Question to Sirken/Nilbog about training

[Stasis01]

Now that guilds have people with multiple 60's, people will often drop trains on characters they don't normally play. A good example of this is Sektor training Sebilis.

If you suspend Sektor's cleric for a week for training it won't serve as a deterrent what so ever, and I can speak to that first hand - even two weeks is worth it for a good sized train.

I am not saying we need subjective snap decisions when mobs agro - but for obvious purposeful training like Sektor did, on fraps, I think the entire Nihilum guild needs a punishment to deter this behavior in the future.

Possibly lose Trak next week, unable to contest as a guild, or suspend all of his characters for a week (they're all sektorx/sektorz etc) just a thought.

Sektor is currently laughing about a possible 1 week suspension on a toon he doesn't even really play, but he could have wiped 30 people and gave Nihilum the victory had we not been prepared to handle it.

[Thrilla]

lol

ur such a crybaby, ya lets suspend an entire guild even people who weren't online for someone's intentional or non intentional train (that apparently is up for debate)

seems like a legit request

[HeisChuck]

I got ban hammer for bein at the solb zoneline when naggy was slewn

[Sektor]

Stasis going off the deep end here.

[Labanen]

Is there some sort of requirement when you join azrael from nihilum, that you have to write lame requests to have nihilum banned as a guild ? Ffs, i ve been trained so many times i lost count, but i dont Bitch and petition about them... Obviously its currently against the rule so petition them if you can document it and feel its important enough for a -1, and then please stfu.

[Stasis01]

That's just it, I don't think a ban is required or necessary, or even good.

I would rather a punishment for the group, and let peer pressure sort this out. If Nihilum can't raid Trak next week because of Sektor's behavior - I believe you won't see the same thing happening next time.

The current punishment is limp, and if Sektor gets a week he'll laugh about it and play his druid/pally/any other toon.

I don't care about trains, and wouldn't mind if they were legal, but since they are not - we should at least address the issue of people doing it on alts not worried about the punishment.

It's just common sense.

[Terpuntine]

Just make training legal and lets be men about it.

[Giovanni]

Nihilum is toxic for the server.


Holocaust - Nihilum got my guild banned for copying Nihilum's own tactics with Nagafen. None of the loot they got via exploit was removed.
Heresy - Nihilum corpse camped our guild of 52-55's in plane of hate until they quit.
Azrael - Nihilum resorting to training using their numerous alts so suspensions are irrelevant.


VZTZ had period wipes which prevented these code red levels of pixel frenzy. Never seen a box so focused on pixels over pals and pixels over pvp.

Note that with the Holocaust ban, guild leaders were also held fully responsible for the actions of their guild members...

[Labanen]

If you re telling me that loosing a level 60 toon even for a period of time is not enough of a punishment for an offense which you yourself think shouldnt be illegal, then the common sense part is lost, at least for me.

[Stasis01]

It isn't.

He mains his pally, when Nizzar was suspended he played his warrior (60 epic full gear aon)

Both suspensions were ineffective in serving as a deterrent, I guess if you can't see that - then I don't know what to say.

Sektor is trying to prove himself to the Nihilum core, trying to be the hero - he believes he's giving himself for the greater good.

Punish the group and make that backfire on him, and people won't do it. This is why the army makes everyone do push-ups/exercises for failures when learning how to march/perform. Peer pressure is the greatest motivator you can have here.

Unless you set up the rules that people will enforce themselves, and have the consequence mean something it should just be legal.

Training Trakanon on 30 deep in seb is about as bad of a train as you can do - it wiped the entire 50 people, and ruined the fight.

It ruined the pvp, everyone should be on the same page in saying this is not what we want.

[pharmakos]

duration of suspension should be variable based on the spawn timer of the mob you were training over

a one week suspension over a dragon that might not even repop in a week would be silly

[Giovanni]

When each guild member is rocking between 2-5 level 60's, losing a single level 60 alt for a week is no disincentive.

Training in VP is legal. Blatant intentional training over Trakanon in Sebilis is not.

The rules in this situation are clear.

[Kinamara]

I heard 2-boxing is against the rules and results in permaban. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ2Uj2WYu3o&feature=youtu.be)

Discuss

[heartbrand]

Holy fuck no one intentionally trained last night, there were tons of reefs and jugs everywhere and chaos in mass pvp. Repops behind as well and idiots who ran into Trakanon aggro range which is huge. Get over it.

[HeisChuck]

alert

running up to traks lair then doing a 180 and then running all the way back to the tunnels with trakanon on you is INDEED an intentional train (sektorz)

[Sirken]

words.

let me make something clear, we absolutely do not answer to you, or to anyone else in this community.

