BRIEF description of a hybrid hard code/soft code 3-faction ruleset

[Aenor]

In my previous wall of text:

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120802

I described a ruleset where each starting city was its own team but cross teaming was allowed under certain conditions. That ruleset got a bit convoluted so I decided to simplify it. Each starting city will be its own team but it may cross team with other cities in its faction. However, each faction is prevented from cross teaming outside its own faction via hard coding.

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Kaladim

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Halas
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

The evil faction is shorted one starting city with the knowledge that, once Kunark is released, the evil faction will add Cabilis and each faction will have 5 starting cities. As Sirken noted during the round table, the evil team is always going to attract the most players, so it will survive initially having only 4 starting cities, especially since most would consider Felwithe and Kelethin to be a single metropolis for the good faction and Surefall Glade is a weak prize for the neutral faction.

To keep it relatively simple to code, don't change any of the available races or classes for each city. Qeynos is a good city so the good faction gets SKs. However, good faction gets no shamans and evil faction gets no bards... tough luck.

Again, to be clear, the teams are soft coded within their own faction, meaning a Qeynos human can choose to KOS halflings but also has the option to group, guild with and cast beneficial spells on halflings. A Qeynos human is prevented by hard coding from grouping, guilding or casting beneficial spells on any member of the evil or neutral factions.

[Aenor]

According to this Wiki page, both Dwarves and Barbarians are considered Good faction:

http://wiki.project1999.com/Character_Races

You could just as easily move Dwarves to the Neutral faction and place Barbarians on the Good faction.

[Aenor]

I would also recommend that, as part of Rogean's planned dynamic level range expansion for players who decide to heal out of range, the staff also incorporate the following: If player A from the Qeynos (Good faction) casts a beneficial spell on player B from Kelethin (also Good faction) while player B is engaged in combat with player C, also from Qeynos, the act of cross teaming will temporarily allow player C to attack player A, even though they are on the same team. This temporary PvP flagging should remain in effect until player A zones.

[Auchae]

I like this idea. What do you think of swapping Erudin and Felwithe factions so Faydwer isn't so lopsided?

[Azure]

Faydwer would be better if dwarves and barbs were swapped. Would make sense for dwarves and gnomes to work together also.

[Auchae]

Faydwer would be better if dwarves and barbs were swapped. Would make sense for dwarves and gnomes to work together also.

Ya that makes sense also, I was just thinking about the race/class combos that would lose nothing from swapping, and I think it is Erudin and Felwithe.

[Aenor]

Felwithe wouldn't make sense as Neutral faction. As charted above, Good faction would control most of Faydwer, Evil faction would control East Antonica and Neutral faction would control Western Antonica. If you swapped Halas to Good faction and Kaladim to Neutral faction, the Neutral faction would lose some of its grip on East Antonica but would gain numbers in Faydwer. I think it could work either way. If you swap Halas to the good faction, it takes Shamans away from the Neutral faction and gives them to Good faction.

[Dullah]

Sorry, bad bad ideas. Teams so lopsided, no ogre warriors for pve, no bards for pvp and pve. Its always been horrible, and will be even worse today when everyone knows how to exploit these fundamental imbalances.

Make no mistake, there needs to be a ffa team, but racial/deity teams just suck in Everquest, and they always will.

[Aenor]

So what's your idea? Also:

racial/deity teams just suck in Everquest, and they always will.

Yeah racial teams suck... I guess nobody told the populations of Vallon and Tallon.

[Old_PVP]

I would play this server. Sounds like it could lead to some interesting zone control / warfare. And make no mistake, that is the best type of pvp. It would also lead to purist guilds, which are awesome.

[Rokannis]

Dwarves were originally neutral on SZ. Barbs could be good or neutral I believe. I know we had them on team neut.

[krazyGlue]

Sorry, bad bad ideas. Teams so lopsided, no ogre warriors for pve, no bards for pvp and pve. Its always been horrible, and will be even worse today when everyone knows how to exploit these fundamental imbalances.

Make no mistake, there needs to be a ffa team, but racial/deity teams just suck in Everquest, and they always will.

Lol pushing for that FFA team so nilly can Zerg that team and raid with no problems of having to xteam
Stop trying to fuck up every server you have red99 stay there

[Aenor]

Dwarves were originally neutral on SZ. Barbs could be good or neutral I believe. I know we had them on team neut.

