Lime the prophet

[Stasis01]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[heartbrand]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[Vile]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[SamwiseRed]

wehrmacht said this shit before server even went up. he is the true prophet. he also predicted exactly how the server would fall with one zerg guild. pras.

EQ P1999 PVP SERVER

You have two options and I will explain the consequences of those choices:

1 - Make a no teams, FFA style PvP server.

2 - Make a two team, dark vs light based, diety based, or race war type server.

I played Sullon Zek since day one and TZVZ for a long time. I'm gonna lay it out exactly how this works. If you make this PvP server a FFA rule set this is what happens:


FFA, no teams PvP server:


Day 1 you will see 30-40 man guilds pop up. There will be Heresy, some random TZ or SZ guild, and a few random blue server guilds that show up with a zerg of people. You'll probably have four or five viable or semi-viable guilds roaming around. Each guild will monopolize some area like Guk, Karnors, whatever.

After a few weeks, one of the guilds implodes and you're down to three. Now there will be two guilds monopolizing spawns, loot, and beating the shit out of the most likely lower population third guild. The demoralized 3rd guild starts bleeding members, some just plain quit, others join the 2 dominant guilds. Then the 3rd guild completely vanishes except that one guy who just got out of prison and logged back into the game at level 3 with now defunct guild tag.

Now you're a few months into the server with a constant day to day brawl of the two dominant guilds fighting for dragons. This goes on a long time and during this entire process, server will constantly drop in population. New players that join the server during this period of time will mostly be standing around by themselves, occasionally get ganked by a level 50, have nobody to group with, and solo their way to 50 because everyone on a FFA server is your enemy.

The majority of these new people will just plain quit. An occasional few will make it to the top but the server will be losing way more people than it's gaining due to this kind of alienation of the new player.

Now the server population is like 100 people: 30 people in guild A, 30 people in guild B, and 30-40 random noobs wandering around. The leader of one of the guilds gets charged with some kind of bestiality sex crimes IRL (probably Heresy). The guild disbands, only one guild remains, server ends.


Next choice is teams based server:


Similar number of people start on day one. The 30 man guilds move into their positions to try and monopolize some area. A random evil guild stands around on shores of oasis killing alligators and starts leveling fast. A low level crapling comes into the zone, see's them, and zones out to go tell all the other craplings. All of a sudden a giant tidal wave of low level craplings starts to pour into the zone and the highest level troll on the server will have 8 halflings clinging to him like some scene from Lord of the Rings.

All of the craplings die and the entire beach is covered in corpses but the uber, evil guild is completely unable to do any leveling so their progress is held back the entire day. The low level craplings then respawn in Misty Thicket and form a guild with the name "Flowers of Happiness".

This goes on for months. One or two guilds will eventually die but each of the two teams will maintain at least one uber guild and one casual or noob guild. At this point, the FFA server would most likely be in it's death spiral but the teams server population would be better off due to lack of alienation of the new or casual player. It might even still be growing.

The uber guild will constantly use their teams noob guild as human shields in order to defend themselves from attack while raiding so there will always be something to do, someone to attack, someone to group with.

The overall effect is much slower progression, more PvP, higher population, and the server's main zerg guilds have much less power and effect on the server world overall due to having to fight much bigger battles against more opponents. When one team's uber guild leader goes to prison, there will most likely always be a secondary guild ready to step in and take over the team and the server avoids collapse.

This rule set would basically be Sullon Zek type setup except with two teams instead of three. Three teams always implodes due to one of the three always ending up much weaker so it's not a viable choice.


Training, Corpse Camping, Other Random Cool Stuff

The way I feel on this issue is that if you can't hard code something, it shouldn't be a rule in the first place. It takes way too much manpower and there are too many variables involved in solving disputes about training and corpse camping. Even on TZVZ where there was a no-training rule with GM's enforcing it and banning people, you always saw people do it anyway. They'll make a 1 foot detour to the side while being chased and make it look like they accidentally did it or the best tactic of all, just run into a giant camp of mobs when someone is attacking you and you're about to die. The surviving guy then brings the huge train back to his guild and they both blame each other for training as everyone in the zone wipes.

