.

I'm opting out of this one.

[radditsu]

Made the wrong class if you dont want to buff people with more then 2 things.

Nonfungi non clarity shammy ain't as mana rich as you think. Especially until torpor.

[Thulack]

Nonfungi non clarity shammy ain't as mana rich as you think. Especially until torpor.

well he did say he had chanter in group for C. have a 57 shaman with no fungi and will still buff people with agi if they ask.

[radditsu]

well he did say he had chanter in group for C. have a 57 shaman with no fungi and will still buff people with agi if they ask.

Not if you are healin.

[Spitty]

Excuses.

[Thulack]

Not if you are healin.

had a pally listed in his group makeup. they make excellent 2ndary healers since he already had a warrior to tank.

[sanforce]

you play a shaman, expect buff requests or solo.

[radditsu]

had a pally listed in his group makeup. they make excellent 2ndary healers since he already had a warrior to tank.

Im sure those 3 heals worth of mana helps.


Paladin. Literally lol. (Unless hes just churning that deepwater heal.


Shams just get epic and root solo 6 mobs at once. Screw groups.

[Reguiy]

Crack? 2 bandage classes? AND a pally for heals? You have cani bound....right?

[Thulack]

Im sure those 3 heals worth of mana helps.


Paladin. Literally lol. (Unless hes just churning that deepwater heal.


Shams just get epic and root solo 6 mobs at once. Screw groups.

you fail as a healer if you dont know what other classes are capable of doing. go look at pally heals sometime there bud.

Just to clarify for you. From 39-53 shamans and paladins have same healing power. from 53-57 shamans have sup heal til 57 when pally gets it. Learn your shit.

[Tantrix]

I just take whatever buffs casters give me, especially when I first join the group and mana is probably low from buffing everyone. If I ask for a buff, I say "when mana permits, could I have blah blah".

[Ahldagor]

defense wins loots.

[radditsu]

From 39 to 53 shamans heal for shit too. Not saying its just pallys.

But pallys suck and are hardly ever played right.

[Splorf22]

If I group with a shaman and they don't immediately give me str/sta/dex/agi/talis I /q and add them to ignore later on when they're not online anymore.

[Skittlez]

From 39 to 53 shamans heal for shit too. Not saying its just pallys.

But pallys suck and are hardly ever played right.

Not this Pally! I rock that shit.

[kaev]

you fail as a healer if you dont know what other classes are capable of doing. go look at pally heals sometime there bud.

Just to clarify for you. From 39-53 shamans and paladins have same healing power. from 53-57 shamans have sup heal til 57 when pally gets it. Learn your shit.

Shaman get specialization (even not alteration focussed it saves mana), canni, regen, and time to sit. Paladin can't compete with that because number of HP healed per cast is insignificant compared to sustained healing output when grinding. DW hat is nice for shortening downtime some when there's no Cleric in the group, but hardly powerful and pretty much useless as combat healing (unless you count PLing a level 5 in Crushbone.)

IOW, in actual play a Paladin has far less "healing power" than any half-competent half-awake Shaman who's not too drunk to remember which hotkey is which.

[Lazie]

Strength is a long term buff....Why would it be hard to cast it once an hour ?

[Skittlez]

Strength is a long term buff....Why would it be hard to cast it once an hour ?

almost all of my buffs last less than 30 min.. dunno what you're talkin bout

[Lazie]

almost all of my buffs last less than 30 min.. dunno what you're talkin bout

Must be pretty low level then. But yeah the time of those buffs extends greatly as you level. If you didn't want to be a buff bot you shouldn't roll a shaman.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Obviously it changes by group but you really need to simply manage what buffs go where. I'll buff with whatever I get asked for but here is the general breakdown for classes if they don't ask and I'm buffing anyways:

Myself (sham): junk buff, sow, regen, sta, tali
Tank: STR, sta, agi, Dex if warrior or proc, tali, haste, regen
DPS (rng, Rog): tali, STR, Dex if proc, haste
Casters: tali (if they want to overwrite shielding), sta, cha and regen for enc/nec.
Bard: cha, Dex, STR, tali
Others: tali, sta

If you request anything besides the preset buffs you're getting JB click buff if I have it but I'll still buff you when you request.

The thing is, in px groups, you eventually get a feeling for the needs of the group. If you're running oom or say at 15% mana perpetually and calling it out, the useless buffs (which you know to be useless to that class but buff with anyways because you were asked) start getting requested a lot less.

You can always try explaining as well why you don't want to throw agi on the Mage and really take charge of the situation.

[Skittlez]

Must be pretty low level then. But yeah the time of those buffs extends greatly as you level. If you didn't want to be a buff bot you shouldn't roll a shaman.

I am level 38. So you must be talking about 45+. Like I said before though, I don't mind buffing whats necessary, just not that extra bull shit.

[Skittlez]

Wtf.. Why the hell won't the rest of my sig pop up? I can't see my character names or anything after my picture..

[Kitsy]

Should have rolled a cleric. Shamans are nonstop workers, its just the way the class is.

And in your scenario the enchanter should be hasting the group since theirs is better, you have C which helps with mana regen and the paladin can throw you a few heals to help you out with canni.

[skipdog]

Shaman that won't buff melee with STR?

Jeez. Maybe you should try a different class...

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Yeah sorry I couldn't see your name. As you appear to have a fairly good understanding of the game, make an effort to politely let the person know about which buffs you think are important to their class.

Or just buff them and call for numerous med breaks while internalizing a large amount of resentment.

[baalzy]

Carry a bunch of bandages and have the monk or war bandage you up when you canni down. It'll get their BW skill up if it needs to be brought up and is pretty much mana-free healing.

People are also kinda easy to trick, you can use your lower level buffs if your mana is super low and as long as they see that little arm icon they'll be happy.

[myxomatosii]

That wants to smash in the faces of people who constantly think they need buffs when they are completely unnecessary?

Like... When I am in a full group and we have a Monk, Enchanter, Mage, Warrior, Paladin, and Shaman (me), I just feel like I should only be thinking about the Monks/tanks health and keeping regen up on them and my self. Oh, and haste of course for the melee. Not a fucking +24 str buff that has no noticeable effect on their dps unless you do hours and hours of comparing and analysis.

I never mind casting Regen/Haste, those are a necessity, just not all that other shit. I mean seriously. We aren't raiding bro, in fact, we are outside and 2 zones away from the nearest dungeon where the real tough guys are at.