The inspiration here is to avoid the imbalance you had on SZ where evil team had multiple starting locations that were exclusive to that team, while good and neutral mostly shared starting locations and had to PvP from the jump.

[RoguePhantom]

The inspiration here is to avoid the imbalance you had on SZ where evil team had multiple starting locations that were exclusive to that team, while good and neutral mostly shared starting locations and had to PvP from the jump.

Barbs could be neutral shamans, as Barb was the only non Evil shaman race.

Shamans could worship The Tribunal (neutral) and Mith Marr (Good).

[Dullah]

Lol pushing for that FFA team so nilly can Zerg that team and raid with no problems of having to xteam
Stop trying to fuck up every server you have red99 stay there

Nilly could "zerg" any team genius. It only means you and your pals can't troll us and use protected characters on our team to train us or find ways to grief. Having a FFA team doesn't effect either of the other normal teams, only players who accept the disadvantage of being on the FFA team.

Stop trying to fuck up the server and allow ways to grief.

[nerfed]

the evil team is always going to attract the most players

Very naive statement.

The best option they mentioned was the choose team 1, 2, or 3 at character select.

[runlvlzero]

I like Aenor and his ideas. Alot.

[gotrocks]

this is pretty solid. if we were going to choose teams based on this kind of system, this would be the way to go EXCEPT

i agree with everyone else, swap barbs/dwarves. Dwarves are traditionally neutral anyway (in eq lore and other fantasy lore. also, they tend to get along with gnomes)

[Bogart]

Teams suck.

[Aenor]

Ok I'm in. By popular demand the factions/teams are:

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Halas

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

[gotrocks]

Ok I'm in. By popular demand the factions/teams are:

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Halas

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

I greatly approve. Will still be going evil, but will definitely be having gotgnomes as a porter alt on the neutral team =P

[Aenor]

Given the above division of factions, you would have the following class restrictions upon server launch:

Evil faction:

No: Paladin, Druid, Ranger, Monk, Bard

Good faction:

No: Shadow Knight, Necromancer

Neutral faction:

No: Shaman

I know I said before that since SK's can start in Qeynos, let the good team have SK's. But now that I see that the evil faction will be missing 5 classes until Kunark release when they add monks, I think you have to take something away from the other factions.

Therefore it makes sense to put Halas on the good faction since otherwise the neutral faction would have every class available. The evil faction still gets screwed on classes, but this is balanced by the fact that they have Grobb and Neriak, the two closest mele bind points for Sol B and Guk.

So to make this work, all the devs need to do besides the engagement coding is disable SK's and necros for Qeynos.

[Aenor]

I greatly approve. Will still be going evil, but will definitely be having gotgnomes as a porter alt on the neutral team =P

Your newt gnome would not be able to port your evil chars. Porting is a beneficial spell and you are hard coded against casting beneficial spells on a char from a different faction. A gnome can only port other neutrals.

[gotrocks]

Your newt gnome would not be able to port your evil chars. Porting is a beneficial spell and you are hard coded against casting beneficial spells on a char from a different faction. A gnome can only port other neutrals.

I understood that :D

more importantly, my gnome would not be able to port my evil characters because there will be no 2boxing ;)

[Aenor]

It's also balanced by the fact that non-evil factions don't get troll and ogre tanks. Good team will have barbs but newts? Dwarf warrior, this is your day in the sun.

[gotrocks]

I actually think evil team has potential to get overpowered in this setup. The lack of some serious classes, particularly monk, at launch will be a huge disadvantage.

As you said, this is made up for by their cities, as well as having access to the all-mighty trolls/ogres. Would be interesting to see what would happen if this was implemented.

Imho this setup + no pvp level range would be ideal.

[Vexenu]

It's a good try but I don't think this ruleset would turn out well. The glaring class imbalances between the teams create too many problems. SZ rules worked because the classes restricted to each side were not core classes for raiding or leveling (SK, Nec for Evil; Pally, Ranger, Druid for Good/Neut). Not having access to any of those classes was an annoyance, at best, and didn't hamstring any team in PvE.