Spamming my PM box with the same exact link 5 times from 4 people and / or running to the forums to make threads, threats, and, demands is the absolute wrong way to get anything done for you by the staff, and almost on pure principle i feel i should ignore this until it's been posted to the proper section... wait for it... PETITION FORUM

now that being said, there is a system in place that i use, your suspension will always be double that of your previous suspension. most first offenses are 7 days, some peoples first offense is too heinous for only 7 days off. but either way, the suspension length doubles from the previous suspension. (please dont confuse Suspensions with Bans. some crimes skip the Suspension stage and are immediate Bans)

as far as guilds and guild punishment, here's how i do things. If GuildA trains GuildB at RaidMob1 and that results in GuildA slaying RaidMob, then the trainer gets suspended and GuildA will not be allowed to contest that same RaidMob1 the next time it spawns. if GuildA ignores this judgement they will receive full blown account suspensions across the entire guild on par with their individual previous suspension times. However if GuildA trains GuildB at RaidMob1 and that results in GuildB slaying the raid mob, then the player or players responsible for the training will be suspended for lengths based on their previous suspension times.

some times trains happen in EQ, and other times kids just drop dragons on other kids. fraps it, stream it, do something to capture it, and then senf it to the PETITION FORUM. NOT the forums. NOT my PM box.

in other words, help us help you.

game on

[Giovanni]

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[Bazia]

yeah most nihi just being faggots by pretending that incredibly obvious train wasnt intentional

as well as the mutliple attempts from other nihi alts logged in on poop mountain to load in and rush to traks lair to attempt to train again after sektorz wiped the whole zone (nerfette, skorge, etc)

guess they loaded in and sprinted to trak because they were "lost" too while we were CRing from sektorz train

[Stasis01]

I don't think I was being judgmental or insulting - posted a question on the forums for a discussion on the current training rules/punishment, and posted my opinion.

Didn't mean to offend.

[Bazia]

tite so sektorz 7th alt he doesnt play taking a week vacation, probably only 3 days at this rate.

gonna take my druid alt to train next encounter, he can eat a few week suspensions for the incredible advantage training an entire raid can give you

dont play it anyway :)

[heartbrand]

No one intentionally trained you, you fucking retard

[Bazia]

red99 part II: the abandoned alt train wars

[Stasis01]

let me make something clear, we absolutely do not answer to you, or to anyone else in this community.

Spamming my PM box with the same exact link 5 times from 4 people and / or running to the forums to make threads, threats, and, demands is the absolute wrong way to get anything done for you by the staff, and almost on pure principle i feel i should ignore this until it's been posted to the proper section... wait for it... PETITION FORUM

now that being said, there is a system in place that i use, your suspension will always be double that of your previous suspension. most first offenses are 7 days, some peoples first offense is too heinous for only 7 days off. but either way, the suspension length doubles from the previous suspension. (please dont confuse Suspensions with Bans. some crimes skip the Suspension stage and are immediate Bans)

as far as guilds and guild punishment, here's how i do things. If GuildA trains GuildB at RaidMob1 and that results in GuildA slaying RaidMob, then the trainer gets suspended and GuildA will not be allowed to contest that same RaidMob1 the next time it spawns. if GuildA ignores this judgement they will receive full blown account suspensions across the entire guild on par with their individual previous suspension times. However if GuildA trains GuildB at RaidMob1 and that results in GuildB slaying the raid mob, then the player or players responsible for the training will be suspended for lengths based on their previous suspension times.

some times trains happen in EQ, and other times kids just drop dragons on other kids. fraps it, stream it, do something to capture it, and then senf it to the PETITION FORUM. NOT the forums. NOT my PM box.

in other words, help us help you.

game on


Is it attached to the character or the person. Can Sektor train on his cleric and receive 1 week if he has trained on his druid before etc, or do you take that into consideration.

[SamwiseRed]

ye 1 week suspension is week as hell.

i was suspended for a month on live for training then perma banned. how an emu (where you can make account after account without paying) has such lax rules, i dont even. honestly just perma ban everyone who breaks the rule. nothing stopping anyone from rerolling immediately so no biggie.

[Bazia]

its the cleric that he never plays eating the week

this is why he trained it because he doesnt care about a toon he doesnt play

[tehruoh]

all im hearing is, "waaahh nihilum is using the same strategy we've been employing guild remake after guild remake (intentionally, or not intentionally training)."

[Bazia]

no one trains trak in azrael or gate pots entire fear temple



dumbass

[tehruoh]

ohhh its been attempted.. maybe not fear temple

[Kraftwerk]

red99 part II: the abandoned alt train wars

haha

except we're at like part 20 by now.