Now this makes me sound like I just don't like to buff, but, that's not the case. Only whenever we DON'T need buffs and people pester the fuck out of me.

You don't Talisman casters because it overwrites their shield.

http://i.imgur.com/rEUEFn2.png

EDIT: Instead of removing my old chart I just added this one, I had forgotten a few spells. Probably still did but I'm done editing now, its all mostly common sense anyway.

http://i.imgur.com/d50ZSrg.png

[Skittlez]

just buff them and call for numerous med breaks while internalizing a large amount of resentment.

I haven't thought about this. Then I can show them how unnecessary all that extra crap is when we could be gettin them xp's

[DrKvothe]

Group makeup is the deciding factor. Do we have an enchanter and a dedicated healer? I'm on every requested buff, no matter how silly, and I'm slowing every mob and rooting as necessary.

Do we not have an enchanter? That adds responsibilities to me: root parking mobs and hasting melees very frequently. I also have to do this without clarity. Under these circumstances, my mana is typically what's holding the group up, and buffs other than haste on anyone but the tank and puller are going to have to wait.

Am I the dedicated healer? If we have an enchanter, this can work fine. Everyone gets everything they want. If I don't have c2 and mobs are unusually magic resistant (wastes lots of my mana), I'm back to limited buffs.

Clicky buffs are fine, but in the types of groups where i dont have mana to cast top-notch buffs, I don't have the time to buff people with clicky buffs. Retardedly long cast times x multiple melees x multiple buffs is a lot of missed canni'ing. Even with the clickies not setting gcd.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

I haven't thought about this. Then I can show them how unnecessary all that extra crap is when we could be gettin them xp's

Unfortunately that would be externalizing it (showing them). You need to harbor that anger deep within your being and maybe make angry posts on the boards about it :p

[Skittlez]

Group makeup is the deciding factor. Do we have an enchanter and a dedicated healer? I'm on every requested buff, no matter how silly, and I'm slowing every mob and rooting as necessary.

Do we not have an enchanter? That adds responsibilities to me: root parking mobs and hasting melees very frequently. I also have to do this without clarity. Under these circumstances, my mana is typically what's holding the group up, and buffs other than haste on anyone but the tank and puller are going to have to wait.

Am I the dedicated healer? If we have an enchanter, this can work fine. Everyone gets everything they want. If I don't have c2 and mobs are unusually magic resistant (wastes lots of my mana), I'm back to limited buffs.

Clicky buffs are fine, but in the types of groups where i dont have mana to cast top-notch buffs, I don't have the time to buff people with clicky buffs. Retardedly long cast times x multiple melees x multiple buffs is a lot of missed canni'ing. Even with the clickies not setting gcd.


Part of it to is that I am spec'd in conjuration while I level up. I mostly solo so, yeah

[DrKvothe]

Additionally, I didn't find it worthwhile to slow mobs until I got the lvl 39 slow (togor's). Just not worth the mana since your tank won't be taking much damage in his lvl 50+ gear and your dps will be ripping through mobs so fast.

So if you're taking that burden on yourself before 39, consider how your group members feel about it. Will they be more butthurt with fewer buffs but a bit less incoming damage, or will they even notice if you're not slowing and be extremely content with their laundry list of useless buffs. I mean, that monk needs his charisma in case a merchant wanders by, amirite?

[RiffDaemon]

http://i.imgur.com/rEUEFn2.png

Bookmarked. Lambsie's going to get lots of attention pretty soon.

[Khaleesi]

That wants to smash in the faces of people who constantly think they need buffs when they are completely unnecessary?

Like... When I am in a full group and we have a Monk, Enchanter, Mage, Warrior, Paladin, and Shaman (me), I just feel like I should only be thinking about the Monks/tanks health and keeping regen up on them and my self. Oh, and haste of course for the melee. Not a fucking +24 str buff that has no noticeable effect on their dps unless you do hours and hours of comparing and analysis.

I never mind casting Regen/Haste, those are a necessity, just not all that other shit. I mean seriously. We aren't raiding bro, in fact, we are outside and 2 zones away from the nearest dungeon where the real tough guys are at.


Now this makes me sound like I just don't like to buff, but, that's not the case. Only whenever we DON'T need buffs and people pester the fuck out of me.

If you're speaking to the point of whether other people should be involved in the micro management of the group (of which includes buffs), then that depends on the people.
My advisement to you is, be thankful of when people do care enough to discuss it, as often too many are oblivious or not concerned until it's too late.

I'd rather be questioned about what I am doing, to which I can give a fair answer and if it is determined I am doing something wrong, then we can discuss it.
Given that it's a video game, I would like to think that ego can be put aside as the objective is to be good at the game, not be good at being cool on the internet.

If it bothers you that much, then tell the person you understand they are interested, though you are confident you have it under control.

For myself I have found that usually not receiving buffs and/or not receiving the ones you request, is not down to any miscommunication or that you do not 'require' them, rather it's simply that the buffer is unaware, uninterested, doesn't care, is ignoring you(?) and/or they are ignorant and don't understand or believe it's worth their mana.

If casters run out of mana and we have to discuss as a group WHY it's happening - to then find out it was over buffing to which we can all compromise and not request as many. This is better than people not receiving buffs and then a fight starts.

[bigsykedaddy]

The way I look at it is I am max STR with a shamans STR buff. This means as a Rogue I can swap out my mithril arms / crested helmet / dwarven work boots etc for Mrylokar, because when evade fails on you back to back and that bad ass in seb spins around you are gonna want that extra AC

[Atmas]

Sounds like you are playing the wrong class. Shaman's are buff whores. I maybe could have agreed with you if it was something like casters asking for agility, but melee should definitely be getting those strength buffs. More str is a direct increase to damage and the gains are not insignificant.

At lower levels it's very normal for a shaman to buff out a group and then say lom from buffing, no one should be surprised.

Just on a side note my 59 Paly heals pretty well. Granted, I have had a DW BP on him since I could click it so I used Symbol buff as a mana free 307 hpt heal. So that has made it feasible to solo and duo a lot. But even with just weaker heal clicky and mana heals I can heal a person chain tanking mobs or toss heals when a group is in a pinch.

[August]

For me it just depends on what camp we're at and the group make up.