When you start restricting Monks, Shaman and Bards though, you really upset the balance of the game. For example, the simple fact that Evils don't get bards, while seemingly minor, would probably be enough to eliminate all hardcore endgame players from the Evil team. Killing raid mobs without Bard resist songs is much more difficult than killing them without Ogre tanks. The team without Shaman for buffs (not clear if it is Good or Neutral since Barbs seem to be shifting around) is also clearly disadvantaged for the same reason.

Basically, I don't see this working unless you add in some grossly un-classic stuff like Dark Elf Bards and Dwarf Shaman. And I think changes on that scale just go too far for most players to be comfortable supporting. For this reason I think a modified SZ ruleset still remains the best option. SZ rules are classic and have known strengths and weaknesses. Rather than trying to reinvent the wheel, let's just improve what already exists and has been proven to work.

[Aenor]

Except that Sullon had the lowest population of any ruleset. If you want to keep it classic/no customization, clearly Teams99 should be classic race war ruleset.

[Vexenu]

Except that Sullon had the lowest population of any ruleset. If you want to keep it classic/no customization, clearly Teams99 should be classic race war ruleset.

Hardly anyone wants to keep it 100% classic with no customization (which would be a direct port of RZ, TZ/VZ or SZ rules). Almost everyone I've seen is advocating for some kind of custom ruleset, it's simply a debate about how far those modifications should go. Personally I'm of the opinion that the changes should remain as invisible and behind the scenes as possible, in order to preserve the feel of the classic PvP rules as much as possible while still trying to correct the problems they had.

I like the idea of a race war teams server in theory, but hardcoded teams with such an imbalance of required raiding classes just wouldn't work. So you either need grossly unclassic race/class combos or another ruleset entirely. Personally, I would find DE Bards and Dwarf Shaman more than a little offputting. It's just a little too far to go in the name of developing a new PvP ruleset in my opinion, especially when alternatives are available that don't require such a glaring break with classic. I think most other players would agree with that point as well.

[Aenor]

I agree that would be offputting. So here's a compromise. Each faction gets 4 starting cities that are exclusive to that team, and Halas and Freeport are contested cities where players from multiple factions can start.

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon

Contested starting cities:

1. Freeport
2. Halas

Via this compromise, evil faction can open with bards and monks from Freeport. The evil faction would still be restricted from playing paladins, druids and rangers and the good team would be restricted from playing shadow knights and necromancers. As you point out, this is a mere inconvenience. I think four exclusive starting cities and only two of the 14 starting cities allowing multiple factions at server launch is a good compromise.

[Aenor]

Neutral faction would of course have every single class available under this compromise, making it a very attractive faction. Gotta break some eggs to make an omelet, however. I'm also open to the idea, proposed elsewhere, of making the evil faction FFA to itself. This makes roleplaying sense and would correct the imbalance from Sullon Zek's launch where the evil team had huge tracts of uncontested land. Make evil faction FFA and you will have just as much PvP in Neriak, Grobb and Oggok as you will have in Freeport at launch.

[Old_PVP]

This is sounding better and better with each post. Make this server happen!

[Vexenu]

I agree that would be offputting. So here's a compromise. Each faction gets 4 starting cities that are exclusive to that team, and Halas and Freeport are contested cities where players from multiple factions can start.

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon

Contested starting cities:

1. Freeport
2. Halas

Via this compromise, evil faction can open with bards and monks from Freeport. The evil faction would still be restricted from playing paladins, druids and rangers and the good team would be restricted from playing shadow knights and necromancers. As you point out, this is a mere inconvenience. I think four exclusive starting cities and only two of the 14 starting cities allowing multiple factions at server launch is a good compromise.

Yeah this would work better. Could probably tinker around with the cities of Neutral/Good a bit to try to make each faction's zone control more geographically contiguous and homogenous (and should Surefall even count as a starting city in classic?). Ideally you'd have each team naturally controlling a decent amount of zones clustered together to form leveling strongholds. Really tough to do though with EQ's race/class requirements and geography.

[Rust1d?]

Freeport has always teetered on being good/evil. Although Qeynos is a "good" city, there is the underground as well, the "Evil part" of Qeynos.

Here is an idea: Qeynos and FP can be both contested. You could also make the FP and Qeynos "undergrounds" separate starting points. Would make for some good pvp there.