I get the feeling the devs do not want this to be a high maintenance server so I only see one logical solution that fixes both of these problems at the same time. Give the priest of discord the ability to summon corpses after they've been dead X number of hours or just implement the shadowrest zone and all corpses pop there after X number of hours. This way you don't need any rules concerning corpse camping and training or really any rules at all.

Now if you're in Plane of Hate and someone trains you for fun (even when it would have originally been against server rules), you don't have a 48 hour long CR. You just log off and come back the next day and go summon your corpse at priest of discord or get it from Shadowrest. Some people are gonna start whining and say "omg training is so terrible omg, I don't want training to be legal". When I played Sullon Zek, training was encouraged and I never even died from a train once. I even had people like Fansy the bard running Sand giants at me. It's really not that big of a deal. You typically already know which direction the train is coming from and who is bringing it to you before it even arrives. So you either take off running, hide, gate, or kill them. It's a pretty easy element of PvP to deal with.

If I was to personally choose an arbitrary number, I would probably make the priest of discord or Shadowrest guy summon your corpse after it's been dead for 4 hours. I think that game mechanic would make it so death in enemy territory would have a long enough penalty but still doesn't prevent you from playing the remainder of the entire day.


Possible Team Setups


Race War using race as selection variable: Probably the best choice since each team gets every class

Dark Elf Alliance (evil)

Dark Elf
Troll
Iksar
Ogre
Half Elf
Erudite


Human Alliance (good)

Human
Dwarf
Gnome
Halfling
High Elf
Barbarian
Wood Elf


Good vs Evil using diety as variable for selection: This setup tries to keep all the races like halflings and elves on one side and trolls and ogres on the other. Might have to disable selection of agnostic somehow because too many races get it. Good team gets no necros or shadowknights and evils get no rangers, druids, or paladins. Diety distribution looks lopsided but it doesn't really matter, People don't choose them equally and you basically just choose your team at player creation. Population on both teams would probably be similar. Evil has more offense, Good team has more healing.

Good team:

karana
tunare
elrollisi
brell
mithaniel
tribunal
quellious
rodcet
prexus
bristlebane
sol ro


Evil Team:

innoruk
bertox
rallos
cazic thule
veeshan


Expansions at Start


Most P1999 and TZVZ players are probably tired of original expansion with no kunark by now. I would either release Kunark on day one or make it so Kunark opens after Nag, Vox, CT, and Innoruk are dead.

[Faerie Blossom]

wehrmacht said this shit before server even went up. he is the true prophet. he also predicted exactly how the server would fall with one zerg guild. pras.

Yeah, but that guy's crazy. Claiming that no teams will ruin the server while advocating training is just silly :P

If we had all spent more time nurturing the community, instead of eating away at it with grief and stupidity, we would have a higher population today.

[Jenni D]

so sad to see a pop of 80 at peak time :(

was around 160 not so long ago.

under 20 players during thai evening hours...shits getting bad

[SamwiseRed]

i dont mind the community as much as i do the ruleset but maybe thats just me. ffa is so unappealing. always has been for me in any game i play.

[Faerie Blossom]

Oh, I don't mind the community much either. It's just that other potential players seem to, and it turns them off from joining :/

But yeah, I vote for teams.

[GODPARTICLE]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[Smedy]

can confirm roots /snares stuns never were used on live, however as a mage in velious i never ever had someone resist my nukes, even bards, so if you expect youll be resisting fire/cold nukes, you're wrong

but i agree, resists needs to be tweaked but it seems to have to be done on a spell to spell basies

[Tradesonred]

Predicted like 2 weeks after launch server would tank because of xp loss, 90% of forum was telling me to shut up, cant be bothered to look for/remember my old banned forum name.

Mostly holocaust, because they enjoyed griefing people off the server and the advantage it gave em through zerging, and Nihilum later on, because of the advantage it gave em through zerging.