I was in CoM at a camp I could solo the other day but people wanted exp and CoM was full so I expanded to a full group. I had several people asking me for the full gamut of buffs for the hard camp and I just kind of laughed. I was soloing the camp before everyone arrived - why do I need to spend all my mana buffing these guys when I was full-clearing the camp by myself?

They complained and complained, so I left. No, I don't think you need dexterity. No, I don't think you need Health - especially when i'm tanking with slow.

Enchanters, if charming, get talisman, agility, and charisma
Tanks, if tanking, get str, (dex if proc wep), health, talisman, chloro
Healers get talisman, chloro
DPS get nothing but jaundiced bone clicks. Sorry dudes, you shouldn't be taking damage. You can have furious strength from my clicky, though.

[Spitty]

Enchanters, if charming, get talisman, agility, and charisma
Tanks, if tanking, get str, (dex if proc wep), health, talisman, chloro
Healers get talisman, chloro
DPS get nothing but jaundiced bone clicks. Sorry dudes, you shouldn't be taking damage. You can have furious strength from my clicky, though.

Wtf?

Chanters get talisman but tanks don't get agi and DPS gets budget buffs?

Your priorities need re-evaluating.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Wtf?

Chanters get talisman but tanks don't get agi and DPS gets budget buffs?

Your priorities need re-evaluating.

This.

Stembolts diagram is simple but effective.

[Kutsumo]

On monk, if I'm pulling, I'm going to expect HP, regen, and str. On rogue, just str (and haste if no enc). Unless you really don't have enough mana to cast it, I don't think it's too much to ask and I think it's pretty dumb to get all bitchy about it. Play a different class if you don't want part of your role to include buffing.

My only disagreement with that chart is giving rogues dex. We don't use proc weapons unless we want to die and certainly don't need to make them proc more often.

[Orruar]

So you have an enc in the group and you're the one doing haste? And then you whine about having to do a str buff every 30-60 min, a buff that is actually wildly mana efficient compared to any form of dps you may have? Fuck off, scrub shaman.

[DrKvothe]

Atmas, there's a level range where it's really an issue of choosing amongst buffs when there's just not enough mana for everything. At 29, your healer won't have cheal, so you should regen the tank, puller, and yourself (300 mana every ~10 min). All melee, let's say you've got 3 of them, are going to want quickness if you don't have an enchanter (240 mana ever ~10 min).

You'll be meditating ~12 mana per tick if you don't miss a tick, and you'll be regen'ing 8 hp per tick if you're barb/ogre, 11 if you're iksar/troll. Assuming you take no hits and never cap out on hp, you're getting 20 mana for every 50 hp you regen.

So for a barb/ogre, that's 15.2 mana per tick and for iksar/troll it's 16.4 mana per tick. You tick ~100 times between rebuffs. So for an untwinked shm doing everything he can to max his mana regen, barb/ogre's mana regen is 1520 mana and iksar/troll's is 1640 mana between necessary buffs.

So just minimal regen/haste at lvl 29 is going to take up 32.9 to 35.5% of maximum mana regen (assuming no external heals). No lvl 29 shaman is going to actually hit that 1520 or 1640 mana per 10 min mark, however, and the real number is likely going to be ~50% of mana regen just for those 2 buffs.

People will expect emergency roots and backup heals at least. That's easily most of the remaining mana. Sometimes additional buffs just don't fit the mana budget.

[August]

Wtf?

Chanters get talisman but tanks don't get agi and DPS gets budget buffs?

Your priorities need re-evaluating.

I think you're overvaluing the buffs that I have.

I'm also not a 60 shaman. My click buffs are currently the same as my actual buffs :) bahahahhahah

Oh and enchanter only gets talisman if he's charming. If he's not he can get a life.

[freez]

woah

[Spitty]

I think you're overvaluing the buffs that I have.

I'm also not a 60 shaman. My click buffs are currently the same as my actual buffs :) bahahahhahah

Oh and enchanter only gets talisman if he's charming. If he's not he can get a life.

I'd get some jaundiced boots and click some agi on your tank, then :). I'm also surprised your chanters aren't using their Shielding line over Talisman, especially if they're charming casters.

[Bill Tetley]

you're a shaman... it's what you do. reroll wizard?

[Ele]

anyone but main/secondary tank asking for hero and symbol for Xygoz fight SMH

[freez]

I'd get some jaundiced boots and click some agi on your tank, then :). I'm also surprised your chanters aren't using their Shielding line over Talisman, especially if they're charming casters.

who charms casters

besides me that ONE TIME

[Spitty]

Is this a serious question, because I don't know if I can give you a serious answer.

[freez]

some pro chanters on blue charmin casters for them deeps

[August]

Is this a serious question, because I don't know if I can give you a serious answer.

Charming casters is way more of a thing in KC / Seb than it is in CoM - which is where I've been grouping lately.

I'm actually playing the shaman my wife was playing before she hit 40 and decided that EQ wasn't for her. I stripped the SK I had (because who likes SK? geez) and twinked my shaman out, so my experience is completely subjective on level 40-48, the entirety of it being spent in CoM.

Just because I have an opinion doesn't mean I'm even remotely correct about anything.

[Spitty]

That answers that.

[freez]

Charming casters is way more of a thing in KC / Seb than it is in CoM - which is where I've been grouping lately.

I'm actually playing the shaman my wife was playing before she hit 40 and decided that EQ wasn't for her. I stripped the SK I had (because who likes SK? geez) and twinked my shaman out, so my experience is completely subjective on level 40-48, the entirety of it being spent in CoM.

Just because I have an opinion doesn't mean I'm even remotely correct about anything.

sorry to inform you there are no casters in com.


no point in charming casters. you must repent

[Spitty]

Charming casters is way more of a thing in KC / Seb than it is in CoM - which is where I've been grouping lately.

I'm actually playing the shaman my wife was playing before she hit 40 and decided that EQ wasn't for her. I stripped the SK I had (because who likes SK? geez) and twinked my shaman out, so my experience is completely subjective on level 40-48, the entirety of it being spent in CoM.

Just because I have an opinion doesn't mean I'm even remotely correct about anything.

I was more talking about the freez. Tons of people charm casters - free manatap on charm breaks.

[August]

I was more talking about the freez. Tons of people charm casters - free manatap on charm breaks.

Yes my main (in your guild, btw, hi!) is an enchanter :) Love me some theft of thought. I also love that when they break they start casting on me instead of wailing on me. Basically I thought, hrm, I already play an overpowered class - why don't i play another?