[Loto]

I agree that would be offputting. So here's a compromise. Each faction gets 4 starting cities that are exclusive to that team, and Halas and Freeport are contested cities where players from multiple factions can start.

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon

Contested starting cities:

1. Freeport
2. Halas

Via this compromise, evil faction can open with bards and monks from Freeport. The evil faction would still be restricted from playing paladins, druids and rangers and the good team would be restricted from playing shadow knights and necromancers. As you point out, this is a mere inconvenience. I think four exclusive starting cities and only two of the 14 starting cities allowing multiple factions at server launch is a good compromise.

Pretty good stuff.

[Loto]

Freeport has always teetered on being good/evil. Although Qeynos is a "good" city, there is the underground as well, the "Evil part" of Qeynos.

Here is an idea: Qeynos and FP can be both contested. You could also make the FP and Qeynos "undergrounds" separate starting points. Would make for some good pvp there.

Low level PvP in Qeynos Catacombs? Shoot me in the face.

[Rust1d?]

That would be tight! Catacombs is like its own town down there. Only for the hardcore gamers?

[Loto]

That would be tight! Catacombs is like its own town down there. Only for the hardcore gamers?

Meh. Easy to get lost, griefed, lose corpse, etc, and really have no reason to be down there after level 5.

I'll get my kicks hiding in the trees on trainer hill in CB.

Not gonna lie, really excited to see gfay swarming with people. Best memories of TZ ever were around there. Faydwer was actually semi-important, as I dont think we utilized the EC tunnel as effectively. Dont truly remember, I burned a lot between 2003 when I quit and now.

[Fame]

Sorry, bad bad ideas. Teams so lopsided, no ogre warriors for pve, no bards for pvp and pve. Its always been horrible, and will be even worse today when everyone knows how to exploit these fundamental imbalances.

Make no mistake, there needs to be a ffa team, but racial/deity teams just suck in Everquest, and they always will.

If you boil this down, it's really the classic WoW argument, "I want everyone to be the same/fair!". The shame. I for one am down with the teams not having access to all the classes/races, makes it that much more interesting.

[Zuranthium]

If you boil this down, it's really the classic WoW argument, "I want everyone to be the same/fair!". The shame. I for one am down with the teams not having access to all the classes/races, makes it that much more interesting.

Yes.

This is what we need: http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120312

[Rust1d?]

Meh. Easy to get lost, griefed, lose corpse, etc, and really have no reason to be down there after level 5.

I'll get my kicks hiding in the trees on trainer hill in CB.

Not gonna lie, really excited to see gfay swarming with people. Best memories of TZ ever were around there. Faydwer was actually semi-important, as I dont think we utilized the EC tunnel as effectively. Dont truly remember, I burned a lot between 2003 when I quit and now.

True, but just a thought. Not easy to please everybody with the layout, but Qeynos does have its bad/corrupt side. Would be nice to play on that some how.

[heals4reals]

Many main tanks on live were wood elves

[Rust1d?]

Also I think you need the following:

1) 1-9 = No pvp
2) 4x exp levels 1-20 (keeps people playing)
3) A way to prevent poopsockers from getting 50 in a day (possibly have level limits like mentioned in the SZ thread):

Week 1: Max lv 20
Week2: Max level 30 etc. up to lv 50

4) Classic zones only

5) No item loot (this always drives off players) or limited item loot (limited to ears and rings) or bags.

[Aenor]

Meh. Easy to get lost...

Ho ho ho you must be new here ;)

[Aenor]

Really tough to do though with EQ's race/class requirements and geography.

Really tough to do and imo not worth attempting. Dwarf shamans and dark elf bards would make this easier but it's not EQ. Let the game stand on its own as it was created with as little customization as possible.

The biggest issue with Sullon Zek lauch was that evil team got Cabilis which was remote from all PvP until players got leveled up. By starting with classic only, it reduces the advantage of evil substantially. If you wanted to go with deity teams where good/newt/evil could all start in Qeynos or Freeport and those cities be contested from day one, then making the evil team FFA to itself counterbalances this (in addition to making roleplaying sense... they're evil... they kill indiscriminately).

That way instead of having Grobb, Oggok and Neriak as cities where only evil resides while newt and good are at each other's throats in contested cities, evil has to fight from day one as well.

[Aenor]

Faydwer was actually semi-important, as I dont think we utilized the EC tunnel as effectively.