[NotJeterezpas]

Anyone who still has faith in this server turning into a haven for guild versus guild pvp over raid content after the GM pvp talks summit on twitch.tv is nuts. Hearing our only hope Sirken giggle about race graphics and team name colors made me realize that a box focused on pvp and devoted to competition was unlikely. That six hour long 'summit' discussed terms obtusely with little awareness of what's wrong with the server and zero focus on issues. It seemed more to me like a sleepover party with wine coolers and pillow fights.

Server is what you make it, but rule lawyering and expecting GM's to intervene when people train is a lost cause. Fraps it, submit it, let people sit out a week, 2 weeks, whatever the GMs decide is worth the effort of typing a petition and entering a link. If you expect there to be some form of control from the administration here you're barking up the wrong tree.

The next argument is when Sektors trains on Sektors or Sektor or Sektorxx or whatever and that 'account' gets a 1 week suspenion for 'first train' and everyone panics and says, "no, no, he already trained once on another character, bla bla bla" it's the same histrionics every two weeks over another manipulation of the rules.

Good luck my bropals, i have faith in one thing. Yellowtext will continue, people wont stop logging in, the drama will continue to entertain. Enjoy this box for what it is not what it'll never be....

[tehruoh]

Anyone who still has faith in this server turning into a haven for guild versus guild pvp over raid content after the GM pvp talks summit on twitch.tv is nuts. Hearing our only hope Sirken giggle about race graphics and team name colors made me realize that a box focused on pvp and devoted to competition was unlikely. That six hour long 'summit' discussed terms obtusely with little awareness of what's wrong with the server and zero focus on issues. It seemed more to me like a sleepover party with wine coolers and pillow fights.

Server is what you make it, but rule lawyering and expecting GM's to intervene when people train is a lost cause. Fraps it, submit it, let people sit out a week, 2 weeks, whatever the GMs decide is worth the effort of typing a petition and entering a link. If you expect there to be some form of control from the administration here you're barking up the wrong tree.

The next argument is when Sektors trains on Sektors or Sektor or Sektorxx or whatever and that 'account' gets a 1 week suspenion for 'first train' and everyone panics and says, "no, no, he already trained once on another character, bla bla bla" it's the same histrionics every two weeks over another manipulation of the rules.

Good luck my bropals, i have faith in one thing. Yellowtext will continue, people wont stop logging in, the drama will continue to entertain. Enjoy this box for what it is not what it'll never be....

i agree with you, finally.

[Something'Witty]

Enjoy this box for what it is not what it'll never be....

I agree with most everything you said, especially the quote above.

[Bardalicious]

Sirken gettin pretty ill-tempered with poor Stasis in this thread.

[pharmakos]

if i was a GM on P99 i'd probably rage and ban all the whiners

imo Sirken is showing remarkable restraint =

[NotKringe]

Problem is this server just has to many inconsistent rulings that pretty much are based upon whatever the GM, or person who handles the petition decides at "that point in time".

Examples given below for forum lawyerism..

Exhibit A) - Holocaust exploits Naggy the same way Nihilum did during first 2 months of server release.... Rogean (whom no one had heard a peep from in 6months, mysteriously logs in and disbands/bans entire guild (including those accounts not logged in or present, with the officers/leaders taking perma bans) 1st offense.

End Result - he later retracted it to just 2-3week bans but changed the entire state of the server.

Exhibit B ) - The mysterious "42 Day Server Reset" - Server was in such a bad state it needed to be rebooted every "40 days" to keep server stability structure intact. Coincidently this has only been enforced for 3 weeks *back to back to back mind you* out of the almost 104 weeks or 730 days Red99 has been open..

End Result - Was just some cockamamie bullshit story to reset the server 3-4 times in a 3 week period stating server stability was needed. Because we haven't seen this happen since its inception back in May.. Server is about 120 days past the "40 day server reset", shit should have blown up by now.


Whichever GM handles the petition/suspension action should show consistency across the board for everyone... Not 1 week for Nizzar, 2 weeks for soandso, 3 days for soandso, Just a flat out suspension.. IT just further proves to the new players coming here, that the community is unstable and the people who do make decisions base them on however the fuck they feel for that day...

Which is none of what anyone wants..

[Silikten]

^^^^^^^^^^ This is a cockamamie bullshit story tldr.

Anyways, the fact that a suspension only affects 1 toon, not even the whole IP, is ridiculous. Sektorz, the person who blatantly trained trakanon, has like 12 RMT'd toons he can play at will. The guild needs to be hit as a whole because the Leader and Officers are supposed to be held responsible for their members.