[freez]

the mana wasted keeping a charmed caster is in no way replenished with a theft of thought.

you want to argue with me about charming casters... pls l2p

[freez]

Yes my main (in your guild, btw, hi!)

hi but you are not in my guild bro

[August]

the mana wasted keeping a charmed caster is in no way replenished with a theft of thought.

you want to argue with me about charming casters... pls l2p

I'll bite - why is mana 'wasted' on charming a caster versus any other mob? There are some camps where casters are everywhere and ToT is a nonbo, but in places like KC basement where everything is a skeleton warrior, there's no way I'm taking anything but a caster downstairs. At least i GET a ToT target every break, and by ToT'ing it I reduce the mana it has so it casts less and melees more - it still has the same hit table as other mobs.

[August]

hi but you are not in my guild bro

Also is your avatar the dwarf from the hobbit?

[Atmas]

Atmas, there's a level range where it's really an issue of choosing amongst buffs when there's just not enough mana for everything. At 29, your healer won't have cheal, so you should regen the tank, puller, and yourself (300 mana every ~10 min). All melee, let's say you've got 3 of them, are going to want quickness if you don't have an enchanter (240 mana ever ~10 min).

You'll be meditating ~12 mana per tick if you don't miss a tick, and you'll be regen'ing 8 hp per tick if you're barb/ogre, 11 if you're iksar/troll. Assuming you take no hits and never cap out on hp, you're getting 20 mana for every 50 hp you regen.

So for a barb/ogre, that's 15.2 mana per tick and for iksar/troll it's 16.4 mana per tick. You tick ~100 times between rebuffs. So for an untwinked shm doing everything he can to max his mana regen, barb/ogre's mana regen is 1520 mana and iksar/troll's is 1640 mana between necessary buffs.

So just minimal regen/haste at lvl 29 is going to take up 32.9 to 35.5% of maximum mana regen (assuming no external heals). No lvl 29 shaman is going to actually hit that 1520 or 1640 mana per 10 min mark, however, and the real number is likely going to be ~50% of mana regen just for those 2 buffs.

People will expect emergency roots and backup heals at least. That's easily most of the remaining mana. Sometimes additional buffs just don't fit the mana budget.

It depends on what you consider extra. It's hard for me to call strength ever extra. It's 60 mana for 45 minutes (if the wiki numbers are right, I admit they often aren't). Or for the case of 3 melees about 40 mana every 10 minutes, pretty small.

Of course the real significance of any measureable buff is value/cost. At this point I really would just be making up numbers but the last toon I played in this range is my 36 rogue. Let say I'm in a group that pulls one mob a minute (I think its usually faster). He has some decent gear so that 26 str would actually take him to cap, I think other characters benefit more than he does. Here is the real out of the air number, lets say he does just an extra 20 hpts of damage per mob or per minute. If that is true its 900 more damage over 45 minutes. Which equates to a 1 mana per 15 damage ratio, which is pretty awesome and far and away better than any casted DoT or Nuke.

[freez]

I'll bite - why is mana 'wasted' on charming a caster versus any other mob? There are some camps where casters are everywhere and ToT is a nonbo, but in places like KC basement where everything is a skeleton warrior, there's no way I'm taking anything but a caster downstairs. At least i GET a ToT target every break, and by ToT'ing it I reduce the mana it has so it casts less and melees more - it still has the same hit table as other mobs.

the dmg put out by a hasted dual wielding melee does 3x the dps of a charmed caster.


also once casters get oom they spam dispells and blinds.


with color slant and boltrans you can recharm with out taking one melee if youre decent.

[Spitty]

the mana wasted keeping a charmed caster is in no way replenished with a theft of thought.

you want to argue with me about charming casters... pls l2p

Get fucked. You don't know what you're talking about.

[freez]

basicly its more dangerous to sit around with a shitty charmed pet that breaks as often as a melee. you want to get in and finished with combat asap. if you have some terrible caster pet that is oom spammin dispells you have to re root it often, you are in fights for twice the duration which equals DANGER !

nawm sayin?

[August]

the dmg put out by a hasted dual wielding melee does 3x the dps of a charmed caster.


also once casters get oom they spam dispells and blinds.


with color slant and boltrans you can recharm with out taking one melee if youre decent.

Do you have numbers to back up your 3x claim? I'd be interested to see parses of different charmed mobs. I haven't played ENC in over a year and when I did was i was just charming the zol knights in seb or melee skellies in HS.

That being said, I can definitely see the value of charming a caster in a mana tight scenario, such as KC basement.

Also, is your avatar Thorin Oakenshield? That's who I see when I see him.

[freez]

Get fucked. You don't know what you're talking about.

im glad you have alot of points to argue about this topic.

oh wait you dont.

[HippoNipple]

Cause I have low health due to spamming canni, greater heal, regen, and quickness. Why would you want the healer to have to take a break and slow the xp rate down because people just 'have' to have their buffs? If you take out all that extra downtime from having to buff, you can just deal with mob after mob after mob after mob. It's only a small difference, but given how long it takes to level in EQ, those extra mobs you squeeze in really make the difference in the long run.

It's just like how I never buff my self when I am soloing. Why? Because I have to waste extra time just sitting there watching my mana bar fill back up when I could have used that mana for that Scourge DoT that just faded. It just wastes too much time if you aren't doing something really worth while.

In your example you have an enchanter. How about you drop the haste and let the pro do that, while you stick to the str buff. Win/Win.

[freez]

Do you have numbers to back up your 3x claim? I'd be interested to see parses of different charmed mobs. I haven't played ENC in over a year and when I did was i was just charming the zol knights in seb or melee skellies in HS.

That being said, I can definitely see the value of charming a caster in a mana tight scenario, such as KC basement.

no. i dont parse to confirm dps of charmed pets.

charmed hasted pets in seb quad once every 1.5 seconds. if it stops to cast a 500 pt nuke that takes 5 secodns to cast, you just lost alot of dps.

the biggest problem is the fact it chain dispells your mob. you want that rooted. this is im sure very obvious.

[freez]

Also, is your avatar Thorin Oakenshield? That's who I see when I see him.


riff raff bro

[Spitty]

Why does everything immediately have to be an argument with you?

Civil discussion is just too challenging, is that it?