Was the same on Vallon. Greater Faymart > EC tunnel.

[Aenor]

If you boil this down, it's really the classic WoW argument, "I want everyone to be the same/fair!". The shame. I for one am down with the teams not having access to all the classes/races, makes it that much more interesting.

This. I'm willing to tweak it so it can be as balanced as possible, but Everquest, by it's nature, is an imbalanced game. I don't need a server that's perfectly fair to everybody. I just need a server without the glaring imbalance of Sullon Zek at launch.

[Arclyte]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411

[Aenor]

I'm sorry.. don't do it Arclyte.

[heals4reals]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411http://www.project1999.org/forums/image.php?u=5948&dateline=1378652411

Q q q qradraaaa post

[Aenor]

DISCUSS TEAMS NERDS.

[Lowlife]

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel
5. (Cabilis eventually, 3-6 months of Classic, 3-6 months of Kunark.)

Good faction starting cities.

1. Rivervale
2. Halas
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Qeynos

Neutral Starting Cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

Neuts least appealing team initially due to lack of Shammies, so by giving them Freeport, Erudin, and Surefall you've allowed them default control over early important transportation choke points for balance purposes. All major docks/shipping areas including both side of Ocean of Tears (if not that entire zone as a result) as well as Erud's crossing would be under neutral control, giving them an additional level of attractiveness for players despite lacking Shm, as Evils lack Bards but will by default carry a robust population, whereas the Good team is the most balanced class-wise. Neuts will also, at the least, have the easiest time completing several Epics including Warrior.

[Aenor]

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

Neutral team, aka "Gnigs and Gnomes."

[Lowlife]

Neutral team, aka "Nigs and Gnomes."

I like it. Also, wait for the first neut "Freeport Port Authority" dock griefing guild. Trying to go to Unrest on your DE? I don't thinks so.

[Lowlife]

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel
5. (Cabilis eventually, 3-6 months of Classic, 3-6 months of Kunark.)

Good faction starting cities.

1. Rivervale
2. Halas
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Qeynos

Neutral Starting Cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

Neuts least appealing team initially due to lack of Shammies, so by giving them Freeport, Erudin, and Surefall you've allowed them default control over early important transportation choke points for balance purposes. All major docks/shipping areas including both side of Ocean of Tears (if not that entire zone as a result) as well as Erud's crossing would be under neutral control, giving them an additional level of attractiveness for players despite lacking Shm, as Evils lack Bards but will by default carry a robust population, whereas the Good team is the most balanced class-wise. Neuts will also, at the least, have the easiest time completing several Epics including Warrior.

[Lowlife]

.

[Aenor]

Could probably tinker around with the cities of Neutral/Good a bit to try to make each faction's zone control more geographically contiguous and homogenous (and should Surefall even count as a starting city in classic?).

Yes, Surefall is absolutely a starting city. It's the only way neutrals get druids and rangers since Rivervale and Kelethin are good cities.

If you wanted to do it by geography, you could have a faydwer team, Evil team (east antonica) and a west antonica team (rivervale, halas, surefall, qeynos and throw in odus). I'm less concerned about geography than I am about preserving the lore of EQ. This is making me more interested in the idea of Qeynos being a contested zone because why act like qcat doesn't exist on the server?

[Aenor]

Freeport has always teetered on being good/evil. Although Qeynos is a "good" city, there is the underground as well, the "Evil part" of Qeynos.

Here is an idea: Qeynos and FP can be both contested. You could also make the FP and Qeynos "undergrounds" separate starting points. Would make for some good pvp there.

I'm in, Qeynos should be contested.

[Lowlife]

I'm in, Qeynos should be contested.

Qeynos and FP.

[Lionfish Roundup]

teams was a troll, give up

[runlvlzero]

In my previous wall of text:

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120802

I described a ruleset where each starting city was its own team but cross teaming was allowed under certain conditions. That ruleset got a bit convoluted so I decided to simplify it. Each starting city will be its own team but it may cross team with other cities in its faction. However, each faction is prevented from cross teaming outside its own faction via hard coding.