Thus, making Nihilum have a 2 week suspension of killing Trakanon will ensure trains will be avoided harder than they are now.

[Smedy]

Nihilum is toxic for the server.


Holocaust - Nihilum got my guild banned for copying Nihilum's own tactics with Nagafen. None of the loot they got via exploit was removed.
Heresy - Nihilum corpse camped our guild of 52-55's in plane of hate until they quit.
Azrael - Nihilum resorting to training using their numerous alts so suspensions are irrelevant.


VZTZ had period wipes which prevented these code red levels of pixel frenzy. Never seen a box so focused on pixels over pals and pixels over pvp.

Note that with the Holocaust ban, guild leaders were also held fully responsible for the actions of their guild members...

Ya looking back at it nihilum is incredible toxic for the server, amazingly their nuts are still swinging in the clear, some serious paypal must be going on in the background

[Rec]

This is why they allowed training on SZ and none of this "interpretation" was ever required ever again.

[Etorryn]

That ruling does not make the best sense sirken. If Guild A trains Guild B and get trakanon than the next week only Guild B can contest? Who's to say Guild B wouldn't have gotten trakanon both weeks? Now Guild A gets the mob at least 1 of the 2.

[NotKringe]

^^^^^^^^^^ This is a cockamamie bullshit story tldr.

Anyways, the fact that a suspension only affects 1 toon, not even the whole IP, is ridiculous. Sektorz, the person who blatantly trained trakanon, has like 12 RMT'd toons he can play at will. The guild needs to be hit as a whole because the Leader and Officers are supposed to be held responsible for their members.

Thus, making Nihilum have a 2 week suspension of killing Trakanon will ensure trains will be avoided harder than they are now.

The bi-polar, change my story to suit me whenever its best guy trying to provide any kind of feed back is pure lol.


Gtfo here you classless fuck... Everyone knows your a pos and you're toxic on any server you hit that "Create Character" on.

[Billbike]

Just make training legal and lets be men about it.

[quido]

Have faith in the staff to do the right thing.

[heartbrand]

checkraise and sector both ran to get the dragon, period

the video shows what looks like a fun pvp battle. Why would you get the dragon? do you not like pvp? What the fuck is wrong with you

neither check nor sector should ever be able to log on those chars again, they clearly ran past everyone to get a raid mob . Done.

Never had aggro on Trakanon and never ran to get Trakanon, sorry you're dumb. Not surprising since you don't even know where trak spawns, I never even got close to jumpy nonetheless trak. Can be verified by Colgate / Tyva / lite many others

[freez]

Never had aggro on Trakanon and never ran to get Trakanon, sorry you're dumb. Not surprising since you don't even know where trak spawns, I never even got close to jumpy nonetheless trak. Can be verified by Colgate / Tyva / lite many others

Can confirm i dont see checkraise near trak aggro radius

I do see eldernerd tho

[freez]

also i was beating down checkraise pretty sure after trak reset near fungis and trak never pathed that far.

[Colgate]

i saw heartbrand dual wielding in pvp

that's what i saw

[runlvlzero]

This is why they allowed training on SZ and none of this "interpretation" was ever required ever again.

And it would be good. People could get back to pvping after this train bullshit panned out. Either Dragons would be pvp or trains. People are smart, they engage where they cant get trained when they want to pvp. etc.. They fight at epic mobs. And other shit. And the pixel lusters are left with little to no chance. Because the best pvpers. Also know how to train the best.

Returns competition to the game IMO.

[Supreme]

How lame is this thread....

A PVP server is suppose to allow issues to be resolved on the field not the forums.

Less QQ more pew pew.

[Darwoth1]

Funny you should say that...



Holocaust cant compete even with 30+ people online for Raids. They consistently spam ingame hate through tells, troll players and staffs RL, grief, train, exploit and generally contribute nothing but mockery to what Project 1999 represents.

ALL BECAUSE THEY FAILED AT EVERQUEST.

It is now time to BAN all of them (as it should be been from the exploited Nagafen) and let the server heal itself.

Bring up HATE+SKY+SOL RO and BAN all of Holocaust ASAP.



If you get banned/suspended your corpse should ROT and not be RESUMMONED.

Proxy penalty for being a total douche and getting suspended/banned.

[heartbrand]

hehehhe

[Chronoburn]

Legalize training or ban people for it. Don't suspend, BAN.

[Sirken]

PS- you kids did far more damage to your selves by wasting 2 months on Legacy of Zek, than any ruling p99 staff made.

/Martial_Law on