Why you gotta come into this thread, rustle up all these nice people? Got nothing better to do than to come into Skittlez's thread and SHOW YOUR ASS?

[August]

no. i dont parse to confirm dps of charmed pets.

charmed hasted pets in seb quad once every 1.5 seconds. if it stops to cast a 500 pt nuke that takes 5 secodns to cast, you just lost alot of dps.

the biggest problem is the fact it chain dispells your mob. you want that rooted. this is im sure very obvious.

Hrm... my experience when I was forced to charm wizards in seb is that they do a shitton of damage and when they stop they start melee'ing w/ the same max hit as their melee counterparts. Like you, i don't parse so I don't know if they are necessarily doing way less damage, but it never felt that way.

I've never had a problem w/ a caster dispelling my roots, but then again I'm not your typical chanter that solos a lot. I like to group with people, and I'm usually juggling buffing everyone, mezzing, and charming. Having my pet break and start casting a slow spell that gets cancelled by a quick mez instead of getting multiple hits on me can be really awesome versus mobs being in camp needing CC and getting bashed/wailed on by my VoG'ed quadding knight.

i tend to take situations 1 by 1. That being said, i'll keep your advice in mind next time i'm on my enc.

Also, is your avatar Thorin Oakenshield? - edit saw you answered this. who is riff raff?

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

There's merits to both for sure. It's nice having a quad pet who absolutely rapes but it can be somewhat unruly. I personally the damage output difference in a full group makes a caster more appealing with a smaller group (duo/trio) benefitting more from greater DPS.

Best pets IMO are SK's. Vampiric curse on a hasted weaponized pet is unreal for longevity. Add in some staves and it starts to get stupid.

[freez]

Why does everything immediately have to be an argument with you?

Civil discussion is just too challenging, is that it?

Why you gotta come into this thread, rustle up all these nice people? Got nothing better to do than to come into Skittlez's thread and SHOW YOUR ASS?

Get fucked. You don't know what you're talking about.


delusional disgruntled retard confirmed

[Spitty]

Also, is your avatar Thorin Oakenshield? - edit saw you answered this. who is riff raff?

It's a 40-year-old Skrillex.

http://cdn.pigeonsandplanes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/skril-richkidsbrand.jpg

[Spitty]

delusional disgruntled retard confirmed

Nah. I just group with people who know their shit.

You and I have never grouped for precisely that reason.

[freez]

its called color slant

if i can handle a charmed krup knight with vog and weapons solo all day in seb theres no reason why someone in a group needs a caster. I promise you its alot less dps.

on blue u cant even hit other players with your aoe stun, if you arent charming the meanest beast you can find youre not top tier.

color slant is a long enough stun to cast, and land your boltrans before stun wears.

its so easy its not even funny.

[freez]

Nah. I just group with people who know their shit.

You and I have never grouped for precisely that reason.

not really sure if you think im someone else. I quit blue before A team killed fungi king.

wtf are u so angry?

[Spitty]

Best pets IMO are SK's. Vampiric curse on a hasted weaponized pet is unreal for longevity. Add in some staves and it starts to get stupid.

Rogues. Rogues are the best.

60 enc with an imp pet in SolB is pants-shittingly terrifying dps.

[Spitty]

not really sure if you think im someone else. I quit blue before A team killed fungi king.

wtf are u so angry?

I killed fungi king before A-Team even existed.

WHAT THE FUCK NOW, BITCH.

[freez]

careful before u get your forum name b b b banned for raging like an idiot in server chat for no reason.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Rogues. Rogues are the best.

60 enc with an imp pet in SolB is pants-shittingly terrifying dps.

I should have specified caster pets. Although an SK isn't a true caster it loosely fits the definition. Rogues are definitely the best all around but they're few and far between (for good reason lol).

[Spitty]

careful before u get your forum name b b b banned for raging like an idiot in server chat for no reason.

Thank you for coming into a thread about buffing and sharing your expertise.

You can go back to the Land of Half-Rate Enchanters or wherever it was you came from.

[freez]

youre very welcome maam

[pasi]

There's merits to charming some casters, but for the most part - pure melee mobs are much better since you don't get the DPS loss and Pell-spam that Freez mentioned.

You do run into scenarios where you need to charm a mob due to it's location, and whether or not it is a caster is irrelevant. If you HS or Seb farm items like a pro - this is actually the case the majority of the time - you use what's there.

There are also mobs that are casters that simply have way better stats than other mobs of the same level.

Anyhow, back to OP - STR melee DPS, STR/STA/DEX the tank, and tell everyone else to fuck right off.

[eqravenprince]

If you are always grouping with an enchanter, you shouldn't be buffing haste anyhow, the enchanter should. As far as Strength goes, let's say it only boosts the each melee toon's dps by only .05 dps. Not much you say, but let's do the math. 3 melee toons in your group, so that's .15 dps which is 9 extra damage a minute and the buff lasts 45 minutes, so you get 405 extra damage. Not bad for 180 mana. That's more damage and mana efficient than your dots and I'm being extremely convervative on how much strength boosts damage. Maybe I'm wrong though.

[Skittlez]

So you have an enc in the group and you're the one doing haste? And then you whine about having to do a str buff every 30-60 min, a buff that is actually wildly mana efficient compared to any form of dps you may have? Fuck off, scrub shaman.

That "group" was thrown together by my imagination. Way to get upset over a random example. Fuck off, scrub forum quester.

[Orruar]

That "group" was thrown together by my imagination. Way to get upset over a random example. Fuck off, scrub forum quester.

You picked the group, not me. So don't get upset that you failed to recognize that when you have an enchanter in group, you no longer need to worry about haste. That's a fair bit of wasted on mana on "your spell would not take hold" messages.

[Skittlez]

Unfortunately that would be externalizing it (showing them). You need to harbor that anger deep within your being and maybe make angry posts on the boards about it :p

Lol'd

[Orruar]

If you are always grouping with an enchanter, you shouldn't be buffing haste anyhow, the enchanter should. As far as Strength goes, let's say it only boosts the each melee toon's dps by only .05 dps. Not much you say, but let's do the math. 3 melee toons in your group, so that's .15 dps which is 9 extra damage a minute and the buff lasts 45 minutes, so you get 405 extra damage. Not bad for 180 mana. That's more damage and mana efficient than your dots and I'm being extremely convervative on how much strength boosts damage. Maybe I'm wrong though.