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel

Good faction starting cities

1. Rivervale
2. Qeynos
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Kaladim

Neutral faction starting cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Halas
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport

The evil faction is shorted one starting city with the knowledge that, once Kunark is released, the evil faction will add Cabilis and each faction will have 5 starting cities. As Sirken noted during the round table, the evil team is always going to attract the most players, so it will survive initially having only 4 starting cities, especially since most would consider Felwithe and Kelethin to be a single metropolis for the good faction and Surefall Glade is a weak prize for the neutral faction.

To keep it relatively simple to code, don't change any of the available races or classes for each city. Qeynos is a good city so the good faction gets SKs. However, good faction gets no shamans and evil faction gets no bards... tough luck.

Again, to be clear, the teams are soft coded within their own faction, meaning a Qeynos human can choose to KOS halflings but also has the option to group, guild with and cast beneficial spells on halflings. A Qeynos human is prevented by hard coding from grouping, guilding or casting beneficial spells on any member of the evil or neutral factions.

Bump for great justice. We need to get Aenor on the dev team ASAP.

[Retti_]

http://weknowgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/didnt-real-lol-gif-9.gif

[SamwiseRed]

naw sz ruleset or dum

[Lionfish Roundup]

teams was a troll, give up

[Kelsar]

Wasn't it divided based on religion and starting city?

e.g. All teams got access to shamans (barbs had good and newt religion)
All teams got access to bards (Zek was for evil)
Evil didn't get access to druids, rangers, and paladins.
Good/newt did not get shadow knights and necros.

Faction hits matter... If you're a newt and you kill a high elf, expect to lose faction with high elves.

[Aenor]

SZ was divided by religion but not by city. This was an attempt to not have contested starting cities but it seems to have failed. I'm ok with SZ rules as long as there's no Kunark at launch.

[Lowlife]

Bump for Alecta Jesus and Sirken Muhammed

[big mouth chew]

omfg ppl have a problem with contested starting cities??

CAREBEARS.JPEG

seriously, hardcoded teams is faggot enough as it is, try not to gay it up any worse

[Lowlife]

Evil faction starting cities

1. Grobb
2. Oggok
3. Neriak
4. Paineel
5. (Cabilis eventually, 3-6 months of Classic, 3-6 months of Kunark.)

Good faction starting cities.

1. Rivervale
2. Halas
3. Felwithe
4. Kelethin
5. Qeynos

Neutral Starting Cities

1. Surefall Glade
2. Kaladim
3. Erudin
4. Ak'Anon
5. Freeport



best.

[dogbarf]

Hard-coded teams are lame, and reintroduce the whole problem you see on blue.

(You can't force annoying people on your own team out of your camps without resorting to training)

3 Factions is fine but give people an option to turn in their discord book and kill/ be killed by anyone. Or just make an entire faction FFA. Also item loot pls.

[jeffd]

evil faction gets no bards

stopped reading at this point

i'm assuming you've never played on an eq pvp server before

[Vexenu]

Hard-coded teams are lame, and reintroduce the whole problem you see on blue.

(You can't force annoying people on your own team out of your camps without resorting to training)

3 Factions is fine but give people an option to turn in their discord book and kill/ be killed by anyone. Or just make an entire faction FFA. Also item loot pls.


stopped reading at this point

i'm assuming you've never played on an eq pvp server before

My suggested ruleset addresses both of these problems: http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120312

[Noselacri]

It'll be nothing but another DOA PvP server if you choose not to make every class available to every team, and especially if you make them all available to one of the teams but not the others. Which team do you think every single serious guild is going to choose? How profoundly idiotic.

[Aenor]

stopped reading at this point

i'm assuming you've never played on an eq pvp server before

Do you have downs? Evil team didn't get bards on Vallon or Tallon, the most successful, popular PvP ruleset in the history of EQ.

[Aenor]

omfg ppl have a problem with contested starting cities??

CAREBEARS.JPEG

seriously, hardcoded teams is faggot enough as it is, try not to gay it up any worse

And yet I'm one of only 4 people who voted soft code on the teams poll.

[Fawqueue]

It'll be nothing but another DOA PvP server if you choose not to make every class available to every team, and especially if you make them all available to one of the teams but not the others. Which team do you think every single serious guild is going to choose? How profoundly idiotic.

You are overlooking the other benefits that the various teams would have. Evil may not have bards, but they have great location especially come Kunark. And you know the golden rule to business: location, location, location.