It was obvious it was going to happen, and transparent why Holos and Nihis didnt want the mechanic to go.

[HeisChuck]

http://peterdarling.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c3e8f53ef00e553964b5e8834-800wi

[Faerie Blossom]

Oh stop being such drama queens.

[compulsion]

It's unfortunate that we have so much dedication to keeping the box free of cheat programs, which Sony never cared about at all, and yet no attempt to make a PvP server with worthwhile PvP. Constant talk about getting new players to the server, yet 58+ players quit and sell their accounts because they came for the PvP and the PvP turned out to be crap.

1. No need to re list the multitude of gamebreaking bugs which are simply ignored despite a mountain of evidence.

2. Resist code which requires BiS gear, much of it coming from raid zones, to even start to enjoy your character. And even if you do have it, you are just a couple golem wand charges away from being dead or forced to gate.

3. Even if you are near BiS there is a solid chance that your PvP will be completely ruined by bad RNG.

4. A very large % of the most active players on this server will use IP exemptions to quit out in 5-8 seconds at the first sign of PvP.

Every other week when I get bored and log in for an Azrael raid, I see new faces. The people who I leveled with have all quit and sold or are inactive. In a few months, the ones playing now will have done the same thing. Tons of people have invested time here because they want to play on a RED server again, only to quit in disappointment or app Nihilum when they realize that the only thing left that might be fun is farming raid bosses.

tl;dr This isn't EQ PvP just because it says EQ on the loading screen. Don't expect a diverse and active population in what has been reduced to a completely one dimensional game. Hell, with invis pulling single bosses half way across zones with pacify through walls, even the regular PvE is boring.

[Shrubwise]

Oh stop being such drama queens.

[Jenni D]

It is what you make of it.

Just try enjoy the ride. if you quit, journey safe into the afterlife pals.

[Tradesonred]

tl;dr This isn't EQ PvP just because it says EQ on the loading screen. Don't expect a diverse and active population in what has been reduced to a completely one dimensional game. Hell, with invis pulling single bosses half way across zones with pacify through walls, even the regular PvE is boring.

Could easily be salvaged if we can get Rogean/other devs to give more of a fuck again. With the majority of the sociopaths gone or lurking, could happen?

- remove xp loss in pvp

- some sort of xp gain bump to repopulate server that lost half its pop a couple months ago when xp gain was axed. Xp gain axing wouldnt be so bad on a 200+ pop server where people were having fun pvping, but both the axe and xp loss in pvp at the same time crippled it.

- better resists

- profit

lol shrub is the hardcorererest of the hardcore

Gonna end up sinking with the boat like a captain, dueling with Big chewie

[Nuk3Afr1ca]

Yeah, but that guy's crazy. Claiming that no teams will ruin the server while advocating training is just silly :P


The client is hardcoded so you have to choose either TZ, RZ, or SZ ruleset and I don't really believe in rules that can't be hardcoded into the client.

[Shrubwise]

lol shrub is the hardcorererest of the hardcore

Aww, thanks. Chewie would win, though.

I've taken my own 3-or so month hiatus here and there. Sometimes I just didn't feel like playing, and I quit. The only difference is, now, it feels like every person who quits these days, feels like they need to make a post about it. A typical quitter's reasoning:

-Pop is too low, server sucks.
-Nihilum is too strong, server sucks.
-The PvP here does not meet my requirements, server sucks.
-No yellow text? Server sucks.
-Exp loss on PvP death? Server sucks.

What we forget is that at some point, the server didn't suck. At some point we felt like it was worth the time sink, worth the no YT, etc. etc. And then, you get tired and stop playing. No need to talk shit about the server; be mature, realize that you're done (for whatever period of time) and take a break.

I love this server. I love classic EQ, been around since the server opened. I joined blue within the first hour, the highest char on / who all was level 3. I've quit here and there, but I always understood it wasn't the server's fault. You won't find any ragequit posts by me.