Extremely conservative is right. It's probably more like 1-3 dps difference in the mid 40s, putting the efficiency at something like 50-100 damage per mana.

[freez]

shm having trouple keeping a 30 minute str buff on his melees

u prolly just skrewed yourself out of any group from now on.

good god

[Skittlez]

You picked the group, not me. So don't get upset that you failed to recognize that when you have an enchanter in group, you no longer need to worry about haste. That's a fair bit of wasted on mana on "your spell would not take hold" messages.

Lol, this guy.

[freez]

this middle of the mall bullshit right here is why i cant play on a blue server


shamans wont buff melees

chanters charming casters

god knows what else

[Itap]

This is like an Enchanter complaining about CCing mobs in a group setting

[Spitty]

He's right.

He also glossed over the part where you invented an imaginary group and fucked that right up from the get-go. Real groups must be a considerable challenge.

Perhaps you were just too...hasty...in your original post due to all the uncontrollable rage.

[Orruar]

Lol, this guy.

Ya, sorry for pointing out the obvious. I do feel pity for anyone who posts a "am i the only one" thread only to find out that they are indeed the only one.

[Spitty]

this middle of the mall bullshit right here is why i cant play on a blue server


shamans wont buff melees

chanters charming casters

god knows what else

Nothing you listed is anywhere near as bad as the evil you've committed here today.

I was so, so fucking very much better off before I knew what and who a "Riff Raff" was. This is a sad day in history, and really a sad state of humanity in general.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

All of our jimmies could use a therapeutic unrustling.

As a recent DeVry graduate I can lend my services to those willing to seek help for their forum transgressions or otherwise inflammatory forum activity. PM me for assistance.

[Itap]

All of our jimmies could use a therapeutic unrustling.

As a recent DeVry graduate I can lend my services to those willing to seek help for their forum transgressions or otherwise inflammatory forum activity. PM me for assistance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdM7vNOgGPM

[indiscriminate_hater]

That "group" was thrown together by my imagination. Way to get upset over a random example. Fuck off, scrub forum quester.

time to abandon thread bro

[myxomatosii]

I forgot a few spells, there.

http://i.imgur.com/d50ZSrg.png

[Skittlez]

time to abandon thread bro

*abandons ship*

[Babayaaga]

I forgot a few spells, there.

http://i.imgur.com/d50ZSrg.png

Necros will always want more HPs. Might want to re-evaluate lumping them in with all INT casters on HP buffs.

[Swish]

Cause I have low health due to spamming canni, greater heal, regen, and quickness. Why would you want the healer to have to take a break and slow the xp rate down because people just 'have' to have their buffs?

I have to waste extra time just sitting there watching my mana bar fill back up when I could have used that mana for that Scourge DoT that just faded. It just wastes too much time if you aren't doing something really worth while.

Didn't read past the first page... but you're saying you'd rather throw a scourge dot on one mob, than give a monk/rogue a STR buff that'll last an hour?

Oh boy...time you rerolled Skittlez :/

[Skittlez]

Didn't read past the first page... but you're saying you'd rather throw a scourge dot on one mob, than give a monk/rogue a STR buff that'll last an hour?

Oh boy...time you rerolled Skittlez :/

Yeah.. I think it's why I play my paladin 90% of the time.

I really only enjoy soloing with ma shammy.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

I think what the OP is actually talking about is, some players like to tell other players how to play their class.

As an enchanter, we can be pulling everything in sight with zero deaths for hours, perfectly fine gameplay, but still, some shitsberg will come along, who will ask me what level root I am using, or offer me helpful advice about how to "med smarter."

These same sort of players will also usually eventually question your gear choices.

My approach is, I just say, I've spent a lot of time in prayer asking Jesus, how should I play everquest, and Jesus told me to be the half-retarded/ half-badass player I am.

Don't even deal with people who try to tell you how to play your class. Just let it go. Unless you actually do suck. But ya know, I am going to rank "shaman who does not cast every buff" WAY down my shitlist from "melee who seems to be afk half the time."

Utility classes pwn. Tell them to focus on their own shit, cuz you got yours reasonably on lock down.

[Skittlez]

I think what the OP is actually talking about is, some players like to tell other players how to play their class.

As an enchanter, we can be pulling everything in sight with zero deaths for hours, perfectly fine gameplay, but still, some shitsberg will come along, who will ask me what level root I am using, or offer me helpful advice about how to "med smarter."

These same sort of players will also usually eventually question your gear choices.

My approach is, I just say, I've spent a lot of time in prayer asking Jesus, how should I play everquest, and Jesus told me to be the half-retarded/ half-badass player I am.

Don't even deal with people who try to tell you how to play your class. Just let it go. Unless you actually do suck. But ya know, I am going to rank "shaman who does not cast every buff" WAY down my shitlist from "melee who seems to be afk half the time."

Utility classes pwn. Tell them to focus on their own shit, cuz you got yours reasonably on lock down.

[Fregar]

I also agree peoples should sometimes mind theire own business
This is A GAME after all, not a work.

Another example of this is how peoples now expect every ench to manage a full time charmed pet in group, while in the past they were happy enough with mezzes and buff.
I don't deny it gives a serious bump to group efficiency, but still it's enlightening a change in mentality.

I believe it come from RL work "market".
It may be different in some countrie, but in mine working life has become worse year after year:
Now everywhere you go, your boss expects you to be as fast as fastest employee and to do 10% better than last year.
You can't be just good, you have to be BEST.

I guess that's why I allways enjoyed soloing, and why I quit EQ live after POP: this "game" became a work and was not an entertainment anymore.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

I do not charm a pet. If I wanted to play a mage, I'd roll a mage. It is typical min/max bullshitism that freaks out if you are not maxing a parse.

I played eq2, or, as I eventually called it, a GUI for ACT. A bunch of burned out gamers punching buttons and macros, and then comparing how they ranked on the parse log, every single damn mob, even for just killing trash mobs.

I eventually found a guild which banned talking about ACT in chat or Vent during raids. We killed shit dead, owned all avatars, and did not spend every minute trying to quantify our epeens. That was actually fun eq2.

This min/max bullshit makes me think I'm gaming with some dude from accounting. Fuck that noise.

edit: in eq2, chanters were mighty dps class. I usually was in the top 5 on raids, outparsing rogues. So it's not like I can't do it, it is just kind of drag, imo, to reduce the game to that. Different players, different styles. The only real question is, can you kill shit dead?

[Clark]

If you don't buff, you're wrong

[Clark]

I forgot a few spells, there.

http://i.imgur.com/d50ZSrg.png

Haha nice. Only thing I'd change is that everyone should use agility and stamina. Two of the most under utilized buffs in the game. The extra dodge checks and hp from +52 agi and +50 stamina is legit for survivability.

[Itap]

If you're an enchanter and you don't have a charmed pet, you are crippling your groups dps. Even as a Druid I keep a pet charmed when available. Fuck, stop being so god damn lazy.

Also, comparing Mage pet dps to an npc of equivalent level is fucking stupid and shows how much you know about your class and the game in general.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Jesus saves tho

[kaev]

If you're an enchanter and you don't have a charmed pet, you are crippling your groups dps. Even as a Druid I keep a pet charmed when available. Fuck, stop being so god damn lazy.

Also, comparing Mage pet dps to an npc of equivalent level is fucking stupid and shows how much you know about your class and the game in general.

Damn dude, that's about the shitiest, most self-righteous, most unfun attitude I can imagine. WTF you want to bring that bullshit into a game for? Check your damned real-life misery at the door and have a good time bro, no need to spend your time pissing into the wind here as well.

[Aviann]

Jesus saves tho

Only thing Jesus saved was his virginity... For his dad.

[myriverse]

Only thing Jesus saved was his virginity... For his dad.
Not if you read that novel in the right way, he didn't.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

If you're an enchanter and you don't have a charmed pet, you are crippling your groups dps. Even as a Druid I keep a pet charmed when available. Fuck, stop being so god damn lazy.

Also, comparing Mage pet dps to an npc of equivalent level is fucking stupid and shows how much you know about your class and the game in general.

See. This is what I mean. But I highly doubt that you realize you just proved the point of my posts in this thread. I doubt you are bright enough to see that.

Control freaks rarely understand what they are doing, and what the people around them are complaining about.

You say I don't understand my class. But you just proved, you don't understand yourself.

Don't fuck with Sadre. I'll fuck your skull all day long.

[webrunner5]

I totally stopped playing my Shaman at level 50 because like the OP says every asshole in the group wanted some silly buff and 2/3 didn't need shit. Play a Shaman and see what its like. Pain in the ass. :o

[Itap]

See. This is what I mean. But I highly doubt that you realize you just proved the point of my posts in this thread. I doubt you are bright enough to see that.

Control freaks rarely understand what they are doing, and what the people around them are complaining about.

You say I don't understand my class. But you just proved, you don't understand yourself.

Don't fuck with Sadre. I'll fuck your skull all day long.

Hey buddy, fuck you

[Itap]

Damn dude, that's about the shitiest, most self-righteous, most unfun attitude I can imagine. WTF you want to bring that bullshit into a game for? Check your damned real-life misery at the door and have a good time bro, no need to spend your time pissing into the wind here as well.

Lol, it's way too easy to troll people here

[Lune]

I totally stopped being a doctor at age 50 because like the OP says every asshole patient wanted some silly medicine and 2/3 didn't need shit. Be a doctor and see what its like. Pain in the ass. :o

[Orruar]

Necros will always want more HPs. Might want to re-evaluate lumping them in with all INT casters on HP buffs.

Necros, like all other int casters, typically keep shield of the magi (or some lesser version) up at all times. This doesn't stack with talisman.

[Atmas]

Unless you actually do suck.

Sorry, but if you don't cast a strength on a melee in favor of casting one Scourge you fall in this category, on multiple levels.

Yeah its a game and you should play it to have fun, but if you are in a group you should be trying to play reasonably efficiently. Also people need to get over their ego.

[Byrjun]

Especially at lower levels (and especially if you're the main healer), fuck anything that's not sow/talisman/sta/regen/haste. Lots of mana, negligible benefit. You could use the mana for a nuke and give more dps than a strength buff. Once you have canni 3, fungi, torpor, etc. and buffs that actually do things and last for an almost reasonable amount of time you can bother with that shit.

[Purdee]

I'm usually happy to buff people, unless its Salerno, then its pretty much "F that guy"

[Skittlez]

Especially at lower levels (and especially if you're the main healer), fuck anything that's not sow/talisman/sta/regen/haste. Lots of mana, negligible benefit. You could use the mana for a nuke and give more dps than a strength buff. Once you have canni 3, fungi, torpor, etc. and buffs that actually do things and last for an almost reasonable amount of time you can bother with that shit.

This guy gets it.

[Gaffin 3.0]

just really depends, id say def always give rogues dex and str increases dps alot, and the tank dex atleast for procs and such. you made the wrong class if you hate buffing, thats all they do on raids.

[Lojik]

just really depends, id say def always give rogues dex and str increases dps alot, and the tank dex atleast for procs and such. you made the wrong class if you hate buffing, thats all they do on raids.

Why dex for the rogues?

[Splorf22]

Another example of this is how peoples now expect every ench to manage a full time charmed pet in group, while in the past they were happy enough with mezzes and buff.

Basically a charming enchanter fills two slots (1x dps, 1x CC/buffs) while a non-charming enchanter fills only one. If you don't charm, you are half as good. It's a huge difference.

That said, if you don't want to charm that is your choice. But it's also your groupmates' choice to be mildly upset that your lack of skills is fucking up their XP, and pick a better enchanter next time.

I probably take a good bit of the credit/blame for this. Between the solo artist challenge showing what enchanters can do and the guide laying out exactly how to do it, the average enchanter is expected to do a lot more. When I was leveling up most enchanters did not charm - and that was in the era of Haynar charm where it lasted forever. I actually leveled to 45ish with a summoned pet and some serious Whirl abuse. Then the Kanras charm nerfs hit and basically every new enchanter said fuck this. It was only those of us who couldn't give up old op charm that continued, and eventually we figured out how to make it work.

[Itap]

Loraen, teach that sadre weirdo how to not fucking suck

[Swish]

Why dex for the rogues?

Gaffin not too smart.

[Skittlez]

Gaffin not too smart.

[Skittlez]

just really depends, id say def always give rogues dex and str increases dps alot, and the tank dex atleast for procs and such. you made the wrong class if you hate buffing, thats all they do on raids.