Threads like this I just /rolleyes. It's the same old story. Haters gonna hate. But aye I am going down with this ship. :D

[reddi lol]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[GODPARTICLE]

The client is hardcoded so you have to choose either TZ, RZ, or SZ ruleset and I don't really believe in rules that can't be hardcoded into the client.

with antihax dll attaching itself to the process it's just a matter of assburgering offsets and putting some jmp instructions to inject whatever the f you want

[Faerie Blossom]

I don't really believe in rules that can't be hardcoded into the client.

"Doubt is a pain too lonely to know that faith is his twin brother."

[Faerie Blossom]

Bring it, Kimm! :p

[NotKringe]

Bumping for profit
Lime

[heals4reals]

Classic pvp was actually pretty fun. Current spellfile make everything terrible.

Classic pvp people actually jousted and a well organized group actually had a chance to outplay a larger force simply due to the fact that you could kite people around, and 5 people chasing 1 person might not land a kill with inability to cc the target as well as nukes resisting on someone with high resists.

Here pvp is decided by 18 second t-staff/skean which always seems to proc in the first combat round as well as highsun spam perma disabling someone, root/snare/stun/blind landing on 300 mr on the first or second cast, wizards pillaring you from out of visible target range in 2.5 seconds, mage pets landing nonstop stuns and roots on you, and rogues/monks bursting 300+ dps onto golem wanded casters with 1200 hp, and nuking classes landing full damage nukes on 160+ resists 70%+ of the time.

People just get blown up and since damage is so high all the cc that is landing that shouldn't be landing is a death sentence to anyone.

The lack of attention to these major issues for months is main reason people don't log in anymore, among other reasons...such as the experience penalty crushing sub 60 players and doing almost nothing to a level 60 who will dip below 100 % into 60 for a day or two.

Killing good players isn't even an accomplishment with current pvp implementation.

[runlvlzero]

I jousted poopgun that was fun. Also had a few other decent pvp battles. But none vs Nili or any entrenched poopsockers from the opposition. All versus lightly twinked players who were chill about it afterwards. Once on my druid vs a wizard Miguel, many on Niem backing gaffin untwinked in unrest or MM. Once with my druid vs a wizard in CB. A few back in the day vs the original mellowyellow and pals in KC, and CoM. Plenty of times where we just obliterated gloinzz with NCC.

/pras chewie, one of the few reasons I bothered logging into this box at all.

Shits dead as fuck now though, too many fungis, too many nilis, too many nili wannabes, and I don't even pvp the naked level 20's out there because its just fucking wrong. Waste of time to hit 52.

A lot of newbs cant hack it in pvp too and make me want to rage quit for their stupid ass behavior during/after/before pvp happens. They either run, /q or ragelog.

A LOT of selfish YT'ers out there don't give a fuck at all about mass pvp or group pvp. Their mindset is in their ballsacks. Nihilum is actually not that bad about it compared to the rest of the server, so kudo's to them for good teamwork even if they suck.

[SamwiseRed]

pras wehrmacht

[heartbrand]

Lime doing it big in ff14 ATM pras

[SamwiseRed]

ye talked to lime the other nite, seemed coo.

[Silikten]

A LOT of selfish YT'ers out there don't give a fuck at all about mass pvp or group pvp. Their mindset is in their ballsacks. Nihilum is actually not that bad about it compared to the rest of the server, so kudo's to them for good teamwork even if they suck.

Check most of nihilum kills. Its on non guilded characters. Especially tune. Not sure why you would even post this type of comment.

[runlvlzero]

Eh its hard to tell with 90% of the server Nihilum now. I'm talking in a general sense here, when I pvp with those unguilded people there is no cohesion. The few times I played with Nihilum core mains, they actually had cohesion as a team.

[s1ckness]

can confirm roots /snares stuns never were used on live, however as a mage in velious i never ever had someone resist my nukes, even bards, so if you expect youll be resisting fire/cold nukes, you're wrong

but i agree, resists needs to be tweaked but it seems to have to be done on a spell to spell basies

mage bolts/spells on live had a different resis check becuase they didnt just instantly land like wizards and all other casters