I won't mind that. I don't mind buffing out necessity. When I hit 46 I am going to change my specialization to Alteration since I won't be soloing as much then.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

I totally stopped being a doctor at age 50 because like the OP says every asshole patient wanted some silly medicine and 2/3 didn't need shit. Be a doctor and see what its like. Pain in the ass. :o

Fallacious analogy is fallacious.

It's an elf simulator dude. No one actually "dies" here.

Jesus going down on Mary are some of you guys desperate.

Just have fun! Kill shit dead, and have fun! Make friends! Try out new angles and ways to play the game!

(note: I am not an exclamation point user usually. But this is worth it. Seriously. Just have fun with other freeks who play this weird old game. Life is too short to not have a few laughs, and classic eq should = lots of laughs.)

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

Necros, like all other int casters, typically keep shield of the magi (or some lesser version) up at all times. This doesn't stack with talisman.

win.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

Loraen, teach that sadre weirdo how to not fucking suck


You poor fool. If you understood basic logic, you would know, Sadre = does not suck.

I just play how I play, and I kill shit dead. No one -- I mean no one -- has *ever* been in a group with me and said, man, who was that loser. I play my class how I play my class, and I've owned lots of shit over these long years.

Why can't you just be cool with that? I would never think to tell another player how to play their class, unless it was a major fuck up (ie, afk a lot, healer never using spot heals, healer not making sure everyone is topped off between pulls -- you know, REALLY basic stuff.)

We are arguing about molecules of difference in most cases.

I am not arguing no buffs are needed. I like to ask for a STA buff to add just a little extra to my lame-ass hp. But if the shaman said no, or forgot?

I would let it go, unless there were other issues.

[Tenlaar]

I would never think to tell another player how to play their class, unless it was a major fuck up (ie, afk a lot, healer never using spot heals, healer not making sure everyone is topped off between pulls, an enchanter doing no DPS instead of some of the best in the game -- you know, REALLY basic stuff.)

FTFY

[Wudan]

You bitchass shaman should reroll wizard, cause you dont even deserve to play this awsome class that shaman is. I have played shaman for years and i always buff people with whatever the fuck they ask for because that is one of my roles! Mana is not an issue and never was, sure you run low after buffing whole grp, but you can build it back up very fast with cannidance, even when you are the main healer/slower....and you had chanter in your group ffs! You might be the worst shaman out there.

Rerollwizardafkandgotobedscrubshamanloser

[Itap]

You poor fool. If you understood basic logic, you would know, Sadre = does not suck.

I just play how I play, and I kill shit dead. No one -- I mean no one -- has *ever* been in a group with me and said, man, who was that loser. I play my class how I play my class, and I've owned lots of shit over these long years.

Why can't you just be cool with that? I would never think to tell another player how to play their class, unless it was a major fuck up (ie, afk a lot, healer never using spot heals, healer not making sure everyone is topped off between pulls -- you know, REALLY basic stuff.)

We are arguing about molecules of difference in most cases.

I am not arguing no buffs are needed. I like to ask for a STA buff to add just a little extra to my lame-ass hp. But if the shaman said no, or forgot?

I would let it go, unless there were other issues.

Let me try this at a different angle.

Instead of doing the bare minimum, try and play your class to its true potential. Your group members will definitely thank you. They will be all like "Wow, this sadre guy is a real fucking weirdo, but his ability to do some major dps AND CC makes up for it!"

This thread is actually useful. It exposes players and their ability to play, or lack thereof

[Atmas]

This guy gets it.

Alright, good troll thread, I was suckered.

[Skittlez]

Alright, good troll thread, I was suckered.

[Aviann]

You bitchass shaman should reroll wizard, cause you dont even deserve to play this awsome class that shaman is. I have played shaman for years and i always buff people with whatever the fuck they ask for because that is one of my roles! Mana is not an issue and never was, sure you run low after buffing whole grp, but you can build it back up very fast with cannidance, even when you are the main healer/slower....and you had chanter in your group ffs! You might be the worst shaman out there.

Rerollwizardafkandgotobedscrubshamanloser

You are the fucking man. Remind me of my good shaman friend Amirite. He's the fucking man too.

[Zeonick]

Go ahead and quit the shaman now. Your main task on raids will be "Send tells for buffs" and you then work your way through 20 tell windows buffing everyone who messaged you. And if the raid wipes... You do it again. Though at that level the buffs people ask for are actually legit and helpful.

And saying melee classes who ask for STR are wasting your time is.... well, ridiculous. STR buffs help melee out more than any other buff besides haste. You aren't doing any worthwhile damage compared to a rogue or monk so you may as well contribute in the best way possible - by buffing them.

But really I should have just let the poll results speak for themselves.

[radditsu]

Go ahead and quit the shaman now. Your main task on raids will be "Send tells for buffs" and you then work your way through 20 tell windows buffing everyone who messaged you. And if the raid wipes... You do it again. Though at that level the buffs people ask for are actually legit and helpful.

And saying melee classes who ask for STR are wasting your time is.... well, ridiculous. STR buffs help melee out more than any other buff besides haste. You aren't doing any worthwhile damage compared to a rogue or monk so you may as well contribute in the best way possible - by buffing them.

But really I should have just let the poll results speak for themselves.

Nope here you login and buff people every once in awhile as they camp out at trak ledge/vs/port spots. And outside avatar and resists, the mob is dead before two ae. Unless a poopsock Is on.


If you were 60/raided you would know this.

[Skittlez]

Thanks everyone for the articulat and overall, quite wonderful advice and thoughts toward this subject my friends. I now understand that I mean the world to just about everyone on here. You guys are gonna make me tear up a little.. *snifflez*

[Zeonick]

Nope here you login and buff people every once in awhile as they camp out at trak ledge/vs/port spots. And outside avatar and resists, the mob is dead before two ae. Unless a poopsock Is on.


If you were 60/raided you would know this.

Nope i've raided here being the only shaman on raids, sure boss mobs fall quickly but what about 2 hour+ sky raids?

But yeah, having avatar would change things a ton. I'm only 51 so I have to pump out every buff individually.

[baalzy]

Why can't you just be cool with that? I would never think to tell another player how to play their class, unless it was a major fuck up (ie, afk a lot, healer never using spot heals, healer not making sure everyone is topped off between pulls -- you know, REALLY basic stuff.)



This makes me lol.

If you're talking basic stuff, why the hell would you ever top someone off between pulls? If they're not the tank/puller and they're at 80% or above let them regen their own HP.